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There is no cherry picking. OT is apart of the game. It counts.

Good teams struggle offensively and still win games because of their defense.

Memphis scored 71 two nights ago and still won!

And Cleveland hasn't even played good offensive teams that will exploit their defense. Only top 10 offensive team they've played was Chicago and D. Rose didn't even finish the game :smh:

Platt needs to devise a good defensive scheme for the defense...offense will work itself out.

Says a lot when they say Platt was the most successful Offensive coach in Europe :lol:

What happen to the defense? Platt don't like? :lol:
 
I think you're thinking short-term. Wade, Lebron, and Bosh struggled their first 20 games together.

They only crossed 100 eight times over their first 15 games. You're looking at chemistry issues on the offensive end.

That doesn't explain the defense though.

I think the situations are different. In this situation, it is a pre-existing problem with Kyrie and Waiters. It's a problem many -- including myself -- thought the introduction of Lebron would solve. It hasn't resolved. Kyrie goes off the rails, Waiters gets fed up and follows. If Kyrie can do it, Waiters figures he can too. If Kyrie pounds the ball and doesn't move without it, Waiters will do the same exact shit until someone checks Kyrie on it.

Miami didn't have these problems. They had chemistry problems. Cavs have a 'fuck it, I'm going to do me no matter what Bron or coach say' problem which then leads to a Waiters problem.
 
The problem with their defense is they play for 23 secs often giving up that last sec.. In yesterday's game, they lock Portland shit down, then on the last sec, Andy for some strange reason read the situation wrong, rotated to double a man with out the ball leaving his man wide open for the shot with one sec.. Then there was the one sec shooting fouls that bailed them out.. To me they have way too many moving parts and need to simplify it instead of looking confused with an over complicated system.. No need to make it tougher than what it is..
 
There is no cherry picking. OT is apart of the game. It counts.

Good teams struggle offensively and still win games because of their defense.

Memphis scored 71 two nights ago and still won!

And Cleveland hasn't even played good offensive teams that will exploit their defense. Only top 10 offensive team they've played was Chicago and D. Rose didn't even finish the game :smh:

Platt needs to devise a good defensive scheme for the defense...offense will work itself out.

I know it is part of the game, but the OT period adds to the point ranking stats for both defense and offense. That's why I was only using 4qts after 3 games.

Kyrie only has 5 assists per game. With all this talent, 5 assists. :smh:

You're optimistic about the offense because you haven't had to deal with Irving and Waiters going at it for two years. That ball dominant, shoot-first shit rubbed Waiters the wrong way now it's doing the same to Lebron. The only difference is you are gone if you keep rubbing Lebron the wrong way. A lot more pull than Waiters. :lol:
 
It's crazy many of the concerns we expressed during the offseason is coming to light, but damn these cats haven't played 5 games yet...

It took Miami a fucking "YEAR" to "SOMEWHAT" figure their shit out.



If you read the article I post, you can tell Lebron understand what's he's dealing with. Shit he knew before hand. I'm curious if he would've made that switch if Love didn't opening up to the Cavs.
 
I know it is part of the game, but the OT period adds to the point ranking stats for both defense and offense. That's why I was only using 4qts after 3 games.

Kyrie only has 5 assists per game. With all this talent, 5 assists. :smh:

You're optimistic about the offense because you haven't had to deal with Irving and Waiters going at it for two years. That ball dominant, shoot-first shit rubbed Waiters the wrong way now it's doing the same to Lebron. The only difference is you are gone if you keep rubbing Lebron the wrong way. A lot more pull than Waiters. :lol:
Waiters clicked on Kyrie already, might happen again
 
It's crazy many of the concerns we expressed during the offseason is coming to light, but damn these cats haven't played 5 games yet...

It took Miami a fucking "YEAR" to "SOMEWHAT" figure their shit out.



If you read the article I post, you can tell Lebron understand what's he's dealing with. Shit he knew before hand. I'm curious if he would've made that switch if Love didn't opening up to the Cavs.

We all knew beforehand. But we thought they would listen. I could see if they actually ran the offense and had chemistry problems. They are pounding the ball, not making cuts, and basically playing And 1 ball.

Pass it to Thompson and you can forget about the ball coming out. It's the two-man game shit Waiters was bitching about when he got into it with them in the locker room last year.

I knew defense would be a problem, but watching them play offense makes me want to punch a kitten.
 
You're optimistic about the offense because you haven't had to deal with Irving and Waiters going at it for two years.

I'll cede this point to you for now. Let me watch a few more games and pay extra attention to Irving and Waiters. I thought Lebron looked out of sync as if he legs just weren't under him yet or he's getting used to the weight. I didn't connect it to Irving.
 
