Writer's Circle: Is it EASIER to write DRAMA or COMEDY?

[playahaitian]

The reason I ask is because it is difficult to find an all black show (period) but especially serious dramas and wanted to ask if it is easier (knowing ALL writing is a challenge and a labor of love) to write comedy.

And I mean in any format TV, stage, sketch, novel, blog etc.

And as a side note is EASIER for the audience (white and black) to accept certain roles and settings then others.

Very few Black romantic comedies which rare in themselves are good, or successful or LAUGH OUT LOUD funny.

And they have been very few if at all straight serious dramas from an all Black either.

As we call upon a new generation of Black writers producers directors I wanted to ask if there GENRES that may be easier to write and also more accessible to the audience.

We call about the success stories like The Wire, Girlfriends The Cosby Show Different World Roc The Jefferson Good Times Love & Basketball The Best Man etc. but that is almost entirely TV.

Or is good writing just good writing?

 

[playahaitian]

sidebar:

esy b posted this skit

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http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?p=15272048&posted=1​

and I thought it was a great idea I'm sure it been done before but I thought that is a GREAT idea for content to take popular stand up routine and turn them into live skits or animated shorts.

I would do the cook-out by eddie murphy actually I always wanted to develop into either a movie, play or tv series.

 

[Jay_from_dade]

For me its easier to write drama. Making someone cry or sad is easy. Making them laugh is hard because people find so many different things either funny or not funny.

Example: Hannibal Burrus "Apple Juice" joke had me crying Laughing.

Nothing Kevin Heart says is remotely funny to me.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

They're the same to me.

One the premise is taken care of and what I'm trying to accomplish, it's a done deal for me.

 

[playahaitian]

For me its easier to write drama. Making someone cry or sad is easy. Making them laugh is hard because people find so many different things either funny or not funny.

Example: Hannibal Burrus "Apple Juice" joke had me crying Laughing.

Nothing Kevin Heart says is remotely funny to me.

They're the same to me.

One the premise is taken care of and what I'm trying to accomplish, it's a done deal for me.

thanks to both you brothers for responding.

I was actually thinking about ya'll specifically when I asked this question.

To me comedy is so damn subjective.

oddly I don't find Kevin Hart funny either but look at his following.

I I had a writing discussion with you all in the past about tone and having a 'voice' when you right.

When I read Bills stuff is voice to me is so distinctive I can actually HEAR his writing. And when he is being satirical or sarcastic I can hear it.

And I think Jay got that too because of his ability to write from different perspectives and if the CHARACTER is funny he can write it is funny.

And from a Black writing side:
That is why I am wondering why is it so hard to write a straight drama from a Black perspective and not have a crime element to it?

And not the EXTREME of a precious or monster's ball.

The Wire had humor (it was never FUNNY) but it had lighter moments.

And I think all good drama moments needs that balance.

But it just seems tragedy and pain (which ironically good COMEDY is based) drama is EASIER to write or at least begin with then comedy to me at least.

 

[MonkeyBizness]

Drama is easier.

Tension is tension. Adversity is adversity. Conflict is conflict.

Comedy on the other hand is incredibly subjective and nuanced.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

thanks to both you brothers for responding.

I was actually thinking about ya'll specifically when I asked this question.

To me comedy is so damn subjective.

oddly I don't find Kevin Hart funny either but look at his following.

I I had a writing discussion with you all in the past about tone and having a 'voice' when you right.

When I read Bills stuff is voice to me is so distinctive I can actually HEAR his writing. And when he is being satirical or sarcastic I can hear it.

And I think Jay got that too because of his ability to write from different perspectives and if the CHARACTER is funny he can write it is funny.

And from a Black writing side:
That is why I am wondering why is it so hard to write a straight drama from a Black perspective and not have a crime element to it?

And not the EXTREME of a precious or monster's ball.

The Wire had humor (it was never FUNNY) but it had lighter moments.

And I think all good drama moments needs that balance.

But it just seems tragedy and pain (which ironically good COMEDY is based) drama is EASIER to write or at least begin with then comedy to me at least.

For drama the way you're talking about the story makes it.

people get too hung up on things like race immediately.

just write a story about people and then make them black.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

Drama is easier.

Tension is tension. Adversity is adversity. Conflict is conflict.

