White Male Privilege Rebuttal Construction Thread

largebillsonlyplease

Large
BGOL Legend
Mod can we get a sticky of this? You can take my other thread down, this is more important.

First. If you haven't viewed the thread that is spawning this, it is right here. http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=793766

Now we all know that this is bullshit. But saying it's bullshit is not enough. We need our black voices represented in the discussion. So rather than just gripe and make valid points here. Let's construct a rebuttal to his paper. Section by section.

I propose that we assign paragraphs, parts or topics to members who will independently tackle those and write a rebuttal. After the components are together we'll put it together, proof of course and finalize and then release it as an official response. we can just sign it- collaborative black voices or something to that effect.

Let's stop talking about it and be about it.

The essay

Tal Fortgang May 2, 2014

1. lbop Behind every success, large or small, there is a story, and it isn’t always told by sex or skin color.

There is a phrase that floats around college campuses, Princeton being no exception, that threatens to strike down opinions without regard for their merits, but rather solely on the basis of the person that voiced them. “Check your privilege,” the saying goes, and I have been reprimanded by it several times this year. The phrase, handed down by my moral superiors, descends recklessly, like an Obama-sanctioned drone, and aims laser-like at my pinkish-peach complexion, my maleness, and the nerve I displayed in offering an opinion rooted in a personal Weltanschauung. “Check your privilege,” they tell me in a command that teeters between an imposition to actually explore how I got where I am, and a reminder that I ought to feel personally apologetic because white males seem to pull most of the strings in the world.

2.big tex I do not accuse those who “check” me and my perspective of overt racism, although the phrase, which assumes that simply because I belong to a certain ethnic group I should be judged collectively with it, toes that line. But I do condemn them for diminishing everything I have personally accomplished, all the hard work I have done in my life, and for ascribing all the fruit I reap not to the seeds I sow but to some invisible patron saint of white maleness who places it out for me before I even arrive. Furthermore, I condemn them for casting the equal protection clause, indeed the very idea of a meritocracy, as a myth, and for declaring that we are all governed by invisible forces (some would call them “stigmas” or “societal norms”), that our nation runs on racist and sexist conspiracies. Forget “you didn’t build that;” check your privilege and realize that nothing you have accomplished is real.

But they can’t be telling me that everything I’ve done with my life can be credited to the racist patriarchy holding my hand throughout my years of education and eventually guiding me into Princeton. Even that is too extreme. So to find out what they are saying, I decided to take their advice. I actually went and checked the origins of my privileged existence, to empathize with those whose underdog stories I can’t possibly comprehend. I have unearthed some examples of the privilege with which my family was blessed, and now I think I better understand those who assure me that skin color allowed my family and I to flourish today.

3 spiderman Perhaps it’s the privilege my grandfather and his brother had to flee their home as teenagers when the Nazis invaded Poland, leaving their mother and five younger siblings behind, running and running until they reached a Displaced Persons camp in Siberia, where they would do years of hard labor in the bitter cold until World War II ended. Maybe it was the privilege my grandfather had of taking on the local Rabbi’s work in that DP camp, telling him that the spiritual leader shouldn’t do hard work, but should save his energy to pass Jewish tradition along to those who might survive. Perhaps it was the privilege my great-grandmother and those five great-aunts and uncles I never knew had of being shot into an open grave outside their hometown. Maybe that’s my privilege.

Or maybe it’s the privilege my grandmother had of spending weeks upon weeks on a death march through Polish forests in subzero temperatures, one of just a handful to survive, only to be put in Bergen-Belsen concentration camp where she would have died but for the Allied forces who liberated her and helped her regain her health when her weight dwindled to barely 80 pounds.

4. Done anonymously Perhaps my privilege is that those two resilient individuals came to America with no money and no English, obtained citizenship, learned the language and met each other; that my grandfather started a humble wicker basket business with nothing but long hours, an idea, and an iron will—to paraphrase the man I never met: “I escaped Hitler. Some business troubles are going to ruin me?” Maybe my privilege is that they worked hard enough to raise four children, and to send them to Jewish day school and eventually City College.

