Who is black in America? Ethnic tensions flare between black Americans and black immigrants

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Who is black in America? Ethnic tensions flare between black Americans and black immigrants.
by Valerie Russ, Updated: October 19, 2018



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(PHOTO BY CHARLES SYKES/INVISION/AP
As soon as it was announced that filming would start for a Harriet Tubman biopic with British Nigerian actress Cynthia Erivo as the lead, a social media fury erupted. An online appeal went up demanding that an African American woman be cast as Tubman, who, after escaping slavery, made more than a dozen trips to lead others to freedom on the Underground Railroad.

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SMITHSONIAN
This photo of Harriet Tubman, the most widely known symbol of the Underground Railroad, was taken between 1860 and 1875.
In the Change.org petition, which garnered 1,123 signatures by Oct. 17, organizer Tyler Holmes wrote: "We will boycott the film Harriet until you hire an actual black American actress to play the part."

Part of the anger directed at Erivo was that social media users unearthed an old tweet where Erivo had mocked a "ghetto American accent." Critics said she denigrated African Americans on one hand, but sought to portray an iconic African American hero on the other.

This came after a tangle in August when Nigerian-born blogger and author Luvvie Ajayi wrote that Tevin Campbell was too obscure a choice to sing at Aretha Franklin's funeral. "Under what rock did they pull that name from?" Ajayi quipped. The Twitter response was livid.

Such arguments, dubbed by some "the diaspora war," reveal more than preferences over movie roles and pop culture. The rancor provides a peek into a debate about identity in America, raising questions about how a changing black population increasingly diverse with immigrants and refugees from Africa, the Caribbean, Britain, and elsewhere — sees itself and is seen by the majority.

Who is black in America? Can there be unity based on skin color alone? Who gets to speak for African Americans?

Although there is more nuance to the arguments, the sides often go like this: Black immigrants are respected more than black Americans, all the while benefiting from reparations meant to right evils of America's past. That's led to some black Americans redefining themselves as "American Descendants of Slavery" to spotlight their claim on America's promises. Meanwhile, immigrants discover they're newly identified as "black" in a white nation — an unnecessary distinction in Nigeria, Ghana, or Jamaica — and say that when pulled over by cops, no one cares whether they have a charming accent.

These identity issues are showing up at universities, during marches, and at theaters, and raise questions of whether these diverging groups can, or want to, build coalitions for political change.

We talked to a number of experts — immigrants and Americans — to help explain the origins of the tension and how the issue is playing out.

One source of contention is who benefits from “diversity” efforts.
For decades, researchers have studied how universities are increasing the numbers of black students at majority-white colleges. But some of the current tensions between immigrants and African Americans can be traced to a theory that the nation's most selective universities have shifted away from racial-justice remedies — things like affirmative action that were put in place to right the wrongs of slavery and Jim Crow segregation — by using diversity as a goal instead.

A study published in the American Journal of Education in 2007 found that immigrants or children of immigrants, while making up 13 percent of the nation's black 18- and 19-year-olds — accounted for 41 percent of blacks admitted to Ivy League schools.

"If it's about getting black faces at Harvard, then you're doing fine," Mary C. Waters, the former chair of Harvard's sociology department, told the New York Times about a need for a philosophical discussion on affirmative action. "If it's about making up for 200 to 500 years of slavery in this country and its aftermath, then you're not doing well."

Compounding the tension is a fivefold increase in the black immigrant population in recent decades. There were 4.2 million black immigrants living in the United States in 2016, up from 816,000 in 1980, according to a Pew Research Center report. As more black immigrants experience success, they get what Fordham University professor Christina M. Greer calls "elevated minority status."

"Foreign-born blacks are often perceived by whites and even black Americans as different and 'special' — as harder-working and more productive citizens than their black American counterparts," Greer wrote in her book Black Ethnics: Race, Immigration, and the Pursuit of the American Dream.

It's a phenomenon that academics started noticing decades ago — that immigrants generally are "strivers" who work hard to better their lives.

