BGOL review .. BATMAN V SUPERMAN... (thoughts, summary, spoilers)

[Kubrick]

Bruce only wakes up 1x time only. (Just Once.)
The director doesn’t do anything to make the audience ‘question’ anything.

The Speed Force is capable of crossing not only time & space, but extra-dimensional travel as well.

This is not ‘general knowledge’. And it was not shown/explained onscreen.
It was a ‘nod’ strictly directed at hardcore DC comic nerds:

The Speed Force serves as the primary measure of velocity in the DC Universe.
It is usually referred to in terms of different barriers:

- The Sound Barrier
- Light barrier
- Time Barrier
- Dimensional Barrier
- and finally the Speed Force Barrier.

As Bruce was dreaming about the Desert, bat-men with wings & whatnot.... the Flash uses the Speed Force to enter Bruce’s dream-like state. (in WHATEVER sub-conscious ‘dimension’ his brain activity was operating in, while sleeping)

So yeah, he interrupts Bruce’s dream... WHILE HE IS STILL SLEEPING.

That WHOLE speech when the Flash is telling him: “Lois is the Key, You were right, yada, yada”… NONE of that portion of the scene is controlled by Bruce. At all. (And Bruce is NOT fully Awake Yet.)

That was ALL done by the Flash.
Those are HIS powers at work, showing the way he can manipulate the Speed Force.

It is not Bruce having a 'premonition'.
It is not Bruce having 'psychic powers'.
And it is not a DREAM.

When the Flash FINISHES that Speech... is when Bruce wakes up.
THAT WHOLE EVENT... IS WHAT WAKES HIM UP.

At best it would probably leave Bruce with a sensation of ‘Deja-Vu’… (even though its only the first time he was experiencing it.)

It’s more of an ‘easter egg’ for Flash fans to show WHERE they will take his storyline.

Bruce had ONE single dream... that got invaded by someone else. Get it?

Basically, DC is telling the audience: 'The Flash is soooo damn fast.... this nigga can run up on you... in YO' DREAMS"

I was with you on some of the other explanations, but Fonzerilli is right, that scene/sequence was sloppy and unnecessary. Bruce Wayne snapped out of the dream and was at his desk, next thing you know Flash is there, says his line, then Bruce snaps out of that dream/vision. The shit was so sloppy a few people in the theater started laughing.

Now cut that scene out of the movie, besides cutting down the run time, would the film have lost anything?

 

[fonzerrillii]

Bruce only wakes up 1x time only. (Just Once.)

The director doesn’t do anything to make the audience ‘question’ anything.

I'm not the only one on this thread or a critic of this movie.... That has pointed out that Bruce woke up twice. That is a pretty obvious thing to notice. I wouldn't have had a WTF was that moment if they didn't show him waking up again after Flash.

As Bruce was dreaming about the Desert, bat-men with wings & whatnot.... the Flash uses the Speed Force to enter Bruce’s dream-like state. (in WHATEVER sub-conscious ‘dimension’ his brain activity was operating in, while sleeping)

So yeah, he interrupts Bruce’s dream... WHILE HE IS STILL SLEEPING.

That WHOLE speech when the Flash is telling him: “Lois is the Key, You were right, yada, yada”… NONE of that portion of the scene is controlled by Bruce. At all. (And Bruce is NOT fully Awake Yet.)

When the Flash FINISHES that Speech... is when Bruce wakes up.
THAT WHOLE EVENT... IS WHAT WAKES HIM UP.

Basically, DC is telling the audience: 'The Flash is soooo damn fast.... this nigga can run up on you... in YO' DREAMS"

If this is true then they made Flash the most powerful person in all of DC that he is able to not only pin point exactly where someone is in time, but also go inside Nigga's dreams like Freddy fucking Kruger. He would be unstoppable.

But wouldn't it be a hell of lot easier to just GO BACK IN TIME and actually tell him.... then just have it appear as Dream.

 

[grownazzblakman]

Here is the thing I get your point. As a fan of DC I figured out these questions because I know the story.....

But a movie has to sit on its own. You can't have a movie with all this random in it. Say I just walked into this movie without any previous knowledge of these characters, can you tell me where this film explains these plot holes? You can't... You have to rely on what you know going into it? And that is fail for me. This was supposed to be a semi-sequel to Man of Steel and this world is still completely different world from other movies interpretation of these characters. A movie is a failure if you have to research outside shit to fill in the blanks.

A long time ago Sam Rami created this amazing movie called Darkman... It was his own creation. He built the world and included character motivations.
What if he just began the movie with Peyton Westlake dressed up as Darkman fucking killing people seeking revenge, but the movie never explains why is Darkman's face fucked up? .. Why is it covered in bandages? How does he know how to make this mask? Why is it able to be shaped into other faces? Why can't he feel pain? Who does he want to kill? There isn't an outside reference about this character. There isn't a comic book or press interviews to explain motivations. In that movie all of these unexplained scenarios would be unacceptable plot holes if left unexplained. Luckily... Sam answered all of these questions. Now don't get it twisted, Darkman isn't an Oscar worthy movie but it did its job and treated it's world with respect by using small touches to fill in gaps in logic.

Say batman v superman was about two brand new DC characters... For example the versions of Batman and Superman from Justice League Gods and Monsters and it contained all these Plot holes... That movie would have been declared a failure. That movies characters were completedly different and there wasn't any previous history with them.. So you had to go into the movie with the faith that it would open its world up to you. And when a movie does that.. It works.

As a fan of DC and especially Superman, I hate that it is obvious that they don't know what to do with him. All of the modern versions... Superman returns, man of steel, and this movie.... Treats him as a plot device and not a living breathing person and he deserves better then this. His death was a complete waste here and had zero impact because in this universe you had a good chunk of the world hating him either because he was an alien, caused massive destruction, or was a false god. So when he died I'm sure that most of those people were like good riddance.....

Well as fans we know he is coming back.. So then what. Now it looks like this dude just faked his death, now I hate him more.
Owe and lets just ignore the fact that Clark Kent is dead forever. Superman can come back, but Clark Kent is done. People saw him in a open actual casket.
So what's the point of a Man of Steel 2. The daily planet can't be used again. You can't show Clark using his brains as an investigator. Now you will just have this blunt object that has a weakness to kryptonite. You can't have him be full superman the entire movie. This shit works in the comics but it can't in a movie and that's where DC failed it's fans.
You can tell that there were two many cooks in the kitchen on this and no one sat back and said... You know what, we don't have to shoot all our wade on this. Let's tease some things and focus on character development.

