Other than MSNBC, is there any mainstream coverage of the WI protests?

Upgrade Dave

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I'm really curious if a protest rally in Madison, Wisconsin is getting the same attention as the ones in Bahrain and Yemen.
When I say "mainstream", I'm not referring to FNC, the propaganda arm of the GOP.

Supreme Court decides for corporations, who support Republicans overwhelming over Democrats, in the Citizens United case.
Now the Republicans are going after unions, the most effective counter to corporate money on the left. This is class warfare.
 

thoughtone

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CNN had a blurb of it. You get 100 Tea Bagers and it's a revolution, you get 100,000 pros testing a newly elected republican governor and you get ignored. So called liberal mainstream media again!:confused:
 

Upgrade Dave

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CNN had a blurb of it. You get 100 Tea Bagers and it's a revolution, you get 100,000 pros testing a newly elected republican governor and you get ignored. So called liberal mainstream media again!:confused:

:yes::smh:

I checked out CNN and I wasn't impressed so I went back to MSNBC.
 

Gunner

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<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9x2N4bDmzdc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

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<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9x2N4bDmzdc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

So what? The major problem isn't public unions not wanting to negotiate and take some losses but in the governor wanting to eliminate and/or weaken their collective bargaining ability.
 

Gunner

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So what? The major problem isn't public unions not wanting to negotiate and take some losses but in the governor wanting to eliminate and/or weaken their collective bargaining ability.

So what??? The point is to look at how much is being wasted on failing schools. I take you didn't watch the story. The problem with unions is that no matter how good a teacher is they are going to be paid what the union deal states. Hell thats crazy. I would like to see school districts compete for the best and the brightest teachers. Why waste that money on teachers that suck. That could be your kid or mine. Most teachers that suck are sent to low income neighborhoods.
 

Cruise

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So what??? The point is to look at how much is being wasted on failing schools. I take you didn't watch the story. The problem with unions is that no matter how good a teacher is they are going to be paid what the union deal states. Hell thats crazy. I would like to see school districts compete for the best and the brightest teachers. Why waste that money on teachers that suck. That could be your kid or mine. Most teachers that suck are sent to low income neighborhoods.

Looky here, I actually agree with you.

With extensive experience with schools in my city, it is easy to see that whites use the inner city schools as a steady paycheck. They do not give a flying crap about the education black children get, which is why the schools are so terrible.

Yet, they want high salaries, extensive pensions, full health care, and more WITHOUT ANY ACCOUNTABILITY!

Teachers and police are wildly overcompensated because of their unions. Local and state budgets are collapsing because of it, and yet they refuse to be reasonable.

This is just going to get worse.
 

thoughtone

Rising Star
BGOL Investor
So what??? The point is to look at how much is being wasted on failing schools. I take you didn't watch the story. The problem with unions is that no matter how good a teacher is they are going to be paid what the union deal states. Hell thats crazy. I would like to see school districts compete for the best and the brightest teachers. Why waste that money on teachers that suck. That could be your kid or mine. Most teachers that suck are sent to low income neighborhoods.

What a bunch of right wing hooeey! This is as preposterous as saying corporations shouldn't pay taxes. Gunner, you know this is not about school teachers, it' about breaking the unions. Karl Rove, when asked if he had mapped out the campaign (for GW Bush), he said, 'Don't expect me to answer this question' -- he is too ambitious to want only that. The real prize is creating a Republican majority that would be as solid as, say, the Democratic coalition that Franklin Roosevelt created -- a majority that would last for a generation and that, as it played itself out over time, would wind up profoundly changing the relationship between citizen and state in this country." (The New Yorker, May 12, 2003)"


The public unions in Wisconsin have made concessions and are will to make more, but they will not allow corporatist politicians to further transfer income from the middle class to the wealthy.
 

Lamarr

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Word on the street is that there are plenty of unemployed folks that would gladly take their jobs for less.
 

thoughtone

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Word on the street is that there are plenty of unemployed folks that would gladly take their jobs for less.

Hell, a trained monkey would do it for free. Then would your ilk complain how shabby the services are or would you admit that you get what you pay for. Not everyone wants there state to be like Mississippi or South Carolina.
 

