My All Stars Baseball Team!!!

[Shurnuff]

This would be my All Star Baseball Team. You can agree and or disagree or come up with your own All Star Baseball Team.

1st base
Lou Gehrig
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.340 2164 8001 1888 2721 493 1995 102
SLG
.632

(very close call with Eddie Murry)


2nd base
Joe Morgan
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.271 2649 9277 1650 2517 268 1133 689
SLG
.427

(2nd Ryne Sanberg)


3rd baseman
Mike Schmidt
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.267 2404 8352 1506 2234 548 1595 174
SLG
.527

(2nd George Brett)



Shortstop
Ozzie Smith
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.262 2573 9396 1257 2460 28 793 580
SLG
.328

(2nd Erine Banks)



Catcher
Johnny Bench
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.267 2158 7658 1091 2048 389 1376 68
SLG
.476

2nd Carlton Fisk)



Outfielders


Willie Mays
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.302 2992 10881 2062 3283 660 1903 338
SLG
.557

Hank Aaron
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.305 3298 12364 2174 3771 755 2297 240
SLG
.555

Mickey Mantle
AVG G AB R H HR RBI SB
.298 2401 8102 1677 2415 536 1509 153
SLG
.557

(2nd Babe Ruth, Lou Brock, Roberto Clemente, the outfielder were the very hard to pick from it is very loaded with talent)


Starting Left Handed Pitcher
Sandy Koufax
ERA W L PCT G IP SO BB SV
2.76 165 87 .655 397 2325.0 2396 817

(2nd Steve Carlton)



Starting Right Handed Pitcher
Bob Gibson
ERA W L PCT G IP SO BB SV
2.91 251 174 .591 528 3885.0 3117 1336 2

(2nd Tom Seaver)



Relief Pitcher
Lee Smith
G GS Wins Losses ERA GF SV IP
1022 66 71 92 3.03 802 478 1289.3
Hits ER HR BB K WHIP
1133 434 89 486 1251 1.256

(2nd Rollie Fingers)


My All Star Team will win at least 130 to 140 games per year!!!

 

[RunawaySlave]

I would go with DiMaggio over Mantle. Best 2 way CF in Yankee history.
The rest get no argument (maybe Brooks Robinson at 3rd)

 

[Shurnuff]

I would go with DiMaggio over Mantle. Best 2 way CF in Yankee history.
The rest get no argument (maybe Brooks Robinson at 3rd)

Lotta of tough decision to make but I am happy with the choices I made!!!
What are your??!!!??!!!

 

[RunawaySlave]

Mine are about the same. I'd pick Dimaggio instead of Mantle. Joe D played CF better than any Yankee except Bernie Williams and would've easily surpassed Mantle's HR numbers if he were not right handed playing all his home games in the place known as "Death Valley" for right handers (463' to center, 450' to left center alley and over 400' to left field).

I would take Brooks over Schmidt. Mike had power numbers, but nobody played the hot corner like Brooks. The left side of the infield is of utmost iportance to have good defenders, which is the same reason I would select Ozzie Smith over Jeter or anyone else. Offense is not the most important aspect of playing shortstop or third. And I wouldn't pick ANY player on my all time squad who couldn't pick it in the field.

Willie Mays and Hank Aaron are both a given. NOBODY played better than these two men. Including Babe Ruth. I would also choose Frank Robinson over anyone else (including Bonds), but not over Joe D. Lefty and righty starters are a given. There's no discussion against Gibson nor Koufax in any era. For relievers, Lee Smith had greater numbers but never made the playoffs. Goose Gossage and Rollie Fingers were better clutch performers.