Dark man is a poor analogy.

Because he is a character that was completely UNKNOWN. So if you make a movie about him... you HAVE to 'fill in the blanks' about every little detail. Cuz mofos don't wtf he is about. At all.

But Superman and Batman have been around for 75+ years. Longer than the X-men & Avengers.

There's enough 'source material' in PRINT alone to fill a whole encyclopedia. Not to mention all the cartoons, tv shows, video games and other movies.

What you want is more 'backstory'. On everything. (But it's already out there ) And there's simply not enough time in a 2.5 hour movie to 'fill in the blanks' without slowing down the whole movie to tell 'origin stories' again.

DC would have to turn this 'Dawn of Justice' movie into a 'Game of Thrones' type of HBO SERIES to fit in all the 'small details' to bring you up to speed & satisfy all your questions.

 

[grownazzblakman]

If this is true then they made Flash the most powerful person in all of DC that he is able to not only pin point exactly where someone is in time, but also go inside Nigga's dreams like Freddy fucking Kruger. He would be unstoppable.

But wouldn't it be a hell of lot easier to just GO BACK IN TIME and actually tell him.... then just have it appear as Dream.

The Flash already IS... LITERALLY... one of the MOST powerful people in DC Comics. Where you been?

 

[KATDADDY]

Here my thing with this flick..

1. Wanye runs towards smoke as the buliding tumbles . then emerge with a crisp suit with lil dust...and not coughing and gagging due to the toxic air

When 911 happen i was out there i was coverd with white dust and could barley see infront of me and breath..

Next up louise lane have magic powers to be everywhere and when superman fly across with the spear. She just so happen to be there to watch him end life of doomsday.. Just when batman was bout to kill superman she was there in time .

Lex was boring like someone said came off as the riddler

 

[grownazzblakman]

Here my thing with this flick..

1. Wanye runs towards smoke as the buliding tumbles . then emerge with a crisp suit with lil dust...and not coughing and gagging due to the toxic air

When 911 happen i was out there i was coverd with white dust and could barley see infront of me and breath..

Next up louise lane have magic powers to be everywhere and when superman fly across with the spear. She just so happen to be there to watch him end life of doomsday.. Just when batman was bout to kill superman she was there in time .

Lex was boring like someone said came off as the riddler

Right after the building fell and Bruce saved the little girl, they immediately cut to a different scene (it said onscreen "18 months later") when the teens found the Kryptonite in the ocean.

He did not reappear from the rubble & ashes with a crisp new suit.

But I do agree about Lois being everywhere. They need to cut that stuff out in the next film.

 

[SamSneed]

I'd like to see y'all come up with a better movie.

 

[spider705]

I'd like to see y'all come up with a better movie.

You just mad because the Zod you wanted in the movie didn't make an appearance...

 

[ansatsusha_gouki]

They should of kept Doomsday out of the movie.He served no purpose at all

 

[Amajorfucup]

To begin with, this movie was almost completely fan service. This is the comic movie that comic fans have been clamoring for; namely a movie that is directed more towards them than the general public. Most of the "plot holes" alluded to in earlier posts were Easter Egg incidents for comic fans. They were AHA moments.

The acting in this movie was very strong across the board. My only gripe is Eisenberg. He played an excellent villain, I'm just not sure he played a good Lex Luthor. Also the apropos comparison to this movie is not any marvel movie or even most other Dc movies. It's Watchmen. Watchmen was an intense interpretation of a complex graphic novel. Graphic novels are at their most basic, Adult comic books, so there is an attempt to ground them in reality that you don't necessarily see in the average comic book, or comic book movie. This attempt means that there will be major things that either work or do not work in a graphic novel to movie translation. Watchmen was very polarizing for this reason, and those of us that like it, mostly appreciate the fact that it was an accurate representation of the graphic novel.

BVS is very ambitious in that it adopts and strings together not one, but three graphic novels. These are the Dark Night Returns, Death of Superman, and Injustice: Gods among Us. Aside from the necessary changes to make these stories work in the same movie (for example Lex Luthor being the one that initiated the creation of Doomsday as opposed to an Alien Scientist named Bertron), this movie was resoundingly faithful to the source materials.

Why does Lois know Superman's identity? Because by the time he fights Doomsday, they are already in a full fledged relationship that is on the verge of becoming a marriage. It adds gravitas to his death, and allows us another conduit of personal grief, aside from Martha Kent. Where was Batman (not Bruce Wayne) during Zod's invasion? Retired for up to ten years and completely disenchanted with the world around him. Why? Because of the Death of Jason Todd (the second Robin) at the hands of the Joker (reason for the graffiti laden suit in the the batcave). Why does Batman come out of retirement? Because of meta-human activity (in the novel "mutants", in the movie Superman) that he feels is threatening society's existence.

Why does Superman threaten Batman and why does Batman kill? These are related questions. TDKR Batman is a very different Batman. Grizzled, immeasurably scarred emotionally, and completely unforgiving of the criminal element of society. He kills now ... a lot. He's so brutal that the government dispatches Superman to put him down, which is the reason they fight in the novel. In the movie, it was a product of Lex's manipulation, but Superman initially threatens Batman for the same reason as in the comics. Namely, he doesn't approve of his methods.

Why so many dream sequences for Batman? Because he is a crazy, tortured soul. He's the good kind of crazy, if there is one, but he's crazy nonetheless. He has no peace and lives a life of almost total physical, emotional, and mental anguish.

What's with the dream sequence where Batman was fighting Superman' s elite soldiers and the Flash shows up from the future? It's a glimpse of the future in either this reality or an alternate timeline where Superman has become an evil all powerful dictator due to either the death of Lois, the manipulation of Darkseid, or a combination of both. (Injustice: Gods Among Us storyline) Key revelations of this fact in these scenes? The omega symbol in the sand (Darkseid's signal) and the parademon sentries (Darkseid's flying bug like soldiers) in the dream sequence.

