Dream Match: George Foreman vs Mike Tyson
- Thread starter Gazoo
- Start date
Frazier had the best left hook in history, but exposed his head too much to punches. In Tyson's he didn't get hit too often because of his movement.
15 Rounds of boxing.
A prime Tyson would be too fast for him. Unlike other boxers, Tyson, from '85 to '88, was a complete fighter. Under Kevin Rooneys training nobody could fuck with Mike. Tysons movement was sick
I think Evander Holyfield proved just how vulnerable Tyson was when he fought an experience fighter. And you saw what Lenox Lewis did to him
Both of those guys were the same age bracket.. Tyson is 50 right now Holyfield is 54 Lenox Lewis is 51 both guys were older than him when they fought him.. Larry Holmes was 7 years younger than Alithats like saying holmes showed how vulnerable ali was
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Most of the people who fought Tyson were not intimidated of him. I've seen all of his fights and most were not afraid of Tyson.
Top Ten Heavyweights of the late 1970s. A Who's Who list.
www.heavyweightaction.com
(1) Muhammad Ali 6’3”, 215- The steady decline of Ali occurred throughout the 1970s. At the start of the decade he was one of the great fighters of all time and at the end he was no more then a shell of his old self. It is pointless to look at who he fought because he fought them all and then some. (27-3) *1121
Assessment: Ali was physically one of the greatest fighting machines ever to enter the heavyweight arena. Lighting speed in his hands and feet and the ability to adapt to almost any style in the ring. Took a punch better than any heavyweight title holder. In his prime I think it is safe to say there were only a handful of fighters who would stand a chance at beating “The Greatest”.
(2) George Foreman 6’3”, 225- One of the most feared fighters of all time, he destroyed George Chuvalo, Joe Frazier and Ken Norton. His 1975 fight against Ron Lyle was a classic. His two losses were to Ali and Jimmy Young.(32-2) *791
Assessment: Foreman is a fighter who was misunderstood during his first reign as the heavyweight champion. His ability to overpower his opponents put him in a class of elite heavyweights in ring history. He had an outstanding jab, power punches that would paralyze his opponents and he could take a powerful wallop himself. He also was a fine boxer who could more than hold his own against fighters who were allusive.
(3) Joe Frazier 5’11”, 205- Smokin Joe Frazier, what a legendary fighter who will always be viewed with greatness. Will their ever be a more courageous fighter. Frazier only lost to two fighters during his entire career, Foreman and Ali. Both of the Ali losses could have went the other way. He owned wins over Ali, Jimmy Ellis twice, Joe Bugner and Jerry Quarry. Hard to argue with his place as number three. (8-4-1) *786
Assessment: Smokin Joe Frazier was one of the most popular fighters of all-time because of his style and his ability to overcome his physical limitations. Frazier’s peak years were very short because of his style that included taking a great deal of punishment. He will be forever connected to Ali and their three historic matches.
(4) Larry Holmes 6’3”,212- Holmes 1978 contest against Kenny Norton was one of the great fights of all-time. Holmes proved himself in that fight alone. He was undefeated during the decade. His key victories were against Norton, Earnie Shavers, Alfredo Evanlegista and Mike Weaver. Weaver had Holmes hurt in their fight and Shavers had Holmes down in their second fight. This is definitely an indicator that Holmes could be hit. (32-0) *333
Assessment: Holmes came along right at the end of the decade and proved to be the best in the division. His great fight against Ken Norton was a classic. Holmes personality left something to be desired and limited his popularity even today but there can be no argument he was a great fighter.
(5) Kenny Norton 6’3”,215 –Norton came out of nowhere in 1973 to defeat Muhammad Ali. He spent the rest of his career proving it was no fluke. He lost both of his rematches with the Greatest but could have easily gotten the decision in either fight. He also could have gotten the decision against Holmes. All three of these fights were split decision losses. His other defeats were to Foreman in a 2-KO, Jose Luis Garcia in a 8-KO, and Earnie Shavers in a 1-KO. His victory list is impressive. Muhammad Ali, Jimmy Young, Jerry Quarry, Duane Bobick and Jose Luis Garcia all fell to Norton. His draw was in his 3rd to last fight of his career against Scott LeDoux. (29-6-1) *637
Assessment: Norton battles against Ali, Holmes and Jimmy Young are his claims to greatness. Had Norton fought at any other time in boxing history he would have been a dominate heavyweight. There were so many great heavyweights during the decade that Norton sometimes gets overlooked.
