Karl Rove's advice to Obama
- Thread starter Costanza
- Start date
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Here is my take: Rove is full of S***. Will always be. I am not even angry now either.
"In recent days, courtesy of Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick, Mr. Obama has invoked the Declaration of Independence, Martin Luther King, Jr., and Franklin Roosevelt to show the power of words. But there is a critical difference between Mr. Obama's rhetoric and that of Jefferson, King and FDR. In each instance, their words were used to advance large, specific purposes -- establishing a new nation based on inalienable rights; achieving equal rights and a color-blind society; giving people confidence to endure a Great Depression. For Mr. Obama, words are merely a means to hide a left-leaning agenda behind the cloak of centrist rhetoric.That garment has now been torn. As voters see what his agenda is, his opponents can now far more effectively question his authenticity, credibility, record and fitness to be leader of the free world."
--------------------------------------------------------
First, Obama's borrowed phrases were to highlight the significance and power of words. How, if the right combination or words and ideas are pieced together, something powerful can happen to the human spirit. NOTHING he said was "merely a means to hide a left-leaning agenda behind the cloak of centrist rhetoric."
That's how Karl and the conservative PNAC pledging snakes misconstrue, undermine and destroy the common sense of the masses. 
Karl thoroughly, and intentionally, shifted the focus from how Barak was defending himself form Hillary's and McCain's attacks. He turns the purity and conviction behind Obama's pointed rebuttal it into a some ruse or petty theater. A hoax even.
I despise his tactics and his continued influence in American politics.
Here is my take: Rove is full of S***. Will always be. I am not even angry now either.
"In recent days, courtesy of Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick, Mr. Obama has invoked the Declaration of Independence, Martin Luther King, Jr., and Franklin Roosevelt to show the power of words. But there is a critical difference between Mr. Obama's rhetoric and that of Jefferson, King and FDR. In each instance, their words were used to advance large, specific purposes -- establishing a new nation based on inalienable rights; achieving equal rights and a color-blind society; giving people confidence to endure a Great Depression. For Mr. Obama, words are merely a means to hide a left-leaning agenda behind the cloak of centrist rhetoric.That garment has now been torn. As voters see what his agenda is, his opponents can now far more effectively question his authenticity, credibility, record and fitness to be leader of the free world."
--------------------------------------------------------
First, Obama's borrowed phrases were to highlight the significance and power of words. How, if the right combination or words and ideas are pieced together, something powerful can happen to the human spirit. NOTHING he said was "merely a means to hide a left-leaning agenda behind the cloak of centrist rhetoric."
That's how Karl and the conservative PNAC pledging snakes misconstrue, undermine and destroy the common sense of the masses. Karl thoroughly, and intentionally, shifted the focus from how Barak was defending himself form Hillary's and McCain's attacks. He turns the purity and conviction behind Obama's pointed rebuttal it into a some ruse or petty theater. A hoax even.
I despise his tactics and his continued influence in American politics.Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
This is an interesting message from Rove because, although he is completely bias toward the Republican cause, he has always been a shrewd political strategist. It has been stated on more than one occassion by many folks, not just Rove and the Republicans, but also by Democrats that have not and do not support Obama that he is unproven. The way I see it, he may get the opportunity to prove them all wrong. We'll see how he does tonight with the debate. He actually has not been the best debater in my book, but he is the most authentic in terms of raw and uncut. Edwards focused on the issues and Clinton just wants to make sure she is always politically correct.
This is an interesting message from Rove because, although he is completely bias toward the Republican cause, he has always been a shrewd political strategist. It has been stated on more than one occassion by many folks, not just Rove and the Republicans, but also by Democrats that have not and do not support Obama that he is unproven. The way I see it, he may get the opportunity to prove them all wrong. We'll see how he does tonight with the debate. He actually has not been the best debater in my book, but he is the most authentic in terms of raw and uncut. Edwards focused on the issues and Clinton just wants to make sure she is always politically correct.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
I agree with you on the debating part. I have consistently said Obama has to step up that part of his game. However, crediting Rove with being "shrewd", or a "great" strategist is like congratulating an eel for being slippery.
That dude is cut throat and grimy. Does any one know what "caging" is? How Rove incorporated that practice into voter suppression? Does any one remember how Rove orchestrated the firing of the U.S. attorneys, especially in Arkansas, where he installed one of his henchmen? Interfering, obstructing and manipulating the law to achieve a tactical political advantage IS NOT strategy. It is criminal. I get tiered of pointing this out to people - but I won't stop.
Rove's commentary is a thinly veiled attack on Obama no more no less. I hate the fact that we even have to know what he thinks...He should be in jail with Scooter.
I agree with you on the debating part. I have consistently said Obama has to step up that part of his game. However, crediting Rove with being "shrewd", or a "great" strategist is like congratulating an eel for being slippery.
That dude is cut throat and grimy. Does any one know what "caging" is? How Rove incorporated that practice into voter suppression? Does any one remember how Rove orchestrated the firing of the U.S. attorneys, especially in Arkansas, where he installed one of his henchmen? Interfering, obstructing and manipulating the law to achieve a tactical political advantage IS NOT strategy. It is criminal.
I get tiered of pointing this out to people - but I won't stop.Rove's commentary is a thinly veiled attack on Obama no more no less. I hate the fact that we even have to know what he thinks...He should be in jail with Scooter.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
i still dont trust a word rove says. also all the shit that has dropped lately is beyond anyones ability to stratigize for. McCain might have just lost any chance to unite his base. Bill just said if hillary loses texas she might as well quit. So fuck a rove strategy the fool should have strategized a way to keep his job in the bush regime
i still dont trust a word rove says. also all the shit that has dropped lately is beyond anyones ability to stratigize for. McCain might have just lost any chance to unite his base. Bill just said if hillary loses texas she might as well quit. So fuck a rove strategy the fool should have strategized a way to keep his job in the bush regime
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
"So fuck a rove
strategy the fool should have strategized a way to keep his job in the bush regime" 
"So fuck a rove
strategy the fool should have strategized a way to keep his job in the bush regime" Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
I agree with most of the posts: Fuck Karl Rove!! He is trying to say that Obama is partisan.............uhhhhhh, they are all partisan to some extent. Fuck the republicans! They have done nothing for this country in the last 7 years, yet they want to try to criticize a person who can unite the country and bring about positive change. For those who haven't done this up to this point, look up the word conservative and understand the meaning (resisting change; desiring to preserve traditions; cautious). To me as a educated Black man, if you are part of the Conservative regime you plan on trying to "RESIST" my ability to financially and socially succeed and accomplish my goals because you plan to "PRESERVE TRADITIONS" and keep Black people where we have been for the last 400 years (a part of the lower economic and social class)! FUCK THAT SHIT! Karl Rove is probably as close to a pure Hater as you can get, with the exception of the Devil of course.
