Pacquiao prepares for 'no' from Mayweather Jr.

dawg9 said:
Bringing the deadline to the press whether Floyd knew beforehand or not is indeed still a negotiating tactic. He's basically trying to pressure Floyd to sign a contract he doesn't agree with by putting the media pressure on him. Coming out to the press saying, Manny has agreed to "everything" and Floyd has to sign by this date or else we're moving on is absolutely a negotiating tactic. This causes the media to stalk Floyd and say "what's up floyd? what's up now? you scared? manny agreed to all your demands, sign the contract".... media PRESSURE is a negotiation tactic.
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You can see it. I'm sure everyone can but they're so caught up in how much they dislike Floyd Mayweather, they refuse to.
Some of you cats :smh::smh: .

qseal00 said:
So "negotiating in the press" is Floyd's "I dont wanna take blood tests because it weakens me"?

:smh:
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No. Mayweather isn't saying anything, as per the agreement. Arum sets a trap, hoping the legendary Mayweather pride/ego will walk into it, but it's the marks, in the public and the sycophantic media, who actually fall in.
 
Upgrade Dave said:
You can see it. I'm sure everyone can but they're so caught up in how much they dislike Floyd Mayweather, they refuse to.
Some of you cats :smh::smh: .




No. Mayweather isn't saying anything, as per the agreement. Arum sets a trap, hoping the legendary Mayweather pride/ego will walk into it, but it's the marks, in the public and the sycophantic media, who actually fall in.
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Dave, it is almost ridiculous at this point. these guy are even in touch with what is really happen...:smh:
 
There was no agreement about not going to the press. It was just a comment made by arum. Also it makes sense to go to the press and say manny is willing to do the test. It was something manny was bashed for and I guess they wanted it to be known it was not an issue this time. 60-40 split in pbf favor is a joke when you put in context this is the biggest ppv event ever in boxing because of both men.

I was against this fight before, but now I am really interested because to me it seems pbf is scared of an opponent. That peaks my interest in the fight. Pbf doesn't need his uncle in the corner if manny is as easy a win as he has claimed.

I want to see the fight take off. But pbf doesn't have a clear advantage so I expect the fight not to take place.
 
Alaskanredman said:
Dave, it is almost ridiculous at this point. these guy are even in touch with what is really happen...:smh:
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Your viewpoint is just a bad as when cats call people haters just cause they disagree. I mean people are in touch. They just have a different viewpoint. It is that simple. It is not ridiculous it is just how things work.

As long as people are not being stupid with name calling or racist taunts then the difference in opinions make the subject interesting.
 
buk said:
There was no agreement about not going to the press. It was just a comment made by arum. Also it makes sense to go to the press and say manny is willing to do the test. It was something manny was bashed for and I guess they wanted it to be known it was not an issue this time. 60-40 split in pbf favor is a joke when you put in context this is the biggest ppv event ever in boxing because of both men.

I was against this fight before, but now I am really interested because to me it seems pbf is scared of an opponent. That peaks my interest in the fight. Pbf doesn't need his uncle in the corner if manny is as easy a win as he has claimed.

I want to see the fight take off. But pbf doesn't have a clear advantage so I expect the fight not to take place.
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That does not even make sense, why should Floyd fight without his trainer? just because he said it would be an easy fight, c'mon man thats reaching
 
buk said:
Your viewpoint is just a bad as when cats call people haters just cause they disagree. I mean people are in touch. They just have a different viewpoint. It is that simple. It is not ridiculous it is just how things work.

As long as people are not being stupid with name calling or racist taunts then the difference in opinions make the subject interesting.
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You're right. How stupid of me to expect both sides to adhere to a very public agreement not to negotiate in public. What kind of man expects people to stick to agreements?
 
Upgrade Dave said:
You're right. How stupid of me to expect both sides to adhere to a very public agreement not to negotiate in public. What kind of man expects people to stick to agreements?
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Where did you see pbf or golden boy state they would not negotiate in public? At least show me where both sides said they were going to do that.
 
