Where Does Lebron Rank All-Time For You As Of Today?

[Spectrum]

hey according to queen t the handchecking rule was removed to help jordan win rings and he wouldn't have won any rings if they never removed it.. yes he said that..funny thing the idiot didn't kno the rule came after jordan first 3 peat

Btw. @KingTaharqa has been on record having Jordan in his top 5 for a while. He's long called him the greatest SG in NBA history. I think he uses exaggeration to try to make points because Jordan gets a pass on a lot of things. I don't agree with his exaggerations, but I agree with some of his premises. Like KingT doesn't believe Pippen carried those squads.if he did.. he would never have jordan in his top five... what's his really saying is that Jordan had great players around him too when he won. It wasn't like they were winning Finals that they were supposed to lose. And regardless of whether he retired or not and was rusty has hell, Jordan fucked up against Orlando. But people act like it doesn't count... it's the equivalent of trying to give Curry a pass on a mythical knee injury. It's a consistency thing.

 

[RoadRage]

When folks say things like LeBron looks lost when you don't allow him to find his driving lanes, this goes to show that they are seeing things but have no idea whats going on..
For one what I seriously doubt that fany substainable facts supporting these claims could ever be found so these things they think they are seeing are nothing but biased opinions, that seem to occur in the minds of people who for some reason have deep disdain towards LeBron... Another hint that is a figment of their imagination these guys is how no coach has ever been able to eploit these so called weaknesses, not the best team in the history of the regular season or non of the teams that has faced LeBron...
People point to the Mavs team and say look they did it, failing to realize the unusual set of circumstances that allowed the Mavs to play the way they did... For one the Heat had no big men, no re-bounders, and no outside shooters, plus the Mavs had three big men and two 7 footers.. Matter fact in spite of all of that the Heat was actually winning until Dallas got smart and switched to a zone defense, where they were able to defend the paint with two 7 footers and a power forward...
The NFL equivalent would be a team committing their corners, linebackers and line to stop the running game... Well if your passing game is crap this would be a problem even if you had the best running back ever, go ask Barry Sanders...
Today if you were to think about implementing that same zone defense the Cavs would torch that same Mavs for 50 three pointers, forcing them to pull out the zone then LeBron would eat them up as usual...
So one one hand I am claiming no man, not LeBron not Jordan, not Kareem is superman to the point of winning shit on their own, everybody needs proper roll players however if you surround the great ones with the right roll players then something magical happens, where their level becomes elevated due to the roll players allowing them to become the superstars they are...
With out the right pieces in place even they can be exploited... Again ask Barry....

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

Oh. I listed it in another thread. Some of it isn't even his fault (the media). You should make a thread 'why don't you like Steph Curry". Remember, I was probably the first person who called him the greatest shooter of all-time....the non-media stuff is how a PG can have a negative assist to turnover ratio in the finals ...not a 2 for 1 which would be below average..or a 1 for 1... a negative assist to turnover ratio.. a starting PG has probably never done that in the finals, ever.. He's an able passer too.. he's just lazy kind of like Harden. Harden can play defensive he just doesn't care about it. A PG throwing behind the back passes out of bounds with a finals on the line or a PG throwing one-handed no look passes that become turnovers with the game on the line hurts my soul.

That's what I think Durant is going to lead the Warriors in scoring. Curry, if he truly wants to become a better player, is going to come back as a better distributor and not just a shooter.

I feel you. Frankly, Durant should lead them in scoring. They can't win if he doesnt IMO. Curry, as great of an offensive player and shooter he is, his game really was never suited to be the #1. His game has all of the characteristics of being a #2, and honestly, he should be unguardable with Durant there because I don't see anyone that can truly guard him 1 on 1 without focused help, and Durant makes that damn near impossible. He can still avg 25 per because he is going to get a lot of open looks. Teams will HAVE to periodically double KD, and that will create a serious problem with the shooters they have. I'm willing to bet Curry's PER goes up noticeably next season...

