trial thread: G6 celtics v. fakers

[cranrab]

look what Tobe fans are saying when trying to excuse Kobe's melt down in 2004 playoffs finals..

Unbelievable

unfortunately, it's plenty believable.

look at the rising number of suspect stans who admit to following me around BGOL "for years", reading my SPORTS posts, and then never have anything to say about SPORTS.

batty boy madness on BGOL. they out themselves every time, delusional tendercrisp cakeboys wanting to defend their boyfriend.

 

[cranrab]

the body language of a leader and true competitor:

 

[shaddyvillethug]

Lebron Put 45

 

[cranrab]

who got double teamed more, pau gasol or tobe?

answer honestly.

alright, i see they didn't want any of this, so i'll make it easy.

pau gasol got doubled 4 times in Q1 and 1 time in Q2.

tobe got doubled 3 times in Q1 and 1 time in Q2.

neither player got doubled AT ALL in Q3 or Q4.

pau gasol doubled 5 times TOTAL.

tobe doubled 4 times TOTAL.

but ignorant bitch-made stans are gonna run around talking about "the celtics D double teamed tobe and forced him to shoot outside".

bet.

 

[cranrab]

i threw the fearful tobe stans a meatball with that first easy question on double teams.

i'm gonna serve up a softball now and see if any of them want to step up to the plate.

how many of the celtics G6 points were scored ON or AGAINST tobe, and/or as a direct result of tobe's poor plays?

be honest.

 

[Spectrum]

where's POOKIE?

 

[pookie]

Well well a thread with nothing but Celtics fans and Kobe haters in it, from reading thru this thread Kobe was the only Laker playing, the one sided posts in here are.................

 

[Spectrum]

Well well a thread with nothing but Celtics fans and Kobe haters in it, from reading thru this thread Kobe was the only Laker playing, the one sided posts in here are.................

Here's a thread for you since you love stats so much:

http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=276352

 

[pookie]

Here's a thread for you since you love stats so much:

http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=276352

Thats something that hater Cranrab would love if he's not the one that gave you the info. I'm still laughing at this one-sided game analysis thread

 

[Spectrum]

Thats something that hater Cranrab would love if he's not the one that gave you the info. I'm still laughing at this one-sided game analysis thread

I was being sarcastic. Watching live, looking at stats, etc won't help a personally who lacks the faculty of deductive reasoning.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

..anybody hungry? I brought muffins:

Interesting note: While crusing the sports websites, I stopped by the Minnesota newspapers just to see what was up. Right now Kevin McHale and Glen Taylor are getting crucified in the Minnesota media.

Also, Early fallout has Lamar Odom being the scapegoat, and rumblings are they want to replace him with Ron Artest. The media doesn't understand that you have to play team defense, and Artest (a good defender) does not help them improve in that area.

 

[pookie]

Also, Early fallout has Lamar Odom being the scapegoat, and rumblings are they want to replace him with Ron Artest. The media doesn't understand that you have to play team defense, and Artest (a good defender) does not help them improve in that area.

So that means Phil needs to find an assistant coach that specializes in defense then because the shit the Lakers called defense in the Finals made no sense. On ESPN they were saying some true things about Pierce and Allen previously not being seen as defense players but under Rivers system started playing it with pride, Phil needs to start viewing some tapes

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

So that means Phil needs to find an assistant coach that specializes in defense then because the shit the Lakers called defense in the Finals made no sense. On ESPN they were saying some true things about Pierce and Allen previously not being seen as defense players but under Rivers system started playing it with pride, Phil needs to start viewing some tapes

I hate to say it, but this is where a player like Shaq would have helped them. They needed a defensive presence that erased the Lakers mistakes on defense.

Even a Camby or a Ben Wallace (at this stage in is career) would have helped. With the team they have now, you can forget about having another perimeter defender. Someone has to go.

 

[pookie]

I hate to say it, but this is where a player like Shaq would have helped them. They needed a defensive presence that erased the Lakers mistakes on defense.

Even a Camby or a Ben Wallace (at this stage in is career) would have helped. With the team they have now, you can forget about having another perimeter defender. Someone has to go.

After watching Game 2 i was thinking they needed a player like Kurt Thomas, a bully or something inside. Anytime you got a under 6'3 ROOKIE coming inside trying to DUNK then you know something is wrong with your defense. If they can sign some free agents Vusijiac and/or Radmonovic are gone but if they have to do a trade its gonna be Odom

 

[cranrab]

Thats something that hater Cranrab would love if he's not the one that gave you the info.

tobe stan AND conspiracy theorist. good look.

I'm still laughing at this one-sided game analysis thread

it's still open. care to comment? or you don't have anything truthful or substantial to add as usual?

care to answer the question about celtics scoring? it's not too late.

 

[cranrab]

Also, Early fallout has Lamar Odom being the scapegoat, and rumblings are they want to replace him with Ron Artest. The media doesn't understand that you have to play team defense, and Artest (a good defender) does not help them improve in that area.

of course lamar odom is gonna be a scapegoat. they were saying those things before G6!

but he put an extra bullseye on his back last night during the post-game interviews. lamar odom came out and said (again) "the ball wasn't moving". we all know what that means.

and ron artest wouldn't necessarily be an improvement. he has poor shot selection (falls in love with the long ball) on O.

 

[cranrab]

So that means Phil needs to find an assistant coach that specializes in defense then because the shit the Lakers called defense in the Finals made no sense

separate yourself from the herd P. you have a chance right now to display some basketball knowledge. all your statement illustrates is that you can regurgitate something you heard broadcast.

so i'm asking you directly: "what EXACTLY about the fakers D made no sense to you?"

or is this just another example of a know-nothing blowhard letting gas escape from his pie hole?

