Cops shoot and kill black man Alton Sterling at point blank range in Baton Rouge

[Spectrum]

According to who? .

I'll be honest with you. I'm not even reading the rest of your response beyond this first point. Go help yourself out and do some research on all those involved in forming and spearheading BLM. Then do a search for their bios. Then look at their ages. Then come back to me and tell me this isn't a youth-led movement. If you aren't willing to accept basic facts, I'm not even willing to continue on with this. That would just be willful ignorance at this point.

The arguments about "who" from the entire black liberation movement should be covered is a different argument altogether.

However, you're not even willing to accept the basic facts that BLM is driving the narrative and the leadership is youth-driven.. thus, why the people you've mentioned are going to be excluded from panel, talks, interviews, etc when that's the hot topic of the movement.

Notice that I've not even disagreed with you that others should be included and other reasons why they wouldn't be regardless (narrative), but you're not accepting the basic facts of the matter. The argument about legitimacy is a subjective thing. They people I know who have been interviewed are real about this and sacrificing their own personal safety for the cause. Sam, Neta, Deray, etc are serious about this.

The "influencers" have changed, man. It's the people with the active social media accounts who also get more coverage in the MSM. The youth have an advantage. They're the ones streaming events live that is bringing attention to all this stuff. It's just the way of the world right now.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

I'll be honest with you. I'm not even reading the rest of your response beyond this first point.

Yea I think I'll do the same and not read the rest of your post. Hopefully BLM will bring something tangible to the black community. But I doubt it.

 

[Spectrum]

Now THAT makes sense. Being well spoken and providing sound bites is cool but I like to see tangle results. You gotta get your hands dirty, and I don't mean "going to jail".

You're only seeing the sound bites and not seeing these people arranging bail money for protestors.... arranging lawyers for protesters.... raising money for families, meeting with legislators to uproot bad laws/policy, doing community building, etc. These people just aren't sitting around waiting to be interviewed. As a matter of fact, they turn down 90% of the media requests they get because they're doing the work.

 

[Spectrum]

Yea I think I'll do the same and not read the rest of your post. Hopefully BLM will bring something tangible to the black community. But I doubt it.

Will? They already have You're not paying attention.

 

[sammyjax]

Will? They already have You're not paying attention.

Weird ass argument yall are having

 

[Tha Great Muta]

Will? They already have You're not paying attention.

I get it. They're your friends that the media ALLOWS to be on their platform. This is the same platform that was quick to put up the picture of an innocent man putting his life in danger and not saying sorry. The same platform that employs Don Lemon Meringue pie. The same platform that refered Micah Xavier Johnson as "Micah X". But yea those are your friends so we aren't allowed to question them. Good Luck to em.

 

[Spectrum]

But yea those are your friends so we aren't allowed to question them. Good Luck to em.

Your argument is a bit silly. I made a post in this very thread saying I questioned their motives until I actually had a chance to meet them, talking to them, and see them work on issues. You don't even know the name of any of their platforms. You're working from ignorance. So in that sense, I can understand why you have an issue with it. It's similar to the issues a lot of whites have with them. I don't care about anyone criticizing anyone. I was wondering why they were being criticized. As of now, no one here as posted one substantial reason. Your reason is "They're getting the tv time so I'm suspicious". That's about as fallacious as an argument as you can get if you don't attach anything else to it. Bomani Jones has multiple shows. Charles M. Blow is always on TV. Are they "suspicious" because they're on tv? That's silly. If you're going to be critical of people working for us, at least have a legitimate reason or evidence of their misdoing.

 

[playahaitian]

http://theadvocate.com/news/1631198...tal-shooting-of-suspect-on-north-foster-drive

 

[playahaitian]

http://www.theblaze.com/tv2/

 

[Tha Great Muta]

Your argument is a bit silly. I made a post in this very thread saying I questioned their motives until I actually had a chance to meet them, talking to them, and see them work on issues. You don't even know the name of any of their platforms. You're working from ignorance. So in that sense, I can understand why you have an issue with it. It's similar to the issues a lot of whites have with them. I don't care about anyone criticizing anyone. I was wondering why they were being criticized. As of now, no one here as posted one substantial reason. Your reason is "They're getting the tv time so I'm suspicious". That's about as fallacious as an argument as you can get if you don't attach anything else to it. Bomani Jones has multiple shows. Charles M. Blow is always on TV. Are they "suspicious" because they're on tv? That's silly. If you're going to be critical of people working for us, at least have a legitimate reason or evidence of their misdoing.

