for all you 9/11 conspiracy "theorists"

bigirl said:
Only the top top people know. All the rest are just puppets in the dark. Besides, anyone who said anything would mysteriously disappear or "commit suicide"

you obviously don't believe in the good of man kind then... this is not a small conspiracy
you cant just have "people at the top" knowing

101: for a government to attempt such a hoax it would need assistance at three levels
1 executive
2 legislative
3 judisary

"mysteriously dissapear" funny that hasn't seemed to happen...

its not that i have a problem with people expressing their views...

but that you have the audacity to look at me as if i'm crazy!!!!

you know you would'nt spew this nonscense in public
 
mrjody said:
You obviously have no idea how THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA works, do you? Being an outsider that is understandable. People have come forward.
You call them sheep. The first responders are the ones who reported hearing "explosions in cadence", like a controlled demolition.

It wouldnt take more than a room full of people to come up with the "cover story". All of which have made financial gain.

Do you know what the phrase "plausible deniability" means?

I dont think 9/11 was a hoax.
Planes DID hit the towers.

After that our views of what happend diverge.

i doubt im much of more of an outsider than most on this board when it comes to american government and politics which is part of my study, and technichally american government is my employer for my internship for the past two years ffrom april to september.

that room full of people would still have to get by checks and balances put in place by their respective organisations!!! people around them would have to know or suspect something.. the fact that you think it would'nt take more than a room full of people is absurd!!!
humour me though... which people?

who would execute the plan?
i did'nt even know you thought planes hit the towers... you all have slightly differing views thats why my answer was vague
 
sitai said:
you obviously don't believe in the good of man kind then... this is not a small conspiracy
you cant just have "people at the top" knowing

101: for a government to attempt such a hoax it would need assistance at three levels
1 executive
2 legislative
3 judisary

"mysteriously dissapear" funny that hasn't seemed to happen...

its not that i have a problem with people expressing their views...

but that you have the audacity to look at me as if i'm crazy!!!!

you know you would'nt spew this nonscense in public
UGH. You are SO FUCKING DENSE AND BRAINWASHED I don't even know why I bother. Why don't you learn about the Masonic and black magic roots of the US government? Not "theory" but FACT. If you wish I will post lists of all the skull and bones members, all the masons, all the bilderbergs and all the attendees of bohemian grove but for now, check this:
THE DARK SECRETS OF BOHEMIAN GROVE

The Bohemian Club has an Annual Summer Encampment, a two-week retreat for the rich and powerful that President Herbert Hoover once called “the greatest party on Earth.” The club’s famed annual gathering has been held for more than 100 years at the 2,700-acre Bohemian Grove in Monte Rio, about 70 miles north of San Francisco in Sonoma County. It draws in notables such as President George W. Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney, Henry Kissinger, Colin Powell, former House Speaker Newt Gingrich and Dow Chemical Chairman Frank Popoff, as well as actors and other luminaries.
The annual gathering near the Russian River, which was first held in 1879, starts with the “Cremation of Care” ritual, in which the club’s mascot is burned in effigy to an owl god (Moloch), symbolizing a freedom from care. Members also perform several plays, and gourmet food and expensive wine are plentiful. While the club was formed in 1872 by a group of San Francisco journalists, the male-only club now bars journalists from membership to protect the group’s privacy. Membership is coveted, and people routinely wait 10 or 15 years before gaining admittance. There are currently about 2,700 members.

The world’s most prestigious summer camp, The Bohemian Grove, is fiercely guarded. The 2,700-acre retreat is the country extension of San Francisco’s all-male ultra-exclusive Bohemian Club to which every Republican President since Herbert Hoover has belonged. Some 20% of members engage in homosexual activity. They watch (and participate in) plays and comedy shows in which women are portrayed by male actors. Although women are not allowed in the Grove, members often leave at night to enjoy the company of many prostitutes and mind controlled sex slaves who come from around the world for this event. Employees of the Grove have said that no verbal description can accurately portray the bizarre behavior of the Grove's inhabitants.

Besides this type of merriment, the annual gathering serves as an informational clearing house for the elite. The most powerful men in the country do their "networking" here. At these gatherings, men representing the government, military-industrial and financial sectors meet and make policy decisions. The Manhattan Project, which produced the first atomic bomb, was conceived in the Grove in 1904. Other decisions made at the Grove include who our presidential candidates will be. There are speeches, known as "Lakeside Talks," wherein high-ranking officials disseminate information which is not available to the public at large. When powerful people work together, they become even more powerful. The Grove membership is wealthy, and becoming more so, while the middle class is steadily becoming poorer. This close-knit group determines whether prices rise or fall (by their control of the banking system, money supply, and markets) and they make money whichever way the markets fluctuate. They determine what our rights are and which laws have effect, and then selling candidates to us via the media which they own. Important issues and facts are omitted from discussion in the press, or slanted to suit their goals, but they are discussed frankly at the Grove. With its high-powered clientele, coveted privacy and cabalistic rituals, the Bohemian Grove has prompted considerable suspicion.

A SIGN WITH A SATANIC FACE GREETS VISITOR'S TO BOHEMIAN GROVE It was formed one night in 1872 by five bored news hawks on the San Francisco Examiner to promote good fellowship (i.e.,wild drunken parties) and ‘to help elevate journalism to that place in the popular estimation to which it is entitled.’ Today, a prospective member faces an interrogation that, according to one club man, ‘would satisfy the KGB.’ There is a waiting list of 1,500 notables, all eager to pay the $2,500 initiation fee and $600-a-year dues.” Some past members include, George P. Shultz, Stephen Bechtel, Jr., Gerald R. Ford, Henry Kissinger, William F. Buckley, Jr., Fred L. Hartley, Merv Griffin, Thomas Haywood, Joseph Coors, Edward Teller, Ronald Reagan, A. W. Clausen, George Bush, William French Smith, John E. Swearingten, Casper W. Weinberger, Justin Dart, William E. Simon, and hundreds of other prominent politicos and businessmen.” Up until recently, our knowledge of Bohemian Grove was that it is the exclusive elitist hideaway of supposedly adult wheeler dealers, a.k.a. Washington statesman and prominent personalities.
Some may dismiss their behavior as immature, even pitiful, acted out by emotionally disturbed individuals, and not worth attention. However, this is actually where Bush, Cheney, and their friends (2700 members)"the governing elite", gather to take part in bizzare, satanic rituals. Recent information will radically change the perception of Bohemian Grove. Not merely drunkenness, unbounded use of alcohol and drugs with vague homosexual tones, but reported activities much more serious – kidnapping, rape, paedophilia, illegal detention of children, sodomy and ritual murder. Investigation is blocked under the 1947 National Security Act.(!) For decades, there have been vague rumors of weird goings on in Bohemian Grove in more remote parts of its 2700 acres. Reliable reports claim Druidic like rituals - druids in red hooded robes marching in procession and chanting to the Great Owl (Moloch) - a funeral pyre with “corpses”. (Scores of men work in the Bohemian Grove as servants, so this party is fairly well established.)