Comedy on the other hand is incredibly subjective and nuanced.

i think it depends on why something is funny. if you understand why something is supposed to be funny then you can write it so that whoever you're trying to reach can "get it"

it can also work on a multilayer level as well

for instance

Colin Powell is at his desk working through a mountain of paperwork. His secretary comes in and adds another stack to his pile. Colin grabs the stack, glances over it and flips the pages and then says "I'm not gonna read all of this shit" and tosses it to the floor.


somebody who has no idea about BGOL will laugh cause they can't blame him its so much stuff why would he want to read all of that too?

bgol fam will crack up because they know the history behind it.

 

[GhostWriter]

Drama definitely but you can earn your bones if you can write intelligent comedy

 

[WhenTheGoingGetsTtuff]

Can't write comedic scenes for shit, drama suspense. Fine. Comedy? Nope. I'm about to ask a comedy writer friend of mine for help.

 

[tallblacknyc]

wrote comedy skits b4 was always easy as shit to me.. juss look at these meme's on the internet u could have 1 subject and tell a diff joke thousands of times on the same situation and it be funny..also comedy is cheaper to make cause dialogue is sometimes all u need to get the point across..hell u could damn near turn anything into comedy even death

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

wrote comedy skits b4 was always easy as shit to me.. juss look at these meme's on the internet u could have 1 subject and tell a diff joke thousands of times on the same situation and it be funny..also comedy is cheaper to make cause dialogue is sometimes all u need to get the point across..hell u could damn near turn anything into comedy even death

they're the same. drama is cheap too, mood and atmosphere and tension through the words as well

action is the one with the big budget. shit gotta blow up, somebody gotta pay.

 

[tallblacknyc]

they're the same. drama is cheap too, mood and atmosphere and tension through the words as well

action is the one with the big budget. shit gotta blow up, somebody gotta pay.

i kno drama can be cheap but i'm saying comedy is pretty cheap and easy to make.. u could damn near wing it with comedy hell that's what improv is all about

 

[geechiedan]

Comedy is pretty much based on your own sense of humor. dave chappelle likes to do observational humor liberally sprinkled with toilet humor (poop and fart jokes: Diamonds make my dookie twinkle baby..) And the one movie he wrote was based on what...weed thats the gamut of his sense humor.


look at any comedy movie writers body of work and you'll see the type of person and humor they like

The Wayans
Chris Rock
Kevin Smith
Judd Apatow

You find your rhythm in your sense of humor and let it flow from there.

I'm doing my own version of those everything wrong with movies comedies using flicks I liked...some got it and thought it was funny some didn't.

The comedy thing i've done thats gotten the biggest response so far was this



thumbs up-409 thumbs down-16

just thought it up and did it...

My advise...just do it

 

[geechiedan]

And from a Black writing side:
That is why I am wondering why is it so hard to write a straight drama from a Black perspective and not have a crime element to it?

answer this: whats drama from a black perspective in the first place?? describe that?

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

i kno drama can be cheap but i'm saying comedy is pretty cheap and easy to make.. u could damn near wing it with comedy hell that's what improv is all about

yea i get you

 

[Black Radical]

Drama is easier.

Tension is tension. Adversity is adversity. Conflict is conflict.

Comedy on the other hand is incredibly subjective and nuanced.

Took the words out of my mouth. Drama is by definition easier. Easy to set up conflict, 2 people with opposing motivations. But even a comedic use an fall short. c

 

[Jay_from_dade]

answer this: whats drama from a black perspective in the first place?? describe that?

There is none, human beings generally go through the same thing, Black people have more experience with poverty and racism, so there is that. The black experience.

The problem is that White people and now conditioned black people think that the only drama black people have going on deals in violence, drugs, rap music, and disrespect of our women. *Cough* EMPIRE. We are waaay more diverse than what the media portrays us on TV.

Im sure there is alot of talented writers out there and have truly original dramatic stories, but we wont see them because corporations like fox rather have the ladder.

And any independent financier plans on making money so they want what they can sell, which would be more nigga shit.

 

[godofwine]

For me its easier to write drama. Making someone cry or sad is easy. Making them laugh is hard because people find so many different things either funny or not funny.

Example: Hannibal Burrus "Apple Juice" joke had me crying Laughing.

Nothing Kevin Heart says is remotely funny to me.

