You're mistating what's happening. The media isn't reporting it as a genocide, they're reporting that very recent members of Gadhafi's regime are calling it that.
Wasn't someone, on here, saying how well Gadhafi treats his people?
- Thread starter QueEx
- Start date
You're mistating what's happening. The media isn't reporting it as a genocide, they're reporting that very recent members of Gadhafi's regime are calling it that.
You knew you had thrown QueEx under the bus as soon as you hit the submit button didn't you. lol... like Gadhafi's people did to him.
You are terribly
. My point is completely unrelated to what Que said.Go back to not speaking on this topic.
<font size="3">Do you get the feeling that each time you open your mouth, you're digging yourself into a deeper hole?
If not, you might consider raising your head above the mound and look around, for just a moment.
</font size>
`
<font size="5"><center>
Libya's Qaddafi offers $400 per family
as rebels close in on Tripoli</font size><font size="4">
Libya's besieged leader, facing a rebel advance on Tripoli
and possible international sanctions, also pledged a 150
percent increase in some government workers' wages.</font size></center>
Christian Science Monitor
By Tom A. Peter, Correspondent
February 25, 2011
As antigovernment forces and demonstrators draw nearer to Libya's capital, Tripoli, Col. Muammar Qaddafi appears to be further losing his grip on power.
<font size="4">Attempt to Appease the Masses</font sze>
In an attempt to appease the masses – possibly inspired by Saudi Arabia’s King Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz, who promised his subject $36 billion in benefits to stave off any potential revolutionaries – Libya's besieged leader on Friday pledged a 150 percent increase in some government workers' wages and promised to give every family $400.
Libyan state television announced the wage increase and said each family would receive $400 to help them cope with the rising food prices. The broadcast aired shortly before Libyans went to mosques for Friday prayers. After prayers, antigovernment protesters are expected to continue demonstrating, reports MSNBC.
The announcement of financial incentives appeared to have little effect. Antigovernment forces claim to be taking control of areas throughout eastern Libya. They have already taken hold of Benghazi, the second-largest city in Libya and a longtime hub of government opposition. Even as large swaths of the country fall in to the hands of antigovernment forces, it appears that the Arab strongman who has ruled Libya for 41 years will not give up the capital city of Tripoli without a fight.
“If he lose [sic] control outside or not, to him the most important thing is my city, the capital Tripoli, and he doesn't want to let go. He doesn't understand. He doesn't care. He's just killing the people,” a woman in Tripoli told the Australian Broadcasting Corporation.
The standoff may be coming soon. Violent clashes have come within 30 miles of the capital city. In the city of Zawiyah, one Libyan told Reuters that there was heavy fighting outside, but that security forces had been unable to penetrate the town.
“There are army and police checkpoints around Zawiyah but there is no presence inside. I just saw a few unarmed civilians,” Saeed Mustafa told Reuters.
Control of Benghazi and other parts of east Libya puts antigovernment supporters in control of critical oil reserves. Although mercenaries employed by Qaddafi have attacked two nearby cities in an attempt to quell the uprising, Sky News reports that rebels have managed to take control of a military airfield.
Humanitarian organizations say it is impossible to determine exactly how many people have died in the fighting. At least 300 deaths have been confirmed by Human Rights Watch, while the International Federation for Human Rights puts the death toll closer to 700 people. According to Gerrard Buffet, a French doctor in Benghazi who was interviewed by the British Broadcasting Corporation, the actual number may be much higher. In the east alone he estimates that as many as 2,000 people may have been killed.
In the face of increasing violence, the international community is preparing to take serious action. France and the UK are calling for the UN to approve an arms embargo and sanctions on Libya. President Barack Obama has consulted with European leaders and when asked if the US would consider military options, the president’s spokesman, Jay Carney, responded, “I'm not ruling anything out," The Wall Street Journal reports.
French officials have made similar calls to action. French Foreign Minister Michele Alliot-Marie said, “We can't make do with speeches any more, we need to act.”
