Where Does Lebron Rank All-Time For You As Of Today?
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I have him Top 10 based on accomplishments, stats, and unique size and strength at his position.
He will have never be top 5 to me, because he lacks a lot of basic skills, no go-to moves, and no killer instinct. His basketball IQ is overrated. If he was not one of the most athletic players ever, and did not have his height and strength, he would be considered an average to below average player.
He really does not do anything, skill-wise, very well. He has not mastered anything on the offensive end.
He will have never be top 5 to me, because he lacks a lot of basic skills, no go-to moves, and no killer instinct. His basketball IQ is overrated. If he was not one of the most athletic players ever, and did not have his height and strength, he would be considered an average to below average player.
He really does not do anything, skill-wise, very well. He has not mastered anything on the offensive end.
As the greatest SF to play the game. Non-Debatable.
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Because he saved a struggling town, fuck the rings, he is GOAT. He didnt need the money. He wanted to put his city on the map. Jordan aint from Chi. Lebron paying for college tuition and Jordan investing in prisons. He carried a team and be the best team and came from a deficit no team has done.
Top 5 easily. Top 3 in terms of players Ive had the chance to see play in their prime
You are one confused bastard imbecile.
Where do u rank kobe?
I think the espys nba player of the year is the best bench mark of best player for the year, due to the fact that it takes into account both the best regular player of the year (mvp) and how they played during the playoffs.. So if you were to use that as a more accurate mark of judging the best players for a year then you have to give LeBron credit for being the best player for as long as it has been around...
Here is a list of the past winners over the years and the amount they won...
Winners[edit]
Year Player Nationality Position Team
1993 Michael Jordan †
United States Shooting guard Chicago Bulls
1994 Charles Barkley
United States Power forward Phoenix Suns
1995 Hakeem Olajuwon †
United States Center Houston Rockets
1996 Hakeem Olajuwon (2)
United States Center Houston Rockets
1997 Michael Jordan (2) †
United States Shooting guard Chicago Bulls
1998 Michael Jordan (3) †
United States Shooting guard Chicago Bulls
1999 Michael Jordan (4)
United States Shooting guard Chicago Bulls
2000 Tim Duncan
United States Power forward San Antonio Spurs
2001 Shaquille O'Neal †
United States Center Los Angeles Lakers
2002 Shaquille O'Neal (2) †
United States Center Los Angeles Lakers
2003 Tim Duncan (2) †
United States Power forward San Antonio Spurs
2004 Kevin Garnett
United States Power forward Minnesota Timberwolves
2005 Steve Nash
Canada Point guard Phoenix Suns
2006 Dwyane Wade †
United States Shooting guard Miami Heat
2007 LeBron James
United States Small forward Cleveland Cavaliers
2008 Kobe Bryant
United States Shooting guard Los Angeles Lakers
2009 LeBron James (2)
United States Small forward Cleveland Cavaliers
2010 Kobe Bryant (2) †
United States Shooting guard Los Angeles Lakers
2011 Dirk Nowitzki †
Germany Power forward Dallas Mavericks
2012 LeBron James (3) †
United States Small forward Miami Heat
2013 LeBron James (4) †
United States Small forward Miami Heat
2014 Kevin Durant
United States Small forward Oklahoma City Thunder
2015 Stephen Curry
United States Point guard Golden State Warriors
2016 LeBron James (5) †
United States Small forward Cleveland Cavaliers
See also[edit]
Here is a list of the past winners over the years and the amount they won...
Winners[edit]
Year Player Nationality Position Team
1993 Michael Jordan †
1994 Charles Barkley
1995 Hakeem Olajuwon †
1996 Hakeem Olajuwon (2)
1997 Michael Jordan (2) †
1998 Michael Jordan (3) †
1999 Michael Jordan (4)
2000 Tim Duncan
2001 Shaquille O'Neal †
2002 Shaquille O'Neal (2) †
2003 Tim Duncan (2) †
2004 Kevin Garnett
2005 Steve Nash
2006 Dwyane Wade †
2007 LeBron James
2008 Kobe Bryant
2009 LeBron James (2)
2010 Kobe Bryant (2) †
2011 Dirk Nowitzki †
2012 LeBron James (3) †
2013 LeBron James (4) †
2014 Kevin Durant
2015 Stephen Curry
2016 LeBron James (5) †
See also[edit]
You be still mad? (figured I would type it in your language so you could understand it!)
You be still mad? (figured I would type it in your language so you could understand it!)
