He gets an F- and you get a D+. I was a Communications major and minored in English. It wasn't until I was working as a lawyer that I realized that I did not know how to write. Tragic.
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Illiterate College Students
- Thread starter PJN
- Start date
Lol! Wait, what? D+?
You can't fault that man just because English is his second language.
Man, it wasn’t until it got my masters until I got a good idea of how to write. I didn’t know how bad I was until doing my thesis.
So
I understand that you have a new job, and that is fine. But as a part-time associate, your are obligated to have an availability to work at least 1 weekend day. This is what you agreed to upon your hiring, and your recent discussion with Angie. As of now, your current work schedule does not align with your new job. If fulfilling your scheduled weekend obligation is something you absolutely cannot do, then you have to decide what is best for you. We cannot afford to schedule you for weekend shifts and you continuously call off. All part-time associates are required to work a weekend shift, and you are no acception. If you have any more questions, please call and speak with me, as I will be your point of contact regarding this situation. Thank you, and have a good weekend!Congratulations on your new job. The Company is certain that your new employer will be as thrilled with your performance as we are. WhereasThe Company is very proud of you; however, you made certain promises to the Company as part of your employment agreement. The Company agreed to pay xxx, in exchange for ___. One of those conditions was to work at least one (1) weekend day per week. etc. etc.
It would take me 10-15 minutes to properly edit your paragraph. I would also edit my edits while editing your work. Any time that you write something, put it aside for a few minutes so that you can see it with fresh eyes. In the legal community, we make sure that every word is the best word possible for that sentence. Then each sentence is perfect for that paragraph, etc.
In college I mentored a Power 5 D1 athlete from a big time HS in Ohio who could barely read, couldn’t type, and whose plan to compete his paper in English 101 were to get copies of his girlfriend’s stuff, change the name and turn em in. Had to teach the dude about the word plagiarism. After I left, I have no idea how they managed to keep him eligible for 3 more years. 
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I thought this thread said Illinois
This. My MS process made me a way better writer.
I was apart of the last graduating class to have to do regents testing which I passed with no problems but I knew a lot of students who could just not cut it and a lot of them ended up dropping out to get a GED because it was easier.
Regents diploma(there's no more regents....)
Regular diploma
IEP diploma(people with learning disabilities)
So many high schoolers were so use to just being pushed along or barely passing til they got to the 10th grade and just couldn't handle it.
I'm not shocked at all by this,some go to college because it's what you're supposed to do after high school and that's why they have a whole thing set up pre-college courses,basically you're back in high school again.
And what’s even more sad is that there are now features in literally every word processing device that has spelling and grammar check. Cats gotta start having a little bit of pride.
I'm watching this show on Amazon Prime. Back in the 80's PBS gave Milton Friedman a series. It's called Free to Choose. There's an episode about education. The episodes start with a 30 minute video followed by him civilly debating other economists or subject matter experts. Right wingers always post videos on YouTube of him schooling some young college students. This isn't that, he's debating his peers and they're holding their own, making equally compelling points. I will say this about Friedman, he is a man completely convinced that his system is perfect, no doubt in his mind. The debates are like a scientist arguing with Priest about religion. Friedman is good at finding errors in current systems but can't provide proof of success in his hyper-capitalistic system, all theory.
He has a lot of interesting points but I disagree with him on most. One thing Friedman points out is that almost all government programs are designed to take money from the poor and middle-class and use it for the wealthy. Perfect example was state universities subsidize by taxes of the poor and middle-classes for students of the upper-class.
That's old school now. I used to bring students cursive books in Asia.
Shit when I went to college my writing mechanics were awful but hey I could run a football so nobody cared.
Seriously, exactly what in the FUCK am I suppose to do about this type of stuff. 
@playahaitian @sammyjax @Quek9 @largebillsonlyplease @gene cisco @OutlawR.O.C.
Ain't no way in hell she can learn like this.
And another student had her mic unmuted and it sounded like a domestic dispute was happening, so I just muted that shit back.
Like I said before, students comes to school to get away from the shit at home. Now, doing this remote learning all the issues are there.
@playahaitian @sammyjax @Quek9 @largebillsonlyplease @gene cisco @OutlawR.O.C.Ain't no way in hell she can learn like this.
And another student had her mic unmuted and it sounded like a domestic dispute was happening, so I just muted that shit back.
Like I said before, students comes to school to get away from the shit at home. Now, doing this remote learning all the issues are there.
