Russell Wilson, Peyton Manning and the evolution of the black quarterback

The Baltimore Ravens Defensive in 2000 had better stats in the Super Bowl but it's not like you came in expecting the Giants to score a lot of points anyway. The Giants had a good defense and VERY average offense. I'm not even arguing that they are a better defense than the Ravens were Im just talking about the SB.


That's why I think the Seahawks had the best super bowl performance because they snuffed out a Super Offense that scored almost twice as many points as the Giants scored during the regular season. It's about perspective man.

That shit would be like Pacman fighting Floyd and landing 60 percent of his punches. :lol:


:lol: Its funny. Just a week ago they were talking about how the Seahawks were going to stop the most prolific offense of all time. A week later....they shut them down and there is no mention. :lol:
 
cause seattle's offense piled on at the end. there were huge stretches they didn't even touch the field.

richard sherman said that the broncos didn't change anything from the film. he said they picked up on his hand signals and his audibles in the 1st quarter and he never changed them.

Man.. It felt like the seattle offense went from the end of the first to mid way through the 3rd quarter without hitting the field... I don't remember shit in the 2nd quarter and then they started the half with the kick off return..
 
Man.. It felt like the seattle offense went from the end of the first to mid way through the 3rd quarter without hitting the field... I don't remember shit in the 2nd quarter and then they started the half with the kick off return..

that's cause they did.

the turnovers produced the points in the 1st half. safety, int, punt. and finally they got the lynch td when they were getting field goals. and the pick 6. denver defense did everything it could do to keep them in the game.. peyton just completely shit the bed. towards the end of the 2nd denver started stringing long drives together and then went for it on 4th instead of taking the field goal and that was game over. it wasn't even desperation time at that point.

they didn't prepare for these 2 weeks they drunk their own kool aid and felt they could just do what they had been doing.
they hadn't faced a defense of that caliber where if you're going to score it's gotta be GRITTY points. ain't no pretty points being scored.

look at the nfc championship

it took some damn miraculous runs
some 4th down passes
some mid air jump throws
to get into that end zone.. anything LESS than perfect or miraculous you not gonna score.

broncos found that out the hard way.
 
Are you sure about that? I thought he said that if he's drafted, he's playing QB, and that's it. I don't think it had to be in the first, but as usual, I could be wrong.

You're right, it is unbelievable and sad. He didn't get drafted, because he said that he wasn't playing ANY other position outside of QB.

From Wikipedia:

Upon graduation, Ward stated he was undecided about professional basketball or football and made it clear that he would not consider playing in the NFL unless selected in the first round of the 1994 NFL Draft. Ward proclaimed that he "deserved to" be a first rounder. Ward’s mother reported that the family was told he "was probably a third-to fifth-round pick." Because teams did not want to waste a first round pick on a player that might eventually choose the NBA, and because of his smaller stature, Ward was not selected in the 1st round of the NFL Draft. Instead of pursuing a career as a football player in the NFL, and having been chosen in the 1st round (26th overall) of the 1994 NBA Draft by the New York Knicks, he began his career in the NBA as a point guard. An inquiry was made during Ward's rookie year with the Knicks for him to become the backup quarterback for Joe Montana of the Kansas City Chiefs, but Ward declined. To this day, Ward is the only Heisman Trophy winner to play in the NBA.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Ward

A FULL article from the NY Times about the subject:

ON PRO FOOTBALL; Ward Gets the Big Snub But Not Without Issue
Timothy W. Smith
Published: May 2, 1994

Sometimes things happen in the National Football League that make one wonder whether N.F.L. stands for National Farce League.

How can Charlie Ward of Florida State, a Heisman Trophy winner who guided his team to a national college championship, not merit consideration in any of the seven rounds of the draft by any of the owners and general managers of the 28 N.F.L. teams? It is almost unfathomable.

Nine quarterbacks were taken in the draft. The Falcons, a team in desperate need of a quarterback, took Perry Klein of C. W. Post in the fourth round. The Jets, who didn't particularly need a rookie quarterback, took Glenn Foley of Boston College in the seventh round.

Outside of Heath Shuler and Trent Dilfer, who were taken in the first round, are all the other quarterbacks selected in the draft better than Ward? And is there such a glut of quarterback talent coming out of colleges that the N.F.L. can snub a player like the Heisman Trophy winner?

