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White Male Privilege Rebuttal Construction Thread

gene cisco said:
Should I had sources to my post....lord knows I have them....
Click to expand...

you can add sources to your post. it can be a mixture.


SlimKid07 said:
Great thread. :yes:

You guys have touched on most things that can be used to counter his bullshit.
Click to expand...


there are still a few sections left, so see one that just makes you want to say something and then directly attack his point with the truth.

we're almost there.
 
this ought to be good,

I dont think you need anymore

people that squad right there

is waaaay more than enough....


Great Idea...

five star thread
 
Rough draft...


Before you took one breath of air, before you ever laid eyes upon your mother's face, before you took one step, said one word, or conjured one thought, a system had been set in place for you. Not for everyone. But for you.

By the merit of simply being born a white male, it was never a question that Princeton was an option for you, let alone college. After all most of the people that attend look like you, and almost all of the people that administer it look like you. Glance at photographs of the distinguished alumni of the school's history, and they most certainly almost exclusively look like you.

By the merit of being born a white male, you will never have to know what is like to have the officers that are the sworn protectors of your community also be one of the biggest threats against you. How can equal protection not be a myth when the protectors consider you the enemy?

By the merit of being born a white male, you were given the seeds you sowed. You were given the plow, and the tillers, and the almanac to know what to plant when and where. That is a far cry from having to find your own way to scratch a living out of the only barren patch of ground you had access to, to make bricks with no straw.

In highlighting the fact that you put in hard work to get where you are, you unknowingly are proving that the ultimate privilege of being a white male is that hard work is enough for you. There are no societal or institutional decks stacked against you.
 
4 & 5

The privilege we talk about has a dual existence.

- That of the past and thus all the privileges enjoyed (or not) because of your race.

- That of the present/future. A Black person who IS accomplished WILL have graver and more challenges in life than a White person on equal or lesser footing. This is the present and future problem and the one I am concerned about for myself and my children. When dude walks out his door, his default privilege is based on how people recognize him. White male? He already has a leg up on anyone else and they don't have to know who he is or what he has done in the past.

See brothers' they want us to argue over past shit like reparations when they know that won't build a nation. I don't care about reparations. The American dream is about success, so let it be based on the work put in.
 
Shit like this is why I pay my membership....

This is a beautiful thing man I swear it is

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk
 
Perhaps it’s the privilege my grandfather and his brother had to flee their home as teenagers when the Nazis invaded Poland, leaving their mother and five younger siblings behind, running and running until they reached a Displaced Persons camp in Siberia, where they would do years of hard labor in the bitter cold until World War II ended.[You are describing an atrocity that lasted one generation.Slavery in the US lasted 4-5 generations.Additionally,families were torn apart by trading and slaves were killed for reading and writing. So the "privilege" of passing down the vivid details of their struggle to descendents was not available to them.



Maybe it was the privilege my grandfather had of taking on the local Rabbi’s work in that DP camp, telling him that the spiritual leader shouldn’t do hard work, but should save his energy to pass Jewish tradition along to those who might survive.[Not to minimize the tragedy that you are describing,but in comparison to slavery,that was in fact a privilege! I have yet to find a credible source that described that slaves had the power and ability to allocate the work and choose who takes gets the day off. I have yet to find a credible source that has noted slaves having the ability to pass on African traditions during slavery.In fact, most credible historical sources will describe that slaves who tried to retain their African traditions were threatened with violence or death.Most credible historical sources note that even learning or teaching a slave to read or write lead to a punishment up to and including death. Compared to that, yes it was a "privilege" to be able to choose who gets not work and concentrate their effort to retain and teach your traditions. Perhaps it was the privilege my great-grandmother and those five great-aunts and uncles I never knew had of being shot into an open grave outside their hometown. Maybe that’s my privilege.

Or maybe it’s the privilege my grandmother had of spending weeks upon weeks on a death march through Polish forests in subzero temperatures, one of just a handful to survive, only to be put in Bergen-Belsen concentration camp where she would have died but for the Allied forces who liberated her and helped her regain her health when her weight dwindled to barely 80 pounds.




*I see others have already hit on the civil rights movement and racism, so I'll just leave with the above*
I also apologize for the poor grammar. I'm at work and exhausted.
 
Last edited:
I like how in this thread:

People are actually reading the text and responding to the argument. Too many potentially good threads get derailed before they ever get a chance to develop.