I could go on and on, but the point is that I enjoyed this movie and it made perfect sense to me. By the same token, I can clearly see how a casual fan might be turned off by what they view as "plot holes". The characterization and the action is supposed to be what brings casual fans to this movie, and I get that it might fall short in this regard. This is why as a movie I give it a solid 7, but as an adaptation it's easily a 9.

Also in terms of Marvel there is one possible comparison. Both DC and Marvel have chosen to adapt some of their more serious story arcs, this year. Some of these arcs have harrowing consequences and events. While I fully expect Civil War to be the superior movie (Winter Soldier is my favorite comic book movie), DC has thrown down the proverbial gauntlet in terms of sticking to the story during difficult moments (i.e. Superman's death). I was so sure when I saw Doomsday in the trailer, that they would omit Superman's death from this arc, but I was pleasantly surprised that they did not. Let's see if Marvel has the cojones to follow suit.

Excellent take.

Just breezed through that awful cam version and now I'm mad. Can't believe they used my favorite Superman book in this movie. That had sequel potential.

That was their biggest mistake imo. Stuffing way too much into this one flick. Should have saved Doomsday for stand alone. But im guessing Supermans death was needed to build the JL movie going forward.

They should of kept Doomsday out of the movie.He served no purpose at all

Agreed. But as i said above... It will be used to springboard the next installment(s).

 

[grownazzblakman]

They should of kept Doomsday out of the movie.He served no purpose at all

Doomsday was Lex's insurance policy... His plan B... In case Superman or Batman failed to destroy each other.

Plus, DC needed a 'big bad' enemy to justify Batman, Superman & Wonder Woman fighting side-by-side. (Because this version of Lex alone isn't enough)

A BIGGER mistake than actually 'putting Doomsday in the movie'... was 'putting him in the trailers'.

Just my opinion.

 

[LordSinister]

Why not reanimate Zod into Bizarro? That would have been better.

 

[TimRock]

Because, being an irrational human, she probably thought if it almost killed Superman, it might kill this thing that can fight Superman toe to toe.

Why do people keep trying to explain this? It made no sense whatsoever. It doesn't matter what they wanted us to think or anyone's opinion of it, it was dumb. Speaking of the spear.....

Batman and Superman are fighting. Superman carriers batman thru various buildings and parts of it, but somehow, they happen to land right where batman planted the spear (or in the vicinity of it)?
This movie was OK for people that don't read comics, but for those that do, the writing was horrible.

 

[grownazzblakman]

To begin with, this movie was almost completely fan service. This is the comic movie that comic fans have been clamoring for; namely a movie that is directed more towards them than the general public. Most of the "plot holes" alluded to in earlier posts were Easter Egg incidents for comic fans. They were AHA moments.

The acting in this movie was very strong across the board. My only gripe is Eisenberg. He played an excellent villain, I'm just not sure he played a good Lex Luthor. Also the apropos comparison to this movie is not any marvel movie or even most other Dc movies. It's Watchmen. Watchmen was an intense interpretation of a complex graphic novel. Graphic novels are at their most basic, Adult comic books, so there is an attempt to ground them in reality that you don't necessarily see in the average comic book, or comic book movie. This attempt means that there will be major things that either work or do not work in a graphic novel to movie translation. Watchmen was very polarizing for this reason, and those of us that like it, mostly appreciate the fact that it was an accurate representation of the graphic novel.

BVS is very ambitious in that it adopts and strings together not one, but three graphic novels. These are the Dark Night Returns, Death of Superman, and Injustice: Gods among Us. Aside from the necessary changes to make these stories work in the same movie (for example Lex Luthor being the one that initiated the creation of Doomsday as opposed to an Alien Scientist named Bertron), this movie was resoundingly faithful to the source materials.

Why does Lois know Superman's identity? Because by the time he fights Doomsday, they are already in a full fledged relationship that is on the verge of becoming a marriage. It adds gravitas to his death, and allows us another conduit of personal grief, aside from Martha Kent. Where was Batman (not Bruce Wayne) during Zod's invasion? Retired for up to ten years and completely disenchanted with the world around him. Why? Because of the Death of Jason Todd (the second Robin) at the hands of the Joker (reason for the graffiti laden suit in the the batcave). Why does Batman come out of retirement? Because of meta-human activity (in the novel "mutants", in the movie Superman) that he feels is threatening society's existence.

Why does Superman threaten Batman and why does Batman kill? These are related questions. TDKR Batman is a very different Batman. Grizzled, immeasurably scarred emotionally, and completely unforgiving of the criminal element of society. He kills now ... a lot. He's so brutal that the government dispatches Superman to put him down, which is the reason they fight in the novel. In the movie, it was a product of Lex's manipulation, but Superman initially threatens Batman for the same reason as in the comics. Namely, he doesn't approve of his methods.

Why so many dream sequences for Batman? Because he is a crazy, tortured soul. He's the good kind of crazy, if there is one, but he's crazy nonetheless. He has no peace and lives a life of almost total physical, emotional, and mental anguish.

What's with the dream sequence where Batman was fighting Superman' s elite soldiers and the Flash shows up from the future? It's a glimpse of the future in either this reality or an alternate timeline where Superman has become an evil all powerful dictator due to either the death of Lois, the manipulation of Darkseid, or a combination of both. (Injustice: Gods Among Us storyline) Key revelations of this fact in these scenes? The omega symbol in the sand (Darkseid's signal) and the parademon sentries (Darkseid's flying bug like soldiers) in the dream sequence.

I could go on and on, but the point is that I enjoyed this movie and it made perfect sense to me. By the same token, I can clearly see how a casual fan might be turned off by what they view as "plot holes". The characterization and the action is supposed to be what brings casual fans to this movie, and I get that it might fall short in this regard. This is why as a movie I give it a solid 7, but as an adaptation it's easily a 9.

Also in terms of Marvel there is one possible comparison. Both DC and Marvel have chosen to adapt some of their more serious story arcs, this year. Some of these arcs have harrowing consequences and events. While I fully expect Civil War to be the superior movie (Winter Soldier is my favorite comic book movie), DC has thrown down the proverbial gauntlet in terms of sticking to the story during difficult moments (i.e. Superman's death). I was so sure when I saw Doomsday in the trailer, that they would omit Superman's death from this arc, but I was pleasantly surprised that they did not. Let's see if Marvel has the cojones to follow suit.

