Toby drops 81 on tdot
- Thread starter Makkonnen
- Start date
Didnt see the game but I did see that Wobe attempted more FGA by himself than his whole team! 
I originally predicted that the lakers would go 47-35 but at his current pace, Wobe will lead the lakers to a sub .500 record and they'll be sitting at home watching the playoffs, again
I originally predicted that the lakers would go 47-35 but at his current pace, Wobe will lead the lakers to a sub .500 record and they'll be sitting at home watching the playoffs, again
game 1 vs tdot toby drops 11pts and lakers winxfactor said:Didnt see the game but I did see that Wobe attempted more FGA by himself than his whole team!
I originally predicted that the lakers would go 47-35 but at his current pace, Wobe will lead the lakers to a sub .500 record and they'll be sitting at home watching the playoffs, again
game 2 vs tdot down 14 at the half - drops 55 in the 2nd half 81 overall and wins
seems like they own the raptors either way so what difference does it make how they do it, especially since this isnt a lakers squad that will even be together next year?
its not good for a team learning to play together but this team is going nowhere so..........? isnt there the cap space build up getting ready for Yao or KG next year? Thats all i been hearing but I havent been reading alot about the lakers longterm plans did I miss something?
who really expects the Lakers to do anything but maybe make the first round of the playoffs this year?
Jellybean's revenge
46 shots. More than pop
got to shoot in his whole
career, lol
46 shots. More than pop
got to shoot in his whole
career, lol
Makkonnen said:
Yao signed a 5 year extension with Houston so he definitely aint coming to the lakers anytime soon. Dont know about KG but I doubt he's the type player to just up and abandon his team because they are facing a little adversity right now.
I dont know what the laker's long term plans are right now but they'll probably be stuck with their current team for a while (well the core players anyway). Someone said that Bosh would jump to the lakers but I doubt that too. You have to remember this too...What current superstar player will want to play with someone who dominates the ball like Bryant? Dont get me wrong, Bryant has the skill and the ability to score is obvious but he's just not the type of player you can build a successful or even a playoff team around.
didnt hear about yaoxfactor said:
i hear minne has been shopping kg and kg doesnt want to be there along with mchale shoppin wally and others for artest
i feel you - two alpha males will bump heads - toby needs a scottie a great player who just doesnt have it in him by himself to be a team carrier
lamar could be that guy if toby was smart enough to help him along but I dont think that will happen- phil is tryin to push that too but I think Lamar might be too nice and toby too stupid for that shit to work out
In tandem with kwame and mihm being rebounders they have enough to do any team but I dont think they're smart enough to see it
The only way you could get another great player on that squad would be for him to be smarter and more mature than toby and someone toby would have respect for aka not try to dominate everything
Just when I'd thought 62 was the limit for him. It'll suffice to say that I was shocked. I kind of hate to think about what's going to happen against Detroit. You know they're not going to let him waltz in any time he feels like scoring in the paint. :|
If he drops 100+ against Golden State...
If he drops 100+ against Golden State...
DCMC said:
Yeah right....Kobe should hold up a Wilt FLAG
Havoc said:
Thats another thing. I was disappointed in the fact that CB allowed Bryant torch his teammates like this.
But I dont think anything is worse than today when some fan told me that Kobe Bryant has now proved to be better than Michael Jordan. Shit almost made my heart stop.
This fandom is getting way out of control here and needs to be stopped.
Two comments about the game because I didnt see it.
1) Is Phil Jackson turning into a soft coach? I was a kid when Jordan played but I dont recall him ever letting Jordan jacked 50 FGA! in one game. Bryant is pretty much doing what he wants on the court. I know he caught fire last night but Im not talking about last night. Mainly the games the lakers lose because Bryant disregards the offense and tries to freelance for points
2) How many shots down the stretch did Bryant take (without his teammates taking one) I hear that he took the lakers' last 20 FGA.
i think phil doesnt have confidence in toby's teammates too- i saw a press conference after that game they lost in OT the other day and he looked pretty disgusted talkin shit to sagerxfactor said:Thats another thing. I was disappointed in the fact that CB allowed Bryant torch his teammates like this.
But I dont think anything is worse than today when some fan told me that Kobe Bryant has now proved to be better than Michael Jordan. Shit almost made my heart stop.
This fandom is getting way out of control here and needs to be stopped.
Two comments about the game because I didnt see it.
1) Is Phil Jackson turning into a soft coach? I was a kid when Jordan played but I dont recall him ever letting Jordan jacked 50 FGA! in one game. Bryant is pretty much doing what he wants on the court. I know he caught fire last night but Im not talking about last night. Mainly the games the lakers lose because Bryant disregards the offense and tries to freelance for points
2) How many shots down the stretch did Bryant take (without his teammates taking one) I hear that he took the lakers' last 20 FGA.
Couple of points to take note of here:
The Lakers were playing their last game before a
5 day break. Sort of a mini vacation. They had played
4 games a week for at least the past two weeks.
Maybe three, can't remember. So each player could
"let the dog out" (so to speak) because they knew
they would have so time off......
