You don't have a problem generalizing us as needing "help"...
The Black-white wealth gap is widening — a racial equity stimulus can narrow it
- Thread starter Joe Money
- Start date
You don't have a problem generalizing us as needing "help"...
So you're not serious about the wealth gap. The black people who applied "eurocentric social norms" are doing the best amongst us!
I've already said that the wealth gap won't be changed by us working hard and opening businesses. Capitalism won't save us. Only government intervention will just like it did for the white middle class with the GI bill and the homestead act.
You think we can bridge a hundred year gap on our own?
LOL that simple, huh.
So those "eurocentric social norms" like education and marriage had nothing to do with it...just a couple of policies.
Nah not that simple...the gap is way to large to close but it can be helped by government measured such as a debt jubilee. Education and marriage in a capitalist system is flawed. We did just fine living off the land and practicing communalism before europe came to Africa.
You can't just skip over the parts that helped fuel the wealth gap and think we're going to get similar results.
And romanticizing pre-imperialist Africa sounds good but you really believe there was no political hierarchy? No caste systems? No rich/poor/winners/losers? No religious dogma you had to abide by to be part of the group?
It can also be noted that nowhere had there been any internal social revolutions. The latter have taken place in European and world history only where class consciousness led to the massive intervention of people's wills within the otherwise involuntary socioeconomic process.
Only with capitalism did class bullshit come along
theres the rub....setting up shop (whatever it is) in non black communities.... how often does that happen?
I made on thread on it years back...
Does anyone know of a study about black businesses in non black communities vs non black businesses in black communities?
he's specifically referring to out of wedlock child birth as the "eurocentric social norms".
The concept of daddy, momma, and 2.5 kids is a white eurocentric concept. The west African family structure contains a number of combinations and extended family members. The positive influences in a child's life aren't just the role ONLY for the biological father and mother. Barack Obama is a perfect example of this...this is a guy who promotes the white-centric nuclear family model meanwhile his upbringing included his grandparents and stepfather and a number of family friends and elder men in his life having a major influence on him....and he only met his biological father once. Then grew up to be the fucking president under this influence. And guess what... there are MANY men and children who grew up in this kind of household who became productive members of society....there's more than one way to skin a cat.
you have to admit those couple of policies made a lot of shit easier tho... and it wasn't just a couple of policies..it was ALOT of them coupled with private sector efforts (with a blind eye from fed, state and local govt) and a culture based on exclusion and discrimination that helped build the white middle class to what it became
- The 1790 Naturalization Act permitted only "free white persons" to become naturalized citizens, thus opening the doors to European immigrants but not others. Only citizens could vote, serve on juries, hold office, and in some cases, even hold property.
- White Americans were also given a head start with the help of the U.S. Army. The 1830 Indian Removal Act, for example, forcibly relocated Cherokee, Creeks and other eastern Indians to west of the Mississippi River to make room for white settlers.
- The 1862 Homestead Act followed suit, giving away millions of acres of what had been Indian Territory west of the Mississippi. Ultimately, 270 million acres, or 10% of the total land area of the United States, was converted to private hands, overwhelmingly white, under Homestead Act provisions.
- In the South, the federal government never followed through on General Sherman's Civil War plan to divide up plantations and give each freed slave "40 acres and a mule" as reparations. Only once was monetary compensation made for slavery, in Washington, D.C. There, government officials paid up to $300 per slave upon emancipation - not to the slaves, but to local slaveholders as compensation for loss of property.
- Jim Crow laws, instituted in the late 19th and early 20th century and not overturned in many states until the 1960s, reserved the best jobs, neighborhoods, schools and hospitals for white people.
- The landmark Social Security Act of 1935 provided a safety net for millions of workers, guaranteeing them an income after retirement. But the act specifically excluded two occupations: agricultural workers and domestic servants, who were predominately African American, Mexican, and Asian.
- Like Social Security, the 1935 Wagner Act helped establish an important new right for white people. By granting unions the power of collective bargaining, it helped millions of white workers gain entry into the middle class over the next 30 years. But the Wagner Act permitted unions to exclude non-whites and deny them access to better paid jobs and union protections and benefits such as health care, job security, and pensions. Many craft unions remained nearly all-white well into the 1970s.