Gunner

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Word on the street is that there are plenty of unemployed folks that would gladly take their jobs for less.

Thank you. Fire their asses. Offer a nation wide incentive for teachers whom are unemployed to come to Wisconsin. Those leeches will be on the job Monday morning. :D
 

Gunner

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What a bunch of right wing hooeey! This is as preposterous as saying corporations shouldn't pay taxes. Gunner, you know this is not about school teachers, it' about breaking the unions. Karl Rove, when asked if he had mapped out the campaign (for GW Bush), he said, 'Don't expect me to answer this question' -- he is too ambitious to want only that. The real prize is creating a Republican majority that would be as solid as, say, the Democratic coalition that Franklin Roosevelt created -- a majority that would last for a generation and that, as it played itself out over time, would wind up profoundly changing the relationship between citizen and state in this country." (The New Yorker, May 12, 2003)"


The public unions in Wisconsin have made concessions and are will to make more, but they will not allow corporatist politicians to further transfer income from the middle class to the wealthy.

Are you in a union? I believe any individual can get any job if they are prepared. Our economy is based on individuals pursuing their own selfish interest. Damn unions. A good friend of mine works for UPS. Every other month he's written up for breaking policy. His excuse to me is always " I'm union they can't touch me".
Cool guy but his priorities are in the wrong place. :smh:

Most union members are afraid to compete in the private sector. Unions were started to keep out the Negro!!!! Whites were afraid to compete with our ancestors.

Why do the liberals defend institutions with racist past????
I mean really Dave wants Planned Parenthood fully funded regardless of how Margaret Sanger felt about him.
 

Upgrade Dave

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So what??? The point is to look at how much is being wasted on failing schools. I take you didn't watch the story. The problem with unions is that no matter how good a teacher is they are going to be paid what the union deal states. Hell thats crazy. I would like to see school districts compete for the best and the brightest teachers. Why waste that money on teachers that suck. That could be your kid or mine. Most teachers that suck are sent to low income neighborhoods.

I didn't watch the video because that's not the argument. The problem of bad teachers is a different issue than trying to eliminate/weaken the ability of workers to collectively bargain, which is what this governor and legislature are attempting to do.


Looky here, I actually agree with you.

With extensive experience with schools in my city, it is easy to see that whites use the inner city schools as a steady paycheck. They do not give a flying crap about the education black children get, which is why the schools are so terrible.

Yet, they want high salaries, extensive pensions, full health care, and more WITHOUT ANY ACCOUNTABILITY!

Teachers and police are wildly overcompensated because of their unions. Local and state budgets are collapsing because of it, and yet they refuse to be reasonable.
This is just going to get worse.

This is just a lie.

Hell, a trained monkey would do it for free. Then would your ilk complain how shabby the services are or would you admit that you get what you pay for. Not everyone wants there state to be like Mississippi or South Carolina.

Exactly.
How is the answer to getting a better quality of teachers making the job less attractive than it is?
 

Upgrade Dave

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Are you in a union? I believe any individual can get any job if they are prepared. Our economy is based on individuals pursuing their own selfish interest. Damn unions. A good friend of mine works for UPS. Every other month he's written up for breaking policy. His excuse to me is always " I'm union they can't touch me".
Cool guy but his priorities are in the wrong place. :smh:

Most union members are afraid to compete in the private sector. Unions were started to keep out the Negro!!!! Whites were afraid to compete with our ancestors.

Huh uh.
Every, and I mean every, thing that benefits workers is because of unions (40 hr work week, paid vacation, child labor laws) and those things benefitted workers who didn't even belong to a union.
Unions, being run by imperfect people, are imperfect creations but they are the last line of defense from this current crop of "conservatives" and Republicans who seem to be jealous of China and the way they treat their workers.

Why do the liberals defend institutions with racist past????

And "conservatives" don't?
Defending institutions with racist past just makes me an American. If we didn't defend said institutions, there wouldn't be any people of color in the military.

I mean really Dave wants Planned Parenthood fully funded regardless of how Margaret Sanger felt about him.


Sanger is a dead racist.
If a woman, whatever color she may be, wants to have an abortion or give her child up for adoption or what ever choice she makes (PP does more than abort fetuses), I think it's a good thing for them to have a place to go to do that.
 