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/terr...-400-per-family-as-rebels-close-in-on-Tripoli
Libya's Qaddafi offers $400 per family
as rebels close in on Tripoli</font size><font size="4">
Libya's besieged leader, facing a rebel advance on Tripoli
and possible international sanctions, also pledged a 150
percent increase in some government workers' wages.</font size></center>
Christian Science Monitor
By Tom A. Peter, Correspondent
February 25, 2011
As antigovernment forces and demonstrators draw nearer to Libya's capital, Tripoli, Col. Muammar Qaddafi appears to be further losing his grip on power.
<font size="4">Attempt to Appease the Masses</font sze>
In an attempt to appease the masses – possibly inspired by Saudi Arabia’s King Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz, who promised his subject $36 billion in benefits to stave off any potential revolutionaries – Libya's besieged leader on Friday pledged a 150 percent increase in some government workers' wages and promised to give every family $400.
Libyan state television announced the wage increase and said each family would receive $400 to help them cope with the rising food prices. The broadcast aired shortly before Libyans went to mosques for Friday prayers. After prayers, antigovernment protesters are expected to continue demonstrating, reports MSNBC.
The announcement of financial incentives appeared to have little effect. Antigovernment forces claim to be taking control of areas throughout eastern Libya. They have already taken hold of Benghazi, the second-largest city in Libya and a longtime hub of government opposition. Even as large swaths of the country fall in to the hands of antigovernment forces, it appears that the Arab strongman who has ruled Libya for 41 years will not give up the capital city of Tripoli without a fight.
“If he lose [sic] control outside or not, to him the most important thing is my city, the capital Tripoli, and he doesn't want to let go. He doesn't understand. He doesn't care. He's just killing the people,” a woman in Tripoli told the Australian Broadcasting Corporation.
The standoff may be coming soon. Violent clashes have come within 30 miles of the capital city. In the city of Zawiyah, one Libyan told Reuters that there was heavy fighting outside, but that security forces had been unable to penetrate the town.
“There are army and police checkpoints around Zawiyah but there is no presence inside. I just saw a few unarmed civilians,” Saeed Mustafa told Reuters.
Control of Benghazi and other parts of east Libya puts antigovernment supporters in control of critical oil reserves. Although mercenaries employed by Qaddafi have attacked two nearby cities in an attempt to quell the uprising, Sky News reports that rebels have managed to take control of a military airfield.
Humanitarian organizations say it is impossible to determine exactly how many people have died in the fighting. At least 300 deaths have been confirmed by Human Rights Watch, while the International Federation for Human Rights puts the death toll closer to 700 people. According to Gerrard Buffet, a French doctor in Benghazi who was interviewed by the British Broadcasting Corporation, the actual number may be much higher. In the east alone he estimates that as many as 2,000 people may have been killed.
In the face of increasing violence, the international community is preparing to take serious action. France and the UK are calling for the UN to approve an arms embargo and sanctions on Libya. President Barack Obama has consulted with European leaders and when asked if the US would consider military options, the president’s spokesman, Jay Carney, responded, “I'm not ruling anything out," The Wall Street Journal reports.
French officials have made similar calls to action. French Foreign Minister Michele Alliot-Marie said, “We can't make do with speeches any more, we need to act.”
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/terr...-400-per-family-as-rebels-close-in-on-Tripoli
You are terribly
Go back to not speaking on this topic.
De nile is a river in Africa lol. Your point is related to what Que said. If the word genocide hadn't been introduced Que couldn't have taken the position he took. Which is basically genocide is genocide, if the media says it's genocide it's genocide.
That's not what I gathered he was saying but he can defend/explain himself.
Either way, it's not "the media" calling it "genocide", it has been reported that members of Ghadhafi's regime are calling it genocide.
Just stop.
There you go once a-damn-gin.
Why do you insist upon knowing what someone else is thinking ? ? ?