Toronto was playing the first game of a back-to-back
That's two games in two nights. Bad teams (the Knicks)
are NOTORIUS for taking off either the first or the second
game. Witness tonite's Toronto game where they are
CLEARLY playing with much more tenacity. Even good
teams (the Nets) will take a night off when they have
these back-to back games. Witness the Nets losing on
Friday in Boston, then blowing them the hell out the
very next night in New Jersey
It is apparent that the Raptors took the game off and
that Kobe was amped because he knew he was gonna
be off for several nights....
Not to take anything away ffrom his performance. I
congratulate him for scoring the second most points
in a single game in the history of the NBA.....
Just remember that the 3-point shot was not in the
NBA until well after the glory days of Pistol Pete, Earl
the Pearl, Rick Barry, Jerry West and the Big O. Not
to mention Elgin Baylor (who scored 71) and David
Thompson (73). Robertson, Monroe and West were
not SELFISH enough to ever score that many points
but could have done so if they ever took the same 46
shots (that's almost a shot per minute) that Kobe did
It was a great performance though. You just have to
have the mindset of a chucker in order to do it. Not
exactly the mindset it takes to win titles though
Revenge of the Jellybean. You know he's gotta be
ecstatic today.
The Lakers were playing their last game before a
5 day break. Sort of a mini vacation. They had played
4 games a week for at least the past two weeks.
Maybe three, can't remember. So each player could
"let the dog out" (so to speak) because they knew
they would have so time off......
Toronto was playing the first game of a back-to-back
That's two games in two nights. Bad teams (the Knicks)
are NOTORIUS for taking off either the first or the second
game. Witness tonite's Toronto game where they are
CLEARLY playing with much more tenacity. Even good
teams (the Nets) will take a night off when they have
these back-to back games. Witness the Nets losing on
Friday in Boston, then blowing them the hell out the
very next night in New Jersey
It is apparent that the Raptors took the game off and
that Kobe was amped because he knew he was gonna
be off for several nights....
Not to take anything away ffrom his performance. I
congratulate him for scoring the second most points
in a single game in the history of the NBA.....
Just remember that the 3-point shot was not in the
NBA until well after the glory days of Pistol Pete, Earl
the Pearl, Rick Barry, Jerry West and the Big O. Not
to mention Elgin Baylor (who scored 71) and David
Thompson (73). Robertson, Monroe and West were
not SELFISH enough to ever score that many points
but could have done so if they ever took the same 46
shots (that's almost a shot per minute) that Kobe did
It was a great performance though. You just have to
have the mindset of a chucker in order to do it. Not
exactly the mindset it takes to win titles though
Revenge of the Jellybean. You know he's gotta be
ecstatic today.
also something to take note of
no rule about how long one could stay in the paint
for wilt - considerably smaller, whiter and less athletic competition
for all others cept Jordan - less athletic league in general compared to todays athletes
theories about whole teams playing harder and taking the game off without proof are not believable
if you watched the game and that's your opinion cool- if you are finding reasons to explain the performance................not credible
what about the dallas game? were the circumstances the same? At the rate Toby was jackin shit up in that one if he had 84, and with a 28pt 4th he would have dropped 91
Chuck Norris is a bad bitch
no one has any comments on Scottie saying Toby is better than Jordan? I'm very surprised considering his role in all those championships with MJ
no rule about how long one could stay in the paint
for wilt - considerably smaller, whiter and less athletic competition
for all others cept Jordan - less athletic league in general compared to todays athletes
theories about whole teams playing harder and taking the game off without proof are not believable
if you watched the game and that's your opinion cool- if you are finding reasons to explain the performance................not credible
what about the dallas game? were the circumstances the same? At the rate Toby was jackin shit up in that one if he had 84, and with a 28pt 4th he would have dropped 91
Chuck Norris is a bad bitch
no one has any comments on Scottie saying Toby is better than Jordan? I'm very surprised considering his role in all those championships with MJ
Makkonnen said:
This is not true. The 3 second rule was instituted during the
George Mikan era. The rule change they made for Wilt was
to widen the lane. But the 3 second violation and 24 second
shot clock were there for years before Wilt was around
On Scottie's comments.
Like I said in the Bill Walton thread
I believe nothing that comes out of
any of their mouth. They say shit to
keep their jobs. Just like coaches do
edit**
Once again, I fell for the hype and got
suckked into a Kobe/Laker discussion
I'm done
I got Kobe's rookie card. A die-cut, refractor
card too. I've had it for over 5 years....I like
the dude. But I'm sick of him
Like I said in the Bill Walton thread
I believe nothing that comes out of
any of their mouth. They say shit to
keep their jobs. Just like coaches do
edit**
Once again, I fell for the hype and got
suckked into a Kobe/Laker discussion
I'm done
I got Kobe's rookie card. A die-cut, refractor
card too. I've had it for over 5 years....I like
the dude. But I'm sick of him
Last edited:
brief comments now,
but i will return to the board thursday night...
i'm one of the FEW on the board that actually saw the game... i know there are A LOT of pretenders who claim to have seen it running their mouths on the BGOL...
in short, tobe had a FANTASTIC shooting night from the floor... but, i've always said tobe had range... caught fire in Q3... always said he was streaky...