I agree with most of the posts: Fuck Karl Rove!! He is trying to say that Obama is partisan.............uhhhhhh, they are all partisan to some extent. Fuck the republicans! They have done nothing for this country in the last 7 years, yet they want to try to criticize a person who can unite the country and bring about positive change. For those who haven't done this up to this point, look up the word conservative and understand the meaning (resisting change; desiring to preserve traditions; cautious). To me as a educated Black man, if you are part of the Conservative regime you plan on trying to "RESIST" my ability to financially and socially succeed and accomplish my goals because you plan to "PRESERVE TRADITIONS" and keep Black people where we have been for the last 400 years (a part of the lower economic and social class)! FUCK THAT SHIT! Karl Rove is probably as close to a pure Hater as you can get, with the exception of the Devil of course.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
It's not about whether YOU AGREE with ROVE or not.........look deeper.
He has just outlined HOW Clinton and McCAin will GO AFTER OBAMA.
Call Rove what you want but has PROVEN to be a brilliant political strategist. He got the retard voted in for 2 terms. Hell after the 1st term EVERYONE agreed that Bush was an idiot. But hell ROVE put together a successful strategy to get the IDIOT voted in again!!
So whether I agree/disagree or like/dislike what Rove says.........I consider it.
It's not about whether YOU AGREE with ROVE or not.........look deeper.
He has just outlined HOW Clinton and McCAin will GO AFTER OBAMA.
Call Rove what you want but has PROVEN to be a brilliant political strategist. He got the retard voted in for 2 terms. Hell after the 1st term EVERYONE agreed that Bush was an idiot. But hell ROVE put together a successful strategy to get the IDIOT voted in again!!
So whether I agree/disagree or like/dislike what Rove says.........I consider it.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Neither of us may like Rove or what he has to say, but he appears to be far from mere, full of shit. In my opinion, Rove is talking to an audience, his audience, in a language that many of them know and understand. Of course, he begins with what I call "an Apology" - the appearance that he is being objective or even a casual admirer of Barack Obama, when in fact he is anything but. However, as you noted below, he simply uses that to enamor himself into the psuedo-good graces of those looking for an excuse to do what they normally do (vote out of fear and/or hatred), in this abnormal time (a time when either an intelligent, qualified Black person and a woman/former first lady will head the democratic ticket and the republicans may very well be without a classic conservative) when it appears a lot of people may be considering, for once, doing the right thing. Hence, Rove is merely a demagog - appealing to the passions and prejudices of his audience.
What a good time it is right now for our (Black) commentators on the national or regional stage unclothe Mr. Rove.
QueEx
On this point, I disagree.
Neither of us may like Rove or what he has to say, but he appears to be far from mere, full of shit. In my opinion, Rove is talking to an audience, his audience, in a language that many of them know and understand. Of course, he begins with what I call "an Apology" - the appearance that he is being objective or even a casual admirer of Barack Obama, when in fact he is anything but. However, as you noted below, he simply uses that to enamor himself into the psuedo-good graces of those looking for an excuse to do what they normally do (vote out of fear and/or hatred), in this abnormal time (a time when either an intelligent, qualified Black person and a woman/former first lady will head the democratic ticket and the republicans may very well be without a classic conservative) when it appears a lot of people may be considering, for once, doing the right thing. Hence, Rove is merely a demagog - appealing to the passions and prejudices of his audience.
What a good time it is right now for our (Black) commentators on the national or regional stage unclothe Mr. Rove.
My point above; my distain just less passionately stated."In recent days, courtesy of Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick, Mr. Obama has invoked the Declaration of Independence, Martin Luther King, Jr., and Franklin Roosevelt to show the power of words. But there is a critical difference between Mr. Obama's rhetoric and that of Jefferson, King and FDR. In each instance, their words were used to advance large, specific purposes -- establishing a new nation based on inalienable rights; achieving equal rights and a color-blind society; giving people confidence to endure a Great Depression. For Mr. Obama, words are merely a means to hide a left-leaning agenda behind the cloak of centrist rhetoric.That garment has now been torn. As voters see what his agenda is, his opponents can now far more effectively question his authenticity, credibility, record and fitness to be leader of the free world."
--------------------------------------------------------
First, Obama's borrowed phrases were to highlight the significance and power of words. How, if the right combination or words and ideas are pieced together, something powerful can happen to the human spirit. NOTHING he said was "merely a means to hide a left-leaning agenda behind the cloak of centrist rhetoric."
Karl thoroughly, and intentionally, shifted the focus from how Barak was defending himself form Hillary's and McCain's attacks. He turns the purity and conviction behind Obama's pointed rebuttal it into a some ruse or petty theater. A hoax even.
QueEx
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
I am going to mark this day down. We actually, roundaboutly, agree.
I know he knows his audience and how to stoke racist, socioeconomic and conservative falmes sublimainally without coming off as the @$$ he is. I just can not, and will not attribute greatness to a man who has committed criminal offenses to give him a competitive advantage and be then be perceived as a savant. Hell no. He is only hired to make you believe what he wants you to believe (as evidenced in the article below). Again, he should be writing every thesis right now from inside of a federal prison. I have no idea why he continues to gets any type of reverence at all.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Rove: Iraq Will Not Be A Big Issue In The Next Election
Yesterday on NBC Nightly News, White House correspondent John Yang said that Bush’s senior political aide Karl Rove has apparently calculated that Iraq will not affect the 2008 elections. Rove, who spoke Sunday at the Aspen Ideas Festival, reportedly said “Iraq may not be a big issue in the next election because, he hopes, troops will be coming home by then.” Watch it:
The Atlantic’s Ross Douhat notes that “Rove talked fluently about the surge as a means to enable us to start drawing down our forces” while the Aspen Daily News provides a few more details on Rove’s speech:
Overall, Rove said the goal was to make the “U.S. combat footprint smaller,” but he also surmised later in the interview that when the next president is sworn in on Jan. 21, 2009, plenty of American troops would still be in Iraq.
Rove appears only to be interested in creating the impression that the troops will be coming home by election day 2008 rather than actually instituting a real redeployment policy. As today’s New York Times reports:
Mr. Rove had warned that if Mr. Bush went too far in announcing a redeployment, the result could include a further cascade of defections — and the passage of legislation that would force a withdrawal by a specific date, a step Mr. Bush has always said he would oppose.
Unfortunately, as Joe Sudbay notes, Rove is still a leading figure in crafting administration policy, which means we can only expect half measures and political rhetoric that appeals to the conservative base, instead of a responsible plan for the orderly withdrawal of American troops from the middle of a civil war.
