Young chick tries to refuse traffic ticket and situation escalates quickly
- Thread starter a1rimrocka
- Start date
Take a closer look @ the video you posted, although the cop was pulling on the window, what actually made it break was the woman making the window go up, her left hand started on her lap, but @ the 2:05 mark she puts it back on the armrest and tries to put the window up as the cop tried to pull the window out, her hand springs back to her lap after the window shatters, I didn't point this out before but from the moment she put the window back ALL THE WAY UP & said "No!" the officer had the right to detain her for non-compliance!
ANY situation where property is damaged automatically triggers an investigation, nothing special about that aspect of this traffic stop.
More than likely this will become a training case for future officers, because in the end this situation should NOT have gotten as far as this woman's window being shattered, but I can tell you this much, she just made it WORSE for other drivers, because the police way to diffuse or keep this situation from happening is to detain her from jump when she couldn't produce her registration!
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The problem with that is that she's saying it AFTER everything is going to shit. In the beginning of the video she is acting cheery and saying she needs to get to an appointment. If it wwere really that serious....she would of said something BEFORE it got real.
For your question, "NOW IS THIS A BATTLE THAT REALLY NEEDS TO BE FOUGHT", maybe not, but on the other hand, police are supposed to be trained to handle that situation. If that cop thought his safety was in jeopardy, why didn't he pull his gun??? He had plenty of room to hand her that clipboard but he chose to pick a battle at that point. Also, if he though he was in danger, why would he take 2 hands to rip out a car window, wouldn't he have been completely vulnerable at that point if SHE pulled a gun??? You say that if you were him you would have gotten angry but what the fuck is that??? Angry??? There is no court in the land where he can justify his actions claiming "anger".
For your question, "NOW IS THIS A BATTLE THAT REALLY NEEDS TO BE FOUGHT", maybe not, but on the other hand, police are supposed to be trained to handle that situation. If that cop thought his safety was in jeopardy, why didn't he pull his gun??? He had plenty of room to hand her that clipboard but he chose to pick a battle at that point. Also, if he though he was in danger, why would he take 2 hands to rip out a car window, wouldn't he have been completely vulnerable at that point if SHE pulled a gun??? You say that if you were him you would have gotten angry but what the fuck is that??? Angry??? There is no court in the land where he can justify his actions claiming "anger".
You're skipping over the fact the she chose to pick a battle that she already conceded by lowering the window just a little @ a time after having it ALL THE WAY DOWN earlier, and after asking why she had to roll it down (which was her right to do) the officer replied 3 times, after which she said "No!" and rolled the window ALL THE WAY UP, once she said no the officer was within his rights to detain her in any way possible, but as I said earlier, this video will become a learning case for other officers to NOT let a situation get that far.
You are right. She probably learned not to roll all the way down and not get out and not agree to a search because she saw some video of people who smoke weed learned to protect their rights.
So here you are admitting that the "officer" did not handle the situation properly so you made my point.
Why do we stay trying to challenge the cops? Why couldn't she just do as she was asked? What is the point? Minimum convo with the cops. Comply and know your rights incase he escalates the situation. She should have just did what she was asked and shut the fuck up in the process.
Nah, she didn't learn ish, somebody told her on the phone not to, she had it rolled all the way down to begin with, which probably added to the situation, if she had done that from jump she would have asserted her position, since she already gave that up I believe that's what had the cop sort of bewildered and sent him there!
Also, keep in mind that the window thing varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, & from state to state, in Texas you can be arrested for not signing the ticket, out on the road the officer is ALWAYS correct (WITHIN REASON, she was CORRECT in NOT opening the glove compartment of an unfamiliar vehicle in view of the officer), YOUR time is in court!!!
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Fam, you NEVER want any sort of property damage to happen during a simple traffic stop, but as I stated earlier the "proper" way for the officer to handle the situation would have been to book her from jump for NOT having the registration, aka PROOF of owning the vehicle, he was within his rights to do so, he was actually letting her off soft, SHE exacerbated her OWN bullshit, I don't see why peeps want to make an already bad situation (which getting ANY ticket is) WORSE, exactly WHAT is gained by it?!?