I knew defense would be a problem, but watching them play offense makes me want to punch a kitten.

The expectation was that they would be the top rebounding team in the league and with their passers (Lebron and Love), they would produce a lot of fast break points in transition. That hasn't transpired because they're not getting the stops they need to push the ball.

So far, with the addition of Love (one of the leagues top rebounders), Cleveland has actually slightly dipped as a rebounding team this season. Which is odd...but you can't get rebounds on made shots.
 
I'll cede this point to you for now. Let me watch a few more games and pay extra attention to Irving and Waiters. I thought Lebron looked out of sync as if he legs just weren't under him yet or he's getting used to the weight. I didn't connect it to Irving.

Yeah, what he said after the game were very public shots at Irving, Waiters, and Thompson. He then mentioned learning from guys like Miller, Marion, and others who have won. Shots fucking fired.

It will be interesting to see how they react.
 
It's crazy many of the concerns we expressed during the offseason is coming to light, but damn these cats haven't played 5 games yet...

It took Miami a fucking "YEAR" to "SOMEWHAT" figure their shit out.



If you read the article I post, you can tell Lebron understand what's he's dealing with. Shit he knew before hand. I'm curious if he would've made that switch if Love didn't opening up to the Cavs.

Miami case was more chemistry and who out take the last shot in close games . Wade and bosh played Defense.. Them cats went to the finals alone off the strength of their defense
 
How are you going to blame Love and not Kyrie, who has the ball a whole lot more :confused:

Love is a perennial loser. Kyrie......I suppose he is too. I think Kyrie's skillset is dependant on him dominating the basketball just like Lebron. So its not shock they both are going to struggle out of the gate until they develop some chemistry with each other. Love is just gonna fit right in and get his 20 points and 15 boards and not play defense because he's a perennial loser. His losing ways are contagious.
 
It's crazy many of the concerns we expressed during the offseason is coming to light, but damn these cats haven't played 5 games yet...

It took Miami a fucking "YEAR" to "SOMEWHAT" figure their shit out.



If you read the article I post, you can tell Lebron understand what's he's dealing with. Shit he knew before hand. I'm curious if he would've made that switch if Love didn't opening up to the Cavs.

Miami case was more chemistry and who out take the last shot in close games . Wade and bosh played Defense.. Them cats went to the finals alone off the strength of their defense
 
The expectation was that they would be the top rebounding team in the league and with their passers (Lebron and Love), they would produce a lot of fast break points in transition. That hasn't transpired because they're not getting the stops they need to push the ball.

So far, with the addition of Love (one of the leagues top rebounders), Cleveland has actually slightly dipped as a rebounding team this season. Which is odd...but you can't get rebounds on made shots.

Yeah, they were expected to be great on the break. They were also expected to be deadly in their half-court set. I think that is what is pissing Lebron off and why he made his comments only 3 games in. He can deal with chemistry problems. He can deal with the defense being a work in progress. But the train wreck on the offensive end is breaking him and pushing him to this :angry:

Miami case was more chemistry and who out take the last shot in close games . Wade and bosh played Defense.. Them cats went to the finals alone off the strength of their defense

True, that was a true chemistry issue. Bosh also had to adapt his game, which he at least was trying to fucking do. Kyrie has shown no signs of trying to do shit.

It's been fuck Byron Scott.....fuck Mike Brown....now it's passively-aggressively saying fuck Lebron and Blatt.....that isn't a chemistry issue...that's some deeper shit...
 
Miami case was more chemistry and who out take the last shot in close games . Wade and bosh played Defense.. Them cats went to the finals alone off the strength of their defense

yeah.. those cats wrecked shop defensively those first 2-3 years together...first year they were snatching everything out of the air and making sportcenter on fast break oops..shit was crazy
 
I'd take Rondo on the heat right now as currently constructed

Give up Chalmers, Norris and Granger lol

who gonna want granger

Rondo is a fucking headcase.....fuck him

cavs will take some work but will be very good

look back at those early Heat season threads from 4 years ago...look at all the dire and despair

people were ready to write them off after 6 games

cavs have lost 2 games....and won one game against a good bulls team...which to me is the most interesting game of their season thus far.....

its good for them to have these teething problems....

yo let me run to the Heat thread and cuss Spo out...cause that muthafucka had me livid
 
yeah.. those cats wrecked shop defensively those first 2-3 years together...first year they were snatching everything out of the air and making sportcenter on fast break oops..shit was crazy


Man. I thought we would see outlets from Love to Kyrie and then oops to Lebron

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Waiters: Catch-And-Shoot Isn't My Game
Nov 05, 2014 12:19 PM EST


With the Cleveland Cavaliers featuring the playmaking abilities of LeBron James and Kyrie Irving on offense, catch-and-shoot perimeter shots are a key component of how they score.