people who WATCHED know that tobe tired in Q4, missing most of his shots from distance... CLEANED UP from the FT line, where tobe's always been a solid shooter...
i'm preparing for testimony in a criminal case... preliminary proceedings will be done by thursday afternoon, maybe everything will already have been said by then...
i heard that someone is going to market the tape of the game and sell it for $5...
tobe fanboys will buy anything! 
dolemite, i see you referenced a scottie pippen quote, but i haven't heard/seen that one yet...
i do have some interesting quotes from coach jackson, coach winter, coach riley, and kareem abdul jabbar... quotes that weren't edited by the FANboys in the media... by now, you've all probably read vince carter's opinion...
also, if anyone watched the fox sports video, wasn't it funny to compare coach d'antoni's and chris duhon's remarks to those of ben gordon (regarding tobe's 81 point performance)? GREAT examples of how american ballers v. EURO ballers approach the game...
2 more items on the checklist for thursday evening:
1) antoine walker's and jalen rose's comments about being physical with a player who is hot from the floor... another reason why tobe's feat is possible in today's game compared to say, 20 years ago?
2) critical discussion of coach mitchell's D in that game... coach mitchell used a few ZONE strategies against the fakers that game... have to ask WHY? ANYbody who has ever played college ball knows that ZONES are ABSOLUTELY the INCORRECT defensive choice against teams with a HOT perimeter shooter...
but i'll leave for now with this quote from LAKER SHILL mychal thompson, who said this in Q4:
"the [f]akers should give the ball to [t]obe every time. i think they want him to score. they're not even guarding him any more.
but i will return to the board thursday night...
i'm one of the FEW on the board that actually saw the game... i know there are A LOT of pretenders who claim to have seen it running their mouths on the BGOL...
in short, tobe had a FANTASTIC shooting night from the floor... but, i've always said tobe had range... caught fire in Q3... always said he was streaky...
people who WATCHED know that tobe tired in Q4, missing most of his shots from distance... CLEANED UP from the FT line, where tobe's always been a solid shooter...
i'm preparing for testimony in a criminal case... preliminary proceedings will be done by thursday afternoon, maybe everything will already have been said by then...
i heard that someone is going to market the tape of the game and sell it for $5...
tobe fanboys will buy anything! dolemite, i see you referenced a scottie pippen quote, but i haven't heard/seen that one yet...
i do have some interesting quotes from coach jackson, coach winter, coach riley, and kareem abdul jabbar... quotes that weren't edited by the FANboys in the media... by now, you've all probably read vince carter's opinion...
also, if anyone watched the fox sports video, wasn't it funny to compare coach d'antoni's and chris duhon's remarks to those of ben gordon (regarding tobe's 81 point performance)? GREAT examples of how american ballers v. EURO ballers approach the game...
2 more items on the checklist for thursday evening:
1) antoine walker's and jalen rose's comments about being physical with a player who is hot from the floor... another reason why tobe's feat is possible in today's game compared to say, 20 years ago?
2) critical discussion of coach mitchell's D in that game... coach mitchell used a few ZONE strategies against the fakers that game... have to ask WHY? ANYbody who has ever played college ball knows that ZONES are ABSOLUTELY the INCORRECT defensive choice against teams with a HOT perimeter shooter...
but i'll leave for now with this quote from LAKER SHILL mychal thompson, who said this in Q4:
"the [f]akers should give the ball to [t]obe every time. i think they want him to score. they're not even guarding him any more.
Re: brief comments now,
Pippen was on Cold PIzza on espn the morning after and had a 5 minute in person interview with that chick
Reggie Miller on PTI yesterday said it was amazing and anyone who had something negative to say about it was jealous- he also said Kobe isnt greater than Jordan
Yeah those espn quotes of what Kareem was saying weren't very flattering for toby - missed any quotes by winter and jackson beyond the "you cant pull him" thing
what did duhon and gordon say?
most people can tell how a player got treated flying into the paint all the time 20 years ago compared to now - especially when it was important- but that's the league not the players- how the game is called by refs (league rules) will shape the game
Pippen was on Cold PIzza on espn the morning after and had a 5 minute in person interview with that chick
Reggie Miller on PTI yesterday said it was amazing and anyone who had something negative to say about it was jealous- he also said Kobe isnt greater than Jordan
Yeah those espn quotes of what Kareem was saying weren't very flattering for toby - missed any quotes by winter and jackson beyond the "you cant pull him" thing
what did duhon and gordon say?
most people can tell how a player got treated flying into the paint all the time 20 years ago compared to now - especially when it was important- but that's the league not the players- how the game is called by refs (league rules) will shape the game
i'm back
i think his age and $10M have made coach jackson ALOT more tolerant...
plus, coach jackson has earned some room for error, considering his past successes...
and on top of it, should the fakers finish as poorly as they did last season, coach jackson could just write 'uncoachable part 2'...
here is a troublesome (to me) quote from the fakers v. raptors game:
Jackson claimed he was unaware of Bryant's total until late in the fourth quarter, when assistant Frank Hamblen notified him. "I wasn't keeping track on what he had and I turned (to Hamblen) and said, 'I think I better take him out now,'" Jackson said. "It was a time I felt the game was sealed, but (Hamblen) said, 'I don't think you can, he has 77 points.' So we stayed with it until he hit 80."