Drama is easier, but what's hard for me is the babble. I don't add enough meat and potatoes. I was reading a book by George Pelecanos, Shame the Devil, and I was just damn, all the extra shit. Most of you have read my short stories. A novel is much harder because there are so many more details than simple narration. I have to add more fluff

 

[Jay_from_dade]

Drama is easier, but what's hard for me is the babble. I don't add enough meat and potatoes. I was reading a book by George Pelecanos, Shame the Devil, and I was just damn, all the extra shit. Most of you have read my short stories. A novel is much harder because there are so many more details than simple narration. I have to add more fluff

I learned a lot from Quintin Tarantino. He basically takes regular conversations Im sure he has had and infuses them into his characters. I.E. Reservoir Dogs "Madonna Virgin" Debate. And Pulp Fiction " $5 milk shake".

They both could just be internal debates he had with with self, but if you take two or more people and give them the affirmative and negative of your own argument, you just gave them character development.

I hated writing fluff or Like I call it bullshit as well. I thought That his method was a great way of getting around it.


A great example in Black Drama Writing is on "Being Mary Jane".

Relate able topics, alot of them are just "dinner conversations" of today's issues.

Plus the show has stole the best elements from better shows. Which is a good thing iN its case since its on BET.

 

[largebillsonlyplease]

lets write a scene

 

[geechiedan]

I learned a lot from Quintin Tarantino. He basically takes regular conversations Im sure he has had and infuses them into his characters. I.E. Reservoir Dogs "Madonna Virgin" Debate. And Pulp Fiction " $5 milk shake".

They both could just be internal debates he had with with self, but if you take two or more people and give them the affirmative and negative of your own argument, you just gave them character development.

I hated writing fluff or Like I call it bullshit as well. I thought That his method was a great way of getting around it.

You gotta be careful with QT's style tho..after reservior dogs and pulp fiction EVERY up and comer started doing that and it fell flat..you could tell they were just ripping his style.

Brad Pitts flick Killing Them Softly did it with this scene


sam jackson talked about that in a roundabout way:



@ 22:00 in he's talking about how bad Brad Pitts flick Killing Them Softly was...

He was basically saying they were trying to be like a tarantino film but couldn't pull it off...

and you know what...he was right..

 

[geechiedan]

There is none, human beings generally go through the same thing, Black people have more experience with poverty and racism, so there is that. The black experience.

The problem is that White people and now conditioned black people think that the only drama black people have going on deals in violence, drugs, rap music, and disrespect of our women. *Cough* EMPIRE. We are waaay more diverse than what the media portrays us on TV.

Im sure there is alot of talented writers out there and have truly original dramatic stories, but we wont see them because corporations like fox rather have the ladder.

And any independent financier plans on making money so they want what they can sell, which would be more nigga shit.

violence, drugs, rap/rock music, and disrespect of women...thats not black shit thats HUMAN shit. Thats where the drama is

thats Game of Thrones, Sons Of Anarchy, House of Lies, Madmen, Breaking Bad, Law and Order etc etc

dysfunction, issues, backbiting, cut throat this is the stuff of shakespeare we call it classic. Lee Daniels does it and we call it trash....why?

 

[grownazzblakman]

Drama is easier.

Tension is tension. Adversity is adversity. Conflict is conflict.

Comedy on the other hand is incredibly subjective and nuanced.

^^ Agreed.

Allow me to add....

When it comes to drama & comedy:

As the saying goes... "you can’t fake funny".

Writing Comedy is EASIER if a writer is 'naturally funny' to begin with.
That's why stand-up comedians make such good 'comedy writers'.

I think good 'comedy writers' can also write drama... because most (have a good sense of 'timing' and) know when it's time to 'get serious' and when it's time to be 'humorous'.

Bear in mind, that Comedy audiences NEED TO LAUGH..... IMMEDIATELY.

So Comedy writers MUST 'get to the funny' very, very quickly.... or they will lose their audience before they ever really 'get going'.

Whereas 'drama-seeking' audiences have a built-in 'waiting mechanism' that affords a dramatic writer MORE TIME to flesh-out characters, or unveil story arcs & build suspense before the ultimate climax takes place for the big payoff.

Dramatic writers can sorta take their time... to explain things carefully... before the audience 'tunes out' for good.

Sometimes good 'dramatic writers' might not be able to keep a purely 'comedy-seeking' audience entertained for a long duration of time.

