Biden doesn't want to fight for 50,000 student loan relief. It's too hard



No email for me either, but those new conditions as far as months for deferment & forbearance would be huge for me if they recount my months.

It seems like those folks in your message went into repayment begining in the late 90s, so hopefully they'll get to recounting my era next.. I graduated in 2002 and didnt start my goverment loan payments until around 2005 (was paying off a private loan first). If I recall correctly, I was young and dumb and about to default and they let me get back in "good standing" by making 12 consecutive auto-payments, after which time I could defer or forebear a few months when needed, so I def maxed those pauses out (again, young and dumb). But since at least 2014 I made auto payments every month like clockwork until the pandemic pause.

Only other thing was that I did consolidate and bounce around between IBR, PAYE, & REPAYE so again, if they are going to count all months and not consider those events as resetting of the clock, ALL that would be BIG for me. I don't think it would discharge my shits, but there would be some light in the distance :lol:
 
No email for me either, but those new conditions as far as months for deferment & forbearance would be huge for me if they recount my months.

It seems like those folks in your message went into repayment begining in the late 90s, so hopefully they'll get to recounting my era next.. I graduated in 2002 and didnt start my goverment loan payments until around 2005 (was paying off a private loan first). If I recall correctly, I was young and dumb and about to default and they let me get back in "good standing" by making 12 consecutive auto-payments, after which time I could defer or forebear a few months when needed, so I def maxed those pauses out (again, young and dumb). But since at least 2014 I made auto payments every month like clockwork until the pandemic pause.

Only other thing was that I did consolidate and bounce around between IBR, PAYE, & REPAYE so again, if they are going to count all months and not consider those events as resetting of the clock, ALL that would be BIG for me. I don't think it would discharge my shits, but there would be some light in the distance :lol:

Yeah well just wanted to alert everyone...

It was crazy seeing people in those groups say they were paying for like 30 years...I was like DAMN....

This is a major problem in our country....No one should be paying for an education loan for 30 years...
 
It was crazy seeing people in those groups say they were paying for like 30 years...I was like DAMN....
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This is a major problem in our country....No one should be paying for an education loan for 30 years...

FrFr. And the folks that think that this is ok either aren't speaking from experience, are benefitting from it, or are just on some crabs in a bucket shit.

Things are going to change over time for one reason or another. Especially with the importance of a college education being diminished by the rise of technology and other forms of job creation and ways to build a business.
 
Pp
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FrFr. And the folks that think that this is ok either aren't speaking from experience, are benefitting from it, or are just on some crabs in a bucket shit.

Things are going to change over time for one reason or another. Especially with the importance of a college education being diminished by the rise of technology and other forms of job creation and ways to build a business.
yup.

I honestly think the people bitching didn’t even go to college or went to community college.
I personally don’t know anyone who is mad at anyone getting their loans discharged.

Yeah the colleges really need to do something, but I also think parents need to be more strategic on where they send their kids.
I was looking at Bowie State in Maryland and they only charge $448 per credit hour.
120 credit hours would be $53,000 for a BS.
Is that a lot though? If you major in Cyber Operations Engineering one can assume you may start out at 50K.

I don’t know I just know kids need something and I’m always going to champion college or community college.
It’s hard without it.

FYI - people don’t talk enough about the programs the FEDS offer. They have this pathways programs that guarantees a job and you get paid. They will even pay your tuition in some cases. I know many frown on the FEDs but you don’t have to stay there forever.



CIA


Student Programs

Undergraduate Scholarship Program​


  • Full time
  • Starting salary: $32,733 – $43,609 ($15.74 – $20.96 per hour)
  • High School Diploma or GED; Bachelor’s; Current Student
  • At least 18 years of age by September 15th of this year

The Undergraduate Scholarship Program is a financial needs-based initiative where you will be exposed to intelligence challenges while performing meaningful work that relates to your college major.

About the Job​

The Summer 2024 application period for the Undergraduate Scholarship Program has closed. Please check back in Early 2024 for Summer 2025 application information.
The Undergraduate Scholarship Program is a financial needs-based initiative that offers undergraduate students an unmatched experience in a diverse, equitable, and inclusive environment. Undergraduate students, serving as scholarship recipients with CIA, attend an accredited college/university on a full-time basis and work during summer breaks at the Agency. While working at CIA, you will be exposed to real intelligence challenges while performing meaningful work that relates to your college major. An IT major, for example, might be given increasingly complex projects involving sophisticated computer systems. An engineering major might help produce a piece of state-of-the-art equipment. A finance major could be involved in developing and analyzing budgets for a worldwide operation, while a foreign language major might be instrumental in translating documents for U.S. policymakers. An international relations major might brief a senior policymaker and, as a final example, a human resources major could have the opportunity to develop and implement personnel policies and procedures.
Because CIA invests in scholarship recipients, accepting an offer means continued employment with the Agency for a specified timeframe. You are required to work at the Agency after college graduation for a period equal to 1.5 times the length of the college sponsorship you received from CIA. Students who leave earlier are required to reimburse the U.S. Government for their tuition. All positions require relocation to the Washington, DC area during summer work tours.