Perhaps it was my privilege that my own father worked hard enough in City College to earn a spot at a top graduate school, got a good job, and for 25 years got up well before the crack of dawn, sacrificing precious time he wanted to spend with those he valued most—his wife and kids—to earn that living. I can say with certainty there was no legacy involved in any of his accomplishments. The wicker business just isn’t that influential. Now would you say that we’ve been really privileged? That our success has been gift-wrapped?

5. older version That’s the problem with calling someone out for the “privilege” which you assume has defined their narrative. You don’t know what their struggles have been, what they may have gone through to be where they are. Assuming they’ve benefitted from “power systems” or other conspiratorial imaginary institutions denies them credit for all they’ve done, things of which you may not even conceive. You don’t know whose father died defending your freedom. You don’t know whose mother escaped oppression. You don’t know who conquered their demons, or may still conquering them now.

6. Assigned to eewwllThe truth is, though, that I have been exceptionally privileged in my life, albeit not in the way any detractors would have it.
It has been my distinct privilege that my grandparents came to America. First, that there was a place at all that would take them from the ruins of Europe. And second, that such a place was one where they could legally enter, learn the language, and acclimate to a society that ultimately allowed them to flourish.

It was their privilege to come to a country that grants equal protection under the law to its citizens, that cares not about religion or race, but the content of your character.

It was my privilege that my grandfather was blessed with resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, and that he was lucky enough to come to the place where he could realize the dream of giving his children a better life than he had.

7. godofwineBut far more important for me than his attributes was the legacy he sought to pass along, which forms the basis of what detractors call my “privilege,” but which actually should be praised as one of altruism and self-sacrifice. Those who came before us suffered for the sake of giving us a better life. When we similarly sacrifice for our descendents by caring for the planet, it’s called “environmentalism,” and is applauded. But when we do it by passing along property and a set of values, it’s called “privilege.” (And when we do it by raising questions about our crippling national debt, we’re called Tea Party radicals.) Such sacrifice of any form shouldn’t be scorned, but admired.

My exploration did yield some results. I recognize that it was my parents’ privilege and now my own that there is such a thing as an American dream which is attainable even for a penniless Jewish immigrant.

8. GENEI am privileged that values like faith and education were passed along to me. My grandparents played an active role in my parents’ education, and some of my earliest memories included learning the Hebrew alphabet with my Dad. It’s been made clear to me that education begins in the home, and the importance of parents’ involvement with their kids’ education—from mathematics to morality—cannot be overstated. It’s not a matter of white or black, male or female or any other division which we seek, but a matter of the values we pass along, the legacy we leave, that perpetuates “privilege.” And there’s nothing wrong with that.

9. kayaBehind every success, large or small, there is a story, and it isn’t always told by sex or skin color. My appearance certainly doesn’t tell the whole story, and to assume that it does and that I should apologize for it is insulting. While I haven’t done everything for myself up to this point in my life, someone sacrificed themselves so that I can lead a better life. But that is a legacy I am proud of.

I have checked my privilege. And I apologize for nothing.


There are 9 sections. You can take 1 or more than 1 depending on the flow and your availability.

Simply state which section(s) you want to tackle and post it. I will update it in the OP as we fill this thing up.

Let's do this.

Eewwll assigned section 6.
 
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Can I get these?

(btw. you should number them to so that you can assign numbers to people)

the truth is, though, that I have been exceptionally privileged in my life, albeit not in the way any detractors would have it.
It has been my distinct privilege that my grandparents came to America. First, that there was a place at all that would take them from the ruins of Europe. And second, that such a place was one where they could legally enter, learn the language, and acclimate to a society that ultimately allowed them to flourish.

It was their privilege to come to a country that grants equal protection under the law to its citizens, that cares not about religion or race, but the content of your character.

It was my privilege that my grandfather was blessed with resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, and that he was lucky enough to come to the place where he could realize the dream of giving his children a better life than he had.
 