- the G.I. Bill was created to help veterans of World War II. It established hospitals, made low-interest mortgages available and granted stipends covering tuition and expenses for veterans attending college or trade schools. While the GI Bill's language did not specifically exclude African-American veterans from its benefits, it was structured in a way that ultimately shut doors for the 1.2 million Black veterans who had bravely served their country during World War II, in segregated ranks. The original GI Bill ended in July 1956. By that time, nearly 8 million World War II veterans had received education or training, and 4.3 million home loans worth $33 billion had been handed out. But most Black veterans had been left behind. As employment, college attendance and wealth surged for whites, disparities with their Black counterparts not only continued but widened.
- New Deal program, the Federal Housing Administration, that helped generate much of the wealth that so many white families enjoy today. These revolutionary programs made it possible for millions of average white Americans - but not others - to own a home for the first time. The government set up a national neighborhood appraisal system, explicitly tying mortgage eligibility to race. Integrated communities were ipso facto deemed a financial risk and made ineligible for home loans, a policy known today as "redlining." Between 1934 and 1962, the federal government backed $120 billion of home loans. More than 98% went to whites. Of the 350,000 new homes built with federal support in northern California between 1946 and 1960, fewer than 100 went to African Americans.
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It doesn't matter if it is a European concept. This entire society is rooted in European ideologies, including the economy.
No one on this planet can deny the facts and the data. Children raised in single parent households have more adverse outcomes in EVERY category. This is not debatable. The only way to avoid this "eurocentric concept" is to leave the society and go somewhere where the society is not governed by these said concepts.
However, black folk are Americans and have been forced to be for years. We are apart of the "eurocentric concept" now.
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You do know that slavery has been practiced in different forms on every continent since the dawn of man, right?
I purposely didn't mention slavery so I'm amused that you did. Yes I know all about slavery and how enamored some of the african chiefs were with shiny european goods that they traded people for them. I'm a walter rodney stan so I've read how europe undeveloped africa a bunch of times.
What's your point?
This is one of the biggest issues that no one talks about.
There's a large part of "buying in" to American ideals that lead to success for many and too many think you can just skip that part and be militant yet successful.
Its a big reason they HATE black conservatives and black immigrants.
You think slaves in ancient Greece enjoyed the same freedoms as free people?
I don't care about the fags in ancient greece. I know the slaves in africa and europe had more freedoms than what america put the slaves through
Two-parent homes aren’t the key for all
As I was reading the existing literature on this topic, I kept noticing the same finding over and over: that even though children who live outside of the two-parent family tend to fare worse than those who live with two parents, minority children are less negatively impacted by this. Scholars have speculated that maybe this has something to do with minority families having a stronger extended family support network than white families or perhaps that they are more frequently exposed to socioeconomic stressors such that the independent effect of living apart from a parent is just not as pronounced. However, I had not come across a study that empirically tested these possible explanations. So, I spent a couple years tracking a nationally representative sample of about 2,600 children’s living arrangements, their access to economic resources, and their interactions with extended relatives through the Panel Study of Income Dynamics (PSID), which is the longest-running household panel study in the world. And what I found was that both sets of factors helped account for group differences in the effect of family structure. However, the socioeconomic-stress argument helps explain relatively more of this puzzle.
One way to think about this is that economic resources play an important role in parents’ ability to provide the material resources that children need to thrive. When children have two parents in the household who are able to pool resources, they are less likely to live in poverty. However, for minority children, and black and Hispanic children in particular, even when they live in a two-parent family they’re still two to three times more likely to be poor. This has a lot to do with the structural disadvantages that these groups face. I don’t mean to suggest that economic resources are the only things that matter for children’s success — parenting and family stability are also important. However, I do find that economic resources play a key role in determining children’s educational success. This is pretty unfortunate and sobering, but I think it’s important because our current welfare legislation, the Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Reconciliation Act of 1996, emphasizes the importance of this two-parent family model.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/01/why-single-parent-homes-affect-children-differently/
I didn't even see his response about this but I'm glad you posted this. I grow weary of all the cliche bullshit that's not backed by data
Where slaves in africa considered of the same class as their owners?????
