so just how much better was jordan then kobe?

[jdc12]

SupremeExtremist,

If the NBA had a position like baseball has with the designated hitter.. like a disignated shooter... I think Kobe would play until he was 50. Where Jordan was an efficient scorer and his scoring was a means to an end... I really think Kobe just loves to shoot and score. I think the muthafucka probably just dreams about shooting...I really think that it were possible, he would shoot every single time down the court..LOL.. that game where he scored 81 points was like nirvana...he probably jizzed in his pants after the game... i bet you that muthafucka watches that video once a week with a sick-evil grin on his face ..

 

[Spectrum]

Dude...

...that is EXACTLY what I think at times. Some years back, he had a 17-47 game against the Celtics. The 17-47 was bad enough, but what struck me was that he got fouled on a shot at the end of the game, went to the line...

...and had a look on his face like the game had just started. His body language was not that of a man who just stunk up the court, but of a man who has happy as hell to add another point to his total.

I've seen this dude come down four plays in a row, and miss every shot. Who does that shit?

I actually thought about it more after your first post breaking it down a couple of years back or so and then, all of a sudden, Kobe made since to me. From that point on, I just appreciate him for what he is.... Im not making anymore statements about his game... the talent is undeniable, but he is certified crazy on the court..not in the Ron Artest kind of way, but in his own special way

I see a player like Lebron who is too got-damn big to be settling for jump shots and Im like what are you doing Lebron..slash...but I do realize that if a team drops into the paint, he can at times be FORCED to shoot jumpers. This is not an excuse for Lebron..it is a fundamental flaw in his game since he has no post up game or back to the basket game whatsoever.... but then I see Kobe shooting fadeaway three pointers from the corner....and Im like because I know he could just as easily just get the ball in the post and get off an easy 10-15 footer because, although not as developed as Jordan by far, he does have a post game...

 

[Kubrick]

Kobe haters are always going to be Kobe haters and there are always going to be 5 players in the league better than him. Im talking about players that cant even get there teams into the playoffs are always better than Kobe.

You cant reason with these people because they change the parameters of the discussion as soon as Kobe reaches another milestone.

Kobe has done things that MJ will never do. He will break Jordans records, he will have more championships that Jordan, and he will have more individual accolades. But it wont matter. Someone will always say something like "Look at this good game Jordan had." And that will be the end of their argument.

If Kobe scores 50 tomorrow, they will say..."uuuuuh Jordan scored 61 against the Celtics....Kobe aint never done that."

Give up the Kobe/Jordan debate. Its like debating a white person of black folks reaction to the Simpson verdict. They just dont get it.

Kobe haters? I can't speak for everyone, but I don't hate Kobe, I just recognize that up until now, he has not surpassed Jordan. In the next few years, who knows, but right now, on a qualitative and quantitative basis it's not a question.

You mention Kobe haters, but Kobe stans are the only people who entertain the idea that Kobe is better than Jordan was.

 

[Spectrum]

Dude...

...that is EXACTLY what I think at times. Some years back, he had a 17-47 game against the Celtics. The 17-47 was bad enough, but what struck me was that he got fouled on a shot at the end of the game, went to the line...

....

BTW.. im almost sure I know the game you are talking about... I think...because I was in NYC on business and I was watching it at the hotel and I was like this muthafucka almost has 50 FIELD GOAL ATTEMPTS. I think that was about 4 years ago...

 

[Yogi Bear]

Kobe has never been physically abused and still put up his points. Hard fouls no lay ups or dunks. (The Jordan rules)

Jordan and Pippen in the post eliminated their need for a big man. Kobe has no post up game.

Jordan was a great defender and help defender. Jordan used to make great defensive plays all the time, especially in crucial moments of games. You don't expect the great defensive play from Kobe like you used to from Jordan.

Kobe is a better outside shooter than Jordan was.

 

[Chauncey8]

Yall in here trippin.

Anybody in here over the age of 30 knows the real deal.

The teams Jordan faced in the finals would murder any team in the league today.

Seattle Supersonics:
Gary Payton
Shawn Kemp
Detlef Shrempf
Sam Perkins
Nate McMillan

C'mon man, that team would have a field day in today's NBA.


Portland Trailblazers:
Clyde Drexler
Cliff Robinson
Terry Porter
Kevin Duckworth
and Jerome Kersey (What'chall know bout Jerome. LOL!)

Again, MURDER today's teams.