 

[pookie]

separate yourself from the herd P. you have a chance right now to display some basketball knowledge. all your statement illustrates is that you can regurgitate something you heard broadcast.

so i'm asking you directly: "what EXACTLY about the fakers D made no sense to you?"

or is this just another example of a know-nothing blowhard letting gas escape from his pie hole?

What made no sense is the "lack of defense" being played. Open shots, no help defense, just nothing. Tell me what you thought of their defense

 

[cranrab]

What made no sense is the "lack of defense" being played. Open shots, no help defense, just nothing. Tell me what you thought of their defense

why so vague? are these things you read on the internet? or things you actually observed for yourself? examples?

who was leaving their man and why?

who wasn't helping or was late on help?

who lost their assignment by watching the ball, when the fundamental rule is "ball and man"?

who got lost on cross matches in transition?

rebounding is a part of D. was someone leaking out looking for cherry picks instead of staying at home to secure rebounds?

come on, P. i smell bullshit.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

of course lamar odom is gonna be a scapegoat. they were saying those things before G6!

but he put an extra bullseye on his back last night during the post-game interviews. lamar odom came out and said (again) "the ball wasn't moving". we all know what that means.

and ron artest wouldn't necessarily be an improvement. he has poor shot selection (falls in love with the long ball) on O.

From the L.A. Times:

Odom, Gasol finish meekly

By Mike Bresnahan, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer
June 18, 2008

BOSTON -- Just as quickly as they arrived, the Lakers' big men disappeared in the NBA Finals.

After a Game 5 effort that helped push the series back to Boston, Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom faded in Game 6.

In a decisive first half, Odom missed all four of his shots and would have been scoreless if not for making four free throws. Gasol was also unproductive as the Celtics took a 58-35 halftime lead, scoring six points and committing four turnovers.

Gasol and Odom were also the main reason the Celtics outrebounded the Lakers, 48-29. The Lakers did not have an offensive rebound in the first half. The Celtics finished with four blocked shots, the Lakers none.

Odom finished with 14 points, nine in a meaningless fourth quarter. Gasol had 11 points.

Afterward, when the Celtics had finished with a 48-29 rebounding advantage, Coach Phil Jackson said the Lakers needed to get more aggressive during the off-season.

"They overran us," Jackson said of the Celtics. "[Kevin] Garnett knocked Pau down in the lane and scored an easy basket in the first four or five possessions and set kind of a tone that they were going to establish an aggressive form, and we never met that energy all night. So we have to get some players if we're going to come back and repeat, to have that kind of aggressiveness that we need."

Gasol and Odom combined for 39 points, 24 rebounds, 14-for-20 shooting and six blocked shots in the Lakers' Game 5 victory.

In Game 6, they combined for 25 points, 18 rebounds, six-for-15 shooting and eight turnovers.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

Lakers have no one to blame but themselves

Even with Coach Phil Jackson and MVP Kobe Bryant, the team that was favored going into the Finals lets itself get steamrolled by Celtics. The difference between the champs and chumps is striking.
June 18, 2008

BOSTON -- If Phil Jackson is supposed to be the best coach in the NBA, then how come he didn't send Vladimir Radmanovic off to another continent to do some snowboarding this last week?

Some strategist.

It's over, all right, the Celtics champs with an exclamation point -- Jackson outcoached, the Lakers outplayed, and as a group, your God-like heroes blew it.

They are an embarrassment. They went into the NBA Finals favored, the Celtics suffering injuries to several of their starters along the way, and still the Lakers could not measure up.

The Lakers had a 24-point lead at home, the best coach and player on their side, and they gagged.

Their greatest claim in the NBA Finals is the fact the Celtics didn't clinch the title in Staples Center, the Lakers' closing mantra: "Not in our house," and how pitiful is that?

They should have been going to Boston in Games 6 and 7 with the chance to win one game and win it all, but instead they only proved they aren't anywhere as good as the Celtics and certainly nowhere near as tough.

Those with purple blinders on, of course, will say, "good for the Lakers, it was a fine year and they overachieved."

Balderdash. If you want to go back to July, OK, but this is a team that had the good fortune to add Derek Fisher to its roster and later the highway robbery that is Pau Gasol.

They lost Andrew Bynum, and maybe there are better days ahead if Gasol and Lamar Odom ever track down the Wizard of Oz and acquire some courage and heart.

But even without Bynum, the Lakers still had their big three, including the MVP, and most everyone saying they were the team to beat. And then they whipped themselves.

They were one of two teams left standing with the chance to win it all, Jackson in position to pass Red Auerbach, and Kobe Bryant in position to have his preseason tantrum answered, and they blew a 24-point lead.

How can anyone be the very best, and explain that blunder?

The Celtics played this series like every possession meant something -- even when down by 24, Kevin Garnett as intense as Bryant, Paul Pierce just as good and Doc Rivers schooling the Zen Master.

The Lakers underachieved when it counted the most, Odom, Fisher and Radmanovic going belly up in the first half of Game 6, a contest the Lakers had to win.

They even had the referees on their side at the start, five years from now maybe everyone learning the league really wanted a Game 7, but even that wasn't enough to help these quitters.

They got steamrolled, everyone across America sitting in front of their TVs hoping for drama, and the Lakers acting as if they can't wait to go home, trailing by 26 with nine minutes left in the third quarter.

The difference between the champs and chumps was striking, the Celtics up by 27 points with a pair of ex-Clippers playing for them, and then by 38 in the fourth -- until Odom exploded for a free throw.