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

Btw. @KingTaharqa has been on record having Jordan in his top 5 for a while. He's long called him the greatest SG in NBA history. I think he uses exaggeration to try to make points because Jordan gets a pass on a lot of things. I don't agree with his exaggerations, but I agree with some of his premises. Like KingT doesn't believe Pippen carried those squads.if he did.. he would never have jordan in his top five... what's his really saying is that Jordan had great players around him too when he won. It wasn't like they were winning Finals that they were supposed to lose. And regardless of whether he retired or not and was rusty has hell, Jordan fucked up against Orlando. But people act like it doesn't count... it's the equivalent of trying to give Curry a pass on a mythical knee injury. It's a consistency thing.

We don't know if Curry was injured or not, and i don't think people give Air a pass... However to sit out a year and a half you will NOT come back without any rust. Doesn't change the end result that he helped them lose that series, but to act like his layoff shouldn't be included in the evaluation equations is inconsistent as hell too... Curry, injured or not, played the whole season. That was more of an indictment on his lack of versatility in his game than his injury....

 

[Spectrum]

We don't know if Curry was injured or not, and i don't think people give Air a pass... However to sit out a year and a half you will NOT come back without any rust. Doesn't change the end result that he helped them lose that series, but to act like his layoff shouldn't be included in the evaluation equations is inconsistent as hell too... Curry, injured or not, played the whole season. That was more of an indictment on his lack of versatility in his game than his injury....

I don't disagree with you. Sitting out a month (much less over a year) is going to have you all off. Dude wasn't in game shape and his rhythm was off, but some people like to act like that season never happened.

 

[Spectrum]

I feel you. Frankly, Durant should lead them in scoring. They can't win if he doesnt IMO. Curry, as great of an offensive player and shooter he is, his game really was never suited to be the #1. His game has all of the characteristics of being a #2, and honestly, he should be unguardable with Durant there because I don't see anyone that can truly guard him 1 on 1 without focused help, and Durant makes that damn near impossible. He can still avg 25 per because he is going to get a lot of open looks. Teams will HAVE to periodically double KD, and that will create a serious problem with the shooters they have. I'm willing to bet Curry's PER goes up noticeably next season...

I think Curry has a rare opportunity to elevate his game in a way that almost no one else will ever get. he'll be a point guard with two players who shoot over 40 percent from three and one of the players is a 5 time scoring leader. it's a PGs dream come true. He has to make the leap. He's too good to only depend on shit shooting. This guys is quick as hell and has some of the best handles in the game..

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

I don't disagree with you. Sitting out a month (much less over a year) is going to have you all off. Dude wasn't in game shape and his rhythm was off, but some people like to act like that season never happened.

Thats the way with any of a fans favorite. People don't want to act like LeBron didn't choke against Dallas, making excuses for it, or that Patrick really was a constant choke artist, etc. Thats the nature of the game. Even though Air didn't play the whole season, the team was much better prior to THAT version of Jordan playing, and he hurt the fuck out of them that season. Ass should have just waited until the next season to come back really...

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

I think Curry has a rare opportunity to elevate his game in a way that almost no one else will ever get. he'll be a point guard with two players who shoot over 40 percent from three and one of the players is a 5 time scoring leader. it's a PGs dream come true. He has to make the leap. He's too good to only depend on shit shooting. This guys is quick as hell and has some of the best handles in the game..

I'll realize he's understanding of his new role if he averages double digit assist next season. He should be taking maybe 5-7 less shots, and actually not free lance AS MUCH! He can't take away what makes him special offensively, but he has to adjust to a new kingpin in town. Durant HAS to be the MV offensive Player for them to win...

 

[Spectrum]

I'll realize he's understanding of his new role if he averages double digit assist next season.

Oh. I wasn't even expecting that much.. if he gets to 10 assists a game, you're not being the Warriors in a 7 game series.

 

[lazarus]

Lebron is obviously a better defender than Bird.

I'm taking Bird over Lebron if I'm able to pick a team. The killer instinct, the rebounding and passing ability, and his extremely high skill level makes me forgive the defensive gap. At the end of the day, the object of the game is to put the ball in the basket, and Bird is just better at doing that shit. The man even averaged a double-double for the career. Lebron has never averaged a double-double for a season.