Dion Waiters made 42 percent of his catch-and-shoot 3-point attempts last season (72-for-173), which ranked 35th in the NBA and higher than both Kevin Love and Irving.

Waiters worked out for an extra 40 minutes after the Cavaliers' shootaround on Tuesday primarily working on catch-and-shoot 3-pointers.

“That’s not my game,” said Waiters when asked if he's focusing on that this season. “I can do it, but you know what I’m effective at: pick-and-roll and things like that.”
 
Waiters: Catch-And-Shoot Isn't My Game
Nov 05, 2014 12:19 PM EST


With the Cleveland Cavaliers featuring the playmaking abilities of LeBron James and Kyrie Irving on offense, catch-and-shoot perimeter shots are a key component of how they score.

Dion Waiters made 42 percent of his catch-and-shoot 3-point attempts last season (72-for-173), which ranked 35th in the NBA and higher than both Kevin Love and Irving.

Waiters worked out for an extra 40 minutes after the Cavaliers' shootaround on Tuesday primarily working on catch-and-shoot 3-pointers.

That’s not my game,” said Waiters when asked if he's focusing on that this season. “I can do it, but you know what I’m effective at: pick-and-roll and things like that.”

You will do it or sit the fuck down somewhere. Damn. Kyrie and Waiters stubborn as fuck. Standing 18 feet or more from the basket wasn't Bosh's game, but he did it.
 
Damn gene read the paragraph right before that...


Dude is working on it, he'll be alright
 
Damn...Skip is right(hate when he is right). As long as shoot-first persists with Kyrie, the clashes will be there and prevent this team from working.

Westbrook/Durant part 2 in fucking Cleveland. Fuck I'm pissed. And if we didn't know that Blatt already has a great offensive system that isn't being used, we'd be under the oppression he is another Brooks. :smh:
 
LeBron opts for new leadership style

PORTLAND, Ore. -- The old head seems to be playing the long game, at least for now.

That's what LeBron James was doing Tuesday night, and perhaps more nights in the near future, when the Portland Trail Blazers whipped the Cleveland Cavaliers so heartily (101-82 was the final) that the white flag was out midway through the fourth quarter.

James pulled up even earlier, jogging through his final shift of the night watching his younger teammates bomb away indiscriminately and generally showing zero interest in fighting. It's an interesting strategy and not one James has relied upon in the past, when he's usually dealt with intra-team frustration by pulling on a cape and trying to heroball his way through it.

This time he just walked quietly to the bench when his coach, David Blatt, called timeouts to stem the bleeding. When his night was over, James picked the final seat on the bench and was into the tunnel shortly after the final horn.

In recent days there have been growing questions as to whether James might be hurt -- he has dealt with some minor back soreness -- or in some way suddenly physically diminished because at times he has looked lackluster.

That is not the case at all.

This is a conscious decision on how he plans to operate in a passive-aggressive mission to yank some teammates toward his way of thinking. Let some of them fail at their way so they will be open to new ideas, is what it looks and sounds like.

"Everyone wants to win, I would hope," James said. "Would you rather play selfish basketball and lose, or play unselfish basketball and sacrifice and win? So you pick it."

This style of leadership is not part of James' typical nature and it wouldn't be like him to keep it up very long. More likely, frustrated by the way the game unfolded as the Cavs' offense collapsed into one-on-one ball, this was his way of counting to 10 to calm down.

It's interesting that this took place in Portland. A few years ago, when he was being booed regularly on the road for the first time in his life, James stood on the court of what was then called the Rose Garden and incited the crowd to boo him as he led a comeback win. He said after the game he accepted the villain role going forward.

Within days, he'd abandoned that because that is not him. Neither, however, is this. This is not the way James sets an example.

And not what Blatt, who is thrashing around a bit in the deep end of his first NBA season as he struggles with basic rotations and player motivation, needs from him, either. Though it has not been hard to miss, James so far seems to be lacking chemistry with his new coach, another of those annoying factors that goes into starting over with a new team.

It must be said James has been preparing for these days and, it can be assumed, he's put thought into how to handle them. He certainly has been talking about his expectations of early struggles for the Cavs for months.

This is what James said in July when he signed:

"It will be a long process, much longer than it was in 2010. My patience will get tested. I know that. I'm going into a situation with a young team and a new coach. I will be the old head."