Wish this was the rule and not the exception.
 
spider705 said:
Shit like this is why I pay my membership....

This is a beautiful thing man I swear it is

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

true that. True that. there is some serious dialogue going on here that could seriously start to build something once much of the confrontational argument has dissipated. There are many intelligent people from all walks of life on this board, and when we sort out those who offer solutions and don't completely identify problems we can start building something here. It is possible that the tree can be saved

Now, if I could only find a way to scrounge up about 25 million I can seriously find a way to get something done and not have people hanging on only worried about profits. it might not even take that much. I have never liked the Profit over people way of living in the current society. My plan put the onus of looking after the community on the community. You have to give them something to be proud of.look good feel good feel good play good play good get paid good
 
The sections have roman numerals so you can identify your section and go over it.

they will not appear in the final presentation of this ETHER.

I did not make huge changes to anyone's piece, just tidied it up a bit. and I added a closing statement to the end.

This is our collaborative black voice.

I. When a certain group of people manage to go through the gauntlet of life and come out Ok, their success story is always praised because of their sex or skin. With hundreds of years having passed, why is it a big deal whenever a person of color, a female, a person with a different sexual orientation, or all of the above accomplishes something? The answer is because that's not how the system we function in is designed to work.

There is a term that nobody says out loud but is spoken in the backrooms of all the important places in America. In the school admissions offices, in the human resource departments across the country. This was just a point of emphasis in the supreme court. The term is affirmative action. Affirmative action was put in place because without it, companies, schools, jobs and banks would strike down capable people without regard for their qualifications, but rather based solely on the complexion of their skin and the anatomy between their legs. Without actual legislation demanding inclusion, people without pinkish-peach complexions rarely got a fair shot across the board to prove their worth.

The world view of other cultures were not taken into consideration, they were dismissed. Either you are a part of the network or you're not. If you weren't, it didn't matter how hard you worked, it just wasn't good enough. If you weren't in order to get practical ideas that could change lives considered, they had to be presented by someone with the same gender and hue as the men in power. Bars were intentionally raised and intentionally lowered by people in power to help one specific targeted group and hinder everyone else. White males overall conspired to keep pulling strings and control the distribution of opportunities so the U.S. Government had to step in and "Check your privilege".


II. Before you took one breath of air, before you ever laid eyes upon your mother's face, before you took one step, said one word, or conjured one thought, a system had been set in place for you. Not for everyone. But for you.

By the merit of simply being born a white male, it was never a question that Princeton was an option for you, let alone college. After all most of the people that attend look like you, and almost all of the people that administer it look like you. Glance at photographs of the distinguished alumni of the school's history, and they most certainly almost exclusively resemble you.

By the merit of being born a white male, you will never have to know what it's like to have the officers that are the sworn protectors of your community also be one of the biggest threats against you. How can equal protection not be a myth when the protectors consider you the enemy?

By the merit of being born a white male, you were given the seeds you sowed. You were given the plow, and the tillers, and the almanac to know what to plant when and where. That is a far cry from having to find your own way to scratch a living out of the only barren patch of ground you had access to, making bricks with no straw.

In highlighting the fact that you put in hard work to get where you are, you unknowingly are proving that the ultimate privilege of being a white male is that hard work is enough for you. There are no societal or institutional decks stacked against you.


III. You are describing an atrocity that lasted one generation. Slavery in the United States lasted 4-5 generations. Additionally, families were ripped apart by trading, imagine being placed on a completely different continent than your loved ones. Father's in Haiti and the Caribbean while mothers were being brought back up to America via Louisiana. and children being sprinkled all across the country like ash after a fire. So the "privilege" of passing down the vivid details of their struggle to descendents was not available to them. Most credible historical sources note that even learning or teaching a slave to read or write lead to a punishment up to and including death. Not to minimize the tragedy that you are describing, but in comparison to slavery, that was in fact a privilege! I have yet to find a credible source that described that slaves had the power and ability to allocate the work and choose who takes gets the day off. I have yet to find a credible source that has noted slaves having the ability to pass on African traditions during slavery .In fact, most credible historical sources will describe that slaves who tried to retain their African traditions were threatened with violence or death. Compared to that, yes it was a "privilege" to be able to choose who gets not work and concentrate their effort to retain and teach your traditions.


