The War at Morehouse

[melonpecan]

With a public school you have to know the fight between the president and the state. And it can be hard and bitter. With private schools, it seems the fight is between the president and the board. Which seems to put up a tougher fight because the students right to demand more has more weight.

Hopefully Morehouse continues to turn it around. I'm not going to talk about the other stuff mentioned...we've talked about it before. However, the need for Morehouse is probably greater than some people can imagine...

 

[JimJones]

Listen brother, reading is fundamental.. All the answers you seek were well fleshed out and articulated in that article.. At some point comprehension kicks in and your ability to discern provides these answers. It was a dam good article. It provided insight on the illusion of keeping up appearances by some elite HBCU's as well as giving a look at specifics and the source and solution to said issues as faced at Morehouse.. And why do you feel the need to infuse faggotry in the discussion? Very odd.

The chairman felt intimidated by what he perceived as an out of touch new guard outsider who threatened his very existence and necessity. This also answers your second question.

The budget changes included ending frivolous spending among faculty, decreasing board size, and adding diversity among board to improve productivity and individual contribution... more importantly tho, the guy who hired the firm responsible for the plan was able to secure 8 figures in grants, donations, and endowments to the University..

Again, i question if you even read the dam article. And if all you came away with was thoughts of faggotry and the conclusion the article provided no insight, then you're a moron... Or maybe im just a genius like you said.

This is more attribution theory than anything. I can see how you discerned all that you said from what was written which speaks to the writing skills of the author far more than it does to the discernment of the reader. Essentially the writer counts on people to deduce things he never said via inuendo and ambiguity. He would love what you deduced from the article and hate that I want more facts to explain what he wrote.

At no point was intimidation an issue that's you attributing that idea from your discernment. The only frivolous spending mentioned was a party that he shot down and no mention of any things else. You and I both know a university budget is humongous and one party is not going to save a whole lot of money so what other budget changes did he make that the people opposed? Board members don't get paid thus reducing the board size and diversifying it does nothing for the budget.

Carry on genius...

 

[Amajorfucup]

This is more attribution theory than anything. I can see how you discerned all that you said from what was written which speaks to the writing skills of the author far more than it does to the discernment of the reader. Essentially the writer counts on people to deduce things he never said via inuendo and ambiguity. He would love what you deduced from the article and hate that I want more facts to explain what he wrote.

Bro, i sincerely consider it basic reading comprehension. Some shit you dont have to have cut up in small pieces and spoon fed to you in order to digest. The article was pretty fucking clear to me.

At no point was intimidation an issue that's you attributing that idea from your discernment. The only frivolous spending mentioned was a party that he shot down and no mention of any things else.

Its an article not a book my man. The author provided context and illustration for all points made. Saying he didnt is simply not true.

You and I both know a university budget is humongous and one party is not going to save a whole lot of money so what other budget changes did he make that the people opposed?

Again, its an article not a book. Would you have rather he provided a pdf of the entire report? I dont feel that was necessary to relay the point(s) being made. Further, your premise requires that you reduce the entire problem and purpose of hiring the firm to "budgetary matters". Thats simple not the case.

Board members don't get paid thus reducing the board size and diversifying it does nothing for the budget.

Again, you make the mistake of assuming the entire matter starts and ends with the budget. No where was this stated. In fact, the article goes out of its way to communicate to the reader that the opposite is true.. Again, i question if you even read the dam article. It clearly states the reasoning behind reducing board size and adding diverse membership.

Carry on genius...

Indeed.

 

[playahaitian]

That sad thing is we ASSUME, because it's Ivy League/PWI that you're going to get a great education/experience but for students of color, it's so not true.

In grad school, I had to take an active role with our graduate black student union because of how marginalizing the experience was at Columbia. It was outrageous to me the hurdles I had to jump in comparison to my white counterparts, whose parents were well known in academia, frequently made appearances on CNN, alumni of Columbia, etc. Plus, those white bitches didn't give a FUCK about my black face because they didn't plan to provide any services to people of color once we received our graduate degrees.

Think of the networking circles one finds by attending an HBCU, not just YOUR personal one. The decision was easy and still easy for me, hands down. My undergrad at Hampton prepared me highly for grad school at an Ivy League school. Personally, I don't think I would have lasted had it not been for the lessons I learned at Hampton.

