There is nothing healthy about repeating ignorance and spreading idiocy. And there is nothing "ho-motional" about correcting the fool doing so.Sigh...another cat getting all ho-motional over healthy conversation over the internet
Atlanta Educators given up to 20 years for cheating?!?! What?
- Thread starter IT IS WHAT IT IS
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Does anyone know the specifics of the plea deals they were offered?
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You mean like the plea they were offered multiple times
Na, those kids who were screwed out of an education are in a no win situation.
These teachers made a choice.
They don't hear you.
With all the bitching and outrage going on in this thread, I wonder if anyone in here bitching can read...
They had a choice, they knew the charges that were levied against them, and the possible sentences of those charges, they were offered a plea deal, a way out, and they CHOSE not to accept the plea deal. They were tried, convicted, and roasted...
They rolled the dice and lost! The fact that they got so much time is their own fucking fault...
So, once they lost, the DA, who was black by the way, should have said 'Hey, I'm going to offer you the plea deal again, especially after we just wasted tax payer money trying you when you had a chance to plea out previously'
FOH!! They brought it on themselves and there are no fucks given, by me, anyone with common sense OR the damn DA...
Nigga...how did you "correct" me?!? Yelling and spitting on a computer screen doesn't resolve what "racketeering" is. I have an assignment for you. Google "RICO" and prove me wrong.
I'll wait...
I havent yelled at you once you sensitive pussy. And stop using google and think for yourself you mindless mutt. My understanding goes far beyond a fucking engine search and wiki run you silly bitch you. The fact remains that the charges and sentencing were both inappropriate and do nothing to further the lives of any of the parties involved. This isnt justice. This is an abuse of it. And any person sincere and objective should have issue with that. Sentencing first offenders to 20 years under these facts- regardless of plea deals offered- is a fucking outrage, and that is where the bulk of the criticism should lie. Violent offenders and white collar crooks who still millions arent penalized as harshly. The shit is a travesty. Society isnt served with these people incarcerated doing hard time... Under any rationale.
Not sure your argument applies here Sir...
You bring up first time offenders? Well, they were offered 'options' which most repeat offenders don't get which was, the ability to accept a plea and walk away with probation, no jail time. So, when they declined that opportunity, the first time offender card went out the window with their decision.
Secondly, arguing about the crime and punishment and making parallels is irrelevant in this case. They clearly knew what they were being charged with, clearly understood what could happen if convicted, and made the decision and lost
Not sure this is an abuse of power, etc. when, they are thrown a lifeline, refuse it, are basically told we have enough evidence to convict you of these charges and sentence you accordingly, you can go home with probation, and you decline?!?!
Please explain to me how, when a person is given every opportunity to avoid a long jail sentence, doesn't accept it, and then gets a long jail sentence... How is that the systems fault?!?!
All the rhetoric comparing what they did to other crimes that have lesser sentences... at the time of their plea offer, those sentencing guidelines were in place, they were informed and refused to accept the chance to avoid it...
This is on them Dude, and frankly, the argument for them makes no sense when they tempted fate and lost...
Another muthafucka who hasnt a clue of which they speak...First time offender isnt a "card" to begin with, so your understanding is off to say the least. Secondly, if this were a designation to consider in lieu of conviction, they would have been eligible for a first time offender diversion program (which they wernt). Thirdly, there is judicial discretion which allows for such considerations AT SENTENCING. So regardless of plea agreements or rejections, the maximum sentencing under these circumstances should never approach anywhere near two decades.
And to say arguing parallels is irrelevant is further proof you simply do not know what the fuck you are talking about. Since when is context not important in these matters? The law is built on distinctions and theory of fairness and equitable punishment. Are you fucking serious! 20 year sentences for these educators is lunacy. Arguing that they some how deserved it because they didnt except the plea is the exact type of misguided bullshit that has corrupted the system to begin with. How about we dont hand down trumped up bullshit and leverage the threat of undeserving incarceration for lesser punishment? How about actually prosecuting crimes on their face and not abusing laws made with the intent to stop organized crime and interstate criminal enterprise??
You are arguing that they should have essentially taken the plea deal because they knew what sentencing they faced. When the reality is they should have never been subject to that fucking sentencing to begin!
*sigh*
Too much to comment on but I'll say this:
if you are faced with seven years in jail and a 25000 fine versus a year of WEEKENDS in jail, community service and a 2500 fine - which would you choose?
yeah the punishments are harsh but word in the news is that there are multiple cases that have been tried, that are currently in motion, and probably some that are in investigation all around the country that deal with the same thing. Because APS has the biggest so far they wanted to make an example. Does that make it right? no, but it's not an APS, Atlanta, or Georgia problem.