Someone who can write top-notch 'dramatic scenes' really well might not be able to write a few (2-HOUR) Comedy movies, or a 1/2 hour sit-com on a weekly basis (and keep it going for a WHOLE season of 'top-notch' hilarity ).

The 'best of both worlds' is a great writer 'who is just happens to be hilarious' (period)... who can probably give you a nice 'balance' between the two.

Drama takes awhile. It's a slow simmer. (So people are accustomed to waiting for it 'to build up'.)
But comedy is quick. Instant gratification. (Be funny. Right now. Or you might lose my attention shortly.)

A drama writer has maybe 15-22 minutes to grab someone's attention & keep them around to watch more. (People will stick around just long enough to figure out the plot / characters & decide if they like the story.)

But a comedy writer only has roughly 3-7 minutes to make someone laugh & keep them around to watch more. (Cuz people will ‘tune out’ real quick if they are not laughing.)

 

[geechiedan]

Drama is easier, but what's hard for me is the babble. I don't add enough meat and potatoes. I was reading a book by George Pelecanos, Shame the Devil, and I was just damn, all the extra shit. Most of you have read my short stories. A novel is much harder because there are so many more details than simple narration. I have to add more fluff

I have the same issue and I think the issue is basically you don't care about the other characters. All we're interested in is the protag and antag cuz thats were the juicy stuff is but supporting characters aren't as interesting so when its time for them to talk we're not listening to what they have to say cuz we don't care as much about them which makes it a chore to write their dialog. We gotta start caring and finding interesting things in the supporting characters.

 

[Jay_from_dade]

violence, drugs, rap/rock music, and disrespect of women...thats not black shit thats HUMAN shit. Thats where the drama is

thats Game of Thrones, Sons Of Anarchy, House of Lies, Madmen, Breaking Bad, Law and Order etc etc

dysfunction, issues, backbiting, cut throat this is the stuff of shakespeare we call it classic. Lee Daniels does it and we call it trash....why?

ONLY problem is white people have balance, black people dont.

 

[geechiedan]

ONLY problem is white people have balance, black people dont.

The only problem is black folk don't own a network or a distribution system.

 

[raze]

thanks to both you brothers for responding.

I was actually thinking about ya'll specifically when I asked this question.

To me comedy is so damn subjective.

oddly I don't find Kevin Hart funny either but look at his following.

I I had a writing discussion with you all in the past about tone and having a 'voice' when you right.

When I read Bills stuff is voice to me is so distinctive I can actually HEAR his writing. And when he is being satirical or sarcastic I can hear it.

And I think Jay got that too because of his ability to write from different perspectives and if the CHARACTER is funny he can write it is funny.

And from a Black writing side:
That is why I am wondering why is it so hard to write a straight drama from a Black perspective and not have a crime element to it?

And not the EXTREME of a precious or monster's ball.

The Wire had humor (it was never FUNNY) but it had lighter moments.

And I think all good drama moments needs that balance.

But it just seems tragedy and pain (which ironically good COMEDY is based) drama is EASIER to write or at least begin with then comedy to me at least.

It's not about difficulty. There's probably a mile-high pile of great drama scripts from Black writers that don't involve crime, but many producers would rather go with something they can cheaply make and easily sell: catchy title, hero mean muggin' the camera, gun(s) prominently displayed and scantily clad, big booty/titty chick(s) somewhere in the background. It's like catnip for most males (of all races) under 25. That male audience is less likely to be interested in an uplifting story about the first Black astronaut. By the time our taste improves to see the shittiness of what purports to be entertainment, the younger generation has taken our spot and the cycle repeats.

There are always going to be more cats more interested in watching the latest Kevin Hart flick over something like the next Precious. Just like people who'll fill up theaters for the new Melissa McCarthy film over something from Julianne Moore. For the most part, people want to forget about their problems with a good laugh. Black sitcoms outnumber Black dramas on television probably because they're cheaper to produce.

Writing comedy can be deceptively difficult for people who are funny in the real life. They think they can just transfer it to the page. Coming up with a snappy one-liner or skit is one thing, but fitting a bunch of them into a cohesive story requires a completely different skill set.

I don't write straight drama, nor would I consider myself a comedian by any stretch of the imagination. My stuff always has some kind of sci-fi, fantasy, or horror element going on. But I'm pretty good at inserting comedic and dramatic moments.

