NBA's 50 greatest: most overrated/underated?

Forget the records, Gasol makes the Triangle Offense efficient, he can pass ,has good mid range shot and his basketball IQ is up there, not forgetting he's a Efficient player.. it's funny how lakers went from being scrubs to title contenders with the addition of gasol. he reminds me of lakers winning rings with shaq, only difference is Gasol is lanky. :lol:

we have a winner! somebody gets it and isn't afraid to admit it.
 
you do realize that Rasheed Wallace averagd 2.0 blks and ben Wallace averaged 3.0blks per game that season man thats 5 blocks between their front line bigs thats outstanding. what the fuck are you talking about ben was the only shot blocker.Sheed averaged 2 a game that was good for top 8 in the damn league man please stop with the bullshit. They averaged almost 3 steals a game between them

yeah, eewwll, you are a dumbass.

don't you know that defensive powerhouse tandem of ben wallace and rasheed wallace was more fearsome than the twin towers of hakeem olajuwon and ralph sampson?

i mean, take a look at what ben wallace and rasheed wallace averaged against the fakers in the finals:

ben wallace: 1 block per game, 1.8 steals per game

rasheed wallace: 1.6 blocks per game, .4 steals per game

all that, plus they held shaquille o'neal to an amazingly low 63.1% FG shooting.

what now, bitch ass eewwll?
 
most overrated: Bill Walton

most underrated: Dominque Wilkins (didn't even make the list)
 
Re: No Colin

1999-00
• In the backcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders. In the frontcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders except below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may only use his forearm. In the post, neither the offensive player nor the defender is allowed to dislodge or displace a player who has legally obtained a position. Defender may not use his forearm, shoulder, hip or hand to reroute or hold-up an offensive player going from point A to point B or one who is attempting to come around a legal screen set by another offensive player. Slowing or impeding the progress of the screener by grabbing, clutching, holding “chucking” or “wrapping up” is prohibited.

2000-01
• No contact with either hands or forearms by defenders except in the frontcourt below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may use his forearm only.
• Defender may not use his forearm, shoulder, hip or hand to reroute or hold-up an offensive player going from point A to Point B or one who is attempting to come around a legal screen set by another offensive player.
• Slowing or impeding the progress of the screener by grabbing, clutching, holding “chucking” or “wrapping up” is prohibited.

2001-02
• A new defensive three-second rule will prohibit a defensive player from remaining in the lane for more than three consecutive seconds without closely guarding an offensive player.

2004-05
• New rules were introduced to curtail hand-checking, clarify blocking fouls and call defensive three seconds to open up the game.

2006-07
• On a clear-path-to-the-basket foul, the team that is fouled is awarded two free throw attempt and the ball on the sideline.

Hall of Famer Rick Barry, a keen observer of the game, said he would love to see players of the past getting to attack the basket under the new officiating. “They’d score a lot more,” he said.

Rod Thorn said that the NBA had changed the rule to give an advantage to the offensive player. “It’s more difficult now to guard the quick wing player who can handle the ball,” Thorn said of the change. “I think it helps skilled players over someone who just has strength or toughness. What the NBA is trying to do is promote unimpeded movement for dribblers or cutters.”

“My opinion is that the game had gone too much toward favoring strong players over skilled players,” Thorn said. “The NBA felt there was too much body, too much hand-checking, being used by defenders to the detriment of the game. There was a feeling that there was too much advantage for a defensive player who could merely use his strength to control the offensive player.” The new rules interpretations have attempted to address that issue, Thorn said. “If the refs perceive that a defender is bumping the cutter, or bumping a ball-handler, then they’ll blow their whistles.” This new way of calling became increasingly apparent with each regular-season game last year, and it really made an impression during the playoffs. Free from the physical challenge of defenders, offensive players found many more opportunities to attack the basket – and draw fouls.

As a result, the new rules interpretation helped promote the emergence immediately of a new generation of super stars, from Kobe Bryant scoring his 81 points during a regular season game, to LeBron James, Vince Carter, Gilbert Arenas and Dwyane Wade making big splashes in the playoffs. “The good wing players – LeBron, Kobe, Arenas, Wade, Carter – shot a lot of free throws with the way the game is now called,” Thorn admitted.

