Immigration comes at a devastating cost to Black Americans

gene cisco said:
Well, I think we can agree that both illegal and legal immigration have negatively affected the black community. The math(from 2nd to 4th) is undeniable.

Where we part ways is I give a fuck who I agree with on an issue. I agree with the 'racist whites' on guns(not everything), immigration, the gender bullshit(fuck messing with kids), and parental rights(more parents need to be involved with schools). I agree with the 'crazy leftists' on healthcare, abortion(I ain't raising the kids), and ending drug prohibition.

Give a fuck if hillbilly earl wants to string me up from a tree after Jose. The fact is if too many Joses here there will be a line to get to us. Shit, the line already formed. :smh: Never cosigned importing enemies just because the ones here don't like them.

Same folks crafting anti-immigration are also crafting laws that ban giving hormones/surgery to kids. Am I supposed to go against that because they don't care about black children in particular? Of course not, because such legislation protects black kids too. Worry about the next issue when it comes up. After one problem is solved, time to part ways. Shit, that's how politics, life, and business tend to work. Temporary alliances.

Yeah, AI is going to be a problem. A problem black America would have been better equipped to face had we remained number 2 instead of number 4. But it is what it is, right? Yet another fucked up hand for black America thanks to our incompetent leadership and politicians who continue to sell the community out for personal gain.

This country is getting more fucked and it's just messed up we(as a community) have lost power to other groups AND still got to deal with whites. Folks running around talking about facism, while at the same time leftist coming with some five reds/five blacks shit, but they don't teach about that in schools, only nazis. :smh:


Black America is caught between leftist authoritarianism and the far right. :smh: 1960s black America was in a much better position to protect itself and make demands than 2020s black America. And remember, Asians and Hispanics actually make groups work for their votes. That 1960s Malcolm X video about chumps doesn't apply to them.


And appreciate the sensible talk, it's rare on BGOL these days. A number of folks around here just go to namecalling because they can't even justify their positions with any form of logic. They just blindly repeat talking points.
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Well realistically bruh, if I thought you were a fuck nigga I would've approached this shit differently lol! Bc I don't agree with you at all on this topic but I respect that there's a coherent, real world, non-fuck-nigga on the other end of this shit. And it's only because I have a decade plus of this same argument going back or forth in one form or another with you lol.

If I had the energy right now, I'd push these arguments to their logical conclusions (as that's all I'm interested in). But I don't got it rn. RN all I wanna do is rewatch BabyFace's NPR Tiny Desk and pretend I didn't find out Teddy Riley is a Maga type dude smh.

I'll be back to share my objections to the above when I have 30 mins to type up a lil dissertation up in here lol. Peace :cool:
 
gene cisco said:
I would agree with you if these illegals were limited to picking fruit from here to eternity. :lol:

Sadly, they aren't. They take roofing jobs, construction, skilled trade, landscaping, warehouse, factory, restaurant work, assembly, and so on. Furthermore, their kids ain't usually picking fruit. They level up. And guess what? They ain't fucking with us.

If you understand humanity 101, then you understand humans are tribal. Divisions ain't fake. They are as real as the air you are breathing and have been like that for all recorded history. From racial(although called different shit in the past), ethnic, national, to religion, it's only human to be divided. Hell, the whites were divided when they took over most the world. Look at how Japanese, Koreans, and the Chinese view each other.

Xenophobia is just a buzzword like transphobia/homophobia. Folks ain't afraid. They just using common sense. But these days, talking points are fueled by buzzwords. Terms that are meant to dead common sense arguments.
You focus on fruit picking. Meanwhile, hispanic purchasing power has passed that of black America. That's a helluva lot of tomatoes. :lol:

On the real side, that will translate to less political power because money talks. How does black American benefit from having less power? Think Hispanics give a fuck? They got slurs for us.