Self satisfaction that you didn't do EVERYTHING that the cop told you to do, even though you're STILL parting with your hard earned $$$?!?
Cop already told her she had a $114 fine coming to her for no registration, she made an unsafe lane change AND had a broken taillight, THEN she told the cop "No!" to rolling down her window/opening the door, WHAT exactly did YOU think was going to happen from there?!?
Do YOU want every traffic cop to now just go in & throw the book @ ANYONE they pull over, or still judge everything on a case by case basis?
That's what the cop did here, and now he has a cut hand, a departmental investigation, and peeps on a message board telling him he was wrong, ALL this would have been prevented if he just took her out from jump and detained her!
Exactly! She said she was recording so if you feel wronged document it complain or sue. But you aint getting nowhere having a pissing contest with the officer smh. What the people who side with her expect the officer to do? Never is he gonna say you know what lady you right, you dont have to do what i asked fuck me and this ticket you have a nice day. That shit aint happening ever so just keep it moving, she had 2 tickets that you can get dismissed in one day fix the light and show the registration. smh
look everyone in the that issue did something wrong..the point for me is we have yet another black person yanked up in the system unnecessarily. As a black person we CANNOT afford to believe that authority figures/law enforcement is going to give the benefit of the doubt all the time.
There is NO historical precedent that shows the police EVER working in FAVOR of black citizens (okay I'm being a bit extreme there but you get my point). You are putting the responsibility and burden on the side of the force that has a historical issue when dealing with black people. The cop didn't control that scene..SHE controlled that scene and what was her way of controlling it?
Theres rights and then theres common sense.
If ALL she wanted to do was get on with her life then was taking a stand at the window worth it?
she got arrested on sept 4...its sept 22 now...shes got about another 3 MONTHS of court dates then car repair, atty fees, bail money, trying to get it expunged AND the shit is on the internet so it will pop up on any background check anyone does on her from now on.
OPEN QUESTION FOR THE BLACK PANTHER CREW:
WAS TAKING A STAND AT THE WINDOW WORTH IT???
If you get pulled over you should do the exact same thing as her. Just make sure you close your eyes so that the glass doesn't fly in them.
Can't believe the dumb asses who are blaming her. So she's a smart ass, that's justification for the cop breaking the window, she could have been seriously injured by flying glass. And she was perfectly within her rights not to roll her windows down any more than necessary to accept the ticket. Sounds to me like a lot of hard cases on this boards are really pussies afraid to stand up for their rights so they clown her because she wasn't afraid to. 
Can't believe the dumb asses who are blaming her. So she's a smart ass, that's justification for the cop breaking the window, she could have been seriously injured by flying glass. And she was perfectly within her rights not to roll her windows down any more than necessary to accept the ticket. Sounds to me like a lot of hard cases on this boards are really pussies afraid to stand up for their rights so they clown her because she wasn't afraid to.
Let's all follow the case to see if the court of law drops the charges. Yes courts get things wrong but we'll see.
Fam, you NEVER want any sort of property damage to happen during a simple traffic stop, but as I stated earlier the "proper" way for the officer to handle the situation would have been to book her from jump for NOT having the registration, aka PROOF of owning the vehicle, he was within his rights to do so, he was actually letting her off soft, SHE exacerbated her OWN bullshit, I don't see why peeps want to make an already bad situation (which getting ANY ticket is) WORSE, exactly WHAT is gained by it?!?
Self satisfaction that you didn't do EVERYTHING that the cop told you to do, even though you're STILL parting with your hard earned $$$?!?
Cop already told her she had a $114 fine coming to her for no registration, she made an unsafe lane change AND had a broken taillight, THEN she told the cop "No!" to rolling down her window/opening the door, WHAT exactly did YOU think was going to happen from there?!?