 

[raze]

I have the same issue and I think the issue is basically you don't care about the other characters. All we're interested in is the protag and antag cuz thats were the juicy stuff is but supporting characters aren't as interesting so when its time for them to talk we're not listening to what they have to say cuz we don't care as much about them which makes it a chore to write their dialog. We gotta start caring and finding interesting things in the supporting characters.

Make your supporting characters think they're the hero of the story. They'll automatically become more interesting.

 

[geechiedan]

Make your supporting characters think they're the hero of the story. They'll automatically become more interesting.

 

[grownazzblakman]

Make your supporting characters think they're the hero of the story. They'll automatically become more interesting.

Salute. Well said.

The funny part is... this INSTANTLY made me think about Game of Thrones.

Shhheeeeiiiittt.... George RR Martin must do exactly this.... because every man, woman & child on that show be running around... 'acting like they are THE ONE".

 

[godofwine]

First off, that Samuel L Jackson interview was damned good, and a great find. Damn that dude is interesting. I ended up watching the whole thing, though I saw a snippet of it before.

Drama is easier, but what's hard for me is the babble. I don't add enough meat and potatoes. I was reading a book by George Pelecanos, Shame the Devil, and I was just damn, all the extra shit. Most of you have read my short stories. A novel is much harder because there are so many more details than simple narration. I have to add more fluff

I learned a lot from Quintin Tarantino. He basically takes regular conversations Im sure he has had and infuses them into his characters. I.E. Reservoir Dogs "Madonna Virgin" Debate. And Pulp Fiction " $5 milk shake".

They both could just be internal debates he had with with self, but if you take two or more people and give them the affirmative and negative of your own argument, you just gave them character development.

I hated writing fluff or Like I call it bullshit as well. I thought That his method was a great way of getting around it.


A great example in Black Drama Writing is on "Being Mary Jane".

Relate able topics, alot of them are just "dinner conversations" of today's issues.

Plus the show has stole the best elements from better shows. Which is a good thing iN its case since its on BET.

I did this with a couple of cop who are chasing my protagonist at the scene of the crime. The way they go back and forth in the car on the way and at the scene is like that.

I have the same issue and I think the issue is basically you don't care about the other characters. All we're interested in is the protag and antag cuz thats were the juicy stuff is but supporting characters aren't as interesting so when its time for them to talk we're not listening to what they have to say cuz we don't care as much about them which makes it a chore to write their dialog. We gotta start caring and finding interesting things in the supporting characters.

I shouldn't have called it fluff, more like background stuff behind "the Last Supper." The shelves, the wall of the church, the food on the table, the detail, color, and shadow work on the clothing. There is more than just Jesus at the table

Example:

protagonist leaves work, drives to a burger king to change clothes, drives to a bus station to "borrow" the car she needs to drive to the house where she stages the scene before the crime.

It isn't so much that I don't care about the character, but the shit before the story gets good and it is the onions and carrots of the stew and not the meat.

I want to get to the meat where she offs the guy, or at least where she preps the scene of the crime. I've done a lot of short stories and you can skip this in short stories and get right to the meat, or even say that, "where she placed the wire yesterday" and skip even that part of the prep work.

I've got characters that people care about, will care about because the story is that deep. I just have to slow down and fill it in.

 

[godofwine]

Make your supporting characters think they're the hero of the story. They'll automatically become more interesting.

Salute. Well said.

The funny part is... this INSTANTLY made me think about Game of Thrones.

Shhheeeeiiiittt.... George RR Martin must do exactly this.... because every man, woman & child on that show be running around... 'acting like they are THE ONE".

Not just George R.R. Martin, but Elmore Leonard as well and the writers of Justified. From Boyd, to Ava, to Dickey, to Dewey - they all ran their lil fucked up show within the show and it made for nice drama. The best part about that show is Raylan shares his screen time willingly...unlike some actors who have to be center screen every time.

 

[MonkeyBizness]

The struggle in doing drama is to avoid clichés and getting your audience invested in the characters.

Finding new ways of creating tension, showing adversity and the struggle to overcome them is where most dramas trip up.

Ultimately, if no one gives a shit or is invested in the characters, everything else is irrelevant.

 

[geechiedan]

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