Canelo: Mayweather Picked Cotto Because He's Easier
- Thread starter Alaskanredman
- Start date
^ This right here. Fuck around and let Shane beat him, then what... Young boy needs to stay in his lane, get some experience, some ppv draws, then talk that Mayweather shit......
This, and Floyd would be completely out of his element in that kind of fight. Kirkland is refocused and re-energized since getting with Anne and I agree, I don't think Sergio, Canelo or Cotto want any part of James. I still take Cotto over Canelo because he's faster, a better boxer and has loads more experience. Canelo hasn't shown much except for power.
I don't know if "out of his element" is the correct phrasing. He has been in there with guys who tried that pressure shit to the max, but Floyd found a way to neutralize it. Floyd has fought that fight many times, shit I don't even remember the last time someone serious tried to box with him w/o being forced into that mode when the pressure shit wasn't working. The real issue is that people want to see if Floyd can survive a brawl. The only way that can be accomplished is by putting him in the ring with bigger, stronger and fast guys who won't be shutdown at all. With that said, even fighting Kirkland would be pointless, because if Floyd got in there and shut him down too... People would point out all of Kirkland's hiccups in the ring and say he isn't worthy even though he is more dangerous than Cotto, Canelo and shit, even Martinez imo.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk
I don't think it's just the fact that Kirkland is a strong brawler that makes him dangerous to Mayweather but he's a controlled brawler. In the Angulo fight, he was persistent but not reckless. He got hit but he didn't allow it to be a constant give and take battle. He's not Mayorga 2.0. That makes him dangerous to anyone.
I disagree, Floyd hasn't fought anyone who could bring it like Kirkland. Floyd is a great fighter who came up in a bad era. Castillo, Coralles....those guys are very different fighters from Kirkland. I still say Kirkland would force Floyd to fight a fight that he tries to avoid every bout - a brawl.
This. And worse, he's a southpaw brawler.
Funny but sad but that is how the Mayweather match seems to work: to tear down Floyd, they go the extra mile to tear down his opponents, even if they were hyping them before the fight.
I think we are saying the same thing. I only added the small difference that Floyd would be used to a fighter trying to drag him into a brawl.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk
I swear no fighter is broken down like Floyd. Yet, a lot of those same motherfuckers on all over the Klits bros' nuts.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk
Ya'll joking right?? Kirkland's defense ain't shit, he gets hit easily, Floyd's defense is the shit and hardly gets hit, as for brawlers Gatti was a brawler, Ortiz, Baldhomir, a brawler only has a punchers chance. Everytime Kirkland would wind up he'd get hit and have to reset, hit and have to reset, hit and have to reset. Kirkland got knocked out by a bum!!!! Floyd is very accurate and straight punches kill. Let's not get carried away Kirkland is great to watch, but would get beat to a fucking pulp by Floyd. Angulo got winded trying to finish, wouldn't happen with Floyd, u in trouble like Angulo had him, that fight is over.
You don't really understand what we're saying. Get your boxing IQ up then come back. Comparing Gatti, Ortiz and Baldomir to Kirkland? You're buggin the fuck out.
There is only so much you can do if a motherfucker can just walk through your punches and no matter how good you are... you don't want a motherfucker with power that you can't hurt but he keeps coming forward. Kirkland more than likely would not have to reset every time he gets hit by Floyd and Floyd damn sure isn't knocking Kirkland out or hurting him.
No one will say Kirkland is unbeatable. Shit, I thought Angulo was going to beat him, but that doesn't mean Kirkland can't look good in certain match-ups. Even when that nobody beat him, it wasn't like Kirkland just got out boxed with counter-punching or so on. He got reckless and got hurt with a lot of other factors going on that could have added to that situation... Dude just got out of prison, he had a bunch of fights close together which probably means his training was all fucked up and he wasn't with his trainer.
It is very likely that Floyd could out box the cat, but it would be a very tough fight is all we are saying.
