I'm sorry to say it but, kobe is better than jordan!!

[cranrab]

jordan!!

Snaq: Big Aristotle, The Big Shaqtus,
Gil: Hibachi,
Patterson: Kobe Stopper
Chad Jonson: Ochocinco
He-Hate-Me

those all prove my point better than i ever could.

though gilbert arenas didn't come up with hibachi. brendan haywood did.

 

[LordSinister]

LeBron is good, but not great. Kobe is great, but not the best.

If Jordan had the supporting cast that each of these guys (especially Kobe) had .
y'all talk Kobe, but didn't the Celtics wax the Lakers with a squad that had Kobe, Odom, Gasol, Ariza, and Bynum 4-2?

No, more like Kobe, Odom Gasol Turriaf and Vujacic against 3 HOF players. Boston had a better team that year. Jordan never beat a team with superior talent. You could argue the Spurs, Blazers and Kings had better TEAMS than Kobe did.

Jordan NEVER had a team that talented. NEVER! Jordan won with Ho Grant, Pippen, Paxon, BJ Armstrong, Rodman, Kerr, Perdue, Wennington and other castoff bums. Now besides Pippen, who on The Bulls would you take over any of the aforementioned Lakers? ZERO! (please don't say Rodman).

Now imagine a lineup of Michael Jordan, Artest, Farmar, Gasol, Bynum, Odom, and Fisher? you don't think that they would win over 72 games and sweep the entire playoffs?


in the East alone, there are 3 teams under .500 who would make the playoffs.

Didn't Jordan make the playoffs with a sub .500 team?

And yeah, give me pippen over odom, Kerr or Armstrong over D-fish. Bynum hasn't proved shit yet. The only Laker that is better than his Bull counterpart is Pau over Kukoc. (sp)

Anyway, Kobe raped more bitches than Mike. Mike's bitch fucked mad ninjas in the league and took half!!

Kobe made Kwame "Cake" Brown better than Jordan ever did and Kobe snitched on Snaq, then Snaq got exposed for paying superhead and running up in Gils baby momma.

It's funny how most of you cats don't give the boy no respect at all. Cuzz sells more jerseys in China than Yao!! Y'all noyt knowing, the rest of the world see's him as the best and you hate it.

 

[LordSinister]

Re: jordan!!

those all prove my point better than i ever could.

though gilbert arenas didn't come up with hibachi. brendan haywood did.

Then who came up with cranrab?

 

[cranrab]

jordan!!

Wow. Maybe cranrab will tear you a new one for that statement.

i think some of those comparison based arguments lack integrity, so i try not to get involved in them.

you take the level of comp for what it is and was at the time.

the bulls competed against the best the WORSTern conference could offer up.

the fakers competed against the best the eastern conference could offer up.

no sense in bashing the comp. they are who they were.

with respect to the competition level argument, the league is weaker today than it ever has been. rules have been changed to manufacture scoring, and to be perfectly honest the talent pool is diluted. the skill levels drop every year.

the argument can be affirmatively made for bigger and stronger athletes in professional basketball today, but that doesn't speak to TALENT and SKILL.

GC and i went back and forth a bit about jerry west.

IMO jerry west could come out today and slay people. maybe not like he did in the 1960's, but the dude could flat out play. listed at 6'2, he had serious hops and a 6'7" wingspan. he played forward in college because he could take shots off the backboard (that form of goaltending was LEGAL back then). but those physical attributes don't speak to his scoring ability or his desire to win.

 

[cranrab]

jordan!!

Cuzz sells more jerseys in China than Yao!

that really doesn't mean shit, considering nobody else spends as much as tobe does on marketing themselves over there.

no knock on the hustle, just an easy explanation for that.

 

[Blizzunt]

Okay, where do I start?.....

1. I keep hearing the argument that Jordan won more with less talent around him. Then that must mean he was playing against less talent then what we see today. Let's get real here for a moment. Pipen and the rest of the supporting cast of the Bulls championship teams never took a night off. They balled their asses off. With that said, stop making it sound like MJ or Kobe or anybody else for the matter is winning shit by themselves.