The term "genocide" was first introduced in this thread at Post No. 6 where I posted a quote from the Libyan Ambassador to Arab League who stated, <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">"I condemn all these crimes which are close to the genocide acts"</span>, in response to your statement in Post No. 4 to the effect that, "[a]s far as dictators go Moammar isn't too bad."
In other words, (1) the reference to genocide was actually made by the Libyan Ambassador to the Arab League; and (2) I posted it in response to something YOU SAID, and not in relation to something Dave had said. In fact, Dave did not post in this thread until <font size="3">Post Number Damn 20</font size>. LMBAO
Once more, unless you want to join Miss Cleo, maybe you should stop pretending to know what others are thinking.
QueEx
Whatever the origin of the term in this discussion, "genocide" is vastly inaccurate. Just know it for what it is: a keyword thrown out there by officials who know the knee-jerk reaction it brings in diplomatic and foreign-policy circles.
If it's murder then it is what it is. Bickering over minutiae here is counterproductive. Let it go.
If it's murder then it is what it is. Bickering over minutiae here is counterproductive. Let it go.
I agree. But its still not a good idea to pretend to know what others are thinking. In this case, that holds true whether its the Libyan Ambassador or "officials" purportedly seeking knee-jerk reactions.
QueEx
<font size="4">
Former Libyan Diplomat: Killing
Gadhafi Only Way to End Violence</font size>
http://www.voanews.com/english/news...hafi-Only-Way-to-End-Violence--116890028.html
Former Libyan Diplomat: Killing
Gadhafi Only Way to End Violence</font size>
<font size="3">
February 24, 2011
A former diplomat and interpreter for Libya’s embattled President
Moammar Gadhafi says <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">killing Gaddafi is the only solution to
ending the ongoing clashes between anti-government protesters,
who demand he step down, and pro-Gaddafi supporters</span>.
Abubaker Saad, professor of history and non-Western cultures at
Western Connecticut State University in the United States, says
Gadhafi’s pronouncements, in his words, depict his unwillingness to
negotiate with the anti-government protesters to end the crisis.
“If you are the leader and you do not offer any compromise, or even
accept the idea of sitting down and having a dialogue, the only alter-
native is to get rid of him and, basically, it’s going to take killing him to
actually end this whole situation.”
</font size>February 24, 2011
A former diplomat and interpreter for Libya’s embattled President
Moammar Gadhafi says <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">killing Gaddafi is the only solution to
ending the ongoing clashes between anti-government protesters,
who demand he step down, and pro-Gaddafi supporters</span>.
Abubaker Saad, professor of history and non-Western cultures at
Western Connecticut State University in the United States, says
Gadhafi’s pronouncements, in his words, depict his unwillingness to
negotiate with the anti-government protesters to end the crisis.
“If you are the leader and you do not offer any compromise, or even
accept the idea of sitting down and having a dialogue, the only alter-
native is to get rid of him and, basically, it’s going to take killing him to
actually end this whole situation.”
http://www.voanews.com/english/news...hafi-Only-Way-to-End-Violence--116890028.html
Not with any implicit assumption of infallibility, no. Still, some are better at it than others and do so as a career. I'm sure you understand.
It is the one word guaranteed to make everybody sit up and take notice, thanks to 60 years constant spoon-feeding from Israel and their supporters. No other term magically opens doors to funding, to offer a veil of legitimacy behind legal/illegal regime change nowadays. Considering that all the usual suspects are already lining up I'd say the knee-jerk is self evident.
Without question the word has been used invariably by some to bring attention to various atrocities and by others to engender sympaythy for various causes. If we can believe whats being reported, however, that Gadhafi is using forces loyal to him, (whether politically or financially), to kill off those who oppose his politics, then the conclusion (genocide) offered by the ex-ambassador is not inconsistent with the commonly accepted definitions of the term. Of course it could be argued that the ex-ambassador has self-serving motives for the characterization, but if the shoe fits, Gadhafi has to wear it -- the would-be motives of the so-called usual suspects, notwithstanding.