(6) Jimmy Young 6’1”, 210- In 1974 there was nothing in Young’s history to indicate he had a chance against Earnie Shavers who had knocked him out the year before. Young turned his career around fighting a draw with Shavers and advanced all the way to the top position in the heavyweight division. George Foreman and Ron Lyle twice fell before his talented fist. Two very close losses to Muhammad Ali and Kenny Norton stopped him from winning the heavyweight title. After his 1978 loss to Ossie Ocasio he was pretty much a journey men. A smooth, cute defensive fighter who made all the top heavies of the mid 1970s look bad. (23-9-1) *365
Assessment: Young’s accomplishments are amazing when you look at his record. He lost a highly questionable decision to Ali in 1975, sent Foreman into retirement with his 1977 victory and lost a close decision to Norton 1977. That is incredible company for the fighter from Philadelphia.
(7) Jerry Quarry 6’1”, 205- One of the all-time great battlers in ring history. If there was ever a tougher fighter than Quarry we would love to see him. Jerry feared no fighter. The Irishmen was the first to defeat Mac Foster, Larry Middleton, Ron Lyle and knocked out Earnie Shavers in the 1st round. His losses during the decade were to Muhammad Ali twice, Kenny Norton and Joe Frazier.(18-4) *416
Assessment: One of the tragic figures in heavyweight history and still one of the most loved. He has almost a cult type following from the boxing fans of the 1970s. Nobody ever fought with more heart and determination than the Bellflower Bomber.
(8) Ron Lyle 6’3 ”, 220 –The powerful Lyle defeated Buster Mathis, Larry Middleton, Jose Luis Garcia, Oscar Bonavena, Jimmy Ellis, Earnie Shavers and Joe Bugner. His losses were to Jimmy Young twice, Muhammad Ali, George Foreman and late in his career Lynn Ball. His 1976 war with Foreman was one of the great heavyweight fights of all time. (37-6) *415
Assessment: Entered boxing late in life right out of prison. At the age of 30 he moved up quickly through the heavyweight ranks to be one of the top fighters of the decade.
(9) Earnie Shavers 6’0”, 206- One of the great power punches ever to enter the ring, Shavers defeated Jimmy Young, Jimmy Ellis, Henry Clark, Howard Smith and Kenny Norton. His losses were to Larry Holmes twice, Muhammad Ali, Jerry Quarry, Ron Lyle, and Bob Stallings. He fought a draw against Young in their second match. (47-6-1) *199
(10) John Tate 6’4”, 230-Big John Tate came out of the Olympics as a real up and comer. He beat an up and coming young fighter named Johnny Boudreaux followed by a 1st round knockout over Duane Bobick. In the WBA heavyweight tourney to find a successor to Ali’s title he defeated Kallie Knoetze in an 8th knockout and then defeated Gerrie Coetzee over 15 rounds. That was pretty much the peak of his success. (20-0) *33
(11) Joe Bugner 6’4”, 230- Bugner was without question the best European heavyweight during the decade. His many victories were against the top heavyweights in Europe and sometimes questioned as top fighters but Bugner met other top contenders from the United States. Bugner was very active defeating Chuck Wepner, Brian London, Eduardo Corletti, Henry Cooper, Jurgin Blin, Rudi Lubbers, Mac Foster, Jimmy Ellis, Jose Luis Garcia, and Richard Dunn. His losses came at the hands of Ali, Joe Frazier, Larry Middleton, Jack Bodell and Ron Lyle. His loss to Lyle was a split decision. (31-6-1) *150
(12) Gerrie Coetzee 6’2”, 222- Coetzee defeated rival South African Kallie Knoetze twice and defeated Johnny Boudreaux and Randy Stephens. The fight that put in spotlight was his 1st round knockout of Leon Spinks in the WBA eliminator contest to find the successor to Ali’s title. In the finals against John Tate he lost a 15 round decision. (22-1) *82
(13) Leon Spinks 6’0”, 196- Spinks upset Muhammad Ali after only seven career fights and captured the heavyweight title. He lost to Ali in the rematch and then was destroyed in the 1st round by Gerrie Coetzee of South Africa. Outside of the Ali victory his career was not much.(7-2-1) *170
(14) Jimmy Ellis 6’1”, 196- Ellis met Joe Frazier for the heavyweight title in 1970 losing a 5 round knockout. He also lost a 12 round KO to Ali and a 1st round KO to Earnie Shavers. His only big victory during the decade was against George Chuvalo. Other losses included Joe Frazier, Joe Bugner, Ron Lyle and to Boone Kirkman. After the first Frazier fight in 1970 it was almost a freefall to the bottom of the division. (13-7-1) *212