QueEx

Rising Star
Super Moderator
Are you in a union? I believe any individual can get any job if they are prepared. Our economy is based on individuals pursuing their own selfish interest. Damn unions. A good friend of mine works for UPS. Every other month he's written up for breaking policy. His excuse to me is always " I'm union they can't touch me".
Cool guy but his priorities are in the wrong place. :smh:
Using your assessment of your friend, sounds like he might have some maturity problems. But, it is YOU describing HIM and WE can't be sure of YOUR assessment.

Nevertheless, YOU are asking us to assume that your friend is representative of the majority of union workers ??? I'd ask you to make a showing how thats so but I feel certain that you would simply change the subject to something else. But go ahead . . .


Most union members are afraid to compete in the private sector. Unions were started to keep out the Negro!!!! Whites were afraid to compete with our ancestors.
Citation please. Don't have one?

Figures. You're always talking-out-of-your-ass.


Why do the liberals defend institutions with racist past????

Why do people defend institutions with a racist present ???

Recall, that you were hugging Breitbarts nuts a couple of months ago until you were embarrassed by the painful truth. You haven't forgotten the Shirley Sherrod have you? - we haven't.

QueEx
 

bigvince06

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Are you in a union? I believe any individual can get any job if they are prepared. Our economy is based on individuals pursuing their own selfish interest. Damn unions. A good friend of mine works for UPS. Every other month he's written up for breaking policy. His excuse to me is always " I'm union they can't touch me".
Cool guy but his priorities are in the wrong place. :smh:

Most union members are afraid to compete in the private sector. Unions were started to keep out the Negro!!!! Whites were afraid to compete with our ancestors.

Why do the liberals defend institutions with racist past????
I mean really Dave wants Planned Parenthood fully funded regardless of how Margaret Sanger felt about him.

Amazing. You actually managed to say something accurate. :rolleyes: Large multinationals act in their own best interest even when it is against the best interest of the economy as a whole. Continue to vote and act against your own interest at your own peril. :smh: The deregulation and "cowboy capitalism" the republicans (and some Dems) have advocated for has fucked a large portion of the country. My wife and I have an AGI that places us in the top 1% but we both recognize that our current economic and tax policies benefit the top .0000001% You should google the "mittelstand" and read up on why Germany is currently kicking our ass. Their position on unions and their recognition of their importance is a major reason for the success.
 

thoughtone

Rising Star
BGOL Investor
Are you in a union? I believe any individual can get any job if they are prepared. Our economy is based on individuals pursuing their own selfish interest. Damn unions. A good friend of mine works for UPS. Every other month he's written up for breaking policy. His excuse to me is always " I'm union they can't touch me".
Cool guy but his priorities are in the wrong place. :smh:

Most union members are afraid to compete in the private sector. Unions were started to keep out the Negro!!!! Whites were afraid to compete with our ancestors.

Why do the liberals defend institutions with racist past????
I mean really Dave wants Planned Parenthood fully funded regardless of how Margaret Sanger felt about him.

Are you in a union?

No, always been salary or non exempted hourly, which means I was always judged by my last accomplishment.

Our economy is based on individuals pursuing their own selfish interest.

Post your evidence.

Damn unions. A good friend of mine works for UPS. Every other month he's written up for breaking policy. His excuse to me is always " I'm union they can't touch me".
Cool guy but his priorities are in the wrong place. :smh:

Unlike GW's TARP bailout:eek: I know assholes that are at non union businesses that skate policy because they know they are favored by management. What's the difference?


Most union members are afraid to compete in the private sector. Unions were started to keep out the Negro!!!! Whites were afraid to compete with our ancestors.

Ever heard of the Pullman Porter Union?

Why do the liberals defend institutions with racist past????
I mean really Dave wants Planned Parenthood fully funded regardless of how Margaret Sanger felt about him.