Who You’ll Work With​

At the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA), we recognize our Nation’s strength comes from the diversity of its people. People from a broad range of backgrounds and viewpoints work at CIA, and our diverse teams are the reason we can keep our country safe.
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What You’ll Get​

If selected as a scholarship recipient, you will receive a wide array of benefits, including:
  • Tuition assistance up to $18,000 per calendar year for tuition, mandatory fees and books; STEM field positions receive tuition up to $25,000 per calendar year.
  • Daily allowance for meals and incidentals during summer tours
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As a CIA employee, you’ll also get the satisfaction of knowing your work is part of something bigger than yourself. Our work is driven by one mission: to keep our Nation safe. Every day is an opportunity to enhance U.S. national security.
Learn more about working at CIA

Minimum Qualifications​

  • At least 18 years of age by September 15th of this year
  • Financial need as demonstrated by the gross annual household income ceiling up to $120,000
    • If the applicant has not been listed as a dependent for the previous tax year, the gross annual household income ceiling is $50,000 or less
  • Acceptance at a 4-year college/university; or pursuing undergraduate degree as a full-time student and enrolled in or planning to take at least 12 credits per semester
  • At least a 3.0 GPA on a 4-point scale for high school and/or college
  • Two 90-day tours are preferred; however, one 90-day tour is the minimum requirement. Also, willingness to work at CIA full time after graduation
  • Ability to meet the minimum requirements for joining CIA, including U.S. citizenship and a background investigation

Desired Qualifications​

  • Academic excellence in core subjects relating to college major or desired major
  • Relevant practical or job experience in your field of interest
  • Demonstrated leadership qualities
  • Genuine interest in contributing to CIA’s mission
  • Proficiency in a foreign language. Languages of interest are listed on our Foreign Language page here.
 
Yeah the colleges really need to do something, but I also think parents need to be more strategic on where they send their kids.
I was looking at Bowie State in Maryland and they only charge $448 per credit hour.
120 credit hours would be $53,000 for a BS.
Is that a lot though? If you major in Cyber Operations Engineering one can assume you may start out at 50K.

I don’t know I just know kids need something and I’m always going to champion college or community college.
It’s hard without it.
I was gonna mention that too re: being more strategic about offering other options. I think another part of the situation I/We are in is because of how strong Baby Boomer parents/ society pushed the college dream on us. Either because they went the same route in a world where the economics were totally different.. or, for a lot of PoC: we were pushed to attain a dream that our parents never did for social and economic reasons. But it's been a different animal for the following generations. So something that seemed like an obvious path to success is no longer a simple choice going fwd.

With my nephew who is a Soph in HS right now, I'm def pushing the Community College or learn a trade angle, etc. and try things out first instead of going on a path that society tells you is the way but locks you in debt.
 
I was gonna mention that too re: being more strategic about offering other options. I think another part of the situation I/We are in is because of how strong Baby Boomer parents/ society pushed the college dream on us. Either because they went the same route in a world where the economics were totally different.. or, for a lot of PoC: we were pushed to attain a dream that our parents never did for social and economic reasons. But it's been a different animal for the following generations. So something that seemed like an obvious path to success is no longer a simple choice going fwd.

With my nephew who is a Soph in HS right now, I'm def pushing the Community College or learn a trade angle, etc. and try things out first instead of going on a path that society tells you is the way but locks you in debt.

What city/state is your nephew at? I would highly recommend him link up with the local 100 Black Men Chapter.

 
Congress should have given more discretionary authority to the President to manage student loans. Forgiving student loans and IDR are common tools used in the private sector to boost amount collected. If they can present strong statistical data, the aggregate amount should be used in their calculation. If they can get somebody like @DC_Dude to revive his defaulted student loan, it could offset an IDR or 'forgiven' student loan debt.

They need to pair up with the private sector and see what how effective settlement offers with enticing borrowers to pay. The government should seek out the exceptional from the private sector like me rather than trying solve these problems on their own with their limited ability.

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For every $50 'forgiven', there could be $1000 boost from borrowers that weren't going to pay shit.
 