An article in a local community newspaper, The Santa Rosa Sun, reported on the Cult of Canaan and the legend of Moloch in place at Bohemian Grove. The Moloch Pagan Cult of Sacrifice is human sacrifice. About the mid 1980s there were rumors of murders in remote parts of the property. A local police investigation went nowhere. State investigators on related criminal acts went nowhere. An observer and near victim has described the Bohemian Grove inner hideaways, the closed sanctum, even the decor at secret locations, places where no outsider goes (or servants according to our sources). Apparently there is an UNDERGROUND lounge (sign spelled U.N.derground) a Dark Room, a Leather Room and a Necrophilia Room.

A HUMAN SACRIFICE AT BOHEMIAN GROVE Also he reported: “Slaves of advancing age or with failed programming were sacrificially murdered at random in the wooded grounds of Bohemian Grove and I felt it was only a matter of time until it would be me.” This potential victim survived. Others reportedly did not. These cults were based on human sacrifice. Why would such a resort reproduce cult ceremonies? At the minimum, it demonstrates an attraction to the ceremonial practices of the occult, i.e. adoration of destruction, blood, barbarity and sacrifice of children. In brief, the charges are consistent with the tenants of Bohemian Grove as played out in ceremony. This is not a resort devoted to, for example, tennis or swimming. It is apparently devoted to blood sacrifices.
There is a videotape put out by radio talk show host Alex Jones,www.infowars.com, who shows on his Web site the bizarre, Luciferian ceremonies that occur there. It was taken surreptitiously by Jones from as far as 200 yards from the owl idol during the grove's annual and highly secret "Cremation of Care" ceremony. But Jones says he could make out the form of a wrapped infant, which he believed was real and alive, being sacrificed. At their corporate-feudal Shangri-La, the New World Order people are bringing to birth a new age in which ritual sacrificing of live humans shall be considered normal and healthy.

These ruling class elitists are certain that by convincing the Left and the Right that each other is the main enemy, they can orchestrate a crescendo of conflict between both camps, knock both out, and eliminate substantial sectors of resistance to the New World Order in the process. The denizens of the Grove are well aware of the critical juncture of time we now live in. After inducing the various elements of the opposition to fall upon each other, perhaps they will be able to continue their bizarre behavior, and human sacrifices, in a more open and accepting environment. Perhaps the behavior we see at the Bohemian Grove is just a taste of the type of society they envision for all of us in the near future.
 
^^^^ don't think you are educating me i am well aware of the literature you have just posted...
its not my fault you are bitter...
 
sitai said:
i doubt im much of more of an outsider than most on this board when it comes to american government and politics which is part of my study, and technichally american government is my employer for my internship for the past two years ffrom april to september.


Listen sitai:
As long as you believe that the US operates the way they tell you in your books, you will never understand.

Checks and balances mean nothing if the government has its thumb on the scale.....
 
sitai said:
^^^^ don't think you are educating me i am well aware of the literature you have just posted...
its not my fault you are bitter...
It ain't my fault you BLIND.
THIS IS WHO PULLS THE STRINGS OF THE GOVERNMENT YOU BLITHERING FUCKING IDIOT!
22Nov00 - Bilderberg's Magic Wand of Power

Bilderberg, it is said, has an uncanny knack of inviting people who later reach very powerful elected positions. It is another one of those surely unprovable allegations, that the most powerful people in the world are selected or 'interviewed' for supposedly democratically elected jobs, including heads of state, at Bilderberg.

Hard evidence of anything to do with Bilderberg policy-wise is almost impossible to get hold of. All venues are swept for bugs (not that we were using any at Genval this June!) and minutes of the steering group are definitely not publicly available.

Nevertheless, circumstantial evidence suggests Bilderberg really do have a magic wand. Take a look at the list of important career moves for the following democratic appointments:

Bill Clinton - Head of State - USA
Attends Bilderberg meeting, Germany, 1991 - gets Presidential Nomination Aug 1992
Tony Blair - effective Head of State - UK
Attends Bilderberg meeting, Greece, 1993 - becomes party leader Jul 1994 - becomes Prime Minister May 1997
Jack Santer - previous Head of State (sacked for corruption) - Europe
Attends Bilderberg, Germany, 1991 - becomes European President Jan 1995
Romano Prodi - present Head of State - Europe
On Bilderberg Steering Committee mid 1980's, attends Bilderberg meeting, Portugal, Jun 1999 - sworn in as President of Europe Sep 1999 (term lasts until Jan 2005)
George Robertson - CEO - NATO
Attends Bilderberg meeting, Scotland, 1998 - sworn in as Secretary General of NATO Aug 1999
A remarkable series of coincidences.

Addendum 2004: Lionel Jospin, participated in Bilderberg 1996. He became Prime Minister of France in 1997 (until 2002). Also, Michel Rocard, French Prime Minister from 1988 to 1991, was for a long time member of the Bilderberg group, before becoming Prime minister. [thanks to my correspondant Monsieur Grenier]


and there is a PLETHORA more of info here:
http://www.bilderberg.org/bilder.htm#info2002
 
sitai said:
^^^^ don't think you are educating me i am well aware of the literature you have just posted...
its not my fault you are bitter...

1st of all Operation Northwoods DID plan on killing U.S Soldiers so that's a lie right there.

2nd Who killed Daniel Pearl? Khalid Sheikh Mohammed or Omar Saeed Sheikh?

