Why do black people think white people speak properly????

[BoyJupiter]

I think its not that they speak "properly" but that some of us have reverted to such a malaigned form of an improper use of the english language where "slang" has become a norm in some cases; that many want to get as far away from the broken slang language as possible.
I'm continually listening to my students DELIBERATELY misuse the english language because they think its the hip thing to do.
I literally detest it when you have a Black person CHANGE their voice to a white diction.... where its repulsively obvious that that are over doing it.
In my opinion there is nothing wrong with having your own Black voice while speaking english with good diction.

dic·tion /ˈdɪkʃən/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[dik-shuhn] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. style of speaking or writing as dependent upon choice of words: good diction.
2. the accent, inflection, intonation, and speech-sound quality manifested by an individual speaker, usually judged in terms of prevailing standards of acceptability; enunciation.

Okay, I see a close tie between diction and enunciation. So I would have to ask, what is "white" diction and what is "black" diction?


When I speak in public, I get respect from all races. I have heard that I speak
"white." These words usually come from those who I came up with in the metro atlanta area that chose a different path....I listen to a lot of seminars that are hosted by all races...I listen to a lot of people, and naturally, have formed/molded my "diction" to reflect my input.

To hear that there is thought to be a "black" and "white" diction is very frustrating. At the end of the day, I suffer from the same tribulations that society imposes on any black man, regardless of my "diction." This kind of thought process, the process of there being a "black" and "white" diction, can actually stifle the growth of my people. By creating a "black" and "white" diction, we are regimenting the growth of a person by means of attacking ones blackness via false preconceptions about the natural state of black people. There is no natural state of black people other than our color and our greatness, anything we create or absorb should be held in the highest esteem, BY ALL RACES.

Speak how you want to speak and be proud.

 

[Built4Life]

What’s sad is you’re trying to bring race into this.

The fact is languages have set rules. Race has nothing to do with it.

Ultimate proof!!!!

George W Bush

He’s white.

He's rich.

Even muthafucking white, die hard republicans agree that he’s CONSTANTLY fucking up the English language.

Race, position, and social status has nothing to do with it.

If you’re fucking up the language, you’re fucking up the language.

And EVERBODY going to know it. Why? Because the language has certain rules and words have certain pronunciations.

Period.

You need to read up. Languages are living. They change with time. The written language has set rules, but not oral language. Listen to any conversation and you will shear people violate all the rules that apply in the written language. You have fragmented sentences run-ons etc...

Also, speaking the standard of any language does not make you an effective communicator.
My point is that the way a language is spoken is a political question.

 

[BoyJupiter]

You need to read up. Languages are living. They change with time. The written language has set rules, but not oral language. Listen to any conversation and you will shear people violate all the rules that apply in the written language. You have fragmented sentences run-ons etc...

Also, speaking the standard of any language does not make you an effective communicator.
My point is that the way a language is spoken is a political question.

I agree; there are people who talk too fast and people who talk too slow, people who don't enunciate and people that do. People who studder, etc.

The fact is that there is tension within our race about the way that we speak...but that tension isn't indigenous to our race. There are white northerners who have preconceptions about certain white southerners due to their drawl. The same goes with black northerners and black southerners.

It sickening really because England has been laughing at us for hundred's of years...watching us fight over a language that they gave us.

The purpose of language is communication...how effectively are you communicating?? Who is your daily demographic/audience? How do they speak? How often do you spend time with this audience? No matter how much you fight it, in time, you will begin to speak like what you are surrounded by.

The political question has an answer in the numbers of people.

 

[Dwayne Wayne]

Man I had this class already:

Standard American English

http://www.pbs.org/speak/seatosea/standardamerican/

Ask a group of experts to define Standard American English, and you'll find, paradoxically, there's no standard answer. Even the editors of The American Heritage Dictionary are careful to qualify their definition. They note:

People who invoke the term Standard English rarely make clear what they have in mind by it, and tend to slur over the inconvenient ambiguities that are inherent in the term.

American Heritage goes on to explain that the term:

is highly elastic and variable, since what counts as Standard English will depend on both the locality and the particular varieties that Standard English is being contrasted with. A form that is considered standard in one region may be nonstandard in another...