I've seen Lebron exposed offensively too many times, and while there have been questions about Lebron's heart, Bird arguably had as much heart as anyone that has ever played the game.

...and there is no way Bird, and two other All-Stars lose to Dirk and Tyson Chandler.

See, the majority of people that actually play basketball and are good at it would say you're an idiot. Let's take away you're a white boy picking the slow white guy. The fact you are going against the grain of most hall of famers, INCLUDING BIRD, shows you that have pent up feelings towards LeBron and trying to reason to keep your view. It's like republicans denying racism. It's sad and it makes you look foolish

 

[RoadRage]

I feel you. Frankly, Durant should lead them in scoring. They can't win if he doesnt IMO. Curry, as great of an offensive player and shooter he is, his game really was never suited to be the #1. His game has all of the characteristics of being a #2, and honestly, he should be unguardable with Durant there because I don't see anyone that can truly guard him 1 on 1 without focused help, and Durant makes that damn near impossible. He can still avg 25 per because he is going to get a lot of open looks. Teams will HAVE to periodically double KD, and that will create a serious problem with the shooters they have. I'm willing to bet Curry's PER goes up noticeably next season...

I was on record saying you never ever should double Durant, that is the stupidest thing any team can do... What you do is collapse on him when he drives to the paint and pick and choose your spots to trap him off the dribble, but I have to educate some people by pointing out collapsing and trapping is not double teaming....
Good teams never double Durant and these are the teams that give him fits..

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

Oh. I wasn't even expecting that much.. if he gets to 10 assists a game, you're not being the Warriors in a 7 game series.

Yep. Thats why I said for them to win he has to accept his new role. That's part of why Cleveland beat them, his game is not meant to be the #1 go to player. Very rarely is a primarily jump shooting player the #1 offensive option.

Everyone is talking about how Durant isn't a fit for GS, yeah, he isn't a fit for LAST YEARS GS team, but... He adds a new dimension to them offensively which will make them that much more of a problem if their star players can adapt to altering the offense to support what KD brings.

 

[RoadRage]

Conversely Durant should never over dribble, make Durant the primary ball handler then his turnover increase tremendously, he is good on the fast break, catch and shoot once he gets heated, but he sucks at decision making with the ball in his hand, once G.S. figure this out OKC was toast.. And if you think I am hating go check the old post where I pointed this out when OKC had a big lead in the series...

 

[RoadRage]

Yep. Thats why I said for them to win he has to accept his new role. That's part of why Cleveland beat them, his game is not meant to be the #1 go to player. Very rarely is a primarily jump shooting player the #1 offensive option.

Everyone is talking about how Durant isn't a fit for GS, yeah, he isn't a fit for LAST YEARS GS team, but... He adds a new dimension to them offensively which will make them that much more of a problem if their star players can adapt to altering the offense to support what KD brings.

I hate to say this but Durant may be the type of player who makes his players worse, this is due to him needing so many touches for him to be effective and the fact that unlike other great players like Jordan, Kobe, and LeBron, you do not have to over extend your defense to stop him... Matter fact trying to stop him is not that big of issue, just as long as you can keep him to shooting what he normally shoots, and as long as he keeps up his turn over rate especially against good defenses... But the biggest flaw to his game is that while he is shooting and getting his touches other star players on his team tend to get less shots and if Durant takes less shots he practically becomes invisible, just like game 6 vs the Warriors...

 

[Day_Carver]

I don't think you know what facts are. Show me where it's "proven" that the 70/80s had "harder" rules? Harder for whom?

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/david_aldridge/04/22/aldridge.defenses/

https://swishnba.com/tag/hand-checking/


http://fan-i.com/nba/2015/11/22/beneficiary-of-no-hand-checking

Sorry for taking so long to respond...these articles list facts that clearly show how much easier it is to score in today's nba as oppose to older eras...now they're ate plenty of articles that show this..there are also plenty of players, from the old to new, and coaches that have stated as such..so for me i like to get info from people who have played and coach the game..since i never have..it's not rocket science and one who has followed the game and watched the game can clearly see this...

