Game Of Thrones: The Sopranos with swords or Dynasty in chainmail?

[grownazzblakman]

I think he doesn't like her- that's understandable. I can't stand her either but shes important.

^^ Exactly. Agreed.

Not liking a character is understandable. That's his prerogative.

But trying to DIMINISH her importance to show is a different story.
With Tywin dead... She's the 'main villain' now.

So saying Cersei "doesn't add ANYTHING to the storyline NOW"... is much different than just saying "I don't like that bitch".

 

[godofwine]

A show covering the backstory could rival this one.

Imagine watching the mad king kill both Neds father and brother, or Jaime killing the Mad King

Only problem would be actors because all the ones currently cast in their roles would be too old to play the characters that young.

I swear I had this same thought while watching the History and Lore vids yesterday. "The back story is damn near better than the show!"

The hardest part in making a Backstory Game of Thrones would be trying to find an actor/actress who looks like/similar, but also has the acting ability to do the role - hard to find that combo. Only a few times in history has that been done to perfection, notably in the movie Ray (2004). Shit, it wasn't until Jamie took off the glasses at the end that I was like, "Oh shit! Jamie Foxx is in this movie!"

 

[stretchwallz]

The hardest part in making a Backstory Game of Thrones would be trying to find an actor/actress who looks like/similar, but also has the acting ability to do the role - hard to find that combo. Only a few times in history has that been done to perfection, notably in the movie Ray (2004). Shit, it wasn't until Jamie took off the glasses at the end that I was like, "Oh shit! Jamie Foxx is in this movie!"

I always thought an anime type cartoon detailing Robert's Rebellion or Aegon's conquest would be good

 

[Count23]

 

[tuckdog]

WTF are you talking about?

Her character doesn't add anything to where the storyline is NOW?

Cotdamn.. you have not been paying attention.
Lemme help you out...

The very FIRST SCENE (of Season 5 Episode 1) started off with a ‘young Cersei’ visiting a witch in the forest who foretold her future.

The Witch told her: "You will be Queen for a time... then comes another. Younger. More beautiful.... To cast you down and take all you hold dear."

Cersei thinks the prophecy is about Margery and the Tyrell family.
But more than likely that witch was really talking about Khaleesi.

So pretty much everything that is happening RIGHT NOW is because of Cersei trying to PREVENT this prophecy from becoming a reality.

No need to give you any lectures, chief.
You probably wouldn't be able to understand them anyway.

Honestly, I think this show might be too much for you to follow.

Just saying.

That last sentence says it all. You have to geek the fuck out to truly comprehend everything going on. This isn't a show you can catch once a week and fuck with your phone for most of it. You have to suspend reality momentarily and fuckin put yourself in Westeros. Some people don't have the patience for that type of dedication to a tv show, but I'm all in. I've gone too far to turn back now.

 

[tuckdog]

I think he doesn't like her- that's understandable. I can't stand her either but shes important.

I have a love/hate relationship with Cersei. At first, if I saw the chick who plays her walking on the street, I couldn't honestly say I wouldn't murk her off GP. As the series has gone on, I've come to understand her a little. She's dedicated to her family and nothing else. Same shit I try and instill in my daughters daily. Can't really be mad at that. She's just playing for the wrong team.

 

[tuckdog]

I always thought an anime type cartoon detailing Robert's Rebellion or Aegon's conquest would be good

That would be dope too, but I'd much rather see it played out just like this series.

 

[dawilleyone]

Yeah, she died giving birth to him and Ned took him in as his own. John Snow, Khalessi, and Tyrion all killed their mothers at birth.

I never thought about this before, but if you assume R+L=J then yeah, all 3 of their mothers died giving birth or immediately after.

Not only that but all their fathers died violently as well.

 

[dawilleyone]

a series or film on Roberts Rebellion, would come off like the star wars pre-quel trilogy. We know to much of the story already and as a result the writers and directors would try to get cute with new characters and and plot twists.

What I'd really like to see is an anime style telling of the Dance with Dragons when the Targ's went all out civil war style on each other with 9 or so dragons and Targaryens battling it out.