Why is it not a Georgia problem? Thank Bush for that damn No Child Left Behind Act. That was the catalyst for all this shit and paying bonuses for high performing schools
And just cause I'm TRYING to keep this short (i got work) i see these kids affected. i talk to them. I'm listening to their words and they can't even comprehend simple questions. I've said it before these are the same kids who were failing everything but PE 9th grade and put into an AP class in the tenth. Some of yall may not feel the effect of socially promoting students but it's hard when you cant fill out an application correctly. or carry a phone conversation. half of these kids probably aren't even fit to get a job at Ross.
I don't like the picture it paints that it was Black educators that did this (nor am I happy when the same thing happened in Detroit with the blaming, there's a doc on that) the direct competition to keep up with other demographics in other schools was too much. People got greedy. Should have taken the deal.
Too much to comment on but I'll say this:
if you are faced with seven years in jail and a 25000 fine versus a year of WEEKENDS in jail, community service and a 2500 fine - which would you choose?
yeah the punishments are harsh but word in the news is that there are multiple cases that have been tried, that are currently in motion, and probably some that are in investigation all around the country that deal with the same thing. Because APS has the biggest so far they wanted to make an example. Does that make it right? no, but it's not an APS, Atlanta, or Georgia problem.
Why is it not a Georgia problem? Thank Bush for that damn No Child Left Behind Act. That was the catalyst for all this shit and paying bonuses for high performing schools
And just cause I'm TRYING to keep this short (i got work) i see these kids affected. i talk to them. I'm listening to their words and they can't even comprehend simple questions. I've said it before these are the same kids who were failing everything but PE 9th grade and put into an AP class in the tenth. Some of yall may not feel the effect of socially promoting students but it's hard when you cant fill out an application correctly. or carry a phone conversation. half of these kids probably aren't even fit to get a job at Ross.
I don't like the picture it paints that it was Black educators that did this (nor am I happy when the same thing happened in Detroit with the blaming, there's a doc on that) the direct competition to keep up with other demographics in other schools was too much. People got greedy. Should have taken the deal.
Why do some of you keep pretending that these exams are the cause of kids being unprepared or uneducated. Their inability to pass these standardized exams is a mere illustration of an already existing problem that has ZERO to do with the exam. Further, again, i have to remind some of you, these fucking exams dont determine whether a child passes or is detained.. Framing this as a scheme to push kids through is a trick of misdirection.
This
So... after calmly asking you simple questions, I have to be 3 motherfuckas and stupid... Cool. I won't THIS time lower myself to the hypersensitive nature that you are obviously dealing with so...
You say abuse: Cool. I'm sure all the 'layers' you try to add to the argument to support your weak ass position were discussed at the plea bargaining table, and they had full disclosure of these facts before they made their decision to go to trial or else their convictions would be oerturned which they are not, so Anybody with even a minor bit of of commonsense sees the fallacies of your 'argument'
Regardless of how unjust you believe the laws and sentencing guidelines are, they were in place BEFORE these invididuals did what they did, where in place and explained to them BEFORE they went to trial, and they still chose to temp fate.
The issue with people like you is you have a victim mentality and like to blame everyone else for their predicament, yet ignoring the choices and actions of the 'victim' when they get mollywhopped, like these people did. That's really a weak mindset which will only facilitate more 'victims' and doesn't change anything...
They did not HAVE to be sentenced to 20 years, they didn't HAVE to go to trial AND, no matter how much you try to cross shit up to further your very weak 'argument' they WERE treated like first time offenders initially, because repeat offenders are normally NEVER offered plea deals
Is 20 years excessive for this type of charge, absolutely! Did they have to go to jail for 20 years?! Absolutely NOT!!!
Why are they in jail for 20 years?! BECAUSE THEY DID NOT ACCEPT THE LIFELINE THAT WAS THROWN TO THEM!!
Your argument is probably one of the most irrational arguments I've ever heard hear, but coming from you it should be expected! It's like telling someone, if you walk in front of a moving car, you will get hurt or killed because the car is big and hard, so DO NOT WALK OUT INTO TRAFFIC, but once the person decides to walk out into traffic and gets hit and killed, the car manufacturers are wrong for making cars big and out of hard material and making them move so fast...
One thing about the smartest people in the room types like you is... most of the time you actually don't engage your brain at all...