Bones said:
That does not even make sense, why should Floyd fight without his trainer? just because he said it would be an easy fight, c'mon man thats reaching
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Not really. I mean his pops and uncle are interchangeable. And for 30million against a fighter he swear he can kick his ass. Come on.
 
buk said:
Not really. I mean his pops and uncle are interchangeable. And for 30million against a fighter he swear he can kick his ass. Come on.
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Are they really that interchangeable? Despite his father giving him his style, Floyd Jr feels more comfortable with his uncle and has said so many times, I doubt he will do anything without him
 
buk said:
Your viewpoint is just a bad as when cats call people haters just cause they disagree. I mean people are in touch. They just have a different viewpoint. It is that simple. It is not ridiculous it is just how things work.

As long as people are not being stupid with name calling or racist taunts then the difference in opinions make the subject interesting.
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What name calling did I do in this thread?

If people saying shit like "Floyd is using the public negotiation like Manny used drug testing making him weak", I don't know how anyone could say those people are in touch because, where did they get that from?

As far as people not recognizing when shit is being used as a negotiation ploy fine if you think that falls in the realm of opinions then we disagree.... but you don't seem to be in touch with anything I've said here.
 
Alaskanredman said:
What name calling did I do in this thread?

If people saying shit like "Floyd is using the public negotiation like Manny used drug testing making him weak", I don't know how anyone could say those people are in touch because, where did they get that from?

As far as people not recognizing when shit is being used as a negotiation ploy fine if you think that falls in the realm of opinions then we disagree.... but you don't seem to be in touch with anything I've said here.
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You didn't.
 
Tim Smith of the NY Daily News

Arum was using the stunt to gain some kind of public-relations advantage over Mayweather in a one-sided war of words. That's because Mayweather and his representatives have maintained their silence throughout the touchy negotiations for what is the biggest boxing match looming for the sport in the near future.

It was the same vow that both sides took when they decided to try to pick up the talks again after they fell apart last December. They first tried to negotiate a fight for this past March, but the negotiations fell apart because of the constant back-and-forth in the press over whether it was proper for Mayweather to ask Pacquiao to take random blood and urine tests for performance-enhancing drugs before the fight.

Ultimately, Pacquiao refused the testing protocols and the fight fell apart. Soon after Mayweather beat Shane Mosley in May, the two sides decided to try to make the fight again. But this time they thought it was best not to negotiate through the press. So far only Mayweather's side has steadfastly kept to that agreement



Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/m...moter_bob_arum_manny_pacqu.html#ixzz0txPWBeCF
 
Alaskanredman said:
What name calling did I do in this thread?

If people saying shit like "Floyd is using the public negotiation like Manny used drug testing making him weak", I don't know how anyone could say those people are in touch because, where did they get that from?

As far as people not recognizing when shit is being used as a negotiation ploy fine if you think that falls in the realm of opinions then we disagree.... but you don't seem to be in touch with anything I've said here.
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I agree with your points you made here.
 
buk said:
They are interchangeable
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You are not in the position to make that claim. Floyd Sr. is in poor health.
If (the only person making that claim is Arum and he can't be trusted) that was the case, waiting for his trainer to clear up his legal issue would be legitimate.
 
Dave that still is not proof that pbf said no public discussing of the negotiations. I need to read where hey said that. Still if this arum move is what pbf uses to back out I am going to laugh. Because stating manny agreed to the test is nothing compared to how pbf and his team called manny a cheater.

I am telling you I think pbf doesn't want the fight. I probably will have to eat my words because there is o lot of cash riding on it. But I really think he is scared.
 
buk said:
Dave that still is not proof that pbf said no public discussing of the negotiations. I need to read where hey said that. Still if this arum move is what pbf uses to back out I am going to laugh. Because stating manny agreed to the test is nothing compared to how pbf and his team called manny a cheater.

I am telling you I think pbf doesn't want the fight. I probably will have to eat my words because there is o lot of cash riding on it. But I really think he is scared.
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I can't chase down every goal line you lay down, buk. I don't have a quote form Floyd himself but then Floyd usually lets Ellerbe and Schaefer do that stuff for him anyway and they've been mum.

Arum lays out the trap and some not only walk into it but they run and jump into it because of how they feel about Floyd Mayweather.
If Floyd didn't want the fight, he would have just retired again. He made plenty of money with the Marquez and Mosley fights, he wouldn't need to fight Pacquiao at all. He could rack up some more big paydays, being the biggest draw in the sport, and let it go. No need to enter negotiations at all.
Arum, on the other hand, he acts like he doesn't want the fight but I've already gone over that.
 
buk said:
Dave that still is not proof that pbf said no public discussing of the negotiations. I need to read where hey said that. Still if this arum move is what pbf uses to back out I am going to laugh. Because stating manny agreed to the test is nothing compared to how pbf and his team called manny a cheater.