Make all the excuses you want, and Lakers fans will, but the Lakers lacked the competitive drive the Celtics exhibited from start to finish in this series.

Some athletes live for opportunities like this, but several key performers in purple wilted when the going got tough.

And Lakers fans, while often too busy genuflecting, should have seen it coming. The Lakers spent too much time whining about the referees this season -- Gasol, Fisher, Odom and Bryant always mad at someone besides themselves.

Blow the whistle on Fisher, and maybe he deserves every good guy award off the court, but every time, he walks over to the ref to bellyache. Blow the whistle on Gasol, and he looks as if someone just swiped his lunch money.

Blow it on Odom, and it takes him right out of his game. Blow it on Bryant, and until the Finals, he was the picture of calm and poise, and then what happened?

The Celtics never played distracted, but the same cannot be said about the Lakers, too often taking the lead from their coach, who also spent time before the media delivering messages to the officials.

By way of startling contrast, Rivers never offered an excuse, his team responding in the same way -- even when some of their better performers were taken to the locker room for repairs.

This is more about the makeup of champions than one colossal collapse in a 39-point loss.

Disagree, if you like, but much of it is Bryant's fault, his teammates and even his coach never quite knowing which Bryant they are going to get from quarter to quarter -- sometimes the facilitator, sometimes the scorer.

He can talk all he wants about being a leader and working better with his teammates, but he still lives in his own world, and hot as he was to start Game 6, the others didn't bother coming along for the ride.

The Lakers have their role players, but Bryant's role always remains fluid, the uncertainty apparently too much for Odom & Co. at times.

And where do the Lakers go if it comes down to counting on Odom? All that talent, and how often has that been said, and going into the fourth quarter of the year's biggest game, he still didn't have a basket.

Two teams go for the title, and one of them has to lose, but that doesn't mean getting pulverized and exposed as big softies -- the Lakers laying down like whipped dogs.

The first half of this game set the tone, both teams tired from the travel and the Celtics stranded in L.A. with airplane troubles, but letting nothing stop them.

Ray Allen left early with an eye injury, but the Celtics remained gritty. The Lakers' response to opportunity? Only Bryant and Luke Walton scoring baskets in the first quarter, the moment too much for everyone else.

Lakers fans will spend the next few days offering excuses, rebuttals and sharp retorts while trying to ignore the obvious -- their heroes lack the heart and true grit to be champions.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

Lakers leave the series with injured egos
They have a lot of work to do in the summer to get over their loss to the Celtics in the NBA Finals.
By Rick Fox
June 18, 2008

Their hopes of an NBA championship lost in a sea of Celtic green, the Lakers return home adrift, questions to answer, moves to ponder and a future course to be charted.

* Did this young team overachieve by merely reaching the NBA Finals?Are the wounds inflicted by Boston, punctuated by the 131-92 season-ending defeat in Game 6, too deep to rebound from?

I know the Celtics played with all sorts of injuries, but it is the Lakers who walk away from this series with what could prove to be the more lasting injuries, to their pride, ego and confidence. How they handle that will be found in the team's' El Segundo facility over the next few weeks, gauged by the number of players who show up to take the first important steps on the road back.

* Are the Lakers a soft team, physically and mentally?

If this team is suffering from a character flaw, the weight room isn't going to fix it.

* Can the team's basketball IQ grow?

It regressed as the series progressed. The young Lakers players made mistakes you don't normally see in a college or a regular-season NBA game, much less the Finals. They forgot the three most important facets of the game: Details, details, details.

* Going forward, will Andrew Bynum be capable, following his knee injury, of bringing the fierce presence into the paint that was so embarrassingly missing, especially on Tuesday night?

There was no post presence by Pau Gasol on Tuesday and he was their only hope in the paint. The one player he was able to handle was Glen Davis, the rookie. But Gasol couldn't seem to do equally well against anybody else.

* Who is going to play defense on this team?

That's what wins championships. True, 48-minute defense, not for just one or two plays a game.

But this series wasn't just about the Lakers' weaknesses. It was about the Celtics' strength as well.

After all the years he struggled in Minnesota, Kevin Garnett has finally settled any doubts about his ability to deliver in big games.

Paul Pierce may have been the MVP, but, to me, the Boston bench was really the most valuable part of their team. Whenever anybody went out, someone else seemed to come in and maintain the momentum. Those reserves played way above what was expected of them. Boston did just fine with Pierce and any other four guys, Garnett and any other four guys, Ray Allen and any other four guys.

The Celtics had an answer for every situation. For the Lakers, there are only questions.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

Celtics have kept lid on Lakers' Kobe Bryant
It's unusual for a Phil Jackson-coached team to have its star's scoring limited, but Boston has kept Kobe Bryant under control for the most part. Yet the NBA Finals continue to go in unexpected directions.
June 17, 2008

BOSTON -- Somewhere between making history and becoming history -- with the Lakers still a lot closer to the latter -- they're back to answer the question:

Was this trip necessary?

Of course, the Celtics were coming home anyway and if the Lakers are a longshot to win two games here -- or even to force a second game here -- it's the only shot they've got.

Also, nothing in the NBA Finals has gone the way anyone thought it would yet.

With the Celtics wiping out a 24-point deficit in Game 4 and erasing 19- and 14-point deficits in Game 5, the NBA came that close to seeing its Nirvana Matchup end that fast.

Going into Game 5, TV ratings were up significantly -- since the obligatory comparison was last spring's record-low 6.2 for San Antonio and Cleveland, now known as the Dark Ages.