Imma PM you I got some questions about college and my daughters for you.

 

[sherminator]

Question:

Would any of you choose to attend HBCU over Ivy League if you were accepted to both w/ full scholarship? Does it depend on which schools specifically? Depends on major? Or do you not even need that much detail to answer?

Sorry OP, I shoulda made this a separate thread but lazy. Someone feel free to...

I love my hbcu but if I could have went to Harvard, yeah I'm going, but for any other school nah, I went to a small hbcu but it changed my life,

This is sad what morhouse is going through I hope they figure it out, but it's the same scenario most black colleges, are facing, lack of funding, and board members who are concerned with their bottom line. That was a big issue at my school

 

[Lattimore]

Great post OP

I work for an Ivy..and hold a leadership position. I hold an undergraduate and graduate degrees from a jesuit and highly ranked university respectively. I have two high performing seeds, life willing they will not follow dad's path, instead they will attend a rigorous hbcu for undergraduate studies simply for this fact: at an hbcu they're called scholars at pwt's they're called minority students or underrepresented or students of color or some other low self esteem and coded euphemism ...and since I know the importance of building strong boys that's the path I have outlined for them... I can share some shit about the inner workings of higher ed. If mofos really only knew...

PS. I'm also a board member of my alma mater... And pwt's face similar if not greater financial challenges... Other market forces such as online education is disrupting all institutions. At the end economics is economics at any institution, you can learn the content for free online nowadays... what you pay for is the network and access... Membership has its privileges.

PPS...we really got to start giving more... And putting our money where our mouth is. Giving gives you leverage and influence.

Thank you for all of this. I get tired of trying to make the points you've made. I am 4th generation HBCU... both great grandparents (Howard and Morehouse... 1910 & 1911), grandparents, and parents. I have one brother (there are 4 of us) who attended Stanford. He regrets not attending an HBCU (he's the youngest... just 25). I'm done trying to convince people about HBCU's. I appreciate your perspective for a million different reasons. We're so sick as a people that we can't hear each other... yet alone support each other. I encourage people to give money all the time... even when they didn't attend. It's so important.

 

[Mask]

Hampton University, STAND UP!

(Sigh) Now that that's over (lol,) I would say that I attended Hampton for undergrad, and did Columbia for grad school. Most of my cohort and fellow Hamptonians did the same: undergrad at an HBCU, and grad/law school at a PWI or Ivy League university. If I had a full scholarship to both, I'd still do my HBCU experience. I come from a long line of HBCU graduates: Xavier, Southern U in Baton Rouge and Dillard, to be exact. I have so much pride in my HBCU experience, same as my parents, aunts and uncles.

I think, depending on the degree, some HBCUs are better than others to attend. Xavier is perfect for a pre-med/pharmacy major (so is Hampton, but I'm really trying to NOT be one-sided here.) Other schools matriculate high numbers of engineering, 5 year MBA grads, etc. that RIVAL the number of black graduates at PWIs.

HOWEVER (sigh,) some HBCUs struggle between their legacy and their continued purpose. Hampton, as much as I love it, is led by a conservative president (who I love, but Dr. Harvey is conservative af.) Many still lead with antiquated, conservative vision and it cripples the schools in growing more.

Hampton might be the center of something huge in the near future

 

[Joe Money]

That's way too god damn long to read.

This article badly needed an editor.

 

[bham_brotha]

Not true.. and if you think the so called top schools arent poorly run as well then you're fooling yourself.. Not to mention you clearly didnt read that article..

Funding is a much bigger issue for HBCU's than poor leadership (tho the two can often go hand in hand as evidenced above).

Don't really need an article to know since I've been around HBCU's for 20 years. Poor leadership isn't as big of an issue? The grade scandals at southern that got covered up? What's going on at Jackson state? Alabama state? FAMU? The lack of the need to push increasing admissions requirements or some of the lowest 6 year graduation rates in the country? It was exactly leadership as to why Morris Brown no longer exists. And even after they fucked the school out of business they still refused to give up control. Yes, leadership is a hell of an issue with HBCU's.