Ignorance and repeating a lie only makes the intellectually lazy believe anything.

source: Planned Parenthood

Sanger's Outreach to the African-American Community

In 1930, Sanger opened a family planning clinic in Harlem that sought to enlist support for contraceptive use and to bring the benefits of family planning to women who were denied access to their city's health and social services. Staffed by a black physician and black social worker, the clinic was endorsed by The Amsterdam News (the powerful local newspaper), the Abyssinian Baptist Church, the Urban League, and the black community's elder statesman, W.E.B. DuBois.

Beginning in 1939, DuBois also served on the advisory council for Sanger's "Negro Project," which was a "unique experiment in race-building and humanitarian service to a race subjected to discrimination, hardship, and segregation” (Chesler, 1992). The Negro Project served African-Americans in the rural South. Other leaders of the African-American community who were involved in the project included Mary McLeod Bethune, founder of the National Council of Negro Women, and Adam Clayton Powell Jr., pastor of the Abyssinian Baptist Church in Harlem.

The Negro Project was also endorsed by prominent white Americans who were involved in social justice efforts at this time, including Eleanor Roosevelt, the most visible and compassionate supporter of racial equality in her era; and the medical philanthropists, Albert and Mary Lasker, whose financial support made the project possible.

A passionate opponent of racism, Sanger predicted in 1942 that the "Negro question" would be foremost on the country's domestic agenda after World War II. Her accomplishments on behalf of the African-American community were unchallengeable during her lifetime and remain so today. In 1966, the year Sanger died, the Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. said:

There is a striking kinship between our movement and Margaret Sanger's early efforts. . . . Our sure beginning in the struggle for equality by nonviolent direct action may not have been so resolute without the tradition established by Margaret Sanger and people like her.

Charges of racism against Sanger are most often made by anti-choice activists who are unfamiliar with the history of the African-American community or with Margaret Sanger's collegial relationship with that community's leaders. The tangled fabric of lies and manipulation woven by anti-choice activists around the issues of class, race, and family planning continues to be embroidered today, more than three-quarters of a century after the family planning movement began.

Published Statements That Distort or Misquote Margaret Sanger

Through the years, a number of alleged Sanger quotations, or allegations about her, have surfaced with regularity in anti-family planning publications. The following are samples of especially pernicious distortions, misattributions, or outright lies that Margaret Sanger's enemies continue to circulate.

“More children from the fit, less from the unfit — that is the chief issue in birth control.” A quotation falsely attributed to Margaret Sanger, this statement was made by the editors of American Medicine in a review of an article by Sanger. The editorial from which this appeared, as well as Sanger's article, "Why Not Birth Control Clinics in America?" (1919b), were reprinted side-by-side in the May 1919 Birth Control Review.

“The mass of ignorant Negroes still breed carelessly and disastrously, so that the increase among Negroes, even more than the increase among whites, is from that portion of the population least intelligent and fit, and least able to rear their children properly.” Another quotation falsely attributed to Margaret Sanger, this was actually written for the June 1932 issue of The Birth Control Review by W.E.B. DuBois, founder of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP). Taken out of the context of his discussion about the effects of birth control on the balance between quality-of-life considerations and race-survival issues for African-Americans, Dubois' language seems insensitive by today's standards.

“Blacks, soldiers, and Jews are a menace to the race.” This fabricated quotation, falsely attributed to Sanger, was concocted in the late 1980s. The alleged source is the April 1933 Birth Control Review (Sanger ceased editing the Review in 1929). That issue contains no article or letter by Sanger.

“To create a race of thoroughbreds . . .” This remark, again attributed originally to Sanger, was made by Dr. Edward A. Kempf and has been cited out of context and with distorted meaning. Dr. Kempf, a progressive physician, was actually arguing for state endowment of maternal and infant care clinics. In her book The Pivot of Civilization, Sanger quoted Dr. Kempf's argument about how environment may improve human excellence:

Society must make life worth the living and the refining for the individual by conditioning him to love and to seek the love-object in a manner that reflects a constructive effect upon his fellow-men and by giving him suitable opportunities. The virility of the automatic apparatus is destroyed by excessive gormandizing or hunger, by excessive wealth or poverty, by excessive work or idleness, by sexual abuse or intolerant prudishness. The noblest and most difficult art of all is the raising of human thoroughbreds (1969).