QueEx
<font size="4">
Libya: Tripoli turning against Gaddafi</font size>
Col Gaddafi blows a kiss to supporters at Green Square in Tripoli
Photo: GETTY
25 Feb 2011
Citizens of Tripoli took to the streets of the capital in their thousands to demand the downfall of their leader.
Within hours the capital was enveloped in blood.
Troops loyal to Col Muammar Gaddafi had flooded the centre of the city as the Brother Leader prepared his last stand.
By the time the evening gloom gathered, Col Gaddafi appeared on the ramparts of al Hamra (Red) Castle desparate for a reprieve.
Wearing a fur hat with ear flaps, pumping his fists and blowing kisses to the die hard defenders of his regime, he implored his once meek population to return its suppport.
"Get ready to fight for Libya, get ready to fight for dignity, get ready to fight for petroleum," he raved. "You must dance, sing, and prepare yourself - this spirit you have is stronger than any other attempt by the foreigners and the enemies to destroy us.
The eastern half of the country is already lost to Col Gaddafi.
FULL STORY
Libya: Tripoli turning against Gaddafi</font size>
Col Gaddafi blows a kiss to supporters at Green Square in Tripoli
Photo: GETTY
25 Feb 2011
Citizens of Tripoli took to the streets of the capital in their thousands to demand the downfall of their leader.
Within hours the capital was enveloped in blood.
Troops loyal to Col Muammar Gaddafi had flooded the centre of the city as the Brother Leader prepared his last stand.
By the time the evening gloom gathered, Col Gaddafi appeared on the ramparts of al Hamra (Red) Castle desparate for a reprieve.
Wearing a fur hat with ear flaps, pumping his fists and blowing kisses to the die hard defenders of his regime, he implored his once meek population to return its suppport.
"Get ready to fight for Libya, get ready to fight for dignity, get ready to fight for petroleum," he raved. "You must dance, sing, and prepare yourself - this spirit you have is stronger than any other attempt by the foreigners and the enemies to destroy us.
The eastern half of the country is already lost to Col Gaddafi.
FULL STORY
Do you know which definition the ex-ambassador used ??? Let me know. I believe his is the one relevant to this discussion. No?
QueEx
<font size="3">
Former Libya minister urges Gaddafi to resign</font size>
Gen Younis refused to order warplanes to fire on
protesters in Benghazi
Interior Minister Gen Abdul Fatteh Younis, one of Colonel Muammar Gaddafi's most powerful and longest-serving associates, has called on him to end his resistance to the uprising against him in Libya. In a BBC interview, Younis says Col Gaddafi's regime is collapsing, and forecasts that he will last only a few more days.
<SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">Having known the colonel for 47 years, Gen Younis says he will not surrender. "Either he will commit suicide or he will resist till he falls,"</span> he says.
25 February 2011 - BBC News, Benghazi - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12585174
Former Libya minister urges Gaddafi to resign</font size>
Gen Younis refused to order warplanes to fire on
protesters in Benghazi
Interior Minister Gen Abdul Fatteh Younis, one of Colonel Muammar Gaddafi's most powerful and longest-serving associates, has called on him to end his resistance to the uprising against him in Libya. In a BBC interview, Younis says Col Gaddafi's regime is collapsing, and forecasts that he will last only a few more days.
<SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">Having known the colonel for 47 years, Gen Younis says he will not surrender. "Either he will commit suicide or he will resist till he falls,"</span> he says.
25 February 2011 - BBC News, Benghazi - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12585174
His definition, yours, mine... in this situation, all irrelevant.
The point is why he and others are using it. They expect a certain response from those who are trained to define it a certain way. They are getting exactly that response.
Okay M.L. I gave a few extra responses to see if your "Let it go" (above) was serious. LOL. Perhap not, as evidenced by the continued "minutiae."