this is troublesome in the same way that i disagreed with coach riley padding kareem abdul jabbar's stats... some on this board are too young to remember that coach riley kept kareem abdul jabbar in meaningless games (albeit not many) simply so kareem could keep his consecutive double digit scoring record going...
coach jackson should've benched tobe regardless of the point scoring milestone looming ahead... any coach who helps players to pad stats is flirting with tarnishing the sport...
and as it pertains to tobe, would it really have been less meaningful for tobe's fanboys had tobe scored 77 instead of 81? i say no...
but, thanks for pointing out another factor as to how a single individual scores 81 points... the coach has to leave you in the game... players can't score if the coach doesn't leave them on the floor...
xfactor said:
i think his age and $10M have made coach jackson ALOT more tolerant...
plus, coach jackson has earned some room for error, considering his past successes...
and on top of it, should the fakers finish as poorly as they did last season, coach jackson could just write 'uncoachable part 2'...
here is a troublesome (to me) quote from the fakers v. raptors game:
Jackson claimed he was unaware of Bryant's total until late in the fourth quarter, when assistant Frank Hamblen notified him. "I wasn't keeping track on what he had and I turned (to Hamblen) and said, 'I think I better take him out now,'" Jackson said. "It was a time I felt the game was sealed, but (Hamblen) said, 'I don't think you can, he has 77 points.' So we stayed with it until he hit 80."
this is troublesome in the same way that i disagreed with coach riley padding kareem abdul jabbar's stats... some on this board are too young to remember that coach riley kept kareem abdul jabbar in meaningless games (albeit not many) simply so kareem could keep his consecutive double digit scoring record going...
coach jackson should've benched tobe regardless of the point scoring milestone looming ahead... any coach who helps players to pad stats is flirting with tarnishing the sport...
and as it pertains to tobe, would it really have been less meaningful for tobe's fanboys had tobe scored 77 instead of 81? i say no...
but, thanks for pointing out another factor as to how a single individual scores 81 points... the coach has to leave you in the game... players can't score if the coach doesn't leave them on the floor...
more follow up
i've NEVER subscribed to the 'lack of confidence' line of thinking... i've never believed that coach jackson has a lack of confidence in his players, and i've never believed that tobe has a lack of confidence in his teammates...
here is a quote from coach jackson, post fakers v. raptors:
Chris Mihm's new year has been more than happy, with his alma mater beating USC in the Rose Bowl and a personal scoring streak that, though not Kobe Bryant's, makes him the only other Laker to reach double figures each of the last seven games.
"He's been playing really well," Laker Coach Phil Jackson said. "He holds the post, does some things on the exterior. It's important for us. He's probably our third-most-steady scorer in his ability to score double figures."
Makkonnen said:
i've NEVER subscribed to the 'lack of confidence' line of thinking... i've never believed that coach jackson has a lack of confidence in his players, and i've never believed that tobe has a lack of confidence in his teammates...
here is a quote from coach jackson, post fakers v. raptors:
Chris Mihm's new year has been more than happy, with his alma mater beating USC in the Rose Bowl and a personal scoring streak that, though not Kobe Bryant's, makes him the only other Laker to reach double figures each of the last seven games.
"He's been playing really well," Laker Coach Phil Jackson said. "He holds the post, does some things on the exterior. It's important for us. He's probably our third-most-steady scorer in his ability to score double figures."
does this make them haters?
interesting point... kareem abdul jabbar had this to say:
"I was at the game when Elgin got 71, so I've been at both games that set the Lakers franchise record," said Hall of Famer Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, now a Lakers assistant. "Elgin did it without the 3-point line. His game was attacking the hoop and hitting jumpers within 20 feet. Kobe's range is unreal and he does it his way."
i'm of the opinion that elgin baylor's accomplishment was more impressive... elgin baylor played during an era with men would put you on your ass... tobe plays against youngsters, fellow primadonnas, and cupcake euros...
antoine walker offers a reminder:
Antoine Walker, the Miami Heat forward, suggested it was the Raptors' collective gutlessness that was to blame: "I think with the 81 now, no other team or other players will let that happen," he told reporters. "Now guys will foul out trying to stop him from doing that. If someone gets 81 on me, I'm going to clothesline him."
some additional thoughts on the realities of scoring ALOT of points:
That's the advantage Bryant has as a guard. He doesn't need anyone to pass him the ball in the frontcourt. He also can float around three-point territory, an option that didn't exist for Chamberlain or any other NBA player before the 1979-80 season.
It's also harder to double-team players on the perimeter. The help has to come from farther away, giving a guard — especially one as savvy as Bryant — more time to recognize it and find an escape route.
But Elgin Baylor, whose Laker record of 71 points fell by the wayside Sunday, once told me he thought a big man would be best suited to take on Chamberlain's record.
"The thing about it [is], you're going to have to get to the line a lot and you're going to have to get some offensive rebounds, some put-backs in order for that to happen," Baylor said. "A guy shooting a three-pointer is not that type of guy, who can score 100 points. Get to the line a lot and finish every time he gets the ball."