I see you find lots of humor in yourself..before the end of next week there will be thread started by you questioning the same guys legacy...clown shit!
How many people in your top ten won a championship on a team that had no all-star players that season, and won vs a team remotely as good as the Warriors...
Very similar here. I think, though he does have the chase down block which he flashes a dozen and a half times a season, his defense has actually gotten worse. He doesn't play his man and plays outside of his team's defensive scheme. They are all playing man-to-man while he's playing Zone and so many times either his man gets open or one of his teammates compensates for him and that man shakes free. As a Cleveland Fan it frustrates me to no end
The lack of a Killer Instinct has always been a problem for me. People in Cleveland kiss his ass so much, and it'll be more because of the championship, nobody calls him on dribbling 20 seconds out of the clock a dozen times a game. Nobody calls him on the fact that he's not an effective three-point shooter. He's a tweener, not a post up player, not a jump shooter, and not a three point shooter. He doesn't have a go-to move and he's not great at one particular thing. I've never seen a star player disappear in the 4th as much as he does.
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Top 5 all time
First of all, find ONE post where I have ever mentioned LeBron being outside the top 10? Secondly, just because I respect a player doesnt mean I cant question aspects of his career. (I do realize with your limited mental capacities you can't process a multi-layered concept). By the way, multi means more than one...
Lastly, you are obviously hurt from me pointing out how much of an idiot you are earlier and that shit must have burned your dumb ass soul all day! Glad to see you perfected you GED class word for the week though. Your dumbass has used imbecile 10 times today in a sentence!!!!
Gold star for the residient idiot!
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He's the GOAT in my eyes.
I look at players skill for skill:
-Ball handling
-Shooting
-Passing
-Defense
-Playmaking ability (yes, this also involves setting your teammates up with great shots also)
When I compare all of that to everyone else, there's none greater.
For some odd reason, the media convinced everyone that "Team" accomplishments are individual accomplishments, i.e. Championships.
(
6 for 6 in the Finals)... This truly is the dumbest shit I hear people hold on to, like it didn't take a great team to do that... Just one man did it.
I look at players skill for skill:
-Ball handling
-Shooting
-Passing
-Defense
-Playmaking ability (yes, this also involves setting your teammates up with great shots also)
When I compare all of that to everyone else, there's none greater.
For some odd reason, the media convinced everyone that "Team" accomplishments are individual accomplishments, i.e. Championships.
(
6 for 6 in the Finals)... This truly is the dumbest shit I hear people hold on to, like it didn't take a great team to do that... Just one man did it.
@IT IS WHAT IT IS Fam you really typed all that shit..sounds more like you're the one in your feelings...ged, mental capacity, working the fries station. Like come on mane, that's actually suppose to hurt me in some type of way lol
Is this the same guy that led with most blocks, steals, points, rebounds and assist by both teams is a finals vs the best regular season team in the history of the NBA??? All I can say I've seen LeBron do everything and everything it takes to help his team win, from big blocks in big moments, big steals in big moments, big three point shots in big moments, big defense vs the best players in big moments...
Matter of fact if you were to take a player like Kobe and look at his biggest moments, tell me how many of them were in big games, now look up LeBron biggest moments they are almost all during big games and great opponents...
It's like, LeBron can do that shit likely every game was like he doesn't want to. He doesn't want to dominate every game, and that passivity is why he's not in my top 5. Remember when Magic Johnson took over the finals because Karen got hurt? LeBron has a chance to do that last year and he just didn't seem to really want it
As a kid I though if Magic can score all those points when Kareem was out, why can't he score more to beat Boston... The answer is sometimes being great is knowing when to take over and when to give the ball to the open man, depending on what the defense is giving you... In reality no player, not even Jordan is god, and sometimes you have to trust your teammates in order to win... The problem in LeBrons past is that often his teammates let him down, as opposed to Jordan, Magic, Kareem, Kobe, Bird and Russel who teammates always came in the clutch for them..
Ask players like Oscar, Dr. J, and Barkley how it is to play with teammates who could not back you up, just to get a clue to how it is walking in LeBrons shoes...
Plus look at that squad he was playing with..... It was almost a D-league squad...
The fact that you pointed it out proves it did! The fact that after 12 hours you seek me out proves your feelings are hurt. The fact that you can barely type a simple sentence proves you are an idiot. No lol's either, you are genuinely stupid... No matter how much you try to laugh it off. You are really slow
Top 10 to 15, though I can live with top 10.
