Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - Kobe Bryant is a clutch player

[cranrab]

Re: tobe is SOOOOO clutch! SCIENCE

Vince shot 12 for 33 (i believe) yesterday. Is it his fault they lost? You cant blame just one person, cause its not like theres only person playing defense.

SOMEtimes, you can't blame just one person. but SOMEtimes you can. it's just simple mathematics.

in taking 33 FGAs, and missing 21 of them, as a single player you are SOLELY responsible for HANDING THE BALL over to the other team at least 15+ times in one game. that is unacceptable and inexcusable. had vince had any TOs that night, he would have been approaching tobe-like levels of stink.

with 15+ changes of possession COMING FROM A SINGLE PLAYER, is it any wonder at all that indiana was able to win that game? let me remind you that the margin of victory was only 2 points! that means that indiana only needed to convert JUST ONE of those extra possessions in order to win the game.

from steve kerr on vince carter's performance last night:

Vince Carter – After taking criticism for a jumper-filled, 12-for-33 night in a Game 1 loss to the Indiana Pacers, Carter played a much more controlled, efficient game in the New Jersey Nets' 90-75 win. Carter shot 12-of-20 and made eight of nine free throws in scoring 33 points as New Jersey evened the series at 1-1. Carter was more aggressive in getting to the rim and the paint area, putting much more pressure on the Pacers' defense than he did in Game 1.

see the difference? fewer FGAs. higher efficiency. 15 point margin of victory.

 

[cranrab]

Re: tobe is SOOOOO clutch! SCIENCE

You cant blame just one person, cause its not like theres only person playing defense.

SOMEtimes you can. of course it doesn't sound good because BASKETBALL is a team game and it's not diplomatic to do so, but there's no escaping FACT.

another example.

lebron james missed 18 FGAs , had 10 TOs , and 5 PFs. that's 25+ changes of possession coming from a SINGLE PLAYER. TRULY a tobe-like performance.

same deal. if ONE PLAYER is SOLELY RESPONSIBLE for HANDING THE BALL OVER to the opponent, who is to blame? that margin of victory was ONLY 5 points! that means washington only needed to convert 2 or 3 of those extra 25+ possessions to win that game.

vince carter had his chance for retribution and made the best of it. let's see how lebron james responds to the washington wizards throwing down the gauntlet on D.

 

[cranrab]

Re: tobe is SOOOOO clutch! SCIENCE

Vince shot 12 for 33 (i believe) yesterday. Is it his fault they lost? You cant blame just one person, cause its not like theres only person playing defense.

and a third example, for fairness.

the suns and fakers entered Q4 tied. so you have a 12 minute game.

tobe had 8 missed FGAs, 1 PF, and 1 missed FTA.

almost TEN changes of possession coming from A SINGLE PLAYER in 12 minutes of basketball. and a coach can't point a finger?

 

[Dolemite]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

cranrab- cook must have fucked jeannie and wiped his dick off on kobe's jersey cuz that dude is on some punishment bench time

kenny smith is a faggot which makes luke walton a transexxual

luke fuckin sucks - im bout to stop watchin the lakers until there is a shakeup or somethin shit is pathetic

@ hands of stone - I didnt think a person that big and strong could take it to the hole so weak lmao

tobe = self absorption personified he's not even smart enough to realize he'd be greater by building up his teammates - who the fuck is devin green?

this season looks like a fuckin waste of time

wtf is luke walton supposed to be good at again? d'in up toine seems like the only shit he's good at besides shootin 1-9 from 3 or some similar shit

damn how things have changed lol

 

[Dolemite]

Re: tobe is SOOOOO clutch! SCIENCE

and a third example, for fairness.

the suns and fakers entered Q4 tied. so you have a 12 minute game.

tobe had 8 missed FGAs, 1 PF, and 1 missed FTA.

almost TEN changes of possession coming from A SINGLE PLAYER in 12 minutes of basketball. and a coach can't point a finger?

he had an off night

you guys are gonna have to focus on hating armenians or something if Toby doesn't remember to be selfish

The Lakers played like a real team for the first time tonight. It wasn't as obvious a new thing to them as it was in Gm2 because of the Sons pushing the ball hard and fast everytime they touched it but their interior weakness and lack of intensity outside of Raja was the death of them

are you in shock ? seems like everyone is
i thought it would happen in the summer or somethin

