Jim Brown says Vick should take notes from Tebow

[Djmarkxr7]

So? Fuck personal records. Superbowl! That's what it is about, how many coaches or former players do you see without a ring on the morning shows. Just a few. It is all about championships.

Ummm
Tom Jackson,
Merril Hoge,
Tim Hasselbeck,
Marcelus Wiley,
Herman Edwards
Jamie Dukes
Waddle.
Marrucci

Boomer
Marino
Sterling
Carter

I assume you are laughing cause I am correct.

Fam, ALL of the people listed HAVEN'T WON SUPERBOWLS!!!

To be a commentator is simply about being able to speak (except in Shannon Sharpe's case, of course!) I mean, you don't see Mr 4 rings Joe Montana as a commentator now, do you???

 

[Upgrade Dave]

Fam, ALL of the people listed HAVEN'T WON SUPERBOWLS!!!

To be a commentator is simply about being able to speak (except in Shannon Sharpe's case, of course!) I mean, you don't see Mr 4 rings Joe Montana as a commentator now, do you???

Some of them weren't even very good.

 

[Damn Right]

Lost some respect For brown

that's cause ur a dumb fuk that knows nothing about jim brown or his activities in the community from the 60s on through today. his amer-i-can prison program helps so many people of color in poorer communities make a positive transition from jail to jobs that it ain't even funny.

but yeah, u go ahead and 'loose' some respect for the man behind personal comments about a football player

 

[Mr. Met]

JB has a point.

Vick has allowed folk to change his game, Tebow hasn't.

Now let's see if Tebow can maintain this type of play and win for a few more years.

 

[jasonblacc]

If you've watched any Eagles game this season you'll see that's exactly what Michael Vick does.

As others have mentioned, Brown also doesn't make a fact to point out that the 2 QB's run 2 totally different offensive philosophies. Vick's run's the pass first West Coast Offense. The other guy runs the Abe Lincoln Middle School run only offense. You can't compare them.

 

[Spectrum]

yea. The title was misleading and you know niggas dont read. He basically is saying that Tim Tebow plays like Tim Tebow. Vick has been trying to become Tom Brady, and thats not his strength. He makes plays with his arm and his legs, he should stick to what works

That is exactly what JB says... changing take notes to take not doesnt change that fact or sentiment. The title wasnt misleading dawg

 

[Spectrum]

What Jim Brown failed to mention is that Fox adapted his team to Tebow. :

This is the one that thing really has to be taken into account. Only Peyton Manning ran the offense... other QBs are subject to OCs...and Vick doesnt call the plays.

However, I do understand what JB is getting at...but at the same time... tebow has an entire offense catered to his limits.....I actually started a thread about tebow running a high school offense...

 

[gene cisco]

He is very polarizing. Just like the hate is overboard, so is the love. Whenever the sports media gets behind someone to this degree, there's going to be a backlash.

I agree. It's either you love him or hate him. I don't like the guy. It's just like with the win streak. Some people give him too much credit, while other don't give him enough. I'm one of the few that takes the middle ground.

 

[Spectrum]

JB has a point.

Vick has allowed folk to change his game, Tebow hasn't.

Now let's see if Tebow can maintain this type of play and win for a few more years.

I dont think Tebow really made this decision. the offense was talored to his skill set.

But what tebow hasnt done is FORCE it... thus, the low turnover ratio and that really helps his defense..

 

[P03t]

The problem with Vick is he tries to be too much of a pocket passer & not enough of a runner...like what happen to Mcnabb....

do what works...Vick is much smaller than Tebow if anything he needs to take off more often...

 

[gene cisco]

This is the one that thing really has to be taken into account. Only Peyton Manning ran the offense... other QBs are subject to OCs...and Vick doesnt call the plays.

However, I do understand what JB is getting at...but at the same time... tebow has an entire offense catered to his limits.....I actually started a thread about tebow running a high school offense...

The Tebow love/hate has blinded most people to this fact.

 

[incogneg]

Lost some respect For brown

That's ridiculous... To lose any respect for the man says the reader doesn't understand his history....

Jim Brown is the closest thing to a superhero we've had in pure flesh... He repped his principles, always refused to be 'sonn'd' by whites, loved the ladies and they loved him back, was one of the toughest guys ever, and still reps for black people harder than most of us at his age... A true renaissance man and a true brother...

 

[Spectrum]

That's ridiculous... To lose any respect for the man says the reader doesn't understand his history....