Ward not being drafted is about control and options.

Supposedly N.F.L. general managers were scared away from Ward because he expressed interest in the National Basketball Association college draft in June.

"The N.F.L. said, 'We don't know what Charlie Ward is going to do.' They tried to paint him as being indecisive," said Eugene Parker, Ward's agent. "All Charlie did was ask the N.F.L. to tell him whether he was going to be taken in the first round. When they wouldn't do that, he just said he was going to keep his options open. He never said he wouldn't play in the N.F.L. if he wasn't drafted in the first round."

Obviously, keeping options open is a one-way street for N.F.L. teams. And in the case of Ward, they would rather concede his talents to the N.B.A. than limit their options.

"Once he got past the second round and into the third and fourth round nobody was going to waste a pick on him, because you didn't know if you'd have him," said Tampa Bay Coach Sam Wyche, who took Dilfer with the No. 6 pick in the first round. "You'd be competing for him with the Canadian Football League or the N.B.A. Nobody wanted to find out if he was just posturing about the N.B.A."


All that does is beg the question: Why wasn't Ward good enough to be drafted in the first round?

Depending on who you talk to, Ward was too short (6 feet) or had marginal N.F.L. arm strength.

But remember this: Joe Montana of Notre Dame was taken in the third round by San Francisco in 1979.

If teams thought Ward had the abilities of a second, third or fourth-round pick, he should have been selected in one of those rounds and allowed to make his own decision. If teams are afraid of not being compensated for a player who jumps leagues, the N.F.L. should have a rule to award teams a selection in the next year's draft if that happens.

Perhaps the baggage of Ward's Heisman Trophy was too heavy for some teams to carry. In 1990, Detroit selected Andre Ware, another black quarterback and Heisman Trophy winner, in the first round. He has yet to make an impact.

Should that have had a bearing Ward? Certainly not. But it might have.

The N.F.L. has an ugly and shameful legacy when it comes to black quarterbacks, which affects its perception of black athletes who play the position.

In his autobiography "Quarterblack" (Bonus Books, 1990), Doug Williams, who led the Redskins to a Super Bowl championship in 1988, talked about what he called the N.F.L.'s black quarterback syndrome.

"It boils down to the fact that most N.F.L. coaches, general managers and owners are scared of black quarterbacks or they just don't want a black man running their team, period," Williams said. "They're afraid if they play a black quarterback and he doesn't pan out, they're going to be ridiculed by their peers. People around the league will say, 'I told you that black guy couldn't play.'

"If they can get away with it, they're going to overlook the young black quarterback coming out of college. They'll find some excuse for not drafting him or they'll move him to another position. The only time they're going to take a black quarterback is when he's obviously the best player available or their team is desperate to win."

James Harris, the Jets' assistant general manager, was one of the first black quarterbacks in the modern N.F.L. and from 1969-81 played for Buffalo, the Los Angeles Rams and San Diego. He knows firsthand the history of black quarterbacks in the N.F.L., but he doesn't believe Williams's black quarterback syndrome is applicable in the case of Ward.

"If Charlie Ward had said, 'I'm going to play football,' and then no one drafted him, then it would be a racial situation," Harris said. "The facts as they exist don't support that."

Harris cites Vikings quarterback Warren Moon and Randall Cunningham of the Eagles as examples of how things have changed in the N.F.L. for black quarterbacks. But they're the only two black starting quarterbacks in the league and Moon played in Canada for six years to establish himself before he could command attention and a high salary in the N.F.L.

Whatever the case, it's unfortunate that N.F.L. teams thought Ward had nothing they wanted. Maybe in the end, he will be better off in the N.B.A.
http://www.nytimes.com/1994/05/02/s...-gets-the-big-snub-but-not-without-issue.html
 
The Baltimore Ravens Defensive in 2000 had better stats in the Super Bowl but it's not like you came in expecting the Giants to score a lot of points anyway. The Giants had a good defense and VERY average offense. I'm not even arguing that they are a better defense than the Ravens were I'm just talking about the SB.


That's why I think the Seahawks had the best super bowl performance because they snuffed out a Super Offense that scored almost twice as many points as the Giants scored during the regular season. It's about perspective man.