 

[cranrab]

Re: tobe is SOOOOO clutch! SCIENCE

in taking 33 FGAs, and missing 21 of them, as a single player you are SOLELY responsible for HANDING THE BALL over to the other team at least 15+ times in one game. that is unacceptable and inexcusable. had vince had any TOs that night, he would have been approaching tobe-like levels of stink.

with 15+ changes of possession COMING FROM A SINGLE PLAYER, is it any wonder at all that indiana was able to win that game? let me remind you that the margin of victory was only 2 points! that means that indiana only needed to convert JUST ONE of those extra possessions in order to win the game.

from steve kerr on vince carter's performance last night:

Vince Carter – After taking criticism for a jumper-filled, 12-for-33 night in a Game 1 loss to the Indiana Pacers, Carter played a much more controlled, efficient game in the New Jersey Nets' 90-75 win. Carter shot 12-of-20 and made eight of nine free throws in scoring 33 points as New Jersey evened the series at 1-1. Carter was more aggressive in getting to the rim and the paint area, putting much more pressure on the Pacers' defense than he did in Game 1.

see the difference? fewer FGAs. higher efficiency. 15 point margin of victory.

vince carter 9-15 FGAs, 7 assists, 6 steals... EFFICIENT, not lopsided... guess what happened? a WIN... no surprise... nets 2, pacers 2...

funny thing is, if tobe and vince carter had similar numbers on an evening, and BOTH teams lost, and i commented on it, it'd ONLY be the batty boy captain-save-a-queers rushing in here to defend tobe.

 

[cranrab]

Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

william parker with the HUGE 3 to cut the lead to 2 with 8 seconds left, and william parker with the HUGE steal that lead to the tying FG.

EDIT: i forgot to add fighting off tim thomas IN THE POST on isolation...

yeah, he sucks...

 

[Makkonnen]

kobe sends it OT and hits the game winner with less than second

not very clutch

 

[SpiritualPorn]

kobe sends it OT and hits the game winner with less than second

not very clutch

He was clutch today....thats for sure.

The MVP STEVE NASH was not.

Props to Kobe and the Lakers

 

[Makkonnen]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

william parker with the HUGE 3 to cut the lead to 2 with 8 seconds left, and william parker with the HUGE steal that lead to the tying FG.

EDIT: i forgot to add fighting off tim thomas IN THE POST on isolation...

yeah, he sucks...

using the logic constantly on display here

if smush didnt shoot 2-12 from the field we wouldn't have needed Kobe to be clutch and send it to OT or hit the game winner with less than a second


im glad smush stepped up though - his defense is real good at times other times he stands around and watches guys like tony parker run by him and score
his timeouts on playing smart are why i talk shit about him but theres no denying that he has crazy ups and could be a great player if he learned to be consistent- i wonder what training offseason with Kobe would do for him

 

[cranrab]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

using the logic constantly on display here

if smush didnt shoot 2-12 from the field we wouldn't have needed Kobe to be clutch and send it to OT or hit the game winner with less than a second

partially correct. if william parker hadn't shot so poorly (even though 12 attempts is FAR from unreasonable), the fakers (not tobe) wouldn't have had AS DIFFICULT a time...

tobe had 2 buzzer beaters, but the CRITICAL plays to me were made by william parker (created the TO on nash) and lamar odom (who picked up nash after euro vujacic lost him) to force nash to pick up his dribble (and got the assist from luke walton) to tie him up...

im glad smush stepped up though - his defense is real good at times other times he stands around and watches guys like tony parker run by him and score

william parker's penetration D is horrible... his perimeter on ball D is terrific because he has quick hands and long arms... william parker continues to impress me as a fighter because even though he occasionally loses, he is FIGHTING like a MAN down on the blocks against height and weight disadvantages...

his timeouts on playing smart are why i talk shit about him but theres no denying that he has crazy ups and could be a great player if he learned to be consistent- i wonder what training offseason with Kobe would do for him

i think the young man is doing just fine... william parker is hungry and a game competitor who has shown THROUGHOUT the season that he can perform...

on another note, anybody got steve nash's postgame quotes?