I like how you quoted a very small portion of my entire post. First off what's more ignorant, the fact that you can't put their "campaigns" into some cliffnotes or the fact that I read up on campaign zero and came to my own conclusion that it's trying to fix a law system that is built to be against you.

I may be wrong but you never heard of Jews trying to tell Gustapo enforcers trying to tweak their laws.

And the issue a lot of whites have with them is the fact that they have black in their name. Plus it gives them an outlet to throw all black.people under one umbrella. Just like that Cac Joe Walsh or how thing is the new code word for ni***r.

And as far as Bomani, he is a conscience brother but his career is a sports analysis not a activist. His podcast is where he speaks what he really wants.

 

[Spectrum]

I like how you quoted a very small portion of my entire post. First off what's more ignorant, .

I'm using the literal definition of ignorance. You've already admitted that you don't know who makes up the BLM movement nor are you aware of any of the platforms they've created to address problems in our community. That's literal ignorance. If you're suspicious about something, you should try to learn more. You're just being lazy. You could have found out about things like Campaign Zero with a simple google search. I hope it's not willful ignorance, though.

 

[Spectrum]

And as far as Bomani, he is a conscience brother but his career is a sports analysis not a activist. .

Bomani is an activist. As a matter of fact, it runs in his family. His mother and father are professors and activists. You know you can be more than one thing, right?

 

[Spectrum]

you can't put their "campaigns" into some cliffnotes or the fact that I read up on campaign zero and came to my own conclusion that it's trying to fix a law system that is built to be against you.

.

Don't confuse "can't" and "won't". If you want to know about something, do the work. That's what Google is for. You can read it and draw your own conclusions. But it's problematic that you didn't know about it until the last 24 hours.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

I'm using the literal definition of ignorance. You've already admitted that you don't know who makes up the BLM movement nor are you aware of any of the platforms they've created to address problems in our community. That's literal ignorance. If you're suspicious about something, you should try to learn more. You're just being lazy. You could have found out about things like Campaign Zero with a simple google search. I hope it's not willful ignorance, though.

I specifically said I was not impressed with Campaign Zero, the ONLY platform you seem to want to mention. Collecting and proposing a policy system to a system that is meant to kill or incarcerate you is pointless. I understand they are your friends or whatever but I'm not gonna go back and forth with you if your drinking their kool-aid. I was one of many that was burned believing in the Barack Obama hype so I'm not too trusting to anyone who thinks they can change the system from within.

Bottom line we need some economics goin on so we can BUY our own police,politician etc. The revolution will not be televised. Period

 

[Tha Great Muta]

Bomani is an activist. As a matter of fact, it runs in his family. His mother and father are professors and activists. You know you can be more than one thing, right?

But he employed by ESPN as sports analysis, he's the best they have in my opinion but there is a reason he doesn't have his own show, they don't want him to say too much on their platform but let Stephen A shit on black people every morning. And what the fuck does his parents being professors have to do with then being "activist"?

 

[Spectrum]

I specifically said I was not impressed with Campaign Zero, the ONLY platform you seem to want to mention.

You said name one. You keep making assumptions. Again, do the work if you want to know more. And you made the statement implying they weren't doing anything. Now, your argument is that you don't agree with what they're doing.

Collecting and proposing a policy system to a system that is meant to kill or incarcerate you is pointless.

So getting people released from jail is pointless? Ok, let's ask the people they got released what they think about that.

