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Where Do You Rank Olajuwon All-Time As A Player?

destrehan said:
man hakeem played in the 80's when the lakers and celtics and pistons were wreckin shop. he was still one of the top guys in the league. it's hard to dominate when you got kareem in the same conference. he fuckin owned shaq, ewing, and d-rob.
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Im well aware when he came into league. Whats your point? That doesnt change the fact that he didnt become "dominant" until his early 30's. There was still an argument between who was the better player in 1995 until he destroyed Dave in the playoffs. Shaq didnt come into the league until 93-94, which was during Hakeems prime, so owning him isnt exactly noteworthy. Ewing isnt in the discussion so im not sure why you brought him up. Again, im not sure what point you're trying to make so i wont respond further until im sure.
 
Amajorfucup said:
Im well aware when he came into league. Whats your point? That doesnt change the fact that he didnt become "dominant" until his early 30's. There was still an argument between who was the better player in 1995 until he destroyed Dave in the playoffs. Shaq didnt come into the league until 93-94, which was during Hakeems prime, so owning him isnt exactly noteworthy. Ewing isnt in the discussion so im not sure why you brought him up. Again, im not sure what point you're trying to make so i wont respond further until im sure.
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Shaq came in the league in 92-93.

become "dominant" until his early 30's?

huh
 
yall do realize the "TWIN TOWERS" (OLAJUWON & SAMPSON) went to the finals in the 80's too ?? they lost to the celtics.

im mad that yall are actually saying Shaq is better than The Dream.
 
Rudey said:
Shaq came in the league in 92-93.

become "dominant" until his early 30's?

huh
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With all due respect, my point was articulated clearly. Which part dont you understand?

Hakeem was great throughout his career, but in terms of dominating his peers or the league, that didnt occur until the ages of 31-33. In case you still dont get it, by dominating im referencing playing at a championship level while being the or near the best player at his position.
 
Amajorfucup said:
With all due respect, my point was articulated clearly. Which part dont you understand?

Hakeem was great throughout his career, but in terms of dominating his peers or the league, that didnt occur until the ages of 31-33. In case you still dont get it, by dominating im referencing playing at a championship level while being the or near the best player at his position.
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Not clearly articulated because Hakeem was dominating his peers in the 80's before he reached in his 30's.

He also surpassed an aging Jabbar and took the position of being the best center in the league before he reached his 30's.
 
Rudey said:
Not clearly articulated because Hakeem was dominating his peers in the 80's before he reached in his 30's.

He also surpassed an aging Jabbar and took the position of being the best center in the league before he reached his 30's.
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We gotta disagree right here. He wasnt as dominant then as he was when he was 31-33. You're talking about late 80's correct? You still had Pat, Moses, and Kareem holding shit down. Hakeem was not the clear cut best big man. Then, even in the early 90's Dave stepped on the scene and was housing niggaz, so there was still a discussion to be had. Hakeem didnt lock it down until the mid 90's (94--96 or so). Again, in no way am i knocking him- he's top 7 all time- im just distinguishing him from those i think rank higher.
 
Amajorfucup said:
We gotta disagree right here. He wasnt as dominant then as he was when he was 31-33. You're talking about late 80's correct? You still had Pat, Moses, and Kareem holding shit down. Hakeem was not the clear cut best big man. Then, even in the early 90's Dave stepped on the scene and was housing niggaz, so there was still a discussion to be had. Hakeem didnt lock it down until the mid 90's (94--96 or so). Again, in no way am i knocking him- he's top 7 all time- im just distinguishing him from those i think rank higher.
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DWL!

It is obvious you did not watch basketball in the 80's.

Olajuwon was clearly the best center in the league 1987-89. at least for that period of time there wasn't a debate.
 
Rudey said:
Not clearly articulated because Hakeem was dominating his peers in the 80's before he reached in his 30's.

He also surpassed an aging Jabbar and took the position of being the best center in the league before he reached his 30's.
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Olajuwon was clearly the best center in the league by his 2nd or 3rd year. Patrick Ewing was clearly second. Maybe a cat like Brad Daughtery was third or 4th. Older players like Kareem and Malone might have been better players, but at this point in their careers on their way out. Other than that, maybe only Ralph Sampson (before he got hurt) or Robert Parrish can be compared to the Dream. There weren't too many others worth mentioning at the center spot during that period that I can remember
 
All-NBA First Team (1987, '88, '89, '93, '94, '97); All-NBA Second Team ('86, '90, '96); Third Team (1991, '95, '99); All-Defensive First Team ('87, '88, '90, '93, '94)
 
Rudey said:
DWL!

It is obvious you did not watch basketball in the 80's.