It's not quite an apples-to-apples comparison, though.

Onoso Imoagene, a University of Pennsylvania sociologist born in Nigeria, who studies African immigrants and how they adapt to discrimination in America, said that although more than half of Nigerians in America are college-educated, just 7 percent of Nigerians living abroad have at least a bachelor's degree. So those who end up in the United States are the most educated — "a hyper-selected group," she said.

Immigrants don’t carry the same racial trauma as Americans, experts say.
Even before immigrants come here, said Amy Yeboah, an assistant professor of African American studies at Howard University and the American-born daughter of Ghanian parents, they have an advantage American blacks often don't.

"If you are educated in Ghana, your level of education will be different from what you get in the Bronx," said Yeboah, who grew up in New York and earned her undergraduate and doctoral degrees from Temple University. "Students who apply from Ghana compared to those who are born here will do better, because they are prepared better."

Harvard professor Lani Guinier told the Washington Post that immigrants have an added benefit.

"In part, it has to do with coming from a country … where blacks were in the majority and did not experience the stigma that black children did in the United States," she said.

Immigrants are not oblivious to discrimination in their home countries, said Imoagene. It's just that those experiences haven't involved skin color.

"We have our own axes of stratification, when you think of ethnic lines [in Nigeria] — whether you are Yoruba or Igbo, or Christian or Muslim," she said. "Then you come here and find out you're [also] black, and have to learn the racial meanings attached to that status."

What’s resulted is a movement to declare who is entitled to what.
Some black Americans want to redefine themselves as an "American Descendant of Slavery," or ADOS, rather than African American.

Antonio Moore, a lawyer in California, and Yvette Carnell, a former journalist and congressional aide, appear to be leading the charge. The two make regular YouTube videos arguing that people whose ancestors were enslaved have a "justice claim" that black immigrants don't.

"We have been doing 'people of color' politics, but if you want to talk about what people who have been identified as African Americans need and what we are owed, then we have to change that definition." Carnell said.

On her videos, she has often criticized former President Barack Obama for saying this is a nation of immigrants. "We were not immigrants. We were property, we were chattel slaves. That's a difference."

Neither Americans nor immigrants are a monolith.
Michelle Saahene's voice was heard around the world when she spoke in April at the Center City Starbucks where a manager called the police on two black American men because they asked to use the bathroom without placing an order.

"They didn't do anything," Saahene, of Philadelphia, said in the viral video of the incident.

Raised in Central Pennsylvania, Saahene, now 32, said it was difficult for her to negotiate her racial identity as the daughter of immigrants growing up in Palmyra, a predominantly white town near Lebanon. Her teachers treated her well because she excelled in school. But at Pennsylvania State University and other places, she felt she got the cold shoulder from African American students.

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STEVEN M. FALK / STAFF PHOTOGRAPHER
Michelle Saahene is the child of Ghanaian immigrants.
Since those times, she has traveled back to Ghana. At Elmina Castle, where captured Africans were held before being taken on ships destined for the Americas, she wept.

"I … imagined what it was like to experience the torture, the rape and murder, and I looked out on the ocean and imagined being on a boat, sailing away, and I got sick to my stomach. When I got back to America, it was impossible for me to look at all African Americans and not see them as my possible brothers and sisters, neighbors and family and friends in Africa.

"To me, this feud between Africans and African Americans, it's terrible and it needs to stop."

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DAVID SWANSON / STAFF PHOTOGRAPHER
Rosita Johnson, an 86-year-old former schoolteacher, was presented this year with a special award from the South African government for her work helping children who fled to Tanzania.
Earlier this year, Rosita Johnson, a retired Philadelphia teacher, was honored by the South African government for her efforts starting in the '80s to support a school for children who fled to Tanzania after the Soweto protests of white rule.

At her Germantown home, the 86-year-old talked about the tensions between some Americans and Africans. A fractured black population, she said, only helps those in power.