If Kirkland was just getting out of prison, I'd pick Floyd. If Floyd was younger, I'd pick Floyd. But at this stage of his career and at this stage of Kirkland's career, especially with him back with Anne, by the time a fight with them could be made, I would lean slightly to Kirkland.
While he's still a great defensive fighter and can be very elusive while standing in one place, he does get hit more than he used to and Kirkland would be the best, most skilled brawler he would have ever faced who would pound him in the body. Floyd's a good puncher, actually he's still underrated as a puncher but he doesn't have Angulo power and if Angulo couldn't put Kirkland away, Floyd can't either.
Thanks. Ya'll said what I wanted to without being all caustic and shit. I apologize OJ.
I just don't see him walking thru the punishment, I don't see it. Angulo didn't put Kirkland away cuz he got winded, an accurate puncher punches at the right time not wildly in a rush. Guess we'll agree to disagree but when Kirkland fights somebody with the kind of skills Floyd has(solid defense, accurate sharp stinging punching power) we'll see what he really is. Shit maybe Kirkland can fight the Berto-Ortiz winner, we'll reconvene when something like that happens
Thanks. Ya'll said what I wanted to without being all caustic and shit. I apologize OJ.
That's 'cause you're an old caustic sumbitch.
You have to look at when the fight would take place. Kirkland is on the way up and Floyd's on the way down. Floyd has a long way to go because he's so good all around but he's not at his peak anymore. By the time he and Kirkland got in the ring, he would be even closer to 40 and fighting a strong, smart brawler with a noticeable size and strength advantage.
While Angulo did get winded, he got winded hitting James in the face after knocking him down. Kirkland withstood an incredible onslaught and was patient when on the offensive instead of rushing in and getting tagged again.
In two years, he would be even smarter, more experienced and more dangerous.
If it happened it might end up looking like Toney vs Barkley, who knows. But judging by the hard time an old dude like Oscar gave Floyd at 154, and how old he's getting and the fact Mosley was able to tag and stun him. Well, imagine if that had been Kirkland had him stunned like that. Floyd might not make it out of the round.
That's 'cause you're an old caustic sumbitch.
You have to look at when the fight would take place. Kirkland is on the way up and Floyd's on the way down. Floyd has a long way to go because he's so good all around but he's not at his peak anymore. By the time he and Kirkland got in the ring, he would be even closer to 40 and fighting a strong, smart brawler with a noticeable size and strength advantage.
While Angulo did get winded, he got winded hitting James in the face after knocking him down. Kirkland withstood an incredible onslaught and was patient when on the offensive instead of rushing in and getting tagged again.
In two years, he would be even smarter, more experienced and more dangerous.
I am. And I agree with this^^^^.
so now Oscar was old and shit, I noticed people try to act like Oscar was shot back then and he wasn't, shit that Oscar beats Kirkland too!!!! Like I said I'll wait to see with Kirkland, just like I don't believe the hype of Sergio Martinez. Last time I believed the hype of a fighter was Kelly Pavlik when he beat the shit out of Taylor, never again prove that you're good first
He was old but he wasn't shot when he fought Floyd. At that point, he probably couldn't beat Kirkland as he is but he would have a good chance. But, with Oscar at that same stage, it's highly doubtful he would be a James Kirkland in 2013, the earliest he could get Floyd Mayweather.
That's 'cause you're an old caustic sumbitch.
You have to look at when the fight would take place. Kirkland is on the way up and Floyd's on the way down. Floyd has a long way to go because he's so good all around but he's not at his peak anymore. By the time he and Kirkland got in the ring, he would be even closer to 40 and fighting a strong, smart brawler with a noticeable size and strength advantage.
While Angulo did get winded, he got winded hitting James in the face after knocking him down. Kirkland withstood an incredible onslaught and was patient when on the offensive instead of rushing in and getting tagged again.
In two years, he would be even smarter, more experienced and more dangerous.
