Where Do You Rank Olajuwon All-Time As A Player?

[Understand My Story]

99-00 lal 79 79 40.0 0.574 0.000 0.524 4.3 9.4 13.6 3.8 0.5 3.0 2.82 3.23 29.7
00-01 lal 74 74 39.5 0.572 0.000 0.513 3.9 8.8 12.7 3.7 0.6 2.8 2.95 3.46 28.7
01-02 lal 67 66 36.1 0.579 0.000 0.555 3.5 7.2 10.7 3.0 0.6 2.0 2.55 2.97 27.2
02-03 lal 67 66 37.8 0.574 0.000 0.622 3.9 7.2 11.1 3.1 0.6 2.4 2.93 3.42 27.5

PRIME SHAQ, age 28-32. NOBODY was guarding him, period. His 350 pound ass was catching spin around alleys for rings. A young skinny Dream would be asking for help from Ralph like he did way before Shaq developed any inside moves.

As much as I hate to give a lazy bastard credit...


He was un-guard-able. HACK A SHAQ

btw, never out for the season, as you suggested, he was too busy winning rings.

And let's not forget he was shooting 58% during those years...

Now before you try to pull them up:

97-98 HOU 47 45 34.7 .483 .000 .755 2.50 7.30 9.80 3.0 1.79 2.04 2.68 3.20 16.4
98-99 HOU 50 50 35.7 .514 .308 .717 2.10 7.40 9.60 1.8 1.64 2.46 2.78 3.20 18.9
99-00 HOU 44 28 23.8 .458 .000 .616 1.50 4.80 6.20 1.4 .93 1.59 1.66 2.00 10.3
00-01 HOU 58 55 26.6 .498 .000 .621 2.10 5.30 7.40 1.2 1.21 1.52 1.40 2.40 11.9
01-02 TOR 61 37 22.6 .464 .000 .560 1.60 4.40 6.00 1.1 1.21 1.48 1.61 2.40 7.1

The Dream dominated for a few years around 32 and then FELL off, and I mean of EPIC proportions. Maybe even worse than Shaq has. Hmmmmmm

Missing half of EVERY season AND getting DESTROYED by Shaq.

Lets not forget taht those Shaq numbers came from a time when the second best center was Brad Miller. Dream, D. Rob, Ewing had all gotten old. Zo had his kidney issues. Shaq had absolutely no comp at his peak. It's funny how niggas totally ignore the 80's and act like Dream only beasted in the 90's when dream was avg. 4 blk and 2 stls along with 23 and 13 in the 80's. Guess that's not good enough huh?

 

[bigjayler]

Skill wise center #1 by a mile

 

[gr8]

Lets not forget taht those Shaq numbers came from a time when the second best center was Brad Miller. Dream, D. Rob, Ewing had all gotten old. Zo had his kidney issues. Shaq had absolutely no comp at his peak. It's funny how niggas totally ignore the 80's and act like Dream only beasted in the 90's when dream was avg. 4 blk and 2 stls along with 23 and 13 in the 80's. Guess that's not good enough huh?

No comp? Damn, Shaq was being guarded by FOUR fuckin people, he was RARELY guarded one on one, so unless Wilt was coming back, that shit is NULL. You see when The Dream was in his PRIME winning titles, he SWITCHED off of Shaq! Remember that STACKED Portland squad with Jermaine Oneill, Sabonis, Sheed, Davis? ALL OF THEM mutherfucks was fouling out trying to guard the Diesel.

 

[thereason]

the best and most skillful center i've personally ever seen play (started watching basketball in 95). cant really compare him to chamberlain or kareem cuz i never saw them play but i'd hes up there with them as the top 3 in imo

this

Keem #1
Robinson#2 (Just cuz i got to watch him)

Kareem #3
Shaq#4

 

[Blunt]

Yep, that's MR. "INJURED RESERVE" missing half of EVERY season AND getting DESTROYED by Shaq.

Can't compare the two. Shaq's only real "skill" was his big ass and mobility for someone that size. Olajuwon was a REAL basketball player. If he was 7 inches shorter he could've played guard. Shaq at 6'4" would be working as a bouncer at some Lousiana dive.