 

[JofromthaNO]

Hampton might be the center of something huge in the near future

Between it's Proton Therapy Center, contracts with NOAA location in a major military area, etc...it has the potential to be several things outside of what it is already. But, I'd love to hear more about what could be forthcoming. I stay active in alumni circles, so if something big is brewing, it'll pop up soon.

 

[Joe Money]

Question:

Would any of you choose to attend HBCU over Ivy League if you were accepted to both w/ full scholarship? Does it depend on which schools specifically? Depends on major? Or do you not even need that much detail to answer?

Sorry OP, I shoulda made this a separate thread but lazy. Someone feel free to...

I attended an Ivy and still regret it for a variety of reasons.

I wouldn't. They still treat you like a nigga and act like you don't deserve to be there. No thanks.

This is part of the reason.

Great post OP

I work for an Ivy..and hold a leadership position. I hold an undergraduate and graduate degrees from a jesuit and highly ranked university respectively. I have two high performing seeds, life willing they will not follow dad's path, instead they will attend a rigorous hbcu for undergraduate studies simply for this fact: at an hbcu they're called scholars at pwt's they're called minority students or underrepresented or students of color or some other low self esteem and coded euphemism ...and since I know the importance of building strong boys that's the path I have outlined for them... I can share some shit about the inner workings of higher ed. If mofos really only knew...

This is another reason. I would be interested in hearing what you have to say about the inner working of higher ed, since I attended an Ivy and worked at the graduate school of so-called "Public Ivy."

That sad thing is we ASSUME, because it's Ivy League/PWI that you're going to get a great education/experience but for students of color, it's so not true.

In grad school, I had to take an active role with our graduate black student union because of how marginalizing the experience was at Columbia. It was outrageous to me the hurdles I had to jump in comparison to my white counterparts, whose parents were well known in academia, frequently made appearances on CNN, alumni of Columbia, etc. Plus, those white bitches didn't give a FUCK about my black face because they didn't plan to provide any services to people of color once we received our graduate degrees.

This as well. None of my business, but when did you attend Columbia?

 

[JofromthaNO]

This as well. None of my business, but when did you attend Columbia?

21st Century

Too few of us there for me to give those specific details away lol

 

[Joe Money]

21st Century

Too few of us there for me to give those specific details away lol

Understandable! I just know a few people who went to grad school there in the mid-2000s.

 

[Amajorfucup]

Don't really need an article to know since I've been around HBCU's for 20 years. Poor leadership isn't as big of an issue? The grade scandals at southern that got covered up? What's going on at Jackson state? Alabama state? FAMU? The lack of the need to push increasing admissions requirements or some of the lowest 6 year graduation rates in the country? It was exactly leadership as to why Morris Brown no longer exists. And even after they fucked the school out of business they still refused to give up control. Yes, leadership is a hell of an issue with HBCU's.

Did i say leadership wasnt an issue? Man, it amazes me how some of you people can function in your daily lives considering how poorly you read..

 

[KingTaharqa]

If I didn't get into where I went I probably would've ended up at Southern like the rest of my family. Have had nothing but positive things to say about their experiences there. We need to donate more money to those schools and we need boosters to give back that'll fix most of the money issues. Taking pride in funding the school you went to is something those other school's really have. They fight to buy buildings with their names on it at the school or fund this or that etc etc.

Bills your fam from Louisiana?

 

[305]

I'm going to say this up front for HBCUs: I acknowledge the lack of funding, lack of facilities, lack of name recognition versus PWIs
if you will acknowledge: there is no place in America like an HBCU undergrad campus to facilitate the transition of young African americans to adult hood.

I had to respond to this. If you had to ask, I can make the assumption, you really don't know or have fully experienced being at a HBCU. not trying to insult anyone.

I am not going to dig up all the factors that point to HBCU graduates actually doing better and living more whole lives than their counterparts who graduate from PWIs. What I will say is that HBCUs provide a foundation and an incubator for developing black talent better than PWIs bc the institutional instructors understand and have better common ground with the students they teach. Pyschologically speaking, it is better to attend a school where people who look like you and understand your condition in this system, can provide you insight, wisdom, guidance, and support in dealing with the system that is set up to serve the dominant majority in this country.