Lebron is a great physical talent, but I noticed some things about him over the years that makes it impossible for me to put him above other players all-time.
1. When teams close the lanes on Lebron, he falls apart offensively. Unless he has confidence in his jumper - which he often doesn't have enough of - if he can't drive, he has nothing to offer scoring wise, outside of transition baskets. GS made it difficult for him to drive in the earlier part of their series, and he looked like an average offensive player. The moment they laxed on defense, and those lanes opened him, he ate them for lunch.
I've seen other teams do this as well, and it was the same results. Every now and again, he'll get into 'Fuck it' mode, and take that jumper, and if he's hitting it, then you're pretty fucked up. But, more often than not, that just doesn't seem to be the case.
You can't be a top 5 player, as a perimeter player, if closing lanes is enough to make you a nobody on the court offensively.
2. Lebron compiles stats in other areas, but that doesn't impress me, because all that takes from a talented player is effort. Westbrook, for instance, suddenly started playing that same style and now his numbers have jumped. I always thought he was an overrated passer, though he is a good passer. He rebounds well, but nothing unusual for a player his height. For instance, Larry Bird averaged double-digit rebounds for the career, but Lebron, despite being around the same height, and faaaar more athletic, never averaged double-digit rebounds for a season. But, Lebron runs around the court, doing everything .... all the while, he'll completely disappear near the end of games. I've seen it a hundred and one times: Lebron will have 39, 15, and 12 ... not show-up at all - meaning, not even take a damn shot in some cases- they lose, and his fans will say, 'It wasn't his fault, look at his stats!"
Lebron to me is a stat stuffer. Its almost as if he feels, if he piles up a bunch of stats, but don't show up when he needs to, people will overlook him not showing up at the end of the game, because he was so statistically productive.
I see you, Lebron. Yes, it takes a very talented player to put up numbers, but I've seen players who aren't considered all-around like Lebron, put up all-around numbers very similar to him when they chose to. Michael Jordan had a 32, 8, and 8 season, despite his career rebound and assist numbers not being close to that. Jordan had back to back 120-plus block seasons, despite never crossing 100 again. It was during the time he wanted to prove he could play great defense. As I said, effort.
3. You picked your teammates, and yet you aren't' running the table? You beat OKC. Cool. You almost lost to the Spurs TWICE. Lost to a Dallas time that he shouldn't have. Lost to GS, but I can overlook that. Point is, for someone who has picked his teams, thinking it'd give him the overwhelming advantage - i.e. Not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, not 5, not 6 - his winning percentage in the Finals just ain't cutting it.
Furthermore, if you're going to pick your All-Star teammates, you shouldn't be barely winning. You should be killing motherfuckers. Isn't your greatest attribute that you make your teammates better, but you've had two All-Stars as third options - Bosh and Love - and yet all thwo were less effective playing with you? Maybe they can't put up the same numbers with you and the second option, but they certainly shouldn't become shell's of themselves.
So, yeah ... to me, Lebron is a lot of smoke and mirrors. If you take him at face value, he can look top 5. But, its just ..... I don't take his shit at face value. There hasn't been a top 5 player in the NBA since Jordan retired.
Lebron is a great physical talent, but I noticed some things about him over the years that makes it impossible for me to put him above other players all-time.
1. When teams close the lanes on Lebron, he falls apart offensively. Unless he has confidence in his jumper - which he often doesn't have enough of - if he can't drive, he has nothing to offer scoring wise, outside of transition baskets. GS made it difficult for him to drive in the earlier part of their series, and he looked like an average offensive player. The moment they laxed on defense, and those lanes opened him, he ate them for lunch.
I've seen other teams do this as well, and it was the same results. Every now and again, he'll get into 'Fuck it' mode, and take that jumper, and if he's hitting it, then you're pretty fucked up. But, more often than not, that just doesn't seem to be the case.
You can't be a top 5 player, as a perimeter player, if closing lanes is enough to make you a nobody on the court offensively.
2. Lebron compiles stats in other areas, but that doesn't impress me, because all that takes from a talented player is effort. Westbrook, for instance, suddenly started playing that same style and now his numbers have jumped. I always thought he was an overrated passer, though he is a good passer. He rebounds well, but nothing unusual for a player his height. For instance, Larry Bird averaged double-digit rebounds for the career, but Lebron, despite being around the same height, and faaaar more athletic, never averaged double-digit rebounds for a season. But, Lebron runs around the court, doing everything .... all the while, he'll completely disappear near the end of games. I've seen it a hundred and one times: Lebron will have 39, 15, and 12 ... not show-up at all - meaning, not even take a damn shot in some cases- they lose, and his fans will say, 'It wasn't his fault, look at his stats!"