I am telling you I think pbf doesn't want the fight. I probably will have to eat my words because there is o lot of cash riding on it. But I really think he is scared.
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So the press just pulled that shit out their asses. Since there seems to be a dispute on the agreement:lol: I will say this..... If there was an agreement regarding negotiation, any violation of that agreement is a good reason to break off negotiation. Talking shit in boxing is not a good reason to break off negotiation, but we don't need to go down that road again.
 
As for Roger and Big Floyd being interchangeable... Not so much!!! Big Floyd is on record saying he doesn't like Floyd fighting against southpaws and Roger's comeback is that's because he doesn't know how to train him against southpaws. Recall, Floyd struggle early in his career against southpaws when his dad was training. He struggled a little bit earlier on with Chop and Zab but made sound tactical adjustments. He flatout whupped Sharmba Mitchell's ass. So obviously Roger is doing something right that he may not be so confident his dad can repeat.
 
Upgrade Dave said:
You are not in the position to make that claim. Floyd Sr. is in poor health.
If (the only person making that claim is Arum and he can't be trusted) that was the case, waiting for his trainer to clear up his legal issue would be legitimate.
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I am in a position to have an opinion that is expressed.
 
Upgrade Dave said:
I can't chase down every goal line you lay down, buk. I don't have a quote form Floyd himself but then Floyd usually lets Ellerbe and Schaefer do that stuff for him anyway and they've been mum.

Arum lays out the trap and some not only walk into it but they run and jump into it because of how they feel about Floyd Mayweather.
If Floyd didn't want the fight, he would have just retired again. He made plenty of money with the Marquez and Mosley fights, he wouldn't need to fight Pacquiao at all. He could rack up some more big paydays, being the biggest draw in the sport, and let it go. No need to enter negotiations at all.
Arum, on the other hand, he acts like he doesn't want the fight but I've already gone over that.
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Well. I at least expect if you state something as fact then you can back it up. I agree with them not taking stuff to the public. But it is fine with me as long as it doesn't derail the fight. And so far nothing has been said to derail the fight.
 
Bones said:
Arum sounds suspect (as all ways) I'm for bringing in mediators when the situation calls for but no direct contact has been made with, Haymon, Ellerbe or Scheaffer per Arum's word, so communication has only been done with HBO sports president. Arum gave the distinct impression that talks had been held with GBP.
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:angry::smh::smh:
 
buk said:
Well. I at least expect if you state something as fact then you can back it up. I agree with them not taking stuff to the public. But it is fine with me as long as it doesn't derail the fight. And so far nothing has been said to derail the fight.
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That's all I'm saying. There is no evidence that Arum has done anything to derail the fight. There is no evidence that any deadline harmed negotiations. I don't see why
"cats" feel the need to become Mayweather's lawyer and dream up all of these conspiracy theories about why he hasn't signed for a fight. It's kind of ridiculous, I've never seen an elite fighter have so much trouble making fights.
 
dawg9 said:
As for Roger and Big Floyd being interchangeable... Not so much!!! Big Floyd is on record saying he doesn't like Floyd fighting against southpaws and Roger's comeback is that's because he doesn't know how to train him against southpaws. Recall, Floyd struggle early in his career against southpaws when his dad was training. He struggled a little bit earlier on with Chop and Zab but made sound tactical adjustments. He flatout whupped Sharmba Mitchell's ass. So obviously Roger is doing something right that he may not be so confident his dad can repeat.
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I said this in a previous post, southpaws are not good for Floyd and the only reason Zab and Chop were able to rock him and drop him was because of that southpaw angle. Luckily for Floyd, he was fighting the right kind of southpaws because Zab is a frontrunner against everybody and always tapers off past the 5th round. Chop Chop is just a never was bummish fighter and one of the worst finishers I've ever seen.

Now Pacquiao is the worst kind of southpaw for Floyd. Now Floyd's fans may scream, "easy fight", "on paper no contest", and stuff like that but Roger and Floyd Sr definitely know what's up. If Pac were to get Floyd in any type of trouble like Chop Chop or Mosley did, Floyd might not get stopped but he would definitely be tasting canvas several times once those shots from weird angles start catching him. Floyd needs a complete training camp with Roger to be tactically ready for this one and most likely he wouldn't do the fight without him.
 