Offensive players were freed as never before and fans were thrilled by high-scoring games. Television ratings jumped with the excitement, and reporters began filing stories signaling an NBA revival not seen since the days when Jordan played for the Bulls. The league had made an obvious move to try to pick up scoring averages that had been in decline since the late 1980s. And it seems to have worked.

Tex Winter, now 84 and the veteran of more than a half century of coaching, has serious misgivings about what the league has done. Winter acknowledges the outgrowth of the new rules interpretation is the rise of the super dominant offensive player, led by Wade’s performance in the NBA Finals and Bryant’s string of 40-, 50, even 60-point games during the regular season. “It’s brought all these 40-point scorers,” Winter said. “They can’t score 40 points unless they get 15-20 free throws.” And that’s exactly what they were getting on their big nights.

those of you who know who tex winter is can see that this is 3 years old, as tex winter is now 87.

this notion that the league created rules to create stars Like Kobe wade and lebron is ridiculous.

The idea that Tex Winter espouses that somehow Kobe, Lebron and wade need 15-20 free throws to score 40 is not backed up by Logic.

MJ's best season as a pro he averaged 11.9 free throws per game averaging 37 ppg.

Kobe's best season he averaged 10.2 ppg averaging 35 ppg

that blows that theory to hell.

Mj in his infamous 63 pt game against the celtics was brillant but lets be real he smoked Ainge, DJ, Sichsting, Bird and Wedman as defenders Kobe, lebron and wade would shit on those same defenders the same exact way.

The hand check era was more physical surely but the straight Iso made it easier to gallop to the hoop, beat the handcheck of slower footed small defenders and it was a race to the hoop and Mj jumped over the bigs once he was there.

ainge, DJ, Hornacek, ehlo, Starks, Marjele, Mcmillan,Dumars, were some of the smaller contemporary wings that guarded MJ I don't give a shit what era Kobe, Lebron and Wade would have murdered those slower ass dudes as well.

It todays NBA the zone principles makes it harder to get to the Hoop than ever before you can sit a big strong side and basically eliminate the Iso wing drive forcing the player to pass the ball, in the MJ era that never happened.

In the MJ era as long as the offensive players were above the free throw line because if they were it was called illegal offense you could straight Iso shake off the hand check and get buckets galore.

There were way more scoring and many more possesions in the game back then now its less scoring and less possesions.

Rule changes came in because of the clutch and grab of the post MJ era game got bogged down with too many highschool to pro kids with incomplete games and with 1 and 2 year college guys plus the heat/Knicks clutch fest didn;t help.

but the new rules haven't elevated free throws and foul calls for star players in this era when numbers suggest otherwise.
 
yeah, eewwll, you are a dumbass.

don't you know that defensive powerhouse tandem of ben wallace and rasheed wallace was more fearsome than the twin towers of hakeem olajuwon and ralph sampson?

i mean, take a look at what ben wallace and rasheed wallace averaged against the fakers in the finals:

ben wallace: 1 block per game, 1.8 steals per game

rasheed wallace: 1.6 blocks per game, .4 steals per game

all that, plus they held shaquille o'neal to an amazingly low 63.1% FG shooting.

what now, bitch ass eewwll?

funny in 85-86.

Sampson and hakeem averaged 5 blocks per game.

The exact same number the both Wallaces averaged combined. in their finals seasons.

LOL

you lose again idiot.

and thanks for proving my point Sheed blocked more shots in the Finals series than ben did but ben was the shot blocker he claimed thanks.
 
EDIT: i couldn't stop laughing so i had to come back and add this. J is sitting up here wondering how the grizzlies got swept by the dallas mavericks (who also eliminated the san antonio spurs). just WTF did you expect to happen with this starting lineup in the playoffs against dallas?

chucky atkins
34 year old eddie jones
shane battier
jake tsakalidis
pau gasol

are you leavbing out Mike Miller, and Bobby Jackson for a reason or are your purposely not naming them in your brekadown.

you've already proven that you can't, so i don't know why i'm asking, but: can you read?

do you see in my quote where it says STARTING LINEUP?

i gave you the playoff starters and your can't-stay-on-point-for-one-second ass brings up mike miller and bobby jackson.

maybe you should ask that over-achieving midget why he chose to start jake tsakalidis in the playoffs.

:lol:

you're sad, bro. you google and you're not even a good googler. you asking about bobby jackson and mike miller tells me you are like most of the pretenders on BGOL when it comes to basketball. you don't watch games and you don't know shit about what actually goes down.

pathetic.