^^^ 5-Star analysis. Well done, sir.

 

[spider705]

Movie was good, not great.

As others have pointed out, some plot holes aren't holes but just nods to those with better knowledge of the comics. To the casual moviegoer that will be a bit confusing.

There were times i turned to my brother like WTF IS THIS SHIT and he'd just point to his phone where he'd wrote in the notepad app I'LL EXPLAIN AFTER THE MOVIE. I'm not a comic head but i know people that are so they filled in those "holes" for me and made me just as excited for the next installments as they are.

My biggest thing with the movie was the timing of events and how it was presented. If i had gone to see this without them or with a date i would have HATED this movie. There simply is too much either going on behind the scenes that we're just to assume happened or you had to have read the comics to know what was happening or being referenced.

And yes, Bruce Wayne woke up twice in that scene...

 

[fonzerrillii]

Dark man is a poor analogy.

Because he is a character that was completely UNKNOWN. So if you make a movie about him... you HAVE to 'fill in the blanks' about every little detail. Cuz mofos don't wtf he is about. At all.

But Superman and Batman have been around for 75+ years. Longer than the X-men & Avengers.

There's enough 'source material' in PRINT alone to fill a whole encyclopedia. Not to mention all the cartoons, tv shows, video games and other movies.

What you want is more 'backstory'. On everything. (But it's already out there ) And there's simply not enough time in a 2.5 hour movie to 'fill in the blanks' without slowing down the whole movie to tell 'origin stories' again.

DC would have to turn this 'Dawn of Justice' movie into a 'Game of Thrones' type of HBO SERIES to fit in all the 'small details' to bring you up to speed & satisfy all your questions.

You are still completely missing my point on this. If you need source material to understand a stand alone movie.. the MOVIE fucking Fails. Stop defending this shit. Are you hearing yourself man... You are actually saying that it is Ok for a writer to be lazy, for a movie to have logic gaps, for it to be filled with leaps of disbelief, to let the crowd fill in the blanks. If this is the type of shit that makes you happy then good continue to pay for your shit. If this is what you want DC to continue to sell to you then great.... cause based on your approach Green Lantern was a 5 star film and it didn't make a lick of sense. Zero fucking sense and it was filled with the Exact same bullshit that this movie was selling.. Oh here is Sinestro.. We aren't going to tell you shit about him though. Come back for the sequel. That movie was rushed.. this movie was rushed. That movie has horrible dialogue. This movie had horrible dialogue. The only way that I could respect the shit that you are pulling here would be if you also said that you liked Green Lantern. Because if you do, then I can understand. I would get it.

 

[TimRock]

they need to stop with the damsel in distress routine. Its fucking annoying. Stop centering these movies around loving relationships.
It ruined Thor, Spiderman, Iron Man 2 and 3, and now this. Tell these hoes to just stay out the way and stay out of their business. They add nothing to the story but more chaos. Cause when they get found out, its the same routine, villain kidnaps her. Captain America movies, first Iron Man, Ant Man, Avengers, these were all good/great and didnt involve any lovey dovey shit. If it did, they saved it for the end of the movie and didnt make it a focal point.

 

[fonzerrillii]

Why do people keep trying to explain this? It made no sense whatsoever. It doesn't matter what they wanted us to think of anyone's opinion of it, it was dumb. Showing off that spear..

Batman and Superman are fighting. Superman carriers batman thru various buildings and parts of it, but somehow, they happen to land right where batman planted the spear (or in the vicinity of it)?
This movie was OK for people that don't read comics, but for those that do, the writing was horrible.

Thank you.... This is what is killing me. I just don't get how people are defending this movie. You can't say oh there were some plot holes, it was too long, there was some pacing issues, Lex fucking Sucked, lois was boring... Hmmm... 5 out of 5.

 

[fonzerrillii]

Movie was good, not great.

As others have pointed out, some plot holes aren't holes but just nods to those with better knowledge of the comics. To the casual moviegoer that will be a bit confusing.

There were times i turned to my brother like WTF IS THIS SHIT and he'd just point to his phone where he'd wrote in the notepad app I'LL EXPLAIN AFTER THE MOVIE. I'm not a comic head but i know people that are so they filled in those "holes" for me and made me just as excited for the next installments as they are.

My biggest thing with the movie was the timing of events and how it was presented. If i had gone to see this without them or with a date i would have HATED this movie. There simply is too much either going on behind the scenes that we're just to assume happened or you had to have read the comics to know what was happening or being referenced.

And yes, Bruce Wayne woke up twice in that scene...

That's my problem with this film and that where I think it is going to have it's biggest issues... You have to know what is happening to understand ALL of the shit that is happening. I went in knowing what was happening and I still left confused about alot of shit. A movie can not be treated as a comicbook, especially when this was your big tentpole world building movie.

 

[TimRock]

and then people are saying "this will be explained in later movies". really, so i have to wait three years from now, and then i have to sit thru this shit again to remember what i need to look for in the next movie? Thats why end of credit scenes have become so popular. Its at the end and its quick. It sticks with you. Did we have to go back and rewatch Hulk, Iron Man, Thor to know what the end of credits scenes meant? No. You mean to tell me that when they finally get to the justice league movie, because thats probably when we will see the Flash from the future again (my god, they showed us two versions of flash in one movie, for what?), that we now have to remember that specific scene where he came to Bruce in a dream? Yall are making too many excuses for this movie. It was ok, and probably the best thing DC has done in a while, which is not saying much, but all the speculating you have to do is ridiculous.

You have to team up with a comic reader to see this shit.

 

[grownazzblakman]

You are still completely missing my point on this. If you need source material to understand a stand alone movie.. the MOVIE fucking Fails. Stop defending this shit. Are you hearing yourself man... You are actually saying that it is Ok for a writer to be lazy, for a movie to have logic gaps, for it to be filled with leaps of disbelief, to let the crowd fill in the blanks. If this is the type of shit that makes you happy then good continue to pay for your shit. If this is what you want DC to continue to sell to you then great.... cause based on your approach Green Lantern was a 5 star film and it didn't make a lick of sense. Zero fucking sense and it was filled with the Exact same bullshit that this movie was selling.. Oh here is Sinestro.. We aren't going to tell you shit about him though. Come back for the sequel. That movie was rushed.. this movie was rushed. That movie has horrible dialogue. This movie had horrible dialogue. The only way that I could respect the shit that you are pulling here would be if you also said that you liked Green Lantern. Because if you do, then I can understand. I would get it.