It was in this spirit that Sanger used the phrase, "Birth Control: To Create a Race of Thoroughbreds," as a banner on the November 1921 issue of the Birth Control Review. (Differing slogans on the theme of voluntary family planning sometimes appeared under the title of The Review, e.g., "Dedicated to the Cause of Voluntary Motherhood," January 1928.)

“The most merciful thing that the large family does to one of its infant members is to kill it.” This statement is taken out of context from Margaret Sanger's Woman and the New Race (1920). Sanger was making an ironic comment — not a prescriptive one — about the horrifying rate of infant mortality among large families of early 20th-century urban America. The statement, as grim as the conditions that prompted Sanger to make it, accompanied this chart, illustrating the infant death rate in 1920:


Deaths During First Year
1st born children 23% 7th born children 31%
2nd born children 20% 8th born children 33%
3rd born children 21% 9th born children 35%
4th born children 23% 10th born children 41%
5th born children 26% 11th born children 51%
6th born children 31% 12th born children 60%

“We do not want word to get out that we want to exterminate the Negro population.” Sanger was aware of African-American concerns, passionately argued by Marcus Garvey in the 1920s, that birth control was a threat to the survival of the black race. This statement, which acknowledges those fears, is taken from a letter to Clarence J. Gamble, M.D., a champion of the birth control movement. In that letter, Sanger describes her strategy to allay such apprehensions. A larger portion of the letter makes Sanger's meaning clear:

It seems to me from my experience . . . in North Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee, and Texas, that while the colored Negroes have great respect for white doctors, they can get closer to their own members and more or less lay their cards on the table. . . . They do not do this with the white people, and if we can train the Negro doctor at the clinic, he can go among them with enthusiasm and with knowledge, which, I believe, will have far-reaching results. . . . His work, in my opinion, should be entirely with the Negro profession and the nurses, hospital, social workers, as well as the County's white doctors. His success will depend upon his personality and his training by us.
The minister's work is also important, and also he should be trained, perhaps by the Federation, as to our ideals and the goal that we hope to reach. We do not want word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population, and the minister is the man who can straighten out that idea if it ever occurs (1939).


“As early as 1914 Margaret Sanger was promoting abortion, not for white middle-class women, but against 'inferior races' — black people, poor people, Slavs, Latins, and Hebrews were 'human weeds.'” This allegation about Margaret Sanger appears in an anonymous flyer, "Facts About Planned Parenthood," that is circulated by anti-family planning activists. Margaret Sanger, who passionately believed in a woman's right to control her body, never "promoted" abortion because it was illegal and dangerous throughout her lifetime. She urged women to use contraceptives so that they would not be at risk for the dangers of illegal, back-alley abortion. Sanger never described any ethnic community as an 'inferior race' or as 'human weeds.' In her lifetime, Sanger won the respect of international figures of all races, including the Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.; Mahatma Gandhi; Shidzue Kato, the foremost family planning advocate in Japan; and Lady Dhanvanthi Rama Rau of India — all of whom were sensitive to issues of race.

The Rising Tide of Color Against White World Supremacy

This is the title of a book falsely attributed to Sanger. It was written by Lothrop Stoddard and reviewed by Havelock Ellis in the October 1920 issue of The Birth Control Review. Its general topic, the international politics of race relations in the first decades of the century, is one in which Sanger was not involved. Her interest, insofar as she allowed a review of Stoddard's book to be published in The Birth Control Review, was in the overall health and quality of life of all races and not in tensions between them. Ellis's review was critical of the Stoddard book and of distinctions based on race or ethnicity alone.


The difference between you and me is that I rely on facts, you rely on what ever the right feed you.
 

QueEx

Rising Star
Super Moderator
<font size="5"><center>
Republican governors
strike at heart of Democratic Party</font size></center>



110220_walker_supporters_reuters_328.jpg

Scott Walker and Chris Christie are fighting labor battles while Terry Branstad may face one.
Reuters


In the states, Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker, New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie and other members of a new class of combative Republican governors are fighting pitched battles over painful budget cuts that affect issues that once were thought to be untouchable such as teacher tenure and collective-bargaining rights.