Phoenix Suns:
Charles Barkley
Kevin Johnson
Cedric Ceballos
Dan Majerle
Tom Chambers (who'd dunk on anybody)
and Richard Dumas (they were calling him the next superstar...before he got strung out on drugs)

These teams had skilled players.

Today's players are extremely athletic, but lack true basketball skills.

 

[Spectrum]

cosign the above.

 

[Yogi Bear]

That's the thing that can be said. We all speak highly of the teams the Bulls beat and think they were great teams. The youngins just don't understand that most of those teams had 3 or 4 players that could easily get 30 most nights. It's not the same way Artest could get 30 once in a blue moon. Those teams would run todays NBA.

 

[Chauncey8]

Tell you the truth,

I don't know how the Bulls beat that Supersonics team.

That team was no joke.

Shawn Kemp was an ANIMAL!

 

[mit_dropout]

Tell you the truth,

I don't know how the Bulls beat that Supersonics team.

That team was no joke.

Shawn Kemp was an ANIMAL!

Easily.....Pippen cancelled out kemp, Grant cancelled out shremph (sp),

 

[No Homo]

I didn't appreciate Jordan until he retired. Throughout his career pre-wizards I've always hated the guy. Growing up a Knick fan in the 90's I had to hate him. I knew he was nice, but didn't really see it until I saw his highlights later on. I'm guessing I have to treat Kobe the same way, because I can't stand him right now. I'll make my judgment when he stops killing the Knicks.

 

[Pworld297]

And it is not even remotely close here. Kobe does not even have the highest basketball IQ on his current team. He is the most talented bone-headed player I have ever seen in any sport. He often does exactly what you shouldnt do and throws off the Lakers offense. I think this was one of his better years and he had played well during the playoffs but I thought he had figured it out..and game 4 of this series showed ne that he still hasnt.

I think the difference between Kobe and Jordan is MUCH further apart than what a lot of young people imagine. I also think that Kobe is at best the 3rd best Laker at this point behind Magic and Kareem.

Since we are in the finals, game 6 of the is a perfect example of the differences between these two players. Look at how Jordan CONTROLLED this game and compare it to how Kobe often bails out the defense by chucking long-range shots and not pressuring the defense.

Please point out ONE game in the NBA Finals that Kobe has played HALF as good as this. (considering Kobe has played in now 7 NBA finals, you should be able to find one game). Watch the clip first to refresh your memory and play very close attention to what Jordan is doing on the court and the various ways in which he scores and positions himself on the floor on both ends.

You are exactly right but young dudes don't want to hear it, If I remember correctly Shaq was the MVP of the first three titles Kobe won in LA, it's funny to me how quickly people forgot that Shaq was the dominant player during those years, Shaq was averaging like 40pts and 20rebs in the finals. Like you said Kobe's IQ is no where near Jordan and Jordan was better on the defensive side. Jordan beat teams in the finals where they were not even the favorite, plus he never lost a finals and on top of that he never even played with big men as skilled as Shaq and Gasol. Not that Pippen was a slouch but playing with Will Perdue, Bill Wennington and Luke Longley... c'mon man.

 

[mit_dropout]

I didn't appreciate Jordan until he retired. Throughout his career pre-wizards I've always hated the guy. Growing up a Knick fan in the 90's I had to hate him. I knew he was nice, but didn't really see it until I saw his highlights later on. I'm guessing I have to treat Kobe the same way, because I can't stand him right now. I'll make my judgment when he stops killing the Knicks.

Thats impossible. You are talking shit. Even if you were blind you would've known how great Jordan was. Jordan wasn't some debatable great player, he was and is the goat. You talking this madness about you never really saw his greatness is complete and utter nonsense.

 

[No Homo]

Thats impossible. You are talking shit. Even if you were blind you would've known how great Jordan was. Jordan wasn't some debatable great player, he was and is the goat. You talking this madness about you never really saw his greatness is complete and utter nonsense.

That's how I saw it. I couldn't give him all his props, because I was a hater. It's simple as that. I didn't say he was wack. I just wasn't worshiping the nigga, calling him the GOAT the same way everyone was.

 

[Chauncey8]

I didn't appreciate Jordan until he retired. Throughout his career pre-wizards I've always hated the guy. Growing up a Knick fan in the 90's I had to hate him. I knew he was nice, but didn't really see it until I saw his highlights later on. I'm guessing I have to treat Kobe the same way, because I can't stand him right now. I'll make my judgment when he stops killing the Knicks.

The Knicks of the 90's were nuthin to play with.

Come thru the lane if you want to, and get clothes-lined.