"It's a divide-and-conquer tactic," said Johnson, "because African Americans are Africans. These are our cousins. If you're African American, you're related to somebody over there. Unfortunately, because of slavery and colonization, all people of African descent have suffered from racism. I call it a mental illness."

http://www2.philly.com/philly/news/...-american-descendants-of-slaves-20181018.html
 
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I don't have a problem with any melanin rich folks on this planet.

Who is creating this narrative?

It's been around for some time. You could arguably trace it back to the early 1900s, when some West Indians migrated to the U.S.. Possibly trace it to the DuBois vs Garvey debates. But, these days, I think it's coming from college campuses.

I've personally seen the feud between Africans and African Americans and it's really dumb.

There is no reason any blacks regardless where you're from should be having issues with each other because they see us all the same.

Your statement is predicated on all of us seeing ourselves through white people's eyes and lenses.
 
It's been around for some time. You could arguably trace it back to the early 1900s, when some West Indians migrated to the U.S.. Possibly trace it to the DuBois vs Garvey debates. But, these days, I think it's coming from college campuses.



Your statement is predicated on all of us seeing ourselves through white people's eyes and lenses.
Yeah it's a real thing. I think this article attempted to handle it pretty moderately and.brought in a few perspectives. Its worth discussion before it gets out of hand. I don't agree with Yvette Carnell and that whole "descendants of slaves" title. Kinda simplistic and -- well if you're gonna name your SELF -thats not the Title I would go with.
 
African Americans are the sole reason other POC's were able to come to the US in the first place. They(other POC's) weren't in no hurry to come here when our people were getting burned alive and hung from whatever tree or lightpost they could find. We held our own nuts and carried the fight to the most vicious beasts in human disguise and changed laws that all benefit from. Despite all they did and are still doing, we are still here and we ain't going no damn where. We Black Americans sees the beast for what he is and we refuse to sell our dignity and integrity to fully "assimilate" with them. These other POC's groups trying to snuggle up with them beasts. We are battle tested in the wilderness, they are not.
 
Yeah they are passing up black american actors and using actors from england which is pure bullshit and the top black actors here in america need to take a stand because there are actors that have been struggling their whole career waiting on that one role,some damn good actors at that and to use someone who isn't even american for whatever reason is crazy.Sam Jackson spoke on it.

It's bullshit but the struggle is real between us and them and it's more of a them problem than it is us because someone them frankly live different culturally but when they come here they adult the mindset of whoever they think is beneficial to them more....I've seen some old bitter asses who have kissed white folks asses for years and as soon as they see it gets them no where they try to help their fellow brotha man or sista and they secretly talk about whites but they cant say it to too many blacks or one of those coons might out em.....its a messy game of bullshit at the end of the day.
 
I don't have a problem with any melanin rich folks on this planet.

Who is creating this narrative?

This. The fuck we arguing with each other for and clowning while the real oppressor sits back and laugh? Stop the madness. I don't give a fuck if you obsidian black (which I love) or cream latte. We are all black, dumbasses.
 
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Yeah it's a real thing. I think this article attempted to handle it pretty moderately and.brought in a few perspectives. Its worth discussion before it gets out of hand. I don't agree with Yvette Carnell and that whole "descendants of slaves" title. Kinda simplistic and -- well if you're gonna name your SELF -thats not the Title I would go with.

It's not about the title; it's about the history, lineage, and, most importantly, economic disenfranchisement that the "DOS" term carries with it.
 
I don't have a problem with any melanin rich folks on this planet.

Who is creating this narrative?
You may not but there are those who amongst us feel very strongly about this issue. I know a few and they have that right... The division is strategically created by whites and ignorantly propagated by Blacks. Whites supremacy have always had their preferred Blacks.

As someone who identifies as Afro-Carribean, I do very well to relate to both sides and stay neutral from divisive and separatists ideologies as it does not advanced the greater fight against systemic white supremacy. I do, however, think that my Afro-American brothers and sisters raise good points regarding their case for being a special group whose struggles and needs warrant special attention and care, but some are doing it from a place that creates division rather than unity across the diaspora. As for Native born Africans, they must learn about the struggles of Black Americans and respect the fact that the opportunities being given to them or any form other of advancement is a direct byproduct of the Civil Rights Movement.
 