Seriously, exactly what in the FUCK am I suppose to do about this type of stuff.
Ain't no way in hell she can learn like this.
And another student had her mic unmuted and it sounded like a domestic dispute was happening, so I just muted that shit back.
Like I said before, students comes to school to get away from the shit at home. Now, doing this remote learning all the issues are there.
This was something I and honestly a MAJORITY of people REALLY didn't take seriously enough at the start of the pandemic
And while I understand doctors nurses truckers delivery uber drivers etc are INCREDIBLE ESSENTIAL WORKERS
What is happening to these CHILDREN the last few months is going to have GENERATIONAL negative effects
The AVERAGE person doesn't consider how much SCHOOL is a CRITICALLY VITAL part of our life and development
how many children are HOMELESS in foster care in abusive households, sexual assault
HUNGRY and only in EAT in school
their ONLY "positive interactions are in school
and the there is NO REAL solution either
because we see the RAISE of outbreaks and over worded educators etc etc..
I ave no idea what the solution is
but I feel that we are STILL not ADDRESSES those SPECIFIC issues enough.
you doing the best you can bro.
What has happened to us?Seriously, exactly what in the FUCK am I suppose to do about this type of stuff.
Ain't no way in hell she can learn like this.
And another student had her mic unmuted and it sounded like a domestic dispute was happening, so I just muted that shit back.
Like I said before, students comes to school to get away from the shit at home. Now, doing this remote learning all the issues are there.
You're right, man. It's a no-win situation. There is absolutely nothing I can do for her.
People (kids) are going to be messed up educationally behind this pandemic. People are fucked up in the game, fam.
There is no real solution here.
Man, your guess is as good as mine.
Her: "I'm going to wash all the blood off and try and finish my knowledge check."
Me:
Me:
Seriously, exactly what in the FUCK am I suppose to do about this type of stuff.
Ain't no way in hell she can learn like this.
And another student had her mic unmuted and it sounded like a domestic dispute was happening, so I just muted that shit back.
Like I said before, students comes to school to get away from the shit at home. Now, doing this remote learning all the issues are there.
Has child protective services gotten involved?
Also is foster care (preferably with a relative) an option for them?
Is a juvenile petition similar to legal emancipation of a minor?
Has child protective services gotten involved?
Also is foster care (preferably with a relative) an option for them?
Is a juvenile petition similar to legal emancipation of a minor?
Fam, I have no idea. This was just sprung on me at 9 pm.
This situation is obviously very serious. Sounds like her sister is on some other shit.
I don't know how far this goes.
I hear you.
I misinterpreted the original post anf assumed a parent was doing this.
Is there a parent in the home or is the abusive sibling also the legal guardian?
This original post didn't state who it was. She mentioned who in a previous response.
I don't know yet. I'm trying to get more info out of her, but she hasn't returned to class.
If it's like she describes, I don't see how this is going to be good for her in the long run. She said "frequently."
I knew something was up when she unmuted her mic. A lot of yelling was going on.
Damn that's rough, I hope she's alright and it works out for her.
I've learned working in the social work field that this shit is far more common than we're aware.
As far as you I my best advice is to do whatever you can but don't take this on yourself since you're ultimately limited in what you can do to help or control in these situations.
Not doing so can tend to eat away at you if you're not careful.
Appreciate that advice, fam.
I pretty much do that now. So many students bring their problems to me and all I can really do is listen.
I try not to dwell on it much. I'm a teacher, not a superhero.
Solving for x isn't going to stop a sibling from trying to kill another.
My sister is in the social work field, so I may run that by her and see what's good. But I have a feeling of what she is going to tell me.
No doubt, good luck to you and the young lady.
Hopefully your sister has some advice which may be more helpful.
Money money money. Push em through. Change the requirements. Give them 20 chances to do the same test. I have 4 kids in school and I hate how these teachers just put everything on a plate for them. Tests they get 3 or 4 chances. It just does not push the kids at all to try harder cause the kids know they gonna pass regardless. Damn teachers told my kid that a D was passing so it’s ok. Me and wifey got all in they ass and told em C is only ok but we want B and better. It is just a different time man.
Damn. That shit will affect generations.Seriously, exactly what in the FUCK am I suppose to do about this type of stuff.
Ain't no way in hell she can learn like this.
And another student had her mic unmuted and it sounded like a domestic dispute was happening, so I just muted that shit back.
Like I said before, students comes to school to get away from the shit at home. Now, doing this remote learning all the issues are there.