I skimmed it and got the gist. He is saying that he had no advantage in the US because of his road and his families road. That said, he is incorrect. I have ALOT of African Immigrant friends. From all different countries on the continent(Mainly Nigerian,Ethiopian,and Eritrean).Most of them came here dirt poor and barely spoke the language.Many of them had parents who fought in the Eritrean-Ethiopian war that just ended in the 90's.Many of them grew up in the same inner city areas as Blacks and went to the same substandard schools as us. That said, they overwhelmingly have achieved more than us in education and in careers. Why is that? I've thought about this alot and came to the realization that its because they don't self identify with the images that our media floods us with. Like the author of that article, they KNOW their rich history. Their parents KNOW their rich history. What do we know? We aren't taught our history in schools and we really don't know what country/region our history is from.The history that we are taught is that we were defeated slaves. That's the foundation that we are taught.Then on that foundation, we are assaulted with images of us being criminals,ignorant,belligerent,homosexual, and low achieving.When you perceive the bulk of the people that look like you to fit these categories,then its only natural that you will expect yourself to fit them.African Immigrants and their first generation children don't self identify with those images and portrayals and are far more successful.

BTW..this is pure anecdotal because articles about the success of African immigrants are very rare. I remember in the 90's we were flooded with the media calling Asians the "model minority". Yet we rarely hear about how Nigerians have been the top achieving ethnic group in the medical field.Unlike the author,positive achievements within our race are suppressed.
 
Can I get these?

(btw. you should number them to so that you can assign numbers to people)

the truth is, though, that I have been exceptionally privileged in my life, albeit not in the way any detractors would have it.
It has been my distinct privilege that my grandparents came to America. First, that there was a place at all that would take them from the ruins of Europe. And second, that such a place was one where they could legally enter, learn the language, and acclimate to a society that ultimately allowed them to flourish.

It was their privilege to come to a country that grants equal protection under the law to its citizens, that cares not about religion or race, but the content of your character.

It was my privilege that my grandfather was blessed with resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, and that he was lucky enough to come to the place where he could realize the dream of giving his children a better life than he had.

yes, about to number them now as well.
 
One question to this dude that will destroy him.


Why did your parents send you to Jewish school?


:hmm::hmm::hmm:


Perhaps my privilege is that those two resilient individuals came to America with no money and no English, obtained citizenship, learned the language and met each other; that my grandfather started a humble wicker basket business with nothing but long hours, an idea, and an iron will—to paraphrase the man I never met: “I escaped Hitler. Some business troubles are going to ruin me?” Maybe my privilege is that they worked hard enough to raise four children, and to send them to Jewish day school and eventually City College.



They sent him to Jewish school to strengthen his sense of identity.

That in turn, like fertilizer, sets the stage for his achievements.


What about black identity?

What has been done for 400 years to destroy it?

Is that impact not going to be considered?


So we are all running a race, he with shoes, we without shoes

does that invalidate how hard you ran?

No


But he doesn't give a fuck about uneven playing fields.

And that is being complicit in racism, the system that preserves outcomes based on race.



So fuck that dude.

He is baby weight.


Give me some stronger shit


:smh:
 
I think it's important to have this ready today.

Here is my response (this is my first draft). I could work on it some more later.

<6. Assigned to eewwllThe truth is, though, that I have been exceptionally privileged in my life, albeit not in the way any detractors would have it.
It has been my distinct privilege that my grandparents came to America.

The very truth of the matter is that your entire existence in this country is based on privilege. The U.S. government (along with other western governments) legislated the type of immigrants they wanted. If your grandparents had been Haitians, for instance, you likely wouldn't even be in this country. Either you're intellectually bankrupt on this point or being extremely disingenuous. Take a look at the history of laws concerning immigration and naturalization in the United States if you would like to educate yourself. Your parents were privileged to fit the desired profile.



First, that there was a place at all that would take them from the ruins of Europe. And second, that such a place was one where they could legally enter, learn the language, and acclimate to a society that ultimately allowed them to flourish.

Yes. Your grandparents ,as privileged whites from Europe, were allowed to enter a place where other whites from Europe had successfully pillaged and built on the back of slave labor. Surely that had nothing to do with your parents ability to rise from the ashes of war-torn Europe. Certainly, if your grandparents were blacks from Senegal, they would have been afforded the same opportunities. Surely.





It was their privilege to come to a country that grants equal protection under the law to its citizens, that cares not about religion or race, but the content of your character.


I'm not even sure where to start with this statement. You're praising a country for offering equal protection by law to its citizens during a time where certain citizens, indeed, did not have equal protection by law. Only your white male privileged soul would allow you to vomit such profound contradictions into the air in such a proud way. Surely, you are aware that, when your parents came to this country, only a specific subsector of society was even allowed to enter a voting booth (amongst a plethoa of other things?)