No matter how 'passionate' you off balance argument is, it's still off balance and weak...
I heard it said once... 'Reasons don't matter, its the consequences of choices we have to live with' 20 years is the consequence of the choices they made, no judge, jury, etc. FORCED them to make that choice... deal with it and stop bitching about nonsense...
So how do you feel about other test like. PSAT, ACT, SAT, PCAT, GRE, GMAT, LSAT, MCAT, ASVAB NCLEX, and Praxis? there are schools that are dropping ACT, and SAT for entry considerations into college. Do you think that's a good idea?
Really Dude, I'm done with this topic with this guy, because people like him, like to put blinders on because they either qualify themselves by the victim role, or they are really too 'intelligent' for their own good and are really quite stupid. The whole argument about excessive sentencing goes out the window when you are offered a chance to avoid it, told what would happen based on evidence if you went to trial, and you chose to anyway and get the book thrown at you. However, people like him will never see the whole picture, thus either not having a brain or refusing to engage it! Probation or 20 years?!?! Probation was a guarantee, 20 years was a strong possibility and you choose to tempt fate on the 20 years, and you get roasted?!?! Yet it's the systems fault. Yeah, that's a strong point of contention to argue right there...
I see what you're saying, but asking them to waive their right appeal was kind of a deal breaker.
Good ol nigga logic. Dudes typing whole books and insulting folks for not disagreeing...while not once taking the actions of the offenders into account. Perfect nigga logic. Just like dudes who sell drugs then get mad at the sentences handed out.
The judge himself said the RICO charge was not properly applied. He said that he knows the law but jurors don't and they would able to be convinced.
My bad though I guess lenient plea deals and fines weren't offered. I guess the fact that some who took those deals were able to keep their jobs means nothing. My bad. Let's be outraged that folks who willingly and admittedly broke the law, were offered deals and rejected them multiple times ...got a harsh sentence.
The judge himself said the RICO charge was not properly applied. He said that he knows the law but jurors don't and they would able to be convinced.
My bad though I guess lenient plea deals and fines weren't offered. I guess the fact that some who took those deals were able to keep their jobs means nothing. My bad. Let's be outraged that folks who willingly and admittedly broke the law, were offered deals and rejected them multiple times ...got a harsh sentence.
^^This is why I believe they walked away from the deal. Maybe their attorneys advised them that there is possibly something better at a higher court.
It Is What It is........ I wont quote your posts because all it does is highlight and display more misinformed and uneducated rhetoric that really doesnt need to be repeated or reposted. Your point essentially boils down to "it wasnt excessive punishment because they were offered a lesser plea deal before sentencing". That mindset shows a complete lack of understanding, intellectual honesty, and objectivity that its quite frankly sad to continually hear rattled off. Their charges go against the rule and spirit of the law, and represent a misapplication that is the first of its kind. Offering a plea deal doesnt negate this.
Its unfortunate but you are not equipped to discuss this matter from any perspective other than a surface level novice who is intent on seeing this as a face value scenario where these people got what they deserved because they didnt accept plea agreements. Its far deeper than that. This isnt some binary bullshit where it starts and stops with either take the plea or do 20 years. Reducing it to that is idiocy, and ignores the numerous injustices at play here.
To say that these people wernt overcharged and over sentenced because they refused plea deals is nonsense. The real tragedy is that they were ever charged in this manner to begin with.
And to have a judge reside over the case, grandstanding, and making ridiculous comments like "This is the worst thing ive ever seen in a court room"?? Are you fucking serious!! And all you muthafuckas can say is "well they were offered a plea deal".. Insane.
Its unfortunate but you are not equipped to discuss this matter from any perspective other than a surface level novice who is intent on seeing this as a face value scenario where these people got what they deserved because they didnt accept plea agreements. Its far deeper than that. This isnt some binary bullshit where it starts and stops with either take the plea or do 20 years. Reducing it to that is idiocy, and ignores the numerous injustices at play here.
To say that these people wernt overcharged and over sentenced because they refused plea deals is nonsense. The real tragedy is that they were ever charged in this manner to begin with.
And to have a judge reside over the case, grandstanding, and making ridiculous comments like "This is the worst thing ive ever seen in a court room"?? Are you fucking serious!! And all you muthafuckas can say is "well they were offered a plea deal".. Insane.
They aren't listening to you.
These kids were robbed by the people that were responsible for educating them.
Here is a streaming link to that vid use flashget or ant video to rip it.
http://www.redtube.com/459137
There are 4 parts on this site.