If it's Khalid Sheikh Mohammed then when will Omar Saeed Sheikh be released from jail?

Omar Saeed Sheikh works for MI6 & the ISI, so why did he wire $100,000 to Mohammed Atta?

http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/south/10/08/india.ressa/
 
mrjody said:
Listen sitai:
As long as you believe that the US operates the way they tell you in your books, you will never understand.

Checks and balances mean nothing if the government has its thumb on the scale.....

i agree with second statement entirely!

jsut because the is often a lack of transparency within government doesn't imply conspiracy either
 
sitai said:
i doubt im much of more of an outsider than most on this board when it comes to american government and politics which is part of my study, and technichally american government is my employer for my internship for the past two years ffrom april to september.

that room full of people would still have to get by checks and balances put in place by their respective organisations!!! people around them would have to know or suspect something.. the fact that you think it would'nt take more than a room full of people is absurd!!!
humour me though... which people?

who would execute the plan?
i did'nt even know you thought planes hit the towers... you all have slightly differing views thats why my answer was vague


I asked you several direct questions (above, in red).
Choose one and answer it.

Tell me how a plane entering Pentagon airspace would be "hard to track, due to transponders being off"

They might not know the call sign or tail numbers on the plane, but they would see it on radar, none the less...
 
sitai said:
i agree with second statement entirely!

jsut because the is often a lack of transparency within government doesn't imply conspiracy either

So, you acknowledge there might be things about 9/11 that we don't know?
 
sitai said:
i agree with second statement entirely!

jsut because the is often a lack of transparency within government doesn't imply conspiracy either

No it means both parties are controlled by the Central Bank.
 
What are Bilderberg Conferences all about?

TG 08Feb00 - The Bilderberg Secretariat proclaims the conferences to be '...private in order to encourage frank and open discussion'. Frank and open discussion is a good thing in any forum but when those doing the discussing are some of the very most powerful financiers and media tycoons in the world it begs the question: If what they discuss is for the good of ordinary people why not publicise it! Isn't it a perverted use of the word 'open' when no-one can find out what they're saying?

Is Bilderberg a secret conspiracy?

When such rich and powerful people meet up in secret, with military intelligence managing their security, with hardly a whisper escaping of what goes on inside, people are right to be suspicious. But the true power of Bilderberg comes from the fact that participants are in a bubble, sealed off from reality and the devastating implications on the ground of the black-science economic solutions on the table.

No, it's not a 'conspiracy'. The world's leading financiers and foreign policy strategists don't get together at Bilderberg to draw up their 'secret plans for the future'. It's subtler than that. These meetings create an artificial 'consensus' in an attempt to spellbind visiting politicians and and other men of influence. Blair has fallen for this hook, line and sinker. It's about reinforcing - often to the very people who are on the edge of condemning Globalisation - the illusion that Globalisation is 'good', 'popular' and that it's inevitable.

Bilderberg is an extremely influential lobbying group. That's not to say though that the organisers don't have a hidden agenda, they do, namely accumulation of wealth and power into their own hands whilst explaining to the participants that globalisation is for the good of all. It is also a very good forum for 'interviewing' potential future political figures such as Clinton (1991) and Blair (1993). [see above for more on this]

The ideology put forward at the Bilderberg conferences is that what's good for banking and big business is good for the mere mortals of the world. Silently banished are the critical voices, those that might point out that debt is spiralling out of control, that wealth is being sucked away from ordinary people and into the hands of the faceless corporate institutions, that millions are dying as a direct result of the global heavyweight Rockefeller/Rothschild economic strategies.

When looking at one of the (partially reliable) participant lists it should be remembered that quite a number of participants are invited in an attempt to get them on-board the globalisation project. These are carefully selected people of influence, who have been openly critical of globalisation. Examples are Jonathan Porritt (Bilderberg 1999) and Will Hutton (Bilderberg 1997) but there are many others. Most of these kinds of participants are happy to speak about the conference afterwards, and may even be refreshingly critical.

The Bilderberg organisers are accepted by those 'in the know' as the prophets of Capitalism. Will Hutton, deputy Editor of The Observer newspaper in London and left-leaning Economist, described private clubs of the elite as masterminded by 'The High Priests of Globalisation'. The ecclesiastical allusion is not accidental. The Bilderberg high-priests are a force against good, out to wipe morality from the earth. For the organisers Bilderberg Conferences are an annual ideological assault by the world's most power-hungry people. Not content with owning unimaginable amounts of money and property they want to use that wealth to acquire even more power for themselves. Power is the most dangerous and addictive drugs known to man. Will the craving be satisfied when a handful of men own and control everything on earth?

And just like the Nazi party in the 1930's the global Capitalist Elite are rising in power by peaceful means. There are some very uncomfortable and unexplained connections between Bilderberg and the Nazis through the Conference's founder Prince Bernhard.

These crown princes of capital use violence at the sharp end - the destruction of dissent - the repossession of homes men and women have worked a lifetime for - needless deaths from starvation and geopolitical machinations - this violence is notable by its absence from the annual meetings.

One can't help but wonder, when the Bilderberg organisers, Rothschild, Rockefeller, Kissinger and the rest have completed their project of enclosing all global goods and services into their own hands, enclosing too the media to stop people freely discussing what they are up to. What then?? What happens when the men who would be gods turn out to be the global devils?

Who is behind Bilderberg?

Bilderberg is run by a Steering Group - if you're wondering who's responsible for so much of the capital-friendly and dissent-crushing law-making, poverty and general misery in the world this may be the place to look. Up-to-date lists are available from the Bilderberg Secretariat. This is the closest approximation to a shadow transatlantic government. And this is another hidden agenda at Bilderberg.

There may be other groups pulling the strings behind even the Steering Group possibly even high degree occult groups such as The Masons or Illuminati! [eg.] - but that is 'conspiracy theory', Bilderberg is not.

There must certainly be some sociopathic minds behind Bilderberg since they go to so much trouble to promote policies that lead to exploitation, inequality and despair. These individuals seem oddly switched off from the suffering they are clearly causing. Surely only pernicious people would want to control the ideology of the world's mainstream press, and undermine natural political discourse. Public opinion and democratic institutions are a threat when you want to own the world.