He didn't have the three-pointer, but Chamberlain tried just about every other kind of shot.
"He had fadeaway jumpers, dunks, layups, all that kind of stuff," said Harvey Pollack, Philadelphia's longtime director of statistical information who was in Hershey, Pa., for the historic game. "He was a mixture."
Most notably, he cashed in at the line. Chamberlain attempted 32 free throws on the 100-point night and made 28, uncharacteristic for a 47% career free-throw shooter.
"They could have called a lot more fouls on the Knicks than they called," Pollack said. "He shot 32, but he was fouled by these two, three guys guarding him constantly."
Free throws stop the clock. And the clock is an even greater adversary than the defense.
coach riley had this to say:
"Anybody who's got the kind of energy to try to hoist up 70 shots is going to score a lot of points," Pat Riley, the Heat sideline walker, said for all to hear, inflating Bryant's 66 combined field-goal and free-throw attempts. "We've got a lot of guys in this league, if they took 70 shots, they'd score a lot of points."
coach jackson had these comments post game:
"It's just a personal challenge for him to attack the whole team. It was not exactly the way you want to win a game, but when you have to win a game, it's great to have that weapon to be able to do it. We rode the hot the hand."
"We remind our players that this is something that was a special night in a heated situation but it's not going to be a steady diet for us," Jackson said. "We can't have that as a steady diet if we're going to accomplish what we plan to accomplish as a basketball team."
"The onus is on Kobe to stay inside the team offense," Jackson. "The onus is on the players to pick it up a little bit better. The onus is on me to provide players out there that can help [win]. The onus is on the general manager to provide players that are a good enough talent. There's onus on everybody."
coach winters had this to say:
Tex Winter, the architect of the triangle offense, expressed the only mature observation after dispensing the obligatory superlatives. "I don't think you can win a championship that way," he said
RunawaySlave said:
interesting point... kareem abdul jabbar had this to say:
"I was at the game when Elgin got 71, so I've been at both games that set the Lakers franchise record," said Hall of Famer Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, now a Lakers assistant. "Elgin did it without the 3-point line. His game was attacking the hoop and hitting jumpers within 20 feet. Kobe's range is unreal and he does it his way."
i'm of the opinion that elgin baylor's accomplishment was more impressive... elgin baylor played during an era with men would put you on your ass... tobe plays against youngsters, fellow primadonnas, and cupcake euros...
antoine walker offers a reminder:
Antoine Walker, the Miami Heat forward, suggested it was the Raptors' collective gutlessness that was to blame: "I think with the 81 now, no other team or other players will let that happen," he told reporters. "Now guys will foul out trying to stop him from doing that. If someone gets 81 on me, I'm going to clothesline him."
some additional thoughts on the realities of scoring ALOT of points:
That's the advantage Bryant has as a guard. He doesn't need anyone to pass him the ball in the frontcourt. He also can float around three-point territory, an option that didn't exist for Chamberlain or any other NBA player before the 1979-80 season.
It's also harder to double-team players on the perimeter. The help has to come from farther away, giving a guard — especially one as savvy as Bryant — more time to recognize it and find an escape route.
But Elgin Baylor, whose Laker record of 71 points fell by the wayside Sunday, once told me he thought a big man would be best suited to take on Chamberlain's record.
"The thing about it [is], you're going to have to get to the line a lot and you're going to have to get some offensive rebounds, some put-backs in order for that to happen," Baylor said. "A guy shooting a three-pointer is not that type of guy, who can score 100 points. Get to the line a lot and finish every time he gets the ball."
He didn't have the three-pointer, but Chamberlain tried just about every other kind of shot.
"He had fadeaway jumpers, dunks, layups, all that kind of stuff," said Harvey Pollack, Philadelphia's longtime director of statistical information who was in Hershey, Pa., for the historic game. "He was a mixture."
Most notably, he cashed in at the line. Chamberlain attempted 32 free throws on the 100-point night and made 28, uncharacteristic for a 47% career free-throw shooter.
"They could have called a lot more fouls on the Knicks than they called," Pollack said. "He shot 32, but he was fouled by these two, three guys guarding him constantly."
Free throws stop the clock. And the clock is an even greater adversary than the defense.
coach riley had this to say:
"Anybody who's got the kind of energy to try to hoist up 70 shots is going to score a lot of points," Pat Riley, the Heat sideline walker, said for all to hear, inflating Bryant's 66 combined field-goal and free-throw attempts. "We've got a lot of guys in this league, if they took 70 shots, they'd score a lot of points."
coach jackson had these comments post game:
"It's just a personal challenge for him to attack the whole team. It was not exactly the way you want to win a game, but when you have to win a game, it's great to have that weapon to be able to do it. We rode the hot the hand."
"We remind our players that this is something that was a special night in a heated situation but it's not going to be a steady diet for us," Jackson said. "We can't have that as a steady diet if we're going to accomplish what we plan to accomplish as a basketball team."