I understand they are your friends or whatever

That organization is 1000s of contributors. I don't know all of them. I don't even know .01 percent of them. They ones I met have great intentions. It's really easy for people to sit back and armchair critique people out there doing the work.

but I'm not gonna go back and forth with you if your drinking their kool-aid. I was one of many that was burned believing in the Barack Obama hype

That's your fault. Don't go projecting your shit on me.

so I'm not too trusting to anyone who thinks they can change the system from within.

Doesn't matter if you trust them or not or if I do or not. When I see them getting black faces out of jail cells, trust is meaningless. Anyone who gets a black person who is unjustly sitting in a jail cell out with their direct action is on my team. Period.

 

[Spectrum]

But he employed by ESPN as sports analysis, he's the best they have in my opinion but there is a reason he doesn't have his own show, they don't want him to say too much on their platform but let Stephen A shit on black people every morning. And what the fuck does his parents being professors have to do with then being "activist"?

BSPN is an entertainment network. Clowns like Skip and SAS are entertaining people. No one watches them for the sports analysis.

You keep saying "he's employed as an analysis as that determines whether or not he can be an activist. Do you have any idea what percentage of activist do and have had other full time fucking jobs? How do you think these people survive day to day? On donations?

This is silly. It's like you have a very banal understanding of how this operates.

 

[Spectrum]

Bottom line we need some economics goin on so we can BUY our own police,politician etc.

This is a mutually exclusive argument. Some people focus on different aspects of the struggle. People who focus on police brutality argue that you need to be alive to do anything else so they are focusing on stopping institutional murdering of black people by police.

The idea that activism has to be monolithic is absurdly myopic.

There are people tackling that as well. The entire black liberation movement can walk and chew gum at the same time.

Telling someone to ignore one problem as the expense of another is living telling someone to not be an advocate for AIDS research because people are doing from cancer.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

Don't confuse "can't" and "won't". If you want to know about something, do the work. That's what Google is for. You can read it and draw your own conclusions. But it's problematic that you didn't know about it until the last 24 hours.

And I didn't know about it because IMO it's exactly what I thought. And I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but a waste of time.

Check this out from the front page of the site:
"We can live in a world where the police don't kill people by limiting police "

From the start, they aren't being honest about the situation. People don't kill people THEY KILL BLACK PEOPLE!!!!

 

[Tha Great Muta]

This is a mutually exclusive argument. Some people focus on different aspects of the struggle. People who focus on police brutality argue that you need to be alive to do anything else so they are focusing on stopping institutional murdering of black people by police.

The idea that activism has to be monolithic is absurdly myopic.

There are people tackling that as well. The entire black liberation movement can walk and chew gum at the same time.

Telling someone to ignore one problem as the expense of another is living telling someone to not be an advocate for AIDS research because people are doing from cancer.



Our struggle is not as complicated as you want to it to be.

For what I highlighed above let me put it like this in my opinion.

We have a population that's dying of both AIDS and Cancer but we are arguing about which we should be researching before we have any money to begin with.

If black people had an economic base it would solve alot of our problems

Giving suggestions/ a proposal for a bully to stop taking your lunch money/ beating your ass is pointless.

 

[Spectrum]

..

Tell that to the families of people who have been murdered. Tell that to the people who have been jailed.

Again, you can do both simultaneously. It's silly to complain about people solving a specific and serious problem because it's not the one you want to have addressed. There are people addressing every aspect of these problems. You don't have to ignore the problem of police brutality to address economic problems.

Your argument is essentially BLM is not addressing the problem that's most important to me. That's subjective. To some people, stop black death is the most pertinent issue.

I actually argue about economics being most significant way making an impact. However, I'm not going to tell someone not to solve a problem that IS important, that they're passionate about, and they're skilled enough to address.

But MLK and Mandela were also focused on criminal justice and civil liberties first before turning to economic ones. I think that's because they're on the front lines. People on the front lines are confronted with the issues in a much different way that others reading articles are writing on tv. When a cop is shooting you, beating your ass, unjustly locking you up, you're not thinking about economics past the financial ability to post bail and get a lawyer.

 

[Maxxam]

@Spectrum, I'm gonna let y'all finish, but can you explain why the title reads Alton Brown and not Alton Sterling?