Do YOU want every traffic cop to now just go in & throw the book @ ANYONE they pull over, or still judge everything on a case by case basis?
That's what the cop did here, and now he has a cut hand, a departmental investigation, and peeps on a message board telling him he was wrong, ALL this would have been prevented if he just took her out from jump and detained her!
Don't explain nothing to these fools they know everything
Your first two words are right point. They describe you perfectly.Dumb bitch
She turned a traffic summons into an arrest for disobeying a lawful order
Can't believe the dumb asses who are blaming her. So she's a smart ass, that's justification for the cop breaking the window, she could have been seriously injured by flying glass. And she was perfectly within her rights not to roll her windows down any more than necessary to accept the ticket. Sounds to me like a lot of hard cases on this boards are really pussies afraid to stand up for their rights so they clown her because she wasn't afraid to.
she got arrested on sept 4...its sept 22 now...shes got about another 3 MONTHS of court dates then car repair, atty fees, bail money, trying to get it expunged AND the shit is on the internet so it will pop up on any background check anyone does on her from now on.
OPEN QUESTION FOR THE BLACK PANTHER CREW:
WAS TAKING A STAND AT THE WINDOW WORTH IT???
yes!!!!
Can't believe the dumb asses who are blaming her. So she's a smart ass, that's justification for the cop breaking the window, she could have been seriously injured by flying glass. And she was perfectly within her rights not to roll her windows down any more than necessary to accept the ticket. Sounds to me like a lot of hard cases on this boards are really pussies afraid to stand up for their rights so they clown her because she wasn't afraid to.
Nobody is justifying the cops action. My thing is why not just do what she was asked to do before hand?
Why rebel?
What was her point for not following an extremely simple order?
Think about what happen before the cop did his wrong, then ask yourself was this an avoidable and uneccessary situation.
Would you have followed the simple order or are you ready to deal with cops knowing they already have it out for us?
She has the right to do what she did, but just because it's a right doesn' make it right.
For the record, I am part of any "BLACK PANTHER CREW". I am just pointing out that the officer handled the situation badly, considering he DID have options to not "get mad". His issues are NOT more important than the students he is paid to protect, and he should be fired... but that's Florida and he's white, she's black so he is safe.
Can't believe the dumb asses who are blaming her. So she's a smart ass, that's justification for the cop breaking the window, she could have been seriously injured by flying glass. And she was perfectly within her rights not to roll her windows down any more than necessary to accept the ticket. Sounds to me like a lot of hard cases on this boards are really pussies afraid to stand up for their rights so they clown her because she wasn't afraid to.
Okay, so let's work this from the other POV, let's say that she established her right to not roll her window down, what exactly does that gain for her?!?
Now let's look from the cop's POV, if I have an uncooperative motorist that I just pulled over for for a broken taillight & an unsafe lane change, and when I question her she doesn't have her registration, it is COMPLETELY within my purview to then THOROUGHLY check the OUTSIDE of her vehicle, along with her license, and to write up ANY and ALL tickets that can be justified!
Police are people, and A LOT of what they do are simple judgement calls out in the field, he can decide to write up one ticket, 4 tickets, or even arrest you and have your car impounded, it's HIS discretion, ALL according to how YOU act!
YOU go ahead & be a dick, establishing your so called "rights" in the view of no one, ALL you accomplish is making your pockets even lighter than they are, use/waste time going back & forth to court, and pay a lawyer who is no doubting laughing @ you because he knows that YOU are the only one to blame for putting yourself in that situation!
Keep in mind that EVERYTHING that I'm saying ONLY refers to if you were riding CLEAN, if you're riding dirty then ALL BETS ARE OFF!
Dude, if you ran a company YOU would be getting sued left & right by former employees, while what happened was extreme, it was by no means an offense worthy of termination, the woman said "No!", rolled her window up & refused to put it back down until AFTER several warnings that her window would be broken, it seems that quite a few people that simply hate cops are letting their hatred cloud their judgement, while YOU may have felt that it was okay to hand your clipboard in to a driver, the officer involved did not, we don't know the history here, it's possible that another officer was dragged, or perhaps when an officer handed in their clipboard the driver came up shooting since their lap was then obscured by the clipboard, WE DON'T KNOW, but simply stated, why take any chances?!?