 

[gr8]

Skill wise center #1 by a mile

Almost true...do not forget the Stilt.
* 67-68 Phil 23.8 24.3 8.6
A CENTER LEADING THE LEAGUE IN ASSISTS?

 

[gr8]

Can't compare the two. Shaq's only real "skill" was his big ass and mobility for someone that size. Olajuwon was a REAL basketball player. If he was 7 inches shorter he could've played guard. Shaq at 6'4" would be working as a bouncer at some Lousiana dive.

I wouldn't say that...there were a few guys that size and SUCKED. Let's not forget Shaq was spinning off cats in the high post and catching alleys with EASE. I repeat, he SHOULD have averaged 30 and 20, but that's another story.

The Dream, skill wise, was a BEAST...but as the NBA goes, 7 inches shorter would land him in the D-League

 

[360KNOWLEDGE2]

A notch below Russel, Wilt, & Kareem and several notches above Shaq and Ewing

Co-sign

 

[thereason]

Can't compare the two. Shaq's only real "skill" was his big ass and mobility for someone that size. Olajuwon was a REAL basketball player. If he was 7 inches shorter he could've played guard. Shaq at 6'4" would be working as a bouncer at some Lousiana dive.

nah blunt shaq was very skilled and had good post moves, but when dude got 2 la thats when i have to agree it pretty much became he was just big and mobile

 

[Understand My Story]

No comp? Damn, Shaq was being guarded by FOUR fuckin people, he was RARELY guarded one on one, so unless Wilt was coming back, that shit is NULL. You see when The Dream was in his PRIME winning titles, he SWITCHED off of Shaq! Remember that STACKED Portland squad with Jermaine Oneill, Sabonis, Sheed, Davis? ALL OF THEM mutherfucks was fouling out trying to guard the Diesel.

Old ass David Robinson guarded him one on one and the Spurs had the most success against them. Actually teams that single covered him had the most succes (Pistons and Kings)

There was no other center that was an offensive threat. Shaq got to rest on defense meanwhile Dream was a beast on both ends. Jermaine was young. Sabonis was old. Sheed was Sheed. Who was the other elite center in the league when Shaq was dominating? It's one thing to dominate, it's another thing to dominate subpar comp.

 

[Amajorfucup]

99-00 lal 79 79 40.0 0.574 0.000 0.524 4.3 9.4 13.6 3.8 0.5 3.0 2.82 3.23 29.7
00-01 lal 74 74 39.5 0.572 0.000 0.513 3.9 8.8 12.7 3.7 0.6 2.8 2.95 3.46 28.7
01-02 lal 67 66 36.1 0.579 0.000 0.555 3.5 7.2 10.7 3.0 0.6 2.0 2.55 2.97 27.2
02-03 lal 67 66 37.8 0.574 0.000 0.622 3.9 7.2 11.1 3.1 0.6 2.4 2.93 3.42 27.5

PRIME SHAQ, age 28-32. NOBODY was guarding him, period. His 350 pound ass was catching spin around alleys for rings. A young skinny Dream would be asking for help from Ralph like he did way before Shaq developed any inside moves.

As much as I hate to give a lazy bastard credit...


He was un-guard-able. HACK A SHAQ

btw, never out for the season, as you suggested, he was too busy winning rings.

And let's not forget he was shooting 58% during those years...

Now before you try to pull them up:

97-98 HOU 47 45 34.7 .483 .000 .755 2.50 7.30 9.80 3.0 1.79 2.04 2.68 3.20 16.4
98-99 HOU 50 50 35.7 .514 .308 .717 2.10 7.40 9.60 1.8 1.64 2.46 2.78 3.20 18.9
99-00 HOU 44 28 23.8 .458 .000 .616 1.50 4.80 6.20 1.4 .93 1.59 1.66 2.00 10.3
00-01 HOU 58 55 26.6 .498 .000 .621 2.10 5.30 7.40 1.2 1.21 1.52 1.40 2.40 11.9
01-02 TOR 61 37 22.6 .464 .000 .560 1.60 4.40 6.00 1.1 1.21 1.48 1.61 2.40 7.1

The Dream dominated for 4-5 years and then FELL off, and I mean of EPIC proportions. Maybe even worse than Shaq has.