"The onus is on Kobe to stay inside the team offense," Jackson. "The onus is on the players to pick it up a little bit better. The onus is on me to provide players out there that can help [win]. The onus is on the general manager to provide players that are a good enough talent. There's onus on everybody."
coach winters had this to say:
Tex Winter, the architect of the triangle offense, expressed the only mature observation after dispensing the obligatory superlatives. "I don't think you can win a championship that way," he said
comparing eras - wilt chamberlain v. tobe
from a chicago newspaper:
The Lakers' Kobe Bryant scored 81 points Sunday night against the Raptors, and it wasn't long before it was being heralded as the greatest individual accomplishment in NBA history. One of the reasons, the heralds said, was because Chamberlain's 100-point game for the Philadelphia Warriors was a result of his being 7 feet 1 inch.
Bryant's feat is far more impressive, they said, because he's a 6-6 shooting guard and therefore had to do a lot more to score 81 points than Chamberlain did to get his 100.
That's weird, heralds.
It's a thin argument because it assumes that being 7-1 is more of an advantage in basketball than having tremendous quickness and leaping ability, which Bryant has. If the logic were sound, it would follow that most of the great players in NBA history would have been 7-footers. Somebody tell Will Perdue that.
The Kobe-is-God crowd scoffs because, on that March night in Hershey, Pa., Chamberlain went against 6-10 Knicks center Darrell Imhoff. If your name is "Darrell Imhoff," people assume you're from Hooterville, but the truth is, Imhoff was a good defender.
"His reputation as a defensive player was very, very high," Joe Ruklick, Chamberlain's backup on the Warriors that night, said Tuesday. "People would say, 'He can't shoot, but, man, can he play defense."'
Kobe scored his 81 against the Raptors, probably the worst defensive team in the league. This is what Toronto's Mike James told Sirius Satellite Radio about the way the Raptors "defended" Bryant on Sunday night:
"You can't point fingers at anyone, but … when a person's that hot, you can't allow somebody to be on a deserted island. And we kept our players on an island the whole night trying to play him one-on-one, and now he's so aggressive and the referees are giving him every call. I felt like we should have been double-teaming."
Chamberlain wore nice threads during the day and two or three defenders on every possession at night. He got hacked and held perhaps more than any player in NBA history.
"I don't suppose Bryant had anything like the physical punishment that Wilt took," said Ruklick, who starred at Northwestern. "Wilt's achievement was a feat of unbelievable endurance. He really had to work to get open, to get those guys off of him. Everybody in the league was tired of him scoring 50 points a game against them. They roughed him up in that game."
DCMC said:
from a chicago newspaper:
The Lakers' Kobe Bryant scored 81 points Sunday night against the Raptors, and it wasn't long before it was being heralded as the greatest individual accomplishment in NBA history. One of the reasons, the heralds said, was because Chamberlain's 100-point game for the Philadelphia Warriors was a result of his being 7 feet 1 inch.
Bryant's feat is far more impressive, they said, because he's a 6-6 shooting guard and therefore had to do a lot more to score 81 points than Chamberlain did to get his 100.
That's weird, heralds.
It's a thin argument because it assumes that being 7-1 is more of an advantage in basketball than having tremendous quickness and leaping ability, which Bryant has. If the logic were sound, it would follow that most of the great players in NBA history would have been 7-footers. Somebody tell Will Perdue that.
The Kobe-is-God crowd scoffs because, on that March night in Hershey, Pa., Chamberlain went against 6-10 Knicks center Darrell Imhoff. If your name is "Darrell Imhoff," people assume you're from Hooterville, but the truth is, Imhoff was a good defender.
"His reputation as a defensive player was very, very high," Joe Ruklick, Chamberlain's backup on the Warriors that night, said Tuesday. "People would say, 'He can't shoot, but, man, can he play defense."'
Kobe scored his 81 against the Raptors, probably the worst defensive team in the league. This is what Toronto's Mike James told Sirius Satellite Radio about the way the Raptors "defended" Bryant on Sunday night:
"You can't point fingers at anyone, but … when a person's that hot, you can't allow somebody to be on a deserted island. And we kept our players on an island the whole night trying to play him one-on-one, and now he's so aggressive and the referees are giving him every call. I felt like we should have been double-teaming."
Chamberlain wore nice threads during the day and two or three defenders on every possession at night. He got hacked and held perhaps more than any player in NBA history.
"I don't suppose Bryant had anything like the physical punishment that Wilt took," said Ruklick, who starred at Northwestern. "Wilt's achievement was a feat of unbelievable endurance. He really had to work to get open, to get those guys off of him. Everybody in the league was tired of him scoring 50 points a game against them. They roughed him up in that game."
Tobe drops 81
here's 1 reason why:
"Kobe's was an extraordinary athletic achievement,'' Pomerantz said in an e-mail. "Wilt's was a revolutionary act and a social statement, if not by intention, then by effect. It was a very different America in 1962 -- and a very different NBA, too. Wilt's 100 was a hyperbolic announcement that the NBA was a white man's enclave no more. In the 1950s and into the early 1960s, the NBA team owners had a quota that limited the number of African Americans to one or two per team, then three or four. Wilt symbolically blew that quota to smithereens.''