(15) Oscar Bonavena 6’0”, 205- Bonavena was a mainstay in the rankings during the late 1960s and early 1970s. Most of his best fights were in the 60s but he was still a tough contender into 1970s. His most famous fight of course was his 15 round KO loss to Muhammad Ali in Madison Square Garden. It was Ali’s second fight after his return to the ring. Bonavena had wins over Luis Pires, Alvin Lewis and Larry Middleton. His losses were to Ali, Floyd Patterson, Luis Pires and to Ron Lyle. His untimely death in 1976 ended his career. (18-4)*362
(16) Kallie Knoetze 6’1”, 211-Kallie lost both fights against Coetzee but did gain international fame with his knockout victory over Duane Bobick. His other victories were over little known Richard Dunn and Randy Stephens. (19-4) *111
(17) Duane Bobick- 6’3”, 215- Duane Bobick came into professional boxing out of the Olympics where he lost in the heavyweight finals against Tefilo Stephenson in one of the most watched Olympic matches in history. Bobick’s winning streak went to 40 in a row as a professional with wins over Larry Middleton, Mike Weaver, Scott LeDoux, Bunny Johnson and Chuck Wepner before his big 1st round knockout loss to Ken Norton. Later Kallie Knoetze Ko’ed Bobick in three rounds and his career really came to a holt with KO losses to John Tate in the 1st round and George Chaplin. (48-4)*181
(18) Floyd Patterson 6’0”, 188- The heavyweight champion of the late 1950s and early 1960s was still going strong in the early part of the 1970s. His biggest victory during the decade was against Oscar Bonavena. His rematch with Ali ended his career and was his only loss during the period. (9-1)*132
(19) George Chuvalo 6’0”, 221- Said to have been able to take a punch better than any fighter who ever entered the ring according to legendary Ring boxing editor and founder, Nat Fleisher. Chuvalo ability to absorb punishment made him a top contender throughout the 1960s and 70s. His biggest win during the decade was against an over the hill Cleveland Williams. The rest of his wins were against a bunch of no names. His three losses were to Ali, Jimmy Ellis and George Foreman. (17-3)*88
(20) Mac Foster - 6’2”, 210 -Foster went all the way up the rankings until his big knockout loss to Jerry Quarry in 1970. He never recovered from the defeated. He faced Ali and lost a 15-decision. Losses continued after that as Foster was never able to turn things around. He lost to Bob Stallings, Joe Bugner, Henry Clark and Stan Ward all by decision. He had no meaningful victories during the decade. (8-6)*193
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Tyson's speed can easily overcome Foreman's strength. Tyson's boxing style both defensively and offensively was developed for him to fight much bigger fighters. I always thought GF was slow as a fighter. They both have tremendous power, but Tyson definitely takes this bout.
You'd have to admit that wasn't the prime Tyson.
Frazier only lost, not to just hall of famers, but all-time greats. Foreman would have dusted Tyson in less than four rounds.
Holyfield was a huge underdog in that first fight. Everyone, except me, were expecting a slaughter. After the trilogy with Bowe and his poor performance against Czyz, everyone was saying the fight was just a formality for Tyson's path to unifying the titles again. November 9, 1996 was a great day. Easiest money ever won.
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Styles make fights and If you wanted the perfect opponent to destroy Tyson, you would create Foreman.
Do you remember what the odds were for that fight?
I think prime Tyson's speed, jab, and defense would give Foreman problems in the beginning, but Foreman would slow Tyson down with those clubbing punches of his. Even when Foreman misses, he hits, and Tyson doesn't rope-a-dope like Ali. He would take the full force of those punches on his arms and sides. Prime Tyson had an excellent jab and defense, but he was still an infighter, which was the kind of fighter that Foreman had the easiest time with. Tyson would try to take Foreman out. He wouldn't be able to resist, and that's where he would pay dearly.