UPDATE: Claiming sole access to “THE math,” Rove has a history of making political predictions that deny reality, especially in regards to Iraq:
ROVE: I’m looking at all of these Robert and adding them up. I add up to a Republican Senate and Republican House. You may end up with a different math but you are entitled to your math and I’m entitled to THE math.
UPDATE II: ABC News has some more of Rove’s exact quotes:
“I think Iraq may or may not be the big issue,” said Rove. “It depends on where Iraq is by March, or April, or May of next year. I think it’s likely not to be the dominant issue because I think, because of my assumptions about where it is — where it is likely to be.”
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/07/09/rove-iraq-2008-election/
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^^^How the hell does ANYONE call him brilliant, a genius, or a strategist after reading that?!?!? He is a LIAR and an opportunist. He lives of the perception of his genius that he has skillfully planted in your mind.
When Rove gets dap its like watching Oliver North on TV. I am like: Did I miss something. This F*** circumvented the Constitution and various laws to sell arms illegally and aided in poisoning our inner cities. Why the F*** is he on TV talking about patriotism and American pride? Who the hell does not know this bastards record?!?!
He gets nothing from me neither does Rove. You and everybody else, by acknowledging his supposed "genius" allow him to have a credible voice. That's just me.
Hey, but at least we initially agreed...right?
I am going to mark this day down. We actually, roundaboutly, agree.
I know he knows his audience and how to stoke racist, socioeconomic and conservative falmes sublimainally without coming off as the @$$ he is. I just can not, and will not attribute greatness to a man who has committed criminal offenses to give him a competitive advantage and be then be perceived as a savant. Hell no.
He is only hired to make you believe what he wants you to believe (as evidenced in the article below). Again, he should be writing every thesis right now from inside of a federal prison. I have no idea why he continues to gets any type of reverence at all.----------------------------------------------------------------
Rove: Iraq Will Not Be A Big Issue In The Next Election
Yesterday on NBC Nightly News, White House correspondent John Yang said that Bush’s senior political aide Karl Rove has apparently calculated that Iraq will not affect the 2008 elections. Rove, who spoke Sunday at the Aspen Ideas Festival, reportedly said “Iraq may not be a big issue in the next election because, he hopes, troops will be coming home by then.” Watch it:
The Atlantic’s Ross Douhat notes that “Rove talked fluently about the surge as a means to enable us to start drawing down our forces” while the Aspen Daily News provides a few more details on Rove’s speech:
Overall, Rove said the goal was to make the “U.S. combat footprint smaller,” but he also surmised later in the interview that when the next president is sworn in on Jan. 21, 2009, plenty of American troops would still be in Iraq.
Rove appears only to be interested in creating the impression that the troops will be coming home by election day 2008 rather than actually instituting a real redeployment policy.
As today’s New York Times reports:Mr. Rove had warned that if Mr. Bush went too far in announcing a redeployment, the result could include a further cascade of defections — and the passage of legislation that would force a withdrawal by a specific date, a step Mr. Bush has always said he would oppose.
Unfortunately, as Joe Sudbay notes, Rove is still a leading figure in crafting administration policy, which means we can only expect half measures and political rhetoric that appeals to the conservative base, instead of a responsible plan for the orderly withdrawal of American troops from the middle of a civil war.
UPDATE: Claiming sole access to “THE math,” Rove has a history of making political predictions that deny reality, especially in regards to Iraq:
ROVE: I’m looking at all of these Robert and adding them up. I add up to a Republican Senate and Republican House. You may end up with a different math but you are entitled to your math and I’m entitled to THE math.
UPDATE II: ABC News has some more of Rove’s exact quotes:
“I think Iraq may or may not be the big issue,” said Rove. “It depends on where Iraq is by March, or April, or May of next year. I think it’s likely not to be the dominant issue because I think, because of my assumptions about where it is — where it is likely to be.”
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/07/09/rove-iraq-2008-election/
---------------------------------------------------------------
^^^How the hell does ANYONE call him brilliant, a genius, or a strategist after reading that?!?!? He is a LIAR and an opportunist.
He lives of the perception of his genius that he has skillfully planted in your mind.When Rove gets dap its like watching Oliver North on TV. I am like: Did I miss something. This F*** circumvented the Constitution and various laws to sell arms illegally and aided in poisoning our inner cities. Why the F*** is he on TV talking about patriotism and American pride? Who the hell does not know this bastards record?!?!
He gets nothing from me neither does Rove. You and everybody else, by acknowledging his supposed "genius" allow him to have a credible voice.
That's just me.Hey, but at least we initially agreed...right?
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
You're being "Presumptive", once again. Try reading and understanding what is written, as opposed to reading into the words understanding never meant.
QueEx
Stop tripping. Please point out exactly where I acknowledge Rove's genius. Please cut and paste it in this thread so that I can see what you're talking about.. . . he has skillfully planted in <u>your mind</u>.
<u>You</u> and everybody else, by acknowledging his supposed "genius" allow him to have a credible voice.
Hey, but at least we initially agreed...right?
[/B]
You're being "Presumptive", once again. Try reading and understanding what is written, as opposed to reading into the words understanding never meant.
QueEx
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Damn...didn't even last one post before we are at it again. OK, so be it.
I could pose the question: Do you not admire his tenacity and guile in which he accomplishes his agenda? Or I could ask Do you, as a follower of politics, respect his political acumen?. But I won't do that because then that would lead into a long debate of never ending assumptions.
Therefore: There is nothing to cut and paste. I should NOT have put "You and everybody else, by acknowledging his supposed "genius" allow him to have a credible voice" without a definitive acknowledgment from you. I will not shit the debate or move the goal post as is often done around here.
I concede, IN THIS CASE ONLY, I have jumped the gun.
Damn...didn't even last one post before we are at it again. OK, so be it.
I could pose the question: Do you not admire his tenacity and guile in which he accomplishes his agenda? Or I could ask Do you, as a follower of politics, respect his political acumen?. But I won't do that because then that would lead into a long debate of never ending assumptions.
Therefore: There is nothing to cut and paste. I should NOT have put "You and everybody else, by acknowledging his supposed "genius" allow him to have a credible voice" without a definitive acknowledgment from you. I will not shit the debate or move the goal post as is often done around here.
I concede, IN THIS CASE ONLY, I have jumped the gun.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
whats with the hate towards Karl Rove?
I mean last time I checked, Bush is about to be out of office, and Rove is on the Wall street Journal. I don't get why people still mad at them.
GET OVER IT!!!
whats with the hate towards Karl Rove?