This is what he said when the Cavs were in the middle of a promising 5-2 preseason, when their offense flowed like water and they widened their lead at the top of the odds-makers' charts:

"You've got to go through something to create a bond; that means for the worse. It has to happen. I know it is going to happen. A lot of guys don't see it, but I see it. That's the only way we're going to be able to grow. You don't define yourself during the good times, you define yourself through the bad times. That's for the players and the coaching staff, as well."

And this was what James said Tuesday with the Cavs sitting at 1-2, the victory thanks to James' heroics and some Chicago Bulls injuries last week:

"It's going to be a long process, man. There's been a lot of losing basketball around here for a few years. ... But there's a lot of bad habits, a lot of bad habits have been built up over the last couple of years, and when you play that style of basketball it takes a lot to get it up out of you. But I'm here to help, and that's what it's about."

On this front, at least, he has been consistent, unlike his defensive efforts in the early going, when at times he has just waved at the ball as it's been driven by him. He may be in great shape but his effort level is far from midseason form.

Nonetheless, he apparently has something up his sleeve. He's working on delivering some sort of message.

His references to breaking bad habits from recent losing seasons seem rather obviously aimed at teammates Kyrie Irving and Dion Waiters, the pair of high draft picks who spent the previous two seasons tugging at the ball.

As James stood passively and watched as the Blazers extended their lead in the second half, Waiters and Irving dribbled and dribbled and shot and shot. They had 19 shots in the second half, James had four. He was scoreless in the second half and put up just two points after the first quarter. To put that in perspective, he hadn't scored two points in three quarters since the 19th game of his career back in December 2003.

"My mission is not a one-game thing," James explained. "We have to do multiple things in order to win. We got to share the ball. We got to play defense. We got to sacrifice in order to ultimately win. And obviously when you're going through the process, it's not the best part of the process, but I'm looking at the end of the tunnel."

The end of the tunnel might be a ways off. When questioned about what he sees as the timeline before the Cavs start playing more like a contender, James offered something both real and metaphoric.

"It could go on for a couple months until we're all on the same page," James said and then compared what he has going through now to when he undertook the rebuilding of a 1972 Chevy Caprice Classic from the wheels up. It took numerous trips to the paint shop before it was James' desired shade of baby blue.

It's not just a "shots for James" vs. a "shots for Irving, Waiters or Kevin Love" issue. Though it should be pointed out that Irving was 3-of-17 Tuesday and then bolted the locker room before offering comment about it in another not-exactly-desirable show of leadership.

The young Cavs have no interest in passing the ball to veterans such as Mike Miller, who has one 3-point attempt in three games, or Shawn Marion, who seems to only get passes from James. And now the team has its first injury as backup guard Matthew Dellavedova tweaked his knee Tuesday and could be out a little while, though the team did not announce his injury.

No matter how it's parsed, the Cavs are going to need a lot better teamwork and a vast amount more effort before a discussion about their long-term goals can truly be had. This is something that James must understand when looking in the mirror as well as when giving sideways glances and speeches in team meetings as he applies his methods for whipping the team into the shape he's looking for.

It's also something Irving, Waiters and even Blatt -- who has seemingly gotten lost in the game at times in his first week doing the real job -- must come to grips with. James is trying to play chess, but the entire team could use a few games of basic checkers, too.

"It's going to be a process. I keep on harping on that word, but it's the truth," James said. "I've been there before and understand it. But you do have to go through it even though you don't like to go through it."
 
If Lebron had to do it over again, I bet he would have kept Bennett and traded Waiters
 
The team is made up sort of poorly. They're deep at some positions, and thin in others...like the back court. They need a more experienced vet point guard to back up Kyrie, and one he can also learn from.

I'm wondering if Lebron called up Ray Allen...to at least get Waiters out of the game during crucial periods. It's funny how they thought he would change up his gunners mentality from the preseason.
 
Man I'm standing by my beliefs that Waiters is the game changer for this team.
I know they have to iron out some bad habits, which could take some games...


But I just checked the ticker and the had 2 assist with 5 mins left in the second and the were down 10!!!

I'm just saying, at least Dion is working on becoming a catch and shoot guy...we know someone is trying
 
Welp....Waiters is out of the starting lineup. Cavs are down 59 to 48 at the half and only have two fucking assists as a team. Utah has 16 assists. :hmm:
 
Welp....Waiters is out of the starting lineup. Cavs are down 59 to 48 at the half and only have two fucking assists as a team. Utah has 16 assists. :hmm:

GM Lebron has spoken

Waiters is in the dog house or they're trying to send a message

Wouldn't be shocked to start hearing trade rumors
 
I honestly think Waiters ain't the problem but a collective of waiters and Irving

Waiters is just the escape goat in all this
 
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