Did I miss something?

 

[Spectrum]

@Spectrum, I'm gonna let y'all finish, but can you explain why the title reads Alton Brown and not Alton Sterling?

Did I miss something?

I'll change it. I think I submitted this shortly after it went down and people didn't have the correct name at that point.

I'm blind as fuck too, because I straight up didn't notice that.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

Tell that to the families of people who have been murdered. Tell that to the people who have been jailed.

Again, you can do both simultaneously. It's silly to complain about people solving a specific and serious problem because it's not the one you want to have addressed. There are people addressing every aspect of these problems. You don't have to ignore the problem of police brutality to address economic problems.

Maybe I'm just not making myself clear.
Let me break it down

To the families that loss a loved one to the police.We as a people need to rally around them and Use (MONEY) to support them. Start a gofund me page so that they can make it for atleast the next two years, pay for funeral services, hire lawyers using (MONEY) to sue the city/police department. Zimmerman got 250K for his lynch memorabilia, The families of Alton Sterling and Philando Castile should have about a million dollars each to get justice.

The men that have been jailed. Are you talking about protesters or the brothers in lockdown for years. Either way you have to use (MONEY) to buy politicians to cut out the bullshit laws that are made to imprison us or use (MONEY) to bail out protesters, which you say they do apparently.

This shit is a system. Police brutality will only stop when you.start fucking with.these.people (MONEY).

 

[Spectrum]

Maybe I'm just not making myself clear.
Let me break it down

To the families that loss a loved one to the police.We as a people need to rally around them and Use (MONEY) to support them. ).

These are mutually exclusive arguments.

You do realize that BLM does that right? How do you think the 100s of the people who were jailed in Baton Rouge got out. They were heavily involved in mobilizing a crowdfunding campaign that has raised about 300k to getting people bailed out of prison. One member put together a campaign that raised over 100k for one of the victims.

They're doing these things. You're just not hearing about it.

But people can both specialize in police brutality and also address economics

 

[Spectrum]

. Police brutality will only stop when you.start fucking with.these.people (MONEY).

I don't think people in BLM would disagree with that. But those are long-term efforts. In the moment, immediate attention can also be given to preventing more police shootings, making sure people are aware that these shooting are happening, supporting victims (and their families) of police brutality, putting pressure on police departments, etc. There is nothing to gain by ignoring that and solely addressing the economics side of the issue.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

These are mutually exclusive arguments.

You do realize that BLM does that right? How do you think the 100s of the people who were jailed in Baton Rouge got out. They were heavily involved in mobilizing a crowdfunding campaign that has raised about 300k to getting people bailed out of prison. One member put together a campaign that raised over 100k for one of the victims.

They're doing these things. You're just not hearing about it.

But people can both specialize in police brutality and also address economics

Your not reading my entire post :

"either way you have to use (MONEY) to buy politicians to cutout the bullshit laws that are made to imprison us or use (MONEY) to bail out protesters, which you say they do apparently."

I don't know about the 100s of people going to jail in Baton Rouge but let me ask you YOUR opinion on this. How can we combat police brutality without an economic base or arming ourselves.

 

[Spectrum]

I don't know about the 100s of people going to jail in Baton Rouge but let me ask you YOUR opinion on this. How can we combat police brutality without an economic base or arming ourselves.

I honestly don't think one way is best. When you roll back to the 60s. They were efforts by MLK that worked. They were efforts by The Black Panthers that worked. They were efforts by the Nation of Islam that worked.

You have to chip away at this shit with every possible mechanism. There is no one solution to this shit. That's why I won't criticize people who are fighting the good battle.

I do know that all the various leaders or organizations arguing about who is doing it right or asking for a monolithic approach isn't helping anyone.

One of the most striking things i've noticed is when you read literature by leaders of liberation movements (when they're older) is that they learned to appreciate all the various approaches that everyone took and realized it took the collective efforts to make progress.

There has neven been one way to win wars like this.

I actually don't think economics is the only way. You can have economic power and still have insignificant influence.