The perverse objective of the Bilderberg Steering Group is to dress totalitarian ideology up to appear rational and push it out, unattributable, for mass consumption under Chatham House rules. Meanwhile, outside the Bilder-bubble, 'god-is-money' globalisation is the new religion. The greedy are given a pat on the back as they plunder both the earth and do their best to destroy the human spirit.
 
Trilateral Commission:
World Shadow Government
The Trilateral Commission was established in 1973. Its founder and primary financial angel was international financier, David Rockefeller, longtime chairman of the Rockefeller family-controlled Chase Manhattan Bank and undisputed overlord of his family's global corporate empire.


Rockefeller's idea for establishing the commission emerged after he had read a book entitled Between Two Ages written by an Establishment scholar, Prof. Zbigniew Brzezinski of Columbia University.

In his book Brzezinski proposed a vast alliance between North America, Western Europe and Japan. According to Brzezinski, changes in the modern world required it.

"Resist as it might," Brzezinski wrote elsewhere, "the American system is compelled gradually to accommodate itself to this emerging international context, with the U.S. government called upon to negotiate, to guarantee, and, to some extent, to protect the various arrangements that have been contrived even by private business."

In other words, it was necessary for the international upper class to band together to protect its interests, and to ensure, in the developed nations, that political leaders were brought to power who would ensure that the global financial interests (of the Rockefellers and the other ruling elites) would be protected over those of the hoi polloi.

POCANTICO HILLS CONFABS
Although the initial arrangements for the commission were laid out in a series of meetings held at the Rockefeller's famous Pocantico Hills estate outside New York City, Rockefeller first introduced the idea of the commission at an annual meeting of the Bilderberg group, this one held in Knokke, Belgium in the spring of 1972.


(The Bilderberg group is similar to the Trilateral Commission in that it is funded and heavily influenced by the Rockefeller empire, and composed of international financiers, industrialists, media magnates, union bosses, academics and political figures.

(However, the much older Bilderberg group's membership is strictly limited to participants from the United States, Canada and Western Europe: i.e. the NATO alliance. For more on the Bilderberg group, keep an eye out for future stories in this paper.

The Trilateral Commission was unique, though, in that it brought the Japanese ruling elite into the inner councils of the global power brokers, a recognition of Japan's growing influence in the world economic and political arena.

RULING CLASSES UNITE
"The Commission's purpose is to engineer an enduring partnership among the ruling classes of North America, Western Europe and Japan -- hence the term 'Trilateral' -- in order to safeguard the interests of Western capitalism in an explosive world. The private commission is attempting to mold public policy and construct a framework for international stability in the coming decades.
"To put it simply, Trilateralists are saying: The people, governments and economies of all nations must serve the needs of multinational banks and corporations.

"In short, Trilateralism is the current attempt by ruling elites to manage both dependence and democracy -- at home and abroad."

Another Trilateral critic, now-retired Sen. Barry Goldwater (R-Ariz.), views the commission as a Rockefeller family operation through and through. According to Goldwater:

"The Trilateral organization created by David Rockefeller was a surrogate -- the members selected by Rockefeller, its purposes defined by Rockefeiler, its funding supplied by Rockefeller. David Rockefeller screened and selected every individual who was invited to participate."

PICKING POLICYMAKERS
David Rockefeller and Brzezinski then began the process of selecting from among the "Trilateral" nations the several hundred elite power brokers who would be permitted to join in Trilateral policymaking in the coming years.

One of the commission's primary goals was to place a Trilateral-influenced president in the White House in 1976, and to achieve that goal it was necessary to groom an appropriate candidate who would be willing to cooperate with Trilateral aims.

Rockefeller and Brzezinski selected a handful of well-known liberal Democrats and a scattering of Republicans (primarily of the liberal-internationalist bent) to serve on the commission.

And in an effort to give regional balance to the commission Rockefeller invited the then-obscure one-term Democratic governor of Georgia, Jimmy Carter, to join the commission.

ROCKEFELLER CENTER SOUTH
Rockefeller had longtime ties to the local Atlanta political and economic Establishment. In fact, much of Rockefeller's personal investment portfolio is in Atlanta real estate. (According to David Horowitz, co-author of The Rockefellers, "Atlanta is Rockefeller Center South.")

And Rockefeller himself had once even invited Carter to dine with him at the Chase Manhattan Bank several years before, as early as 1971, the year Carter began serving as governor.

Carter very definitely impressed Rockefeller and Brzezinski, more so than another Southern Democrat, Florida Gov. Reuben Askew, also selected to serve on the commission and viewed, like Carter, as a possible Trilateral candidate.

In fact, according to Brzezinski, "It was a close thing between Carter and Askew, but we were impressed that Carter had opened up trade offices for the state of Georgia in Brussels and Tokyo. That seemed to fit perfectly into the concept of the Trilateral."

Carter, in fact, like Askew, did announce for the 1976 Democratic presidential nomination, but because of Rockefeller's interest, Carter had the inside shot.

So much so that in a speech at the commission's first annual meeting in Kyoto, Japan in May of 1975, Rockefeller's man Brzezinski promoted the then-still obscure Carter to his fellow Trilateralists as an ideal presidential candidate.

CUT AND DRIED
From that point on, it was all cut and dried. According to Goldwater: "Rockefeller and Brzezinski found Carter to be their ideal candidate. They helped him win the Democratic nomination and the presidency.

"To accomplish this purpose they mobilized the money-power of the Wall Street bankers, the intellectual influence of the academic community -- which is subservient to the wealth of the great tax-free foundations -- and the media controllers represented in the membership of the CFR and the Trilateralists."

(The aforementioned Council on Foreign Relations -- is another Rockefeller-financed foreign policy pressure group similar to the Trilateralists and the Bilderberg group, although the CFR is composed solely of American citizens.)

(In his book The Carter Presidency and Beyond, published in 1980 by the Ramparts Press, Prof. Laurence H. Shoup devotes an entire chapter to demonstrating how the Trilateral-linked and Trilateral-controlled Establishment media promoted the presidential candidacy in 1976 of the then-obscure Georgia Gov. Jimmy Carter.)