Olajuwon was clearly the best center in the league 1987-89. at least for that period of time there wasn't a debate.
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Clearly the best? Based on what? He surely wasnt dominating shit. He had good numbers but he wasnt winning no games. In the late 80's Hakeem was barely playing 500 ball and getting hammered in the playoffs. That aint "dominant" dawgs. Come on man, and miss me with that "you aint watch basketball" bullshit. Did he even make it out the 1st round during that span??
 
IMO Shaq>>>Hakeem. But he is at least just as good. There is No way you can say he is not on Hakeems level.

Both are great though. But all Hak's fancy moves are persuading you guys to much. Shaq was ugly but effective.

Shaq 4 rings to Hakeem's 2.... 6 finals to Hakeems 3. Shaq has better career numbers in Ppg, FG%. Hakeem is a better blocker and defender.
Rebounds pg and assist pg are nearly the same.

Plus I know Hak outplayed Shaq in the finals but he didn't own him like cats like to believe. Look at the numbers of that series, there is only one game where Hak owned Shaq, but other than that Shaq held his own. Plus Shaq was a young buck at that time and Hakeem was a vet. Shaq would later begin to shit on Hakeem when he was to old to defend himself..
 
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OTG08 said:
the best and most skillful center i've personally ever seen play (started watching basketball in 95). cant really compare him to chamberlain or kareem cuz i never saw them play but i'd hes up there with them as the top 3 in imo
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You've got a great eye young man. I would say those three and add Moses and Russell and that would be my top 5
 
I'm always amazed how niggas will talk about who's better all time but NEVER post any stats:

http://espn.go.com/nba/history/leaders

ALSO LOOK AT THE DEFENSIVE STATS.

Case closed, Hakeem was better than Shaq. As big as Shaq was he should have dominated on the boards. Why wasn't Shaq pullin down at least 15 a game?
 
I'd put only Kareem over him. No disrepsect the Wilt and Bill but if they played today, I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be grabbing 25 rebounds or avg. 50 pts or winning 8 straight titles. You put Hakeem in any era and he would still do his thing. I put him over Shaq simply because Shaq was inferior defensively and didn't bring it all the time. Shaq at his absolute best when he was motivated and wanted to dominate was better but Shaq didn't play at that level consistently.
 
Didn't see Kareem and Wilt play. But out of the 90's? The Ewing's, D-Rob's, Shaq's, etc.? He was easily the most TALENTED big man. But I give Shaq the edge because he dominated the game at his position. He wasn't as talented as Dream but he was more dominant.
 
JD Walker said:
I'm always amazed how niggas will talk about who's better all time but NEVER post any stats:

http://espn.go.com/nba/history/leaders

ALSO LOOK AT THE DEFENSIVE STATS.

Case closed, Hakeem was better than Shaq. As big as Shaq was he should have dominated on the boards. Why wasn't Shaq pullin down at least 15 a game?
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Because stats don't mean shit. It tells one side of the story. Factor in who Shaq played alongside and who Dream played alongside. Horace Grant was snaggin' 9 to 10 boards a game himself and he was known as a damn good rebounder too.
 
to a Houstonians like me, the best all time, he helped us get our rings. i grew up watchin him play and he gave his all every day.
 
dtownsfinest said:
Because stats don't mean shit. It tells one side of the story. Factor in who Shaq played alongside and who Dream played alongside. Horace Grant was snaggin' 9 to 10 boards a game himself and he was known as a damn good rebounder too.
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Cop-out! D. Rob managed to avg. 11 reb a game with Rodman grabbing 16. He still managed to avg. double digits when Duncan came along and his minutes dropped. How long to Shaq play with Horace...a couple seasons? The reason Shaq never lead the league in rebounds is because it wasn't something he wanted to do. He had all of the tools to be a 15 rpg guy for more than a decade.
 
ron_mexico said:
IMO Shaq>>>Hakeem. But he is at least just as good. There is No way you can say he is not on Hakeems level.

Both are great though. But all Hak's fancy moves are persuading you guys to much. Shaq was ugly but effective.

Shaq 4 rings to Hakeem's 2.... 6 finals to Hakeems 3. Shaq has better career numbers in Ppg, FG%. Hakeem is a better blocker and defender.
Rebounds pg and assist pg are nearly the same.

Plus I know Hak outplayed Shaq in the finals but he didn't own him like cats like to believe. Look at the numbers of that series, there is only one game where Hak owned Shaq, but other than that Shaq held his own. Plus Shaq was a young buck at that time and Hakeem was a vet. Shaq would later begin to shit on Hakeem when he was to old to defend himself..
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Shaq had Kobe and Wade. Who did Hakeem have? Horry?
 
For all you revisionist. 1995 finals Hakeem vs Shaq stats..

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1995_finals.html

Again Hakeem didn't own Shaq, The rockets swept a young Orlando squad but Shaq despite being a young buck, more than held his own with the MVP...