 

[Day_Carver]

You saying you're not a warriors' fan is like @Excelsior saying he's not a Kobe fan. Your entire posting history says otherwise.

 

[Spectrum]

Sorry for taking so long to respond...these articles list facts that clearly show how much easier it is to score in today's nba as oppose to older eras..

I don't think you know what proof means. I also don't think you understand what you're saying.


If the argument is what constitutes "easier" to score. The two clearest ways you can illustrate this is by points per game and shooting percentage. A higher scoring average illustrates that you're able to score more points this alluding to less efficient defensive abilities and/or increased offensive ability/efficiency. A higher shooting percentage illustrates that the defenses are allowing higher percentage shots and or shooting skills have increased.


Last season, the NBA average was 102 points per game on 45% shooting.


In 1986, the NBA average was 108 points per game on 48% shooting


In 1962, the NBA average was 118 points per game on 44% shooting.


Clearly, this current decade is NOT the easiest era for scoring. That's how you present factual evidence. And you prove your point by providing data.


Your argument could be that THIS SEASON it was easier to score than 5 seasons ago. That could be argued but even a beyond surface level look at that shows the flaw, easily.


And it's not that it's easier to score. What you're seeing is a proliferation of volume three point shooting. Overall the team shooting percentages from 3 haven't even increased. They've been stable over the last 20 years. You're just seeing more shots being taken from 3 which produces a higher scoring output with all other things remaining stable. It's not easier to score. Players are just shooting more 3s.

What you're seeing now is a change in defense that's made ONE aspect of the game to become more effective (outside shooting). It's no different that what you see in the NFL with making the game easier for WRs...but it's not easier for offenses overall.

 

[lazarus]

These dudes think they understand basketball more than the following people: jalen rose, bird, webber, tmac, Oscar Robertson, Julius,

Yep. Thats why I said for them to win he has to accept his new role. That's part of why Cleveland beat them, his game is not meant to be the #1 go to player. Very rarely is a primarily jump shooting player the #1 offensive option.

Everyone is talking about how Durant isn't a fit for GS, yeah, he isn't a fit for LAST YEARS GS team, but... He adds a new dimension to them offensively which will make them that much more of a problem if their star players can adapt to altering the offense to support what KD brings.

i agree, but defensively they will have the same problems. They're going to outscore everyone regular season unless two or three have off nights which will happen every now and then. But it's going to have problems when they face teams that can score at ease with offensive talent and by driving to the rim. Facing Lebron with no inside presence is yikes. He's just too strong. But Durant is a new wrinkle which remains to be seen if Cleveland can figure out. It all depends on the new scheme and how well its run by GS.

 

[lazarus]

On a side note, its interesting to see how GS made a lot of the league change their schemes and brought in smaller centers that can shoot and stretch defenses. Many feared the 7'1 big man that guards the paint was a relic. But then you see how not having one lets a slasher score at will. When you are guarding shooting teams, it doesn't matter but slashers eat this way. I think you will see more times have one of each type of big on their rosters or do what GS did, have Bogut set the stage for a few when needed and then start to run small for most of the game.

 

[Day_Carver]

I don't think you know what proof means. I also don't think you understand what you're saying.


If the argument is what constitutes "easier" to score. The two clearest ways you can illustrate this is by points per game and shooting percentage. A higher scoring average illustrates that you're able to score more points this alluding to less efficient defensive abilities and/or increased offensive ability/efficiency. A higher shooting percentage illustrates that the defenses are allowing higher percentage shots and or shooting skills have increased.


Last season, the NBA average was 102 points per game on 45% shooting.


In 1986, the NBA average was 108 points per game on 48% shooting


In 1962, the NBA average was 118 points per game on 44% shooting.


Clearly, this current decade is NOT the easiest era for scoring. That's how you present factual evidence. And you prove your point by providing data.


Your argument could be that THIS SEASON it was easier to score than 5 seasons ago. That could be argued but even a beyond surface level look at that shows the flaw, easily.