The panic around the reported numbers of single-parent households was based on a host of faulty or untested premises: that two bad parents would be better than one good one, that the presence of an abusive Black father is better for the child than his absence, that having a second income for a child trumps all other factors, that all of the single parents were Black women, that none of these absent fathers were in prison or the grave, that Black mothers never hid the presence of Black fathers in their household to keep their welfare for the child.
Class didn't exist buddy. It wasn't even a concept yet. If they worked the land they are like everybody else
Happens more often than people realize, diff is lots of people don’t go around saying this is a black biz.. it’s just a biz like most places that are setup in every other environment.. do you know what every person looks like or what nationality that owns the bizz you frequent? A franchise could be own by a black person, a supermarket, a lounge/club, hardware store, etc.. all you see is the workers which could be random hired people, family, the owner themselves, etc.. you never know..you just buy and leave.. not everybody announces this is a black biz, or Latin biz, or mid eastern, or Asian, or cac.. some just blend in
Average Black Person:
Damn what you're talking about. What about the immigrants?
Damn what you're talking about. What about the immigrants?
My brother, the author of the article is/ was a student. The article you provided is an opinion piece with absolutely zero published data. None.
Anecdotal evidence and anomolies are not the norm.
Would you advise your daughter to get pregnant and raise her children, particularly a male child alone? If she asked, which is better, raiding my child alone or raising my child in a two parent household, would you say, "raise him alone?"
Even the provided article says this. Minority children are more likely to live in poverty even with two parents. However these same children are more likely to see more positive outcomes than those children who live in single parent households.
There is absolutely zero data that supports that minority single household families have equitable outcomes as minority two-parent households.
There is one, and only one study by Dr. Christina Cross that says that having a two-parent household does not guarantee success. This is true. But, being in a single-parent household increases the probability of failure. Facts.
We have to stop celebrating and condoning fatherless children. It does not work for us and has not been working for us. 80% of all black children are born out of wedlock. We can not act as though this is normal or acceptable.
We have to stop trying to avoid accountability by reaching for anomalies and anecdotal evidence.
Again, this is an opinion piece. Not vetted research.
Where is your vetted research to support your position?
Because ppl will always throw this back in your face "it is my money do not tell me how and where to spend it".
Well my criteria isn't who grows up to become middle class or better.. it's who grows up to be productive citizens and the vast majority of black people do that. regardless of their parental circumstances. The hypothetical question you give is just ridiculous... also you overlook extended family and support in terms of friends etc thats mentioned in the piece. Scholars have speculated that maybe this has something to do with minority families having a stronger extended family support network than white families.
And many fathers tho not living with their children arent absentee..
In 1965, white sociologist and Assistant Secretary of Labor Daniel Patrick Moynihan published a report called The Negro Family: The Case For National Action. This report claimed that increasing rates of “out-of-wedlock” births and single-mother homes among African-Americans signaled the coming destruction of Black families, and these trends were to blame for many of the issues facing the Black community in America. (The report has been roundly criticized by many race scholars.)
Today, around 70% of Black children are born to parents who aren’t married. (Rates of “out-of-wedlock” births have, of course, increased among all races since 1965.) The idea that racial disparities in education, employment, income, incarceration, and more can be blamed not on structural racism, but on this “absence” of black fathers has been parroted by pundits and politicians alike.
Even Black public figures have shared these statistics. In 2008, President Barack Obama said during his Father’s Day speech that “more than half of all black children live in single-parent households… children who grow up without a father are five times more likely to live in poverty and commit crime; nine times more likely to drop out of schools and 20 times more likely to end up in prison. They are more likely to have behavioral problems, or run away from home or become teenage parents themselves. And the foundations of our community are weaker because of it.”
This stereotype ignores clear evidence that Black fathers are in fact more involved in their children’s care, and their lives, than fathers of other races.
We can not equate the number of unmarried dads to the number of “fatherless” children. First of all, marriage rates don’t necessarily reflect the number of Black fathers living with their children; as writer Josh Levs points out, the majority of Black dads (2.5 million of around 4.2 million) do live with their kids, even if they’re not married to their partner.