Not really about illiterate college students but more about my point of why are we telling everyone they should go to college to get a good job.
SCARBOROUGH, Maine — Putting on hazmat gear for the first time turns out to be a drawn-out process, so the trainees who are practicing this new skill make the time go faster with a little clowning around.
“Smile! Work it! Work it!” one shouts at a classmate as she jokingly strikes glamour poses for photos in a heavy vapor suit with rubber boots, two layers of gloves, a respirator and a 26-pound breathing tank. Another compares the get-up to the uniforms worn by the child-detection agents in the movie “Monsters, Inc.”
Spread out in a parking lot beside a fire station, these congenial 20- and 30-somethings are enrolled in a community college program to become firefighters.
Four of the five in this group have something else in common: They previously earned bachelor’s degrees, even though they’ve now returned to school to prepare for a job that doesn’t require one.
“I was part of that generation that was told to go to college, so that’s what I did,” Michael Kelly said with a shrug. “That’s what we were supposed to do.”
But after getting a bachelor’s degree in political science — for which he’s still paying off his student loans — Kelly realized that what he actually wanted to do was become a firefighter. After all, he said, unlike a politician, no one is ever angry to see a firefighter show up.
“I spent a lot of money to end up doing . . . this,” said Kelly, who is now 28, as his colleagues stowed the equipment before they filed back into a classroom.
A lot of other people also have invested time and money getting four-year degrees only to return for career and technical education in fields ranging from firefighting to automation to nursing, in which jobs are relatively plentiful and salaries and benefits comparatively good, but which require faster and far less costly certificates and associate degrees.
One in 12 students now at community colleges — or more than 940,000 — previously earned a bachelor’s degree, according to the American Association of Community Colleges. And even as college and university enrollment overall declines, some career and technical education programs are reporting growth, and anticipating more of it.
“I thought I was the only one following this road, but apparently a lot of people are,” said Noor Al-Hamdani, 26, who is getting an associate degree in nursing at Fresno City College, a community college, after having already earned a bachelor’s degree in public health from California State University at Fresno.
In some cases, bachelor’s degree-holders are obtaining supplementary skills — computer science majors adding certificates in cloud technology, for example.
But the trend is also exposing how many high school graduates almost reflexively go to college without entirely knowing why, pushed by parents and counselors, only to be disappointed with the way things turn out — and then having to start over.
“Somewhere along the line it became ingrained that in order to succeed, whether your children wanted to go to college or not, they had to go to college,” said Jane Oates, who was assistant secretary in the Obama administration’s Labor Department and now heads WorkingNation, a nonprofit that tries to better match workers with jobs.
When they do start on the route to bachelor’s degrees, a third of students change their majors at least once and more than half take longer than four years to graduate, according to the National Center for Education Statistics. Some of the rest drop out.
Even among those who manage to finish, more than 40 percent of recent graduates aged 22 to 27 are underemployed, meaning that they’re working in jobs that don’t require their degree, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York reports.
That makes four-year universities and colleges “a really expensive career exploration program,” quipped Amy Loyd, vice president at the education and employment policy organization Jobs for the Future.
Shana Tinkle, who has a bachelor's degree from Brown University, is also studying fire science in Maine. (Molly Haley for The Hechinger Report)
When Shana Tinkle was finishing high school, it was more or less “a rite of passage” to go on and get a bachelor’s degree, she said — in her case, in creative writing from Brown University.
“‘You’re supposed to do this. You’ll get a job later,’ ” Tinkle, now 32, remembered being told. “It wasn’t a particularly career-oriented approach.”
Now she’s also here at Southern Maine Community College with the tentative goal of becoming a wildland firefighter, an occupation she points out is in extremely high demand.
Advocates for career and technical education say that, for many people, it makes more sense to start with those kinds of programs, reserving the option of continuing on to more time-consuming and expensive bachelor’s degrees later, instead of vice versa.
“They’re doing college backwards,” said Dave DesRochers, a former offensive tackle for the Seattle Seahawks and now vice president of PATH2, which helps students figure out what they want to do with their lives — before they finish high school — and choose their educations accordingly.
AD
Chris Drumm went to the University of Massachusetts at Amherst and earned a bachelor’s degree in business administration. He worked in hospitality for a while, then as a paralegal, and now is in the firefighter training course at SMCC. “I wish I knew about this program when I was coming out of high school,” said Drumm, now 25.