Where does this leave us? American Heritage suggests there's no single, universally accepted standard for how to speak or write American English. Even so, school systems, professional communicators and businesses all have standards and, not surprisingly, the rules (at least for grammar) do not vary dramatically from place to place.


What's more elusive is finding an accent that sets the standard. The variety of English spoken in the nation's Midland areas is often pointed to as sounding most neutral or "mainstream." It's frequently identified as the speech of broadcasters. But as linguist Matthew Gordon explains, it too is not unaccented English. For a variety of reasons, over time, the Midland variety may lose its status as the vox media....

You want more click the link

http://www.pbs.org/speak/seatosea/standardamerican/

 

[Vagina Feaster]

LOL @ The Dark Mind butchering kayanation with logic and reasoning. God, I love it!

Maybe this kayanation faggot will stop posting race baiting threads now...

 

[NiggaHate]

In all honesty, many of my people are lazy with the tonge. We used to know when to 'turn it on" and then keep it real when back home.

Now niggas just dont care. Blame whoever you want. Many of us dont enunciate then get mad when someone askes us to repeat ourselves.

This is their language... period. Master it and move on... simple.

 

[water]

LOL @ The Dark Mind butchering kayanation with logic and reasoning. God, I love it!

Maybe this kayanation faggot will stop posting race baiting threads now...

I think you are feasting on too many vaginas............


Anyone with common sense will see that Dark Mind has been owned.

He keep insisting that language is fixed.

Many posters above have illuminated his ignorance without resorting to emotion. Both of you just can't see it.

Apparently you two need a reading lesson.

Standard American English

http://www.pbs.org/speak/seatosea/standardamerican/

Ask a group of experts to define Standard American English, and you'll find, paradoxically, there's no standard answer. Even the editors of The American Heritage Dictionary are careful to qualify their definition. They note:

People who invoke the term Standard English rarely make clear what they have in mind by it, and tend to slur over the inconvenient ambiguities that are inherent in the term.

American Heritage goes on to explain that the term:

is highly elastic and variable, since what counts as Standard English will depend on both the locality and the particular varieties that Standard English is being contrasted with. A form that is considered standard in one region may be nonstandard in another...

Where does this leave us? American Heritage suggests there's no single, universally accepted standard for how to speak or write American English. Even so, school systems, professional communicators and businesses all have standards and, not surprisingly, the rules (at least for grammar) do not vary dramatically from place to place.


What's more elusive is finding an accent that sets the standard. The variety of English spoken in the nation's Midland areas is often pointed to as sounding most neutral or "mainstream." It's frequently identified as the speech of broadcasters. But as linguist Matthew Gordon explains, it too is not unaccented English. For a variety of reasons, over time, the Midland variety may lose its status as the vox media....

You want more click the link

http://www.pbs.org/speak/seatosea/standardamerican/

I will suggest you go to the link before DarkMind corrupts your mind with his shit...............

I would love to see DarkMind address those points in red.......






Bump to MassaQ, nukdollars, Mc2, divine, BigDaddyYul and other who get it.

 

[swiftandsilent]

it's basically ghetto & country people (not necessarily Blacks) who fuck up the english language,,, for the record, red necks, mexicans and asians fuck it up too,,,

every launguage has a standard,,, either you are speaking it correctly, or you are not,,,

AMEN BROTHA, PREACH PREACH

 

[water]

AMEN BROTHA, PREACH PREACH

What color do you need me to put this in?????




"Ask a group of experts to define Standard American English, and you'll find, paradoxically, there's no standard answer. Even the editors of The American Heritage Dictionary are careful to qualify their definition. They note:

People who invoke the term Standard English rarely make clear what they have in mind by it, and tend to slur over the inconvenient ambiguities that are inherent in the term.

American Heritage goes on to explain that the term:

is highly elastic and variable, since what counts as Standard English will depend on both the locality and the particular varieties that Standard English is being contrasted with. A form that is considered standard in one region may be nonstandard in another...