These showdowns in the states — expressed most spectacularly this week in Wisconsin’s capital — have brought to life a long-standing cliché of government: The most consequential political action and the most serious policy debates are not taking place in Washington, which appears unlikely to tackle any big-ticket items but, rather, beyond the Beltway, in the state capitols, which Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis famously labeled the “laboratories of democracy.”

With a budget-cutting and reform zeal unseen since the mid-1990s, a group of Republican chief executives are using difficult economic times to press an ambitious policy agenda that makes their GOP counterparts in Washington seem like timid incrementalists.

<SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">Their goal: to shatter a bipartisan consensus on public labor that’s shaped politics in the West, the Northeast and the Upper Midwest since the 1960s.</span>


Welfare reform was the centerpiece legislation at issue for the new GOP governors in the ’90s. Today, public employee rights and benefits are on the firing line. Between the two, there is an important distinction: The political stakes are much greater now.

Aside from social justice advocates and traditional liberals, welfare recipients had little political clout. To take on the well-organized and politically connected teachers and state workers, however, is to strike at the heart of the Democratic Party in many states.

<SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">If Walker, who is trying to curb collective-bargaining rights,</span> and Christie, who <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">is</span> attempting to overhaul teacher tenure, manage <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">to succeed, they’ll only embolden their counterparts elsewhere — and potentially do grave damage to what is one of the Democrats’ most important financial and grass-roots constituencies. Florida Gov. Rick Scott and Ohio Gov. John Kasich, among other Republicans, are watching carefully, bracing for similar showdowns</span>.

<SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">Much of the attention in Wisconsin is devoted to Walker’s proposal to strip state employees of the right to bargain collectively for anything besides their pay and to make them pay more for their health care and pensions.

Yet another element of the legislation could have even greater political consequences. The Republican would end the automatic deduction from their workers paychecks and make the unions collect the dues themselves, a move that would almost surely result in less cash flowing into labor coffers. It would block unions from collecting money from consenting wokers’ paychecks for political operations, and it would force annual elections on whether state workers even want a union, a lethal threat to public-sector labor.
</span>


<font size="3">Iowa Waiting</font size>


“The new crop of governors is even more bold,” said Iowa Gov. Terry Branstad, who was elected last year but previously served four terms in the 1980s and ’90s. “We came in with a mission. The times call for it. What government has been doing for way too long is unaffordable and unsustainable.”

Branstad, noting that he had just talked to Walker on Thursday and offered his support, told POLITICO he was anxious to reassess Iowa’s public employee benefits and had brought in an official from the private sector to examine the state’s collective-bargaining law.


“We have state employees paying nothing toward their health insurance,” exclaimed the governor with a tone of incredulity. “These are things that have to change.”

He promised an “all-out effort” to take control of the Democratic-held state Senate “to do what other states are doing and what has to be done for the long term.”

Former Michigan Gov. John Engler, who served from 1991 to 2003, said the scene this week in Madison reminded him of Lansing in the early 1990s, when his effort to reform welfare prompted the staging of a tent city on the Capitol lawn and a burning of his likeness in effigy.

“We were able to do a number of things that at the time seemed so dramatic and even draconian,” Engler said.

Yet he acknowledged that what the new Republicans are doing could have more fundamental political impact.

“Because now you’re getting structurally at government itself,” he said.



<font size="3">Democrats & Labor See Same Stakes</font size>


Democrats and labor leaders see the stakes the same way — which is why they’re rallying by the thousands outside Wisconsin’s Capitol dome.

“Underneath the real crisis about funding and revenue and pensions is an opportunity to take your opponents and knock them down a peg in terms of having their members participate politically,” said former Service Employees International Union President Andrew Stern. “It’s an opportunity to rebalance the political scale.”

“Those unions are an important part of the core Democratic coalition — from a purely mechanical standpoint, they matter in our elections,” said Jim Jordan, a Democratic consultant, who added that the principle of collective bargaining is also a central one to the party.

“This isn’t just about power and politics — this is one that is truly about principle,” he said.

What makes the politics of it somewhat easier for the new crop of Republican governors, though, is that after a sustained recession, those Americans who work in the private sector and have lost their jobs or seen their wages stagnate have less sympathy for public employees who, in some cases, enjoy enviable health care and pension packages.