The simple truth is that it didn't have to be that way. Cops are always going to over do it if you try to get slick. She could have been on her way in a few minutes, but now ... as mentioned earlier, this will come up every time she goes for a job and they Google her.
She had NOTHING to gain by her actions. It was just not a wise play on her part. Not a single Black man here would do play it the way she did. We could easily end up dead
It wasn't even a BS stop to be upset about. Take the L, keep it moving and DON'T end up on the internet looking like a fool.
... as mentioned earlier, this will come up every time she goes for a job and they Google her.She had NOTHING to gain by her actions. It was just not a wise play on her part. Not a single Black man here would do play it the way she did. We could easily end up dead
It wasn't even a BS stop to be upset about. Take the L, keep it moving and DON'T end up on the internet looking like a fool.
Many of you, who don't know the governing laws of this land, who think people who resist the daily nonsense that municipalities and local circuit courts try to enforce or for those on the law enforcement side of things, are quick to think that people need to allow officers to assert brute force upon our rights of the laws of the land. Day by day, courts are passing laws which give law enforcement rights where we are turning to a military state. Things like being arrested for video taping an arrest and numerous laws being passed which strip us of our rights.
For those who care to take the time to read, and not be ignorant to the fact that there are inalienable rights as a human being within these united states of America
-----------------
Pulled over today with no license, license plate, or registration
A CHP officer came up behind me today on 680N and turned his lights on, because I dont have a plate, I knew he didnt have a warrant, I know I didnt commit any Crime, so if I pulled over, it would be considered an "Arrest by Consent". I continued to my exit, about 3/4 of a mile. On the exit the officer said "Pull over right here" through his loud speaker, I ignored him and continued to the light, turned my blinker, and turned. He repeated "pull over right now", I continued on, and took a right and pulled into a church parking lot.
The officer came to my passenger window, I immediately asked "Am I under arrest?", he said "No", I said, "So Im free to go?", he said "no", I said "So Im under arrest", this time he said "yes". I told him that I did not consent to this arrest, and asked him if he had a warrant. He said no, and asked for my drivers license.
I handed him my notarized secured party declaration, a copy of the title to the truck, and my proof of insurance.
He went back to his car for about 5 minutes. A sergeant showed up and took over. I asked him if I was arrested and he said "no". I again said "So I can leave?" he said "no, you're detained". He started talking about arresting me and towing the truck and I asked under what authority. I told him I was on private property and I have not committed a crime. He agreed, but was playing tough guy.
He started asking me what was going on with my license, asked if I was ever licensed in California, and why the truck wasnt registered. I explained all of my info, we read through the case law and cvc together, and both officers admitted that they were fascinated by this. Turns out they were anti-obama, anti-health care, and 'tea partiers' (who knows what type) but either way we made a connection.
I repeated that I have conviction and respect for the Constitution, and that I understand the codes and definitions. I reminded the officers that ALL ROADS in the United States have been deemed "channels of Interstate commerce" by the Supreme Court, and because of that, local and State laws are trumped by Federal Laws, and that in the Federal Laws a "Motor Vehicle" was a "Commercial Vehicle"...we were waiting for almost 30 minutes while they waited for word from their supervisors.
Eventually, they hand me a citation with "none" marked in the DL location, and "none" in the License Plate location. I asked him if I was required to sign it, and he said "yes, otherwise we have to take you to jail." This now made the signature "under duress". I wrote "under duress" and signed my name next to the ticket.
This is where I was surprised, the Officer said "hey, we never read you your Miranda rights, so anything we use against you in court is not admissible."
Im not sure if this is true, but I was intrigued.
I have written "refused for fraud" across the original ticket, and sent it to the Court and the CHP with the letter below attached. I have done this in the past, and never heard another word, I had wondered if there were any warrants, apparently not!