Where does this leave us? American Heritage suggests there's no single, universally accepted standard for how to speak or write American English. Even so, school systems, professional communicators and businesses all have standards and, not surprisingly, the rules (at least for grammar) do not vary dramatically from place to place.


What's more elusive is finding an accent that sets the standard."

 

[water]

Now we got that cleared.........

I see no reason why black people cannot speak with their own accents, enunciations etc while using correct grammar.



There is no reason for you to "sound white"

It's just another way for you to hate who you are...........

 

[Leeeeeee]

Now we got that cleared.........

I see no reason why black people cannot speak with their own accents, enunciations etc while using correct grammar.



There is no reason for you to "sound white"

It's just another way for you to hate who you are...........

You know K, occasionally you offer enlightening insights, but at times you sound like the egotistical pompous folk you claim to disagree with so......

Who made you the All Mighty of all things Black.....?

Just because a Black person has an opinion different than yours, then they must hate who they are.....Bullshit!

I grew up in a small All Black college community.......my pops was a professor as were the parents of All my friends......we learn our enunciation and diction from those we grow up around........but if my friend whose mother was a college English professor "sounds" white to Kaya, then he hates himself. Bullshit.

So not only do you appear to be racist against whites, but against Blacks who do not fit your mold.

That's shallow bruh, even though I see you are trying not to be, that shit is shallow.

Are you sure your obsession with "all things white" as exhibited in ALL your threads is not an indication of your self hate. I don't wake up and go to sleeping wondering about what white folk are thinking or doing, or any other folk for that matter, because I am comfortable with who I am.

You may have traveled the world, but you haven't experienced the world, because if you have you would cease expecting All Black folk to either fit the same mold or be self haters.

Just something to think about.

And I offer this with the utmost respect.

 

[The Dark Mind]

You need to read up. Languages are living. They change with time.

I do stay read up, and yes languages are living. I've had to explain this to kayanation before. And yes they change over time. But that's the key point. They change OVER TIME, not in an instant at the whim of any speaker.

The written language has set rules, but not oral language.

False oral language has rules too. And those rules generally follow the written ones. They are just not as enforceable as the written ones.

Listen to any conversation and you will shear people violate all the rules that apply in the written language. You have fragmented sentences run-ons etc...

Yes you are right. When speaking, generally rules are such as run-ons and fragments are not enforced. Nor should it be. People are just speaking freely amongst themselves; humans being humans, if you will. But there are still rules... even when speaking. You're still expected to pause in between sentences, and to construct sentences speak in a way that people can understand you.

Anyone who says that there aren't rules to speech has not been in a college level speech class and had instructors rip students apart for not putting sentences together correctly or broken delivery. They are just as bad as the English professors. Speech professors will tell you it is not good enough to write a good term paper and then stand up and give a presentation with broken delivery and ebonics. The paper will get an A and the speech will get an F. It's not pretty.

Also, speaking the standard of any language does not make you an effective communicator.

Agreed. Amen to that.

My point is that the way a language is spoken is a political question.

Not really. How you speak doesn't have so much to do with the political. It has more to do with a combination of personal preference and environment.

 

[Gods_Debris]

I have a beef w/ the word "EBON-ics" in general... fuck whitey

 

[HandsSolo2K5]

Dude, You Are, Like, So Mental For This thread.......whoa!

 

[HandsSolo2K5]

Dark Mind,


1. White people in America did NOT create the english language.

2. Interjecting "like" after every 2 words is NOT speaking properly no matter what you say

3. A lot of white people who are NOT "trailer trash" do NOT speak properly

4. How can I work in corporate america as a successful professional and not meet a lot of white people?

5. This post is about black people who use white enunciations to make it appear they are speaking properly.



Get it?

If people use terms like "like" in between their sentences, they, henceforth, are not speaking proper English. Quit being so naive. It is just their dialect...... Enunciating words depends on whether people are lazy with the language or not. I say 'ALRIGHT' alot but a lot of black men say "aight" There are other cultures that completely obliterate the English language..... Go talk to an Irishmen, or Italian, or Chinese person, they fuck up all the time. Even WASP do it. It isnt race specific. Even with my good diction and enunciation, I fuck up once in a while. I use 'OK' alot and it annoys my female friend......But a lot of black people use " Hair Did" "I'm finna"
"Whaddup Mayne" "I'm axing" " Know what I'm sayin" and shit like that..... Of course I'll come off white to them if I say things the CORRECT way. Again, stop being so naive

 

[BoyJupiter]

Now we got that cleared.........