Do you even know what is going on in our prisons between hispanics(the native and native/white kind) and black? Wait until more regions see the street violence. :smh: We still run shit in Ohio, but fucking around with these open borders probably won't in a few decades. Yeah, they doing more than picking tomatoes fam.
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gene cisco said:
Well, I think we can agree that both illegal and legal immigration have negatively affected the black community. The math(from 2nd to 4th) is undeniable.

Where we part ways is I give a fuck who I agree with on an issue. I agree with the 'racist whites' on guns(not everything), immigration, the gender bullshit(fuck messing with kids), and parental rights(more parents need to be involved with schools). I agree with the 'crazy leftists' on healthcare, abortion(I ain't raising the kids), and ending drug prohibition.

Give a fuck if hillbilly earl wants to string me up from a tree after Jose. The fact is if too many Joses here there will be a line to get to us. Shit, the line already formed. :smh: Never cosigned importing enemies just because the ones here don't like them.

Same folks crafting anti-immigration are also crafting laws that ban giving hormones/surgery to kids. Am I supposed to go against that because they don't care about black children in particular? Of course not, because such legislation protects black kids too. Worry about the next issue when it comes up. After one problem is solved, time to part ways. Shit, that's how politics, life, and business tend to work. Temporary alliances.

Yeah, AI is going to be a problem. A problem black America would have been better equipped to face had we remained number 2 instead of number 4. But it is what it is, right? Yet another fucked up hand for black America thanks to our incompetent leadership and politicians who continue to sell the community out for personal gain.

This country is getting more fucked and it's just messed up we(as a community) have lost power to other groups AND still got to deal with whites. Folks running around talking about facism, while at the same time leftist coming with some five reds/five blacks shit, but they don't teach about that in schools, only nazis. :smh:


Black America is caught between leftist authoritarianism and the far right. :smh: 1960s black America was in a much better position to protect itself and make demands than 2020s black America. And remember, Asians and Hispanics actually make groups work for their votes. That 1960s Malcolm X video about chumps doesn't apply to them.


And appreciate the sensible talk, it's rare on BGOL these days. A number of folks around here just go to namecalling because they can't even justify their positions with any form of logic. They just blindly repeat talking points.
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gene cisco said:
The white leftists don't want to see any of that shit. Won't be covered. They live on college campuses shielded from the real world. And they dare not admit that hispanics can be racist. Don't fit the narrative.
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I believe that you're engaging in a false equivalency on this stuff. Lord help me for engaging a topic I can only connect to like once every couple of weeks or so :lol:

But real talk, a staple of your argument is that I have the more "idealistic" pov but I'd actually argue to the contrary. I have the MOST realistic pov. One that acknowledges that you can't support one part of a fascist framework without capitulating to all of it. One that is crystal clear about the stakes and is laser focused on obvious outcomes.

Conservatives peddle all kinds of enormous bullshit to advance an agenda oriented around preserving the status quo and siphoning as much wealth as possible to the upper echelons of society. It's amazing that anyone could buy into the trans hysteria snakeoil being sold by these ppl. Yesterday it was hordes of migrants at the border that was the boogeyman (and we were supposed to be cool with their kids being seperated from them lol, what happened to all this faux concern about the children then?). Before that it was Arabs. And before that (and now) it was black folks etc etc. Always a scapegoat for the problems of our inability to engage seriously with the calculated economics, militarism, neoliberalism and white supremacy that produces these results. Even Trump expressed awe at how gullible his supporters and the folks who hopped on the "trans are the cause of all our problems!" bandwagon are.



There is no equivalence between left and right in this country. You can argue mainstream Dems are kind of wack and driven by the same corporate interests that over-index on this Dylan Mulvaney, corpo Pride type stuff. But ultimately, even then, there are substantive differences. Even the Orcas are sick of the status quo bruh (fucking up boats in the ocean)... fuck making excuses for all this stupid bullshit lmao. Jose ain't the problem.
 
sharkbait28 said:
I believe that you're engaging in a false equivalency on this stuff. Lord help me for engaging a topic I can only connect to like once every couple of weeks or so :lol:

But real talk, a staple of your argument is that I have the more "idealistic" pov but I'd actually argue to the contrary. I have the MOST realistic pov. One that acknowledges that you can't support one part of a fascist framework without capitulating to all of it. One that is crystal clear about the stakes and is laser focused on obvious outcomes.