Nevertheless, the ex-ambassador is at the scene, giving his first-hand account and impressions of what it is he is witnessing. If his definition or usage of the term genocide is irrelevant -- then certainly your clairvoyant guesses as to (a) why he might have used the term; and (b) what might be his desired response among his hearers -- must not only be irrelevant, but immaterial as well.
But hey! -- its Friday and I'm just enjoying the back and forth as I write this appellate brief I'm working on.
QueEx
Okay M.L. I gave a few extra responses to see if your "Let it go" (above) was serious. LOL. Perhap not, as evidenced by the continued "minutiae."
Nevertheless, the ex-ambassador is at the scene, giving his first-hand account and impressions of what it is he is witnessing. If his definition or usage of the term genocide is irrelevant -- then certainly your clairvoyant guesses as to (a) why he might have used the term; and (b) what might be his desired response among his hearers -- must not only be irrelevant, but immaterial as well.
But hey! -- its Friday and I'm just enjoying the back and forth as I write this appellate brief I'm working on.
QueEx
His use of the word is not irrelevant, thats the point, why was that word allowed into the debate. What did the ambassador hope to accomplish by using it and why didn't experienced news editors use another word besides genocide to describe the situation. It's everything except irrelevant especially now that the world is turning against Gadhafi even though he's the one being attacked.
You are very poorly informed here, and the resulting assumptions are dangerous ones. Enjoy your academic refuge.
BBC/ABC Interview Live With Gaddafi 28th Feb 2011.
<font size="4">
No Fly Zones?</font size><font size="3">
The U.S. moved naval and air forces closer to Libya on Monday and said all options were open, including patrols of the North African nation's skies to protect its citizens from their ruler.
France said it would fly aid to the opposition-controlled eastern half of the country. The European Union imposed an arms embargo and other sanctions, following the lead of the U.S. and the U.N. The EU was also considering the creation of a no-fly zone over Libya. And the U.S. and Europe were freezing billions in Libya's foreign assets.
USS Kearsarge
Pentagon spokesmen didn't detail the purpose of the U.S. ship and aircraft movements, but the moves didn't appear to signal direct U.S. military intervention in Libya. Among the ships being sent, reports said, is the USS Kearsarge, which carries nearly 2,000 Marines and dozens of helicopters.
"We have planners working and various contingency plans and I think it's safe to say as part of that we're repositioning forces to be able to provide for that flexibility once decisions are made," said Marine Col. David Lapan, a Pentagon spokesman.
</font size>
No Fly Zones?</font size><font size="3">
The U.S. moved naval and air forces closer to Libya on Monday and said all options were open, including patrols of the North African nation's skies to protect its citizens from their ruler.
France said it would fly aid to the opposition-controlled eastern half of the country. The European Union imposed an arms embargo and other sanctions, following the lead of the U.S. and the U.N. The EU was also considering the creation of a no-fly zone over Libya. And the U.S. and Europe were freezing billions in Libya's foreign assets.
USS Kearsarge
Pentagon spokesmen didn't detail the purpose of the U.S. ship and aircraft movements, but the moves didn't appear to signal direct U.S. military intervention in Libya. Among the ships being sent, reports said, is the USS Kearsarge, which carries nearly 2,000 Marines and dozens of helicopters.
"We have planners working and various contingency plans and I think it's safe to say as part of that we're repositioning forces to be able to provide for that flexibility once decisions are made," said Marine Col. David Lapan, a Pentagon spokesman.
</font size>
France recognises rebels as government
France has become the first country to recognise
the Libyan rebel leadership, the National Libyan
Council, as the country's legitimate government
BBC News
10 March 2011
It came as Nato met to discuss military options in the Libyan conflict
including a possible no-fly zone.
The office of French President Nicolas Sarkozy said Paris regarded the
[National Libyan Council] NLC as Libya's "legitimate representative".
Mustafa Gheriani, a spokesman for the rebels in their eastern stronghold
of Benghazi, said the French move was "breaking the ice", adding that he
expected other EU members to follow suit.