It was my privilege that my grandfather was blessed with resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, and that he was lucky enough to come to the place where he could realize the dream of giving his children a better life than he had.
>

While your grandparents were building their business, they may have taken the time to read about the Tulsa race riots that destroyed a vibrtant black community dubbed "The Black Wall Street". Those destroyed communities didn't have resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, huh? They were just unlucky to be born in a place where their own government sanctioned viligante attacks on their communities.
 
Large.. which ones are you taking? If you don't get more people in 3-4 hours, I'll take another paragraph later.
 
One question to this dude that will destroy him...

I swear to WHITE JESUS with blond hair and blues eyes if you don't take a paragraph :angry::angry:

:lol::lol:

I don't know why, but the first thing I thought about was the movie Dead Presidents, the scene with Kirby and Cleon at the table discussing the money.

Cleon "This is wrong. Im not going to take the money..."

Kirby: Man if you don't...

Cleon: "No, no. I'll take the money

this is a good idea though. Let me look it over once more and I will pick a paragraph too
 
My contribution #4 :


"First, that there was a place at all that would take them from the ruins of Europe. And second, that such a place was one where they could legally enter, learn the language, and acclimate to a society that ultimately allowed them to flourish."

Unfortunately, during that very same time, other groups were not "allowed" to flourish.
Examples:
FBI's illegal COINTELPRO operation http://www.pbs.org/now/politics/cointelpro.html
Eq
The need for Civil Rights legislation
The need for a federal agency called Equal Employment Opportunity Commission
Equal work, equal pay legislation which we are still struggling with, the status quo being white males.
Don't ask, Don't Tell legislation

The fact that there are African Americans who migrate to Germany and flourish do NOT invalidate the existence of systematic programs that existed to destroy Jews and surely does not place blame on those Jews who failed to flourish in Germany today.




"Maybe my privilege is that they worked hard enough to raise four children, and to send them to Jewish day school and eventually City College."


You said earlier "acclimate to a society", yet your parents chose for you to attend a Jewish school.
Why?
Shouldn't you have attended an American school? Learn't American values?
Is there something wrong with American schools? The same schools African Americans, Hispanics and Asians attend?

What exists in Jewish schools that you could not get from an American school?


End of contribution



Thoughts;

Our arguments should be broad enough that it covers systematic discrimination of several groups since he is painting utopia for everyone.

It's easy to talk shit about AA but not so easy to do for groups like women and gays, he bites and it's all over


:lol:
 
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I'm comin in, don't know where to begin but soon as I can sit to think I'll chime in

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk
 
I skimmed it and got the gist. He is saying that he had no advantage in the US because of his road and his families road. That said, he is incorrect. I have ALOT of African Immigrant friends. From all different countries on the continent(Mainly Nigerian,Ethiopian,and Eritrean).Most of them came here dirt poor and barely spoke the language.Many of them had parents who fought in the Eritrean-Ethiopian war that just ended in the 90's.Many of them grew up in the same inner city areas as Blacks and went to the same substandard schools as us. That said, they overwhelmingly have achieved more than us in education and in careers. Why is that? I've thought about this alot and came to the realization that its because they don't self identify with the images that our media floods us with. Like the author of that article, they KNOW their rich history. Their parents KNOW their rich history. What do we know? We aren't taught our history in schools and we really don't know what country/region our history is from.The history that we are taught is that we were defeated slaves. That's the foundation that we are taught.Then on that foundation, we are assaulted with images of us being criminals,ignorant,belligerent,homosexual, and low achieving.When you perceive the bulk of the people that look like you to fit these categories,then its only natural that you will expect yourself to fit them.African Immigrants and their first generation children don't self identify with those images and portrayals and are far more successful.

BTW..this is pure anecdotal because articles about the success of African immigrants are very rare. I remember in the 90's we were flooded with the media calling Asians the "model minority". Yet we rarely hear about how Nigerians have been the top achieving ethnic group in the medical field.Unlike the author,positive achievements within our race are suppressed.

:yes::yes:

Real Spit...I often use this argument myself.
 