Yep. I believe Floyd is in a danger zone right now historically speaking. I mean this in reference to his age and yes, lack of activity. I think Floyd squandered his peak years as soon as he left 135. It can be argued whether or not he ducked competition. It can't be argued that he missed a whole bunch of top dudes from 135 to 147 for whatever reasons. It will be interesting to see how the Mayweather story turns out. Will he suddenly get the itch to fight more often after 35, ironically when he'll most likely be more vulnerable? Or will he continue to fight sporadically eventually disappearing into the sunset with one hand on the steering wheel of his Lamborghini and a grape soda in the other?
I knew that would get your attention. Hey, I love grape soda and I'm black. Is it racial, I don't know. I love fried chicken too. Maybe it is racial. But it's also reality.
Ya'll making this about age then explain Bernard Hopkins still beating the shit outta top contenders?? Floyd has the same dedication with the no drinking no smoking always in shape attitude, why couldn't he do it
I actually agree. Floyd still looks sharp as fuck to me. I just think Welter weight is his limit, but he will be able to out box most guys at 154 just because he is that good.
Bernard has been very, very careful in his choice of opponents as he got older. While most of his opponents have been good, not one has been dangerous. If Floyd did that, he could be successful too but I'm talking specifically about fighting James Kirkland. Since we all acknowledge "styles make fights", this is a bad style matchup for Floyd at this stage of his career. Dude was feeling his age a few years ago after the Hatton fight and he's even older now.
Funny. A bad match up for a fighter is a great fight for a fan. Taking safe fights constantly degrade a fighters legacy in my opinion. I am not sure James is ready for PBF. He needs to beat an elite boxer in 154 first. On paper James looks perfect to upset PBF. But he needs a victory on the big stage to help people better understand his chances.
Bernard is also a bad comparison as he STARTED his career as a light heavy and moved down in weight. To go back up as an old man was totally natural for dude. But his last fight showed you why he'd been avoiding a fight with Dawson, Cloud, etc....But he's earned the right to fight whoever he wants. Much more so than Floyd in my opinion.
After that ass whipping Cloud caught, u can't tell me shit bout him!!!!!!! B Hop fighting Dawson again we'll see
B-Hop and Mayweather have one thing in common. They are gym rats which will probably allow Floyd a similar fountain of youth to B-Hop. I just think you can only move up so much. Floyd looked weak against De La and I think Floyd could have problem with any real strong 154 fighter... But that shit can't be helped by age.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk
I agree.
This too.
Cloud had a bad fight, happens to everybody (Bernard didn't retire after losing twice to Jermain Taylor, did he?). I want to see if he can bounce back strong.
fixed
Unfixed. Bernard did NOT get robbed. He won the last four rounds of the first fight but it's a 12 round fight. Math beat Bernard Hopkins.
And he wasn't terribly impressive and did nothing to win the second one. For whatever reason, Jermain was a bad matchup for him, in a way, similar to how James Kirkland would be a bad matchup to Floyd Mayweather if they fought now.
I disagree, but hey won't be the first time
I disagree. If anything both fights should have been a tie. B-hop didn't fight the first half of those fights, but Taylor didn't do anything to win those rounds except for looking active. On the other hand, when B-hop did finally fight in the second half of those fights, he was embarrassing Taylor. Damn shame that B-hop only fought 6 rounds in each fight, because he was the better boxer and if you took the whole fight into account instead of going round by round... Hopkins clearly won both fights. Taylor wasn't a match up problem, B-Hop used a bad strategy, and in all honesty, I think he was trying to pull another Trinidad... ending his opponent late in the fight, but Taylor survived.
If you do nothing and I do even a little more (look active), I win the round. Hopkins didn't even fight 6 rounds in those fights, if he had, he would have won. If a fighter takes off at least the first half of the fight, he gives his opponent a huge headstart.
And I think it was a combination of poor matchup and strategy. After getting "robbed" in the first one, why wasn't he more aggressive in the rematch? Bernard needed those losses because he had gotten lazy and used to getting by on his bullshit. We haven't seen him pull that shit (to that degree) since.
Fights aren't judged based on the whole fight, they're judged round by round and he lost two tight fights he could have won.