I see no reason why black people cannot speak with their own accents, enunciations etc while using correct grammar.



There is no reason for you to "sound white"

It's just another way for you to hate who you are...........

Black people are many things....we don't all enunciate the same, nor do we all speak or look the same.

By criticizing another person for "sounding white," YOU are, in fact, reflecting a self hate...you are embracing an image of blackness that society has put before you, and saying that all else is not black.

Now THAT'S self hate.

Black people are capable and allowed to master all things, even the diction of their choice.

 

[SKATTA]

well since its called english and the british speak different than most north americans.who is fuggin it up.
the brits/americans/canadians/caribbean etc etc....

 

[Adam Knows]

I think its not that they speak "properly" but that some of us have reverted to such a malaigned form of an improper use of the english language where "slang" has become a norm in some cases; that many want to get as far away from the broken slang language as possible.
I'm continually listening to my students DELIBERATELY misuse the english language because they think its the hip thing to do.
I literally detest it when you have a Black person CHANGE their voice to a white diction.... where its repulsively obvious that that are over doing it.
In my opinion there is nothing wrong with having your own Black voice while speaking english with good diction.

what's considered talking "white" is clear correct pronounciation of words. No slurs, no partial pronounciation of the word, no adding of syllables, vowels or consonants to the word

 

[The Dark Mind]

I think you are feasting on too many vaginas............

Anyone with common sense will see that Dark Mind has been owned.

Hahahah actually it's the other way around, the reason you got mad is because everybody can see that it is you getting owned.

And all you are doing now is just making it worse for yourself.

...

Oh well.

He keep insisting that language is fixed.

As you can see here kayanation has a tendency to LIE a lot.

I never say the language is fixed. I said that words have set definitions and meanings and you can't just make up your own because you feel like it and claim it's the standard.

Here is proof what I really said.

You need to read up. Languages are living. They change with time.

I do stay read up, and yes languages are living. I've had to explain this to kayanation before. And yes they change over time. But that's the key point. They change over time, not at the whim of any speaker.

What is sad is that I've explained all this before in another thread on a similar subject.

Many posters above have illuminated his ignorance without resorting to emotion. Both of you just can't see it.

Now you're just living in fantasy world. Nobody's done no such thing, and the only ignorance being demonstrated is yours.

Apparently you two need a reading lesson.

Obviously it is you who needs a reading lessons. The information in the links back up my points, not yours.


----------------------------------------------------
From the PBS link:
American Heritage goes on to explain that the term:

is highly elastic and variable, since what counts as Standard English will depend on both the locality and the particular varieties that Standard English is being contrasted with. A form that is considered standard in one region may be nonstandard in another...

which proves my point when I said...

kayanation,

1. White people, including the ones in America, DID create the English language

Americans speak speak with various accents depending on what part of the country they are from.

----------------------------------------------------
From the PBS link:
Where does this leave us? American Heritage suggests there's no single, universally accepted standard for how to speak or write American English. Even so, school systems, professional communicators and businesses all have standards and, not surprisingly, the rules (at least for grammar) do not vary dramatically from place to place.

What's more elusive is finding an accent that sets the standard."

which backs up my point when I said...

No. What you are talking about now is accent. They have foreign accents

Their are Indians who speak english perfectly (form sentences using correct grammar, and speak words properly), they just have an accent.

And then there are other Indians who break up sentences, and turn phrases around. Plus they have and accent. You can still understand what they are saying, but you would never say they were speaking proper english.

See??? I win. You lose.

 

[HandsSolo2K5]

Black people are many things....we don't all enunciate the same, nor do we all speak or look the same.

By criticizing another person for "sounding white," YOU are, in fact, reflecting a self hate...you are embracing an image of blackness that society has put before you, and saying that all else is not black.

Now THAT'S self hate.

Black people are capable and allowed to master all things, even the diction of their choice.