I skimmed it and got the gist. He is saying that he had no advantage in the US because of his road and his families road. That said, he is incorrect. I have ALOT of African Immigrant friends. From all different countries on the continent(Mainly Nigerian,Ethiopian,and Eritrean).Most of them came here dirt poor and barely spoke the language.Many of them had parents who fought in the Eritrean-Ethiopian war that just ended in the 90's.Many of them grew up in the same inner city areas as Blacks and went to the same substandard schools as us. That said, they overwhelmingly have achieved more than us in education and in careers. Why is that? I've thought about this alot and came to the realization that its because they don't self identify with the images that our media floods us with. Like the author of that article, they KNOW their rich history. Their parents KNOW their rich history. What do we know? We aren't taught our history in schools and we really don't know what country/region our history is from.The history that we are taught is that we were defeated slaves. That's the foundation that we are taught.Then on that foundation, we are assaulted with images of us being criminals,ignorant,belligerent,homosexual, and low achieving.When you perceive the bulk of the people that look like you to fit these categories,then its only natural that you will expect yourself to fit them.African Immigrants and their first generation children don't self identify with those images and portrayals and are far more successful.

BTW..this is pure anecdotal because articles about the success of African immigrants are very rare. I remember in the 90's we were flooded with the media calling Asians the "model minority". Yet we rarely hear about how Nigerians have been the top achieving ethnic group in the medical field.Unlike the author,positive achievements within our race are suppressed.

Yes. Address revisionist history. Taking the word "n*gger" out of Huck Finn to soften the harsh reality that white people are terrible and slavery was horrific. They don't read the Willie Lynch papers in history class, they don't read about Derby's dose...we have become what was written in 1984. History changed through writings, and keeping the truth hidden. A half truth is still half a lie.
 
Large.. which ones are you taking? If you don't get more people in 3-4 hours, I'll take another paragraph later.

Im batting cleanup basically. I want people to do the ones they're passionate about, I'm passionate about them all so whichever ones aren't taken I'll gladly do to tie complete it. I do agree we should have it ready tonight my time and then have a course of action of spreading it around social media tomorrow.


Whichever section people take please say the number so i can edit the op and put your name there so anyone viewing can understand that part is taken.
 
Im batting cleanup basically. I want people to do the ones they're passionate about, I'm passionate about them all so whichever ones aren't taken I'll gladly do to tie complete it. I do agree we should have it ready tonight my time and then have a course of action of spreading it around social media tomorrow.


Whichever section people take please say the number so i can edit the op and put your name there so anyone viewing can understand that part is taken.

Just a suggestion. You should take the opening paragragh, final paragraph, and the final editing.

That's just a suggestion though. And you should put your parts up as soon as possible.

Also. People are giving their responses without taking a specific paragraph. Get people to take ownership of a paragraph.
 
Just a suggestion. You should take the opening paragragh, final paragraph, and the final editing.

That's just a suggestion though. And you should put your parts up as soon as possible.

Also. People are giving their responses without taking a specific paragraph. Get people to take ownership of a paragraph.


You sounding like me on the job lol
 
I think it's important to have this ready today.

Here is my response (this is my first draft). I could work on it some more later.

<6. Assigned to eewwllThe truth is, though, that I have been exceptionally privileged in my life, albeit not in the way any detractors would have it.
It has been my distinct privilege that my grandparents came to America.

The very truth of the matter is that your entire existence in this country is based on privilege. The U.S. government (along with other western governments) legislated the type of immigrants they wanted. If your grandparents had been Haitians, for instance, you likely wouldn't even be in this country. Either you're intellectually bankrupt on this point or being extremely disingenuous. Take a look at the history of laws concerning immigration and naturalization in the United States if you would like to educate yourself. Your parents were privileged to fit the desired profile.



First, that there was a place at all that would take them from the ruins of Europe. And second, that such a place was one where they could legally enter, learn the language, and acclimate to a society that ultimately allowed them to flourish.

Yes. Your grandparents ,as privileged whites from Europe, were allowed to enter a place where other whites from Europe had successfully pillaged and built on the back of slave labor. Surely that had nothing to do with your parents ability to rise from the ashes of war-torn Europe. Certainly, if your grandparents were blacks from Senegal, they would have been afforded the same opportunities. Surely.





It was their privilege to come to a country that grants equal protection under the law to its citizens, that cares not about religion or race, but the content of your character.