First of all, stop making assumptions on what other people think are good movies, or bad ones.

Second if all, You continually bring up Green Lantern, SuckerPunch, Darkman and a bunch of other bullshit movies to defend your positions about Batman vs Superman.

Not me. I haven't talked about any other film in this discussion.

Thirdly, I've understood your point from the very beginning. I just disagree with it because this movie is a continuation of MoS... And a set-up for the next few movies from DC, including Wonder Woman, Justice League, Aquaman and solo Batman films.

The movie accomplished that.

So it doesn't need to 'Stand in its own' as if it should 'live in a vacuum' devoid of any inter-connected story arcs... where the 'casual movie goer' should pay their $20 for a single ticket and get every last 'newbie' question answered about the DC pantheon of heroes.

It was never meant to be that.
That's what YOU want it to be.

You think it should be one way... But it's the other.

The movie caters MORE toward the DC comic fans who know a bit more about these heroes, and don't just walk into the movie theater like its the very first superhero movie they ever saw in their life... And the first time they ever learned something about characters that been around for more than half a century.

You want a casual movie. A frolicking joyride.

A movie where if you knew 'zero' walking in.... you walk out feeling like you are 'all caught up' on the latest superhero events from the DCEU.

Stop bitching.

The movie wasn't meant to be any of that.
Deal with it.

 

[playahaitian]

​

 

[playahaitian]

BATMAN V SUPERMAN’S 3 BIGGEST WTF MOMENTS EXPLAINED
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Unpacking some of the more head-scratching Easter Eggs that are setting up the DC Extended Universe.SCOTT COLLURA Whether you loved or hated or were “eh” aboutBatman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, I think we can all agree that the film is chockfull of Easter eggs that set up a larger DC movie universe (officially called the DC Extended Universe). We’ll have a full report on the most noteworthy Easter eggs soon, but for now let’s take a look at some of the crazier and most WTF moments that even diehard comics fans might be trying to figure out.

Obviously, major spoilers follow for Batman v Superman…

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice - Review
04:24








Bruce Wayne's Vision of the Future


When Ben Affleck’s Bruce Wayne takes a catnap at his computer in the Batcave, he has a couple of intense dreams -- or perhaps visions is a more accurate way to describe them. (This sequence has also been referred to as a “Knightmare,” at least on the toy and merchandising side of BvS.) First up, he finds himself in a hellish, post-apocalyptic landscape where a giant Omega symbol has been burned into the ground. This is the coat-and-goggles version of Batman glimpsed in the trailers for the film. He’s overrun by Nazi-like Stormtroopers (bearing Superman’s “S” symbol on their arms) and what certainly appear to be Parademons -- the flying, alien foot soldiers who serve the cosmic villain from the comics known as Darkseid. Yes, aside from representing Bruce’s fear of Superman taking over the world, this sequence also hints at that character, who is sort of like the Thanos of the DC Universe. Director Zack Snyder certainly seems to be setting up Darkseid, who is one of the New Gods, as the big bad of the upcoming Justice League movies, or the DCEU as a whole.



Attack of the Parademons!

There are several other Darkseid references in the film: The Omega sign is the character’s symbol; the alien tech used to help rebuild Cyborg (more on him down below) looks like it could be a Mother Box (a device commonly used by Darkseid and his people); and at the end of BvS, Lex Luthor refers to “he” having now noticed Earth after the battle with Doomsday ("The bell has been rung," he says). Was Lex’s scheme at the center of Batman v Superman all a bid to get Darkseid to conquer our planet? Who can say right now, but for more on Darkseid, watch our Comics History video below:

Comics History 101: Darkseid
05:12



The Flash Visits Bruce Wayne


Immediately following this Knightmare (or perhaps it’s just another part of the vision/dream/whatever), Bruce awakens in the Batcave to find what seems to be Ezra Miller’s version of the Flash appearing to him in a continuous blast of light and sound. He’s yelling at Bruce, and while much of it is hard to hear or understand, it seems that the Flash has either briefly travelled through time here to warn Batman about something, or he’s visiting from another dimension or another Earth -- as Flashes are wont to do. (That bright vortex thingee he’s arrived via is likely either the speed force, the cosmic treadmill, or a boom tube, which is also Darkseid/New Gods tech.) Miller’s costume in this scene seems more futuristic or battle-ready than the traditional Flash suit, and even has a helmet of some kind with a faceplate that opens and closes. As for what he’s saying, it’s something along the lines of Lois Lane being “the key” and how Bruce has always been “right about him.” Then the Flash disappears again in a flash (ahem) of light. Again, it’s not entirely clear who the “him” is that he’s referring to, but that’s why it’s an Easter egg! For more on this out-there moment, watch our Keepin' It Reel BvS discussion below (scrub to 20.40 for the Flash talk):

IGN Keepin' It Reel, Episode 319: Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Spoilercast
33:56



Time to Make a Cyborg!


That video footage that Batman steals from Lex about the metahumans he’s discovered out in the world features some familiar faces for even casual comics observers (Wonder Woman, the Flash again, and Aquaman), but then there’s also that poor guy who’s hanging up on that board with half his body missing. That would be Cyborg (played by newcomer Ray Fisher).

Cyborg has become a pretty important player in DC Comics in recent years, and is now considered a founding member of the Justice League (sorry Martian Manhunter!). Fisher will play the character in the soon-to-be shooting Justice League movie, but Cyborg has also long been associated with the team of young heroes known as the Teen Titans -- and has been a fixture on both of the popular animated series based on that group.

We’re seeing a key part of his origin in this scene in Batman v Superman, as his S.T.A.R. Labs scientist dad (Joe Morton, a.k.a. Miles Dyson, Terminator 2's creator of Skynet) works to save his son after the boy’s been in a deadly accident. For more on the character, watch Cyborg in a Minute right here:

Cyborg in a Minute
01:28

Of course, there are plenty more Easter eggs, references, and cool things to dissect in Batman v Superman, so be sure to check back very soon for our full investigation into those…

 

[raze]

A couple questions:

How does Superman shake off the effects of INHALING KRYPTONITE (TWICE)!! Why is Kryptonite more dangerous externally than internally?