I mean last time I checked, Bush is about to be out of office, and Rove is on the Wall street Journal. I don't get why people still mad at them.
GET OVER IT!!!
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Why Karl Rove has a public platform to expound his diabolical machinations is beyond ludicrous to me. However, I do understand the psyche of the simpletons that follow him. They can't help it. ROVE SHOULD BE IN JAIL - period.
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Bush’s New US Attorney a Criminal?
Published March 28th, 2007 in Articles
BBC Television had exposed 2004 voter attack scheme by appointee Griffin, a Rove aide.
Black soldiers and the homeless targeted.
by Greg Palast
There’s only one thing worse than sacking an honest prosecutor. That’s replacing an honest prosecutor with a criminal.
There was one big hoohah in Washington yesterday as House Judiciary Chairman John Conyers pulled down the pants on George Bush’s firing of US Attorneys to expose a scheme to punish prosecutors who wouldn’t bend to political pressure.
griffin-caging.pngBut the Committee missed a big one: Timothy Griffin, Karl Rove’s assistant, the President’s pick as US Attorney for the Eastern District of Arkansas. Griffin, according to BBC Television, was the hidden hand behind a scheme to wipe out the voting rights of 70,000 citizens prior to the 2004 election.
Key voters on Griffin’s hit list: Black soldiers and homeless men and women. Nice guy, eh? Naughty or nice, however, is not the issue. Targeting voters where race is a factor is a felony crime under the Voting Rights Act of 1965.
In October 2004, our investigations team at BBC Newsnight received a series of astonishing emails from Mr. Griffin, then Research Director for the Republican National Committee. He didn’t mean to send them to us. They were highly confidential memos meant only for RNC honchos.
However, Griffin made a wee mistake. Instead of sending the emails — potential evidence of a crime — to email addresses ending with the domain name “@GeorgeWBush.com” he sent them to “@GeorgeWBush.ORG.” A website run by prankster John Wooden who owns “GeorgeWBush.org.” When Wooden got the treasure trove of Rove-ian ravings, he sent them to us.
And we dug in, decoding, and mapping the voters on what Griffin called, “Caging” lists, spreadsheets with 70,000 names of voters marked for challenge. Overwhelmingly, these were Black and Hispanic voters from Democratic precincts.
tim-griffin.jpgThe Griffin scheme was sickly brilliant. We learned that the RNC sent first-class letters to new voters in minority precincts marked, “Do not forward.” Several sheets contained nothing but soldiers, other sheets, homeless shelters. Targets included the Jacksonville Naval Air Station in Florida and that city’s State Street Rescue Mission. Another target, Edward Waters College, a school for African-Americans.
If these voters were not currently at their home voting address, they were tagged as “suspect” and their registration wiped out or their ballot challenged and not counted. Of course, these ‘cages’ captured thousands of students, the homeless and those in the military though they are legitimate voters.
We telephoned those on the hit list, including one Randall Prausa. His wife admitted he wasn’t living at his voting address: Randall was a soldier shipped overseas.
Randall and other soldiers like him who sent in absentee ballots, when challenged, would lose their vote. And they wouldn’t even know it.
And by the way, it’s not illegal for soldiers to vote from overseas — even if they’re Black.
But it is illegal to challenge voters en masse where race is an element in the targeting. So several lawyers told us, including Ralph Neas, famed civil rights attorney with People for the American Way.
Griffin himself ducked our cameras, but his RNC team tried to sell us the notion that the caging sheets were, in fact, not illegal voter hit lists, but a roster of donors to the Bush-Cheney reelection campaign. Republican donors at homeless shelters?
Over the past weeks, Griffin has said he would step down if he had to face Congressional confirmation. However, the President appointed Griffin to the law enforcement post using an odd little provision of the USA Patriot Act that could allow Griffin to skip Congressional questioning altogether.
Therefore, I have a suggestion for Judiciary members. Voting law expert Neas will be testifying today before Conyers’ Committee on the topic of illegal voter “disenfranchisement” — the fancy word for stealing elections by denying voters’ civil rights.
Maybe Conyers should hold a line-up of suspected vote thieves and let Neas identify the perpetrators. That should be easy in the case of the Caging List Criminal. He’d only have to look for the guy wearing a new shiny lawman’s badge.
http://www.gregpalast.com/bushs-new-us-attorney-a-criminal/
Why Karl Rove has a public platform to expound his diabolical machinations is beyond ludicrous to me.
However, I do understand the psyche of the simpletons that follow him. They can't help it. ROVE SHOULD BE IN JAIL - period.----------------------------------------------------------
Bush’s New US Attorney a Criminal?
Published March 28th, 2007 in Articles
BBC Television had exposed 2004 voter attack scheme by appointee Griffin, a Rove aide.
Black soldiers and the homeless targeted.
by Greg Palast
There’s only one thing worse than sacking an honest prosecutor. That’s replacing an honest prosecutor with a criminal.
There was one big hoohah in Washington yesterday as House Judiciary Chairman John Conyers pulled down the pants on George Bush’s firing of US Attorneys to expose a scheme to punish prosecutors who wouldn’t bend to political pressure.
griffin-caging.pngBut the Committee missed a big one: Timothy Griffin, Karl Rove’s assistant, the President’s pick as US Attorney for the Eastern District of Arkansas. Griffin, according to BBC Television, was the hidden hand behind a scheme to wipe out the voting rights of 70,000 citizens prior to the 2004 election.
Key voters on Griffin’s hit list: Black soldiers and homeless men and women. Nice guy, eh? Naughty or nice, however, is not the issue. Targeting voters where race is a factor is a felony crime under the Voting Rights Act of 1965.
In October 2004, our investigations team at BBC Newsnight received a series of astonishing emails from Mr. Griffin, then Research Director for the Republican National Committee. He didn’t mean to send them to us. They were highly confidential memos meant only for RNC honchos.
However, Griffin made a wee mistake. Instead of sending the emails — potential evidence of a crime — to email addresses ending with the domain name “@GeorgeWBush.com” he sent them to “@GeorgeWBush.ORG.” A website run by prankster John Wooden who owns “GeorgeWBush.org.” When Wooden got the treasure trove of Rove-ian ravings, he sent them to us.
And we dug in, decoding, and mapping the voters on what Griffin called, “Caging” lists, spreadsheets with 70,000 names of voters marked for challenge. Overwhelmingly, these were Black and Hispanic voters from Democratic precincts.
tim-griffin.jpgThe Griffin scheme was sickly brilliant. We learned that the RNC sent first-class letters to new voters in minority precincts marked, “Do not forward.” Several sheets contained nothing but soldiers, other sheets, homeless shelters. Targets included the Jacksonville Naval Air Station in Florida and that city’s State Street Rescue Mission. Another target, Edward Waters College, a school for African-Americans.