I think the Jews have it mastered. Since the holocaust, they've made it a point to have both economic might and media control. Hitler didn't take over economics. He took over through propaganda.

So you might be surprised that you are I are probably in agreement about a lot.. I just think if a portion of the movement is passionate about police brutality and they're bringing attention to the problem, saving lives, getting people out of jail, and pushing narrative..let them do it. This shit wasn't front and center until BLM made is a national issue through their protests after ferguson.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

I honestly don't think one way is best. When you roll back to the 60s. They were efforts by MLK that worked. They were efforts by The Black Panthers that worked. They were efforts by the Nation of Islam that worked.

You have to chip away at this shit with every possible mechanism. There is no one solution to this shit. That's why I won't criticize people who are fighting the good battle.

I do know that all the various leaders or organizations arguing about who is doing it right or asking for a monolithic approach isn't helping anyone.

One of the most striking things i've noticed is when you read literature by leaders of liberation movements (when they're older) is that they learned to appreciate all the various approaches that everyone took and realized it took the collective efforts to make progress.

There has neven been one way to win wars like this.

I actually don't think economics is the only way. You can have economic power and still have insignificant influence.

I think the Jews have it mastered. Since the holocaust, they've made it a point to have both economic might and media control. Hitler didn't take over economics. He took over through propaganda.

So you might be surprised that you are I are probably in agreement about a lot.. I just think if a portion of the movement is passionate about police brutality and they're bringing attention to the problem, saving lives, getting people out of jail, and pushing narrative..let them do it. This shit wasn't front and center until BLM made is a national issue through their protests after ferguson.

What shit exactly? I agree with what most of what you said but wasn't front and center?

 

[Spectrum]

What shit exactly? I agree with what most of what you said but wasn't front and center?

We knew how bad police brutality was, but the shit wasn't a national topic again until Ferguson and the BLM protests started. Police brutality hasn't been a national topic since Rodney King.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

We knew how bad police brutality was, but the shit wasn't a national topic again until Ferguson and the BLM protests started. Police brutality hasn't been a national topic since Rodney King.

Black people have always been talking about the how fucked up the system is. Not just because it's in the national spotlight. I live in Cincinnati and the Timothy Thomas was a really big deal here as well as Everette Howard, Jr. Shit been fucked up and gonna be fucked up as long as we march and not put some money behind our actions.

Fuck the national spotlight. Because the majority of this country hates us.

 

[Spectrum]

Black people have always been talking about the how fucked up the system is.

Surely, you realize it doesn't matter if only we (and it's not ALL of us) are talking about the shit. You're not that clueless right? Why do you think guys like MLK, Mandela, etc did the things they did? Mainstream visibility matter. That's obvious and a basic pillar of resistance.

 

[Spectrum]

Shit been fucked up and gonna be fucked up as long as we march and not put some money behind our actions..

You do know these organization also put together economic boycotts as well and use their visibility to get the word out?

Also, just in case you didn't know, many BLMs organizers have economic agendas like: http://agendatobuildblackfutures.org/

You don't know because you're not looking. But you're also complaining about people getting airtime which gives them more visibility and influence to put the spotlight on other issues.

I keep telling you that the current focus is on police brutality because they're driving the topic, but they're also working on other issues.

 

[Tha Great Muta]

Surely, you realize it doesn't matter if only we (and it's not ALL of us) are talking about the shit. You're not that clueless right? Why do you think guys like MLK, Mandela, etc did the things they did? Mainstream visibility matter. That's obvious and a basic pillar of resistance.

People like to use MLK are propped up because he talks the non violent apporach, and Mandela is a rider but let's be honest ...South Africa is fuck up for black people BIG TIME.

Being on a nation spotlight will just do something that will undermine our cause...letting the left hand know what the right hand is doing.

But like I said before, the revolution will NOT be televised. Mainstream media clearly has it out to depict us in a negative light.

 

[Spectrum]

But like I said before, the revolution will NOT be televised. Mainstream media clearly has it out to depict us in a negative light.

The revolution is going to be streamed.