And it's not that it's easier to score. What you're seeing is a proliferation of volume three point shooting. Overall the team shooting percentages from 3 haven't even increased. They've been stable over the last 20 years. You're just seeing more shots being taken from 3 which produces a higher scoring output with all other things remaining stable. It's not easier to score. Players are just shooting more 3s.

What you're seeing now is a change in defense that's made ONE aspect of the game to become more effective (outside shooting). It's no different that what you see in the NFL with making the game easier for WRs...but it's not easier for offenses overall.

Bro let me help you...scoring is down compared to different eras because of pace of play, coaching, and players being less skilled among other things..that doesn't take away from the fact that the rules that changed created scenarios to help make scoring easier..mj, barkley, Ewing, Bird, magic, Oscar, olajawuan, Drexler, wilkins, Pippen, shaq, Kareem, Payton, mourning, mullin, isaiah,kiki, Kenny smith, Jack Ramsey, mcchale, greg pop, doug Collins, Phil Jackson, hubie brown, doc, kerr, George Karl, Larry brown, Miller, and many other great or good players and coaches etc etc have all stated the rules make easier for players to score..you can Google their comments on it..it's not hard to find..my articles that i posted earlier suggest that..again I'm going to take the words of people who played and coached the game at the highest level above fans..and I'm just a fan..now all I'm saying is the same..and i would have to assume that an offensively skilled player from different era could perform as such in this era..just because players of today are unable to take advantage of it doesn't mean it's not easier..now maybe they don't know what they're talking about, and maybe they are just off, and you are correct

 

[Day_Carver]

You saying you're not a warriors' fan is like @Excelsior saying he's not a Kobe fan. Your entire posting history says otherwise.

Im a fan of basketball..i like seeing dominant teams..i grew up watching dominant teams and i love it..if you look at my post when lbj teamed up with bosh and wade i wanted them to win..i wanted them to wreck the league..i want gs to wreck that league now..i wanna see a team win 4 in a row..that's all it is

 

[Spectrum]

Bro let me help you...scoring is down compared to different eras because of pace of play, coaching, and players being less skilled among other

You're doing everything but posting any empirical data that backs your premise oand keep leaning on anecdotal evidence.

You said it's easier to score in today's game. Where is the statistical evidence to support the claim? You can't post it because it doesn't exist. The only thing different between now and several years ago is the proliferation of 3 point shooting.

Appealing to "a famous" person said it is called the fallacious "appeal to popularity". Famous scientists all agreed the world was flat at one point? That means nothing. If the game is so much easier now, where is the empirical evidence to support it? Appeals to authority are meaningless

The ONLY era that had less scoring was the early 90s and 00s. The only thing that's changed is the proliferation of 3 point shooting...the perimeter play. All the major defensive rule changes had long been made at that point. So why is scoring up over the last 4 seasons? Look at the data. It's nothing but more 3 point shooting...nothing else.

Appealing to former players about the "ease" of play of the current game is juvenile. Practically every player in every sport thinks their era was the toughest. That's why it's meaningless conjectural because it's "anecdotal" evidence.

You clearly don't know what "proof" means.

Players from the 60s think the league was more competitive then because you had fewer teams and talent was less dispersed. So now your appeal to authority doesn't work. That's why it's called a fallacious argument. So the people in the 60s, think the 80s had it easy. Players from the 80s think the 00s had it easier. Ask current players they'll tell you it's more difficult because of the athletic ability of defenders and the speed and complexity of defensive schemes. That's all anecdotal evidence.

 

[Spectrum]

..that doesn't take away from the fact that the rules that changed created scenarios to help make scoring easier..

Nope. You've argued that the current era is the easiest of any era.

How many players averaged 30 points per game in 2016? Just one

How many players averaged 30 points per game in 1962? 6. With one scoring 50 points per game.

You're saying it's the easiest era to score yet in practically every decade proceeding it, there were more points scored per game and way more players averaging 30 points or more per game.

If you're arguing it was because of "pace", that just means it was easier. Defensive schemes could not slow the pace of the game..which makes it easier for the offenses.

There is no argument for 2016 being the "easiest" time for offenses.

You're only argument can be the last 4 years over the previous decade because the last 4 years have seen an increase in ppg...but when you look at the data, nothing else has changed by volume 3 point shooting...nothing.