Jim Brown is the closest thing to a superhero we've had in pure flesh... He repped his principles, always refused to be 'sonn'd' by whites, loved the ladies and they loved him back, was one of the toughest guys ever, and still reps for black people harder than most of us at his age... A true renaissance man and a true brother...

 

[Uncontainable_Spirit]

that's ridiculous... To lose any respect for the man says the reader doesn't understand his history....

Jim brown is the closest thing to a superhero we've had in pure flesh... He repped his principles, always refused to be 'sonn'd' by whites, loved the ladies and they loved him back, was one of the toughest guys ever, and still reps for black people harder than most of us at his age... A true renaissance man and a true brother...

/thread

 

[Djmarkxr7]

JB has a point.

Vick has allowed folk to change his game, Tebow hasn't.

Now let's see if Tebow can maintain this type of play and win for a few more years.

Exactly, ANY player that has a few years under his belt changes his game!!!

The game has been enhanced for passers, peeps here complain about Vick getting hit so much need to realize that a big part of the reason is because most refs STILL think of Vick as a runner first, passer second, once you go out past the tackles you can be hit just like a runner, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning stay in the pocket and while they do get superstar calls, they very rarely run out of the pocket.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

JB has a point.

Vick has allowed folk to change his game, Tebow hasn't.

Now let's see if Tebow can maintain this type of play and win for a few more years.

the fuck are you talking about
he's running the offense the person changing his game is the head coach and maker of the offense.

if he had option reads as his offense he'd do it

if tebow didn't have option reads as his offense he wouldn't do it

its that simple

 

[ugk]

I'mma go out on a limb here...

If the Eagles win outright they win the division and get to the new season! They would be 8-8 and 5-1 in the division. The remaining games are @ home vs. NY Jets, @ Dallas then @ home vs. Washington. 8-8 is possible, and Dallas & NY Giants can end up 8-8 with inferior division records. Does the NFL go by conference records before division if all 3 end up 8-8?

Vick needs to do this for himself, his team, his BIG CONTRACT, Vince FUCKIN' Young who will be gone after this season (hopefully) and for those who came before him. Run, Michaek, RUN!

cue Tina Marie:

"I'm out on a limb..."

For the Eagles to make the playoffs:

Dallas would have to lose the the Bucs and Eagles, then beat the Giants.

Any Giants win eliminates the Eagles from the playoffs

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

The problem with Vick is he tries to be too much of a pocket passer & not enough of a runner...like what happen to Mcnabb....

do what works...Vick is much smaller than Tebow if anything he needs to take off more often...

that's not vicks problem
vicks problem is he has a coach who isn't willing to adapt to vicks strengths and wants him to run the offense he wants him to run

vick can't run because vick doesn't get running plays

and you guys keep saying mcnabb...and you're right
who do those people have in common? ANDY REID

he'd be on the bench if he took off more often cause its not what his coach wants
and if he didnt listen to his coach he'd be on the bench

 

[AwwSchitt]

However, I do understand what JB is getting at...but at the same time... tebow has an entire offense catered to his limits.....I actually started a thread about tebow running a high school offense...

^^^Read what brotha Eewwll has said one more time. Think about it.

Brown's assessment that Mike Vick needs to understand how to use his legs is incorrect. Mike Vick knows how use them and does often. Anyone who has seen the Philly O-line breakdown knows he scrambles like a mofo. I think Brown looked at some recent Philly games and confused Vince Young for Mike Vick.

Facts:
Mike Vick - 544 yards, 8.1 yards per rush
Timothy Tebow - 517 yards, 5.5 yards per rush

That says Vick understands how to use his legs and uses them more effectively.

 

[r3d DaWn]

The point is, Vick WILL NOT last as a running QB, he HAS to evolve his game and throw. He is constantly getting hurt, and the offense, WAS built around his strengths. He has gone on record to say that. Reid didn't say you run my offense and that's it, they created the offense Vick wanted. So how Reid isn't a better coach then Fox is not catching with me.

As to Tebow, NO single person would ever say he has more talent, or is a better QB then Vick, that wasn't it. The talk is, "leadership", which that kid has, he knows how to find ways to lead men into battle, something Vick never has had, and never will have. Watch what they constantly say about Tebow, the "it" factor... That's what I referenced too, Mike has never had that, he leads with his talent, but we've seen talent alone can't lead you far. I wish Vick had lived up to his promise to be the best for us, but he was lazy, didn't put in the work, which he admitted too. Now in Philly, with so much talent, he still can't get it done, no matter the excuse. Then you got Tebow who took over a god awful team, and somehow they find ways to win, they all talk about his leadership, will, blah blah, never talent.. That's something you never hear about Vick...