Lou Gehrig is a popular choice at 1b because of the incredible offensive numbers, even though he was a lefty in Yankees Staduim (296' short porch in right). There were definitely better defensive 1b, you can make a case for Eddie Murray there, but I wouldn't take Murray he played for the Mets and did not look too good. Too early to tell, but Albert Pulois may be on that list when all is said and done. The Reds picked are pretty indisputable. Johnny Bench is still the best ever behind the plate and little Joe was probably the best 2 way 2nd basemen ever so I got no problem with either

 

[Rezn8]

Mine are about the same. I'd pick Dimaggio instead of Mantle. Joe D played CF better than any Yankee except Bernie Williams and would've easily surpassed Mantle's HR numbers if he were not right handed playing all his home games in the place known as "Death Valley" for right handers (463' to center, 450' to left center alley and over 400' to left field).

I would take Brooks over Schmidt. Mike had power numbers, but nobody played the hot corner like Brooks. The left side of the infield is of utmost iportance to have good defenders, which is the same reason I would select Ozzie Smith over Jeter or anyone else. Offense is not the most important aspect of playing shortstop or third. And I wouldn't pick ANY player on my all time squad who couldn't pick it in the field.

Willie Mays and Hank Aaron are both a given. NOBODY played better than these two men. Including Babe Ruth. I would also choose Frank Robinson over anyone else (including Bonds), but not over Joe D. Lefty and righty starters are a given. There's no discussion against Gibson nor Koufax in any era. For relievers, Lee Smith had greater numbers but never made the playoffs. Goose Gossage and Rollie Fingers were better clutch performers.

Lou Gehrig is a popular choice at 1b because of the incredible offensive numbers, even though he was a lefty in Yankees Staduim (296' short porch in right). There were definitely better defensive 1b, you can make a case for Eddie Murray there, but I wouldn't take Murray he played for the Mets and did not look too good. Too early to tell, but Albert Pulois may be on that list when all is said and done. The Reds picked are pretty indisputable. Johnny Bench is still the best ever behind the plate and little Joe was probably the best 2 way 2nd basemen ever so I got no problem with either

Good breakdown RS. Both of your teams would be great, but in a 7-game series, I'd go...........

Runaway Slave - 4 Games
Shurnuff - 3 Games

 

[Shurnuff]

Mine are about the same. I'd pick Dimaggio instead of Mantle. Joe D played CF better than any Yankee except Bernie Williams and would've easily surpassed Mantle's HR numbers if he were not right handed playing all his home games in the place known as "Death Valley" for right handers (463' to center, 450' to left center alley and over 400' to left field).

I would take Brooks over Schmidt. Mike had power numbers, but nobody played the hot corner like Brooks. The left side of the infield is of utmost iportance to have good defenders, which is the same reason I would select Ozzie Smith over Jeter or anyone else. Offense is not the most important aspect of playing shortstop or third. And I wouldn't pick ANY player on my all time squad who couldn't pick it in the field.

Willie Mays and Hank Aaron are both a given. NOBODY played better than these two men. Including Babe Ruth. I would also choose Frank Robinson over anyone else (including Bonds), but not over Joe D. Lefty and righty starters are a given. There's no discussion against Gibson nor Koufax in any era. For relievers, Lee Smith had greater numbers but never made the playoffs. Goose Gossage and Rollie Fingers were better clutch performers.

Lou Gehrig is a popular choice at 1b because of the incredible offensive numbers, even though he was a lefty in Yankees Staduim (296' short porch in right). There were definitely better defensive 1b, you can make a case for Eddie Murray there, but I wouldn't take Murray he played for the Mets and did not look too good. Too early to tell, but Albert Pulois may be on that list when all is said and done. The Reds picked are pretty indisputable. Johnny Bench is still the best ever behind the plate and little Joe was probably the best 2 way 2nd basemen ever so I got no problem with either

Side note for Joe DiMaggio he spent 3yrs in the service during WW2 1943 - 1945!!!!!

 

[RunawaySlave]

Mariano Rivera might replace all relievers. He is lights out. Lee Smith and Goosage never had the luxury of only having to pitch one inning. Nor did they have set up men. Plenty of 2 and 3 innings saves on their records.