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This. The fuck we arguing with each other for and clowning while the real oppressor sits back and laugh? Stop the madness. I don't give a fuck if you obsidian black (which I love) or cream latte. We are all black, dumbasses.


He just forgot the comma. Goes a long way.

As for this divide, its silly. Black immigrants don't quite understand a black Americans fight and struggle and therefore is in a better position to be patient about things. I've always said that we as black Americans are the most emotionally damaged and torn down in the diaspora, so if and when we do act out, it's best to understand the psychology behind it before making assumptions.
 
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African Americans are the sole reason other POC's were able to come to the US in the first place. They(other POC's) weren't in no hurry to come here when our people were getting burned alive and hung from whatever tree or lightpost they could find. We held our own nuts and carried the fight to the most vicious beasts in human disguise and changed laws that all benefit from. Despite all they did and are still doing, we are still here and we ain't going no damn where.

Fully agree!

We Black Americans sees the beast for what he is and we refuse to sell our dignity and integrity to fully "assimilate" with them. These other POC's groups trying to snuggle up with them beasts. We are battle tested in the wilderness, they are not.

And therein lies the problem. This is the divisive talk that gets us nowhere!
 
And therein lies the problem. This is the divisive talk that gets us nowhere!

Well we did not start the problem. We are just reacting in the most righteous indignant way possible. I refuse to let others come here and think they can look down their nose at us because they did not recognize the struggles we made that they benefit from. That is not divisive, that is standing up, telling the unapologetic truth, and demanding respect. I think our existence in this wilderness warrants us to demand said respect. Until they experience the indignities we had to suffer in this colony for over 4 centuries they need to fall back and brush up on learning American history. We up to speed over here, they need cliffnotes.
 
African Americans are the sole reason other POC's were able to come to the US in the first place. They(other POC's) weren't in no hurry to come here when our people were getting burned alive and hung from whatever tree or lightpost they could find. We held our own nuts and carried the fight to the most vicious beasts in human disguise and changed laws that all benefit from. Despite all they did and are still doing, we are still here and we ain't going no damn where. We Black Americans sees the beast for what he is and we refuse to sell our dignity and integrity to fully "assimilate" with them. These other POC's groups trying to snuggle up with them beasts. We are battle tested in the wilderness, they are not.
Holy shit.



Record this moment. I agree with you lmao
 
Well we did not start the problem. We are just reacting in the most righteous indignant way possible. I refuse to let others come here and think they can look down their nose at us because they did not recognize the struggles we made that they benefit from. That is not divisive, that is standing up, telling the unapologetic truth, and demanding respect. I think our existence in this wilderness warrants us to demand said respect. Until they experience the indignities we had to suffer in this colony for over 4 centuries they need to fall back and brush up on learning American history. We up to speed over here, they need cliffnotes.

I agree, they should smarten up and learn about the plights of AA. As someone who is educated about the subject matter, you're in a position to teach and educate those who are not as learned as you are. Ignorance of truth and knowledge is not something met with respect and appreciation if it's coming in the form of defensive attacks however warranted you may feel it to be. I am not asking you to be apologetic, I am asking to to be more understanding and tactful regarding teaching those who may not know. Help to bridge the gap rather than widening the chasm.
 
One thing that I like about the trump presidency is that everybody got there Nigga wake up card. All these immigrants from Dominican, Puerto Rican to Trinidadian that claim there not black and want to look down on black Americans. Trump showed them that the end of the day there all niggas.

Just understand that white supremacy is all that matters in this country. So people of color need to stop the infighting
 
I agree, they should smarten up and learn about the plights of AA. As someone who is educated about the subject matter, you're in a position to teach and educate those who are not as learned as you are. Ignorance of truth and knowledge is not something met with respect and appreciation if it's coming in the form of defensive attacks however warranted you may feel it to be. I am not asking you to be apologetic, I am asking to to be more understanding and tactful regarding teaching those who may not know. Help to bridge the gap rather than widening the chasm.