 

[Makkonnen]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

i posted nashs remarks in another thread- he said they lost and he didnt have beef with the refs - he thought diaw called a timeout before the jumpball thing


dantoni was laughin not to cry- both said this loss was a tough one

honestly i think theyre cooked

 

[Havoc]

Re: tobe is SOOOOO clutch! SCIENCE

well, i'm not entirely convinced that the heat could beat detroit. but if those 2 clubs did meet in the ECF, i'd be rooting for the heat. in a heat v. pistons matchup, antoine walker and james posey would be the deciding factors.

IMO, both of those players are careless and thoughtless shooters. and those are 2 HUGE liabilities against the detroit pistons because the pistons play GOOD team defense, can rebound the ball, and MOST OF ALL, play ball control basketball.

detroit reduces the number of possessions for the opposition, so each possession becomes extremely valuable. even if antoine walker and james posey only took a few bad shots each, those possessions would be enough to carry the pistons to victory in a sub 100 point game.

james posey should not be allowed to shoot the ball unless it is an open 3 off a double, or finishing in transition. and antoine walker makes me cringe every time he touches the damn ball.

those 2 players aside, how can you NOT like the chances of a team with shaquille o'neal on it? his performances against detroit speak for themselves.

The impossible has happened. I have agreed 100% with you on something. I must now die.

 

[TrojansFan]

It's NO Myth... That muthafucka is CLUTCH!!!

I'm guessing you feel real stupid right about now for creating this thread

 

[Havoc]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

partially correct. if william parker hadn't shot so poorly (even though 12 attempts is FAR from unreasonable), the fakers (not tobe) wouldn't have had AS DIFFICULT a time...

tobe had 2 buzzer beaters, but the CRITICAL plays to me were made by william parker (created the TO on nash) and lamar odom (who picked up nash after euro vujacic lost him) to force nash to pick up his dribble (and got the assist from luke walton) to tie him up...



william parker's penetration D is horrible... his perimeter on ball D is terrific because he has quick hands and long arms... william parker continues to impress me as a fighter because even though he occasionally loses, he is FIGHTING like a MAN down on the blocks against height and weight disadvantages...



i think the young man is doing just fine... william parker is hungry and a game competitor who has shown THROUGHOUT the season that he can perform...

on another note, anybody got steve nash's postgame quotes?

The part is bold made me laugh. Smush is definitely a player that plays the games to win and not just because he's getting paid for them. However, despite his physical prowess (speed, ups, etc.), he's in dire need of some off-season practice (maybe with Kobe?) to improve his game.

Not to take anything away from him, he made some critical plays tonight, although when you're shooting 2-12, something's bound to go right for a change.

 

[xfactor]

It's NO Myth... That muthafucka is CLUTCH!!!

I'm guessing you feel real stupid right about now for creating this thread

You're right its no myth because its the truth he isnt. For me to admit Bryant is a clutch player, he would have to make more game winning shots or shots in the clutch than miss and two makes in the clutch today does not discount all of the others he has missed over the years... hell even the ones he missed in Game 1 when he went 1-4 FGA in the final 56 seconds. Lakers haters such as yourself must be suffering from dementia because you certainly have selective memories and repeat the same sob stories

 

[cranrab]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

i posted nashs remarks in another thread- he said they lost and he didnt have beef with the refs - he thought diaw called a timeout before the jumpball thing


dantoni was laughin not to cry- both said this loss was a tough one

honestly i think theyre cooked

i finally saw some of nash's remarks... classy in losing...

coach d'antoni was shellshocked... i watched his ENTIRE time at the podium and he actually said they WON the game TWICE... and i don't mean regulation and OT, i mean TWO separate occasions in response to 2 different reporters...

i have to agree about the suns' position... it takes a tremendous mental toll on an opponent to be beaten in this fashion... the spurs and kings are examples after the robert horry and derek fisher FGs...

 

[cranrab]

Re: tobe is SOOOOO clutch! SCIENCE

The impossible has happened. I have agreed 100% with you on something. I must now die.

LOL!

OK, but promise me 1 thing... when you DO decide to go, could you do us all a favor and take the armenian with you?