If these voters were not currently at their home voting address, they were tagged as “suspect” and their registration wiped out or their ballot challenged and not counted. Of course, these ‘cages’ captured thousands of students, the homeless and those in the military though they are legitimate voters.
We telephoned those on the hit list, including one Randall Prausa. His wife admitted he wasn’t living at his voting address: Randall was a soldier shipped overseas.
Randall and other soldiers like him who sent in absentee ballots, when challenged, would lose their vote. And they wouldn’t even know it.
And by the way, it’s not illegal for soldiers to vote from overseas — even if they’re Black.
But it is illegal to challenge voters en masse where race is an element in the targeting. So several lawyers told us, including Ralph Neas, famed civil rights attorney with People for the American Way.
Griffin himself ducked our cameras, but his RNC team tried to sell us the notion that the caging sheets were, in fact, not illegal voter hit lists, but a roster of donors to the Bush-Cheney reelection campaign. Republican donors at homeless shelters?
Over the past weeks, Griffin has said he would step down if he had to face Congressional confirmation. However, the President appointed Griffin to the law enforcement post using an odd little provision of the USA Patriot Act that could allow Griffin to skip Congressional questioning altogether.
Therefore, I have a suggestion for Judiciary members. Voting law expert Neas will be testifying today before Conyers’ Committee on the topic of illegal voter “disenfranchisement” — the fancy word for stealing elections by denying voters’ civil rights.
Maybe Conyers should hold a line-up of suspected vote thieves and let Neas identify the perpetrators. That should be easy in the case of the Caging List Criminal. He’d only have to look for the guy wearing a new shiny lawman’s badge.
http://www.gregpalast.com/bushs-new-us-attorney-a-criminal/
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
I agree with QueEx on this point. Read between the lines and don't let Rove's reputation get the better of your judgment. He is built to appeal to the typical white electorate. Learn how he does it and learn to adapt it to our causes. Whites’ use Blacks and think tanks to analyze Black folks buying and political patterns. We need to learn from them the way they have been learning from us for 400 years and put it to our advantage.
I agree with QueEx on this point. Read between the lines and don't let Rove's reputation get the better of your judgment. He is built to appeal to the typical white electorate. Learn how he does it and learn to adapt it to our causes. Whites’ use Blacks and think tanks to analyze Black folks buying and political patterns. We need to learn from them the way they have been learning from us for 400 years and put it to our advantage.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
This main point of Rove's argument is stupid and misleading (which he may very well understand).
Obama's points about removing the influence of lobbyists-- institutional reform as well as his pledge not to take their money-- has to do with lobbyists being disproportionately powerful-- the "iron triangle" of politics. It does not mean that everything any lobbyist works for is bad; it atacks lobbying as the motivating factor. Rove claims Obama needs to abandon any position he may hold that may be advanced by a lobbyist, which is absurd.
As QueEx said here, the major insight comes from seeing the line of attack being prepared for use... It makes sense to attack Obama as more liberal than he lets on-- Hell, I'd have never voted for him over John Edwards if I didn't think so myself.
This main point of Rove's argument is stupid and misleading (which he may very well understand).
Obama's points about removing the influence of lobbyists-- institutional reform as well as his pledge not to take their money-- has to do with lobbyists being disproportionately powerful-- the "iron triangle" of politics. It does not mean that everything any lobbyist works for is bad; it atacks lobbying as the motivating factor. Rove claims Obama needs to abandon any position he may hold that may be advanced by a lobbyist, which is absurd.
As QueEx said here, the major insight comes from seeing the line of attack being prepared for use... It makes sense to attack Obama as more liberal than he lets on-- Hell, I'd have never voted for him over John Edwards if I didn't think so myself.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
I got all that^^^. Do you all get any of this from my previous post:
"I know he knows his audience and how to stoke racist, socioeconomic and conservative flames subliminally without coming off as the @$$ he is. I just can not, and will not attribute greatness to a man who has committed criminal offenses to give him a competitive advantage and be then be perceived as a savant. Hell no. He is only hired to make you believe what he wants you to believe (as evidenced in the article below). Again, he should be writing every thesis right now from inside of a federal prison. I have no idea why he continues to gets any type of reverence at all."
You all are responding to my comments like you don't. I can't tell...
I got all that^^^. Do you all get any of this from my previous post:
"I know he knows his audience and how to stoke racist, socioeconomic and conservative flames subliminally without coming off as the @$$ he is. I just can not, and will not attribute greatness to a man who has committed criminal offenses to give him a competitive advantage and be then be perceived as a savant. Hell no. He is only hired to make you believe what he wants you to believe (as evidenced in the article below). Again, he should be writing every thesis right now from inside of a federal prison. I have no idea why he continues to gets any type of reverence at all."
You all are responding to my comments like you don't. I can't tell...
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Uh... I wasn't responding to your comments, man.
Looking at what you wrote, though, you seem to be very hyped up over nothing.
Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man... If you can't grasp what practical value comes from analysis of the other side's most talented strategists, that's on you. You may think he should be in jail or whatever else but he's not and understanding either the thought process or what he wants perceived as his thought process is of some value.
The fact that you're lashing out at anybody who comments on his words and then morph the act of commenting into reverence makes it hard to have honest discussion.
You all are responding to my comments like you don't. I can't tell...
Uh... I wasn't responding to your comments, man.
Looking at what you wrote, though, you seem to be very hyped up over nothing.
Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man... If you can't grasp what practical value comes from analysis of the other side's most talented strategists, that's on you. You may think he should be in jail or whatever else but he's not and understanding either the thought process or what he wants perceived as his thought process is of some value.
The fact that you're lashing out at anybody who comments on his words and then morph the act of commenting into reverence makes it hard to have honest discussion.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
I believe Karl Rove only wants to remain relevent. Americans know that the now infamous unwarranted attacks against John McCain during the '00 campaign for the Republican nominee were orchastrated by Mr. Rove.
The PBS show Frontline did a documentary on Karl Rove and his exploits. You can watch it online, here's a link: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/architect/
Most people know that Karl Rove for decades has used every legal, border line, and Illegal tactic he could to win elections for his candidate. After the nation finally spat the taste of Rove out of our mouths he's back. Some 5 months or so later he's become a FOX News contributor and editorialist dispensing "advise".
It's only a cry for attention.
I believe Karl Rove only wants to remain relevent. Americans know that the now infamous unwarranted attacks against John McCain during the '00 campaign for the Republican nominee were orchastrated by Mr. Rove.