Unfortunately for the NBA, the Lakers and Celtics were on pace for only the No. 6 rating in the 10 years since the end of the glory days with Michael Jordan's Bulls.

Like the Lakers, the TV numbers rallied in Sunday night's nail-biter, which drew a 12.1 overnight rating.

If that still wasn't spectacular, it blew away the 8.5 overnight rating for the U.S. Open the same day.

The NBA's overall number even beat the 11.4 overnight the Open got in prime time in the East and Midwest for the last two hours of its riveting finish with Tiger Woods rolling in that birdie putt on the last hole to force a playoff.

(Not that NBA people resent Woods, but with the Open on TV in the press room before Game 5, a young league aide walked up, changed the channel and when asked to change it back, announced, "It's a slow game, you can catch up.")

In a fortunate development for the NBA, which needed one, it also got a Game 6 telecast.

Beyond that, it's in the hands of the Lakers and Celtics. If the Lakers started the Finals confident, or cocksure, they should be over that because nothing has worked the way they thought it would.

Coach Phil Jackson has always been able to take something away from opponents -- as he is now with Kobe Bryant dropping off Rajon Rondo to jam up the Celtics' offense.

Rarely has an opponent ever taken away Jackson's star -- as the Celtics are doing with Bryant.

Without double-teaming, the Celtics now bring so much help into Bryant's area, he rarely sees daylight to the basket.

Bryant joked about missing "bunnies" in Game 1 but got only one shot inside 10 feet in that one, and the selection hasn't improved since.

Bryant has been stuck on the perimeter . . . unless he forces the issue, trying to get inside . . . and winds up holding the ball as the offense grinds to a halt and his teammates die on the vine.

In Game 4, he took four shots in the first half, missing all, as his teammates exploded for 58 points, then tried to take over but couldn't.

With fallen spirits to rally after their Game 4 nightmare, Bryant came out firing in Game 5, scoring 15 points in the first quarter but only 10 after that, shooting three for 13 the rest of the way.


"They're going to throw the whole kitchen sink at me," said Bryant after Game 5.

"Could I force myself to get 40? Yeah. But is that better for our ballclub? No. We've got guys open, I'm going to move the ball and do what I need to do.

"I think it was important tonight, though, for me to get off to a quick start just so my team could feed off that energy. Once I did that, it was important for me to step back and bring the other guys along as opposed to staying hot or continuing to go with it. That's what's been successful for us."

It worked for one night, anyway.

At the other end, the Celtics' first team can't even run an offense with Bryant roaming off Rondo.

Not that the Celtics necessarily have to run an offense. Sunday night, Paul Pierce almost put the Lakers away by himself, going for 38 points and eight assists.

As Jackson put it in the understated style he uses after an opponent puts everyone he sends at him to the torch, "We have to do a better job."

To save time after putting Bryant, Vladamir Radmanovic, Sasha Vujacic, Luke Walton and Trevor Ariza on Pierce, Jackson could have asked, "Is there anyone who hasn't tried guarding him yet?"

So for the Lakers to do this, they have to slow Pierce down, Rondo and Kevin Garnett have to keep struggling as Gasol and Lamar Odom come up big again?

Anything is possible or at least has been to this point.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

Lakers are buried in the Garden

With L.A. melting down early and suffering one of the worst losses in NBA Finals history, 131-92, the Celtics complete a stifling defensive series to claim their 17th championship.
By Mike Bresnahan, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer
June 18, 2008
BOSTON -- Beaten L.A.

The Lakers came to their final resting place in the frenzied home of their most hated historical rival, drifting far from victory in a 131-92 Game 6 loss to the Boston Celtics that was every bit as uneven as the score indicated.

Looking nothing like the team that ripped through the Western Conference, the Lakers were yanked apart at the seams by a Boston team that pushed them from one end to the other in one of the most decisive games in NBA Finals history.

The Celtics won the series, 4-2, and took their 17th NBA championship, three more than the Lakers, in front of a jubilant crowd Tuesday at TD Banknorth Garden. The most one-sided game in Finals history remained a 42-point victory by Chicago over Utah (96-54) in 1998.

Game 4 will be the one that bothers the Lakers over the next 3 1/2 months, a lost 24-point lead all that needs to be said, but Tuesday night will also sting, the Celtics leading by as many as 43 in the final minutes.

There were too many culprits to name for the Lakers, from the recurring frontcourt issues to Kobe Bryant's continual shooting woes to another night of lethargy from the reserves. There will be plenty of time to ponder it all on the Lakers' six-hour flight back home this morning.

Bryant spoke in short, clipped sentences after the game, frustration evident in his words and posture.

"Just upset more than anything," he said. "But I'm proud of the way that we performed all year. I'm proud of my guys. At the same time, understand that second place just means you're the first loser."

Paul Pierce was the Finals most valuable player, hitting the Lakers hard on numerous fronts throughout the series -- points, assists, free throws. He had 17 points, 10 assists and made seven of eight free throws in Game 6. He began dancing on the Celtics' bench during a timeout in the final minutes, much to the crowd's delight.

Pierce outplayed the regular-season MVP, Bryant, who again shot poorly in Game 6 -- 22 points on seven-for-22 shooting; he made only three of his last 17 shots. For the series, he averaged 25.7 points and shot only 40.5%.

As if on cue, the Garden crowd derisively chanted "Where is Kobe?" while the Celtics hovered near a 30-point lead early in the fourth quarter. At the time, Bryant was sitting on the bench with three other starters.

"Kobe started off that game with a hot hand and then I think his legs, you could see his shot was flat, he didn't get his shot going, and it really changed the course of the game," Lakers Coach Phil Jackson said.