 

[cranrab]

Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe Bryant is a clutch player

The part is bold made me laugh. Smush is definitely a player that plays the games to win and not just because he's getting paid for them.

i think a lot of fakers fans need to put william parker's performance in perspective... prior to this season, he'd only had 82 games in this league... and 1 league overseas with some sheepherders...

william parker played WELL this season. he's had some highs and lows for sure, but who wouldn't, playing in the same backcourt as bizarro?

However, despite his physical prowess (speed, ups, etc.), he's in dire need of some off-season practice (maybe with Kobe?) to improve his game.

but who couldn't stand to improve his/her game in the offseason?

and all kidding aside, what SKILLS do you really believe tobe could teach william parker? teach anyone for that matter?

Not to take anything away from him, he made some critical plays tonight, although when you're shooting 2-12, something's bound to go right for a change.

you know, i let makk/dolemite off the hook on that one... true enough, william parker didn't have a great shooting night, but he only had 1 TO in 41 minutes...

i could've reminded him that the fakers wouldn't have been in such a poor position had tobe not made 7 TOs in 38 minutes...

 

[cranrab]

Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

You're right its no myth because its the truth he isnt. For me to admit Bryant is a clutch player, he would have to make more game winning shots or shots in the clutch than miss and two makes in the clutch today does not discount all of the others he has missed over the years... hell even the ones he missed in Game 1 when he went 1-4 FGA in the final 56 seconds. Lakers haters such as yourself must be suffering from dementia because you certainly have selective memories and repeat the same sob stories

on an interesting side note, i don't recall the alleged bgol BASKETBALL fans talking about brent barry's clutch shot in game 2 of the spurs/kings series...

if barry doesn't sink that 3 from the corner, we're looking at 3-1 kings...

 

[SpiritualPorn]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

on an interesting side note, i don't recall the alleged bgol BASKETBALL fans talking about brent barry's clutch shot in game 2 of the spurs/kings series...

if barry doesn't sink that 3 from the corner, we're looking at 3-1 kings...

These are some real children on here

All season long we have been saying Kobe should be playing like this and when he does the team looks good.

All season we have been saying the other players on the team need more touches.

The Kobe Nash's (nut huggher fans that are jealous they couldn't grab Kobe's dick like Nash) take every objective analysis that criticizes Kobe and calls it hate. Kobe and Phil must have been reading this board cause it sure looks like Kobe has the point.

It the press confrence yesterday after the game Kobe actually said ODOM CARRIED THE TEAM TO SET UP HIS SHOT. The same Odom that Kobe fans said sucked just three weeks ago.

Kobe was clutch yesterday. Played great team ball.

Props

 

[xfactor]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

on an interesting side note, i don't recall the alleged bgol BASKETBALL fans talking about brent barry's clutch shot in game 2 of the spurs/kings series...

if barry doesn't sink that 3 from the corner, we're looking at 3-1 kings...

C,

Its really unexplainable. You'd think most Wobe fans were teenage white girls cheering at a Backstreet Boys concert the way they continue to hype Wobe but downplay the rest of the team. It's sickening IMO.

And that was a great shot by Barry... Not to mention a huge momentum killer against SAC but since it wasnt played on sportscenter 50 times during a 1 hour show, I guess it wasnt enough to brainwash the drones. Hell, sportscenter could hype up anything and some of these cats would follow it mindlessly.

But just as ESPN will hype you up, they'll bring you down. I remember when they ripped USC up like a piece of paper after they lost to Texas after proclaiming them as the best football dynasty since the 2000-2004 Patriots.

 

[TimRock]

Well if you ask me, I say THE WHOLE ENTIRE TEAM played well. Luke, Smush, Odom, Kwame, Sasha, everybody. They all played major parts in winning this game. I must admit though, when kobe got that ball after the jump ball, i was wishing he would just drive to the whole. But Luke and Smuch had the major key plays in that game. Good win for the Lakers, a real confidence booster. And Nash with those two critical turnovers The first really wasnt his fault, because Smush came from his blind side. The second one, he should not have expected them to foul him. Of course they are gonna go for the steal first, thats the way it always goes. He should know better than that.