2. I keep reading peoples arguments about how many rings MJ has or Kobe has. Well shit, did we all forget Bill Russell has almos twice as many as MJ...... So then Russell must clearly be the GOAT, if most rings make you the GOAT,.. right?!

3. I think when people compare the two, they're obviously comparing the shit they see on the court! Leave it at that! If you watch Kobe, and remember what Mike did on the court, if you're old enough, then how can you hate Kobe. Shit, I appreciate what that brother is doing on the court. He reminds me of Mike.

To finish my 200 cents , I hated MJ the 1st half of his career, being a Piston fan. But somewhere near his return after his 1st retirement, I started to appreciate the entertainment he brought to the game. He was never my favorite player in the league though. My favorite players were always Magic, Isiah, Dumars, Penny, Grant Hill, A.I., now Kobe. I love what Mike did for the game. And now I'm loving what Kobe is doing for the game!

That is all .............

 

[THE DRIZZY]

You young mofos need to STFU and ask your grandads, dads, and uncles this question. Kobe never had to play the physical Pistons, Knicks, and the Barkley 76ers teams from the late 80's-early 90's.

 

[LordSinister]

Re: jordan!!

i think some of those comparison based arguments lack integrity, so i try not to get involved in them.

you take the level of comp for what it is and was at the time.

the bulls competed against the best the WORSTern conference could offer up.

the fakers competed against the best the eastern conference could offer up.

no sense in bashing the comp. they are who they were.

with respect to the competition level argument, the league is weaker today than it ever has been. rules have been changed to manufacture scoring, and to be perfectly honest the talent pool is diluted. the skill levels drop every year.

the argument can be affirmatively made for bigger and stronger athletes in professional basketball today, but that doesn't speak to TALENT and SKILL.

GC and i went back and forth a bit about jerry west.

IMO jerry west could come out today and slay people. maybe not like he did in the 1960's, but the dude could flat out play. listed at 6'2, he had serious hops and a 6'7" wingspan. he played forward in college because he could take shots off the backboard (that form of goaltending was LEGAL back then). but those physical attributes don't speak to his scoring ability or his desire to win.

Well homie, at least you are honest and stick with your arguments. I think personally ABA doctor J with the afro would have shit all over the cats playing now and gave Jordan a run for his money. After the knees went bad, well.....

In my honest opinion, Kobe is in the top 10 to play the game. I know you put at least 3-4 other 2 guards ahead of him. I don't think if he won 4 straight and ended up with 8 you'd change your mind, so I just like having a lil fun with the back and forth.

Lake Show on Mine!!​

 

[LordSinister]

Re: jordan!!

that really doesn't mean shit, considering nobody else spends as much as tobe does on marketing themselves over there.

no knock on the hustle, just an easy explanation for that.

Smart man. Plus all those dunks over 7'5" Yao helped too.

 

[cranrab]

Re: jordan!!

several cats had career years working with the "garden weasel."

take those little red stars and put them next to the "minutes played" column.

end of mystery.

 

[LordSinister]

You young mofos need to STFU and ask your grandads, dads, and uncles this question. Kobe never had to play the physical Pistons, Knicks, and the Barkley 76ers teams from the late 80's-early 90's.

And Jordan never played against cats like the destroyer that would have straight fucked him up. Remember Boston clothes-lining Rambis? They would have kicked ninjas out of the league for doing that to MJ.

Hell, Dr. J choked the dog shit out of Larry Bird. Cuzz, y'all don't know anything about rough play. That bullshit the knicks did was because they fucking sucked ass and that's the only way they could compete. Hence the lack of jewelry.

 

[LordSinister]

Re: jordan!!

take those little red stars and put them next to the "minutes played" column.

end of mystery.

Yep, with Kobe on the court covering for these bitches, they got their game up.

If they are so great, why didn't they get more minutes (and more shots without Bean jacking 23 times a night) when they left?