Oh they are now free on an appeals bond so there may be hope for them yet.
Dont talk about nigga logic when you cant compose a concise coherent sentence and then go forth and use a drug dealing analogy you fucking moron. Not to mention you acknowledge even the fucking judge called the charges inappropriate yet did nothing to address the injustice.
The nigga logic is the one that equates these transgressions with drug dealing while calling a plea deal that still gives excessive punishment as "lenient". You're a fucking idiot.
Lastly, dumbass, my entire premise is based on me taking their "actions into account" you fucking mutt. Thats the entire basis of my argument.
Nah...it doesn't matter as long as white people do it too.
You have to try a little harder. You sound you are sitting up in your G.I. Joe pajamas with a helmet on yelling at the screen. All that tough talk over a computer reveals what type of clown you actually are..In any event the only moronic person here is you. At the end of the day you can type juvenile insults until you get carpal tunnel, the fact is that they knowingly participated in illegal activity. As teachers they knew good and well that changing test scores was against the law and they did it anyway. Did they know they could get charged with the RICO law? I'm pretty sure they did not, however they were still aware of the nature of their conduct.
Those kids have been irreparably damaged. Not one child...hundreds, possibly thousands. People are blaming the parents like the parents aren't the ones that raised the red flags. Why don't you tell your story of this great "injustice" to a parent of a child that is several years behind educationally due to the actions of the educators involved. You can't put a number of years or dollars on that damage.
The bottom line is they had a choice. Teaching is not blood in blood out. They could have transferred to teach in another district or reported illegal activity, instead they participated. I'm sure that since you are such a legal expert you also know that just because the law is created for a certain purpose does not mean that it cannot be interpreted to fit others. The law cannot fuck you if you do not get in the bed.
This is the problem i have when imbeciles come into discussions half cocked parroting misinformation and further misrepresenting the facts and matters at hand. If you bothered to truly read the thread, the responses you address, or the facts of the case at hand you would realize how fucking patently idiotic everything you typed above is. Repeating the same horse shit narrative about "irreparably damaged" is nothing more than headline tripe. No different than the overly dramatic
wailings from the judge who described this scandal as the worst thing hes ever seen in his court room. Its all bullshit. And instead of addressing the matter on the merits, you guys operate in soundbites and hyperbole and contrived narratives created to scapegoat educators while justifying what amounts to prosecutorial misconduct and an abuse of discretion.
The merits were they were found guilty by a jury of their peers. That's not a soundbite, that's a real life verdict, on the merits.
These cacs and Jews been perpetuating that cheating shit within the NYC board of education for years and going as far as stealing money... Not a peep
But black teachers given unrealistic expectation from that no child left behind bullshit now all of a sudden cacs want to speak in integrity? Fuck these cacs
But black teachers given unrealistic expectation from that no child left behind bullshit now all of a sudden cacs want to speak in integrity? Fuck these cacs
These kids weren't only robbed by their teachers, they were robbed before they even made it to the classroom. I've seen some of their single parents, and to be quite frank, they didn't sound all that intelligent either. 
Sent from Clayton County Department of Corrections using Pay Phone
Sent from Clayton County Department of Corrections using Pay Phone
Only cac I've seen is the judge, the prosecuter and d.a. are black.
These kids weren't only robbed by their teachers, they were robbed before they even made it to the classroom. I've seen some of their single parents, and to be quite frank, they didn't sound all that intelligent either.
Sent from Clayton County Department of Corrections using Pay Phone
I've got stories for days about the lack of parent participation at one of these schools.
I remember being at one of the schools and the two GBI Tahoe's were broken into while they were there
Right. But thats never been disputed asshole. So im not sure your point or purpose.
So everybody is misinformed but you huh? Please share your favorite factual information and links or shut the fuck up! All your doing is taking out of your assistance and making less than no sense to anyone with common sense fool...
Bottom line is these 12 were of offered the chance to plea out and walk, they chose not to take it so they are guest of the system for up to 20 years while the ones smart enough to take it will be at home laughing at their dumbasses. All the bullshit you type really doesn't mean a damp thing...
Only cac I've seen is the judge, the prosecuter and d.a. are black.
I've got stories for days about the lack of parent participation at one of these schools.
I remember being at one of the schools and the two GBI Tahoe's were broken into while they were there
True and the DA ain't shit.. This was clearly a hit job to make a name for himself, granted these teachers should've known better because they don't get the same leash as cacs...
Personal attacks are no substitute for substantive analysis. Carry on internet tough guy, carry on...
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