Oh and whats the reason for not winning a SINGLE GAME a single game the year before in 04-05 and the year before in 03-04

oh you mean 2004-05 when the memphis grizzlies were in the playoffs and the fakers were already fishing? tied in the pussific division cellar with the golden state warriors? in spite of having the dude that could outscore another team by himself for 3 quarters?

:lol:
 
fixed it for you.

son, coach harris does not equal coach tomjanovich. can't you address the point? what's the matter, google button not working for you?

why you trying to squirm your way out?

can't stay on point?

this is grown folks talking, kid. go to sleep quick.

Uh Rudy T led the Lakers to 23-19 record in 43 games lakers won 60 something games for Del harris whats the point Rudy is a better coach than harris but what does that mean Rudy T quit not because of Kobe no one has ever said that and be rational,Kobe dropped 27 6 6 for the man,lol AND you trying to slip slide away from the argumnent now you dared not challenge any of the gasol shit because I smashed the bullshit to pieces, you can't explain the stupidty of saying lakers are gasol's team thats stupid as hell for a man that hadn't won a playoff game lol


Forget the records, Gasol makes the Triangle Offense efficient, he can pass ,has good mid range shot and his basketball IQ is up there, not forgetting he's a Efficient player.. it's funny how lakers went from being scrubs to title contenders with the addition of gasol. he reminds me of lakers winning rings with shaq, only difference is Gasol is lanky. :lol:

Are you an idiot or an alias of cornholerab.

lol

Gasol and Shaq remind you of each other oh really we are done after this post because you disqualified yourself from ever discussing hoops with me after that proclamation.

lakers haven't won a title yet and lakers were 25-14 pre Gasol that same season. They were not scrubs.

Gasol has helped the lakers tremednously but to say its his teasm is the stupidest shit anyone with a brain can say not one expert alive will make that claim the only reason you and others are saying it is to take credit away from Kobe.

so when Kobe wins the ring its because of gasol like it was because of Shaq, lol when everyone says it was Gasol's soft ass who prevented the lakers from winning the Finals last season.

but you are saying he's like Shaq LOL

shut this noise up man its stupid and benath you I hope.

Gasol had not won a playoff game and suddenly the lakers with Kobe being a 3 time champion a winner of playoff games pre Gasol post Shaq and its Gasol's team :lol::lol::lol:
 
Re: No Colin

this notion that the league created rules to create stars Like Kobe wade and lebron is ridiculous.

your blowhard position doesn't surprise me.

after all, you're in a better position to comment on league officiating than GM & NBA EVP rod thorn. uh-huh.

and you're certainly more knowledgeable about defense than say, HOF joe dumars, who agrees in full with the points made in the article. right.

and you're certainly more knowledgeable about offense than say, HOF rick barry or HOF clyde drexler, who both agree in full with the points made in the article. sure.

and you're certainly more knowledgeable about Xs and Os than coach winter. you betcha.

J,

i don't know if you're just stupid or a poor reader, but you haven't been able to directly address anything in this thread so far.

you rebut coach winter's claim with SEASON averages. but dumb ass, he was specifically talking about GAMES where players scored 40 or more points AFTER the rules changes. google is NOT YOUR friend because you don't know how to be relevant.

:smh:

here are the facts:

when tobe has scored 40-49 pts in a game AFTER the rule changes, he had 15 or more FTAs in 6 of 16 games.

when tobe has scored 50-59 pts in a game AFTER the rule changes, he had 15 or more FTAs in 5 of 10 games.

when tobe has scored 60-69 pts in a game AFTER the rule changes, he had 15 or more FTAs in 2 of 3 games.

do you see the trend and positive correlation?
 
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what ben wallace and rasheed wallace averaged against the fakers in the finals:

ben wallace: 1 block per game, 1.8 steals per game

rasheed wallace: 1.6 blocks per game, .4 steals per game

all that, plus they held shaquille o'neal to an amazingly low 63.1% FG shooting.

funny in 85-86.

Sampson and hakeem averaged 5 blocks per game.

The exact same number the both Wallaces averaged combined. in their finals seasons.