Carter, of course, campaigned as a "populist" -- as a "man of the people" -- as an "outsider" with no ties to the Establishment. The fact is, however, Carter, who said he'd never lie, was an elitist, an insider, the Trilateral Commission's "man on the white horse."

And with the power of the commission and the Rockefeller empire and its media influence behind him, Carter made his way to the presidency, establishing the first full-fledged Trilateral administration, appointing numerous Trilateralists to key policymaking positions and carrying out the Trilateral agenda to the hilt.


more on trilateral commission and CFR here:
http://www.prolognet.qc.ca/clyde/cfr.html
 
Pap Smear said:
1st of all Operation Northwoods DID plan on killing U.S Soldiers so that's a lie right there.

2nd Who killed Daniel Pearl? Khalid Sheikh Mohammed or Omar Saeed Sheikh?

If it's Khalid Sheikh Mohammed then when will Omar Saeed Sheikh be released from jail?

Omar Saeed Sheikh works for MI6 & the ISI, so why did he wire $100,000 to Mohammed Atta?

http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/south/10/08/india.ressa/

1st i didn't state, confirm or deny that so how is it a lie? lol

2nd im not spectacular with names so i cannot be sure at this moment

i honestly have no answer to your final question... but that does not disprove anything i said
 
mrjody said:
So, you acknowledge there might be things about 9/11 that we don't know?

even government acknowledges that... lots of results and findings are still due this year about 9/11

i never claimed that the documented facts were exact,

oh and as for long passages of wrting can't read them.... i'm concussed so thats why im not responding to articles...and links
 
sitai said:
even government acknowledges that... lots of results and findings are still due this year about 9/11

i never claimed that the documented facts were exact,

oh and as for long passages of wrting can't read them.... i'm concussed so thats why im not responding to articles...and links

Do you simply ignore the questions that you haven't been issued an answer for?

How can a 747 escape radar detection?
 
sitai said:
1st i didn't state, confirm or deny that so how is it a lie? lol
It was the video you just posted that claims "Operation Northwoods" never mean to kill anyone, but it did, so THEY'RE LYING.

:lol:

sitai said:
2nd im not spectacular with names so i cannot be sure at this moment

I'm not suprised that you don't know who Omar Saeed Sheikh is. :rolleyes:

sitai said:
i honestly have no answer to your final question... but that does not disprove anything i said

It proves that the Hijackers have links to Intelligence Agencies.
 
sitai said:
first let me say i am not going into depth of all the claims because

1 some are just flat out unverified statements aka fabrications
2 since no1 wanted to be specific i had to be general because some theories actually disagree with others!!
thats why i asked you to be specific... there's about 100 different theories you know!!

i'm simply going to give a brief outline of the main theories and what i think about it. and why i believe this entire hoax would be impossible

You say that explosives brought down the Twin Towers, but the impact of the Boeing 767s damaged support columns and steel floor trusses, causing the inward collapse of perimeter columns, which pulled floors straight down. A misquote of a demolition expert propagated the explosives theory. Seismic spikes, caused by debris hitting the ground, were recorded 10 sec. after each tower started to fall.
You claim WTC 7 also contained explosives since fire alone has never felled a modern skyscraper. Authorities have delayed releasing a WTC 7 report to hide the truth.
World Trade Center 7 is the best proof for controlled demolition because it wasn't hit by airliners and only had a few fires. some i even heard some say that there was a confession from the building owner who said he "pulled" it.(more rumours)
This is deceptive because while building 7 wasn't hit by an airliner, it was hit by the large perimeter columns of the Tower collapse. It was 400 ft away but the towers were more than 1300 ft tall!!!!! As the tower peeled open, it easily tilted over to reach building 7.

In Dennis Smith's book, "Report from Ground Zero" he writes about first account from a group of firefigher survivors. Lieutenant Mickey Croft of Engine Company Sixteen was around the second floor in Stairway B when the building began to collapse. He described the wind as being "fierce" and that it almost lifted his body. He notes that he had to hold on to his helmet so it wouldn't blow off. A downward wind would not have caused him to lose his helmet. In fact an EXPLOSION from ground level would cause him to lose his helmet, the pancake theory does not explain how his helmet would of came of in all the air would of come from above.

ALSO

Jim McLean from Engine 39 was between the 1st and 2nd floors when the building began to fall. He also described a "rush of air going up".


An upward wind would be consistent with the demolition model of collapse, in which demolition charges are pre-positioned on support structures in the building’s interior. Their triggering and explosive reaction would tend to consume oxygen within the structure, sucking more air inward from the stairwells, while forcibly ejecting solid matter outward.


ALSO more quotes from his book

eye witness acount said:
Pasquale Buzzelli, a structural engineer at the Port Authority, and Genelle Guzman McMillan, a secretary at the Port Authority, were together in Stairway B on the 13th floor of the North Tower when it collapsed. After losing consciousness, Buzzelli awoke on the surface, on top of a pile of rubble, and was carried away with minor injuries. McMillan survived in an air pocket for 27 hours before she was rescued. She is famous for being the last person pulled alive from the rubble.

The pancake model of collapse would have an increasing mass of kinetically charged objects piling down, burying everything beneath it, arguing against any survival from any lower floors, let alone objects from the lower floors emerging at or near the top of the heap. However, this observed fact is consistent with the demolition model in which the upper floors are reduced to powder from the demolition charges, and the falling debris, while substantial, could spare a stairwell below, falling around it, rather than crushing it.

Each tower had three stairways labeled A, B and C. On most floors, the stairways were about 30 feet apart in the core with the plumbing, elevators and other infrastructure. Stairway B of the North tower was the only one to yield survivors. One possible explanation for these survivors, in the demolition model, is that explosives that were placed in the vicinity of this stairwell section failed to go off.