Why is Lex smart enough to figure out Superman's secret identity but Batman isn't? The World's Greatest Detective wasn't able to acquire ANY intel on Superman for the past 18 months? At the very least, he didn't notice Superman kept saving Lois over and over? Obviously, the reason he doesn't figure it out is so we can have that "Martha" moment, which is also the only reason we have the scene of Thomas and MARTHA Wayne being killed in the beginning, establish her name to the audience.

What does Wonder Woman want with a photograph that's over a hundred years old? It doesn't prove anything. If Lex had found her lasso, bracelets, or the coordinates to Themyscira, it would made more sense. The movie could having incorporated superhero cameos into the story: a red blur saves a bunch of kids trapped on a burning bus, an anonymous hacker helps Batman decrypt Lexcorp's files, someone plugs a hole in damaged oil tanker...)

Where the hell was Clark going when he meets Pa Kent? Was that supposed to be a dream or flashback?

 

[TimRock]

The movie caters MORE toward the DC comic fans who know a bit more about these heroes, and don't just walk into the movie theater like its the very first superhero movie they ever saw in their life... And the first time they ever learned something about characters that been around for more than half a century.

so just fuck all the people that dont read comics? DC doesnt want their money?
and if that was their MO, why the fuck are they still telling us how Bruces parents die? Oh, i know why, because in the past, they never showed the pearls getting caught on the gun. Got it now. Pure genius move. Bullfucking shit. If you want to introduce new characters, you explain it to the audience, regardless of who is watching the movie. You want people that dont read comics, to become interested. You want to make them want to see the next installment. I.E. Marvel. How many people actually read Iron Man comics before seeing the movie? He was not the most popular marvel hero. Same with Ant Man. Throwing random shit in a movie and saying "come back in three years for an explanation" is horrible and lazy.

 

[TimRock]

BATMAN V SUPERMAN’S 3 BIGGEST WTF MOMENTS EXPLAINED
Share.
Unpacking some of the more head-scratching Easter Eggs that are setting up the DC Extended Universe.SCOTT COLLURA Whether you loved or hated or were “eh” aboutBatman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, I think we can all agree that the film is chockfull of Easter eggs that set up a larger DC movie universe (officially called the DC Extended Universe). We’ll have a full report on the most noteworthy Easter eggs soon, but for now let’s take a look at some of the crazier and most WTF moments that even diehard comics fans might be trying to figure out.

Obviously, major spoilers follow for Batman v Superman…

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice - Review
04:24








Bruce Wayne's Vision of the Future


When Ben Affleck’s Bruce Wayne takes a catnap at his computer in the Batcave, he has a couple of intense dreams -- or perhaps visions is a more accurate way to describe them. (This sequence has also been referred to as a “Knightmare,” at least on the toy and merchandising side of BvS.) First up, he finds himself in a hellish, post-apocalyptic landscape where a giant Omega symbol has been burned into the ground. This is the coat-and-goggles version of Batman glimpsed in the trailers for the film. He’s overrun by Nazi-like Stormtroopers (bearing Superman’s “S” symbol on their arms) and what certainly appear to be Parademons -- the flying, alien foot soldiers who serve the cosmic villain from the comics known as Darkseid. Yes, aside from representing Bruce’s fear of Superman taking over the world, this sequence also hints at that character, who is sort of like the Thanos of the DC Universe. Director Zack Snyder certainly seems to be setting up Darkseid, who is one of the New Gods, as the big bad of the upcoming Justice League movies, or the DCEU as a whole.



Attack of the Parademons!

There are several other Darkseid references in the film: The Omega sign is the character’s symbol; the alien tech used to help rebuild Cyborg (more on him down below) looks like it could be a Mother Box (a device commonly used by Darkseid and his people); and at the end of BvS, Lex Luthor refers to “he” having now noticed Earth after the battle with Doomsday ("The bell has been rung," he says). Was Lex’s scheme at the center of Batman v Superman all a bid to get Darkseid to conquer our planet? Who can say right now, but for more on Darkseid, watch our Comics History video below:

Comics History 101: Darkseid
05:12



The Flash Visits Bruce Wayne


Immediately following this Knightmare (or perhaps it’s just another part of the vision/dream/whatever), Bruce awakens in the Batcave to find what seems to be Ezra Miller’s version of the Flash appearing to him in a continuous blast of light and sound. He’s yelling at Bruce, and while much of it is hard to hear or understand, it seems that the Flash has either briefly travelled through time here to warn Batman about something, or he’s visiting from another dimension or another Earth -- as Flashes are wont to do. (That bright vortex thingee he’s arrived via is likely either the speed force, the cosmic treadmill, or a boom tube, which is also Darkseid/New Gods tech.) Miller’s costume in this scene seems more futuristic or battle-ready than the traditional Flash suit, and even has a helmet of some kind with a faceplate that opens and closes. As for what he’s saying, it’s something along the lines of Lois Lane being “the key” and how Bruce has always been “right about him.” Then the Flash disappears again in a flash (ahem) of light. Again, it’s not entirely clear who the “him” is that he’s referring to, but that’s why it’s an Easter egg! For more on this out-there moment, watch our Keepin' It Reel BvS discussion below (scrub to 20.40 for the Flash talk):

IGN Keepin' It Reel, Episode 319: Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice Spoilercast
33:56



Time to Make a Cyborg!


That video footage that Batman steals from Lex about the metahumans he’s discovered out in the world features some familiar faces for even casual comics observers (Wonder Woman, the Flash again, and Aquaman), but then there’s also that poor guy who’s hanging up on that board with half his body missing. That would be Cyborg (played by newcomer Ray Fisher).

Cyborg has become a pretty important player in DC Comics in recent years, and is now considered a founding member of the Justice League (sorry Martian Manhunter!). Fisher will play the character in the soon-to-be shooting Justice League movie, but Cyborg has also long been associated with the team of young heroes known as the Teen Titans -- and has been a fixture on both of the popular animated series based on that group.