Too bad though, they should've one at least one championship.

They had some talented teams back then.
Larry Johnson
Ewing
Alan Houston
Charles Oakley
Anthony Mason
John Starks
Charlie Ward (yeah, the Heisman Trophy winner)
even Chris Childs

Larry Johnson had GAME! But that money made him lazy.

 

[mit_dropout]

That's how I saw it. I couldn't give him all his props, because I was a hater. It's simple as that. I didn't say he was wack. I just wasn't worshiping the nigga, calling him the GOAT the same way everyone was.

Impossible. If you were a knicks fan, then you must have watched Jordan rape the knicks regularly. There's no way you can claim to not have realized how great he was even if you were a hater.

I Hate Kobe, but I know that nigga is a fucking beast, and great. Hate is one thing, but what you're saying can't be true.

 

[jdc12]

I didn't appreciate Jordan until he retired. Throughout his career pre-wizards I've always hated the guy. Growing up a Knick fan in the 90's I had to hate him. I knew he was nice, but didn't really see it until I saw his highlights later on. I'm guessing I have to treat Kobe the same way, because I can't stand him right now. I'll make my judgment when he stops killing the Knicks.

I also saw Jordan shit on the Knicks year after year and fucking hated him for that. The fact that we (the Knicks or any of the other teams of that era) couldn't beat him during his prime is the one thing that separates him from nearly everyone else in the discussion. Kobe will actually lose and has lost in instances where his team had no reason to lose. Can't say the same about Jordan.

 

[TheKingofVa]

I disgree completely. Kobe has a much better team and a HOF coach. He has a very distinct advantage. If you switched positions and placed Lebron or Wade on the Lakers, they would still be contending for titles. If you put Kobe on the Heat, they would still be getting bounced from the playoffs earlier. Individually, there is not much separating these three players.

There is a big difference between Kobe and Melo for instance... but not Kobe and Wade for instance.

There isn't a big difference between Kobe and Melo, because Melo is better than Wade. And Kobe is no where close to the player Jordan was. Kobe is a top 20 player of all time, while Jordan is in the running for GOAT status.

 

[Chauncey8]

You are exactly right but young dudes don't want to hear it, If I remember correctly Shaq was the MVP of the first three titles Kobe won in LA, it's funny to me how quickly people forgot that Shaq was the dominant player during those years, Shaq was averaging like 40pts and 20rebs in the finals. Like you said Kobe's IQ is no where near Jordan and Jordan was better on the defensive side. Jordan beat teams in the finals where they were not even the favorite, plus he never lost a finals and on top of that he never even played with big men as skilled as Shaq and Gasol. Not that Pippen was a slouch but playing with Will Perdue, Bill Wennington and Luke Longley... c'mon man.

You forgot Stacey King and Scott Williams.

*In Charles Barkley voice* them cats were TURRBLE

 

[Blaq]

Yall in here trippin.


The teams Jordan faced in the finals would murder any team in the league today.

End thread

 

[Spectrum]

There isn't a big difference between Kobe and Melo, because Melo is better than Wade. And Kobe is no where close to the player Jordan was. Kobe is a top 20 player of all time, while Jordan is in the running for GOAT status.

Do you really think Melo is better than Wade. I think Wade is the least appreciated out that class and I think Melo, although he has improved a lot over the last couple of years, is still a step below Wade. I dont think Melo can carry a team as a leader. Chauncey is the leader of that team... Wade showed me what he was made of when he took over in the NBA Finals man... to me Wade >>>> Melo and Wade is probably the best SG in the league.

 

[Blaq]

Easily.....Pippen cancelled out kemp, Grant cancelled out shremph (sp),

Rodman was with the Bulls then. Their core 3 were the truth. I didn't look at that series being an automatic win for the Bulls. They had to show and prove.

 

[Helico-pterFunk]

Jordan was the fucking man in the 80s and 90s.

 

[mit_dropout]

Rodman was with the Bulls then. Their core 3 were the truth. I didn't look at that series being an automatic win for the Bulls. They had to show and prove.

I get the years mixed up.... I remember now..Grant was there vs the lakers, Trailblazers, and Suns. Rodman was there vs the Sonics, Jazz, Jazz. You're right. My bad.

 

[Blaq]

I get the years mixed up.... I remember now..Grant was there vs the lakers, Trailblazers, and Suns. Rodman was there vs the Sonics, Jazz, Jazz. You're right. My bad.

I knew what you meant (power forward position). Just clarifying for kats who are maybe looking at match-ups.