Zeferino said:
I said this in a previous post, southpaws are not good for Floyd and the only reason Zab and Chop were able to rock him and drop him was because of that southpaw angle. Luckily for Floyd, he was fighting the right kind of southpaws because Zab is a frontrunner against everybody and always tapers off past the 5th round. Chop Chop is just a never was bummish fighter and one of the worst finishers I've ever seen.

Now Pacquiao is the worst kind of southpaw for Floyd. Now Floyd's fans may scream, "easy fight", "on paper no contest", and stuff like that but Roger and Floyd Sr definitely know what's up. If Pac were to get Floyd in any type of trouble like Chop Chop or Mosley did, Floyd might not get stopped but he would definitely be tasting canvas several times once those shots from weird angles start catching him. Floyd needs a complete training camp with Roger to be tactically ready for this one and most likely he wouldn't do the fight without him.
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I hear what you're saying but at the same time, you're looking at this fight as why Pac gives Floyd trouble but you're not stating that Floyd has a say in how this fight turns out too. I'll match your Zab and Chop with a Marquez and Morales. Two boxers not nearly of Floyd's caliber who dug all up in Manny's ass. In my opinion, Floyd's defense is better than Manny's offense. Now you compare Manny's defense to Floyd's offense and tell me what you get? Clottey busted Manny up and you won't find a more one sided fight.
 
dawg9 said:
I hear what you're saying but at the same time, you're looking at this fight as why Pac gives Floyd trouble but you're not stating that Floyd has a say in how this fight turns out too. I'll match your Zab and Chop with a Marquez and Morales. Two boxers not nearly of Floyd's caliber who dug all up in Manny's ass. In my opinion, Floyd's defense is better than Manny's offense. Now you compare Manny's defense to Floyd's offense and tell me what you get? Clottey busted Manny up and you won't find a more one sided fight.
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I actually think the Morales analysis is the best one even though Pac was not as diverse back then either. Pac was even less diverse when he drew with Marquez. If we are going to use Morales fight as a parallel or a comparison, we can certainly the Jose Luis Castillo fight to compare as well. Pac's stance, movement, power, and speed should represent a much more complicated task than Castillo's simple walk you down style albeit with good boxing. In spite of that, most viewers thought Castillo beat the supposedly untouchable Mayweather. Yes Mayweather barely beat Castillo in the rematch, not by much, maybe 7 rounds to 5. But Pac destroyed Morales in the rematches for whatever reasons and was able to bounce Marquez off the canvas yet again when they fought.

Regarding Pac's offense, I rate it more dynamic and proven against different styles than May's defense. As far as defense, of course Mayweather's defense is better because he is a defensive fighter. I think his defense is overrated because he has been rocked, dropped, and he rarely fights offensive specialists in their prime. Corrales and Castillo happened almost 10 years ago.
 
Zeferino said:
I actually think the Morales analysis is the best one even though Pac was not as diverse back then either. Pac was even less diverse when he drew with Marquez. If we are going to use Morales fight as a parallel or a comparison, we can certainly the Jose Luis Castillo fight to compare as well. Pac's stance, movement, power, and speed should represent a much more complicated task than Castillo's simple walk you down style albeit with good boxing. In spite of that, most viewers thought Castillo beat the supposedly untouchable Mayweather. Yes Mayweather barely beat Castillo in the rematch, not by much, maybe 7 rounds to 5. But Pac destroyed Morales in the rematches for whatever reasons and was able to bounce Marquez off the canvas yet again when they fought.

Regarding Pac's offense, I rate it more dynamic and proven against different styles than May's defense. As far as defense, of course Mayweather's defense is better because he is a defensive fighter. I think his defense is overrated because he has been rocked, dropped, and he rarely fights offensive specialists in their prime. Corrales and Castillo happened almost 10 years ago.
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Manny fought to a draw 6 years ago w/ Marquez(and was given a hell of a fight 2 years ago) in comparison to the Castillo fight that was 8 years ago(and the rematch was not close by any means). That 2 years is a big difference, especially considering that Manny lost to a war-beaten Morales a year later(even after "El Terrible" gave him his chin for the whole 12th), which was only 5 years ago! Floyd has basically been dominate even since the second Castillo fight... 8 years ago!