*************************************
NOTICE and DEMAND
ATTN: Certified Mail 7009 2820 0003 2274 8185
California Highway Patrol Golden Gate Division
Officer B. Knudsen
DUBLIN (390)
4999 Gleason Road
Dublin, CA 94568-3310
CC: Certified Mail 7009 2820 0003 2274 8192
JUDICIAL COUNCIL OF CALIFORNIA, THE
Also Traded as ALAMEDA COUNTY SUPERIOR COURT
5672 Stoneridge Drive
Pleasanton, CA 94588-8559
RE: CALIFORNIA HIGHWAY PATROL
Violation Number: 60435 LJ
This notice to appear was signed UNDER DURESS as evidenced by the original citation in possession of, or submitted by Officer B. Knudsen.
Because this notice to appear was signed UNDER DURESS;
1) Statements made therein shall not be considered admissible evidence,
2) As a party to this action, I hereby void this contract and notice to appear, and
3) Any perceived consent or promise to appear is hereby withdrawn.
If you, or any Officer of the court or Officer of the CALIFORNIA HIGHWAY PATROL disagrees with the facts or statements stated above, you must refute those items point by point within 10 days of receipt of this Notice, via sworn affidavit, under your full commercial liability, signing under penalty of perjury that the facts contained therein are true, correct, complete and not misleading. Mere declarations are an insufficient response, as declarations permit lying by omission and hearsay, which no honorable draft may contain. If an extension of time is needed to properly answer, please request it in writing. Failure to respond will be deemed agreement with the facts stated above and an inability to prove your claim.
_____________________________________
Name, non resident, non licensed and non registered pursuant to CVC 4, 17459, 17460
See: Edwards v. California, 314 US 160 (1941), Thompson v. Smith, 154 SE 579., Hertado v. California, 110 US 516
(Enclosed) Copy of Notice to Appear
source: http://www.dailypaul.com/133248/pulled-over-today-with-no-license-license-plate-or-registration
For those who care to take the time to read, and not be ignorant to the fact that there are inalienable rights as a human being within these united states of America
-----------------
Pulled over today with no license, license plate, or registration
A CHP officer came up behind me today on 680N and turned his lights on, because I dont have a plate, I knew he didnt have a warrant, I know I didnt commit any Crime, so if I pulled over, it would be considered an "Arrest by Consent". I continued to my exit, about 3/4 of a mile. On the exit the officer said "Pull over right here" through his loud speaker, I ignored him and continued to the light, turned my blinker, and turned. He repeated "pull over right now", I continued on, and took a right and pulled into a church parking lot.
The officer came to my passenger window, I immediately asked "Am I under arrest?", he said "No", I said, "So Im free to go?", he said "no", I said "So Im under arrest", this time he said "yes". I told him that I did not consent to this arrest, and asked him if he had a warrant. He said no, and asked for my drivers license.
I handed him my notarized secured party declaration, a copy of the title to the truck, and my proof of insurance.
He went back to his car for about 5 minutes. A sergeant showed up and took over. I asked him if I was arrested and he said "no". I again said "So I can leave?" he said "no, you're detained". He started talking about arresting me and towing the truck and I asked under what authority. I told him I was on private property and I have not committed a crime. He agreed, but was playing tough guy.
He started asking me what was going on with my license, asked if I was ever licensed in California, and why the truck wasnt registered. I explained all of my info, we read through the case law and cvc together, and both officers admitted that they were fascinated by this. Turns out they were anti-obama, anti-health care, and 'tea partiers' (who knows what type) but either way we made a connection.
I repeated that I have conviction and respect for the Constitution, and that I understand the codes and definitions. I reminded the officers that ALL ROADS in the United States have been deemed "channels of Interstate commerce" by the Supreme Court, and because of that, local and State laws are trumped by Federal Laws, and that in the Federal Laws a "Motor Vehicle" was a "Commercial Vehicle"...we were waiting for almost 30 minutes while they waited for word from their supervisors.