Conservatives peddle all kinds of enormous bullshit to advance an agenda oriented around preserving the status quo and siphoning as much wealth as possible to the upper echelons of society. It's amazing that anyone could buy into the trans hysteria snakeoil being sold by these ppl. Yesterday it was hordes of migrants at the border that was the boogeyman (and we were supposed to be cool with their kids being seperated from them lol, what happened to all this faux concern about the children then?). Before that it was Arabs. And before that (and now) it was black folks etc etc. Always a scapegoat for the problems of our inability to engage seriously with the calculated economics, militarism, neoliberalism and white supremacy that produces these results. Even Trump expressed awe at how gullible his supporters and the folks who hopped on the "trans are the cause of all our problems!" bandwagon are.



There is no equivalence between left and right in this country. You can argue mainstream Dems are kind of wack and driven by the same corporate interests that over-index on this Dylan Mulvaney, corpo Pride type stuff. But ultimately, even then, there are substantive differences. Even the Orcas are sick of the status quo bruh (fucking up boats in the ocean)... fuck making excuses for all this stupid bullshit lmao. Jose ain't the problem.
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First, you know me around here. I am a realist to a fault. I calls them like I sees them and that has got me a lot of hate. Man, when I was in the streets like that it was both a blessing and a curse. But since I was willing to die for mine, cats respected it.

I will state obective truths whether they hurt feelings or not. For instance, I don't like Asians. I have no problems admitting as much. Call me racist. But I respect the hell out of them for what they have done here. Their success and academic excellence is an objective truth. I feel that everyone should catch up with them academically or shut the fuck up. DEI folks don't like that, but I'm a realist. These folks want these immigrants here than bitch about grades and test scores. Then want to call Asians white adjacent or enacting whiteness. Can't make this bullshit up. :lol:

Second, if we are going to throw around the word 'facist', we must also call out this leftist, Americanized maoist bullshit, right? The left basically doing 'red' and 'black' but we talking facism? Funny everyone talking nazis/facist, but no one talks about how closely the left in America mirrors that MAO shit. Just like Mao learned from leftists before him and adapted to China.

Do you have young children? If so, you'd never say 'trans hysteria' like shit ain't real in these schools. Fortunately, we homeschool, but the horror stories are real. Trust me, I thought it was BS and you know me to be live let live for 20 years on this board. Not no more. When you have a side that is for teaching sexual shit to k-3 and then lies about the name of the bill, we have fucking problems. Fuck.Those.People. And yeah, I read queer theory out their own mouths, not from FOX. I listed the scholars here in another thread. Fuck them and their supporters.

Last, but not least, I don't care about if truth is right wing or left wing. I just care about the truth. Another fault that gets me into shit and always has. Immigration has pushed black America back. That is truth. Now cats crying about affirmative action because another 'poc' group don't need the shit and is actually hurt by low standards. Funny how that immigration shit worked.

And how many potatoes do hispanics have to pick to have a higher income than black people? Just curious, because income in this country breaks down to Asian(so much for white supremacy since asian women outearn white men, but lets change definiton of white supremacy), then white, then hispanic, then black. Again, objective truth. But hey, DEI will fix it the eggheads say. Trust us. We just have to exclude certain POC--meanwhile bring in more of those POC. :lol:
 
sharkbait28 said:
I believe that you're engaging in a false equivalency on this stuff. Lord help me for engaging a topic I can only connect to like once every couple of weeks or so :lol:

But real talk, a staple of your argument is that I have the more "idealistic" pov but I'd actually argue to the contrary. I have the MOST realistic pov. One that acknowledges that you can't support one part of a fascist framework without capitulating to all of it. One that is crystal clear about the stakes and is laser focused on obvious outcomes.