We’re seeing a key part of his origin in this scene in Batman v Superman, as his S.T.A.R. Labs scientist dad (Joe Morton, a.k.a. Miles Dyson, Terminator 2's creator of Skynet) works to save his son after the boy’s been in a deadly accident. For more on the character, watch Cyborg in a Minute right here:

Cyborg in a Minute
01:28

Of course, there are plenty more Easter eggs, references, and cool things to dissect in Batman v Superman, so be sure to check back very soon for our full investigation into those…

see, this is the problem. you just sat and watched a 2.5 hour movie, but now you have to go fishing the internet for things to be explained. You need google open on your phone to watch movies now.

 

[fonzerrillii]

and then people are saying "this will be explained in later movies". really, so i have to wait three years from now, and then i have to sit thru this shit again to remember what i need to look for in the next movie? Thats why end of credit scenes have become so popular. Its at the end and its quick. It sticks with you. Did we have to go back and rewatch Hulk, Iron Man, Thor to know what the end of credits scenes meant? No. You mean to tell me that when they finally get to the justice league movie, because thats probably when we will see the Flash from the future again (my god, they showed us two versions of flash in one movie, for what?), that we now have to remember that specific scene where he came to Bruce in a dream? Yall are making too many excuses for this movie. It was ok, and probably the best thing DC has done in a while, which is not saying much, but all the speculating you have to do is ridiculous.

You have to team up with a comic reader to see this shit.

Dude I'm giving you the standing slow clap for this one. Because you exactly right... It will probably be Justice league part 2 by the time we get to the flash that we saw... Or they begin Justice league part 1 with mad max batman and have flash go back in time for the climax but then that would also be stupid. They just backed themselves into this huge corner on this one. And it doesn't appear that Wonder Woman is going to have a connection to the Justice league movie. This is exactly why you need end credit scenes.

The first time that will probably hear anything about Darkseid will be part 1 and that if he shows.

 

[fonzerrillii]

First of all, stop making assumptions on what other people think are good movies, or bad ones.

Second if all, You continually bring up Green Lantern, SuckerPunch, Darkman and a bunch of other bullshit movies to defend your positions about Batman vs Superman.

Not me. I haven't talked about any other film in this discussion.

Thirdly, I've understood your point from the very beginning. I just disagree with it because this movie is a continuation of MoS... And a set-up for the next few movies from DC, including Wonder Woman, Justice League, Aquaman and solo Batman films.

The movie accomplished that.

So it doesn't need to 'Stand in its own' as if it should 'live in a vacuum' devoid of any inter-connected story arcs... where the 'casual movie goer' should pay their $20 for a single ticket and get every last 'newbie' question answered about the DC pantheon of heroes.

It was never meant to be that.
That's what YOU want it to be.

You think it should be one way... But it's the other.

The movie caters MORE toward the DC comic fans who know a bit more about these heroes, and don't just walk into the movie theater like its the very first superhero movie they ever saw in their life... And the first time they ever learned something about characters that been around for more than half a century.

You want a casual movie. A frolicking joyride.

A movie where if you knew 'zero' walking in.... you walk out feeling like you are 'all caught up' on the latest superhero events from the DCEU.

Stop bitching.

The movie wasn't meant to be any of that.
Deal with it.

But I am a DC fan and I don't feel catered to all. I'm a huge DC fan. I don't want a casual movie... I want to see before my eyes a fully realized world and its not there in this movie. I'm not the only one with this compliant. Read other messages board... See the complaints from other people. We are saying the same thing. I'm seriously worried about the second and third week for the movie, because I know DC... If this shit doesn't make a billion dollars.. They will scrap this entire plan and pull some New 52 bull shit. They have done it before and they will do it again. I mention Green lantern because that was supposed to be there first attempt at this shared universe thing. It didn't live up to expectations... And they dropped the planned universe. Superman Returns was a box office and critical success. It was supposed to be the start of something but Warner Bros didn't like the worldwide box office and they cancelled the planned sequel and that universe. Do you see the pattern here?

 

[TimRock]

But I am a DC fan and I don't feel catered to all. I'm a huge DC fan. I don't want a casual movie... I want to see before my eyes a fully realized world and its not there in this movie. I'm not the only one with this compliant. Read other messages board... See the complaints from other people. We are saying the same thing. I'm seriously worried about the second and third week for the movie, because I know DC... If this shit doesn't make a billion dollars.. They will scrap this entire plan and pull some New 52 bull shit. They have done it before and they will do it again. I mention Green lantern because that was supposed to be there first attempt at this shared universe thing. It didn't live up to expectations... And they dropped the planned universe. Superman Returns was a box office and critical success. It was supposed to be the start of something but Warner Bros didn't like the worldwide box office and they cancelled the planned sequel and that universe. Do you see the pattern here?

dude, if they had used put Superman Returns and Dark Knight in the same universe, DC would probably be on par with Marvel right now. Bale v. Downey, blown opportunity. Both pull numbers in the box office. Bale could have been the Stark of this franchise. Imagine how far in front DC would be had they started this back then. We'd probably be up to black superman and arabian green lantern by now.

 

[fonzerrillii]

so just fuck all the people that dont read comics? DC doesnt want their money?
and if that was their MO, why the fuck are they still telling us how Bruces parents die? Oh, i know why, because in the past, they never showed the pearls getting caught on the gun. Got it now. Pure genius move. Bullfucking shit. If you want to introduce new characters, you explain it to the audience, regardless of who is watching the movie. You want people that dont read comics, to become interested. You want to make them want to see the next installment. I.E. Marvel. How many people actually read Iron Man comics before seeing the movie? He was not the most popular marvel hero. Same with Ant Man. Throwing random shit in a movie and saying "come back in three years for an explanation" is horrible and lazy.

Fucking thank you.....

There wasn't anything in this movie that made me excited for Justice League. If they didn't have the double Flash vision/dream/premonition ... whatever it was and just had Flash randomly show up talking about "You were right, Lois is the Key, Stop him" and didn't make it appear like it could have been a dream... then I would have Stocked for Justice League. I would have been stocked for the end fight between Superman and Batman. Batman would have had clear... confirmed information that Superman was a threat. He would have seen a world where Superman was a tyrant and He could have gone into that fight believing that this was the moment that Flash was talking about. Once he determined that that wasn't the moment...Then he would have been motivated to seek out these other people and to keep a eye of Lois. Which would have explained him at the Funeral.