 

[TrojansFan]

You're right its no myth because its the truth he isnt. For me to admit Bryant is a clutch player, he would have to make more game winning shots or shots in the clutch than miss and two makes in the clutch today does not discount all of the others he has missed over the years... hell even the ones he missed in Game 1 when he went 1-4 FGA in the final 56 seconds. Lakers haters such as yourself must be suffering from dementia because you certainly have selective memories and repeat the same sob stories

Laker hater? I've been a fan for 25+ years! And remember I guaranteed you the Lakers would not get swept after you predicted they would.

You obviously don't know what the definition of a clutch player is! It doesn't get any more clutch than Bryant's performance yesterday in a pivotal playoff game...sinking the game tying shot with .07 sec left in regulation and the game winner in OT. Did Bryant win this game byhimself? Hell No! But when the game was on the line and they needed 1 shot they went to Bryant not Odom (who did have a helluva game).

Nobody can make every shot that they take, but you bring up game 1 as your example of not being clutch? None of those 4 shots were potential game winners and 3 of the 4 were long ass desperation 3s including a 43 footer! You are really reaching here trying to prove a point that you are way off base on and you sound stupid!!!

 

[cranrab]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

These are some real children on here

All season long we have been saying Kobe should be playing like this and when he does the team looks good.

All season we have been saying the other players on the team need more touches.

yeah, the list is long...

all the fakers not named tobe suck... wait. no they don't

tobe needs to shoot more to give the fakers a chance to win... wait. no he doesn't

tobe needs to score 40 every night for the fakers to have a chance to win... wait. no he doesn't

tobe defends the other team's best scorer night in and night out... wait. no he doesn't

and on, and on and on...

The Kobe Nash's (nut huggher fans that are jealous they couldn't grab Kobe's dick like Nash) take every objective analysis that criticizes Kobe and calls it hate. Kobe and Phil must have been reading this board cause it sure looks like Kobe has the point.

ex-fakers big man and current fakers radio announcer mychal thompson has been reading this board since game 2 of this series...

 

[cranrab]

Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

Well if you ask me, I say THE WHOLE ENTIRE TEAM played well. Luke, Smush, Odom, Kwame, Sasha, everybody. They all played major parts in winning this game.

given the chance, these players can produce...

I must admit though, when kobe got that ball after the jump ball, i was wishing he would just drive to the whole.

naw... that would've been a mistake... tobe did the right thing: he went to his comfort zone and took a comfortable shot...

one of the reasons i hate euros is that their game has little or no improvisation... tobe is the same way... his pet move since childhood has been the baseline turnaround jumper from 15-18... when he is guarded well, he still goes back to that shot as a crutch to boost his O... about 5 seasons ago, he rotated that spot on the floor (think of the rim as the center of your compass) out to the elbows...

But Luke and Smuch had the major key plays in that game. Good win for the Lakers, a real confidence booster.

lamar odom is still the fakers' MVP to me (and i'm not a fan of the pot head)...
7-16 FGAs, 11-14 FTAs, 8 rebounds, 5 assists, 49 minutes...

for the series, shooting over 50% FGAs, TEAM leader in rebounds (more than 4+ per game MORE than the next closest player), TEAM leader in blocked shots...

And Nash with those two critical turnovers The first really wasnt his fault, because Smush came from his blind side. The second one, he should not have expected them to foul him. Of course they are gonna go for the steal first, thats the way it always goes. He should know better than that.

BOTH TOs were his fault. for good or bad, a good PG is ALWAYS responsible for the ball, EVEN AFTER it leaves his hands... i do believe that boris diaw was attempting to call a time out, but what's done is done... that game is over. game 5 is going to be a good test of character... if the fakers are ready to become WINNERS, they will have to close out on a beat down opponent... if the suns are WINNERS, they will have to have to fight with their backs to the wall...