Martin has a short story in print telling parts of it, but I'm telling you it would be great as an animated feature.

 

[Kubrick]

^^ Exactly. Agreed.

Not liking a character is understandable. That's his prerogative.

But trying to DIMINISH her importance to show is a different story.
With Tywin dead... She's the 'main villain' now.

So saying Cersei "doesn't add ANYTHING to the storyline NOW"... is much different than just saying "I don't like that bitch".

Is she really a villain?

I consider Roose and Ramsay Bolton villains, but not Cersei. She is just doing what she thinks are the best move for her the Lannisters.

Hell, you could make an argument that Stannis is more of a villain than Cersei. People forget that he used magic to kill Renly. He also used magic to curse Rob Starks. Because the wildling King did not bow to him, he had his ass burned alive.

 

[tuckdog]

I never thought about this before, but if you assume R+L=J then yeah, all 3 of their mothers died giving birth or immediately after.

Not only that but all their fathers died violently as well.

R + L = J

 

[kidmegaii]

Is she really a villain?

I consider Roose and Ramsay Bolton villains, but not Cersei. She is just doing what she thinks are the best move for her the Lannisters.

Hell, you could make an argument that Stannis is more of a villain than Cersei. People forget that he used magic to kill Renly. He also used magic to curse Rob Starks. Because the wildling King did not bow to him, he had his ass burned alive.

99% of clan Lannister are assholes, by default that makes her a villain or as close to a villain you can be on that show.

 

[Nobody]

Is she really a villain?

I consider Roose and Ramsay Bolton villains, but not Cersei. She is just doing what she thinks are the best move for her the Lannisters.

Hell, you could make an argument that Stannis is more of a villain than Cersei. People forget that he used magic to kill Renly. He also used magic to curse Rob Starks. Because the wildling King did not bow to him, he had his ass burned alive.

Roose and Ramsay are doing what's best for the Boltons. Ramsay is also a sadist in addition to being a villain.

 

[tuckdog]

a series or film on Roberts Rebellion, would come off like the star wars pre-quel trilogy. We know to much of the story already and as a result the writers and directors would try to get cute with new characters and and plot twists.

What I'd really like to see is an anime style telling of the Dance with Dragons when the Targ's went all out civil war style on each other with 9 or so dragons and Targaryens battling it out.

Martin has a short story in print telling parts of it, but I'm telling you it would be great as an animated feature.

The writers are dedicated to the series. I would hope they would realize the mistakes of the Star Wars prequels and avoid them. I really don't care what medium they use to tell the story, but it needs to be fleshed out for the fans.

 

[Nobody]

WTF are you talking about?

Her character doesn't add anything to where the storyline is NOW?

Cotdamn.. you have not been paying attention.
Lemme help you out...

The very FIRST SCENE (of Season 5 Episode 1) started off with a ‘young Cersei’ visiting a witch in the forest who foretold her future.

The Witch told her: "You will be Queen for a time... then comes another. Younger. More beautiful.... To cast you down and take all you hold dear."

Cersei thinks the prophecy is about Margery and the Tyrell family.
But more than likely that witch was really talking about Khaleesi.

So pretty much everything that is happening RIGHT NOW is because of Cersei trying to PREVENT this prophecy from becoming a reality.

No need to give you any lectures, chief.
You probably wouldn't be able to understand them anyway.

Honestly, I think this show might be too much for you to follow.

Just saying.

To add to it, Sansa is on the path to being Cersei unless things change. Consider Sansa from season 1 to now. Cersei is Sansa's worst case scenario.

 

[tuckdog]

They have the back story that relates to their respective seasons on each blu ray release narrated by the actors/actresses, one of the main reasons I buy them

Yeah, those are the History and Lore vids on YouTube mentioned a few times in the thread. Some of the youtubers have taken time to piece them all together into hour long vids. I still would like to see them acted out in a full length feature, animated or live action series.

 

[dawilleyone]

Is she really a villain?

I consider Roose and Ramsay Bolton villains, but not Cersei. She is just doing what she thinks are the best move for her the Lannisters.