The PBS show Frontline did a documentary on Karl Rove and his exploits. You can watch it online, here's a link: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/architect/
Most people know that Karl Rove for decades has used every legal, border line, and Illegal tactic he could to win elections for his candidate. After the nation finally spat the taste of Rove out of our mouths he's back. Some 5 months or so later he's become a FOX News contributor and editorialist dispensing "advise".
It's only a cry for attention.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Uh... I wasn't responding to your comments, man.
Looking at what you wrote, though, you seem to be very hyped up over nothing.
Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man... If you can't grasp what practical value comes from analysis of the other side's most talented or at least sucessful strategists, that's on you. You may think he should be in jail or whatever else but he's not and understanding either the thought process or what he wants perceived as his thought process is of some value.
The fact that you're lashing out at anybody who comments on his words and then morph the act of commenting into reverence makes it hard to have honest discussion.
You all are responding to my comments like you don't. I can't tell...
Uh... I wasn't responding to your comments, man.
Looking at what you wrote, though, you seem to be very hyped up over nothing.
Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man... If you can't grasp what practical value comes from analysis of the other side's most talented or at least sucessful strategists, that's on you. You may think he should be in jail or whatever else but he's not and understanding either the thought process or what he wants perceived as his thought process is of some value.
The fact that you're lashing out at anybody who comments on his words and then morph the act of commenting into reverence makes it hard to have honest discussion.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
1. You responded before I could come back and change my response to: "IF YOU ARE reacting to my posts then you all are responding to my comments like you don't." My initial, uncorrected, statement would lead me into the same type of argument as well. My bad.
2. "Looking at what you wrote, though, you seem to be very hyped up over nothing.
Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man... If you can't grasp what practical value comes from analysis of the other side's most talented strategists, that's on you. You may think he should be in jail or whatever else but he's not and understanding either the thought process or what he wants perceived as his thought process is of some value."
* Depriving people the right to vote through caging does not make you talented.
* Illegally firing US attorneys to get one of you corrupt cronies in does not make yo talented.
* Outing a CIA agent and Keeping your job does not make you talented.
You write "Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man..." but at the same time you give this man dap for his "intellectual" prowess in the area of politics. You footnote the fact that he is not in jail, but I say that is the biggest travesty. If somebody in the government would have cornered him on just ONE of the three things I've listed - it's a wrap.
We are debating a man affectionately called "Bush's Brain." Look at our world as a result of the lack of significant neural firings between the two of them. If you want to find practical value in Rove's philosophy go back and look at how he got Bush elected, undercut McCain's presidential bid with negative attack ads, and how he chaired the White House Iraq Group. Its all there for you to research. He's not Solomon, the Holy Grail or the Brain Bug (from Starship Troopers). Listening to his "insights" will not do for the democratic party what the Enigma machine did for the Allies in WWII. No code is being cracked here.
Last. I "officially" lashed out at Que earlier in this thread not you or anyone else.I addressed that with him already.
Peace.
1. You responded before I could come back and change my response to: "IF YOU ARE reacting to my posts then you all are responding to my comments like you don't." My initial, uncorrected, statement would lead me into the same type of argument as well. My bad.
2. "Looking at what you wrote, though, you seem to be very hyped up over nothing.
Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man... If you can't grasp what practical value comes from analysis of the other side's most talented strategists, that's on you. You may think he should be in jail or whatever else but he's not and understanding either the thought process or what he wants perceived as his thought process is of some value."
* Depriving people the right to vote through caging does not make you talented.
* Illegally firing US attorneys to get one of you corrupt cronies in does not make yo talented.
* Outing a CIA agent and Keeping your job does not make you talented.
You write "Greatness? Reverence??? Nobody is revering anybody, man..." but at the same time you give this man dap for his "intellectual" prowess in the area of politics. You footnote the fact that he is not in jail, but I say that is the biggest travesty. If somebody in the government would have cornered him on just ONE of the three things I've listed - it's a wrap.
We are debating a man affectionately called "Bush's Brain." Look at our world as a result of the lack of significant neural firings between the two of them. If you want to find practical value in Rove's philosophy go back and look at how he got Bush elected, undercut McCain's presidential bid with negative attack ads, and how he chaired the White House Iraq Group. Its all there for you to research. He's not Solomon, the Holy Grail or the Brain Bug (from Starship Troopers). Listening to his "insights" will not do for the democratic party what the Enigma machine did for the Allies in WWII. No code is being cracked here.
Last. I "officially" lashed out at Que earlier in this thread not you or anyone else.
I addressed that with him already.Peace.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
If you want to find practical value in Rove's philosophy go back and look at how he got Bush elected, undercut McCain's presidential bid with negative attack ads, and how he chaired the White House Iraq Group. Its all there for you to research.
I think what got Bush elected in 2000 and 2004 is self-evidently valuable in analyzing the process for the Democratic nominee for President in 2008.
Everything else is extra.
If you want to find practical value in Rove's philosophy go back and look at how he got Bush elected, undercut McCain's presidential bid with negative attack ads, and how he chaired the White House Iraq Group. Its all there for you to research.
I think what got Bush elected in 2000 and 2004 is self-evidently valuable in analyzing the process for the Democratic nominee for President in 2008.
Everything else is extra.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Karl Rove wanted pictures, Alabaman alleges
by Mark Silva
Karl Rove, former chief political adviser to President Bush and "architect'' of the president's election campaigns, once sought salacious photographs of the Democratic governor of Alabama, an aide to the convicted ex-governor tells CBS News' 60 Minutes in an interview airing Sunday.
Yet there is no truth to this allegation, according to Rove's lawyer, who tells the Tribune the president's adviser never asked for any such thing.
The Republican operative in Alabama tells CBS that Rove asked her to try to prove the state's Democratic governor was unfaithful to his wife in an effort to thwart the highly successful politician's re-election. Rove's attempt to smear Don Siegelman was part of a Republican campaign to ruin him that finally succeeded in imprisoning him, says the operative, Jill Simpson, in an interview with 60 Minutes' Scott Pelley.
CBS News says: "Simpson spoke to Pelley because, she says, Siegelman's seven-year sentence for bribery bothers her. She recalls what Rove, then President Bush's senior political adviser, asked her to do at a 2001 meeting in this exchange from Sunday's report:
"Karl Rove asked you to take pictures of Siegelman?" asks Pelley. "Yes," replies Simpson. "In a compromising, sexual position with one of his aides," clarifies Pelley. "Yes, if I could," says Simpson.
"Simpson says she found no evidence of infidelity despite months of observation,'' CBS reports. "She tells Pelley that Rove had made requests for information from her before in her capacity as an "opposition researcher" for Republicans running for office.