:lol:

this dumb ass can't stay on track no matter how many chances you give him.

can you read the part of my quote where is specifically says IN THE FINALS?

so tell us why your googling ass always gotta go with SEASON averages when we're talking about VERY SPECIFIC time frames?

is it because the web sites you're frantically hunting and pecking for only give SEASON stats which are the best you can muster since you have no ACTUAL knowledge?
 
Re: No Colin

this notion that the league created rules to create stars Like Kobe wade and lebron is ridiculous.

The idea that Tex Winter espouses that somehow Kobe, Lebron and wade need 15-20 free throws to score 40 is not backed up by Logic.

MJ's best season as a pro he averaged 11.9 free throws per game averaging 37 ppg.

Kobe's best season he averaged 10.2 ppg averaging 35 ppg

that blows that theory to hell.

Mj in his infamous 63 pt game against the celtics was brillant but lets be real he smoked Ainge, DJ, Sichsting, Bird and Wedman as defenders Kobe, lebron and wade would shit on those same defenders the same exact way.

The hand check era was more physical surely but the straight Iso made it easier to gallop to the hoop, beat the handcheck of slower footed small defenders and it was a race to the hoop and Mj jumped over the bigs once he was there.

ainge, DJ, Hornacek, ehlo, Starks, Marjele, Mcmillan,Dumars, were some of the smaller contemporary wings that guarded MJ I don't give a shit what era Kobe, Lebron and Wade would have murdered those slower ass dudes as well.


It todays NBA the zone principles makes it harder to get to the Hoop than ever before you can sit a big strong side and basically eliminate the Iso wing drive forcing the player to pass the ball, in the MJ era that never happened.

In the MJ era as long as the offensive players were above the free throw line because if they were it was called illegal offense you could straight Iso shake off the hand check and get buckets galore.

There were way more scoring and many more possesions in the game back then now its less scoring and less possesions.

Rule changes came in because of the clutch and grab of the post MJ era game got bogged down with too many highschool to pro kids with incomplete games and with 1 and 2 year college guys plus the heat/Knicks clutch fest didn;t help.

but the new rules haven't elevated free throws and foul calls for star players in this era when numbers suggest otherwise.

MJ defenders Craig Ehlo, Byron Scott, Danny Ainge, Jeff Hornacek, Jeff Malone, Ron Harper, Ricky Pierce, Clyde Drexler, John Starks, Voshon Lenard, Eddie Jones, Vinny Del Negro, Rolando Blackman, Sleepy Floyd, Reggie Lewis, Joe Dumars, Mitch Richmond, Reggie Miller, Penny Hardaway, John Starks, Steve Smith, Gerald Wilkins, Bernard King, Reggie Theus, Ricky Pierce, Rex Chapman, Reggie Lewis, Hersey Hawkins, Willie Anderson, Vernon Maxwell, Nick Anderson, Tony Campbell, Reggie Williams, Nate McMillan, Rory Sparrow, Kendall Gill, Stacy Augmon, Dan Majerle, David Wesley, Rex Walters, Jim Jackson, J.R. Rider, Calbert Cheaney, Kerry Kittles, and Bobby Phills,etc

Kobe Defenders Dwyane Wade, Lebron James, Vince Carter, Tracy McGrady, Ray Allen, Cuttino Mobley, Corey Maggette, Carmleo Anthony, Jason Richardson, Manu Ginobili, Reggie Miller (post prime), Raja Bell, Allen Iverson, Joe Johnson, Paul Pierce, Scottie Pippen (post prime), Richard Jefferson, Rip Hamilton, J.R Smith, Shawn Marion, James Posey, Bruce Bowen, Ron Artest, Raja Bell, Tayshawn Prince, Brandon roy Shane battier, Andre Kirelinko, , Gilbert Arenas, Caron Butler, Bo Outlaw, Kenyon Martin, Chanucey Billups, Jason Kidd, Josh Howard, etc

The blue indicate the players MJ played against and embarrased them

The red indicates players that are better defenders than 98% of the players that your boy faces. Also Consider there is no hand checking :smh:. A prime Jordan would be eating ninjaz alive in this league. Like i told someone before , height isn't the determining factor of a good defender. Things like strength, length, quickness, footwork, etc are much more important than pure height and athleticism. There are literally dozens of players who are tall and athletic who are NOT good defenders in the league( kirilenko being one of them)

:lol::lol::lol::lol:
 
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Re: No Colin

me and cranrab had a Convo about Kobe and people started butting in.