Lamar Odom and Pau Gasol were also flat, again, their Game 5 outburst proving to be no more than a hiccup. Odom didn't make a shot until the 7:54 mark of the fourth quarter, finishing with 14 points after a late individual push. Gasol had 11 points.

How bad was it? The "Hey, Hey, Hey, Goodbye" chant began with five minutes left. Then came a "Seventeen" chant a few minutes later. Then it became official, Commissioner David Stern handing over the championship trophy to the Celtics in a blizzard of green-and-white confetti.

The Lakers trailed, 32-29, with seven minutes left in the second quarter but never stood a chance from there. The Celtics' scoring in the final three quarters: 34-31-42.

"I think if we're going to learn one thing from this series, we can't expect to win a championship by focusing on the offensive end," Bryant said. "We have to be able to hold people down as well."

Bryant was then asked how much Andrew Bynum would have helped in this series.

"Rebounding and a shot-blocker in the middle. He solves a couple of those," Bryant said.

The Game 6 stats were ugly across the board for the Lakers. The Celtics had 48 rebounds, the Lakers 29. The Celtics had 14 offensive rebounds, the Lakers a meager two. The Celtics had 33 assists, the Lakers 16. The Celtics had seven turnovers, the Lakers 19. And on and on.

And with that, the Lakers' attempt to become the only team to win the Finals after trailing, 3-1, ended after only one victory.

Jackson tried to be positive afterward, recapping a season that included the Western Conference championship and Bryant's first MVP trophy.

"We suffered injuries and survived a season and rebuilt our team and came back and had a great playoff run until the Celtics were able to extinguish that hope," Jackson said. "But we'll look back on this favorably. We were surprised we were here, and we're glad that we had an opportunity, but whenever you get this opportunity, you don't want to let it slip away, and we did."

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

Going back in time to bad old days

June 18, 2008
BOSTON -- Maybe the Lakers should have quit this rivalry while they were ahead.

After a 21-year break to enjoy their 1987 Finals victory that followed their 1985 breakthrough -- after having lost the first eight -- the Lakers saw the Celtics turn the hands of time all the way back to the '60s when Boston ruled everyone, especially them.

In those days, Bill Russell dominated them. In this Finals, it was no single Celtic but a suffocating team defense, although the effect was the same.

By Game 6, the flashy, high-scoring and favored Lakers who had started the series were no more.

All that was left was a confused, overmatched, soft little band of Lakers, circling the perimeter of the Boston defense like ants who couldn't get out of the rain as 21 years of frustration fell on their heads in the Celtics' 131-92 rout.

Alert! Alert! Alert!

For fans who aren't old enough to remember the era when the Lakers' hearts were always being questioned, you're about to get a refresher course.

Of course, it's not every Finals loser that can look forward to adding a 21-year-old seven-foot center but the Lakers will if Andrew Bynum returns.

Looking no more fazed than usual, Lakers Coach Phil Jackson was asked afterward if he was surprised by the final score.

"I don't know what the final score was," he said. "Let me look it up for you."

He glanced down at a box score.

"Yes," said Jackson.

Hard as it may be to believe, the Lakers started this series as the favorite after going 12-3 in the first three rounds while the Celtics went seven games with Atlanta, seven more with Cleveland and six with Detroit.

By then the Celtics looked out on their feet, only to arise, looking refreshed in this series.

Nevertheless, Boston Coach Doc Rivers worried about their endurance right to the end, making no secret of his concern about the fast turnaround as the teams changed coasts between Games 5 and 6.

Of course, if Red Auerbach still watches over the Celtics, as Jackson joked when Minnesota General Manager Kevin McHale traded Kevin Garnett to his old team, an unseen force seemed to guide the Lakers, at least where their opponents' mode of transportation was involved.

After the Denver Nuggets' bus caught fire on the way to Game 1 in the first round and the San Antonio Spurs spent the night on their plane trying to fly to Los Angeles for the Western Conference finals, the Celtics had to sit around for three hours Monday, waiting for a new plane when theirs had mechanical trouble.

In keeping with the spirit of Lakers-Celtics rivalry, Rivers suggested a Lakers plot.

"Why don't you call Mitch Kupchak and Phil," said Rivers before the game, laughing. "They'll probably tell you exactly what happened.

"It was a long day, it really was. . . .

"We were supposed to leave at 11 a.m. and they called us at nine and told us we had to run to the bus because the first plane had broken down.

"So we were going to get on the other one that was leaving. And when we get there at the gate, we see the Laker plane taking off.

"And I was saying, 'Oh, this is nice.' "

If energy was any kind of a problem, it was nothing compared to the Lakers' issues with the Boston defense.

This was a rout from the opening tip, masked by the fact that Kobe Bryant hit three three-pointers in the first quarter, keeping the Lakers within 24-20.

In the real news, they made only five shots in the first quarter, of which just one -- a layup by Luke Walton -- came inside 20 feet.

The pattern continued in the second quarter, Bryant went cold from the outside and after that, it was like driving a bulldozer through an ant colony.

It was 58-35 at halftime, by which time garbage time had already started.

The ending was as humiliating for the Lakers as it could be as the Celtics poured it on, the fans sang, "Na na na na na na na, hey, hey goodbye," and Paul Pierce emptied the Gatorade barrel over Rivers.

The only thing missing was the cigar smoke but the Lakers should be able to remember this one without it.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

Garnett finally earns first NBA title
By Christopher L. Gasper
Globe Staff / June 18, 2008

With 4:01 left and all but the trophy presentation awaiting, Kevin Garnett embraced Paul Pierce and Doc Rivers on the Boston sideline, but the adrenaline was still flowing, so Garnett knocked his coach upside the head for good measure.