Yep, that's MR. "INJURED RESERVE" missing half of EVERY season AND getting DESTROYED by Shaq.

This is a good take and statistical support.

 

[Blunt]

nah blunt shaq was very skilled and had good post moves, but when dude got 2 la thats when i have to agree it pretty much became he was just big and mobile

Dude took up a lot of space and could dunk. What other actual SKILLS did he have??? Couldn't shoot. Underachieved as a rebounder. Not a great passer. Couldn't bring the ball up the court. He got a lot of offense out of being a GIANT man who had some flexibility, but that's where it ends.

 

[gr8]

Old ass David Robinson guarded him one on one and the Spurs had the most success against them. Actually teams that single covered him had the most succes (Pistons and Kings)

There was no other center that was an offensive threat. Shaq got to rest on defense meanwhile Dream was a beast on both ends. Jermaine was young. Sabonis was old. Sheed was Sheed. Who was the other elite center in the league when Shaq was dominating? It's one thing to dominate, it's another thing to dominate subpar comp.

One on One? HE WAS TRIPLED! There was no guarding shaq one on one, PERIOD. If you did, you got dunked all night. And you act like they play those elite centers every night If you named those 3, that means Hakeem had 73 out of 80+ games against the same type "subpar" comp and averaged less across the board than shaq. The stats DO NOT lie.

 

[4 Dimensional]

Yea...

I gotta put The Dream up higher than Shaq.

Although Shaq is bigger and more dominant, Olajuwon had impeccable footwork and a mid-range game like no other. Even had a crossover​

And Defense!!

The Dream is #4 in my books and because I never seen Wilt or Russell play that would move him to #2 behind Kareem.

 

[Understand My Story]

One on One? HE WAS TRIPLED! There was no guarding shaq one on one, PERIOD. If you did, you got dunked all night. And you act like they play those elite centers every night If you named those 3, that means Hakeem had 73 out of 80+ games against the same type "subpar" comp and averaged less across the board than shaq. The stats DO NOT lie.

You must be 16. Everybody didnt triple Shaq. Like I said the teams that had the most success like the Spurs singled him. The point about the comp is that he dominated an era where he was the only one. He was still just as strong in the 90s and wasn't as dominant as he was in the early 00's. Why? More comp, period. Stats don't lie Shaqs teams got swept every year til all the other greats got old, then he suddenly becomes MDE.

 

[4 Dimensional]

Dude took up a lot of space and could dunk. What other actual SKILLS did he have??? Couldn't shoot. Underachieved as a rebounder. Not a great passer. Couldn't bring the ball up the court. He got a lot of offense out of being a GIANT man who had some flexibility, but that's where it ends.

idk what happen to Shaq after the LSU years. He actually had some of those skills you mentioned, but when he got to the league he became limited in what he could do. He got much bigger and lost some of his footwork. Orlando Shaq >>> LA Shaq

 

[Understand My Story]

idk what happen to Shaq after the LSU years. He actually had some of those skills you mentioned, but when he got to the league he became limited in what he could do. He got much bigger and lost some of his footwork. Orlando Shaq >>> LA Shaq

But ORL Shaq got swept every year and LA Shaq won 3 straight titles and was MDE. What happened? OH yeah all his comp got old.

 

[gr8]

You must be 16. Everybody didnt triple Shaq. Like I said the teams that had the most success like the Spurs singled him. The point about the comp is that he dominated an era where he was the only one. He was still just as strong in the 90s and wasn't as dominant as he was in the early 00's. Why? More comp, period. Stats don't lie Shaqs teams got swept every year til all the other greats got old, then he suddenly becomes MDE.

Damn, nice insult

I watched those games and against that subpar comp you stated, SHAQ WAS DOUBLED and TRIPLED. You stated the comp and I stated why it isn't so cut and dry. There really was no one on one coverage of Shaq. and MORE IMPORTANTLY-HAKEEM didn't cover him one on one! wonder why not?