I'm not even sure where to start with this statement. You're praising a country for offering equal protection by law to its citizens during a time where certain citizens, indeed, did not have equal protection by law. Only your white male privileged soul would allow you to vomit such profound contradictions into the air in such a proud way. Surely, you are aware that, when your parents came to this country, only a specific subsector of society was even allowed to enter a voting booth (amongst a plethoa of other things?)


It was my privilege that my grandfather was blessed with resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, and that he was lucky enough to come to the place where he could realize the dream of giving his children a better life than he had.
>

While your grandparents were building their business, they may have taken the time to read about the Tulsa race riots that destroyed a vibrtant black community dubbed "The Black Wall Street". Those destroyed communities didn't have resolve and an entrepreneurial spirit, huh? They were just unlucky to be born in a place where their own government sanctioned viligante attacks on their communities.
rating_5.gif
 
7.But far more important for me than his attributes was the legacy he sought to pass along, which forms the basis of what detractors call my “privilege,” but which actually should be praised as one of altruism and self-sacrifice. Those who came before us suffered for the sake of giving us a better life. When we similarly sacrifice for our descendents by caring for the planet, it’s called “environmentalism,” and is applauded. But when we do it by passing along property and a set of values, it’s called “privilege.” (And when we do it by raising questions about our crippling national debt, we’re called Tea Party radicals.) Such sacrifice of any form shouldn’t be scorned, but admired.

My exploration did yield some results. I recognize that it was my parents’ privilege and now my own that there is such a thing as an American dream which is attainable even for a penniless Jewish immigrant.

Jews always talk about the holocaust and their ancestors' struggles within and afterward and compare their successes to Black people and the lack thereof. I am not diminishing the destruction that the holocaust caused, but we are talking 12 years. Twelve years from when the first concentration camp was built in Dachau in 1933 until the end of the war in 1945.

Let's think about that. Twelve years. It seems like a long time, but is it really? Maybe, but that depends what you compare it to. Yesterday Charles Ramsey was being interviewed about his book "Dead Giveaway," about his side of the story when he helped free those three girls Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus, & Michelle Knight. For 10 years they were in what amounts to a concentration camp, held as slaves, and still that doesn't even equal 5% of the time that slavery existed and was legally practiced in America.

For 246 years, from when slaves where first brought here by the Dutch in 1619, until the ending of the Civil War in 1865 - and more than that if you consider that many slaves didn't find out that they were indeed free for a number of years after the end of the Civil War. When you compare the 12 years of the holocaust to the 246 years of slavery then their 12 years is an absurdly meek comparison. If a generation is 20 years then their 12 is half of that and slavery is more than 12 times that. Substantially more can be lost in 246 years that can in 12.

Jews have the benefit of being able to blend in. My eye is far from trained and I cannot look into a room of White people and spot the Jewish, but one could look at a picture of the American Presidents and be able to spot President Obama with certainty. Some of the Italians changed their names from Rosetto to Rose allowing them to blend in, and some Jews did the same, but no amount of name changing could allow me or anyone in my family to slip into the community unnoticed and make our way. This man's grandfather may have come here penniless, but the world he walked into did not have laws forbidding him to learn nor prohibit anyone to teach him. The fact that he even knew his grandfather is a privilege that many slaves did not know, unless their "grandfather" was their own master, and being that, what legacy could one pass down?

Environmentalism? Privilege? Impossible when you are stolen and spend a lifetime in bondage in a world where it is forbidden for you to know anything but the basics which were your job and how to take care of the masters. The struggle of the Jewish peoples cannot compare to that of black people, and whatever they were able to pass down is a far cry from the pain, suffering and hopelessness that Black people had to pass down. The kid that brags that he made it even though he failed 11th grade does not compare under any circumstances to the child who wasn't allowed to go to school, but and neither could his parents, his grandfather or his grandfather before him.
 
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^^

Great response above.

We just need the following:

Two or three more people to take ownership on a paragraph

Large to drop his two paragraphs.
 
#7

Jews always talk about the holocaust, and I am not diminishing it at all but we are talking 12 years. Twelve years from when the first concentration camp was built in Dachau in 1933 until the end of the war in 1945.