California foster youth can now attend college for free

Myja Gary
July 14, 2023


Foster youth across California will now be able to attend college, free of charge, after new legislation, SB 307, was signed into the state budget Monday.

The new Fostering Futures program will cover the entire cost for foster youth to attend a University of California, California State University or California community college.

93% of foster youth in California want to attend college, but only 4% will attend and graduate with a degree, officials said. In addition, foster youth are directly impacted, more than other youth, by significant increases in the cost of living, which further impedes their ability to attend college.

An expansion of the existing Middle-Class Scholarship (MCS) program, the Fostering Futures program will cover college tuition for foster youth in addition to other costs including books, food and lodging.

Officials say the program serves to both increase the likelihood that foster youth can reach their educational goals and also better prepare them to enter the next stage of their lives, whether that involves pursuing an advanced degree or entering directly into their chosen career path, by providing the opportunity to begin their next chapter debt-free from higher education.

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The Republicans really fuck their selves by fucking with the student loan forgiveness program. This is really going to cost them a lot and I do mean a lot of young votes for decades. Around 8 million teenagers turned 18 before the next election in 2024 so yep.
 
The Republicans really fuck their selves by fucking with the student loan forgiveness program. This is really going to cost them a lot and I do mean a lot of young votes for decades. Around 8 million teenagers turned 18 before the next election in 2024 so yep.

Most of their children aren't going to college (and if they are they aren't paying like that) and most are in the trades.

What's going to happen is Younger Democrats are going/are starting to get pissed.
 
Here we go

Thanks for posting. I was just about to link this....Should be interesting....This will literally cause a fucking riot...I still don't understand how people can vote for these Republicans....
 
Thanks for posting. I was just about to link this....Should be interesting....This will literally cause a fucking riot...I still don't understand how people can vote for these Republicans....
You’re gonna get really pissed off when you discovered Hunter filed the suit.

When will you realize Biden was playing the shit outa you?
 
Most of their children aren't going to college (and if they are they aren't paying like that) and most are in the trades.

What's going to happen is Younger Democrats are going/are starting to get pissed.
That’s the point. Where are they going to voice their anger? On Twitter? If Elon promises to give them a nickel for voting against the Biden Crime Family, will they demand a dime?

Coalitions are meant to be broken. Divide and conquer always win.
 
Do nothing bugers taste good?

I know some of you metro/skinny jean/weirdo types hate meat.

Is it like an unbelievable burger? Because nothing is unbelievable with these strange people in office.

Meanwhile in Africa. The supposed most evil man on the planet gave more money to Africa than you Democratic fanbois will ever see.



If Obama and Biden ain't proof enough that they don't give a fuck about your black asses then you deserve the continued disrespect.

When Biden bombs Africa. What's the excuse going to be then ?? BLM gonna protests then?? They don't matter???
 
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Lawsuit Filed to End SAVE Repayment Plan/One-Time IDR Account Adjustment​

A new lawsuit has student loan borrowers nervous. Should there be concern over the future of SAVE and the one-time IDR account adjustment?​

Michael P. Lux, Esq.August 8, 2023 at 2:54 pm
In the past few days, numerous media outlets have reported on a lawsuit that would end the SAVE Repayment Plan or prevent the One-Time IDR Account Adjustment.

First, it’s worth noting that this new lawsuit has nothing to do with the SAVE Repayment plan. The reports that claim that the SAVE plan is the subject of the suit are factually wrong. If you read the actual complaint, the lawsuit is about ending the one-time IDR account adjustment.

As for the substance of the lawsuit, borrowers are justifiably worried. After the Supreme Court struck down the one-time forgiveness plan, the idea of litigation around the one-time account adjustment is troubling.

Today, I’ll explain what is at issue in the lawsuit. This will include an assessment of the case’s merits and thoughts on how borrowers should handle the uncertainty when making student loan plans.

Analyzing the Cato Institute Case to End the One-Time IDR Adjustment​

Before jumping into the case details, I’d like to discuss my qualifications to offer this analysis.

I am an attorney, and I have years of litigation experience. I’ve also spent over a decade helping borrowers understand student loan policy on this site.

However, I’m not a regulatory law expert, and some of the critical areas of this case fall outside of my personal experience.

Thus, what you are about to read is my informed opinion. Where possible, I’ll link to other resources so that the legal scholars among you can go as far down the rabbit hole as you like. That said, this article is written specifically for non-attorneys.

Hopefully, I can shed some light on the situation while we wait for federal judges to ultimately make final determinations.

Another Student Loan Case, Another Standing Issue​

When Biden’s plan to cancel up to $20,000 per borrower went before the Supreme Court, there were actually two cases. Several states brought one case, and another came from two student loan borrowers. In both cases, standing was a significant issue.