And Shaq played on an OK team that he carried to the finals. He actually developed an inside game for a fistful of years and DOMINATED, even as he took a damn Matrix style jumping from hackers They would just punch and hammer down as soon as he turned.

 

[gr8]

AND what "OTHER" teams played him straight up? Just curious

 

[gr8]

This is a good take and statistical support.

Too much emotion, stats are not welcomed here

 

[thereason]

Dude took up a lot of space and could dunk. What other actual SKILLS did he have??? Couldn't shoot. Underachieved as a rebounder. Not a great passer. Couldn't bring the ball up the court. He got a lot of offense out of being a GIANT man who had some flexibility, but that's where it ends.

actually Shaq is known for being a great post passer, and he had good post moves in his early days, homie just started relying more on his size later on

 

[Spectrum]

AND what "OTHER" teams played him straight up? Just curious

The only player that I saw successfully and consistently defend Shaq straight up was ironically not even a center (Dennis Rodman). Even the year the Pistons beat LA (04) Shaq was beasting on the Pistons. He just wasnt getting the ball.

 

[gr8]

The only player that I saw successfully and consistently defend Shaq straight up was ironically not even a center (Dennis Rodman). Even the year the Pistons beat LA (04) Shaq was beasting on the Pistons. He just wasnt getting the ball.

I concur


These other cats must have been watching a different league.

And to say that Shaq wasn't a good passer:
Hakeem 32yrs ...32.8ppg.... rpg 11.5.... apg5.5.... blk 2.0.... fg%.483
Shaq 22yrs .......28.0ppg .... rpg 12.5.... apg6.3.... blk 2.5.... fg% .595

This is the pre-posted stat line from their matchup that Hakeem so dominated

 

[Understand My Story]

AND what "OTHER" teams played him straight up? Just curious

I clearly stated Spurs, Kings, Pistons. Spurs beat them twice. Kings would have beat them had the refs allowed it. Pistons beat them. You are missing my point though. He dominated the weakest era in terms of center play in the history of the league. He was still strong and still demanding double teams and getting swept when the other great centers were at their peak. He didn't dominate the league until the center position damn near became extinct. Who were the other top 5 centers from 00-03?

 

[gr8]

actually Shaq is known for being a great post passer, and he had good post moves in his early days, homie just started relying more on his size later on

Shaq is often measured against his POTENTIAL and not by his play. Wilt said it best: NOBODY roots for Goliath

How can guys say that he underachieved as a rebounder and passer while his career averages are EVEN with Hakeem in those categories?

Myself included, he is measured by what he SHOULD have done.

 

[thereason]

Shaq is often measured against his POTENTIAL and not by his play. Wilt said it best: NOBODY roots for Goliath

How can guys say that he underachieved as a rebounder and passer while his career averages are EVEN with Hakeem in those categories?

Myself included, he is measured by what he SHOULD have done.

true very true

 

[Spectrum]

Shaq is often measured against his POTENTIAL and not by his play. .

Agreed.

I used to do the same thing with Shaq and also criticize him for his conditioning. However, the fact that he is a center and still playing at 38 years and and still productive says a lot. He is obviously doing something because most centers decline RAPIDLY. I am surprised his 300 pound frame has not completely broken down at this point.

 

[gr8]

I clearly stated Spurs, Kings, Pistons. Spurs beat them twice. Kings would have beat them had the refs allowed it. Pistons beat them. You are missing my point though. He dominated the weakest era in terms of center play in the history of the league. He was still strong and still demanding double teams and getting swept when the other great centers were at their peak. He didn't dominate the league until the center position damn near became extinct. Who were the other top 5 centers from 00-03?

Tim Duncan (David Robinson)
Ewing
Hakeem
Mutumbo
Kemp
Hell, Even Ric Smits was balling for a few years back then!
Add in Zo, Yao...there were some good guys players, not a bunch of Oliver Millers.
ALL OF THESE CATS PLAYED SOME OF THEIR PRIME vs Shaq and he MORE than held his own while being doubled by EACH of them at some point. Shaq doubled NO ONE

 

[gr8]

Agreed.