 

[three-fifths]

he outta shut his ol' country ass up.

 

[Big Phil98]

I think what JIm Brown is saying is that Vick should be Vick. Just as McNabb would have been more effective if he did not succumb to the idea that he had to be a complete pocket passer. I don't want to insert race into it, but these coaches have basically tried to reel in these black quarterbacks while they are letting Tebow grow and play the way he is most effective. The coaches are willing to change for him instead of vice versa.

This

 

[shaddyvillethug]

stick to makin movies jim brown or talking about the cleveland browns.

 

[Ming Fei Hong]

JB has a point.

Vick has allowed folk to change his game, Tebow hasn't.

Now let's see if Tebow can maintain this type of play and win for a few more years.

This.

 

[jasonblacc]

^^^Read what brotha Eewwll has said one more time. Think about it.

Brown's assessment that Mike Vick needs to understand how to use his legs is incorrect. Mike Vick knows how use them and does often. Anyone who has seen the Philly O-line breakdown knows he scrambles like a mofo. I think Brown looked at some recent Philly games and confused Vince Young for Mike Vick.

Facts:
Mike Vick - 544 yards, 8.1 yards per rush
Timothy Tebow - 517 yards, 5.5 yards per rush

That says Vick understands how to


use his legs and uses them more effectively.[/QUOTE]

One of the few in this thread who get it

 

[code_pirahna]

"Michael Vick in the last few games seemed to be afraid to use his legs because they say he's not a great quarterback because he doesn't stay in the pocket and throw the ball.

Vick, McNabb, Young....hell they even tried to do this to Randall Cunningham.....

The critics and folks who never played the game wanted to say they weren t good because they used their running ability.....and all of these dudes should have told all of the critics to STFU.....

Tebow has and he wins...now all they talk about is "Why is Tebow winning?" that s a conversation that will keep you in the league for years.

 

[Upgrade Dave]

The point is, Vick WILL NOT last as a running QB, he HAS to evolve his game and throw. He is constantly getting hurt, and the offense, WAS built around his strengths. He has gone on record to say that. Reid didn't say you run my offense and that's it, they created the offense Vick wanted. So how Reid isn't a better coach then Fox is not catching with me.

As to Tebow, NO single person would ever say he has more talent, or is a better QB then Vick, that wasn't it. The talk is, "leadership", which that kid has, he knows how to find ways to lead men into battle, something Vick never has had, and never will have. Watch what they constantly say about Tebow, the "it" factor... That's what I referenced too, Mike has never had that, he leads with his talent, but we've seen talent alone can't lead you far. I wish Vick had lived up to his promise to be the best for us, but he was lazy, didn't put in the work, which he admitted too. Now in Philly, with so much talent, he still can't get it done, no matter the excuse. Then you got Tebow who took over a god awful team, and somehow they find ways to win, they all talk about his leadership, will, blah blah, never talent.. That's something you never hear about Vick...

You keep hitting that note like it's true but there's nothing backing that up.
You don't think Vick earned a hell of a lot of respect from his teammates playing the Arizona game with broken ribs?
The failure of the Eagles isn't on Vick but on a poorly put together team. Much in the way Dallas and Washington thought that if they just put together name brand talent and it would lead to success, Philly tried that too and, like Dallas and Washington, it's not working out. So you're trying to twist reality and recent history to fit what you want to believe, facts be damned, and you're coming to the wrong conclusing, much like Jim Brown did.

 

[code_pirahna]

I think what JIm Brown is saying is that Vick should be Vick. Just as McNabb would have been more effective if he did not succumb to the idea that he had to be a complete pocket passer. I don't want to insert race into it, but these coaches have basically tried to reel in these black quarterbacks while they are letting Tebow grow and play the way he is most effective. The coaches are willing to change for him instead of vice versa.

c/s

 

[Upgrade Dave]

Vick, McNabb, Young....hell they even tried to do this to Randall Cunningham.....

The critics and folks who never played the game wanted to say they weren t good because they used their running ability.....and all of these dudes should have told all of the critics to STFU.....

Tebow has and he wins...now all they talk about is "Why is Tebow winning?" that s a conversation that will keep you in the league for years.

Tebow hasn't told anybody shit. His coach has worked around him and made it work. Before he gets anointed, people should wait and see if he can sustain this success or if he's the qb version of "the Wildcat": hot for a season but done once everyone figures him out.