I WAS ABOUT TO TELL HIM THE SAME THING, CONVERSELY, A BLACK MAN TRYING TOO HARD TO ARTICULATE CAN BE CONSTRUED AS THE SAME THING.... I HATE USING SLANG, BUT THAT IS JUST ME....... THIS WHITE GIRL ASKED ME AND MY DATE IF I WERE "SERIOUS" WHEN I ORDERED A BURGER FROM PORTILLO'S .... I WANTED TO REACH OVER THE COUNTER AND YANK THAT BITCH FIRST THING THAT CAME TO MIND WAS BLACK MEN HAVE TO TALK IN FUCKED UP BROKEN ENGLISH, AND SECOND, I WAS IN A CHICAGO SUBURB OF DOWNERS GROVE, SHE HAD TO RUN INTO PROPER SPEAKING BLACK MEN BEFORE

 

[divine]

the sad thing about fools is that they don't realize they are fools. Kaya has been dropping jewels on this board for a long time..and you..well, you're a damn fool if you think you owned anyone...

Hahahah actually it's the other way around, the reason you got mad is because everybody can see that it is you getting owned.

And all you are doing now is just making it worse for yourself.

...

Oh well.



As you can see here kayanation has a tendency to LIE a lot.

I never say the language is fixed. I said that words have set definitions and meanings and you can't just make up your own because you feel like it and claim it's the standard.

Here is proof what I really said.


What is sad is that I've explained all this before in another thread on a similar subject.


Now you're just living in fantasy world. Nobody's done no such thing, and the only ignorance being demonstrated is yours.



Obviously it is you who needs a reading lessons. The information in the links back up my points, not yours.


----------------------------------------------------
From the PBS link:
American Heritage goes on to explain that the term:

is highly elastic and variable, since what counts as Standard English will depend on both the locality and the particular varieties that Standard English is being contrasted with. A form that is considered standard in one region may be nonstandard in another...

which proves my point when I said...


----------------------------------------------------
From the PBS link:
Where does this leave us? American Heritage suggests there's no single, universally accepted standard for how to speak or write American English. Even so, school systems, professional communicators and businesses all have standards and, not surprisingly, the rules (at least for grammar) do not vary dramatically from place to place.

What's more elusive is finding an accent that sets the standard."

which backs up my point when I said...



See??? I win. You lose.

 

[HandsSolo2K5]

the sad thing about fools is that they don't realize they are fools. Kaya has been dropping jewels on this board for a long time..and you..well, you're a damn fool if you think you owned anyone...

BUT THE PROBLEM WITH K-NATION IS THAT HE BELIEVES THAT MOST BLACKS BELIEVE THAT WHITES TALK PROPER ENGLISH.... THEY DO NOT. IN FACT YOU HAVE MORE INARTICULATE WHITES THAN YOU HAVE BLACKS IN THIS COUNTRY. WAY MORE. ANY INTELLIGENT BLACK PERSON WITH ENOUGH EXPERIENCE WITH THE CAUCASEAN PERSUASION WOULD UNDERSTAND THAT. I THINK HE IS TALKING ABOUT THE TIGER WOODS'S THE ALAN KEYES, AND PEOPLE WHO TALK LIKE THAT....... ALL I HAVE TO SAY IS PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT EXPERIENCES AND DIFFERENT BACKGROUNDS. I HATE "WHITE TALK " TOO BUT SOME BLACKS TRUST WHITES MORE....... SOME LIKE WHITES MORE. UNFORTUNATELY, I GET LUMPED INTO THAT CATEGORY ALSO WHEN I'M AROUND A BUNCH OF TRASHY, GUTTA, GHETTO FOLK...... BUT REALLY, IT IS THEIR IGNORANT WAY OF NOT ACCEPTING WHAT THEY DONT UNDERSTAND AND ISOLATING THEM. BUT I WILL NEVER DOUBT MY BLACKNESS BECAUSE SOMEONE DID NOT WANT TO READ A FUCKIN' BOOK. ARE ALL BLACK MEN SUPPOSED TO DO JAIL TIME (ALTHOUGH I DID SOME COUNTY TIME), THUS UNDERSTAND WHAT JAIL IS LIKE? OR RUN FROM THEIR RESPONBILITIES AS FATHERS? OR SMOKED WEED OR DRANK ALCOHOL ALTHOUGH I VE DONE BOTH AT ONE POINT? OR WALKED IT OUT, OR JUKED? MAKE YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE, WITHOUT WHITE NOR BLACK PREJUDICES OR ANY OTHER RACE. YOU BECOME A BETTER PERSON FOR IT

 

[The Dark Mind]

LOL @ The Dark Mind butchering kayanation with logic and reasoning. God, I love it!