Additional facts regarding the collaspe of the twin towers


* The engineers who designed the building designed it to withstand impact by planes and fire.
* Building 7, which was not structurally damaged by aircraft, came down in a manner that matches the signature demolition model, complete with triggering squibs (outward explosions of support structures preceding the falling mass), and falling into its footprint. Slow motion video footage highlights these features.
* Towers 1 and 2 also fell in a manner consistent with demolition, and had numerous visible squibs preceding the falling mass. Bear in mind that a "tidy" and "safe" fall would not necessarily be the objective of individuals pulling off such a thing.
* Rate of speed of the fall is near that of free-fall, which contradicts the pancake model in which a delay must be expected due to conservation of momentum – one of the foundational Laws of Physics.
* The fine powder into which the building was converted during the collapse is consistent with the demolition model and its associated explosives. There would have been some pulverization in the pancake model, but not to the extent seen in this case.
* Molten iron in the wreckage, weeks after the collapse, is consistent with military-grade demolition charges, which chemicals continue to react with the metal long after the initial implosion event.
* Numerous eyewitnesses described hearing explosions not associated with the planes hitting the buildings.
* The wreckage from the towers was quickly shipped off for scrap, contrary to laws governing removal of items from a crime scene.
* WTC buildings 1,2 and 7 had undergone unannounced security evacuations in the days prior to Sept. 11. A concurrent power outage disabled security cameras. Explosives-sniffing dogs were called off as part of that evacuation procedure. Martin Bush, brother to the President, was involved with the security company involved in this process.
* It would take 10 men ten trips to place the necessary explosives to bring the towers down by demolition.
* The 911 Commission report says that there were no central support columns, which is a lie. The WTC had the most robust central support columns in the world at the time it was built, and was designed to be centrally supported.





sitai said:
A few critical elements including damage on the south face, unusual structural design to accommodate a Con Edison substation, extreme weight bearing on floors, and long-burning diesel fuel leaked from large emergency generators--compromised WTC 7's structural integrity.
You claim a missile or smaller plane not Flight 77 struck the Pentagon because the size of two were too small to have been made by a 757, which has a wingspan of nearly 125 ft. w
How do you explain how witnesses saw the 757 hit the Pentagon. The plane lost its wings when one hit the ground and the other slammed into the building's west wall before the Boeing's fuselage tore a 75-ft. hole in the outermost Ring E. The jet's landing gear caused the 12-ft. hole in inner Ring C. But to question Flight 77's demise is to question the fate of the 64 people onboard; the remains of all but one have been identified.
Seriously though how do you account for the 100’s of people who saw it fly passed them towards the pentagon? How do you account for the people at the scene who say they saw it? This one part of the hoax alone would require the cooperation of 100’s of people!!
Some also say fighter jets within range of the hijacked planes must have been under orders to stand down, since none from the 28 Air Force bases in the area was scrambled, but there are seven alert sites on the U.S. mainland, each with two active aircraft, that can scramble fighters. The 9/11 commission concluded that F-15s were scrambled within 6 min. of notification of the hijacking of Boston's Flight 11. Because hijackers had dismantled the planes' transponders, the F-15s could not identify the endangered aircraft.


Hundreds of people reported seeing a Boeing 757, a vastly smaller plane, and a missle hit the Pentagon. What contributes to this fluctuation of uncertainty among the eye witnesses. Why does it seem that they all SAW different things?????

satellite.jpg


second-anneau.jpg


The first satellite image shows the section of the building that was hit by the Boeing. In the image below, the second ring of the building is also visible. It is clear that the aircraft only hit the first ring. The four interior rings remain intact. They were only fire-damaged after the initial explosion.

Can you explain how a Boeing 757-200, weighing nearly 100 tons and travelling at a minimum speed of 250 miles an hour* only damaged the outside of the Pentagon?


premiers-secours2.jpg




this photo shows that the building just after the attack. We may observe that the aircraft only hit the ground floor. The four upper floors collapsed towards 10.10 am. The building is 26 yards high.

Can you explain how a Boeing 14.9 yards high, 51.7 yards long, with a wingspan of 41.6 yards and a cockpit 3.8 yards high, could crash into just the ground floor of this building?



pelouse.jpg



The photograph above shows the lawn in front of the damaged building.

remember that the aircraft only hit the ground floor of the Pentagon's first ring. Can you find debris of a Boeing 757-200 in this photograph?


avion-incrustation.jpg



The photographs in Question 5 show representations of a Boeing 757-200 superimposed on the section of the building that was hit.

Can you explain what happened to the wings of the aircraft and why they caused no damage?



sitai said:
For anyone interested in a point-by-point debunking of some of the most popular conspiracy theories out there like the fact that steel melts at 1525° C, and although jet fuel burns only at 825° C, it doesn't have to burn hot enough to melt to cause the buildings to collapse, since steel loses 50% of its strength at 648 ° C

I won't argue that the U.S. government does not engage in brutal, murderous skulduggery from time to time. But the notion that the U.S. government either detected the attacks but allowed them to occur, or, worse, conspired to kill thousands of Americans to launch a war-for-oil in Afghanistan is absurd.

So let's start with a broad question: would U.S. officials be capable of such a foul deed? Capable -- as in able to pull it off and willing to do so. Simply put, the spies and special agents are not good enough, evil enough, or gutsy enough to mount this operation. That conclusion is based partly on, dare I say it, common sense, but also on years spent covering national security matters.



My main reason to be sceptical from the start is the complexity of how you would pull off such hoax. Not so much as citizens are concerned but government officials, FBI, CIA and organisations such as these have hiarachical structures. They generally tend to work well that way… the opposite goes for communication between the various organisations. My point is to execute the simultaneous destruction of the two towers, a piece of the Pentagon, and four airplanes and make it appear as if it all was done by another party -- is far beyond the skill level of U.S. intelligence. It would require dozens (or scores or hundreds) of individuals to attempt such a scheme. They would have to work together, and trust one another not to blow their part or reveal the conspiracy. They would hail from an assortment of agencies (CIA, FBI, INS, Customs, State, FAA, NTSB, DOD, etc.)