Rove would not speak to 60 Minutes, but elsewhere has denied being involved in efforts to discredit Siegelman. But Rove's attorney, Robert Luskin, offered this comment for the Tribune:
"At no time did Karl ask Ms. Simpson, or anyone else, to take compromising photos of Gov. Siegelman,'' said Luskin, suggesting this isn't the first time Simpson has steered people astray. "There was no truth to her earlier allegations and no truth to this one, either.''
Siegelman was convicted of bribery in a case that has drawn criticism, CBS notes.
"In fact, 52 former states' attorneys general from both political parties petitioned Congress to investigate Siegelman's case, resulting in hearings held last fall.'' CBS adds. " Says Grant Woods, the former Republican attorney general of Arizona and one of those who petitioned Congress:
"I haven't seen a case with this many red flags on it that pointed towards a real injustice being done," he tells Pelley. "I personally believe that what happened here is that they targeted Don Siegelman because they could not beat him fair and square.'''
Siegelman was the first in Alabama history to be elected to all four of the state's highest offices of secretary of state, attorney general, lieutenant governor and governor, and he did it as a Democrat in the heavily Republican state. The CBS program airs at 7 pm EST on Sunday.
Posted by Mark Silva on February 23, 2008 7:00 AM | Perma
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/02/karl_rove_wanted_pictures_alab.html
Karl Rove wanted pictures, Alabaman alleges
by Mark Silva
Karl Rove, former chief political adviser to President Bush and "architect'' of the president's election campaigns, once sought salacious photographs of the Democratic governor of Alabama, an aide to the convicted ex-governor tells CBS News' 60 Minutes in an interview airing Sunday.
Yet there is no truth to this allegation, according to Rove's lawyer, who tells the Tribune the president's adviser never asked for any such thing.
The Republican operative in Alabama tells CBS that Rove asked her to try to prove the state's Democratic governor was unfaithful to his wife in an effort to thwart the highly successful politician's re-election. Rove's attempt to smear Don Siegelman was part of a Republican campaign to ruin him that finally succeeded in imprisoning him, says the operative, Jill Simpson, in an interview with 60 Minutes' Scott Pelley.
CBS News says: "Simpson spoke to Pelley because, she says, Siegelman's seven-year sentence for bribery bothers her. She recalls what Rove, then President Bush's senior political adviser, asked her to do at a 2001 meeting in this exchange from Sunday's report:
"Karl Rove asked you to take pictures of Siegelman?" asks Pelley. "Yes," replies Simpson. "In a compromising, sexual position with one of his aides," clarifies Pelley. "Yes, if I could," says Simpson.
"Simpson says she found no evidence of infidelity despite months of observation,'' CBS reports. "She tells Pelley that Rove had made requests for information from her before in her capacity as an "opposition researcher" for Republicans running for office.
Rove would not speak to 60 Minutes, but elsewhere has denied being involved in efforts to discredit Siegelman. But Rove's attorney, Robert Luskin, offered this comment for the Tribune:
"At no time did Karl ask Ms. Simpson, or anyone else, to take compromising photos of Gov. Siegelman,'' said Luskin, suggesting this isn't the first time Simpson has steered people astray. "There was no truth to her earlier allegations and no truth to this one, either.''
Siegelman was convicted of bribery in a case that has drawn criticism, CBS notes.
"In fact, 52 former states' attorneys general from both political parties petitioned Congress to investigate Siegelman's case, resulting in hearings held last fall.'' CBS adds. " Says Grant Woods, the former Republican attorney general of Arizona and one of those who petitioned Congress:
"I haven't seen a case with this many red flags on it that pointed towards a real injustice being done," he tells Pelley. "I personally believe that what happened here is that they targeted Don Siegelman because they could not beat him fair and square.'''
Siegelman was the first in Alabama history to be elected to all four of the state's highest offices of secretary of state, attorney general, lieutenant governor and governor, and he did it as a Democrat in the heavily Republican state. The CBS program airs at 7 pm EST on Sunday.
Posted by Mark Silva on February 23, 2008 7:00 AM | Perma
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/02/karl_rove_wanted_pictures_alab.html
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Karl Rove wanted pictures, Alabaman alleges
by Mark Silva
Karl Rove, former chief political adviser to President Bush and "architect'' of the president's election campaigns, once sought salacious photographs of the Democratic governor of Alabama, an aide to the convicted ex-governor tells CBS News' 60 Minutes in an interview airing Sunday.
Yet there is no truth to this allegation, according to Rove's lawyer, who tells the Tribune the president's adviser never asked for any such thing.
The Republican operative in Alabama tells CBS that Rove asked her to try to prove the state's Democratic governor was unfaithful to his wife in an effort to thwart the highly successful politician's re-election. Rove's attempt to smear Don Siegelman was part of a Republican campaign to ruin him that finally succeeded in imprisoning him, says the operative, Jill Simpson, in an interview with 60 Minutes' Scott Pelley.
CBS News says: "Simpson spoke to Pelley because, she says, Siegelman's seven-year sentence for bribery bothers her. She recalls what Rove, then President Bush's senior political adviser, asked her to do at a 2001 meeting in this exchange from Sunday's report:
"Karl Rove asked you to take pictures of Siegelman?" asks Pelley. "Yes," replies Simpson. "In a compromising, sexual position with one of his aides," clarifies Pelley. "Yes, if I could," says Simpson.
"Simpson says she found no evidence of infidelity despite months of observation,'' CBS reports. "She tells Pelley that Rove had made requests for information from her before in her capacity as an "opposition researcher" for Republicans running for office.
Rove would not speak to 60 Minutes, but elsewhere has denied being involved in efforts to discredit Siegelman. But Rove's attorney, Robert Luskin, offered this comment for the Tribune:
"At no time did Karl ask Ms. Simpson, or anyone else, to take compromising photos of Gov. Siegelman,'' said Luskin, suggesting this isn't the first time Simpson has steered people astray. "There was no truth to her earlier allegations and no truth to this one, either.''
Siegelman was convicted of bribery in a case that has drawn criticism, CBS notes.
"In fact, 52 former states' attorneys general from both political parties petitioned Congress to investigate Siegelman's case, resulting in hearings held last fall.'' CBS adds. " Says Grant Woods, the former Republican attorney general of Arizona and one of those who petitioned Congress:
"I haven't seen a case with this many red flags on it that pointed towards a real injustice being done," he tells Pelley. "I personally believe that what happened here is that they targeted Don Siegelman because they could not beat him fair and square.'''
Siegelman was the first in Alabama history to be elected to all four of the state's highest offices of secretary of state, attorney general, lieutenant governor and governor, and he did it as a Democrat in the heavily Republican state. The CBS program airs at 7 pm EST on Sunday.