They suck ass

end of mystery

 

[TheFuser]

I still haven't seen anyone make an excuse for Kobe for this...

Year Championship Team Finals MVP
1990-91 Chicago Bulls Michael Jordan
1991-92 Chicago Bulls Michael Jordan
1992-93 Chicago Bulls Michael Jordan
1993-94* Houston Rockets Hakeem Olajuwon
1994-95* Houston Rockets Hakeem Olajuwon
1995-96 Chicago Bulls Michael Jordan
1996-97 Chicago Bulls Michael Jordan
1997-98 Chicago Bulls Michael Jordan
1998-99* San Antonio Spurs Tim Duncan
1999-00* L.A. Lakers Shaquille O'Neal

* = Michael Jordan retired

Can Kobe say he owned a decade? Fuck no! Would you like to take a look at the '00 decade?


2000-01 Los Angeles Lakers Shaquille O'Neal
2001-02 Los Angeles Lakers Shaquille O'Neal
2002-03 San Antonio Spurs Tim Duncan
2003-04 Detroit Pistons Chauncey Billups
2004-05 San Antonio Spurs Tim Duncan
2005-06 Miami Heat Dwyane Wade
2006-07 San Antonio Spurs Tony Parker
2007-08 Boston Celtics Paul Pierce
2008-09 Los Angeles Lakers Kobe Bryant

Did Kobe own the 2000s like MJ owned the 90s? If so, what can you point to to prove your assertion?

LordSinister tried to use the "Jordan beat nobodies" line of thinking which flopped.

1990 - Bulls beat Lakers with Magic, AC Green, Elden Campbell, James Worthy. Call them what you want but Magic averaged 12.5 assists per game.
This team had two 50 year anniversary Top 50 players.

1991 - Bulls beat the Clyde Drexler, Terry Porter, Jerome Kersey, Cliff Robinson Portland Trailblazers. Try as you might to downplay that team, but ANYONE who actually watched the NBA back then will tell you they were far from slouches. Clyde = Top 50 of all Time (50 Year anniversary team)

1992 - Bulls beat the Phoenix Suns who featured Top 50 Charles Barkley, Dan Majerle, Tom Chambers, Kevin Johnson among others. Again, a team far from slouches as they finished the season 62-20.

1995 - Bulls beat the Seattle Supersonics who featured Gary Payton & Shawn Kemp

1996 & 1997 - Bulls beat the Utah Jazz featuring TWO Top 50 players of all time in John Stockton and Karl Malone.

Let's not play this game family. He beat QUALITY players and quality TEAMS. Some of the best to ever play the game. They have no rings because of this man. Can Kobe say this?

And then there's this, which no one has taken a stab at:

NO OTHER Guard won NBA MVP during the 90s. There were no better guards during ANY SEASON than MJ in the 90s.

1999-00 Shaquille O'Neal Los Angeles Lakers
1998-99 Karl Malone Utah
1997-98 Michael Jordan Chicago
1996-97 Karl Malone Utah
1995-96 Michael Jordan Chicago
1994-95 David Robinson San Antonio
1993-94 Hakeem Olajuwon Houston
1992-93 Charles Barkley Phoenix
1991-92 Michael Jordan Chicago
1990-91 Michael Jordan Chicago

AGAIN, something Kobe can't say.

Steve Nash (2004-05, 2005-06) has TWO MVPs during the past decade. Allen Iverson (00-01) has 1 as well as Lebron James (last year).


Any takers who will use actual FACTS and not emotional fandom. Please use stats, or facts to back up what you say. Thank you.

 

[cranrab]

Re: jordan!!

I know you put at least 300-400 other YMCA guards ahead of him. I don't think if he won 4 straight and ended up with 8 you'd change your mind

all it would take is ONE.

the best high school player to ever play in the NBA did it. but the garden weasel can't. why not?

 

[TheFuser]

Re: jordan!!

Says it all. Thanks to the poster who originally posted it.