<font size="3">The Polls; Time to Attack Public Sector</font size>

New polls out Friday suggested a deep ambivalence on the subject: A Pew survey suggested that a narrow majority would side instinctively with workers against government, but a Clarus Research survey showed 64 percent of voters disapproving of public-sector unions that make financial demands.

And unlike in the mid-1990s, when many GOP governors came to office, most states are facing soaring budget deficits that give the chief executives a measure of cover to push through wide-ranging structural changes in the name of austerity even as Democrats howl and some veteran legislators in their own parties grow queasy.



“I do think you have an establishment interested in the status quo that can’t be afforded anymore,” Engler said.

GOP consultant Phil Musser, a former Republican Governors Association official, was even more blunt: “The public has lost patience with a bloated, 1950s, one-size-fits-all style system that benefits a public employee class that gets special deals.”

But Musser conceded that taking on the public sector — whose unions are now larger than those in industry — also could mean gaining an important strategic advantage.

“A, it’s the right thing to do, B, it’s simple mathematics — we’re taking in less than we’re spending — and, C, it is good politics,” he said.

That’s why the GOP confrontation with labor marks something far more meaningful than the typical policy changes that accompany a switch from Republican to Democratic governance. Instead, it represents a violent break with a bipartisan consensus about government workers that has operated unquestioned for four decades in union-friendly states from California to Michigan to New York.

“The moderate Republicans of the 1960s were totally accommodating to unions,” said E.J. McMahon, a senior fellow at the conservative Empire Center in Albany, N.Y., who cited Michigan Gov. George Romney and New York’s Nelson Rockefeller, who shepherded through that state’s law extending collective bargaining to state workers. “This was the governing consensus up to this crisis.”

Unions extended their reach through the mid-1970s, when attempts to pass a federal law to extend collective-bargaining rights to all public-sector workers stalled amid a wave of high-profile strikes. One in Pennsylvania was led by the fiery local AFSCME leader, Gerald McEntee — now the chief of the national union — whose pointed rallying cries reportedly called for closing the entire state.

But for decades, governors of both parties — including Democrats with close ties to labor like California’s Pat and Jerry Brown, and Republicans like former New York Gov. George Pataki, former Massachusetts Gov. William Weld and former New Jersey Gov. Christie Todd Whitman — waged tough negotiations without trying to drive their labor adversaries into extinction.

“I never tried to change the rules,” said former New Jersey Gov. Tom Kean, a moderate Republican, who recalled in an interview that union members picketed his home in the negotiations over his first budget in the recession of the early 1980s. “I had a confrontation but nothing like Christie’s.”



http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0211/49852.html
 

Lamarr

Star
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I'm a little torn on this one. It is not right for the government (republicans) to pass a law limiting your rights to collective bargaining, however, the employer (government) is also in their "right" to set terms of employment.
 

QueEx

Rising Star
Super Moderator
I'm a little torn on this one. It is not right for the government (republicans) to pass a law limiting your rights to collective bargaining, however, the employer (government) is also in their "right" to set terms of employment.

One side having the "right" to set the terms of employment is inconsistent with the other party having a right to bargain, isn't it ???

QueEx
 

Lamarr

Star
Registered
One side having the "right" to set the terms of employment is inconsistent with the other party having a right to bargain, isn't it ???

QueEx

not exactly, unions can TRY to collectively bargain and if the other party accepts, the govt shouldn't interfere. I guess I just disagree with the manner in which Walker is going about the process.

The govt should not pass laws to limit the ability to collectively bargain.
 

GET YOU HOT

Superfly Moderator
BGOL Investor
I'm really curious if a protest rally in Madison, Wisconsin is getting the same attention as the ones in Bahrain and Yemen.
When I say "mainstream", I'm not referring to FNC, the propaganda arm of the GOP.

Supreme Court decides for corporations, who support Republicans overwhelming over Democrats, in the Citizens United case.
Now the Republicans are going after unions, the most effective counter to corporate money on the left. This is class warfare.

Any recent developments on the media blackout...? :yes:mainstream media is propaganda...