Let's think about that. Twelve years. It seems like a long time, but is it really? Maybe, but that depends what you compare it to. Yesterday Charles Ramsey was being interviewed about his book "Dead Giveaway," about his side of the story when he helped free those three girls Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus, & Michelle Knight. For 10 years they were in what amounts to a concentration camp, held as slaves, and still that doesn't even equal 5% of the time that slavery existed and was legally practiced in America.

For 246 years, from when slaves where first brought here by the Dutch in 1619, until the ending of the Civil War in 1865 - and more than that if you consider that many slaves didn't find out that they were indeed free for a number of years after the end of the Civil War. When you compare the 12 years of the holocaust to the 246 years of slavery then their 12 years is an absurdly meek comparison. If a generation is 20 years then their 12 is half of that and slavery is more than 12 times that. Substantially more can be lost in 246 years that can in 12.

Jews have the benefit of being able to blend in. My eye is far from trained and I cannot look into a room of White people and spot the Jewish, but one could look at a picture of the American Presidents and be able to spot President Obama with certainty. Some of the Italians changed their names from Rosetto to Rose allowing them to blend in, and some Jews did the same, but no amount of name changing could allow me or anyone in my family to slip into the community unnoticed and make our way. This man's grandfather may have come here penniless, but the world he walked into did not have laws forbidding him to learn nor prohibit anyone to teach him. The fact that he even knew his grandfather is a privilege that many slaves did not know, unless their "grandfather" was their own master, and being that, what legacy could one pass down?

Environmentalism? Privilege? Impossible when you are stolen and spend a lifetime in bondage in a world where it is forbidden for you to know anything but the basics which were your job and how to take care of the masters.

The struggle of the Jewish peoples does not compare to that of black people, and whatever they were able to pass down is a far cry from the pain, suffering and hopelessness that Black people had to pass down. The kid that brags that he made it even though he failed 11th grade does not compare under any circumstances to the child who wasn't allowed to go to school, but and neither could his parents, his grandfather or his grandfather before him.

That's powerful man. When people bring up the holocaust for a pity party, they honestly don't consider the events that took place during the slavery were just as bad, if not worse. 12 years versus 246 years...both prison labor with limited food, the overseers could beat, kill, rape, or torture whenever they saw fit... Now I don't want to make that a, my history deserves more sympathy than your history point, but you can't deny the obvious...even when slavery ended, the disturbing waves it left in its wake continued to live on through Jim Crow laws.
 
9.Behind every success, large or small, there is a story, and it isn’t always told by sex or skin color. My appearance certainly doesn’t tell the whole story, and to assume that it does and that I should apologize for it is insulting. While I haven’t done everything for myself up to this point in my life, someone sacrificed themselves so that I can lead a better life. But that is a legacy I am proud of.


Response:
Racism is NOT about skin color just as feminism is NOT about moustaches.
Racism is about creating and preserving the gains of white privilege.

And you are right, someone did sacrifice themselves so that you could lead a better life.
Some of those people are overwhelmingly Africans brought to American that built this capitalistic society from which you benefit in ways we still can't.



:cool:
 
Jews always talk about the holocaust and their ancestors' struggles within and afterward and compare their successes to Black people and the lack thereof. I am not diminishing the destruction that the holocaust caused, but we are talking 12 years. Twelve years from when the first concentration camp was built in Dachau in 1933 until the end of the war in 1945.

^^^ GOW I think it might be worth mentioning the Nazis did a trial run of a holocaust on the Africans in Shark Island in the early 1900s. I think that'll help drive that point home :yes:

Just my $0.02
 
1. Behind every success, large or small, there is a story, and it isn’t always told by sex or skin color.

There is a phrase that floats around college campuses, Princeton being no exception, that threatens to strike down opinions without regard for their merits, but rather solely on the basis of the person that voiced them. “Check your privilege,” the saying goes, and I have been reprimanded by it several times this year. The phrase, handed down by my moral superiors, descends recklessly, like an Obama-sanctioned drone, and aims laser-like at my pinkish-peach complexion, my maleness, and the nerve I displayed in offering an opinion rooted in a personal Weltanschauung. “Check your privilege,” they tell me in a command that teeters between an imposition to actually explore how I got where I am, and a reminder that I ought to feel personally apologetic because white males seem to pull most of the strings in the world.