And any basic mind will say...ok.. I think the skill level has risen... and the rules are there to promote more scoring, but on a adjusted rate, it's not moved.. that should tell you that rules changes are a red herring.. the only difference is volume three point shooting.

 

[tallblacknyc]

I asked you a question about Bird. Not Jordan. Can you answer it? I cant believe you tried to slide MJ into your answer as if they even remotely close in terms of athleticism. They arent even in the same galaxy.

But lets use MJ and explore this further. When he came into the league he didnt have a consistent jumper yet. No 3pt shot to speak of. No post game. Yet he couldnt be stopped. How did he score all his points then?

The post game in today's NBA doesnt exist anymore. Do you know why specifically?

For the record, Bird if he played today would be a PF. He would be great of course. But it wouldnt be the same Bird we saw in the 80s.

whoa did u say jordan didn't have a consistant jumper when he came into the league.. dude air jordan was known for gunning down the court and pulling up and hitting a quick 15 footer.. that's what made him hard to guard the fact he could juss pull up real fast and hit a quick j.. so while he running up u try to guard that quick j and he blow rite pass you for a layup or dunk.. like i said most people never seen "air" jordan play on this board.. u can tell cause all you hear about is the rodman 3 peat team.. people don't remember his offensive lacking bulls chips where he was the main scorer cause he had to.. pippen only average 20 points once during the first 3 peat yrs and their 3rd best scorer never averaged at least 15 points..that means 2 out of 3 yrs jordan didn't even have a 20 point scorer to help him win.. that's why people don't seem to remember why people thought the suns had a chance to beat them cause they had a team loaded with scorers..when u really look at the bulls bench in the first 3 peat u'd be like ehhh who are these guys..stacey king, scott williams, will perdue , lot of nobodies and not really good

 

[RoadRage]

Nope. You've argued that the current era is the easiest of any era.

How many players averaged 30 points per game in 2016? Just one

How many players averaged 30 points per game in 1962? 6. With one scoring 50 points per game.

You're saying it's the easiest era to score yet in practically every decade proceeding it, there were more points scored per game and way more players averaging 30 points or more per game.

If you're arguing it was because of "pace", that just means it was easier. Defensive schemes could not slow the pace of the game..which makes it easier for the offenses.

There is no argument for 2016 being the "easiest" time for offenses.

You're only argument can be the last 4 years over the previous decade because the last 4 years have seen an increase in ppg...but when you look at the data, nothing else has changed by volume 3 point shooting...nothing.

And any basic mind will say...ok.. I think the skill level has risen... and the rules are there to promote more scoring, but on a adjusted rate, it's not moved.. that should tell you that rules changes are a red herring.. the only difference is volume three point shooting.

Correct, I will take it one step further, today's game make it virtually to score in the paint, this is why that most of you to scorers in the league are jump shooters... If it was so easy to score in the paint you would expect more guys developing their game so that they could exploit this weakness... But instead the trend is getting smaller, slimmer, and being a better jump shooter....
This is one reason why I say that LeBron would actually be better off playing in a era where the rules was more conducive towards players with his type of game... Just look at Dominique for example, dude was a all-time great with not much of a jump shot, now tell me how many people with his playing style would dream of putting up his numbers with a lack of a perimeter game, in today's NBA...

 

[incogneg]

I have him Top 10 based on accomplishments, stats, and unique size and strength at his position.

He will have never be top 5 to me, because he lacks a lot of basic skills, no go-to moves, and no killer instinct. His basketball IQ is overrated. If he was not one of the most athletic players ever, and did not have his height and strength, he would be considered an average to below average player.

He really does not do anything, skill-wise, very well. He has not mastered anything on the offensive end.