 

[LordSinister]

The fact that they gave MVP's to two foreign white players that have 0 rings between them is all the "proof" I need. Snaq dominated the first 3 years of the decade, and hasn't since. How the fuck does Snaq only have 1 MVP?

c'mon son. stick to the teams and players.

judging that, Kobe has a chance to pass Jordan. If all you put up are stats, then Russell is top dog, cause the "stats" say 11 championships.

Apples and oranges.

Some cats are loved, others are hated.

Barry Bonds is the HR king and one of the best pure hitters the game has ever seen. Didn't stop him from being blackballed.

 

[chemist]

I am a Kobe fan. Always have been, just ask Cranrab.

Even if he won 6 rings, how could he be better than Jordan where he's lagging in all other major accomplishments?

Please explain, i'm just seriously interested in the rationalization where you'd come to that conclusion.

I not saying he would be but when he gets six is when I will start building my case for him. He still has four more prime years in him to make it a little closer.

We all know the regular season MVP is rigged for Lebron for at least the next 6 years so I wouldn't be surprised if Kobe doesn't get another one but it's very possible for him to get 2 more Finals MVP's.

[FLASH]http://www.youtube.com/v/30ElUmrpZEU[/FLASH]

 

[LordSinister]

Re: jordan!!

all it would take is ONE.

the best high school player to ever play in the NBA did it. but the garden weasel can't. why not?

Anyway, Lakers have the best record in the league right now. So eat it haters.

I wish the worst for all of you Laker haters!!

 

[TheFuser]

The fact that they gave MVP's to two foreign white players that have 0 rings between them is all the "proof" I need. Snaq dominated the first 3 years of the decade, and hasn't since. How the fuck does Snaq only have 1 MVP?

c'mon son. stick to the teams and players.

judging that, Kobe has a chance to pass Jordan. If all you put up are stats, then Russell is top dog, cause the "stats" say 11 championships.

Apples and oranges.

Some cats are loved, others are hated.

Barry Bonds is the HR king and one of the best pure hitters the game has ever seen. Didn't stop him from being blackballed.

statS not STAT. I've heard plenty of people say Russell should be considered best of all time. They actually have a strong argument. I disagree considering ALL the numbers though. I see what you're doing though. You can't make an argument for Kobe quantitatively so let's throw all the stats out since YOU can't use them. Nice try. If all Kobe stans didn't use this same method, it may have worked.

 

[LordSinister]

statS not STAT. I've heard plenty of people say Russell should be considered best of all time. They actually have a strong argument. I disagree considering ALL the numbers though. I see what you're doing though. You can't make an argument for Kobe quantitatively so let's throw all the stats out since YOU can't use them. Nice try. If all Kobe stans didn't use this same method, it may have worked.

You are acting as if I'm saying he's better than MJ. That is not what I am saying, have said or will say until he shows me more. What I am saying is he's close.

Take away the stats of his first 2-3 years as if he were in college like Jordan, his numbers are closer.

Jordan played his first few years as a straight ball hog. it was his team from day 1 so his stats are stacked. Take that into account.

Then, look at his numbers towards the end of his career. FG% dropped. Right now Kobe's is going up. he is getting better. The fool is playing smarter.

If he keeps this up, and ties Jordan at 6 or passes him at 7 with improving numbers shooting wise I will put him ahead of Jordan. That's a big if. if not, then no, he will have wasted too many years being young and dumb to catch up.

Speaking of young, you must be too young to0 remember how hated MJ was when he came into the league. He wasn't mr. clean then, he was treated like AI.

Time has a way of changing ones perspetives.

Anyway, the STAT that counts is winning, and Russell is the leader in the only 1 that counts.

 

[TheFuser]

You are acting as if I'm saying he's better than MJ. That is not what I am saying, have said or will say until he shows me more. What I am saying is he's close.

Take away the stats of his first 2-3 years as if he were in college like Jordan, his numbers are closer.

Jordan played his first few years as a straight ball hog. it was his team from day 1 so his stats are stacked. Take that into account.

Then, look at his numbers towards the end of his career. FG% dropped. Right now Kobe's is going up. he is getting better. The fool is playing smarter.