Maybe Garnett mistook Rivers for the Bully. The Bully was the personification of Garnett's titleless career until he won his first NBA championship last night in his first year in a Boston uniform. Rivers is still standing, but the Bully is down for the count. Never again can they say, "Yeah, but he's never won a title" about Kevin Garnett.

"I knocked that Bully's [butt] out. That was what it felt like," said Garnett.

He certainly knocked out the Lakers last night. Garnett finished with a team-high-tying 26 points to go with 14 rebounds, 4 assists, and 3 steals.

After comparing his play to refuse in Game 5, Garnett, just one win from an NBA championship, refused to be denied powering the Celtics to a 131-92 drubbing of the Lakers in Game 6 of the NBA Finals, the 17th title in franchise history.

"Other than my kid being born this has got to be the happiest day of my life right now," he said. "I plan on sleeping for a week, months. Personal friends, you looking for me, my number is about to change."

This was why Garnett agreed to leave the Land of 10,000 Lakes and 10,000 different teammates to come to Boston - to play in a game and to play a game the way he did last night. For one game when it mattered most, Garnett channeled all of his ferocious energy and all of his prodigious talent and finally delivered on the promise he showed the moment he stepped on an NBA court in 1995 straight out of Farragut Academy in Chicago.

Celtics legend Bill Russell wouldn't have to give KG one of his championship rings, as he had promised. Garnett had earned his own.

"He deserves it. I'm so happy for KG," said teammate James Posey, who embraced Garnett in the locker room and told him the same thing. "Even in Minnesota, when things weren't going right, he didn't cry like most superstars and say he wanted out. He stuck there and you knew what you'd get out of him every night and he gave it his all."

Garnett, who was 10 of 18 from the field, has scored more points, grabbed more rebounds, and passed out more assists, but he's never played better offensive basketball in a big game than he did in the first half. He had 10 points on 5-of-7 shooting in the first period to set the tone and he had 17 points on 8-of-12 shooting at the half.

He hit face-up jumpers, baseline jumpers, turnaround jumpers, and even added a nifty shoulder-shimmy, Hakeem Olajuwon Dream Shake during the decisive 15-2 run Boston used to close out the half and put the game out of reach.

You knew it was Garnett's night when he took a slip pass from Pierce, got hammered by Lamar Odom as he hung in the air, and then somehow one-handed the ball off the backboard for a 3-point play that gave Boston a 56-35 lead with 47.3 seconds left in the first half.

When Garnett fed Kendrick Perkins for a reverse layup on Boston's final possession of the half, the Celtics went to the locker room with a 58-35 lead and one hand already wrapped around the Larry O'Brien NBA Championship Trophy.

After tying up Paul Gasol with 5:09 left in the third quarter, KG raised his right fist and then beat his chest. He could smell the title.

As he was on the sideline embracing Pierce and Ray Allen, the three shared a moment - just as they had at a press conference after Garnett was traded to Boston from Minnesota, altering the fortunes of the franchise.

"We said, 'This is the reason we came here.' From that moment on the podium, to talking in the back, to the trip to Rome. This was the reason."

Garnett had one simple request: Don't call him, Pierce, and Allen the Big Three.

"No, we're Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and Kevin Garnett."

With the Bully gone, that's finally good enough.

 

[Spectrum]

^^^ thanks for dropping these RF

 

[cranrab]

i read a post by one of the stans (who used to have "8" on either side of his screenname, but deleted it after tobe switched to "24") on BGOL. he claimed that the celtics D threw everything at tobe. clearly he didn't watch the game, because as i already pointed out, tobe only got double teamed 4 times the ENTIRE game. and FEWER times than pau gasol.

 

[cranrab]

why so vague? are these things you read on the internet? or things you actually observed for yourself? examples?

who was leaving their man and why?

who wasn't helping or was late on help?

who lost their assignment by watching the ball, when the fundamental rule is "ball and man"?

who got lost on cross matches in transition?

rebounding is a part of D. was someone leaking out looking for cherry picks instead of staying at home to secure rebounds?

come on, P. i smell bullshit.

i'm a little disappointed, P.

you had a shot to demonstrate some basketball knowledge. but you ran away with your tail between your legs, like the fakers in a playoffs close-out game.

so i'll help you out, and break it down by quarters.

Q1: tobe, due to lazy and poor fundamental D, was personally responsible for 10 celtics points. 12 if you count his mis-play of a back screen for paul pierce. so 10 or 12 points of the celtics' 24 points in Q1.

Q2: tobe, due to low basketball IQ, was personally responsible for 12 celtics points. 15 if you count his late rotation to eddie house. so 12 or 15 points of the celtics' 34 points in Q2.

Q3: tobe, due to lack of effort, no heart, work ethic, integrity or responsibility to his teammates, was personally responsible for 13 of the celtics points. so 13 of the celtics' 31 points in Q3.

Q4: tobe, due to being a quitter, was personally responsible for 5 celtics points.

so if you're a glass half-full guy, tobe only gave up 40 points in G6.

if you're a glass half-empty guy, tobe gave up 45 points.

through 3 quarters, tobe's play accounted for 39% of the celtics' scoring. (that's using the conservative amount. the other is 45% )

so how did the celtics coaching staff exploit tobe? it was a thing of beauty. tobe's tremendously LOW basketball IQ doesn't allow him to process cross matches. the celtics saw this and used not 1, not 2, but 3 different cross matches during G6. those cross matches, and tobe's inability to comprehend how he was being toyed with, resulted in an entire game of mismatches and team confusion BECAUSE TOBE COULD NOT STAY WITH HIS ASSIGNMENT.