RunawaySlave said:
here's 1 reason why:
"Kobe's was an extraordinary athletic achievement,'' Pomerantz said in an e-mail. "Wilt's was a revolutionary act and a social statement, if not by intention, then by effect. It was a very different America in 1962 -- and a very different NBA, too. Wilt's 100 was a hyperbolic announcement that the NBA was a white man's enclave no more. In the 1950s and into the early 1960s, the NBA team owners had a quota that limited the number of African Americans to one or two per team, then three or four. Wilt symbolically blew that quota to smithereens.''
Re: Tobe drops 81
and this queer can't read...
i knew a fanboy would take the bait... in case you hadn't noticed, these posts were direct quotes from
coach riley
coach jackson
coach winter
antoine walker
mike james
mychal thompson
a published author who chronicled wilt chamberlain's 100 point game
and a chicago sports columnist
when will you homosexual tobe fans learn to READ and COMPREHEND?
BTW where was the downplay you imagined you read? or are you just another hyper sensitive punk with too much sugar in his tank?
Complex said:This muthafucka is hopping from topic to topic trying to downplay Kobe
and this queer can't read...
i knew a fanboy would take the bait... in case you hadn't noticed, these posts were direct quotes from
coach riley
coach jackson
coach winter
antoine walker
mike james
mychal thompson
a published author who chronicled wilt chamberlain's 100 point game
and a chicago sports columnist
when will you homosexual tobe fans learn to READ and COMPREHEND?
BTW where was the downplay you imagined you read? or are you just another hyper sensitive punk with too much sugar in his tank?
Last edited:
Re: Tobe drops 81
Aren't all of their comments about Kobe? or Wilt?
What did you say about comprehend and reading?
Now go back and read my comment, and read you response. So which one doesn't make sense? Are you even intelligent enough to realize it
I wasn't going to quote you, but I decided to so you wouldn't edit your shit and so you dumb ass could be exposed for the fradualant ass no job having dim wit you are.
Here let me help you out
com·pre·hend P Pronunciation Key (kmpr-hnd)
tr.v. com·pre·hend·ed, com·pre·hend·ing, com·pre·hends
To take in the meaning, nature, or importance of; grasp. See Synonyms at apprehend.
To take in as a part; include. See Synonyms at include.
Maybe you should spend more time reading something other than shit about Kobe like the obsessed crazed stalking little bitch you are and hanging from his scrotum.
cranrab said:and this queer can't read...
i knew a fanboy would take the bait... in case you hadn't noticed, these posts were direct quotes from
coach riley
coach jackson
coach winter
antoine walker
mike james
mychal thompson
a published author who chronicled wilt chamberlain's 100 point game
and a chicago sports columnist
when will you homosexual tobe fans learn to READ and COMPREHEND?
Aren't all of their comments about Kobe? or Wilt?
What did you say about comprehend and reading?
Now go back and read my comment, and read you response. So which one doesn't make sense? Are you even intelligent enough to realize it
I wasn't going to quote you, but I decided to so you wouldn't edit your shit and so you dumb ass could be exposed for the fradualant ass no job having dim wit you are.
Here let me help you out
com·pre·hend P Pronunciation Key (kmpr-hnd)
tr.v. com·pre·hend·ed, com·pre·hend·ing, com·pre·hends
To take in the meaning, nature, or importance of; grasp. See Synonyms at apprehend.
To take in as a part; include. See Synonyms at include.
Maybe you should spend more time reading something other than shit about Kobe like the obsessed crazed stalking little bitch you are and hanging from his scrotum.
Re: Tobe drops 81
Let me do it for you again. You seem to have a problem understanding english. Are you mexican or some shit? Angry that Kobe married a mexican chick? Is that it Richard Ramirez?
down·play P Pronunciation Key (dounpl)
tr.v. down·played, down·play·ing, down·plays
To minimize the significance of; play down
They way you've been running on this board every day. No wait, you actually took a day off my bad...to post peoples opinions and highlighting them to show that Kobe's 81 points really isn't that great.
My new nickname for you is Obsession. It fits so well. The way you suck his dick. Plus oh yeah...you're a bitch.
cranrab said:and this queer can't read...
Let me do it for you again. You seem to have a problem understanding english. Are you mexican or some shit? Angry that Kobe married a mexican chick? Is that it Richard Ramirez?
down·play P Pronunciation Key (dounpl)
tr.v. down·played, down·play·ing, down·plays
To minimize the significance of; play down
They way you've been running on this board every day. No wait, you actually took a day off
my bad...to post peoples opinions and highlighting them to show that Kobe's 81 points really isn't that great. My new nickname for you is Obsession. It fits so well. The way you suck his dick. Plus oh yeah...you're a bitch.
Re: i'm back
"coach jackson should've benched tobe regardless of the point scoring milestone looming ahead... any coach who helps players to pad stats is flirting with tarnishing the sport... "
We watch the NBA because it entertains us. A select few watch it because they have been around long enough to earn a love for the game and a certain way to play it. With that said, I don't think that there were too many people NOT rooting for Kobe Bryant to break Wilt's record in the game against Golden State. Enough with the purist BS.