The revolution Will Not Be Televised
 

QueEx

Rising Star
Super Moderator
<font size="3">
Last week, in the face of protest demonstrations against Wisconsin’s new union-busting governor, Scott Walker — demonstrations that continued through the weekend, with huge crowds on Saturday — Representative Paul Ryan made an unintentionally apt comparison: <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">“It’s like Cairo has moved to Madison.”</span>


It wasn’t the smartest thing for Mr. Ryan to say and he probably didn’t mean to, but he <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">compared Wisconsin Governor Walker, a fellow Republican, to Hosni Mubarak.</span> Or maybe he did — after all, quite a few prominent conservatives, including Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and Rick Santorum, denounced the uprising in Egypt and insist that President Obama should have helped the Mubarak regime suppress it.

</font size>​


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/21/opinion/21krugman.html
 

Upgrade Dave

Rising Star
Registered
not exactly, unions can TRY to collectively bargain and if the other party accepts, the govt shouldn't interfere. I guess I just disagree with the manner in which Walker is going about the process.

The govt should not pass laws to limit the ability to collectively bargain.


I agree and thank you for focusing on the real point of the protests.
And thanks to thoughtone for giving me another perspective on Sanger.

Any recent developments on the media blackout...? :yes:mainstream media is propaganda...


The revolution Will Not Be Televised


It's gotten a lot better. Finally.

<font size="3">
Last week, in the face of protest demonstrations against Wisconsin’s new union-busting governor, Scott Walker — demonstrations that continued through the weekend, with huge crowds on Saturday — Representative Paul Ryan made an unintentionally apt comparison: <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">“It’s like Cairo has moved to Madison.”</span>


It wasn’t the smartest thing for Mr. Ryan to say and he probably didn’t mean to, but he <SPAN style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffff00">compared Wisconsin Governor Walker, a fellow Republican, to Hosni Mubarak.</span> Or maybe he did — after all, quite a few prominent conservatives, including Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and Rick Santorum, denounced the uprising in Egypt and insist that President Obama should have helped the Mubarak regime suppress it.

</font size>​


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/21/opinion/21krugman.html

I saw that and thought the same thing immediately.

So the unions are willing to accept the cuts, so what's Walker's objective if not union-busting?

Gunner
Right wing media is doing you a disservice. Widen your viewing/reading habits.
 

Gunner

Support BGOL
Registered
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/kEja-1emRic" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Thought, so we may not agree on much but when you are right you're right. If I've been wrong, I said it. Ok we both have angles, but why defend her? They used black ministers to spread their message. These places are mostly populated in black neighborhoods!!! If it was a right wing agenda you would point out the racist past.
It's like you guys defend the scum of the earth just to promote your agenda.

The damn governor is telling you we don't have the money and the promises made by others are not sustainable. The only way you guys understand is when the people who were promised these goodies take to the streets. WTF I mean, stop relying on others for your future.
 

Gunner

Support BGOL
Registered
Some guy posted the video on the main board.
I don't know what party this guy is, at this point when its the truth it doesn't matter.

Several parts but his opening argument is compelling.

It's sad to say but many of our people will be stranded on rooftops waiting for the government.


<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/B4JuBOtUSJ0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

QueEx

Rising Star
Super Moderator
Some guy posted the video on the main board.
I don't know what party this guy is, at this point when its the truth it doesn't matter.

Several parts but his opening argument is compelling.

It's sad to say but many of our people will be stranded on rooftops waiting for the government.

<font size="3">What is the relevance of the video to the subject of this thread ?

What ?

</font size>
 

thoughtone

Rising Star
BGOL Investor
Thought, so we may not agree on much but when you are right you're right. If I've been wrong, I said it. Ok we both have angles, but why defend her? They used black ministers to spread their message. These places are mostly populated in black neighborhoods!!! If it was a right wing agenda you would point out the racist past.
It's like you guys defend the scum of the earth just to promote your agenda.

The damn governor is telling you we don't have the money and the promises made by others are not sustainable. The only way you guys understand is when the people who were promised these goodies take to the streets. WTF I mean, stop relying on others for your future.

I have nothing more to add. The lies and distortions you have absorbed about Sanger were addressed in my post and explained further in the link. I view Planned Parenthood as aiding women in contraceptive options, you view it has a political tool.
 
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