Eventually, they hand me a citation with "none" marked in the DL location, and "none" in the License Plate location. I asked him if I was required to sign it, and he said "yes, otherwise we have to take you to jail." This now made the signature "under duress". I wrote "under duress" and signed my name next to the ticket.
This is where I was surprised, the Officer said "hey, we never read you your Miranda rights, so anything we use against you in court is not admissible."
Im not sure if this is true, but I was intrigued.
I have written "refused for fraud" across the original ticket, and sent it to the Court and the CHP with the letter below attached. I have done this in the past, and never heard another word, I had wondered if there were any warrants, apparently not!
*************************************
NOTICE and DEMAND
ATTN: Certified Mail 7009 2820 0003 2274 8185
California Highway Patrol Golden Gate Division
Officer B. Knudsen
DUBLIN (390)
4999 Gleason Road
Dublin, CA 94568-3310
CC: Certified Mail 7009 2820 0003 2274 8192
JUDICIAL COUNCIL OF CALIFORNIA, THE
Also Traded as ALAMEDA COUNTY SUPERIOR COURT
5672 Stoneridge Drive
Pleasanton, CA 94588-8559
RE: CALIFORNIA HIGHWAY PATROL
Violation Number: 60435 LJ
This notice to appear was signed UNDER DURESS as evidenced by the original citation in possession of, or submitted by Officer B. Knudsen.
Because this notice to appear was signed UNDER DURESS;
1) Statements made therein shall not be considered admissible evidence,
2) As a party to this action, I hereby void this contract and notice to appear, and
3) Any perceived consent or promise to appear is hereby withdrawn.
If you, or any Officer of the court or Officer of the CALIFORNIA HIGHWAY PATROL disagrees with the facts or statements stated above, you must refute those items point by point within 10 days of receipt of this Notice, via sworn affidavit, under your full commercial liability, signing under penalty of perjury that the facts contained therein are true, correct, complete and not misleading. Mere declarations are an insufficient response, as declarations permit lying by omission and hearsay, which no honorable draft may contain. If an extension of time is needed to properly answer, please request it in writing. Failure to respond will be deemed agreement with the facts stated above and an inability to prove your claim.
_____________________________________
Name, non resident, non licensed and non registered pursuant to CVC 4, 17459, 17460
See: Edwards v. California, 314 US 160 (1941), Thompson v. Smith, 154 SE 579., Hertado v. California, 110 US 516
(Enclosed) Copy of Notice to Appear
source: http://www.dailypaul.com/133248/pulled-over-today-with-no-license-license-plate-or-registration
again...she got arrested on sept 4...its sept 22 now...shes got about another 3 MONTHS of court dates then car repair, atty fees, bail money, trying to get it expunged AND the shit is on the internet so it will pop up on any background check anyone does on her from now on.
OPEN QUESTION FOR THE BLACK PANTHER CREW:
WAS TAKING A STAND AT THE WINDOW WORTH IT???
At what point did I state that as you quoted.
I never defended her actions, I said his were uncalled for. Never said she was right, nor would I say anything she did was right. All any of my posts said was his actions were uncalled for.
you can point out case law all you want...there are more things to consider than trying to make the cops look foolish. Like if I were an employer considering hiring her...If I saw that vid it would influence my decision. And thats something thats very real and possible long after she's won her case IF she wins (which won't make the news)...just admit it homie the window, and thats where things got off the rails, wasn't worth it..
you know it and I know and the board knows it.
Dude, did you forget the window was halfway down? Why was he not able to hand her the clipboard for a signature? Again, the window was halfway down, that is why he was able to pull it until it broke. Again, if he felt that he was in some kind of danger from her having a window halfway down (as stupid as that sounds), why would he use both hands to break the window? Why wasn't the "in danger" officer keeping one hand on his gun??? And she did NOTHING to assault that fool, whatever happened to him came from his own poor choices. I hope she sues that lying bitch of a cop.
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