Foreman by late mid-to-late KO.
It was Douglas type odds. Low 20s to as high as mid 40s. It my memory serves correctly, it was in the pre-fight show with Bobby Czyz's hating commentary against Holyfield.
Sam Watson on Holyfield that night.
Yea he peaked and had those two great fights.
In your opinion who was the best fighter Tyson beat from 85-88 ? An end of career Larry Holmes, who was also inactive for almost two years and an undersized Michael Spinks don't compare to a prime Big George. Tyson didn't even want to fight old George.
While we were eating, Benton said, "Bobby, what's up with Foreman and Tyson, how come they're not fighting each other on the 16th? Isn't that the fight that King was trying to make?" He said, "Georgie, You'll never believe this but, Fuckin' Tyson is scared shit less of Foreman and wants no part of him. I was there when Don was trying to make the fight. He was telling Tyson that Foreman represented huge money, plus he was old and slow and would be no problem. Tyson got up and screamed at King saying, 'I'm not fight in' that Fuckin' animal, if you love the motherfucker so much, you fight him!'"
Goodman stated that Tyson said Foreman was much better than people thought, and was a dangerous fight for any of the top heavyweights. Goodman proceeded to explain how Tyson was calling Foreman a big con man, and explained that the grandpop act was just a front. He said Tyson saw Foreman as trying to set up the boxing world into thinking he was a pushover, knowing that he really wasn't. Tyson said Foreman was a wolf in sheep's clothing. Goodman continued to say that after seeing Tyson's response to King trying to push him into a fight with Foreman, he had no doubt that Tyson had fear of Foreman. He also said that from that point on, he felt that if Foreman and Tyson ever fought, Foreman would knock Tyson out!
http://coxscorner.tripod.com/foreman_tyson_fl.html
Horrible analogy, Holmes was fighting a badly faded, end of career Ali. Tyson was fighting a fighter that was not only older than he was but was also much more ring worn than he was.thats like saying holmes showed how vulnerable ali was
George would win and that's just my opinion because he's used to going the distance and wearing his comp down(I've only seen two or three of his fights ever)like he did with Ali but that also was his weakness too and Ali proved that.
Mike from what I remember was two round,three at the most and if it went longer than that he ended up losing and bull rushing him wouldn't work because George would just side step right on out of that and try to jab him to death and keep him at a distance.
Mike from what I remember was two round,three at the most and if it went longer than that he ended up losing and bull rushing him wouldn't work because George would just side step right on out of that and try to jab him to death and keep him at a distance.
the analogy stands as both ali and tyson were beyond their primes
and both fighting because of money surrounded by a bunch of yes men
when it was clear to the neutral that they should not have been in the ring
Have heard that Tyson wanted no part of George...the story is that Cus used to tell young Tyson all sorts of stories about how dangerous George was (always been rumored George killed a man with his bare hands as a youth in Htown)...George at the time was retired and no one could see George coming back...so George comes back and the fight is declined by Tyson when offered to him...Tyson wants no part of it...he already has the stories of the monster George in his head
Knowing this, George would have beaten Tyson because Tyson would have been the intimidated one
As an aside, let me add for those that don't know...George Foreman hit harder than Tyson but Ernie Shavers punched harder than George...both Ron Lyle and Ali picked Shavers as the harder puncher
Knowing this, George would have beaten Tyson because Tyson would have been the intimidated one
As an aside, let me add for those that don't know...George Foreman hit harder than Tyson but Ernie Shavers punched harder than George...both Ron Lyle and Ali picked Shavers as the harder puncher
Here's the difference, when Holmes and Ali fought, Holmes was in his prime and Ali was at the very end of his career. When Tyson and Holyfield fought both men were at the mid-point of their careers. Don't act like Tyson was on his last leg, 1n 96, Tyson would have been a heavy favorite over any fighter except maybe Lennox Lewis and he still would have been a favorite in that fight.
don't forget, Tyson had time off, while Lenox was still keeping active. That does play a factor. I am a Lenox fan as well, but i think, it they fought early on, Tyson would win.
dont know about that
Apart from that freak loss to rahman
Lennox had to be the perfect boxer
I really dont think there is anyone who could beat him in his prime
Lennox seemed to get better in his 30s.
The two losses Lennox had he avenged. You might be right. Maybe Ali.
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