That shit would be like Pacman fighting Floyd and landing 60 percent of his punches. :lol:

:yes:Agreed.

The Giants weren't even supposed to beat the Vikings, who had a more prolific offense, in the NFC Championship Game that year, I remember that I was in absolute SHOCK:eek: @ how that game went down, and THAT'S from a Giants fan, lol!

When you tie in that the Seahawks went against the #1 offense with the rules changes that benefit offenses in today's NFL, this Seahawks "D" is in the argument for best ALL-TIME, 4 real!!!:yes:
 
F"All Charlie did was ask the N.F.L. to tell him whether he was going to be taken in the first round. When they wouldn't do that, he just said he was going to keep his options open. He never said he wouldn't play in the N.F.L. if he wasn't drafted in the first round."l[/url]

This above.

I don't see where he's ever quoted as saying if he doesn't get drafted in the first round, he would never play football.
 
This above.

I don't see where he's ever quoted as saying if he doesn't get drafted in the first round, he would never play football.

any excuse brother.

any excuse. they tagged him as non committal and you see what happens..

remember the rhodes scholar a few years back?
 
Ward explained that it was actually a close call between the NFL and the NBA coming out of Florida State. He said he did everything to prepare for the NFL Draft, and the Chiefs called him in the fifth round. But he said he couldn’t guarantee he’d go to training camp if the NBA drafted him.

 
:lol: Its funny. Just a week ago they were talking about how the Seahawks were going to stop the most prolific offense of all time. A week later....they shut them down and there is no mention. :lol:

I don't know man... the media went through some much effort to vilify their seconday and stuff... they just said fuck it and cut their losses and went to the next story... the media is something else man :smh::lol:

How you gonna have the "Great QB of all-time" and great offense of all-time...5 offensive players with more than 10 TDs come into a game and get mauled like that....no beaten or beaten badly... they got fucked mauled.... dude said he tried to upload the the Super Bowl game to a porn site and it get rejected with an error message "we don't accept rape vids" :lol:
 
I don't know man... the media went through some much effort to vilify their seconday and stuff... they just said fuck it and cut their losses and went to the next story... the media is something else man :smh::lol:

How you gonna have the "Great QB of all-time" and great offense of all-time...5 offensive players with more than 10 TDs come into a game and get mauled like that....no beaten or beaten badly... they got fucked mauled.... dude said he tried to upload the the Super Bowl game to a porn site and it get rejected with an error message "we don't accept rape vids" :lol:

cause its hype going both ways now.

that offense was not as good as they seemed.
coupled with the team having its worst performance on the biggest stage.
that has people talking about the seahawks defense as one of the best ever. it was great and elite but not one of the best ever over the season.

it was one of the best ever performances in the super bowl for damn sure....
 
This above.

I don't see where he's ever quoted as saying if he doesn't get drafted in the first round, he would never play football.

?!?

Upon graduation, Ward stated he was undecided about professional basketball or football and made it clear that he would not consider playing in the NFL unless selected in the first round of the 1994 NFL Draft. Ward proclaimed that he "deserved to" be a first rounder.

:dunno:

It could be spin from the NFL, or spin from Charlie Ward, not only to make a team commit, but also to better his draft position & pay, but when you factor in longevity & the guaranteed contracts of the NBA, I'd say he made the right decision, keep in mind that he was also considered short gor the NBA as well!
 
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It's difficult to have an all-time great offense without a very good-elite RB (no balance). The Broncos know that because their GM didn't win his two Super Bowls until he could ride Davis and their #1 running game.

right.
it was easy to pick that notion apart BUT they put up huge numbers all season anyway.
 
lol why is armstrength always thrown out there yet i've seen him throw deep balls - and i've seen him throw balls on a fuckin rope.

What wasn't he doin in college? at the combine? That all of a sudden he does in the NFL?

A ball thrown without arm strength lacks speed, it's the equivalent of a toss. The ball simply takes too long to reach the intended receiver. The longer the ball is in the air the greater the possibility of an interception.

He figured something out that worked for him, helped him elevate his game.
 
get a weave :lol:

A yaki beard. :lol:

I'ma get a bearded beanie.

jpnMo96LfLI0G.jpg


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WTF, a bunch of companies approached Peyton Manning for endorsement deals after the Superbowl. It is like we are reliving Doug Williams and John Elway again, where John Elway still got all the endorsement deals after 'losing'. Next year, the NFL is going to fix that shit, trading his best receivers away. He will lucky to even finish the season.