And second of all, according to a 2013 report by the CDC, Black dads—whether they live with their children, or not—are more actively involved in their children’s lives than their counterparts of other races.
For example, the CDC reports that Black fathers who live with their children are more likely than fathers of other races to provide physical care (bathe, diaper, feed) for their young children, read to their children, and help their children with their homework—all on a daily basis—than fathers of other races who also cohabitate with their kids.
The report also reveals that, among dads who don’t live with their children, Black dads are more likely to be involved in care, including reading to their children, helping them with homework, talking to them about their days, and taking them to activities, than Hispanic or white dads who live apart from their kids. Non-residential Black fathers are also the least likely to report that they’re not at all involved in the care of their children, including bathing, dressing, changing diapers, and playing with their children.
The truth about Black fatherhood - Give Legacy
Black fatherhood has been blamed for racial disparities—but evidence demonstrates that the majority of Black fathers are active, involved parents.
www.givelegacy.com
Here you go. In fact, they covered why Dr. Cross has never been published by a peer reviewed periodical.
Yet Cross narrowly cites evidence that seeks to denigrate the two-parent household as a marginal thing for black children, while ignoring the data that actually cement the difference family structure plays in the lives of children of all races.
Here is the article and the vetted data from reliable sources that 100% nullify the opinion of the article you posted.
The power of the two-parent home is not a myth
Among several disturbing elements of Christina Cross's New York Times op-ed, “The Myth of the Two-Parent Home,” is the author’s seeming belief that unless growing up with married parents has the same effect on black children as on white youngsters, it is not worthy of endorsement.
Bro, this does not work well for the whole. You can't just make up what success is. As a whole, we are losing and are at the bottom.
Why is it so hard to come to terms that this is a multifaceted issue. Yes, there are systemic issues that plague our community. However, there are aspects that are within our control. And we have to be able to accept that and want to work through it.
We can not wait for the system to self correct. It will never do that for us.
Here you go. In fact, they covered why Dr. Cross has never been published by a peer reviewed periodical.
Yet Cross narrowly cites evidence that seeks to denigrate the two-parent household as a marginal thing for black children, while ignoring the data that actually cement the difference family structure plays in the lives of children of all races.
Here is the article and the vetted data from reliable sources that 100% nullify the opinion of the article you posted.
The power of the two-parent home is not a myth
Among several disturbing elements of Christina Cross's New York Times op-ed, “The Myth of the Two-Parent Home,” is the author’s seeming belief that unless growing up with married parents has the same effect on black children as on white youngsters, it is not worthy of endorsement.fordhaminstitute.org
This is from the article you posted? Kinda contradicts your original clichés about black people no?
According to ChildTrends, the percent of births occurring to unmarried women has grown most rapidly among white women. And there is increasing evidence that opioid deaths and other issues facing particularly white working class men are linked to a breakdown in family stability.
https://fordhaminstitute.org/sites/default/files/inline-images/ir table.png
Y'all ain't even trying anymore
You missed what the report is saying. The point they are making is that this is not a "black problem." It is a single mother problem. White women are the fastest growing group with out of wedlock children. This is why white children stats have been declining as well. This is the point. It's not a black thing. It's just a thing.This is from the article you posted? Kinda contradicts your original clichés about black people no?
According to ChildTrends, the percent of births occurring to unmarried women has grown most rapidly among white women. And there is increasing evidence that opioid deaths and other issues facing particularly white working class men are linked to a breakdown in family stability.
https://fordhaminstitute.org/sites/default/files/inline-images/ir table.png
This is from the article you posted? Kinda contradicts your original clichés about black people no?
According to ChildTrends, the percent of births occurring to unmarried women has grown most rapidly among white women. And there is increasing evidence that opioid deaths and other issues facing particularly white working class men are linked to a breakdown in family stability.
https://fordhaminstitute.org/sites/default/files/inline-images/ir table.png
If you're gonna make conclusions from this chart it should be that a big reason Asians have taken the top spot in group wealth from white people is their low out-of-wedlock birthrate...
He didn't read the entire article to understand the data. White people are f n up too. But, we don't care about what they do. We need to focus on ourselves and fixing our ish.
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