 

[Shurnuff]

Mariano Rivera might replace all relievers. He is lights out. Lee Smith and Goosage never had the luxury of only having to pitch one inning. Nor did they have set up men. Plenty of 2 and 3 innings saves on their records.

The players I picked are all players who have retired from the game and whose numbers and standing are set! No active players or players who just retired within the last 5yrs.
If you have a team to pick.....please no current players! this gives a better debate with the numbers and careers set in stone.

 

[hanginbals]

No Barry??

 

[Shurnuff]

No Barry??

NO!!!! If he was the player that was a triple threat like in his younger years (Power,Speed, and defense)maybe!!
Also he has not been out of baseball long enough!!!
Did he ever officially retired??????

 

[hanginbals]

NO!!!! If he was the player that was a triple threat like in his younger years (Power,Speed, and defense)maybe!!
Also he has not been out of baseball long enough!!!
Did he ever officially retired??????

No!! They made him retire by no teams signing him! Im an American League dude. Barry for DH!!

 

[RunawaySlave]

The players I picked are all players who have retired from the game and whose numbers and standing are set! No active players or players who just retired within the last 5yrs.
If you have a team to pick.....please no current players! this gives a better debate with the numbers and careers set in stone.

no doubt...that's why I didn't pick him. Just making a point

 

[RunawaySlave]

No Barry??

Bonds does not rate above Mays or Aaron on my list. If these two men had
played in the game today with all these "cookie cutter" ball parks, they'd
each have 800 HRs...Maybe a thousand

 

[jdc12]

I'll say the same thing I said when you first put this team together 2 years ago. Outside of your 2b, ss, of, and pitching staff I completely agree with you.

Now unlike before I'll give you my team with my reasons for it. First I'll say straight up that I put more of a premium on great offensive players in certain positions than others so that's why a few positions may not make a whole lot of sense.

C - Johnny Bench

1B - Lou Gehrig

2B - Rogers Hornsby

3B - Mike Schmidt

SS - Honus Wagner

LF - Ted Williams

CF - Willie Mays

RF - Babe Ruth

LHP - Randy Johnson

RHP - Walter Johnson

Closer - Mariano Rivera

2nd base was the only position of the ones I disagreed with that I could be convinced to change. Morgan was much more of a speed person than Hornsby and obviously the MVPs help greatly. I just have a hard time placing a guy who batted over .400 three times on my bench.

Shortstop once again I wanted someone who was more of a threat with the bat. If it were an all-defensive team than no doubt Ozzie is the SS.

Outfield I did by position so Mantle would've been out from the beginning. Even if it were 3 outfielders regardless of position, it would be hard for me to place anyone in the starting lineup.

With pitchers, ERA was essentially invented because of Walter Johnson. Randy Johnson I preferred just because he had a larger body of work over Koufax. Rivera is hands down the best closer of all-time. The postseason ERA under 1 with all those innings and the fact that he's been doing it for 15 years when in this day and age if you're able to get 5 of his average years out of a closer that's a hell of a feat.

 

[RunawaySlave]

I just have a hard time placing a guy who batted over .400 three times on my bench

I believe during his time (for a few years) that walks counted toward your batting average. But using this criteria, then Ty Cobb should bump everybody in the outfield, since he had more hits and scored more runs and stole more bases than anyone

 

[jdc12]

I believe during his time (for a few years) that walks counted toward your batting average. But using this criteria, then Ty Cobb should bump everybody in the outfield, since he had more hits and scored more runs and stole more bases than anyone

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hornsro01.shtml

Hornsby was playing during the time of Gehrig and Ruth so if that were the case then OBP would've been almost the same as BA. Also, if that were true Ruth would've probably had at least 1 .400 season. The only stat that I know for a fact has changed over the course of time is the SB. And that was basically if a player went from 1st to 3rd on a single, they would get credited with a SB. But even then that rule changed in the late 19th-early 20th century.