 

[Pworld297]

You forgot Stacey King and Scott Williams.

*In Charles Barkley voice* them cats were TURRBLE

Hell yeah, Scott Hansen and Cliff Livingston too....

 

[smokeon2006]

Minus him retiring, Mike would have won 8 straight rings......nuff said

 

[dugglerlover]

I usually don't post on bgol, actually this is my first time posting. I can see most of ya'll dudes are 25 and under. U youngins lack of knowlegde of the game is mind boggling, Kobe never had to face the defenses jordan had to face (example, knicks and the bad boy pistons). The defensive rules have changed to the point where it made the league pussyfied. I don't think kobe has the skill level and the physicality to face those types of defenses that jordan had to face in his prime.

 

[mit_dropout]

I usually don't post on bgol, actually this is my first time posting. I can see most of ya'll dudes are 25 and under. U youngins lack of knowlegde of the game is mind boggling, Kobe never had to face the defenses jordan had to face (example, knicks and the bad boy pistons). The defensive rules have changed to the point where it made the league pussyfied. I don't think kobe has the skill level and the physicality to face those types of defenses that jordan had to face in his prime.

Everything you said is correct except 1 thing.....Bgol is 18 and under, not 25 and under.

 

[Shallah99]

There isn't a big difference between Kobe and Melo, because Melo is better than Wade. And Kobe is no where close to the player Jordan was. Kobe is a top 20 player of all time, while Jordan is in the running for GOAT status.

Funny, I came in here for the comedy that I expected to be posted with regards to Kobe vs Jordan, but there are some pretty valid arguments about Kobe. This post kinda got me thinking about the individual flaws in the game of all of Kobe's peers. I know it was mentioned that Lebron shoots too many jumpers, Melo doesn't have the leadership, etc, but it would be a good read to see how everyone analyzed the "elite" players of this generations' game.

 

[Blaq]

I usually don't post on bgol, actually this is my first time posting. I can see most of ya'll dudes are 25 and under. U youngins lack of knowlegde of the game is mind boggling, Kobe never had to face the defenses jordan had to face (example, knicks and the bad boy pistons). The defensive rules have changed to the point where it made the league pussyfied. I don't think kobe has the skill level and the physicality to face those types of defenses that jordan had to face in his prime.

I would like to see how Kobe would deal with the contact that MJ had to deal with. You don't really have any enforcers in the league today. Mason, Oakley, X-Man, Zo, Laimbeer, Malone, etc.

In that '92 series in game 7, I remember Jordan punking X when the Knicks were trying to take Pippen out of his game. I'd never seen Xavier get punked liked that before. He couldn't and didn't say shit to Jordan.

Jordan & X @ 7:18

 

[No Homo]

Impossible. If you were a knicks fan, then you must have watched Jordan rape the knicks regularly. There's no way you can claim to not have realized how great he was even if you were a hater.

I Hate Kobe, but I know that nigga is a fucking beast, and great. Hate is one thing, but what you're saying can't be true.

I'm not explaining shit to you anymore. Knick fans are a different breed.

 

[mit_dropout]

I'm not explaining shit to you anymore. Knick fans are a different breed.

No way....I was a die hard bulls fan while my pops was a die hard bulls fan, and he knew how great jordan was. He wished on a daily basis that some nigga would break that niggas legs so the Knicks would have a chance to win for a change. I think you are just in denial.

 

[D-TOWN REP]

Larry Johnson had GAME! But that money made him lazy.

Larry had a bad back and had to change his game

 

[Got gumbo?]

Yall in here trippin.

Anybody in here over the age of 30 knows the real deal.

The teams Jordan faced in the finals would murder any team in the league today.

Seattle Supersonics:
Gary Payton
Shawn Kemp
Detlef Shrempf
Sam Perkins
Nate McMillan

C'mon man, that team would have a field day in today's NBA.


Portland Trailblazers:
Clyde Drexler
Cliff Robinson
Terry Porter
Kevin Duckworth
and Jerome Kersey (What'chall know bout Jerome. LOL!)

Again, MURDER today's teams.


Phoenix Suns:
Charles Barkley
Kevin Johnson
Cedric Ceballos
Dan Majerle
Tom Chambers (who'd dunk on anybody)
and Richard Dumas (they were calling him the next superstar...before he got strung out on drugs)

These teams had skilled players.

Today's players are extremely athletic, but lack true basketball skills.

I would like to see the same list for the teams Kobe beat in the finals.
The competition is diluted now. All flash, no skills.