 

[r3d DaWn]

You keep hitting that note like it's true but there's nothing backing that up.
You don't think Vick earned a hell of a lot of respect from his teammates playing the Arizona game with broken ribs?
The failure of the Eagles isn't on Vick but on a poorly put together team. Much in the way Dallas and Washington thought that if they just put together name brand talent and it would lead to success, Philly tried that too and, like Dallas and Washington, it's not working out. Still, before he got hurt, the Eagles were winning. So you're trying to twist reality and recent history to fit what you want to believe, facts be damned, and you're coming to the wrong conclusing, much like Jim Brown did.

Bro I watched him for years lead my Falcons with only his talent, and he never lived up to what he "could have been", and made some horrible mistakes along the way. When he went to Philly and admitted he was lazy and didn't do the things he should have in Atl, I thought, like most, he is becoming what he should have been with us, responsible, and going to put all that talent he has to work. Yet, though he had a great season last year, he didn't get them anywhere. This year, I've watched him, they still looked bad at times, and he hasn't been hurt all year, and has had some poor games. Of course there is ton's of reasons, the team not working as they should, drop balls, etc. I continue to point out, Vick has more talent then probably ANY QB in the league, but the guy isn't a leader. Crumpler said as much about Vick when he left, he lead with his talent, but people weren't jumping to follow the guy. It looks the same in Philly. My point has been just that. Tebow sucks so bad at times, yet, that team, follows him, they believe, for whatever reason. I think Tebow is horrible at the QB position at times, laughable even. Yet even I have to admit, he knows how to lead. He took a horrible team, that wasn't doing crap, simply losing, and look, they now all believe and talk about the kid like he is a 10 year vet, running a joke of an offense. That's where I see the biggest difference between him and Vick, and probably the ONLY difference, since Vick beats him with everything else. Yet talent alone won't always get you where you want. If that were true, Vick would have numerous rings, and yet, he doesn't. Vick want's to be a passing QB, that's what he has always wanted, and Reid gave him that. It's up to Vick to prove he can lead doing just that.

 

[jasonblacc]

Bro I watched him for years lead my Falcons with only his talent, and he never lived up to what he "could have been", and made some horrible mistakes along the way. When he went to Philly and admitted he was lazy and didn't do the things he should have in Atl, I thought, like most, he is becoming what he should have been with us, responsible, and going to put all that talent he has to work. Yet, though he had a great season last year, he didn't get them anywhere. This year, I've watched him, they still looked bad at times, and he hasn't been hurt all year, and has had some poor games. Of course there is ton's of reasons, the team not working as they should, drop balls, etc. I continue to point out, Vick has more talent then probably ANY QB in the league, but the guy isn't a leader. Crumpler said as much about Vick when he left, he lead with his talent, but people weren't jumping to follow the guy. It looks the same in Philly. My point has been just that. Tebow sucks so bad at times, yet, that team, follows him, they believe, for whatever reason. I think Tebow is horrible at the QB position at times, laughable even. Yet even I have to admit, he knows how to lead. He took a horrible team, that wasn't doing crap, simply losing, and look, they now all believe and talk about the kid like he is a 10 year vet, running a joke of an offense. That's where I see the biggest difference between him and Vick, and probably the ONLY difference, since Vick beats him with everything else. Yet talent alone won't always get you where you want. If that were true, Vick would have numerous rings, and yet, he doesn't. Vick want's to be a passing QB, that's what he has always wanted, and Reid gave him that. It's up to Vick to prove he can lead doing just that.

Vick led a subpar Philly team to a division championship when many had them as 6-10 5-11 team. Vick led subpar ATL to NFC championship games. You ever hear of leading by example? Not everyone us going to go out and give a rah rah speech. Remember the DEFENSE IN Denver is leading them not Tebow.


Oh and if you bring up College Vick led a far less talented to national championship game at VT and might had one the greatest single game performances in college football history.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

I think what JIm Brown is saying is that Vick should be Vick. Just as McNabb would have been more effective if he did not succumb to the idea that he had to be a complete pocket passer. I don't want to insert race into it, but these coaches have basically tried to reel in these black quarterbacks while they are letting Tebow grow and play the way he is most effective. The coaches are willing to change for him instead of vice versa.

its not them not being them
its the coaches that coach them not allowing them to be them and forcing them to play to the coaches strength instead of their own.

if they were rb's or wr's or something then i could see
but they're qb's and they have to run the offense designated by the coach

and the 2 examples are people being coached by the same person
so maybe its not them maybes its him....