Drumm’s fellow trainee Matt Duhaime attended the prestigious Boston Latin School, from which almost everyone in his class went on to four-year colleges and universities. Duhaime chose Plymouth State University in New Hampshire, largely because “I knew I wanted to get better at snowboarding,” he said.
What he didn’t know was what to do with the bachelor’s degree in marketing he ended up with. So Duhaime worked at restaurants until, now 27, he has also found himself in the firefighter training program.
AD
“Coming out of high school there’s social pressure on you: ‘Where are you going to college?’ ” he said. “But the hardest thing is making such a finite decision about what you want to do at 18 years old.”
The push to help students make more informed career decisions while they’re still in high school is coinciding with frustration over the high cost of college and increased awareness of the potential for jobs at good pay in the skilled trades.
In Virginia, Colorado and Texas, where earnings are tracked, students with certain technically oriented credentials short of bachelor’s degrees earn an average of from $2,000 to $11,000 a year more than bachelor’s degree-holders, the American Institutes for Research reports.
An analysis by the Georgetown University Center on Education and the Workforce found first-year nurses with associate degrees making $80,200 a year and up and first-year electrical and power transmission installers, who also need associate degrees, $80,400 — more than some graduates with not just bachelor’s, but master’s degrees.
AD
Graduates with bachelor’s degrees still generally make more than people with lesser credentials — about $19,000 a year more than associate degree recipients when they’re at the peak of their respective careers, according to the Hamilton Project.
Completing career and technical education is almost always faster and less expensive than studying toward a bachelor’s degree, however, and trainees can earn while they learn. That’s the case for several of these future firefighters, who are already working in fire stations and getting paid to go on calls.
All of this is helping to change perceptions of long-disparaged career and technical — previously called vocational — education.
Maine’s community colleges report that the number of people signing on to short-term job training quadrupled over the last two years. El Paso Community College in Texas is expanding those kinds of programs; its president, William Serrata — who chairs the American Association of Community Colleges — told education journalists in September that his counterparts are also preparing for an increase in demand.
AD
Tinkle, the aspiring wildlands firefighter with the Brown degree, said people often react to her story by expressing envy for her less conventional route to a job.
“A lot of people I’ve met have said to me, ‘I wish I’d done what you were doing when I was your age,’ ” she said. “And I tell them: ‘Well, you should have.’ ”
SCARBOROUGH, Maine — Putting on hazmat gear for the first time turns out to be a drawn-out process, so the trainees who are practicing this new skill make the time go faster with a little clowning around.
“Smile! Work it! Work it!” one shouts at a classmate as she jokingly strikes glamour poses for photos in a heavy vapor suit with rubber boots, two layers of gloves, a respirator and a 26-pound breathing tank. Another compares the get-up to the uniforms worn by the child-detection agents in the movie “Monsters, Inc.”
Spread out in a parking lot beside a fire station, these congenial 20- and 30-somethings are enrolled in a community college program to become firefighters.
Four of the five in this group have something else in common: They previously earned bachelor’s degrees, even though they’ve now returned to school to prepare for a job that doesn’t require one.
“I was part of that generation that was told to go to college, so that’s what I did,” Michael Kelly said with a shrug. “That’s what we were supposed to do.”
But after getting a bachelor’s degree in political science — for which he’s still paying off his student loans — Kelly realized that what he actually wanted to do was become a firefighter. After all, he said, unlike a politician, no one is ever angry to see a firefighter show up.
“I spent a lot of money to end up doing . . . this,” said Kelly, who is now 28, as his colleagues stowed the equipment before they filed back into a classroom.
A lot of other people also have invested time and money getting four-year degrees only to return for career and technical education in fields ranging from firefighting to automation to nursing, in which jobs are relatively plentiful and salaries and benefits comparatively good, but which require faster and far less costly certificates and associate degrees.
One in 12 students now at community colleges — or more than 940,000 — previously earned a bachelor’s degree, according to the American Association of Community Colleges. And even as college and university enrollment overall declines, some career and technical education programs are reporting growth, and anticipating more of it.
“I thought I was the only one following this road, but apparently a lot of people are,” said Noor Al-Hamdani, 26, who is getting an associate degree in nursing at Fresno City College, a community college, after having already earned a bachelor’s degree in public health from California State University at Fresno.
In some cases, bachelor’s degree-holders are obtaining supplementary skills — computer science majors adding certificates in cloud technology, for example.
But the trend is also exposing how many high school graduates almost reflexively go to college without entirely knowing why, pushed by parents and counselors, only to be disappointed with the way things turn out — and then having to start over.