In the case brought by the states, the plaintiffs could meet the standing requirement because of the connection between Missouri and federal servicer MOHELA. That was a controversial decision, but it was enough for the case to proceed.

In the case where two borrowers challenged the forgiveness policy, the Supreme Court unanimously ruled that the borrowers did not have standing to challenge the forgiveness.

In this new case, the Plaintiffs are PSLF employers who claim they have standing because the IDR payment count adjustment makes pursuing PSLF less appealing, making it harder for them to attract and retain employees.

It seems likely that the plaintiffs, in this case, will eventually lose on the standing issue.

Imagine, for a moment, a repair shop just down the road from a giant pothole. People passing through town keep hitting the pothole and bringing more business to the repair shop. When the government announces plans to fix the pothole, the repair shop sues to block the repairs. Does the repair shop have the right to sue?

The analogy here is a bit simplified, but it illustrates what I see as the absurdity in the plaintiffs’ argument. I’d be surprised if the plaintiffs have standing and if the case moves forward.

Digging Deeper: One of the plaintiffs, the Cato Institute, also sued to block the one-time forgiveness plan. In that case, just like the new case, they argued that they had standing as PSLF employers.

Unfortunately, the court never ruled on the standing issue in the old case. When other challenges to the one-time forgiveness rule went to the Supreme Court, the Cato Institute case was put on hold and eventually dismissed based on the Supreme Court’s ruling.

However, both parties filed briefs explaining their analysis on the standing issue. The government’s argument starts on page 8 of this document. The response from the plaintiff is available here.

The Merits of the Case​

If the plaintiff meets all of the procedural requirements to bring a case, including showing standing, our analysis then moves forward to the merits of the case.

This is one area where my lack of experience with regulatory law is an issue. (If anyone has some experience in this area, please let me know.)

The plaintiffs argue that the government didn’t follow the proper rulemaking procedure to adjust IDR payment counts as planned.

Unfortunately, I don’t have any insight into the strength of this argument.

However, I do have a couple of other thoughts as it pertains to the merits of their case:

The Lawsuit Feels Like a Political Stunt​

The complaint opens by stating that “efore the ink dried on the Supreme Court’s June 30 decision… the Department announced a host of equally unlawful loan cancellation schemes.”

However, the IDR payment count adjustment was announced in April of 2022, more than a year before the Supreme Court ruled on one-time forgiveness. To suggest that the IDR account adjustment was in response to the Supreme Court ruling is either misleading or shows a lack of understanding of the facts.

Advocating for your client is to be expected in a complaint, but dubious claims that are factually inaccurate are not likely to be well received by the judge in the case.

Similarly, the complaint argues that “[t]here is no statutory or regulatory authority to count non-payments during periods of forbearance as qualifying monthly payments for PSLF or IDR.”

Here again, the claim is factually inaccurate. For example, the CARES Act states that time during the Covid-19 forbearance will count toward both PSLF and IDR forgiveness.

Both plaintiffs in this case have an agenda, and this case clearly furthers their advocacy goals. That doesn’t mean they will lose, but it could explain why a weaker lawsuit was filed.

A Plaintiff Win Might Not Last​

As noted earlier, a large portion of the complaint revolves around alleged violations of the Administrative Procedures Act.

In these arguments, the plaintiffs are not arguing that the rules shouldn’t exist. They argue that the Department of Education didn’t follow the proper creation steps.

Should the plaintiff win on these grounds, the Department of Education could start the rulemaking process from scratch and remedy flaws found in this case.

Why Have an IDR Count Adjustment?​

As a final bit of analysis, it is worth pointing out the purpose behind the one-time IDR count adjustment.

According to the Department of Education, loan servicers were improperly steering borrowers into a forbearance when they would have been better off signing up for an IDR plan. This issue was raised by Federal Student Aid, The Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, and the attorneys general of multiple states.

To correct the improper guidance that borrowers were given by their servicers, the IDR account adjustment will award borrowers credit toward IDR forgiveness for certain deferments and forbearances.

In other words, the IDR account adjustment isn’t some scheme to go around the ruling of the Supreme Court. The one-time adjustment was created to address a specific and well-documented problem, and it was announced over a year before the court ruled on the one-time forgiveness program.

Planning and Implications for Borrowers​

Once again, borrowers are caught up in uncertainty as they try to plan a repayment strategy without knowing what programs will actually be available.

For example, FFEL loan borrowers who wish to take advantage of the one-time IDR count adjustment need to consolidate their loans before December 31, 2023.

It is entirely possible that this case will not be resolved before that deadline.