 

[cranrab]

Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

C,

Its really unexplainable. You'd think most Wobe fans were teenage white girls cheering at a Backstreet Boys concert the way they continue to hype Wobe but downplay the rest of the team. It's sickening IMO.

inexplicable? nah. the cakeboy nation is just waiving their rainbow flags right now... let 'em be. this is a big year for them, with brokeback mountain doing so well at the box office and all...

sickening? a little. especially after you see the geeked up batty boys making 2 page posts on bgol because now tobe is PLAYING LIKE AN AVERAGE ROLE PLAYER.

tobe's current playoffs averages:

44 minutes per game, 44% FGAs, 18% 3pt FGAs, 78% FTAs, 6 rebounds, 6 assists, 1.25 steals, .25 blocks, 4.5 TOs, 3.5 PFs, 23 points per game.

andres nocioni's current playoffs averages:

40 minutes per game, 54% FGAs, 46% 3pt FGAs, 89% FTAs, 9.5 rebounds, 2 assists, 1.25 steals, .5 blocks, 2.25 TOs, 3.3 PFs, 23 points per game

vince carter's current playoffs averages:

41 minutes per game, 46% FGAs, 22% 3pt FGAs, 79% FTAs, 7 rebounds, 5 assists, 2.75 steals, .75 blocks, 1.25 TOs, 3.3 PFs, 29 points per game

kirk hinrich's current playoffs averages:

38 minutes per game, 45% FGAs, 47% 3pt FGAs, 86% FTAs, 3 rebounds, 9 assists, 1.25 steals, .25 blocks, 3.75 TOs, 4.5 PFs, 23 points per game

bonzi wells' current playoffs averages:

40 minutes per game, 58% FGAs, 50% 3pt FGAs, 60% FTAs, 12 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 steal, .5 blocks, 2.75 TOs, 4.3 PFs, 21 points per game

ben gordon's current playoffs averages:

43 minutes per game, 46% FGAs, 43% 3pt FGAs, 68% FTAs, 3.5 rebounds, 3 assists, 1 steal, 0 blocks, 2.5 TOs, 2 PFs, 24 points per game

but they don't hear me though.

funny thing is, if tobe's getting all this pub for just scratching AVERAGE now, it tells you how STRAIGHT SHITTY he was playing before.

on top of that, tobe fans are saying 'hallelujah' and 'amen' because tobe only NOW (MIGHT have) learned 10 years into his career that basketball is more fun when you play as part of the TEAM?

 

[TimRock]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

ex-fakers big man and current fakers radio announcer mychal thompson has been reading this board since game 2 of this series...

What has he been saying about the things posted on here?

 

[TimRock]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

on an interesting side note, i don't recall the alleged bgol BASKETBALL fans talking about brent barry's clutch shot in game 2 of the spurs/kings series...

if barry doesn't sink that 3 from the corner, we're looking at 3-1 kings...

Or what about the Bucks blasting the pistons? Has anyone even been watching this series? They have no one that can stop Michael Redd.

 

[TrojansFan]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

inexplicable? nah. the cakeboy nation is just waiving their rainbow flags right now... let 'em be. this is a big year for them, with brokeback mountain doing so well at the box office and all...

sickening? a little. especially after you see the geeked up batty boys making 2 page posts on bgol because now tobe is PLAYING LIKE AN AVERAGE ROLE PLAYER.

tobe's current playoffs averages:

44 minutes per game, 44% FGAs, 18% 3pt FGAs, 78% FTAs, 6 rebounds, 6 assists, 1.25 steals, .25 blocks, 4.5 TOs, 3.5 PFs, 23 points per game.

andres nocioni's current playoffs averages:

40 minutes per game, 54% FGAs, 46% 3pt FGAs, 89% FTAs, 9.5 rebounds, 2 assists, 1.25 steals, .5 blocks, 2.25 TOs, 3.3 PFs, 23 points per game

vince carter's current playoffs averages:

41 minutes per game, 46% FGAs, 22% 3pt FGAs, 79% FTAs, 7 rebounds, 5 assists, 2.75 steals, .75 blocks, 1.25 TOs, 3.3 PFs, 29 points per game

kirk hinrich's current playoffs averages:

38 minutes per game, 45% FGAs, 47% 3pt FGAs, 86% FTAs, 3 rebounds, 9 assists, 1.25 steals, .25 blocks, 3.75 TOs, 4.5 PFs, 23 points per game

bonzi wells' current playoffs averages:

40 minutes per game, 58% FGAs, 50% 3pt FGAs, 60% FTAs, 12 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 steal, .5 blocks, 2.75 TOs, 4.3 PFs, 21 points per game

ben gordon's current playoffs averages:

43 minutes per game, 46% FGAs, 43% 3pt FGAs, 68% FTAs, 3.5 rebounds, 3 assists, 1 steal, 0 blocks, 2.5 TOs, 2 PFs, 24 points per game

but they don't hear me though.

funny thing is, if tobe's getting all this pub for just scratching AVERAGE now, it tells you how STRAIGHT SHITTY he was playing before.

on top of that, tobe fans are saying 'hallelujah' and 'amen' because tobe only NOW (MIGHT have) learned 10 years into his career that basketball is more fun when you play as part of the TEAM?