Lakers have the best bench in the NBA for 2 years now
 
at the end of the day, its the player that has to go out there and perform. Yea he drew em up but its the players who have to execute period.

at least as far as BGOL is concerned, coach is tremendously undervalued. many posters on here believe in the celebrity approach. whichever team has the most celebrities will win.

there's at least one HUGE problem with that sort of thinking.

in the past 27 years, there have only been 9 different championship head coaches. 4 of those 9 are permanently retired.

great teams must obviously have talented players, but without a coach to put the pieces together, you just have a bunch of incoherent parts.
 
Re: No Colin

me and cranrab had a Convo about Kobe and people started butting in.

i don't mind if anyone butts in. intelligent contributions to any discussion are always welcomed. i just wish the pretentious know-nothing bitches would STFU and continue lurking until they have something valid to add.
 
you do realize there is a difference between being a great post defender and a great defender overall which entails blocking shots weakside and getting steals. But on ball man up post defense Sheed is one of the best says Doug Collins, Tim Duncan, Shaq and Phil Jackson.

Fuck outta here you clown.

You said he was one of the best post defenders in the history of the NBA. How can you be one of the best post defenders in the history of the game and NEVER even make an all defensive team in your entire career...not even one:lol::lol::lol: fucka outta here.

And you clown..you were the original dumbass that also said Sheed was a great overall defender because he provides great help defense when the perimeters player funnel players to the Middle. So he's one of the best post defenders of all time and also a great help defender..however,..he can't manage to make an all nba defensive team just once in his career?


I hate arguing with the ignorant of basketball

You're like a 500 pound man talking about "I hate fat people" :lol::lol:


of course the Pistons didn;t double and trap guys on the perimeter they played tough man up defense and collapsed the paint when guys penetrated BUT you do realize that Rasheed Wallace averagd 2.0 blks

You do realize that Rasheed didn't even play that entire season with the Pistons right?

However, my case still stands. Ben Wallace was the real shot blocker on that team, the defensive player of the year, and the real defensive threat to team.. if you actually watch the game, you will notice that Rasheed actually gets a lot of his blocks on the perimeter challenging mid range shots one on one... not on help...


I said that to say Kobe blew Prince up for big games he's had other regular average games against prince the other times thats in 5 years thats 9 games 3 of them Kobe blew Prince up for big numbers he scored 30 like 2 other times Prince held him down a couple thats 9 games. stop overlapping shit saying 5 years lioke they play 4 times a season.

Kobe gets contained by Prince. Of course a person that averages 30 points is going to eventually score 30+ points when he gets 10 chances to do it. For the most part, Kobe gets contained by Prince. Watching the games reveals that and looking at the stats confirms it..no matter how much you want to revise history.



again Bullshit in that series against the Lakers Prince crowded Kobe and bothered his jumpshot, and when Kobe drove he was forced into help you keep talking double teaming who the fuck is saying double teaming you using semantics to avoiud the point I'm making thats the defense collapsed when Kobe penetrated and forced him into bad shots and turnovers. Where is the evidence of low bball IQ where, all defense, all nba 1st team, allstar, MVP, where is the evidence of low hoops IQ,I haven't seen that, the idea that the Lakers was gonna pound the ball to Shaq and win that series are a fucking joke,they had 2 guys capable of scoring thst whole series that was it and Slava medvedenko at pf. That wasn't gonna beat any damn body especially a balanced team like the Pistons the lakers had malone at least in the Conference Finals against the Spurs but he was done in the Finals. so stop the it was Kobe's fault bullshit thats stupid one man won't cost any team a series the Lakers defense to boot wasn;t stoping shit their reserves got run the fuck off the floor against Big nasty, Okur and Mike james.


Revisionist history at its best. You Kobe stans always want to make up some bullshit to attempt to cover up the fact that Kobe just makes bad decisions.

What are you talking about "crowded" Kobe. The Pistons didn't double team Kobe no "overplay" him. We let him shoot jumpers and he took them at every available chance...bad fall-aways, awkward shots with Prince in his face..etc... He wasn't double-teamed...he was defended well one on one and forced a ton of bad shots.

You can look up former posts about his bad basketball IQ. I've wasted enough time in this thread with Kobe stans.