However Italy and Spain have said they will not take a similar step until
European Union members have reached a common position on the issue.
EU foreign ministers will also hold talks in Brussels, ahead of a European
Council summit on Friday.
France's announcement came amid fresh fighting on the ground between
Col Gaddafi's forces and the rebels.
FULL STORY
`
Medievel bastards. !!!!!
Libyan Woman Struggles to Tell Media of Her Gang-Raped
http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=576418
''original post in main''
Libyan Woman Struggles to Tell Media of Her Gang-Raped
http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=576418
''original post in main''
The Real Reason for NATO Attacking Libya
The Real Reason for NATO Attacking Libya - the gold dinar currency
The Real Reason for NATO Attacking Libya - the gold dinar currency
I'm amazed this thread was re-started.
There are posters in this thread who come off as nothing more than government stooges, propaganda puppets, corporate clowns, and state agents.
Cuba has the same leadership since the 50s.
North Korea has the same leadership for generations.
Morocco has the same leadership since the 1800s.
Saudi Arabia has been ruled by the House of Saud for centuries.
But, magically, Qadaffi is so hated by his people in 2011 (after 40 years of rule), after gas prices hit $3/gallon, because "the West" (white scum) says so?
And supposedly black people in the United States support this "white scum" invasion of Africa?
Interesting.
There are posters in this thread who come off as nothing more than government stooges, propaganda puppets, corporate clowns, and state agents.
Cuba has the same leadership since the 50s.
North Korea has the same leadership for generations.
Morocco has the same leadership since the 1800s.
Saudi Arabia has been ruled by the House of Saud for centuries.
But, magically, Qadaffi is so hated by his people in 2011 (after 40 years of rule), after gas prices hit $3/gallon, because "the West" (white scum) says so?
And supposedly black people in the United States support this "white scum" invasion of Africa?
Interesting.
You don't know if the people in his country wanted him to leave Did the people of Libya want him out of power?
The UN is dominated by the United States that is responsible for 25% of the World's GDP, many of the countries are trading partners that could be retaliated against if they vote against any action. Plus the other countries desperately need access to the oil. Therefore, the UN, Arab League will never be a stamp of legitimacy for any military action in the Middle East.
President Bush at one time obtained a majority of the votes in an Election! Who would have thought that the will of the people in the United States wanted President Bush to lead them, but they did!! His popularity with the rest of the World was probably lower than Gadhafi. You can't assume anything, they had people on TV that supported Gadhafi; however, the media focused on Rebels to push for an overthrow.
A dictator with oil is a dictator to the world.
The UN is dominated by the United States that is responsible for 25% of the World's GDP, many of the countries are trading partners that could be retaliated against if they vote against any action. Plus the other countries desperately need access to the oil. Therefore, the UN, Arab League will never be a stamp of legitimacy for any military action in the Middle East.
President Bush at one time obtained a majority of the votes in an Election! Who would have thought that the will of the people in the United States wanted President Bush to lead them, but they did!! His popularity with the rest of the World was probably lower than Gadhafi. You can't assume anything, they had people on TV that supported Gadhafi; however, the media focused on Rebels to push for an overthrow.
A dictator with oil is a dictator to the world.
Last edited:
Since I was the one attacked in this thread I think I should respond by saying whats happening in the Middle East is a precursor of whats about to happen in America ONE WORLD GOVT WITH NO MIDDLE CLASS. The U.N is looking into how the Gadhafi family was murdered without regard to international law if we allow this govt to get away with it WE are next. Thank you.
And neither do you, but from all the evidence (if you have someting different, please show it) it was Libyan's that started this revolt and Libyan's that asked for any help they could get.
You know, several thousand miles away from the action, a lot of Libyans would undboutedly ask you: who the fuck are you to tell them how they should have handled their dictator ?
Do you have any Libyan experience that would give you some special insight as to how they should manage their affairs ? ? ? How would they set up elections when the standing government doesn't want elections ? ? ?
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