Even if it kills you to witness a player becoming a part of history, or simply having a fantastic game (like Lebron's game today against Phoenix), just enjoy the sport. And for the record, Pat Riley is off with this one. If that was the case (regarding the "70 shots"), then players would be scoring more. It's not that uncommon to see someone with 2-5 shooting or 6-18, or even 2-9 (LAMAR ODOM!). I'm not saying that you should jump on the bandwagon, but it doesn't mean that you have to devote your life to berading the player every time he does something outstanding.
"Anybody who's got the kind of energy to try to hoist up 70 shots is going to score a lot of points," Pat Riley, the Heat sideline walker, said for all to hear, inflating Bryant's 66 combined field-goal and free-throw attempts. "We've got a lot of guys in this league, if they took 70 shots, they'd score a lot of points."
cranrab said:i think his age and $10M have made coach jackson ALOT more tolerant...
plus, coach jackson has earned some room for error, considering his past successes...
and on top of it, should the fakers finish as poorly as they did last season, coach jackson could just write 'uncoachable part 2'...
here is a troublesome (to me) quote from the fakers v. raptors game:
Jackson claimed he was unaware of Bryant's total until late in the fourth quarter, when assistant Frank Hamblen notified him. "I wasn't keeping track on what he had and I turned (to Hamblen) and said, 'I think I better take him out now,'" Jackson said. "It was a time I felt the game was sealed, but (Hamblen) said, 'I don't think you can, he has 77 points.' So we stayed with it until he hit 80."
this is troublesome in the same way that i disagreed with coach riley padding kareem abdul jabbar's stats... some on this board are too young to remember that coach riley kept kareem abdul jabbar in meaningless games (albeit not many) simply so kareem could keep his consecutive double digit scoring record going...
coach jackson should've benched tobe regardless of the point scoring milestone looming ahead... any coach who helps players to pad stats is flirting with tarnishing the sport...
and as it pertains to tobe, would it really have been less meaningful for tobe's fanboys had tobe scored 77 instead of 81? i say no...
but, thanks for pointing out another factor as to how a single individual scores 81 points... the coach has to leave you in the game... players can't score if the coach doesn't leave them on the floor...
"coach jackson should've benched tobe regardless of the point scoring milestone looming ahead... any coach who helps players to pad stats is flirting with tarnishing the sport...
"We watch the NBA because it entertains us. A select few watch it because they have been around long enough to earn a love for the game and a certain way to play it. With that said, I don't think that there were too many people NOT rooting for Kobe Bryant to break Wilt's record in the game against Golden State. Enough with the purist BS.
Even if it kills you to witness a player becoming a part of history, or simply having a fantastic game (like Lebron's game today against Phoenix), just enjoy the sport. And for the record, Pat Riley is off with this one. If that was the case (regarding the "70 shots"), then players would be scoring more. It's not that uncommon to see someone with 2-5 shooting or 6-18, or even 2-9 (LAMAR ODOM!). I'm not saying that you should jump on the bandwagon, but it doesn't mean that you have to devote your life to berading the player every time he does something outstanding.
"Anybody who's got the kind of energy to try to hoist up 70 shots is going to score a lot of points," Pat Riley, the Heat sideline walker, said for all to hear, inflating Bryant's 66 combined field-goal and free-throw attempts. "We've got a lot of guys in this league, if they took 70 shots, they'd score a lot of points."
Sorry y'all, but this comment is NOT about Kobe Bryant.
It is about the comments made by Vince Carter....I am
not saying whether I agree with them or not, but I will
give the man credit for saying what he really feels
instead of just aping the company line like 99% of players
will do to retain their jobs....
His comments are all too rare. A man who will say what
is on his mind instead of what he is required to say
Dapz Vince
It is about the comments made by Vince Carter....I am
not saying whether I agree with them or not, but I will
give the man credit for saying what he really feels
instead of just aping the company line like 99% of players
will do to retain their jobs....
His comments are all too rare. A man who will say what
is on his mind instead of what he is required to say
Dapz Vince
Re: Tobe drops 81
do you spend too much time rehearsing with your village people tribute band?
as you observed (after i pointed it out for you
) those quotes belong to OTHER people... kinda pokes holes in your FANboy theory that i downplayed tobe...
still waiting for the exposure, son... those quotes belong to OTHER people... the BEST you could extrapolate is that OTHER people were downplaying tobe's performance, but your hypersensitive BITCH ass played your own damn self...
Complex said:
do you spend too much time rehearsing with your village people tribute band?
as you observed (after i pointed it out for you
) those quotes belong to OTHER people... kinda pokes holes in your FANboy theory that i downplayed tobe...Complex said:
still waiting for the exposure, son... those quotes belong to OTHER people... the BEST you could extrapolate is that OTHER people were downplaying tobe's performance, but your hypersensitive BITCH ass played your own damn self...
Re: Tobe drops 81
let's see... YOU:
1. check the SPORTS board (and presumably others) to see how often i post
2. take note of the days i 'take off' from posting
and yet you suggest that i have an obsession?
what a pathetic, cyber stalking homosexual you are
Complex said:They way you've been running on this board every day. No wait, you actually took a day off
let's see... YOU:
1. check the SPORTS board (and presumably others) to see how often i post
2. take note of the days i 'take off' from posting
and yet you suggest that i have an obsession?
what a pathetic, cyber stalking homosexual you are
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