Hakeem 32yrs ...32.8ppg.... rpg 11.5.... apg5.5.... blk 2.0.... fg%.483
Shaq 22yrs .......28.0ppg .... rpg 12.5.... apg6.3.... blk 2.5.... fg% .595




If Shaq could hit freethrows he would have better ppg and maybe better numbers than Hakeem across the board.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd1D-u8oAfo&feature=player_embedded#!
 
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ron_mexico said:
For all you revisionist. 1995 finals Hakeem vs Shaq stats..

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1995_finals.html

Again Hakeem didn't own Shaq, The rockets swept a young Orlando squad but Shaq despite being a young buck, more than held his own with the MVP...

Hakeem 32yrs ...32.8ppg.... rpg 11.5.... apg5.5.... blk 2.0.... fg%.483
Shaq 22yrs .......28.0ppg .... rpg 12.5.... apg6.3.... blk 2.5.... fg% .595




If Shaq could hit freethrows he would have better ppg and maybe better numbers than Hakeem across the board.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd1D-u8oAfo&feature=player_embedded#!
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Well put AND backed up with facts. :eek: Shaq wayyyyyy more than held his own, he arguably outplayed him. Notice in that clip the Dream stopped guarding Shaq at times, he was SEVERELY over matched physically. But, Shaq was ALWAYS on him. Hmmmmmmmmm

A HUGE question would be: How would a raw 22 year old Dream match up with a DOMINANT and in his prime 32 year old Shaq? He would be DESTROYED. :smh:

BUT...I give the Dream a slight edge due to his out of this world footwork and amazing timing on defense. Watch how he is sizing up these cats in that highlight video posted earlier...DAMN He was coming out of nowhere with those blocks:eek: And the fact that Shaq took off way too many games/plays.

But, at his best, Shaq fouls the Dream out by halftime. As he would have done ANY center not named Wilt.
 
gr8 said:
A HUGE question would be: How would a raw 22 year old Dream match up with a DOMINANT and in his prime 32 year old Shaq? He would be DESTROYED.
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:eek:
At 22 years old Olajuwon was a whirlwind in the center spot...only weakness that cat had was his religion. Catch him during Ramadan and you could do a little something cause he was weak from not eating.
But under normal circumstances, a 32 year old, 350 lb Shaquille O'Neal would end up on Injured Reserve with broken everything if he tried to guard Hakeem at 22 years old.

Now match them BOTH up at 22 years old, that would be a hellified matchup that I would pay to see
 
runawayslave said:
:eek:
At 22 years old olajuwon was a whirlwind in the center spot...only weakness that cat had was his religion. Catch him during ramadan and you could do a little something cause he was weak from not eating.
But under normal circumstances, a 32 year old, 350 lb shaquille o'neal would end up on injured reserve with broken everything if he tried to guard hakeem at 22 years old.

Now match them both up at 22 years old, that would be a hellified matchup that i would pay to see
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:eek:
99-00 lal 79 79 40.0 0.574 0.000 0.524 4.3 9.4 13.6 3.8 0.5 3.0 2.82 3.23 29.7
00-01 lal 74 74 39.5 0.572 0.000 0.513 3.9 8.8 12.7 3.7 0.6 2.8 2.95 3.46 28.7
01-02 lal 67 66 36.1 0.579 0.000 0.555 3.5 7.2 10.7 3.0 0.6 2.0 2.55 2.97 27.2
02-03 lal 67 66 37.8 0.574 0.000 0.622 3.9 7.2 11.1 3.1 0.6 2.4 2.93 3.42 27.5

PRIME SHAQ, age 28-32. NOBODY was guarding him, period. His 350 pound ass was catching spin around alleys for rings. A young skinny Dream would be asking for help from Ralph like he did way before Shaq developed any inside moves.

As much as I hate to give a lazy bastard credit...:hmm:


He was un-guard-able. HACK A SHAQ

btw, never out for the season, as you suggested, he was too busy winning rings.

And let's not forget he was shooting 58% during those years...

Now before you try to pull them up:

97-98 HOU 47 45 34.7 .483 .000 .755 2.50 7.30 9.80 3.0 1.79 2.04 2.68 3.20 16.4
98-99 HOU 50 50 35.7 .514 .308 .717 2.10 7.40 9.60 1.8 1.64 2.46 2.78 3.20 18.9
99-00 HOU 44 28 23.8 .458 .000 .616 1.50 4.80 6.20 1.4 .93 1.59 1.66 2.00 10.3
00-01 HOU 58 55 26.6 .498 .000 .621 2.10 5.30 7.40 1.2 1.21 1.52 1.40 2.40 11.9
01-02 TOR 61 37 22.6 .464 .000 .560 1.60 4.40 6.00 1.1 1.21 1.48 1.61 2.40 7.1

The Dream dominated for 4-5 years and then FELL off, and I mean of EPIC proportions. Maybe even worse than Shaq has.

Yep, that's MR. "INJURED RESERVE" missing half of EVERY season AND getting DESTROYED by Shaq.
 
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