In my opinion, this case is far weaker than the case that ultimately sunk the one-time forgiveness plan. If I had FFEL loans, I’d probably be consolidating right now so that I could sign up for the SAVE plan when payments resume.

Even if the one-time adjustment were to get struck down, I’d expect the Department of Education to attempt a more narrow version of the program, or to assist borrowers who consolidated in reliance of the program.

However, nothing is set in stone. Litigation is inherently unpredictable, and anything could happen. Things may go poorly for borrowers, and the administration might do nothing to address the issue. It’s conceivable that borrowers who consolidate specifically for the one-time adjustment look back and regret their decision.

That all said, I’d be surprised if that is what happened.

At present, the IDR account adjustment is an excellent opportunity for borrowers to move closer to loan forgiveness. I’d hate to see people miss out because they assumed the worst would happen.

I think it is a weak lawsuit, and I don’t think it is something borrowers should stress out about.

It’s a situation worth monitoring, but I won’t be rethinking my student loan repayment strategy because some think tank decided a new policy meant that student loan borrowers might not be financially desperate enough to work for them.

Stay Up to Date: Student loan rules constantly change, and temporary programs create deadlines that can’t be missed. To help manage this issue, I’ve created a monthly newsletter to keep borrowers updated on the latest changes and upcoming deadlines.

Click here to sign up. You’ll receive at most one email per month, and I’ll do my best to make sure you don’t overlook any critical developments.
 


IDR Adjustment Law Suit Megathread​

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To keep things organized we're going to keep all things about the lawsuit in this one thread.
I am NOT an attorney so I will not be answering legal questions about this suit.
You can read the suit here https://nclalegal.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/ECF-1_-Complaint.pdf
If you are unaware of what the one time adjustment is see here
A good article about the suit https://time.com/6302140/lawsuit-loan-forgiveness-income-driven-repayment/
An article containing the ED's response to the suit https://apnews.com/article/student-...-forgiveness-73327bbcb47dba6aec0c686f44bc2ab4
What is the lawsuit about?
The suit is claiming that the one time account adjustment is unlawful in part because it did not go through the proper regulatory process, called negotiated rulemaking.
This suit is NOT about the new SAVE plan, that did go through that process. There are some elements of SAVE that are the same as the adjustment, such as allowing certain deferments to count towards the 20/25 years needed for IDR forgiveness. Those are also not at risk under this suit because they are future periods. The adjustment is broader than the SAVE plan and addresses past periods.
The suit also claims the adjustment is "arbitrary and capricious"
The case also claims that allowing the 36 months of forbearance under the waiver (they don't argue the covid period) to count is unlawful. I realize that some are reading this as the covid period, but I don't see it as that - the covid period has been longer than 36 months and they don't mention the cares act etc at all. They do talk about forbearance steering etc which is why i think the 36 months refers to that provision of the adjustment - not the cares act.
What harm are the plaintiff's claiming?
They claim that by allowing PSLF to be granted after less than 120 qualifying payments under the traditional rules the ED is increasing the recruitment costs for PSLF employers because those that get forgiveness sooner due to the account adjustment could leave their pslf eligible jobs.
What does this mean for those of us that received the "golden email?"
So far nothing. But today, August 7th, the plaintiff filed a temporary restraining order to prevent loan cancellation during the court proceedings. My understanding is that such orders, if granted, are usually granted quickly, so we should know this week how the judge is going to rule on that.
https://nclalegal.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/ECF-7_TRO-PI-Motion.pdf
What if I consolidated already - if this goes through will i be reset to zero?
I don't see a court ruling that way even if they rule in favor of the plaintiff due to the harm it would cause borrowers. But that's just my opinion. So if the case did go anywhere it would mean not getting credit for normally ineligible periods, not a reset to zero.
**I was about to consolidate to get the higher count - should i cancel it?"
Up to you. If you are concerned you do have under December 31st of this year to consolidate and get that higher count benefit so you could wait and see which way the wind might be blowing.
Remember that effective July 1, 2023 consolidation results in a weighted average of the underlying loan counts. So even if this waiver did get struck down, that benefit was done through negotiated rulemaking and is not under threat. So there truly is no more resetting to zero.
I'm so angry - what action can I take?
I don't blame you - you should be angry. This waiver has been public since April of 2022 and it feels particularly cruel for the plaintiffs to wait for so many borrowers to get that email announcing their forgiveness before filing suit. Unfortunately you can't sue someone for filing a mean lawsuit. I mean you can, but it would get thrown out. You could encourage Congress to approve the waiver under the law, but other than that, all we can do is watch and hope the courts see this as nonsense. For those wondering, the judge looking at this was appointed by George W Bush.
 
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