Conservatives peddle all kinds of enormous bullshit to advance an agenda oriented around preserving the status quo and siphoning as much wealth as possible to the upper echelons of society. It's amazing that anyone could buy into the trans hysteria snakeoil being sold by these ppl. Yesterday it was hordes of migrants at the border that was the boogeyman (and we were supposed to be cool with their kids being seperated from them lol, what happened to all this faux concern about the children then?). Before that it was Arabs. And before that (and now) it was black folks etc etc. Always a scapegoat for the problems of our inability to engage seriously with the calculated economics, militarism, neoliberalism and white supremacy that produces these results. Even Trump expressed awe at how gullible his supporters and the folks who hopped on the "trans are the cause of all our problems!" bandwagon are.



There is no equivalence between left and right in this country. You can argue mainstream Dems are kind of wack and driven by the same corporate interests that over-index on this Dylan Mulvaney, corpo Pride type stuff. But ultimately, even then, there are substantive differences. Even the Orcas are sick of the status quo bruh (fucking up boats in the ocean)... fuck making excuses for all this stupid bullshit lmao. Jose ain't the problem.
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Don't forgot the most recent boogeyman, Critical Race Theory.

It's funny how the free thinkers have no issues with Repubs finding legal ways to take black history out of schools based solely on the fact that certain aspects of black history make white children "uncomfortable" and therefore shouldn't be even mentioned in a classroom setting.

Yet these same people cry all day because they feel the "lame-stream" media doesn't want to hear from them.
 

Black Americans need better immigration policy​


Growing up on the rural farms of Halifax, Va., I pulled tobacco just like my great-grandfather Roosevelt, a sharecropper who provided for his family until he died in his late 80s. Just a generation before him, his father was a slave.

In the late 1990s, as I edged closer to high school graduation, I noticed a shift in the farm workforce. My fellow laborers were increasingly immigrants, rather than Black Americans like me.

At the time, I didn’t think much of it. It wasn’t until later that I realized that the labor market changes I’d witnessed in my hometown were lower-wage immigrant workers displacing Black Americans, a nationwide phenomenon that had occurred several times throughout American history.

Reducing immigration is not a cure-all for the plights of Black Americans. But it’s an immediate, tangible action that Congress could take — one that, over the last 200 years, has been repeatedly proven to tighten labor markets and improve workers’ bargaining power.

Since the end of the Civil War, African Americans have repeatedly made progress in closing racial wealth and income gaps, only to see that progress reversed by proverbial waves of immigration crashing onto U.S. shores to supply businesses with the cheap labor they crave.

This is not the fault of the immigrants themselves. They can hardly be blamed for seeking better opportunities here. Some would argue nor is it the fault of businesses who sought to find the least expensive, legal way to manufacture.

Rather, the fault lies squarely with those elected officials, policymakers, who’ve allied themselves with Big Business, most likely in exchange for financial support in their election campaigns, allowing the dilution of Black workers’ bargaining power by importing cheap, desperate laborers by the tens of millions. The problem won’t be fixed until Black voters and community leaders hold those policymakers, these elected officials, accountable with the power voters have at the ballot box.

In the decades after emancipation, Black Americans became essential workers in the factories of a rapidly industrializing nation. Their standard of living improved, despite pervasive racism and the legalized discrimination of Jim Crow.

But towards the end of the 19th century, the flow of migrants, legal immigrants — increasingly from southern and eastern Europe — turned into a torrent. These desperate arrivals, who were willing to accept virtually any job at any wage, pushed Black workers out of many jobs. It’s no accident that the protagonist of Upton Sinclair’s The Jungle, the famous novel depicting the dangerous and despicable working conditions of meatpacking plants around the turn of the century, was a recent arrival from Lithuania.

Many of the Black leaders of the time, from Booker T. Washington to W. E. B. Du Bois to A. Philip Randolph, pleaded with policymakers to restrict immigration — a historical fact that’s little known today, but amply demonstrated in Back of the Hiring Line, a book by Roy Beck, the founder of my organization.