When a certain group of people manage to go through the gauntlet of life and come out Ok, their success story is always praised because of their sex or skin. With hundreds of years having passed, why is it a big deal whenever a person of color, a female, a person with a different sexual orientation, or all of the above accomplishes something? The answer is because that's not how the system we function in is designed to work.

There is a term that nobody says out loud but is spoken in the backrooms of all the important places in America. In the school admissions offices, in the human resource departments across the country. This was just a point of emphasis in the supreme court. The term is affirmative action. Affirmative action was put in place because without it, companies, schools, jobs and banks would strike down capable people without regard for their qualifications, but rather based solely on the complexion of their skin and the anatomy between their legs. Without actual legislation demanding inclusion, people without pinkish-peach complexions rarely got a fair shot across the board to prove their worth.

The world view of other cultures were not taken into consideration, they were dismissed. Either you are a part of the network or you're not. If you weren't it didn't matter how hard you worked, it just wasn't good enough. If you weren't in order to get practical ideas that could change lives considered, they had to be presented by someone with the same gender and hue as the men in power. Bars were intentionally raised and intentionally lowered by people in power to help one specific targeted group and hinder everyone else. White males overall conspired to keep pulling strings and control the distribution of opportunities so the U.S. Government had to step in and "Check your privilege".
 
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8......I am privileged that values like faith and education were passed along to me. My grandparents played an active role in my parents’ education, and some of my earliest memories included learning the Hebrew alphabet with my Dad. It’s been made clear to me that education begins in the home, and the importance of parents’ involvement with their kids’ education—from mathematics to morality—cannot be overstated. It’s not a matter of white or black, male or female or any other division which we seek, but a matter of the values we pass along, the legacy we leave, that perpetuates “privilege.” And there’s nothing wrong with that.

How can values be passed on if home isn't there? When home is destroyed? And when these things happen because of the color of your skin?

Let's go back to the Civil Rights Movement. A large success, no? But when the system removes one obstacle, it places another one in the way: Enter the War on Drugs. [1]

From the early 1970s to the present, the prison population has increased dramatically. Most of the offenders are non-violent offenders. Most of the non-violent offenders are black people.

Passing on values and traditions is hard when you are locked up for what other people aren't locked up for. It's hard to pass on the value of hard work and education when the hard work is not offered to you because of manufactured crimes stopping you from getting hired -- as if racism weren't enough.

Example: White man aged 19 is busted for a drug offense. He gets the case dropped to a misdemeanor and probation. Black man aged 19 is bused for a drug offense. He gets the felony charge and jail time. Even if he doesn't go to jail, the felony is bad enough.

There is no need to go back further in history. The Civil Rights Movement speaks for itself. There wouldn't have been one if there weren't a serious problems. Ever heard of Black Wall Street? [2] Unfortunately, white supremacy evolved after the movement. Some call it the New Jim Crow. [3] Others may call it Jim Crow 2. Whatever you choose to call it, it does stand in the way of values being passed down.

It's hard to talk to your children or grandchildren about values if a person is screaming into a bullhorn while you are trying to talk. That screaming is the systematic racism that exists in America.

1. https://www.aclu.org/drug-law-reform/drug-war-new-jim-crow

2. http://breakingbrown.com/2013/09/ok...logizes-for-1921-attack-on-black-wall-street/

3. http://newjimcrow.com/
 
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Dude is talking about his grandparents struggle,trying to equate it to himself,like he himself went through these things,and survived it,all the while completely ignoring the question of his privilege in 2014 etc...


due to jewish controlled media
stealing land from the Palestinians with help from America and allies
Holocaust reparations from several countries
favoritism/racism,knowing he is almost guaranteed a job once finished college regardless of how poorly he does.


i can go on.
 
Dude is talking about his grandparents struggle,trying to equate it to himself,like he himself went through these things,and survived it,all the while completely ignoring the question of his privilege in 2014 etc...


due to jewish controlled media
stealing land from the Palestinians with help from America and allies
Holocaust reparations from several countries
favoritism/racism,knowing he is almost guaranteed a job once finished college


i can go on.


pick a section, and just go in on it. the ones without a name are available. get your voice and thoughts heard. this is going everywhere. signed collaborative black voices.
 
A timely response is critical. You typically want to respond to these types of things within 48 hours to be apart of the viral cycle of the original. So people should really post their responses today so this can be completely by tomorrow.
 
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