 

[RunawaySlave]

One other factor that might (slightly) skewer some of the numbers in favor of pre 1948 players....
No black people in the field to rob them of some of those hits. No latinos either
Probably would not make a huge difference, but on this list were the numbers are so lofty it might bring some categories closer together

 

[jdc12]

One other factor that might (slightly) skewer some of the numbers in favor of pre 1948 players....
No black people in the field to rob them of some of those hits. No latinos either
Probably would not make a huge difference, but on this list were the numbers are so lofty it might bring some categories closer together

Playing devil's advocate you could make the same case for anybody who played after 1961 when expansion came into play. Or for any pitcher who played after 1969 when they lowered the mound from 15 to 10 inches. Or for any batter who has the luxury of playing in many of the numerous bandboxes today compared to some of the national parks that existed during some of the older generations. Plus you add the fact that to my knowledge it is the only professional team sport where there is no uniform playing field. There have been a number of events and changes that would skew results to a certain type of player. I could even point out certain players who were helped or hurt by the era but then I'd be getting off topic since none of the players I would mention would have any mention on such a historical list.

 

[RunawaySlave]

I've already mentioned most of that stuff anyway. I was adding an element of PERSONNEL rather that any physical changes to the game.
This really is why I usually don't get into any of these "who's the greatest" debates. Shit don't matter anyway

 

[Shurnuff]

I'll say the same thing I said when you first put this team together 2 years ago. Outside of your 2b, ss, of, and pitching staff I completely agree with you.

Now unlike before I'll give you my team with my reasons for it. First I'll say straight up that I put more of a premium on great offensive players in certain positions than others so that's why a few positions may not make a whole lot of sense.

C - Johnny Bench

1B - Lou Gehrig

2B - Rogers Hornsby

3B - Mike Schmidt

SS - Honus Wagner

LF - Ted Williams

CF - Willie Mays

RF - Babe Ruth

LHP - Randy Johnson

RHP - Walter Johnson

Closer - Mariano Rivera

Please no active players!!!!!

 

[jdc12]

Please no active players!!!!!

Even though numerous writers, former players, and historians alike say that he's the greatest of all time?

If I had to pick someone who wasn't active it would probably be Dennis Eckersley. I'd have to take a look at the stats between him, Goose Gossage, and Rollie Fingers before I came to a conclusion.

 

[Shurnuff]

Even though numerous writers, former players, and historians alike say that he's the greatest of all time?

If I had to pick someone who wasn't active it would probably be Dennis Eckersley. I'd have to take a look at the stats between him, Goose Gossage, and Rollie Fingers before I came to a conclusion.

Like I stated before the retired players careers and numbers are set in stone. Putting in actives players will just be like listing a fantasy baseball team whose career numbers may or may not improve!!!!

 

[Shurnuff]

Bonds does not rate above Mays or Aaron on my list. If these two men had
played in the game today with all these "cookie cutter" ball parks, they'd
each have 800 HRs...Maybe a thousand

So true!!!
Baseball back in the days had ballparks with very, very, deep outfields and plenty of foul territories before the stand and dugouts!!!!

 

[jdc12]

Like I stated before the retired players careers and numbers are set in stone. Putting in actives players will just be like listing a fantasy baseball team whose career numbers may or may not improve!!!!

Didn't see that in the original post. After reading through the thread I came across the post you are referring to with active players. Like I said before if I had to choose someone to replace Rivera it would probably be Eck.

So true!!!
Baseball back in the days had ballparks with very, very, deep outfields and plenty of foul territories before the stand and dugouts!!!!

There were still a few parks that were built for the pull hitter though. Polo Grounds for one I believe was less than 300 down the line and is the reason Mel Ott is in the 500 HR club. Haven't looked at the home/away splits in years but if my memory is correct his splits were in line with some of the Rockies' home/away splits in the 90's.

 

[Shurnuff]

Didn't see that in the original post. After reading through the thread I came across the post you are referring to with active players. Like I said before if I had to choose someone to replace Rivera it would probably be Eck.