I used to do the same thing with Shaq and also criticize him for his conditioning. However, the fact that he is a center and still playing at 38 years and and still productive says a lot. He is obviously doing something because most centers decline RAPIDLY. I am surprised his 300 pound frame has not completely broken down at this point.

Ask Sabonis, Yao and Stanley how hard it is to carry THAT MUCH weight and remain productive, FUCK DOMINANT

 

[RunawaySlave]

and MORE IMPORTANTLY-HAKEEM didn't cover him one on one! wonder why not?

usually because Rudy T, took Olajuwon off of Shaq to save him from getting into foul trouble. Shaq's style of play was almost conducive with getting fouls because he would run right at you.


All I am saying is that at 22 years old, Hakeem was a NIGHTMARE to guard for centers and Shaq would've been no exception at age 32. Also, you are underestimating Olajuwon's strength. He more than hold his own against a bigger, stronger centers in his youth.

You call age 32 "their prime". Maybe it the prime of a player's career MENTALLY, but PHYSICALLY their prime comes at a younger age. It's the main reason Olajuwon had so many problems with Shaq. Because he had passed his PHYSICAL prime years before. But MENTALLY he was still able to manipulate him

 

[Les W]

Top 10 All time, Top 3 Centers.

fixed

I ain't seen nobody dominate the center position from a SKILL and technical level like Hakeem ... Shaq will tell you if he is being serious that Hak is better

Where you think MJ got that spin/shake jumper move from?

 

[Blunt]

How can guys say that he underachieved as a rebounder and passer while his career averages are EVEN with Hakeem in those categories?

Because people keep putting him in the upper echelon of centers and yet he's NEVER led the league in the PRIME "center" requirements of rebounding and/or blocks, despite always being just 3 feet away from the basket (unlike other more versatile centers like Olajuwon, who did lead in both those categories, despite being further from the rim).

 

[gr8]

usually because Rudy T, took Olajuwon off of Shaq to save him from getting into foul trouble. Shaq's style of play was almost conducive with getting fouls because he would run right at you.


All I am saying is that at 22 years old, Hakeem was a NIGHTMARE to guard for centers and Shaq would've been no exception at age 32. Also, you are underestimating Olajuwon's strength. He more than hold his own against a bigger, stronger centers in his youth.

You call age 32 "their prime". Maybe it the prime of a player's career MENTALLY, but PHYSICALLY their prime comes at a younger age. It's the main reason Olajuwon had so many problems with Shaq. Because he had passed his PHYSICAL prime years before. But MENTALLY he was still able to manipulate him

Good point, but you REALLY think Hakeem didn't agree with the switch? I mean prime as in winning rings and being at a good mix of Physical and mental dominance.

BOTH Shaq and Hakeem failed as youngsters in the finals to better teams, so that is a mute point. They BOTH dominated around 30 and reached the "Best" status. But, physically, Shaq is on another level...as is Hakeem with his skill set.

People are just so quick to write off Shaq's achievements with the size argument, hell being good for more than 2 years with that kind of size is a skill all by itself!

Point blank, all you could do was foul that bitch or get your head bashed. He was THAT dominant. AND that takes NOTHING away from the Dream, but...he did concede.

 

[gr8]

Because people keep putting him in the upper echelon of centers and yet he's NEVER led the league in the PRIME "center" requirements of rebounding and/or blocks, despite always being just 3 feet away from the basket (unlike other more versatile centers like Olajuwon, who did lead in both those categories, despite being further from the rim).

They both averaged 14 boards as their high in rebounds.

If Rodman wasn't such an animal, Shaq would have lead in that as well. SO move on with that.

Blocks Hakeem average 3 for his career

Shaq averaged 2.3

BUT, the Dream was a more DOMINANT defender. Shaq was a more DOMINANT scorer.

 

[Complex]

Hard to judge him, because I didn't see a lot of players play

From the players I saw play, he's top 5

That's no discredit to Kareem, Wilt, Russell...