If Kareem was 6'6", if Jordan didn't have big hands and God given bounce and body, if dr j didn't have hops, if wilt, if bill Russell wasn't on Celtics... You see my point right? You dissed LeBron bc hes one of the finest specimens to ever lace up high tops. That's ridiculous

 

[RoadRage]

To show you how much the game has changed back in his days Bird was considered a big man who can shoot the outside shot... Ask most old heads who had a better three point shot between him and LeBron hands down, everyone would say Bird... After all LeBron is just an inside shooter with no outside game...
While its true Bird has a better career 3pt % LeBron has taken a hell of a lot more three point shots 3953 to 1727, so you can look at it as more is asked from big men today, they just cannot sit in the paint looking to post or hit those comfy mid range shots...
If LeBron were to put up these number back in those days they would be looking at him as one of the best outside shooting big men ever, yet by today's standard he is just ok..

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

If Kareem was 6'6", if Jordan didn't have big hands and God given bounce and body, if dr j didn't have hops, if wilt, if bill Russell wasn't on Celtics... You see my point right? You dissed LeBron bc hes one of the finest specimens to ever lace up high tops. That's ridiculous

Better ways to make this point Bruh

 

[NER0]

Got damn...y'all niggas long winded than A muthafucker...

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

Got damn...y'all niggas long winded than A muthafucker...

Funny thing is... most of the back and forth has been repeated 100s of times in other threads! No new info here!

 

[HotNixon36]

If Kareem was 6'6", if Jordan didn't have big hands and God given bounce and body, if dr j didn't have hops, if wilt, if bill Russell wasn't on Celtics... You see my point right? You dissed LeBron bc hes one of the finest specimens to ever lace up high tops. That's ridiculous

No, I did not diss him. Anybody that has ever played or coached basketball from college level on up, knows Lebron has a weak ass jumpshot, has no go-to moves, and has no killer instinct. This is all truth. He can pass pretty well, but he lacks a lot of the basics. Being a good athlete does not make you an offensively skilled basketball player. There is no skill that Lebron has mastered on offense. He is pretty good all around, but has never been a fluid offensive player. Kobe, Iverson, Carmelo, Durant, etc.... are pure, natural scorers.

All these guys you named had great offensive skills except Bill Russell. That is the reason he would never be in my top 5 either. If you are a top 5 player, you should have mastered at least one skill. There is nothing Lebron is the best at.

 

[RoadRage]

So it goes to show, that when you are comparing eras, there are good and bad fo

No, I did not diss him. Anybody that has ever played or coached basketball from college level on up, knows Lebron has a weak ass jumpshot, has no go-to moves, and has no killer instinct. This is all truth. He can pass pretty well, but he lacks a lot of the basics. Being a good athlete does not make you an offensively skilled basketball player. There is no skill that Lebron has mastered on offense. He is pretty good all around, but has never been a fluid offensive player. Kobe, Iverson, Carmelo, Durant, etc.... are pure, natural scorers.

All these guys you named had great offensive skills except Bill Russell. That is the reason he would never be in my top 5 either. If you are a top 5 player, you have to have mastered at least one skill. There is nothing Lebron is the best at.

For a guy with a weak jump shot he sure has taken a and made almost double the amount of three pointers the great Larry Bird made, a he was supposed to be one of the greatest outside shooting big men of his time and one of the so called skilled players of his day...

 

[RoadRage]

Also not being fluid is another terminology that has no stats or data to back up, it simply a made up term that only resides in the mind of the person who is giving his opinion, out of all the stats that exist, these are the only type of stats that the LeBron hates can pull up...
BTW whats the use of being fluid if it doesn't show up in results, stats or awards.

 

[IT IS WHAT IT IS]

Damn... Steph Curry has over 200 more 3pt FGs made than LeBron in 402 LESS games played!!!

 

[HotNixon36]

So it goes to show, that when you are comparing eras, there are good and bad fo

For a guy with a weak jump shot he sure has taken a and made almost double the amount of three pointers the great Larry Bird made, a he was supposed to be one of the greatest outside shooting big men of his time and one of the so called skilled players of his day...

Please do not tell me or let anybody on this board know that you think that Lebron has a better jump shot than Bird....

Bird rebounded, shot way better, had better B Ball IQ, better free throw shooter, better passer (averaged the same amount of assist without being primary ball handler), and had way more killer instinct. Only lacked James athletism, but more skilled offensively.


Use a different example please.