Don't get me wrong I have much respect for their work ethic when they come to the US. I am also envious that they have their cultural identity and heritage intact. I think us black people in the US should take note about how industrious and economically viable they are and how they are thriving despite a lack of political presence. Their old world values help keep them grounded and focused, we can learn a lot from them.
 
I find it odd that they’re always getting non black Americans to play black American roles. It’s like they’re systematically doing the shit.

They had some African Play Dr King
They had an African Play a black American in Get Out
They give Zoey Saldana black American roles and she’s Dominican and don’t fuck with blacks at all.
The Rock is half Black American but he getting the role of a dark skinned strong black male

12 Years a Slave had non black Americans playing major roles.
 
Don't get me wrong I have much respect for their work ethic when they come to the US. I am also envious that they have their cultural identity and heritage intact. I think us black people in the US should take note about how industrious and economically viable they are and how they are thriving despite a lack of political presence. Their old world values help keep them grounded and focused, we can learn a lot from them.

That is because where they come from there is no safety net. If you don’t work you do not eat. Where as a lot of Americans over time have become spoiled and entitled.

Which is why I can understand why socialism and communism never works. People become lazy and do not try there best because they can always run to the government
 
That is because where they come from there is no safety net. If you don’t work you do not eat. Where as a lot of Americans over time have become spoiled and entitled.

Which is why I can understand why socialism and communism never works. People become lazy and do not try there best because they can always run to the government

You right about that lack of safety net where they are from.
 
It never amazes me. No other group has to get along. I wonder what would happen if you started letting Japanese take Chinese roles. Or how about Koreans taking Japanese roles. Fuck it. They all the same right? Hell no. Call a Japanese person a Korean and it's an insult. They have slurs for each other. Must be self-hate. :hmm:

White Americans don't have to be cool with Europeans.

But once again, it's something wrong with black people if they have the same issues as other groups. :smh: Nigerians have Nollywood. Are black Americans getting roles over there? I don't know. Serious question.
 
It never amazes me. No other group has to get along. I wonder what would happen if you started letting Japanese take Chinese roles. Or how about Koreans taking Japanese roles. Fuck it. They all the same right? Hell no. Call a Japanese person a Korean and it's an insult. They have slurs for each other. Must be self-hate. :hmm:

White Americans don't have to be cool with Europeans.

But once again, it's something wrong with black people if they have the same issues as other groups. :smh: Nigerians have Nollywood. Are black Americans getting roles over there? I don't know. Serious question.

If I was a black American actor looking for work I would do Nollywood. I don't know why more black US actors don't try and go there to get work.
 
Pocket watching. Angry about someone else's success that doesn't affect them. Work harder, and get those roles. Stop being mad at someone elses hard work or hustle.
 
If I was a black American actor looking for work I would do Nollywood. I don't know why more black US actors don't try and go there to get work.

They would have to move to Africa...African Americans absolutely do not want to do that. All the resources, riches, and opportunity....nah, its Africa.
 
They would have to move to Africa...African Americans absolutely do not want to do that. All the resources, riches, and opportunity....nah, its Africa.

Sad but true and funny all at once. Yeah I remember when rapper NORE said he turned down gigs in Africa because he believed all the stereotypes about it. Then you have Akon who is telling black Americans that opportunity is there in Africa for us.

 
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The model minority ideology hasn’t stopped at all. Seen it with Asians as model students and workers now we are experiencing it with Africans from other countries in entertainment. But I presume it will backfire just as it did with Asians when they started taking over colleges, same will happen in Hollywood. lol
 
Well the title might as well be "niggas"

I'd like something that has a forward direction
That's retarded. One title is based in fact and the other is based on a pejorative. So jews shouldn't refer to themselves as holocaust survivors? That's dense.
 
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