Hell, you could make an argument that Stannis is more of a villain than Cersei. People forget that he used magic to kill Renly. He also used magic to curse Rob Starks. Because the wildling King did not bow to him, he had his ass burned alive.

Using that criteria, Tywin and Littlefinger aren't villains either. Their's nothing ignoble about looking out for your family, but when the ends justify any means well you get villain status.

Her way tends to work in this world, but that don't make it right.

 

[silentking]

Again...the beauty of the show is that nothing is as black & white as hero/villain. All the "good" guys got bodies on em and some kinda dirt. Cersei though...you gotta remember...the show is called Game of Thrones and she's the one who really put us on that concept in S1. "When you play the game of thrones, you win or you die." Her, Stanis, Dany (Varys) and Littlefinger are the only ones left really playing the game so she'll remain important to the show long as she's alive and still making moves.


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[tuckdog]

To add to it, Sansa is on the path to being Cersei unless things change. Consider Sansa from season 1 to now. Cersei is Sansa's worst case scenario.

I just had this same convo with wifey earlier today. We were discussing Sansa and she made a comment about Sansa being weak. I said "sheeiiittttt." That may have been true at the beginning, but after all the bullshit she's been through, someone will feel her wrath before the series is over.

 

[tuckdog]

Using that criteria, Tywin and Littlefinger aren't villains either. Their's nothing ignoble about looking out for your family, but when the ends justify any means well you get villain status.

Her way tends to work in this world, but that don't make it right.

It doesn't make it right by today's standards, but in feudal Westeros, her behavior is expected. Except what they did to the Stark kid.

 

[silentking]

It doesn't make it right by today's standards, but in feudal Westeros, her behavior is honorable.

I think it's a stretch to say her behavior is "honorable" by any standards. The most I'd say is that all of her motives aren't totally fucked up. There's no honor in fucking your cousin to convince him to kill your husband...the King...conspiring to have your brother killed...having kids with your other brother...shit she's gone way past anything honorable. She lusts for power plain and simple...her family is just the face she puts on it.


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[silentking]

It doesn't make it right by today's standards, but in feudal Westeros, her behavior is honorable.

I think it's a stretch to say her behavior is "honorable" by any standards. The most I'd say is that all of her motives aren't totally fucked up. There's no honor in fucking your cousin to convince him to kill your husband...the King...conspiring to have your brother killed...having kids with your other brother...shit she's gone way past anything honorable. She lusts for power plain and simple...her family is just the face she puts on it.


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[tuckdog]

I think it's a stretch to say her behavior is "honorable" by any standards. The most I'd say is that all of her motives aren't totally fucked up. There's no honor in fucking your cousin to convince him to kill your husband...the King...conspiring to have your brother killed...having kids with your other brother...shit she's gone way past anything honorable. She lusts for power plain and simple...her family is just the face she puts on it.


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I tried to go back and change the word honorable before someone responded. I had to remember what they did to the Stark kid. Attempting to kill children is never honorable. Everything outside of that is a go when you're playing the Game of Thrones.

 

[dawilleyone]

I think it's a stretch to say her behavior is "honorable" by any standards. The most I'd say is that all of her motives aren't totally fucked up. There's no honor in fucking your cousin to convince him to kill your husband...the King...conspiring to have your brother killed...having kids with your other brother...shit she's gone way past anything honorable. She lusts for power plain and simple...her family is just the face she puts on it.

don't forget encouraging your brother to push a lil kid to his death cause he caught you fucking him

 

[kidmegaii]

When you do harm or cause harm to a Stark I think that qualifies you as a bad guy.

 

[tuckdog]

As far as the incest, that was common during those times. Especially amongst noble houses. Let's not forget that the patriarch of House Targaryen conquered Westeros along side his two sister/wives.

 

[silentking]

I tried to go back and change the word honorable before someone responded. I had to remember what they did to the Stark kid. Attempting to kill children is never honorable.

I feel you.