Anyone with the most basic understanding of how government functions (or does not function) realizes that the various bureaucracies of Washington particularly those of the national security "community" do not work well together. Even covering up advance knowledge would require an extensive plot. If there truly had been intelligence reports predicting the 9/11 attacks, these reports would have circulated through intelligence and policymaking circles before the folks at the top decided to smother them for geopolitical gain. That would make for a unwieldy conspiracy of silence. And in either scenario -- planning the attacks or permitting them to occur everyone who participated in the conspiracy would have to be sure that all the other plotters would stay quiet.
“Conspiracy theories may seem more nuisance than problem. But they do compete with reality for attention. There is plenty to be outraged over without becoming obsessed with X Files-like nonsense. Few will argue that mistakes were made… There are always national security misdeeds to be mad about. They may not be as cinematic in nature as a plot in which shady, unidentified U.S. officials scheme to blow up the World Trade Towers to gain control of an oil pipeline in Central Asia. But dozens of dead Hondurans or twenty or so Afghans wrongly killed ought to provoke anger and protest. In fact, out-there conspiracy theorizing serves the interests of the powers-that-be by making their real transgressions seem tame in comparison. (What's a few dead in Central America, compared to thousands in New York City? Why worry about Negroponte, when unidentified U.S. officials are slaughtering American civilians to trigger war?)
Perhaps there's a Pentagon or CIA office that churns out this material. Its mission: distract people from the real wrongdoing. Now there's a conspiracy theory worth exploring. Doesn't it make sense? Doesn't it all fit together? I challenge anyone to disprove it”

please take the time to read this and preferably respond


What the hell are you talking about?

The simple facts of temperatures

* 1535ºC (2795ºF) - melting point of iron
* ~1510ºC (2750ºF) - melting point of typical structural steel
* ~825ºC (1517ºF) - maximum temperature of hydrocarbon fires burning in the atmosphere without pressurization or pre-heating (premixed fuel and air - blue flame)

Diffuse flames burn far cooler.
Oxygen-starved diffuse flames are cooler yet.

The fires in the towers were diffuse -- well below 800ºC.
Their dark smoke showed they were oxygen-starved -- particularly in the South Tower


Basically no matter what, the towers were not hot enough to cause the stability of the building to collapse thus why EXPLOSIVES were needed!!!!

1540044w.gif




The CIA and FBI have put a gag order on Air traffic control officials who were in contact with the pilots of 9/11. Why would they do this?............Why was a fighter jet never assembled to see why the planes were going off course????............NORAD has a specific policy stating that when a plane goes off course the pilot has only a certain amount of time to respond or jets are sent into the air to retrieve the plane.

NONE OF THIS OCCURED ON SEPTEMEBR 11


the CIA is directly responsible for creating and funding the Taliban


The Bush family and the Bin Laden family are CLOSE Business partners and FRIENDS. George BUSH first oil reserve he purchased it from the Bin Laden family.

bushladen_network.gif



Bush pictured with the Bin Laden family
YE_MIDEAST.jpg


Bush SR with Laden Family members
bushcarlyle.jpg



Members of the Bin Laden Family were even flown out of the country soon after the attacks

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/09/30/archive/main313048.shtml


So this shows that the government had previous knowledge of who "may" be responsible yet they didn't do anything to prevent it. They also claimed they knew who the culprit was soon after the attacks. In fact they knew so quickly they even arranged for this family to be flown out of the country????????????


GET THE FUCK OUTTA HERE
 
bigirl said:
WRONG!
12.jpg


So answer me just one teensy weensy lil question....
How can you claim the 767s caused and inward collapse when in the picture above they are clearly bent outwards?
*bump*
 
mrjody said:
Do you simply ignore the questions that you haven't been issued an answer for?

How can a 747 escape radar detection?

im no expert but there would be several 747's flying in the proximity, maybe it is down to the fact that they were on radar but by the time they identified the plane that it was it was to late.. because they only had a small time period in which to act.. don't quote me but i read an atricle whch stated something as such
 

Only individuals who want to remain willfull ignorant, fully swallow and accept the "official 9/11 story" completely WITH NO QUESTIONS.

There is NO SHORTAGE of such individuals in America and the world.

Governments LIE
So called Religious leaders LIE
Your mother & father told you some LIES

All of that being said, Despite the Perpetual US government propaganda...



PROPAGANDA
• noun - information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote a political cause or point of view.

— ORIGIN originally denoting a committee of Roman Catholic cardinals responsible for foreign missions: from Latin congregatio de propaganda fide ‘congregation for propagation of the faith’.



...About 911, A plurality of Americans
(in the last Pew research poll 58% don't believe the "official story")
CAN SEE THE OBVIOUS LIES in the official government and corporate media sanctioned 9/11 story.

The Gapping holes in the "official story" are MASSIVE.
Books and Documentaries too numerous to mention here, but that you are all familiar with highlight the various implausibilities of the "official story" .

There is NO EXPLANATION!
NONE!
That explains the collapse of World Trade Center 7.
World Trade Center 7 WAS NOT hit by a plane.
IT'S collapse is AN OBVIOUS CONTROLLED DEMOLITION.

The "official story" propaganda about what happened at the Pentagon is also implausible. The site below thoroughly debunks the "official story" about what happened at the Pentagon.

Don't believe The Hype.


http://thepentacon.com/
 
sitai said:
im no expert but there would be several 747's flying in the proximity


Tell me this:

Do you know what "restricted air space" means?

Planes arent of any size allowed anywhere NEAR the Pentagon.
Especially one that has a disabled transponder, several hundred miles off course...

The "buffer zone" takes into account a plane moving at several hundred miles an hour, and the time required to mount an air defense.


You don't know enough about the subject....

Maybe it will be covered next semester...
 
WHY EVEN ENTERTAIN THIS CLOWN ANY FURTHER HES RAMBLING A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT WITH NO CONCRETE PROOF.HE SAYS WTC 7 FELL BECAUSE DEBRIS FROM ONE OF THA TOWERS FELL ON IT AND MADE IT COLLAPSE.
SHOW US THA DEBRI IN THIS VIDEO?????WTC 7 COLLAPSE
GOVERMENT SAID SMALL FIRES LEVELED THA BUILDING.FIRES HAVE "NEVA" LEVELED A STEEL SKYSCRAPER BEFORE.
THIS IS WHAT THA DUDE WHO OWNED THA BULDING SAID HAPPEN.
THA TRUTH.COM
LOOKS LIKE THA GOVERMENT LIED AND YOU STILL HAVEN'T FURNISHED PROOF TO SAY OTHERWISE.CLOSE THIS FUCKING THREAD.
 
mrjody said:
Tell me this:

Do you know what "restricted air space" means?

Planes arent allowed anywhere NEAR the Pentagon.
The "buffer zone" takes into account a plane moving at several hundred miles an hour, and the time required to mount an air defense.