Lebron to me is a stat stuffer. Its almost as if he feels, if he piles up a bunch of stats, but don't show up when he needs to, people will overlook him not showing up at the end of the game, because he was so statistically productive.
I see you, Lebron. Yes, it takes a very talented player to put up numbers, but I've seen players who aren't considered all-around like Lebron, put up all-around numbers very similar to him when they chose to. Michael Jordan had a 32, 8, and 8 season, despite his career rebound and assist numbers not being close to that. Jordan had back to back 120-plus block seasons, despite never crossing 100 again. It was during the time he wanted to prove he could play great defense. As I said, effort.
3. You picked your teammates, and yet you aren't' running the table? You beat OKC. Cool. You almost lost to the Spurs TWICE. Lost to a Dallas time that he shouldn't have. Lost to GS, but I can overlook that. Point is, for someone who has picked his teams, thinking it'd give him the overwhelming advantage - i.e. Not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, not 5, not 6 - his winning percentage in the Finals just ain't cutting it.
Furthermore, if you're going to pick your All-Star teammates, you shouldn't be barely winning. You should be killing motherfuckers. Isn't your greatest attribute that you make your teammates better, but you've had two All-Stars as third options - Bosh and Love - and yet all thwo were less effective playing with you? Maybe they can't put up the same numbers with you and the second option, but they certainly shouldn't become shell's of themselves.
So, yeah ... to me, Lebron is a lot of smoke and mirrors. If you take him at face value, he can look top 5. But, its just ..... I don't take his shit at face value. There hasn't been a top 5 player in the NBA since Jordan retired.
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...and for the record, when I say Lebron is smoke and mirrors, I don't think he's alone. Kobe is smoke and mirrors, Shaq, and Duncan, for instance. To me, the top 5 players have a greater substance to hype ratio. Now, obviously to be a top 10 player, you have to have A LOT of substance, but it just means to me that while shit can look crazy on the surface, some digging will reveal that you don't quite meet that top 5 standard.
Just a question but how old are you fam. Just wanna know what players you've seen in action and not just highlights and stories
Any player who attacks the rim are dependent on his shooters to open the lane, the same way running backs are dependent on the passing attack to get the defense from loading up the box...
Conversely jump shooter depend on re-bounder for 2nd chances allowing them to get more shots...
No one player is independent not needing key players to help them succeed.... This is the beauty of the game and a part that is over looked by the video game generation and sports commentators who never played the sport..
Another thing to consider, LeBron always plays with his head up, unlike most drivers who tuck their head down when they are attacking the rim allowing the defense to collapse with out worrying about the ball being kicked back out to the open man at the wing...
One complaint that I had with Durant over the years is that when he goes to the hole, you can usually tell what he is going to do by his head, when he is going to pass his head is up and when he is going to shoot he lowers the head... Most players do this and when the defense attacks folks be swearing up and down he is being tripled teamed, no he isn't, its just the defense knows he is trying to score and they collapse hard knowing he will not beat them with the pass...
When LeBron does this people often confuse it as not being as aggressive, but LeBron kills you by any means necessary, collapse to hard he will kick it out and make that pass stay at home and he will kill you driving to the lane... This is also how he is able to have both so many points, shoot for a high% while having so many assist...
One complaint that I had with Durant over the years is that when he goes to the hole, you can usually tell what he is going to do by his head, when he is going to pass his head is up and when he is going to shoot he lowers the head... Most players do this and when the defense attacks folks be swearing up and down he is being tripled teamed, no he isn't, its just the defense knows he is trying to score and they collapse hard knowing he will not beat them with the pass...
When LeBron does this people often confuse it as not being as aggressive, but LeBron kills you by any means necessary, collapse to hard he will kick it out and make that pass stay at home and he will kill you driving to the lane... This is also how he is able to have both so many points, shoot for a high% while having so many assist...
Bro', I've seen any player that came into the NBA after 1985. I was born in 1980.
Do you realize that James actually plays the point, not some fake point like Irving and Curry, but a true point.... Now tell me in the history of the sport how many points have scored as much as he has, win as many games, MVP's, championships, have his rebounds, while playing for as little talent as he has played in his career????