Average role player? The man is leading his team in scoring (as he did all season) and now he is leading his team in assists! Nobody else you posted up there can say that. In fact nobody else in the playoffs can say that! He is far from average and definitely not a role player. You've been crying for him to play more team ball all year, now when he does and has his team looking like legit championship contenders, you say he is an average role player. SMH at the jealousy!

So if what he is doing is average, what kind of numbers does he need to put up to be a superstar in your mind?

 

[cranrab]

Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

You've been crying for him to play more team ball all year,

crying? more like TALKING SENSE. and for good reason? haven't the fakers been more successful? haven't the fakers personnel flourished?

now when he does and has his team looking like legit championship contenders

i LOVE fans... god bless you all, even the bandwagoneers like you holding the reins...

you say he is an average role player. SMH at the jealousy!

oh, i forgot. BASED ON CURRENT PLAYOFFS PERFORMANCES, kirk hinrich, andres nocioni and bonzi wells are NBA SUPERSTARS too. no, LEGENDS also. no, THE BEST TO EVER PLAY THE GAME as well. or at least they look like it.

So if what he is doing is average,

well which one is it? tobe is, or is not average? pick one and stick with it. i already said tobe IS average. but you're not content with that, are you?

what kind of numbers does he need to put up to be a superstar in your mind?

PROOF of you being a 100% fanboy... tobe wouldn't have to score a single point, or even take a single shot to be a superstar. all he'd have to do is PLAY SMART and CONTRIBUTE... see lamar odom for examples...

EDIT: people steady down chauncey billups because he plays as PART OF A TEAM, but if tobe does it, he's the MVP.

 

[cranrab]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

Or what about the Bucks blasting the pistons? Has anyone even been watching this series? They have no one that can stop Michael Redd.

sadly, michael redd can stop michael redd...

coach stotts seems to believe that inserting toni kukoc into the lineup relieved some defensive pressure off of michael redd...

i disagree, but let's see what happens...

 

[TimRock]

Bryant seizes every moment
Kevin Modesti, Columnist



I was about to call this Kobe Bryant's finest moment.

Which is crazy, and not principally because I'd be rating it higher than the three NBA championships he's won with the Lakers, higher than his 81-point night, higher than all his other heroics.

It's crazy because I'd have to figure out which of Sunday afternoon's moments we're talking about.

Was it the moment when Bryant saved Luke Walton's jump-ball tap at the left sideline near midcourt, dribbled down and hit the 15-foot shot from the right corner of the lane as the overtime clock struck 0.0, sending Staples Center into throbbing celebration of a 99-98 Lakers victory over the Phoenix Suns and a 3-1 L.A. lead in this first-to-four playoff series?

Was it the moment, at the end of the fourth quarter, when Bryant took a pass from Devean George after Smush Parker stripped Steve Nash, and sank a high-looping layup over two defenders from the right baseline bored straight down through the net at 0.7 to force the overtime?

Was it the moment, during the Suns' timeout after the layup, when Bryant squeezed Parker's face in his hands and told the young guard who'd just made a 3-point basket and game-changing steal that "This is all you"?

Was it the moment, after it was over, when Bryant spread credit around the locker room the way a leader does, pointing out the contributions of Parker and Luke Walton and Devean George and Lamar Odom, and somehow working Laron Profit into his comments even though Profit hasn't played since January?

Or was it the moment, later in the postgame press conference, when Bryant talked about how much fun it is to share this unlikely victory with teammates who've experienced nothing like it and a city that expected nothing close?

For a while there, it sounded as if this was more fun for him than winning those titles.