You don't know enough about the subject....

Maybe it will be covered next semester...


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


I want to see if this fool responds to my rebuttle after I just got done ethering his ass of the face of the Earth. Or will he continue to barry sanders his way out of certain questions.

barrysanders1.jpg




LOOK AT SITAI GO!!!!!!!!
 
mrjody said:
Tell me this:

Do you know what "restricted air space" means?

Planes arent of any size allowed anywhere NEAR the Pentagon.
Especially one that has a disabled transponder, several hundred miles off course...

The "buffer zone" takes into account a plane moving at several hundred miles an hour, and the time required to mount an air defense.


You don't know enough about the subject....

Maybe it will be covered next semester...
:lol: :lol: :lol: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:
YOU ARE JUST FUCKING KILLING ME DEAD TODAY!!!!!!!!!
 
i never claimed to have detailed scientifc knowledege superior to anyone on this board as to the inner workings of the fire/crashes etc

i put forth the general accepted answers to some of the main questions about the matter
i also tried to appeal to common sense

then again if you really wanted to find answers to your questions you'd probly look them up 4 yourselves, the fact that you direct them at me shows me you don't...

how many of you even read one link i posted entirely? 1?

i have found plenty of sufficient answers to all of your questions over the years but posting them would take far too long

its not that i'm so sure that i have all the facts...i never claimed too
its that you all are so sure that you do

you people 'reverse scientific method'. you determine what happened, throw out all the data that doesn't fit their conclusion, and then hail your findings as the only possible conclusion

imagine if people bothered to scrutinise what you see to be reality!!

"The mistaken belief that a handful of unexplained anomalies can undermine a well-established theory lies at the heart of all conspiratorial thinking"
"evidence" for a 9/11 conspiracy falls under the rubric of this fallacy. Such notions are easily refuted by noting that scientific theories are not built on single facts alone but on a convergence of evidence assembled from multiple lines of inquiry."[
 
mrjody said:
Tell me this:

Do you know what "restricted air space" means?

Planes arent of any size allowed anywhere NEAR the Pentagon.
Especially one that has a disabled transponder, several hundred miles off course...

The "buffer zone" takes into account a plane moving at several hundred miles an hour, and the time required to mount an air defense.


You don't know enough about the subject....

Maybe it will be covered next semester...

yes i am aware but how long between restricted airspace and the pentagon? how long did they have?
your not proving anything i just stated that i did'nt have an answer to that question and i gave a guess... thanks for educating me

and nope i won't be learning that next semester LIKE I SAID its not my field
 
sitai said:
i never claimed to have detailed scientifc knowledege superior to anyone on this board as to the inner workings of the fire/crashes etc

i put forth the general accepted answers to some of the main questions about the matter
i also tried to appeal to common sense

then again if you really wanted to find answers to your questions you'd probly look them up 4 yourselves, the fact that you direct them at me shows me you don't...

how many of you even read one link i posted entirely? 1?

i have found plenty of sufficient answers to all of your questions over the years but posting them would take far too long

its not that i'm so sure that i have all the facts...i never claimed too
its that you all are so sure that you do

you people 'reverse scientific method'. you determine what happened, throw out all the data that doesn't fit their conclusion, and then hail your findings as the only possible conclusion

imagine if people bothered to scrutinise what you see to be reality!!

"The mistaken belief that a handful of unexplained anomalies can undermine a well-established theory lies at the heart of all conspiratorial thinking"
"evidence" for a 9/11 conspiracy falls under the rubric of this fallacy. Such notions are easily refuted by noting that scientific theories are not built on single facts alone but on a convergence of evidence assembled from multiple lines of inquiry."[


log_off.jpg
 
sitai said:
i never claimed to have detailed scientifc knowledege superior to anyone on this board as to the inner workings of the fire/crashes etc

i put forth the general accepted answers to some of the main questions about the matter
i also tried to appeal to common sense

then again if you really wanted to find answers to your questions you'd probly look them up 4 yourselves, the fact that you direct them at me shows me you don't...

how many of you even read one link i posted entirely? 1?

i have found plenty of sufficient answers to all of your questions over the years but posting them would take far too long

its not that i'm so sure that i have all the facts...i never claimed too
its that you all are so sure that you do

you people 'reverse scientific method'. you determine what happened, throw out all the data that doesn't fit their conclusion, and then hail your findings as the only possible conclusion

imagine if people bothered to scrutinise what you see to be reality!!

"The mistaken belief that a handful of unexplained anomalies can undermine a well-established theory lies at the heart of all conspiratorial thinking"
"evidence" for a 9/11 conspiracy falls under the rubric of this fallacy. Such notions are easily refuted by noting that scientific theories are not built on single facts alone but on a convergence of evidence assembled from multiple lines of inquiry."[
I POSTED 2 VIDEO LINKS THAT SPOKE FOR THEMSELVES AND SHUT DOWN THA COPY AND PASTED SHIT YOU TRIED TO PASS OFF AS SHIT YOU BRAINSTORMED.
 
smokedacane said:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


I want to see if this fool responds to my rebuttle after I just got done ethering his ass of the face of the Earth. Or will he continue to barry sanders his way out of certain questions.

barrysanders1.jpg




LOOK AT SITAI GO!!!!!!!!

i didnt read it i can't concussed only short paragraphs
 
DaAssWatcher said:
I POSTED 2 VIDEO LINKS THAT SPOKE FOR THEMSELVES AND SHUT DOWN THA COPY AND PASTED SHIT YOU TRIED TO PASS OFF AS SHIT YOU BRAINSTORMED.

i did'nt see them and i never said i was brainstorming!!
whats with all the false accusations

trust me if i had written it entirely it would habe been much better, i would never pass that off proudly
 
DaAssWatcher said:
I POSTED 2 VIDEO LINKS THAT SPOKE FOR THEMSELVES AND SHUT DOWN THA COPY AND PASTED SHIT YOU TRIED TO PASS OFF AS SHIT YOU BRAINSTORMED.


Hell yeah, he has yet to respond to my post!


That shit won't fly in the courtroom and you may need to rethink your aspirations in the career field of law


lawyer_cartoon.gif
 
Back
Top