 

[Rollie_Fingaz]

Lakers come up short, leaving questions about long-term success
By J.A. Adande
ESPN.com

Updated: June 18, 2008

BOSTON -- The stunning thing about these NBA Finals is what the Lakers didn't produce.

No memorable performance from Kobe Bryant.

No critical adjustments from Phil Jackson.

No candidate for the Tyronn Lue Award for best unexpected performance that lands a lucrative new contract.

And, in the end, no resistance as the Celtics closed in on their 17th championship.

Their submissive 131-92 defeat didn't just bring the Finals to its conclusion. It made you wonder if this Laker season was a mirage instead of the dawn of a new dynasty.

Over the course of the series, the Lakers showed an alarming lack of toughness, defensive backbone and offensive creativity. As a result they suffered the worst Finals blown lead on record in Game 4 and the worst ending loss in Finals history in Game 6.

Privately, some folks at the upper levels in Lakerland believe these Finals were a bonus and only a prelude to when they get really dangerous when Andrew Bynum comes back from his knee injury. Jackson gave a glimpse into that mind-set when he said, "We were surprised we were here, and we're glad that we had an opportunity."

The danger in that thought process is the Celtics beat the Lakers twice in the regular season with Bynum. And the supposed savior has played only about 40 to 50 really good NBA games in his career. And we've yet to see how he does in June, when the games matter most. And, oh yeah, he's coming off a knee injury.

Bryant said Bynum could solve a couple of the Laker issues: rebounding and shot-blocking. But could he single-handedly make up for the Lakers' 48-29 deficit on the boards in Game 6, in which they didn't get a single offensive rebound in the first three quarters?

Stats like that -- and a 65-49 offensive rebounding advantage for Boston in the series -- indicate that the problems go deeper.

Lamar Odom said the Lakers need to: "Get better this summer individually, come back as a better team, get stronger, get nastier and get ready for next year."

Odom kept talking about the team's needs for the future, but it's possible the long-term might not even include him. He has the shortest contract term of their key, high-salary players, with one more year left on his deal. A strong role in a championship run might have solidified his status, but instead he averaged an inconsistent 13.5 points and nine rebounds in a losing effort.

He was one of the people lacking aggression, especially when it came to attacking the basket. Game 6 was another example, when the Lakers would rack up quick fouls on the Celtics early in quarters, only to allow long stretches to pass before they shot bonus free throws.

So can people actually get nastier?

"It's just a mindset," Odom said. "It's called disposition. Carry yourself a certain way throughout the game, throughout the whole 48 minutes. I think they did a better job at that."

It's usually easier to import toughness than instill it. Every oven needs a pilot light, which is what Kevin Garnett gave to the Celtics. The Lakers didn't have anyone to give them that spark. For a while Ronny Turiaf was their wild energy guy, but he was strangely subdued over the past month and saw his minutes dwindle.

The Lakers would like to bring in Sacramento's Ron Artest, who attended a few Lakers games at Staples Center in these playoffs and was in the TD Banknorth Garden on Tuesday. He was wearing a "Property of Kings" t-shirt, and he'll remain that way unless he opts out of his contract this summer. He said he doesn't plan to do so.

"If you're in a foxhole with somebody, you don't want to jump out of the foxhole because of some gold," Artest said.

A foxhole mentality is exactly what the Lakers need.

Bryant couldn't provide that -- or enough points either -- in this series. He averaged 25.7 points per game on 40.5 percent shooting. The Celtics' defense didn't yield many looks at the basket, and in those times he did heat up, Bryant couldn't maintain his early high-scoring pace. In Game 6 it was 11 points in the first six and a half minutes, then only 11 more the rest of the way, missing 14 of his final 17 shots. In the second quarter, when James Posey had the lead defensive assignment on him, he scored only on three technical free throws.

This was one of those rare times Bryant dropped the façade after a loss and didn't try to mask how deeply it hurt him. Normally he tries to cool his way through the postgame interviews, say that it's simply a process of getting the team's rhythm and flow back and they'll be fine.

Not Tuesday. For once you could see the pain on his face and hear it in his voice.

"Just upset more than anything, frustrated," he said.

He added that he was proud of the Lakers' effort and what they accomplished this season, but they'd have to realize this isn't good enough.

It was a big difference from the way he went out last year, when he was seething after losing Game 5 in Phoenix, angry that he'd had to go to battle with this group, upset that his input hadn't been solicited or heeded, frustrated that another one of his prime years had gone by the wayside, anxious that it wouldn't get better fast.

Bryant looked a little trapped. Losing always hurts, but this time he can't unleash and demand a trade the way he did last summer. Not after he got a bunch of hard-working teammates who came back better, then an All-Star big man at a Euros-for-dollars exchange rate.

There would have been something karmically wrong about a guy being rewarded with a championship a year after he trashed his teammates and the organization. Bryant needs to be quiet this summer, and maybe even work out harder. He's known as a fitness fanatic, but he faded in the latter stages of the last two games, his jumpers coming up shorter and shorter.

The question is whether this game will be a tombstone or a turning point for the Lakers. It evoked memories of the 148-114 loss to the Celtics at the start of the 1985 NBA Finals. That wound up launching the Lakers into the run that cemented their team-of-the-'80s status. Pat Riley came up with the keynote speech of his Lakers career, channeling the parting words from his father to inspire his team. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar uncorked the greatest series in the twilight of his career, and Magic Johnson redeemed himself for his choke job in 1984. The Lakers won that series, and two of the next three as well.