IV. That's fantastic that your grandfather had the opportunity to begin a wicker business. Are you aware that actually having a business is a privilege? You see my mother and father's parents were not awarded that privilege. My great aunt's business was burnt to the ground when angry white people destroyed Black Wall Street in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Where you aren't faced with the roadblock of discrimination and racism you will be surprised on the opportunities that open up. Many black families were not able to acquire wealth because grandparents and great-grandparents had nothing to pass on to the children. This is not a woe is me, this is a historical fact within the frameworks of this country, we were denied basic human rights that your family never had to endure. So while it's very honest and respectable that your parents were able to put in so much time, money and effort into their business unfortunately there is a group of people in this country that were never awarded that opportunity in the same fashion.


V. The privilege we talk about has a dual existence.
1.That of the past and thus all the privileges enjoyed (or not) because of your race.
2. That of the present/future. A Black person who is accomplished WILL have graver and more challenges in life than a white person on equal or lesser footing. This is the present and future problem and the one I am concerned about for myself and my children. When you walks out of your door, your default privilege is based on how people recognize you. White male? you already have a leg up on anyone else and they don't have to know who he is or what he has done in the past.

See brothers' they want us to argue over past things like reparations when they know that won't build a nation. I don't care about reparations. The American dream is about success, so let it be based on the work that we put in and not on the color of our skin.


VI. The very truth of the matter is that your entire existence in this country is based on privilege. The U.S. government (along with other western governments) legislated the type of immigrants they wanted. If your grandparents had been Haitians, for instance, you likely wouldn't even be in this country. Either you're intellectually bankrupt on this point or being extremely disingenuous. Take a look at the history of laws concerning immigration and naturalization in the United States if you would like to educate yourself. Your parents were privileged to fit the desired profile. Yes. Your grandparents ,as privileged whites from Europe, were allowed to enter a place where other whites from Europe had successfully pillaged and built on the back of slave labor. Surely that had nothing to do with your parents ability to rise from the ashes of war-torn Europe. Certainly, if your grandparents were blacks from Senegal, they would have been afforded the same opportunities. Surely. You're praising a country for offering equal protection by law to its citizens during a time where certain citizens, indeed, did not have equal protection by law. Only your white male privileged soul would allow you to vomit such profound contradictions into the air in such a proud way. Surely, you are aware that, when your parents came to this country, only a specific subsector of society was even allowed to enter a voting booth (amongst a plethora of other things?). While your grandparents were building their business, they may have taken the time to read about the Tulsa race riots that destroyed a vibrant black community dubbed "The Black Wall Street". Those destroyed communities didn't have resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, huh? They were just unlucky to be born in a place where their own government sanctioned vigilante attacks on their communities.


VII. Jews always talk about the holocaust and their ancestors' struggles within and afterward and compare their successes to black people and the lack thereof. I am not diminishing the destruction that the holocaust caused, but we are talking 12 years. Twelve years from when the first concentration camp was built in Dachau in 1933 until the end of the war in 1945.

Let's think about that. Twelve years. It seems like a long time, but is it really? Maybe, but that depends what you compare it to. Yesterday Charles Ramsey was being interviewed about his book "Dead Giveaway," about his side of the story when he helped free those three girls Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus, & Michelle Knight. For 10 years they were in what amounts to a concentration camp, held as slaves, and still that doesn't even equal 5% of the time that slavery existed and was legally practiced in America.

For 246 years, from when slaves where first brought here by the Dutch in 1619, until the ending of the Civil War in 1865 - and more than that if you consider that many slaves didn't find out that they were indeed free for a number of years after the end of the Civil War. When you compare the 12 years of the holocaust to the 246 years of slavery then their 12 years is an absurdly meek comparison. If a generation is 20 years then their 12 is half of that and slavery is more than 12 times that. Substantially more can be lost in 246 years that can in 12.

You have the benefit of being able to blend in. My eye is far from trained and I cannot look into a room of white people and spot the Jewish, but one could look at a picture of the American Presidents and be able to spot President Obama with certainty. Some of the Italians changed their names from Rosetto to Rose allowing them to blend in, and some Jews did the same, but no amount of name changing could allow me or anyone in my family to slip into the community unnoticed and make our way. Your grandfather may have come here penniless, but the world he walked into did not have laws forbidding him to learn nor prohibit anyone to teach him. The fact that he even knew his grandfather is a privilege that many slaves did not know, unless their "grandfather" was their own master, and being that, what legacy could one pass down?