If he keeps this up, and ties Jordan at 6 or passes him at 7 with improving numbers shooting wise I will put him ahead of Jordan. That's a big if. if not, then no, he will have wasted too many years being young and dumb to catch up.

Speaking of young, you must be too young to0 remember how hated MJ was when he came into the league. He wasn't mr. clean then, he was treated like AI.

Time has a way of changing ones perspetives.

Anyway, the STAT that counts is winning, and Russell is the leader in the only 1 that counts.

● Jordan averaged five more points per game (30.1 PPG for MJ versus 25.1 for Kobe)
● Jordan averaged more rebounds (6.2 vs. 5.3)
● Jordan averaged more assists (5.3 vs. 4.6);
● Jordan shot a higher percentage from the field (49.7% vs. 45.5%)
● Jordan averaged more steals (2.3 vs. 1.5)
● Jordan averaged more blocks (0.8 vs. 0.6)
● Jordan averaged fewer turnovers (2.7 vs. 2.9)

Not young at all. I remember all the oldheads when I young telling me that MJ wouldn't be a good player. By 1993-94, those same oldheads were changing their tune. Saying he was comparable to AI is unfair. People thought MJ was arrogant. AI was way past that. He never said fuck practice. In fact, if you listen to the stories of Cartwright, Armstrong, Paxson, MJ was a brutal competitor in practice and took it very serious. He practiced how he played. AI he was not.

It's become quite apparent that your love for the Lakers is skewing your view in my opinion. I respect your standpoint though. This has been a great discussion.

 

[darkninja7000]

some of ya'll cats suck kobe's dick better than vanessa and even that white bitch he "raped".

 

[Ming Fei Hong]

I cant imagine being a Kobe Bryant fanatic knowing that he's reached his ceiling. Its gotta be tough knowing no matter what he does from here on out, no matter how many last second shots he hits to beat NBA doormats or how many titles he wins, he'll never be considered as good or better than MJ. The best he can hope for is being #2. Unfortunately when you copy & mimic something or someone and build your whole career off of biting shit they did you seldom are going to be seen as being better than the original. Kobe has proven he's better than his biological father was, but he'll never be as good as his real dad (who fathered his entire style) on the basketball court.

Oh... Really?

 

[chemist]

some of ya'll cats suck kobe's dick better than vanessa and even that white bitch he "raped".

What do you have to say about these Jordan fans in here.

 

[LordSinister]

● Jordan averaged five more points per game (30.1 PPG for MJ versus 28.2 for Kobe)
● Jordan averaged more rebounds (6.2 vs. 5.9)
● Jordan averaged more assists (5.3 vs. 5.2;
● Jordan shot a higher percentage from the field (49.7% vs. 45.8%)
● Jordan averaged more steals (2.3 vs. 1.7)
● Jordan averaged more blocks (0.8 vs. 0.6)
● Jordan averaged fewer turnovers (2.7 vs. 2.9)

Adjusted by removing Kobe's first 3 years (College)

Now, the reason why Kobe averages two less points than Jordan is because Jordan averaged 1.5 more field goal attempts per game than Kobe without his first three seasons.

This has been a great discussion.

Now it has, there are the stats you requested.

As far as AI......
Not comparing his work ethic, but the earrings,jewelry and attitude put off a lot of people. he became "like Mike" after he started winning.

 

[darkninja7000]

Oh... Really?

but guess what ming......... Jordan was/is better than Dr J. in almost every statistical category and as an all around player.....

 

[LordSinister]

What do you have to say about these Jordan fans in here.

They are sucking Mike off wayyyy more that Juanita and they didn't get half his chips for doing it.

 

[darkninja7000]

What do you have to say about these Jordan fans in here.

first of all I should have you on ignore.....

 

[LordSinister]

but guess what ming......... Jordan was/is better than Dr J. in almost every statistical category and as an all around player.....

Jordan never balled like this cuzz. Young Julius wasn't no punk.