The NFL is about establishing Aryan supremacy over non-whites, in the same manner as Hitler wanted to use the Olympics.

article-2165435-13D0BB36000005DC-995_634x390.jpg


Establishment media as predicted is portraying the victory as a 'defensive' one, downplaying the role of Russell Wilson.

:lol::lol::lol:
 
pro i understand what you're saying
but the role of wilson in this super bowl was to not fumble or throw an int. the defense literally put up enough points to win by themselves so it should be portrayed as a defensive one because that's exactly what it was.
 
pro i understand what you're saying
but the role of wilson in this super bowl was to not fumble or throw an int. the defense literally put up enough points to win by themselves so it should be portrayed as a defensive one because that's exactly what it was.

Peyton won a Superbowl based on defense and it was never portrayed in that media that way. He still got a MVP.

It is about getting your comfortable for your eventual role in their organization. Accepting their leadership and dominion over your lives.

You going to the Titan colony in 2 weeks? They erased your memories so that it wouldn't fall into the wrong hands?

:lol::lol::lol:
 
WHOA, let's clarify that, Charlie Ward stated that unless he was drafted IN THE FIRST ROUND, he would NOT play football, he would opt for the NBA instead, while racism was the norm back then, keep in mind that Joe Montana wasn't drafted until the 3rd round (just like Wilson) and even Gino Torretta (who wasn't as good) won the Heisman, two National Championships, but wasn't drafted until the 7th round despite being 6'2", scouts like what they like (and of course, some are QUITE racist) but scouts are indeed QUITE wrong @ times, most notably Tom Brady, who didn't go until the 5th round!

I also have no doubt that Warren Moon would have a ring if he played in the NFL his entire career, but I guess 5 Grey Cup Championships and being the ONLY man in BOTH the CFL & NFL HOFs will have to do!:rolleyes:

But Charlie was the best qb back then....period
 
WHOA, let's clarify that, Charlie Ward stated that unless he was drafted IN THE FIRST ROUND, he would NOT play football, he would opt for the NBA instead, while racism was the norm back then, keep in mind that Joe Montana wasn't drafted until the 3rd round (just like Wilson) and even Gino Torretta (who wasn't as good) won the Heisman, two National Championships, but wasn't drafted until the 7th round despite being 6'2", scouts like what they like (and of course, some are QUITE racist) but scouts are indeed QUITE wrong @ times, most notably Tom Brady, who didn't go until the 5th round!

I also have no doubt that Warren Moon would have a ring if he played in the NFL his entire career, but I guess 5 Grey Cup Championships and being the ONLY man in BOTH the CFL & NFL HOFs will have to do!:rolleyes:

Are you sure about that? I thought he said that if he's drafted, he's playing QB, and that's it. I don't think it had to be in the first, but as usual, I could be wrong.

You're right, it is unbelievable and sad. He didn't get drafted, because he said that he wasn't playing ANY other position outside of QB.

People seem to always leave this out when talking about Ward.

I'm not even a big football fan, but I know that is bullshit (Ward not playing if not drafted in the first round).

=====

"The N.F.L. said, 'We don't know what Charlie Ward is going to do.' They tried to paint him as being indecisive," said Eugene Parker, Ward's agent. "All Charlie did was ask the N.F.L. to tell him whether he was going to be taken in the first round. When they wouldn't do that, he just said he was going to keep his options open. He never said he wouldn't play in the N.F.L. if he wasn't drafted in the first round."

The NFL didn't want no n*gger QB with the potential to be great.
 
I'm not even a big football fan, but I know that is bullshit (Ward not playing if not drafted in the first round).

=====

"The N.F.L. said, 'We don't know what Charlie Ward is going to do.' They tried to paint him as being indecisive," said Eugene Parker, Ward's agent. "All Charlie did was ask the N.F.L. to tell him whether he was going to be taken in the first round. When they wouldn't do that, he just said he was going to keep his options open. He never said he wouldn't play in the N.F.L. if he wasn't drafted in the first round."

The NFL didn't want no n*gger QB with the potential to be great.

You just said fuck the youtube clip huh?
 
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