Changing 1 thing..... would have changed then entire dynamic of the second half and set up a clear path for Justice League without the need for a end scene. 1 fucking thing.... But Nope... Zack Snyder wan't to make it appear as a dream to further enhance his portrayal of Batman as a possible psychotic. That would be a good move for a stand alone movie... but its stupid when you know there are Seven films coming after this thing.

 

[grownazzblakman]

so just fuck all the people that dont read comics? DC doesnt want their money?
and if that was their MO, why the fuck are they still telling us how Bruces parents die? Oh, i know why, because in the past, they never showed the pearls getting caught on the gun. Got it now. Pure genius move. Bullfucking shit. If you want to introduce new characters, you explain it to the audience, regardless of who is watching the movie. You want people that dont read comics, to become interested. You want to make them want to see the next installment. I.E. Marvel. How many people actually read Iron Man comics before seeing the movie? He was not the most popular marvel hero. Same with Ant Man. Throwing random shit in a movie and saying "come back in three years for an explanation" is horrible and lazy.

DC has several solo movies 'on deck' that will INTRODUCE these new characters that you keep complaining about. Where you been?

All these dumbass questions you keep asking will be answered whenever those movies drop.

Plus they already GOT your money (along with 'the casual movie going audience' of people who don't read comics) if you PAID to see the movie in the theaters.

Wake up.

They not giving you a refund.

If you don't want your questions answered... Don't watch the next few episodes of movies they put out.

Simple as that.

DC won't miss your business, chief.

They will keep making these movies and putting out comics, graphic novels, cartoons, video games, comic-con conventions, tv shows and all kinds of material for you to 'catch up' on the lore.

It's up to you whether or not you decide to find out more.

As for Iron Man and Ant-Man.. Lots of people read the comics back in the day... before seeing the movie.

You sound as if the ONLY people in the movie theaters buying tickets... are 'shut-ins' or 'adolescents'... who know nothing about comics books.

The audience of people who are familiar with comic book characters that been around for 25+ years is much BIGGER than you think.

Not everyone is a completely 'casual moviegoer' with absolutely ZERO knowledge of these characters.

You think a packed moviehouse for a Batman vs Superman showtime has just 10 comic nerds... and the rest are fans of 'the Notebook'?

 

[grownazzblakman]

With all the negative criticism... The movie has already made almost HALF a BILLION dollars (worldwide) in the 1st weekend alone.

- $424 million worldwide
- $170 million US box office

Pretty sure that breaks the #1 spot for any March movie release which was previously held by a Hunger Games flick. ($165 million)

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=superman2015.htm

 

[fonzerrillii]

dude, if they had used put Superman Returns and Dark Knight in the same universe, DC would probably be on par with Marvel right now. Bale v. Downey, blown opportunity. Both pull numbers in the box office. Bale could have been the Stark of this franchise. Imagine how far in front DC would be had they started this back then. We'd probably be up to black superman and arabian green lantern by now.

Again... Exactly... but nope... They didn't want to copy Marvel. But Marvel... was willing to gamble. The incredible Hulk made only $263 million off a budget of $150 million in 2007. It wasn't the hit that Marvel hoped. That was the second of their big universe movies that came out that year. Marvel could have said.. Damn this plan is stupid. But they stuck with and risked stand alone movies on Lower tier characters... Now look at the machine they created. Superman returns came out in 2006 and made 391 million on a 203 million dollar budget. Batman Begins came out in 2005 and made $375 million. All they had to do was link Superman and Batman to the same worlds and BAM.. they would have had a full two year head start on Marvel with their big guns leading the way, but NOPE....

They didn't know what they are doing then and they don't know what they are doing now.

 

[TimRock]

DC has several solo movies 'on deck' that will INTRODUCE these new characters that you keep complaining about. Where you been?

All these dumbass questions you keep asking will be answered whenever those movies drop.

Plus they already GOT your money (along with 'the casual movie going audience' of people who don't read comics) if you PAID to see the movie in the theaters.

Wake up.

They not giving you a refund.

If you don't want your questions answered... Don't watch the next few episodes of movies they put out.

Simple as that.

DC won't miss your business, chief.

They will keep making these movies and putting out comics, graphic novels, cartoons, video games, comic-con conventions, tv shows and all kinds of material for you to 'catch up' on the lore.

It's up to you whether or not you decide to find out more.

As for Iron Man and Ant-Man.. Lots of people read the comics back in the day... before seeing the movie.

You sound as if the ONLY people in the movie theaters buying tickets... are 'shut-ins' or 'adolescents'... who know nothing about comics books.

The audience of people who are familiar with comic book characters that been around for 25+ years is much BIGGER than you think.

Not everyone is a completely 'casual moviegoer' with absolutely ZERO knowledge of these characters.

You think a packed moviehouse for a Batman vs Superman showtime has just 10 comic nerds... and the rest are fans of 'the Notebook'?

if they are dumb, why haven't you answered one of them yet? Its a dumb question to ask who was the guy that showed up during the dream? why is that dumb? I'll wait. Its dumb to ask how Lois knew that the spear would work on Doomsday? why? I'll wait. Give me an answer to that. She didnt know who was out there. She didnt know shit about doomsday. So explain that dumb question.

You just said it yourself, the movie was made for comic fans. so again, another question you havent answered, why show how bruces parents die....again? what purpose did it serve? To learn his mothers name was Martha? Really?

You dont have the answers.

 

[TimRock]

With all the negative criticism... The movie has already made almost HALF a BILLION dollars (worldwide) in the 1st weekend alone.

- $424 million worldwide
- $170 million US box office

Pretty sure that breaks the #1 spot for any March movie release which was previously held by a Hunger Games flick. ($165 million)

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=superman2015.htm

duh, what was it up against? Yeah it made a lot of money because of expectations, which is why a lot of movies make money. People want to see it, because the trailers look good, or it was advertised in a way that made people think it would be worth it. The second week is the telling factor.

I'm not into calling people names on the internet and insulting them, but you are saying some pretty stupid shit. "wait until the next movie to have your questions answered". fucking really?