 

[MonkeyBizness]

i love arguing this.

someone explain this:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=260506021

Suns run past Lakers, complete 3-1 series comeback

PHOENIX (AP) -- The Phoenix Suns went from the brink to a blowout, from the edge of elimination to one of the most impressive turnarounds in NBA playoff history.

So much for the nail-biting suspense of a Game 7. The fast, feisty Suns won in a 121-90 laugher over the listless Los Angeles Lakers on Saturday night.

Kobe Bryant scored 24 points of 8-of-16 shooting, but the rest of the Lakers starters were 17-for-50. Bryant scored only one point and took just three shots in the second half.

Kobe quit.

 

[Ming Fei Hong]

but guess what ming......... Jordan was/is better than Dr J. in almost every statistical category and as an all around player.....

First all that's bullshit. Either you're too young or too uninformed to know what Dr J meant to the game. Without Dr J, there's no MJ.

Secondly, your assertion that MJ is better than the father of his style, both negates the statement you made about Kobe never eclipsing the father of his style. And it also gives credence to the possibility of Kobe rising above MJ, the same way MJ rose above Dr J (to hear you tell it).

Either way, welcome to The Lake Show, cousin!

Jordan never balled like this cuzz. Young Julius wasn't no punk.

 

[cranrab]

I remember all the oldheads when I young telling me that MJ wouldn't be a good player.

that's unusual.

nobody knew what michael jordan would go on to accomplish later in life, but i can't recall a single soul saying he wouldn't be a good player.

those things were said about shaquille o'neal, but i don't remember anyone saying that about michael jordan.

 

[Project313]

Jordan has 6 finals MVPs Kobe has 1. . . .Men lie women lie numbers dont

 

[darkninja7000]

First all that's bullshit. Either you're too young or too uninformed to know what Dr J meant to the game. Without Dr J, there's no MJ.

Secondly, your assertion that MJ is better than the father of his style, both negates the statement you made about Kobe never eclipsing the father of his style. And it also gives credence to the possibility of Kobe rising above MJ, the same way MJ rose above Dr J (to hear you tell it).

Either way, welcome to The Lake Show, cousin!

i'm probably older than you. with that said I had the privilege of watching the good doctor play in the ABA let alone the NBA. with that said... I'm not disputing that Dr J paved the way for MJ.... but at the same time only a blind man or complete jackass would say that Jordan did not ascend above Erving. As for Kobe.. while that may happen... the key word is may. niggaz in here talkin about he's the GOAT now... which is utter bullshit. and all it shows is stanism and cock slurpin


MJ
Honors: Six-time NBA champion (1991-93, 1996-98); MVP (1988, '91, '92, '96, '98); 10-time All-NBA First Team (1987-93, 1996-98); All-NBA Second Team (1985); Defensive Player of the Year (1988); Nine-time All-Defensive First Team (1988-93, 1996-98); Rookie of the Year (1985); 14-time All-Star; All-Star MVP (1988, '96, '98); One of 50 Greatest Players in NBA History ('96); Olympic gold medalist (1984, '92).


Dr J
* 1× NBA Champion (1983)
* 1× NBA MVP (1981)
* 11× NBA All-Star (1977–1987)
* 5× All-NBA First Team Selection (1978, 1980–1983)
* 2× All-NBA Second Team Selection (1977, 1984)
* 2× NBA All-Star Game MVP (1977, 1983)
* 1× J. Walter Kennedy Citizenship Award (1983)
* NBA's 50th Anniversary All-Time Team
* NBA 35th Anniversary Team
* 2× ABA Champion (1974, 1976)
* 3× ABA MVP (1974–1976)
* 5× ABA All-Star (1972–1976)
* 2× ABA Playoffs MVP (1974, 1976)
* 4× All-ABA First Team (1973–1976)
* 1× All-ABA Second Team (1972)
* 1× All-ABA Defensive First Team
* 1972 ABA All-Rookie First Team



.........................

 

[rebell4life]

Man dude has really lost his mind...Jordan is proably the best ever.......