Environmentalism? Privilege? Impossible when you are stolen and spend a lifetime in bondage in a world where it is forbidden for you to know anything but the basics which were your job and how to take care of the masters. The struggle of the Jewish peoples cannot compare to that of black people, and whatever they were able to pass down is a far cry from the pain, suffering and hopelessness that black people had to pass down. The kid that brags that he made it even though he failed 11th grade does not compare under any circumstances to the child who wasn't allowed to go to school, and neither could his parents, his grandfather or his grandfather before him.


VIII. How can values be passed on if home isn't there? When home is destroyed? And when these things happen because of the color of your skin?

Let's go back to the Civil Rights Movement. A large success, no? But when the system removes one obstacle, it places another one in the way: Enter the War on Drugs. [1]

From the early 1970s to the present, the prison population has increased dramatically. Most of the offenders are non-violent offenders. Most of the non-violent offenders are black people.

Passing on values and traditions is hard when you are locked up for what other people aren't locked up for. It's hard to pass on the value of hard work and education when the hard work is not offered to you because of manufactured crimes stopping you from getting hired -- as if racism weren't enough.

Example: White managed 19 is busted for a drug offense. He gets the case dropped to a misdemeanor and probation. Black man aged 19 is bused for a drug offense. He gets the felony charge and jail time. Even if he doesn't go to jail, the felony is bad enough.

There is no need to go back further in history. The Civil Rights Movement speaks for itself. There wouldn't have been one if there weren't a serious problems. Ever heard of Black Wall Street? [2] Unfortunately, white supremacy evolved after the movement. Some call it the New Jim Crow. [3] Others may call it Jim Crow 2. Whatever you choose to call it, it does stand in the way of values being passed down.

It's hard to talk to your children or grandchildren about values if a person is screaming into a bullhorn while you are trying to talk. That screaming is the systematic racism that exists in America.


IX. Racism is NOT about skin color just as feminism is NOT about moustaches.
Racism is about creating and preserving the gains of white privilege.

And you are right, someone did sacrifice themselves so that you could lead a better life.
Some of those people are overwhelmingly Africans brought to American that built this capitalistic society from which you benefit in ways we still can't.

Closing

So as much as you reject the notion that white privilege has worked in your favor. As much as you want to poke your chest out and tell everyone of the struggles of your family to make it in America. As much as you want to convince the world at large that the privilege has nothing to do with your accomplishments. As much as you want to believe all of those things to be true, you know they are not. Everyone who is cheering for you, knows this to be true as well. Black people have been writing about white privilege for eons to deaf ears. You, a white male write about white privilege denouncing it and it is a national topic of discussion, extending ears to you that have never been available to countless, qualified, elite journalist of color. You in writing your average at best essay actually proved our point for us. Ironic that in your quest to tear down the notion of white privilege, you were the biggest help in making the truth that it does exist even sturdier than before.
Signed,
Collaborative Black Voices

1. https://www.aclu.org/drug-law-reform...r-new-jim-crow

2. http://breakingbrown.com/2013/09/okl...k-wall-street/

3. http://newjimcrow.com/
Click to expand...
 
:bravo::bravo:

I read every single word in this post...I hope something bigger comes out of this...I'm down for the movement
 
Bookmarking and applauding all my brothers who put in work to correct and educate this slime and those like him. That is why bgol is the best on the net imo
 
After reading the rebuttal I am loving it. There are a couple of grammar corrections that need to be made but the message is loud, clear and concise. Job well done fellas.
 
luvpussy said:
After reading the rebuttal I am loving it. There are a couple of grammar corrections that need to be made but the message is loud, clear and concise. Job well done fellas.
Click to expand...

You should point those out.

I saw some as well and in a response like this, the grammar, spelling, etc needs to be perfect.

Someone besides large should possibly take on editing duties. It would be best to get a fresh set of eyes on it. Or people can point out all the mistakes they find right here in this thread.
 
Good job. Two suggestions though:
1.) Edit the grammatical errors.
2.) Describe how our current media portrays us and how it effects our self image. I mentioned it in a earlier post on here. IMO that is one of the most important instruments of racism that is actually effecting us now.
 

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