Your point of Manny being the type of southpaw that Floyd hasn't had to go against is valid, but he's also a southpaw with a 5" reach disadvantage of PBF's hardest southpaw opponents and Floyd. It's alot harder landing those shots, even in a southpaw stance, when you're up against an accurate defensive specialist who dwarfs you. With that said, I wouldn't be surprised if Manny pulled off a KO win, for the same reason I would be surprised if a more prime Mosley(or even Oscar) might've... Finishing ability
 
Zeferino said:
I actually think the Morales analysis is the best one even though Pac was not as diverse back then either. Pac was even less diverse when he drew with Marquez. If we are going to use Morales fight as a parallel or a comparison, we can certainly the Jose Luis Castillo fight to compare as well. Pac's stance, movement, power, and speed should represent a much more complicated task than Castillo's simple walk you down style albeit with good boxing. In spite of that, most viewers thought Castillo beat the supposedly untouchable Mayweather. Yes Mayweather barely beat Castillo in the rematch, not by much, maybe 7 rounds to 5. But Pac destroyed Morales in the rematches for whatever reasons and was able to bounce Marquez off the canvas yet again when they fought.

Regarding Pac's offense, I rate it more dynamic and proven against different styles than May's defense. As far as defense, of course Mayweather's defense is better because he is a defensive fighter. I think his defense is overrated because he has been rocked, dropped, and he rarely fights offensive specialists in their prime. Corrales and Castillo happened almost 10 years ago.
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This last post is so riddled with biasness that I'm not even going to respond... I'll just say that you are the FIRST person I have heard say that Floyd barely won the Castillo rematch. Jim Lampley is quoted saying floyd won the rematch more one sided than the first fight but yet the scores were closer. I see you made excuses for Pac's close fights but you didn't mention Floyd had a shoulder injury in the first Castillo fight. As for Floyd being rocked and dropped... Come on man!!! Yea his glove barely touched the damn ground against Zab... So much so that it wasn't even counted as a knockdown. If you want to reach and credit floyd with being dropped for a knockdown that's not on his record than go on. We both know we don't have to stretch to find how many times Manny has hit the canvas... So Pac is a better fighter now since he got his ass whupped by Marquez and Morales but Floyd isn't a better fighter. Don't forget what Floyd just did to Shane when Freddie Roach himself told Shane he was TOO GOOD for Pac and that he would NEVER make that fight. NOT EVEN IF HE CAME DOWN TO 140!
 
Bxlegend said:
Manny fought to a draw 6 years ago w/ Marquez(and was given a hell of a fight 2 years ago) in comparison to the Castillo fight that was 8 years ago(and the rematch was not close by any means). That 2 years is a big difference, especially considering that Manny lost to a war-beaten Morales a year later(even after "El Terrible" gave him his chin for the whole 12th), which was only 5 years ago! Floyd has basically been dominate even since the second Castillo fight... 8 years ago!

Your point of Manny being the type of southpaw that Floyd hasn't had to go against is valid, but he's also a southpaw with a 5" reach disadvantage of PBF's hardest southpaw opponents and Floyd. It's alot harder landing those shots, even in a southpaw stance, when you're up against an accurate defensive specialist who dwarfs you. With that said, I wouldn't be surprised if Manny pulled off a KO win, for the same reason I would be surprised if a more prime Mosley(or even Oscar) might've... Finishing ability
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I agree regarding Manny's reach disadvantage and other intangibles and that's why I think the fight is a toss up. I've never said that I expect Manny to steamroll Mayweather. I just think it's a difficult fight for both guys. Therefore, I disagree when some state that Mayweather will just easily walk through Manny.

Regarding the competition comparisons. Yes, Mayweather has been dominant since his fight with Castillo 8 years ago but IMO that's more of a testament to how May's quality of competition has dipped. After Mayweather fought Castillo (he only won by two points in the rematch), when did he ever again face a fresh or young champion in their prime in his own weight class? Never!

After Castillo, he followed up with Ndou, Bruseles, Corley, Gatti, etc, so of course he was going to remain dominant. The level of competition in that same time period was just poor when compared to Pac's IMO. Sure Pac lost to Morales but before that he beat Barrera. Barrera obviously wasn't shot because he bounced back, became a champ again and made several defenses. Pac has been dominant for several years while testing himself against better fighters than Bruseles, Gatti, etc.
 
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