There were still a few parks that were built for the pull hitter though. Polo Grounds for one I believe was less than 300 down the line and is the reason Mel Ott is in the 500 HR club. Haven't looked at the home/away splits in years but if my memory is correct his splits were in line with some of the Rockies' home/away splits in the 90's.

Polo Grounds IV

Area of fair territory: 129,000 sq. ft.

Area of foul territory: Humongous



Fences: LF-CF: 16.8 ft to 8.5 ft

CF background: 30.5 ft.

RCF: 12 ft.

RF: 10.64 ft.

Elevation: 55 feet

1957 dimensions:



LF: 280 feet

LCF bullpen: 447 feet

CF: 480 feet

RCF bullpen: 440 feet

RF: 258 feet

Backstop: 74 feet



General Information

Who Played Here: New York Giants (NL) 1911-1957; New York Yankees (AL) 1913-1922; New York Mets (NL) 1962-1963
First opened: June 28, 1911
First night game: May 24, 1940
Last game: September 18, 1963
Capacity: 34,000 (1911); 55,000 (1923)
Demolished: April 10, 1964

Architects: Henry B. Herts and Osborn Engineering (1912)
Owner: New York Giants

483 straight away centerfield!!!

 

[jdc12]

Polo Grounds IV

Area of fair territory: 129,000 sq. ft.

Area of foul territory: Humongous



Fences: LF-CF: 16.8 ft to 8.5 ft

CF background: 30.5 ft.

RCF: 12 ft.

RF: 10.64 ft.

Elevation: 55 feet

1957 dimensions:



LF: 280 feet

LCF bullpen: 447 feet

CF: 480 feet

RCF bullpen: 440 feet

RF: 258 feet

Backstop: 74 feet



General Information

Who Played Here: New York Giants (NL) 1911-1957; New York Yankees (AL) 1913-1922; New York Mets (NL) 1962-1963
First opened: June 28, 1911
First night game: May 24, 1940
Last game: September 18, 1963
Capacity: 34,000 (1911); 55,000 (1923)
Demolished: April 10, 1964

Architects: Henry B. Herts and Osborn Engineering (1912)
Owner: New York Giants

483 straight away centerfield!!!

While it's crazy to imagine a CF being close to 500 ft, the distance down the lines is what gets me. Imagine if a park like that was in play today. Any hitter that the shift would be applied to would hit 50 home runs with that as a home park.

 

[RunawaySlave]

Polo Grounds was amazing. I can't imagine all the HRs that died off the bat of Willie. Down the line were some serious cheap HRs, but the thing about trying to pull the ball down the line is that if you keep doing it on a consistent basis, eventually it will jack up your swing and render you kind of ineffective. You might have 30+ HRs a year, but your average is only going to be in the 230s at best because pitchers (especially back in those days) are gonna bust your HARD inside to jam you then throw something nasty of the outside. The proper way to swing suggests that you hit most of your HRs in the "power" alleys and the pwer alleys of the Polo Grounds were (in the words of Bernie Mac) gi-normous

 

[Shurnuff]

Polo Grounds was amazing. I can't imagine all the HRs that died off the bat of Willie. Down the line were some serious cheap HRs, but the thing about trying to pull the ball down the line is that if you keep doing it on a consistent basis, eventually it will jack up your swing and render you kind of ineffective. You might have 30+ HRs a year, but your average is only going to be in the 230s at best because pitchers (especially back in those days) are gonna bust your HARD inside to jam you then throw something nasty of the outside. The proper way to swing suggests that you hit most of your HRs in the "power" alleys and the pwer alleys of the Polo Grounds were (in the words of Bernie Mac) gi-normous

Back in those days pitchers just threw at your head to back you off the plate!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[jdc12]

Back in those days pitchers just threw at your head to back you off the plate!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not going to lie. I kinda wish they brought that aspect back. Even though I couldn't stand Clemens and Pedro I respected the hell out of them because they would purposely throw at batters the way Gibson and others used to do in the old days.

 

[Shurnuff]

I totally agree with you on this!!!!