Kobe had a poor series as did the whole fucking team

WRONG. Shaq was shooting 63 percent from the field. He stopped getting the touches after game two...let's guess who was taking those shots away by hijacking the offense :lol:


and our non existant defense you are latching on to the Kobe factor like a bone to hate the man and pin the whole shit on him when thats hardly the case Billups ripped our pg's out the frame, the Pisons had balance defense and bench over the Lakers we had Kobe struggling, Shaq who wasn;t playing an ounce of defense in the pick and roll later revealed as a severe weakness of his.

Bone up on the game my man.please.

Fuck outta here... Shaq played the same on the pick and roll that he's played his entire career.

You are doing everything fucking thing to avoid admitting that your man-crush on Kobe is refusing you to see that a player shooting 25 shots at game at only 30+ percent is most likely going to lead to his team losing..you damn clown
 
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yeah, eewwll, you are a dumbass.

don't you know that defensive powerhouse tandem of ben wallace and rasheed wallace was more fearsome than the twin towers of hakeem olajuwon and ralph sampson?

i mean, take a look at what ben wallace and rasheed wallace averaged against the fakers in the finals:

ben wallace: 1 block per game, 1.8 steals per game

rasheed wallace: 1.6 blocks per game, .4 steals per game

all that, plus they held shaquille o'neal to an amazingly low 63.1% FG shooting.

what now, bitch ass eewwll?


:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
 
Overrated: Scottie Pippen; especially when he fuckked up in the Portland/Lakers series. Jackass...

Underrated: Dominique Wilkens; Next to Jordan, Nique was the truth. His teams were never that good but laud, he could ball.

Most Overrated coming out of college: Glen "Big" Robinson - got paid so much dam money but couldn't' stop eating doughnuts and drinking cokes. Would also say Jerry Stackhouse - he should have been better!

Most Underrated coming out of college:
Richard Hamilton - never got a lot of hype although he was outstanding in college. Good on him for having a very good career.
 
Overrated: Scottie Pippen; especially when he fuckked up in the Portland/Lakers series.

while i share the opinion of scottie pippen being overrated, i differ on the reason why.

i cannot hang the portland/fakers series outcome on scottie pippen. i think if you examine the play of PUSSIFIC 10 tree blazer damon stoudamire, you'd find a much worse series performance than scottie pippen's. damon stoudamire's uneven and unreliable play basically left the trailblazers short handed.
 
at least as far as BGOL is concerned, coach is tremendously undervalued. many posters on here believe in the celebrity approach. whichever team has the most celebrities will win.

there's at least one HUGE problem with that sort of thinking.

in the past 27 years, there have only been 9 different championship head coaches. 4 of those 9 are permanently retired.

great teams must obviously have talented players, but without a coach to put the pieces together, you just have a bunch of incoherent parts.



oh no dont get me wrong. Phil was a major part of the reason they won. But I dont like how people discount Pips role in that.

Its absurd
 
Re: No Colin

i don't mind if anyone butts in. intelligent contributions to any discussion are always welcomed. i just wish the pretentious know-nothing bitches would STFU and continue lurking until they have something valid to add.

It's not that you don't have some valid points but your utter disdain for Kobe Bryant is just ridiculous. You act as if he doesn't deserve some of the praise people give him. He's not the best player in the NBA, we know that. But he is a Top 5 player.

By the way, the Lakers sure do know how to give up leads. NBA Champs my ass. Dallas is back in the game now? WTF? Phil Jackson refuses to make adjustments. And Ariza should be starting every game.
 
Re: No Colin

It's not that you don't have some valid points but your utter disdain for Kobe Bryant is just ridiculous. You act as if he doesn't deserve some of the praise people give him. He's not the best player in the NBA, we know that. But he is a Top 5 player.

By the way, the Lakers sure do know how to give up leads. NBA Champs my ass. Dallas is back in the game now? WTF? Phil Jackson refuses to make adjustments. And Ariza should be starting every game.

its kobes fault they lost the lead. Farmar, Luke and Sasha couldnt get going because of kobe.:rolleyes:

And yes, ariza should be starting. Luke Walton sucks.
 
Re: No Colin

Kobe in the fourth is showing his worth. Gasol is turning the ball over during a crucial possession. If Dirk hits that 3, this game could have been heading to OT. But rest assured, Kobe nails a jumper to seal the deal. At moments like this, I guarantee you Phil is glad he has Kobe the chucker.
 