I know you have heard the terms "school to prison pipelines" and "racial bias" at all levels of our American educational system. we are still the only group of people who send our children off to be educated by people who truly don't understand what it is to be black in America. AND there are very few PWIs that mandate African American history in their curriculum as part of self education and development. From micro-aggressions to outright racism, HBCUs teach you what you are up against and strengthen your resolve to face it. I HAVE PERSONALLY WITNESSED african-americans who lost themselves at PWIs and become suicidal bc they had to support and no one to reach out. I cant speak for all HBCUs but most have a level of SPECIFICALLY BLACK SUPPORT SYSTEMS that help "armor up" our young men and women and gird them better to face the harsh realities of life. I'm a realist. If I know what the challenge is up front, I am better prepared to fight it. I knew from jump that I had to be twice as good to get half a far. In my career, I have been both hated and respected/revered for that. I

I am a lot more experienced now and would advise my children, mentees and others to choose what is right for you. But do not discount the HBCUs. PWIs will white wash the crap out of you to the point you will no longer to be able to identify with your own people thus continuing the fracturing and degradation of our communities. Yes you can go to PWIs make the big salary and gain large network connections.....but the older you get, you will realize the value of being able to go to homecoming and have lifelong friends that have shared experiences. a real life whole value network vice going out with buffy and chip to golf and nothing to talk about except work.

I tell all my mentees, and young people I come into contact with...go to an HBCU for undergrad (build your foundation) and to a PWI for grad school. get the best of both words if you plan on working in corporate America. BUT THE BEST SOLUTION TO HAVE YOUR OWN BUSINESS AND BE AN ENTREPRENUER. What better place to learn that skillset than at a HBCU..... from selling t-shirts, to shoes, to food plates, to accessories.

I was gonna post a reply to the question but you nailed it. Going to Clark Atlanta Uni and growing up in Miami and never seeing a successful legal African American. Never seeing a conscious AA, until I went to CAU was hands down the best thing that could have happened to my life, and my love for my people and myself.

 

[mailboxpimp]

FISK UNIVERSITY

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

Bills your fam from Louisiana?

Scotlandville

 

[JofromthaNO]

Scotlandville

Damn, you're right there at Southern anyway being from Scotlandville. I never considered Southern (because I wanted to get far af away from home,) but I have so much pride for that school you'd think I went there myself sometimes. Always attended the Bayou Classic as a kid - love the SWAC!

 

[Majestic Lion]

Giving money isn't the issue, the money is and has been available.

What the (potential) money given is used for is the issue.

 

[Amajorfucup]

Giving money isn't the issue, the money is and has been available.

What the (potential) money given is used for is the issue.

Wrong.

 

[Majestic Lion]

Wrong.

lol

Do tell.

 

[Amajorfucup]

lol

Do tell.

They are notoriously underfunded and dont have nearly the alumni financial support they should. Money trumps all.

 

[peterlongshort]

Pretty good discussion going on here. I don't feel like I'm casting my pearls to swine so here's my .02...

1. This cake has been baking for awhile. Before coming on as Morehouse President Wilson was the director of the Obama HBCU initiative, which pretty much everyone agreed was a disaster in the beginning. Most notably the 2012 Pell grant/Plus loan fiasco were hundreds of thousands of black students were sent home because they no longer qualified for aid under the new rules. Silvanius was persona non-grata at every HBCU campus from that point on.

2. But wait? Right after/around the same time as the fiasco Wilson was chosen as president of Morehouse. Incredible timing. I think the Board had buyer's remorse at that point, but it was too late.

3. Wilson is not a yes man. He does his own thing. He don't give a shit if you 3rd generation Morehouse or your parents are crack addicts, he treated everyone the same, he wanted everyone to pay on time. (Lol!) The Board is a gotdamn who's who of the black illumninati, they see things differently. They like to call in favors, do you know who such and such parents are and shit like that, pulling strings, hookups. Wilson gave zero fucks. Zero. It was doomed from the start.

4. The beginning of the end is when Wilson started cutting staff. He wasn't just cutting staff, he was gutting legends. It's like someone taking over the BGOL board from HNIC and demoting Slam or Ten from Mod status... that. is. an.act.of.war.