Maybe this kayanation faggot will stop posting race baiting threads now...

It's not a big deal really.

kayanation has never won a debate with me on this board.

Oh he makes a lot of noise, but if you calmly sit there and attack him with logic and common sense, his arguments quickly fall apart.

Why? Simple most of his arguments are based around hate.

It's sad really, because he does appear to have some knowledge. He obviously researches black history. But then he puts this hateful black power spin on everything.

He engages in what I call "black power racism".

What's so sinister about this type of racism is that it doesn't just unjusty attacks all whites... It attacks blacks that it doesn't feel measure up to being called "black".

This is the reason why ....

If you don't talk a certain way he calls you white.
If you don't agree with his point of view or think the way he thinks you should think, then you are white.
If you state that you have a few white friends, then he says that you hate yourself.

He believes all white people hate black people secretly. He's obsessed.

Therefore black power racists lash out at their fellow blacks with more ferocity than at the whites. Because he demand that all blacks think alike, talk alike, and tow some militant black line. And woe to the black man who tries to educate himself, think for himself, speak for himself, and/or expand himself. The black power racist will be right there to tell you how you hate yourself

Kayanation doesn't engage in logic. He just engages in hate.

Again it's sad because he appears to have some knowledge, If he would just drop the warped irrational hate, he would be potent.

 

[The Dark Mind]

BUT THE PROBLEM WITH K-NATION IS THAT HE BELIEVES THAT MOST BLACKS BELIEVE THAT WHITES TALK PROPER ENGLISH.... THEY DO NOT. IN FACT YOU HAVE MORE INARTICULATE WHITES THAN YOU HAVE BLACKS IN THIS COUNTRY. WAY MORE. ANY INTELLIGENT BLACK PERSON WITH ENOUGH EXPERIENCE WITH THE CAUCASEAN PERSUASION WOULD UNDERSTAND THAT. I THINK HE IS TALKING ABOUT THE TIGER WOODS'S THE ALAN KEYES, AND PEOPLE WHO TALK LIKE THAT....... ALL I HAVE TO SAY IS PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT EXPERIENCES AND DIFFERENT BACKGROUNDS. I HATE "WHITE TALK " TOO BUT SOME BLACKS TRUST WHITES MORE....... SOME LIKE WHITES MORE. UNFORTUNATELY, I GET LUMPED INTO THAT CATEGORY ALSO WHEN I'M AROUND A BUNCH OF TRASHY, GUTTA, GHETTO FOLK...... BUT REALLY, IT IS THEIR IGNORANT WAY OF NOT ACCEPTING WHAT THEY DONT UNDERSTAND AND ISOLATING THEM. BUT I WILL NEVER DOUBT MY BLACKNESS BECAUSE SOMEONE DID NOT WANT TO READ A FUCKIN' BOOK. ARE ALL BLACK MEN SUPPOSED TO DO JAIL TIME (ALTHOUGH I DID SOME COUNTY TIME), THUS UNDERSTAND WHAT JAIL IS LIKE? OR RUN FROM THEIR RESPONBILITIES AS FATHERS? OR SMOKED WEED OR DRANK ALCOHOL ALTHOUGH I VE DONE BOTH AT ONE POINT? OR WALKED IT OUT, OR JUKED? MAKE YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE, WITHOUT WHITE NOR BLACK PREJUDICES OR ANY OTHER RACE. YOU BECOME A BETTER PERSON FOR IT

PREACH!

PREACH Brotha!

PREACH!!!!

 

[HandsSolo2K5]

PREACH!