Re: No Colin

It's not that you don't have some valid points but your utter disdain for Kobe Bryant is just ridiculous. You act as if he doesn't deserve some of the praise people give him.

because some of the praise people give him isn't deserved.
 
Re: No Colin

because some of the praise people give him isn't deserved.

I agree. He is an overrated defender & his shot selection is awful at times. But does the good outweigh the bad? An overwhelming yes from me. If he had played organized ball before coming to the NBA, he'd be much better off. Dean Smith or Roy Williams would have done wonders for him. His playground style is not a winning brand of basketball but it is certainly entertaining to watch at times. But I'd take Wade, Paul or Lebron any day.

Kobe is no Jordan (not even close) & I have heard people say he is better than Jordan. At that point, I come with the James Evans from Good Times eyes & say WTF are you saying. Now when it comes to those fans, I agree with you. But you have yet to say one good thing about Kobe.
 
Re: No Colin

the Lakers sure do know how to give up leads. NBA Champs my ass. Dallas is back in the game now? WTF? Phil Jackson refuses to make adjustments. And Ariza should be starting every game.

i don't know how much of it was the fakers. the lead evaporated due to luke walton. dallas grew the lead because of tobe. timrock no doubt will offer some sort of protest (if he hasn't already), but it's just plain fact. i hope he's actually watching the game.

Kobe in the fourth is showing his worth. Gasol is turning the ball over during a crucial possession. I guarantee you Phil is glad he has Kobe the chucker.

this is an example of where contention arises (at least between us). your attention seems to narrow as the clock winds down.

you chose to focus on pau gasol's TO even though it was a 2 possession ball game (fakers up by 6). the mavericks netted 1 pt from the TO. bad play? yes. does that come close to nullifying the rest of his game? not in my mind.

more importantly, i think lamar odom's Q4 offensive rebounding and passing was MUCH more signficant than tobe's chucking.
 
lakers were 25-14 pre Gasol that same season.

:lol:

this fool can't stop putting his foot in his unusually large and ignorant mouth.

the fakers were 30-16 (.652) BEFORE pau gasol.

the fakers were 22-5 (.815) the rest of the regular season in games with pau gasol.

sure, pau gasol isn't the reason. must be those lucky charms.
 
:lol:

this fool can't stop putting his foot in his unusually large and ignorant mouth.

the fakers were 30-16 (.652) BEFORE pau gasol.

the fakers were 22-5 (.815) the rest of the regular season in games with pau gasol.

sure, pau gasol isn't the reason. must be those lucky charms.

I said it once and I'll say it again. Kobe stans have a complete and utter disregard for facts. They just make up shit.
 
Re: No Colin

i don't know how much of it was the fakers. the lead evaporated due to luke walton. dallas grew the lead because of tobe. timrock no doubt will offer some sort of protest (if he hasn't already), but it's just plain fact. i hope he's actually watching the game.



this is an example of where contention arises (at least between us). your attention seems to narrow as the clock winds down.

you chose to focus on pau gasol's TO even though it was a 2 possession ball game (fakers up by 6). the mavericks netted 1 pt from the TO. bad play? yes. does that come close to nullifying the rest of his game? not in my mind.

more importantly, i think lamar odom's Q4 offensive rebounding and passing was MUCH more signficant than tobe's chucking.

How the hell was it Kobe's fault that Jason Terry went off? Kobe wasn't guarding Terry. Phil Jackson should have put Kobe or Ariza on Terry. If Terry goes off with a 6'7" guy on him, then
more power to him. The lead evaporating is just due to poor coaching on Phil's part. Gasol should have gotten more than 13 shots. He was passing well out of the post if a double team comes. This reminds me of Bynum scoring 42. He could have had 60 if Phil plays him more minutes & runs the offense through him.

Gasol's turnover wasn't costly because the chucker nailed the coffin. This was one of Kobe's most efficient games. He didn't take any bad shots after the first quarter. Gasol had an excellent game (in the first half). Phil was not running plays for Gasol (for the life of me, why not?) in the second half, which is why he wasn't in rhythm when he had that turnover. I blame Phil for the turnover. You can't expect Gasol to be in rhythm when you haven't thrown him a bone for an entire quarter & a half. I'm not saying anything bad about Gasol. I'm saying you see who Phil Jackson looks to when the game is on the line. That's why he deserves most of his praise.
 
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