To paraphrase one of the most famous sports rants in this town's history, Riley, Kareem and Magic aren't walking through that door.

These Lakers couldn't live up to their tradition-laden past. The question now is, can they fulfill the promise of their future?

 

[pookie]

i'm a little disappointed, P.

you had a shot to demonstrate some basketball knowledge. but you ran away with your tail between your legs, like the fakers in a playoffs close-out game.

so i'll help you out, and break it down by quarters.

Q1: tobe, due to lazy and poor fundamental D, was personally responsible for 10 celtics points. 12 if you count his mis-play of a back screen for paul pierce. so 10 or 12 points of the celtics' 24 points in Q1.

Q2: tobe, due to low basketball IQ, was personally responsible for 12 celtics points. 15 if you count his late rotation to eddie house. so 12 or 15 points of the celtics' 34 points in Q2.

Q3: tobe, due to lack of effort, no heart, work ethic, integrity or responsibility to his teammates, was personally responsible for 13 of the celtics points. so 13 of the celtics' 31 points in Q3.

Q4: tobe, due to being a quitter, was personally responsible for 5 celtics points.

so if you're a glass half-full guy, tobe only gave up 40 points in G6.

if you're a glass half-empty guy, tobe gave up 45 points.

through 3 quarters, tobe's play accounted for 39% of the celtics' scoring. (that's using the conservative amount. the other is 45% )

so how did the celtics coaching staff exploit tobe? it was a thing of beauty. tobe's tremendously LOW basketball IQ doesn't allow him to process cross matches. the celtics saw this and used not 1, not 2, but 3 different cross matches during G6. those cross matches, and tobe's inability to comprehend how he was being toyed with, resulted in an entire game of mismatches and team confusion BECAUSE TOBE COULD NOT STAY WITH HIS ASSIGNMENT.

Man i wish i was here for the game and this thread, the stuff you spouting is pure comedy

 

[cranrab]

Man i wish i was here for the game and this thread, the stuff you spouting is pure comedy

why? it'd just be more duck & dodge routine from you.

all you've shown over the last 3 days is that you don't actually watch games, you duck chances to dicuss games in near real time (something you pretended to want), and even in hindsight you're not prepared to discuss real basketball.

you throw up the smokescreen about your loathing (fear?) of statistics, but when someone puts PURE BASKETBALL in your lap, you still run away.

P, you are pathetic. you offer excuse after excuse NOT to talk basketball.

 

[pookie]

why? it'd just be more duck & dodge routine from you.

all you've shown over the last 3 days is that you don't actually watch games, you duck chances to dicuss games in near real time (something you pretended to want), and even in hindsight you're not prepared to discuss real basketball.

you throw up the smokescreen about your loathing (fear?) of statistics, but when someone puts PURE BASKETBALL in your lap, you still run away.

P, you are pathetic. you offer excuse after excuse NOT to talk basketball.

You're an pathetic obsessed Kobe hater, tell me you didn't record this game and rewatch it to spout all that info you posted previous to this or are you gonna say like Game 5 you just "watched it differently than other people. Any question you asked was responded to by me but you on the other hand pn two separate occassions decided to play the "dumb role" until i left. Game 5 when me and you were on here at the sametime you wouldn't even respond to me because you knew you'd have to answer questions about players other than Kobe. You know nothing abut basketball outside of stats and you've proven that twice when you decided to play "the dumb role" when you couldn't find a answer to a question i asked. YOur whole game breakdown after and during the game focused solely on Kobe like the other Lakers had picture perfect game and what makes you so laughable is that you will swear up and down that you're not a Kobe hater

 

[cranrab]

You're an pathetic obsessed Kobe hater, tell me you didn't record this game and rewatch it to spout all that info you posted previous to this or are you gonna say like Game 5 you just "watched it differently than other people.

right. so somehow i magically entered all of those posts AFTER the game, but got HNIC to backdate all of them for me. and then i hacked into other screennames so they could magically quote my post dated entries.

you desperate stans are amazing with the shit you come up with.

BTW, i noticed you didn't contest, challenge or refute anything i posted. guess you're learning that unlike fakers fans and tobe stans, i don't make shit up or lie when i come to the table.

Any question you asked was responded to by me but you on the other hand pn two separate occassions decided to play the "dumb role" until i left.

it didn't dawn on me until a couple days later WTF you're talking about right now. you see, unlike you, i don't stalk people on BGOL and the SPORTS board. maybe you don't realize it, but you were posting questions to me in TWO DIFFERENT THREADS. since i'm not a cyber stalking stan, tell me HowTF i'm supposed to know you're posing questions to me in TWO DIFFERENT THREADS at the same time?

Game 5 when me and you were on here at the sametime you wouldn't even respond to me because you knew you'd have to answer questions about players other than Kobe.

see above, dim wit.

You know nothing abut basketball outside of stats and you've proven that twice when you decided to play "the dumb role" when you couldn't find a answer to a question i asked.

quote a question of yours i haven't responded to.

YOur whole game breakdown after and during the game focused solely on Kobe like the other Lakers had picture perfect game

did any other fakers player generate 39% OR MORE of the CELTICS O? can't answer that, can you?

did any other fakers player shooting LESS THAN 50% take MORE shots than lamar odom or pau gasol?

which fakers player got double teamed the most?

you STANS want to divert attention away from the TRUE PRIMARY cause of the fakers collapse because you simply can't handle the truth.

you're like the little kid who grew up eating mcdonalds, who later became an obese adult diagnosed diabetic with high blood pressure. SUPERSIZE ME came along and you can't believe it.

 

[shaddyvillethug]

hey man i can score at will