5. Once Wilson got on Dr. Barksdale's bad side that was it. It was over. All those cats from class of '61 -'71 are damn near untouchable, they run that show. Moss/Davidson/Barksdale, I think they all came up under Bennie Mays. If they tell you to do something you do it, but you certainly don't poke the bear.

6. The Alumni wasn't feeling Wilson, didn't like his style. And the requirement of 3 years mandatory on-campus housing was a real obstacle to recruitment and retention.

Overall, I liked Wilson and I thought he was doing a decent job. I have my critiques of the Board but for the most part they have delivered the goods financially as far as corporate donations are concerned. The absolute bottom line is the market is tight right now for quality college ready black males and it's getting tighter by the day. In conclusion, it's complicated....

 

[Mask]

Scotlandville

Damn you right up the road, how often you come down

 

[Mask]

Between it's Proton Therapy Center, contracts with NOAA location in a major military area, etc...it has the potential to be several things outside of what it is
already. But, I'd love to hear more about what could be forthcoming. I stay active in alumni circles, so if something big is brewing, it'll pop up soon.

I got wind of a tech movement that could be base around that area. Hampton have a pretty good tech field.

 

[Mt. Yukon]

Question:

Would any of you choose to attend HBCU over Ivy League if you were accepted to both w/ full scholarship? Does it depend on which schools specifically? Depends on major? Or do you not even need that much detail to answer?

Sorry OP, I shoulda made this a separate thread but lazy. Someone feel free to...

In hindsight, yes. Granted, I went to a state school so my options wernt as extreme as your scenario. But I used the HBCUs in state as my backups because I knew Id get in. What I like from the friends of mine that are HBCU alums is that the pride in their school, the closeness of their friendships and how big their networking circles are for obvious reasons. I envy that. Now, the horror stories about the incompetence of some of the staff, and how having the basics isnt a given are kind of off putting. Every experience will vary, and I didnt go away to school. So Im sure not being on the yard all the time plays a part. But I would definitely change my choice if I had it to do over.

 

[peterlongshort]

Don't really need an article to know since I've been around HBCU's for 20 years. Poor leadership isn't as big of an issue? The grade scandals at southern that got covered up? What's going on at Jackson state? Alabama state? FAMU? The lack of the need to push increasing admissions requirements or some of the lowest 6 year graduation rates in the country? It was exactly leadership as to why Morris Brown no longer exists. And even after they fucked the school out of business they still refused to give up control. Yes, leadership is a hell of an issue with HBCU's.

Poor leadership. Part of leadership is making hard choices. Why Morris Brown still had a football and basketball team all the way up until their bankruptcy is beyond me. Spelman cut that shit years ago.

 

[Majestic Lion]

They are notoriously underfunded and dont have nearly the alumni financial support they should.

Again, the money exists. Black spending power is a known quantity. The question then becomes why those with the money aren't giving to the institutions we're talking about.

Money trumps all.

No, sir. Money is just a tool. Purpose and the will to see it done trumps all.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

Damn, you're right there at Southern anyway being from Scotlandville. I never considered Southern (because I wanted to get far af away from home,) but I have so much pride for that school you'd think I went there myself sometimes. Always attended the Bayou Classic as a kid - love the SWAC!

Yea everyone went there but me and another cousin lol.

Everyone.

I can walk to the campus from my grandmother's house

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

Damn you right up the road, how often you come down

I be in the field once a year I just came back from the field a few weeks ago I'll be there again late summer

 

[Joe Money]

Poor leadership. Part of leadership is making hard choices. Why Morris Brown still had a football and basketball team all the way up until their bankruptcy is beyond me. Spelman cut that shit years ago.

Perhaps the teams were generating money?

 

[bham_brotha]

Poor leadership. Part of leadership is making hard choices. Why Morris Brown still had a football and basketball team all the way up until their bankruptcy is beyond me. Spelman cut that shit years ago.

Honestly, most can't afford athletics without raping the students with athletics fees.

 

[Mask]

I be in the field once a year I just came back from the field a few weeks ago I'll be there again late summer

Man holla once you touch down, I often pass thru BR

 

[Mask]

Poor leadership. Part of leadership is making hard choices. Why Morris Brown still had a football and basketball team all the way up until their bankruptcy is beyond me. Spelman cut that shit years ago.

Man it's a shame this happens