PREACH Brotha!

PREACH!!!!

Trust me, you live long enough, somebody probably think Kayanation sounds white..... I wonder who that backwoods, inbred, reverse toe nail growin' , swamp breathed mud slug would be?

 

[BigDaddyBuk]

i have The Dark Mind on ignore.

why doesn't everyone else?

 

[DeadAzz Serious]

Why do black people think white people speak properly????

For the life of me I can't figure out that shit.

Then when someone says that they are sounding white they take it as a compliment............

It is not a compliment. It is referring to you forcing yourself to assimilate to the DICTION of a white person.

Since when did "like" after every two words become correct?????




I have travelled to many cities over the years and I KNOW that a lot of white people DO NOT speak properly.

Why do black people feel that white people speak properly?????

So much so that they have white people feeling that they do!

As far as I see it you can speak properly without a "white" diction and be fine.

Patel, Prakash and Singh do fine with their indian dialect.

As far as I see it, the pressure to assimilate crosses good common sense in our own people.

Most times the person discriminating against a black sounding name in HR is black himself/herself.


We need to stop that shit.

Very good thread,and IGNORANT asses will never comprehend how they constantly put THEMSELVES down. And if I personally say that someone is trying to talk white I damn sure am not trying to convey that they're speaking proper. Fucking idiots,learn to use you mind.

 

[Shadow]

I think you are feasting on too many vaginas............


Anyone with common sense will see that Dark Mind has been owned.

He keep insisting that language is fixed.

Many posters above have illuminated his ignorance without resorting to emotion. Both of you just can't see it.

Apparently you two need a reading lesson.






I will suggest you go to the link before DarkMind corrupts your mind with his shit...............

I would love to see DarkMind address those points in red.......






Bump to MassaQ, nukdollars, Mc2, divine, BigDaddyYul and other who get it.

Who won this one is debatable because you two are coming from two different sides of the same argument.

I do agree you are race bating with this thread, though.

You say explain the points in red, but did you bother to read the rest of the thread? Language may not have a standard, but there is accepted and unaccepted speech everywhere.

Someone here mentioned "turning it on" when needed and speaking slang when away from the work place. Don't agree completely, but it's better than having someone "axe" me if I want to have "scrimps" at the "restron" "cross da screet" to discuss his employment with my firm.

 

[The Dark Mind]

Trust me, you live long enough, somebody probably think Kayanation sounds white..... I wonder who that backwoods, inbred, reverse toe nail growin' , swamp breathed mud slug would be?

I don't know I just think if kayanation would let go of some his hate, he would stop bashing his fellow brothas and sistas and any other group of people that don't agree with his way of things.

He comes off like a paranoid sith lord.

 

[The Dark Mind]

Who won this one is debatable because you two are coming from two different sides of the same argument.

I do agree you are race bating with this thread, though.

You say explain the points in red, but did you bother to read the rest of the thread? Language may not have a standard, but there is accepted and unaccepted speech everywhere.

Someone here mentioned "turning it on" when needed and speaking slang when away from the work place. Don't agree completely, but it's better than having someone "axe" me if I want to have "scrimps" at the "restron" "cross da screet" to discuss his employment with my firm.

I agree with this.

Amen.

 

[Lunagato]

My parents were both teachers and in our home standard English was spoken. My parents had no tolerance for slang and ghettoisms. I was repeatedly accused of "talking white" by my peers. My standard response was and still is 'No, I am speaking correct English". I didn't hear what they were hearing. Later on in life, even white people on the phone assumed that they were talking to a why person, something I corrected immediately. What was happening was that I did not have a sterotypical "BlacK' accent to people assumed that I was white. That would offend me.

One day a white gentleman on the phone cleared things up for me. As we spoke, he said "May I ask you a personal question?"
I said, "okay" and he asked me if I was Black. I said that I was but I was often mistaken for white over the phone. He said he understood that but he could definitely detect a gentile southern Black accent which is pleasing to the ear. I asked him if he was a linguist and he said no, he was a reading teacher and many of his students were older Blacks that had to drop out to take care of their families when they were children and were now taking reading as adults. He said many of his older Black students had the same pleasant voice. He said LOTS of Blacks have a TRADITION of using proper grammar and diction even though they could not read. The assumption that I was white was based on inaccurate stereotypes but, it no different from them assuming I am good at baskeball because I am Black. He told me that I did not have a White accent, but it was the ABSENCE of a more well known Black accent that caused the wrong assumption. When I am accused of sounding white, I am no longer offended, It is going to keep happening and all I can do is educate them one person at a time.