In the 1920s, a broad multiracial coalition of Americans finally succeeded in pressuring Congress to scale back immigration. Du Bois praised the restrictions, noting that “the stopping of the importing of cheap white labor on any terms has been the economic salvation of American black labor.” Randolph concurred, saying that “excessive immigration is against the interests of the masses of all races and nationalities in the country — both foreign and native.”

The slowdown in foreign migration enabled Black workers to reclaim the gains they’d lost — and then some. Between 1940 and 1980, Black wages quadrupled — outstripping the rate of wage growth among white earners. During that period, the percentage of Black men considered middle class skyrocketed from 22 percent to 71 percent.

Unfortunately, Black workers once again lost ground after Congress reopened the cheap labor spigot with the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 and turned it full throttle with subsequent legislation throughout the 1980s and 1990s. Between 1979 and 2019, the median wage of Black workers rose only 5.2 percent, while white workers’ earnings swelled by 20 percent — a drastic contrast with previous decades.

Economists have pointed to the increased immigration between 1980 and 2000 as the cause of 60 percent of the relative wage decline, while 25 percent of the decline was in employment, and 10 percent of the rise was in incarceration rates among less-educated Blacks.

Immigration’s crowding-out effect continues through the present day. The Economist recently covered the replacement of African American agricultural workers in Mississippi — in a county that’s 70 percent Black — by white South Africans brought here on H-2A guest worker visas.
Scaling back immigration would benefit virtually all American workers — but it’d particularly help the African American descendants of slaves, who have all too often been consigned to the back of the hiring line by businesses seeking the cheapest and most pliable labor allowed by elected officials who make and enforce immigration policy.

afro.com

Black Americans need better immigration policy

By Andre Barnes Growing up on the rural farms of Halifax, Va., I pulled tobacco just like my great-grandfather Roosevelt, a sharecropper who provided for his family until he died […]
afro.com afro.com
 
Immigration policy isn't just at the border, it is keeping housing prices high and offshoring jobs to reduce wages. This reduces what immigrants can send home to entice more immigration. This also effects us.

As somebody looking to leave the U.S. because it is sucks, I would like to see some type of exchange setup with other countries to expedite everything. If a country has an imbalance with the U.S. they have to pay money.

A country can't grow enough food, they have to pay money.
 
the artist said:
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Just saw this in another thread. Immigration is another symptom of a host of other Reagan era policies & thinking that has brought internal & global circumstances to this point. But keep on with the misdirection, we will see how it serves you in the future. But we have seen this before so let me tell you; same shit different era all because you would rather blame another than be accountable & face the truth & your true enemies.
 
COINTELPRO said:
Immigration policy isn't just at the border, it is keeping housing prices high and offshoring jobs to reduce wages. This reduces what immigrants can send home to entice more immigration. This also effects us.

As somebody looking to leave the U.S. because it is sucks, I would like to see some type of exchange setup with other countries to expedite everything. If a country has an imbalance with the U.S. they have to pay money.

A country can't grow enough food, they have to pay money.
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Excellent point with the bolded.
 
VAiz4hustlaz said:
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California will probably be a sanctuary state like it was the last time Trump was in office. regardless of Harris winning.

people always came up with excuses not to hire black, now it's immigration. When immigrants aren't taking "black jobs", they go back to the old stereotypes about being lazy or not qualified.
 
Regardless of how dems feel about immigration, it's republican owned businesses that are going out of their way to hire them.

Again, where's the heat on the repub party about constantly hiring these folks?
 
xxxbishopxxx said:
California will probably be a sanctuary state like it was the last time Trump was in office. regardless of Harris winning.

people always came up with excuses not to hire black, now it's immigration. When immigrants aren't taking "black jobs", they go back to the old stereotypes about being lazy or not qualified.
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Yep and these dummies fall for the misdirection. Why are they complaining about fighting with immigrants over low skilled jobs. I go to a lot of big businesses when I'm working and the offices be filled with white folk. Stop complaining and come up with a plan to take over.

This is how Trump got elected both times. He created the boogieman aka immigrants and white folk got scared and voted for him.
 
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