"Whaaaaat?" Bryant said when he was asked if he'd go that far. "This is a big step for us in the maturation process," he said, meaning it's just a step back to the title-contending level.

But if you were in the building at 11th and Figueroa on Sunday, you know how different this felt from all of Bryant's other signature moments, good and bad. You know that this Kobe being everything his fans and his critics have ever wanted him to be.

His finest moment? It's not so crazy.

"This was the most fun shot I've ever hit," Bryant said, and I think he was talking about the end-of-overtime moment. "Because it's us, it's us and the city of L.A.

"The difference is, in the past, people expected us to win these games, so hitting a shot was almost a relief.

"This is just so much more fun, playing together, playing as a team."

There were all those playoff years when it was Kobe and Shaquille O'Neal fighting to see who got credit for the Lakers' success. Now there's this playoff year when it's Kobe straining to see how much credit he can share.

"I'm sure people will be replaying the (game-tying) shot," Bryant said, "but what people must understand is that it would not have even been possible it if was not for Smush Parker's great play defensively. There's a guy who struggled all night, stuck with it and made a huge defensive play. Then Luke Walton making a big defensive play (forcing the jump ball with Nash in overtime), Devean George coming off the bench making big shots. Lamar basically put us on his back and carried us all the way to the end of the game.

"I just hit a 15-footer (to end it)."

For most of the day, it was more than Bryant could do to just hit a 15-footer. He sat out 11 minutes of the second quarter with three fouls. He passed up a lot of shots because of double-teams and passed up a few more despite having one-on-ones. He had only 16 points going into the final sequence in regulation. Nash was winning this battle of the MVP hopefuls, even though the Phoenix guard was playing with a stiff back.

With 12.6 seconds to go in regulation, the Lakers trailed by five, and fans were heading to the parking lots. Staples Center boss and L.A. Kings governor Tim Leiweke left his courtside seat, only to return after Parker's 3-pointer and Bryant's layup tied it.

With 15.7 seconds to go in overtime, the Lakers trailed by three, and fans were leaving. Leiweke walked out again, and apparently missed Kobe's drive to make it a one-point game and jumper to win it.

Choose your Kobe highlight Sunday.

The one shot. Or the other shot. Or any of the team-building statements.

His finest moment? Now, I think any of them might have been. And that all of them, put together, really are.

Kevin Modesti's column appears in the Daily News three days a week.

Thoughts?

 

[SpiritualPorn]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

Average role player? The man is leading his team in scoring (as he did all season) and now he is leading his team in assists! Nobody else you posted up there can say that. In fact nobody else in the playoffs can say that! He is far from average and definitely not a role player. You've been crying for him to play more team ball all year, now when he does and has his team looking like legit championship contenders, you say he is an average role player. SMH at the jealousy!

So if what he is doing is average, what kind of numbers does he need to put up to be a superstar in your mind?

Those numbers are suprising though.

I get Cran's point though........Before we start calling him Jordan lets see how he does year two in the playoffs.

We really don't want Cran to put up Jordan vs. Kobe playoff stats do we?

I was glad to see Kobe do well yesterday........he is not Jordan yet..

72-10 and six titles is hard to beat


Michael Reed.......can he do it twice?

Sac town....Can they win?

Will the refs will the Cavs and Bulls to victory?

Let the games begin

 

[TrojansFan]

Re: Dispelling a Myth: Part 1 - tobe is a clutch player

Those numbers are suprising though.

I get Cran's point though........Before we start calling him Jordan lets see how he does year two in the playoffs.

We really don't want Cran to put up Jordan vs. Kobe playoff stats do we?

I was glad to see Kobe do well yesterday........he is not Jordan yet..

72-10 and six titles is hard to beat


Michael Reed.......can he do it twice?

Sac town....Can they win?

Will the refs will the Cavs and Bulls to victory?

Let the games begin

Who is comparing him to Jordan? Is that the criteria used here? If he doesn't match up to Jordan (the best SG in the history of the game) he is just average. Well, if average is the title given to the player second-best to Jordan then I can't argue, because you are right he isnt' better than Jordan yet and may never be that is a tall order.

Hmmm, maybe a comparison to say a Clyde Drexler might be in order...