But to be honest, even by Westeros standards she would have gotten publicly merked a long time ago if not for her ability to manipulate power to cover her ass. Whether it was her family's money, her husband or sons' crowns, or her interactions with cats like Littlefinger and Varys, she's only alive and in the game cuz she hasn't been fully exposed. But she done set the table for that to change. Once all her shit comes out, they gone be lookin at her like "Westeros don't like that shit...we don't like that shit at all."


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[tuckdog]

I feel you.

But to be honest, even by Westeros standards she would have gotten publicly merked a long time ago if not for her ability to manipulate power to cover her ass. Whether it was her family's money, her husband or sons' crowns, or her interactions with cats like Littlefinger and Varys, she's only alive and in the game cuz she hasn't been fully exposed. But she done set the table for that to change. Once all her shit comes out, they gone be lookin at her like "Westeros don't like that shit...we don't like that shit at all."


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The people loyal to House Lannister will see her deeds as necessary. She made sacrifice after sacrifice for her family and in turn, their loyalists. The only people who will have a problem are the Clergy of the 7, who her silly ass put in power, and members/loyalist of other noble houses vying for the Iron Throne.

 

[silentking]

The people loyal to House Lannister will see her deeds as necessary. She made sacrifice after sacrifice for her family and in turn, their loyalist. The only people who will have a problem are the Clergy of the 7, who her silly ass put in power, and members/loyalist of other noble house vying for the Iron Throne.

What sacrifices did she make for her family? She made sacrifices for power or to keep secrets. Not to mention, outside of the financial grip, the houses loyal to the Lannister's are crazy motherfuckers like the Boltons and the Cleganes.

The incest piece ain't even what makes her the most foul...it's what she did connected to it.....fucked up the Stark boy...fucked up Ned...and lied to all of Westeros presenting them two illegitimate kings. The Targaryans did they incest like bosses in the daylight cuz they had dragons to dare anybody to say something about it.


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[tuckdog]

What sacrifices did she make for her family? She made sacrifices for power or to keep secrets. Not to mention, outside of the financial grip, the houses loyal to the Lannister's are crazy motherfuckers like the Boltons and the Cleganes.


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Fam, first of all I'm mad yall got me trying to defend this broad lol, but you have to admit, she's sacrificed her entire life for this shit. Besides Lady Stark, what other female on the show has dedicated her life so wholeheartedly to achieving the dreams of her father/family?

 

[jdc12]

Using that criteria, Tywin and Littlefinger aren't villains either. Their's nothing ignoble about looking out for your family, but when the ends justify any means well you get villain status.

Her way tends to work in this world, but that don't make it right.

Completely agree with that regarding Tywin and Littlefinger which is a little ironic because those are two of my favorite characters in the series while I despise Cersei. Although it's more because of what Tywin said regarding Cersei not being anywhere near as smart as she thinks she is.

I think a problem with a show like this is everyone is trying to make the characters into traditional heroes and villians while you can make the case that just about every single character can be made to fit both roles.

 

[silentking]

Fam, first of all I'm mad yall got me trying to defend this broad lol, but you have to admit, she's sacrificed her entire life for this shit. Besides Lady Stark, what other female on the show has dedicated her entire life to achieving the dreams of her father/family?

I feel you slightly...but those sacrifices were as much to get what she wanted...a crown. It's easy for her to put her lust for power off on family loyalty, but the reality is she been out for self since the witch gave her that prophecy.


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[tuckdog]

I feel you slightly...but those sacrifices were as much to get what she wanted...a crown. It's easy for her to put her lust for power off on family loyalty, but the reality is she been out for self since the witch gave her that prophecy.


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Question: What do you think she desired more, the crown, or the respect of her father? Tywin drilled that Lannister shit in her head probably since she took her first breath.

 

[silentking]

Here's what I'm saying....the fact that what she wanted and what her father wanted were somewhat aligned doesn't make her ambitions purely noble or about him. I think she wanted to spite her father more than anything. Let's say she didn't go the route she went in life....what was the alternative? Run away and have babies with Jaime? That shit wasn't gonna fly so I mean... It's not like she gave up some respectable dream.


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[tuckdog]