 

[Dwayne Wayne]

See??? I win. You lose.

How you going to win an argument using info you didn't find? You keep quoting the link I posted. Man please, If anyone won it was me. you take, take, take and never give back....

 

[The Dark Mind]

How you going to win an argument using info you didn't find? You keep quoting the link I posted. Man please, If anyone won it was me. you take, take, take and never give back....

I'm sorry.

You're right though... I should've given you props.

Much props to you for posting the article.

Thanks.

 

[water]

For all of you who mis-understood what this thread is about.



Get off your emotions and personal experiences and see what I am saying.

Most of the time I speak proper English.

I have never been accused of speaking white.

Why???

My enunciation remains the same.

I am saying that some black people feel that by changing their enunciation of words to mimic white people, they are speaking properly.

I am saying that is not the case because the majority of white people also do not speak properly.


They equate white=right and that is not always the case.


When we go down that road this is what happens..........

Biden had comments about Barack Hussein Obama. “I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy,” he said. “I mean, that’s a storybook, man.”





An opinion:

"Interesting that...Jan 31st, 2007 - 19:16:42

People so often feel the need to use words like 'articulate' when discussing prominent African American figures whom they have an affinity for. It's clearly a back-handed compliment because the implication is that being articulate and clean distinguishes that person from other African Americans - or at least it does in the handicapped worldview of the racially prejudiced.

Some might say i'm exhibiting paranoia or 'pulling the race card', but take a careful accounting of how often you see white Americans both in the media and in their everyday conversation cite 'articulate' as their first impression of a public figure who happens to be black- it's as if they are shocked whenever they meet an articulate black person... of course they could only be shocked if their expectation was that the person would be inarticulate, sad since there's not really an reason to base such a presumption on skin color.

In this case the inclusion of 'clean' betrays the presence of an even more disturbing prejudice. Apparently Senator Biden feels that cleanliness is a trait which Senator Obama possesses apart from the rest of the black (unwashed) masses."





I hope people don't fall for distractions like DarkMind..........and understand my position.



Ask yourself this question also:

Why is it that whites adopt word play created by blacks a couple of years later and then it is not a problem.

Just today at the office I heard a white guy saying "jive" (a couple of years behind as usual). If a black guy says the same thing he is speaking "EBONICS"?????

So where is the "IVONICS"???

 

[Built4Life]

I do stay read up, and yes languages are living. I've had to explain this to kayanation before. And yes they change over time. But that's the key point. They change OVER TIME, not in an instant at the whim of any speaker.


False oral language has rules too. And those rules generally follow the written ones. They are just not as enforceable as the written ones.


Yes you are right. When speaking, generally rules are such as run-ons and fragments are not enforced. Nor should it be. People are just speaking freely amongst themselves; humans being humans, if you will. But there are still rules... even when speaking. You're still expected to pause in between sentences, and to construct sentences speak in a way that people can understand you.

Anyone who says that there aren't rules to speech has not been in a college level speech class and had instructors rip students apart for not putting sentences together correctly or broken delivery. They are just as bad as the English professors. Speech professors will tell you it is not good enough to write a good term paper and then stand up and give a presentation with broken delivery and ebonics. The paper will get an A and the speech will get an F. It's not pretty.



Agreed. Amen to that.


Not really. How you speak doesn't have so much to do with the political. It has more to do with a combination of personal preference and environment.

I don't want to get into it with anyone because I beleie Black people should know how to speak standard English and be able to code switch just for the sake of doing so as a survival technique.

Oral language does have rules, but they vastly differ from the written language. I don't want to get into it, but you never write as you speak. The spoken language is full of inconsistencies and it varies from region to region or community to community.

I would go into this, but I am a little tired.