“Somewhere along the line it became ingrained that in order to succeed, whether your children wanted to go to college or not, they had to go to college,” said Jane Oates, who was assistant secretary in the Obama administration’s Labor Department and now heads WorkingNation, a nonprofit that tries to better match workers with jobs.
When they do start on the route to bachelor’s degrees, a third of students change their majors at least once and more than half take longer than four years to graduate, according to the National Center for Education Statistics. Some of the rest drop out.
Even among those who manage to finish, more than 40 percent of recent graduates aged 22 to 27 are underemployed, meaning that they’re working in jobs that don’t require their degree, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York reports.
That makes four-year universities and colleges “a really expensive career exploration program,” quipped Amy Loyd, vice president at the education and employment policy organization Jobs for the Future.
Shana Tinkle, who has a bachelor's degree from Brown University, is also studying fire science in Maine. (Molly Haley for The Hechinger Report)
When Shana Tinkle was finishing high school, it was more or less “a rite of passage” to go on and get a bachelor’s degree, she said — in her case, in creative writing from Brown University.
“‘You’re supposed to do this. You’ll get a job later,’ ” Tinkle, now 32, remembered being told. “It wasn’t a particularly career-oriented approach.”
Now she’s also here at Southern Maine Community College with the tentative goal of becoming a wildland firefighter, an occupation she points out is in extremely high demand.
Advocates for career and technical education say that, for many people, it makes more sense to start with those kinds of programs, reserving the option of continuing on to more time-consuming and expensive bachelor’s degrees later, instead of vice versa.
“They’re doing college backwards,” said Dave DesRochers, a former offensive tackle for the Seattle Seahawks and now vice president of PATH2, which helps students figure out what they want to do with their lives — before they finish high school — and choose their educations accordingly.
AD
Chris Drumm went to the University of Massachusetts at Amherst and earned a bachelor’s degree in business administration. He worked in hospitality for a while, then as a paralegal, and now is in the firefighter training course at SMCC. “I wish I knew about this program when I was coming out of high school,” said Drumm, now 25.
Drumm’s fellow trainee Matt Duhaime attended the prestigious Boston Latin School, from which almost everyone in his class went on to four-year colleges and universities. Duhaime chose Plymouth State University in New Hampshire, largely because “I knew I wanted to get better at snowboarding,” he said.
What he didn’t know was what to do with the bachelor’s degree in marketing he ended up with. So Duhaime worked at restaurants until, now 27, he has also found himself in the firefighter training program.
AD
“Coming out of high school there’s social pressure on you: ‘Where are you going to college?’ ” he said. “But the hardest thing is making such a finite decision about what you want to do at 18 years old.”
The push to help students make more informed career decisions while they’re still in high school is coinciding with frustration over the high cost of college and increased awareness of the potential for jobs at good pay in the skilled trades.
In Virginia, Colorado and Texas, where earnings are tracked, students with certain technically oriented credentials short of bachelor’s degrees earn an average of from $2,000 to $11,000 a year more than bachelor’s degree-holders, the American Institutes for Research reports.
An analysis by the Georgetown University Center on Education and the Workforce found first-year nurses with associate degrees making $80,200 a year and up and first-year electrical and power transmission installers, who also need associate degrees, $80,400 — more than some graduates with not just bachelor’s, but master’s degrees.
AD
Graduates with bachelor’s degrees still generally make more than people with lesser credentials — about $19,000 a year more than associate degree recipients when they’re at the peak of their respective careers, according to the Hamilton Project.
Completing career and technical education is almost always faster and less expensive than studying toward a bachelor’s degree, however, and trainees can earn while they learn. That’s the case for several of these future firefighters, who are already working in fire stations and getting paid to go on calls.
All of this is helping to change perceptions of long-disparaged career and technical — previously called vocational — education.
Maine’s community colleges report that the number of people signing on to short-term job training quadrupled over the last two years. El Paso Community College in Texas is expanding those kinds of programs; its president, William Serrata — who chairs the American Association of Community Colleges — told education journalists in September that his counterparts are also preparing for an increase in demand.
AD
Tinkle, the aspiring wildlands firefighter with the Brown degree, said people often react to her story by expressing envy for her less conventional route to a job.
“A lot of people I’ve met have said to me, ‘I wish I’d done what you were doing when I was your age,’ ” she said. “And I tell them: ‘Well, you should have.’ ”
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