Posted by Mark Silva on February 23, 2008 7:00 AM | Permalink
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/02/karl_rove_wanted_pictures_alab.html
Karl Rove wanted pictures, Alabaman alleges
by Mark Silva
Karl Rove, former chief political adviser to President Bush and "architect'' of the president's election campaigns, once sought salacious photographs of the Democratic governor of Alabama, an aide to the convicted ex-governor tells CBS News' 60 Minutes in an interview airing Sunday.
Yet there is no truth to this allegation, according to Rove's lawyer, who tells the Tribune the president's adviser never asked for any such thing.
The Republican operative in Alabama tells CBS that Rove asked her to try to prove the state's Democratic governor was unfaithful to his wife in an effort to thwart the highly successful politician's re-election. Rove's attempt to smear Don Siegelman was part of a Republican campaign to ruin him that finally succeeded in imprisoning him, says the operative, Jill Simpson, in an interview with 60 Minutes' Scott Pelley.
CBS News says: "Simpson spoke to Pelley because, she says, Siegelman's seven-year sentence for bribery bothers her. She recalls what Rove, then President Bush's senior political adviser, asked her to do at a 2001 meeting in this exchange from Sunday's report:
"Karl Rove asked you to take pictures of Siegelman?" asks Pelley. "Yes," replies Simpson. "In a compromising, sexual position with one of his aides," clarifies Pelley. "Yes, if I could," says Simpson.
"Simpson says she found no evidence of infidelity despite months of observation,'' CBS reports. "She tells Pelley that Rove had made requests for information from her before in her capacity as an "opposition researcher" for Republicans running for office.
Rove would not speak to 60 Minutes, but elsewhere has denied being involved in efforts to discredit Siegelman. But Rove's attorney, Robert Luskin, offered this comment for the Tribune:
"At no time did Karl ask Ms. Simpson, or anyone else, to take compromising photos of Gov. Siegelman,'' said Luskin, suggesting this isn't the first time Simpson has steered people astray. "There was no truth to her earlier allegations and no truth to this one, either.''
Siegelman was convicted of bribery in a case that has drawn criticism, CBS notes.
"In fact, 52 former states' attorneys general from both political parties petitioned Congress to investigate Siegelman's case, resulting in hearings held last fall.'' CBS adds. " Says Grant Woods, the former Republican attorney general of Arizona and one of those who petitioned Congress:
"I haven't seen a case with this many red flags on it that pointed towards a real injustice being done," he tells Pelley. "I personally believe that what happened here is that they targeted Don Siegelman because they could not beat him fair and square.'''
Siegelman was the first in Alabama history to be elected to all four of the state's highest offices of secretary of state, attorney general, lieutenant governor and governor, and he did it as a Democrat in the heavily Republican state. The CBS program airs at 7 pm EST on Sunday.
Posted by Mark Silva on February 23, 2008 7:00 AM | Permalink
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/02/karl_rove_wanted_pictures_alab.html
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
I think he's done it and if he keeps on this trajectory, he is going to smash McCain in the presidential debates.
I think he's done it and if he keeps on this trajectory, he is going to smash McCain in the presidential debates.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
MSNBC said it was a low scoring debate and that they could not tell a winner, but I though Obama nailed it perfectly. How do yo have Hillary quoting Saturday Night Live as a reference, insulting Obama and obviously making a "canned" objection to the moderators and the debate format and still find her performance credible?
Yes. I must say that I was veeeeeeeeeryyyyyy impressed by his ability to remain calm and sidestep Hillary's attacks. I REALLY liked the way he gave the analogy of the ditch for the Iraq vote. Yes he voted like her in the Senate, but what could he do at that point. I don't think the medial covered how masterful a stroke that was.
MSNBC said it was a low scoring debate and that they could not tell a winner, but I though Obama nailed it perfectly. How do yo have Hillary quoting Saturday Night Live as a reference, insulting Obama and obviously making a "canned" objection to the moderators and the debate format and still find her performance credible?
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
Yeah. He killed her with that. It's funny how journalists are attempting to score it as a tie.. but if you look at the polls on their own sites... their actual readers have scored it an overwhelming win for Obama..by a landslide.
I like how he played her on that Reject and Denounce shit.
McCain, from what I've seen, is a horrible debater and it may end up being a Nixon vs. JFK moment during their first debate...
Yeah. He killed her with that. It's funny how journalists are attempting to score it as a tie.. but if you look at the polls on their own sites... their actual readers have scored it an overwhelming win for Obama..by a landslide.
I like how he played her on that Reject and Denounce shit.
McCain, from what I've seen, is a horrible debater and it may end up being a Nixon vs. JFK moment during their first debate...
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
McCain is going to lean heavily on the moderators to attack Obama for him. He is stoic and mechanical in his delivery ALL THE TIME. He will pull the patriot card. I believe that if Obama can tie Him to Bush at every turn, recant how he mislead the viewing public about how safe Iraq was (then had an armed guard provide security for him in the SAFE streets of Iraq) and pick apart how the surge is not really working according to the initial guidelines of political reconciliation, it will make it much easier on him to win the American public (white people). The country has war/terror fatigue. If Obama is not afraid to frame the debate from that standpoint and point out how McCain is more of the same its a wrap IMO.
McCain is going to lean heavily on the moderators to attack Obama for him. He is stoic and mechanical in his delivery ALL THE TIME. He will pull the patriot card. I believe that if Obama can tie Him to Bush at every turn, recant how he mislead the viewing public about how safe Iraq was (then had an armed guard provide security for him in the SAFE streets of Iraq) and pick apart how the surge is not really working according to the initial guidelines of political reconciliation, it will make it much easier on him to win the American public (white people). The country has war/terror fatigue. If Obama is not afraid to frame the debate from that standpoint and point out how McCain is more of the same its a wrap IMO.
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
(1) Yeah, but while he is pounding and pounding McCain, it would be wise to continuously measure the temperament of the American people. Too much pounding can generate sympathy for the person being pounded.
(2) The American public is not white people. Geez. I can't believe you would employ such a definition.
QueEx
McCain is going to lean heavily on the moderators to attack Obama for him. He is stoic and mechanical in his delivery ALL THE TIME. He will pull the patriot card. I believe that if Obama can tie Him to Bush at every turn, recant how he mislead the viewing public about how safe Iraq was (then had an armed guard provide security for him in the SAFE streets of Iraq) and pick apart how the surge is not really working according to the initial guidelines of political reconciliation, it will make it much easier on him to win the American public (white people). The country has war/terror fatigue. If Obama is not afraid to frame the debate from that standpoint and point out how McCain is more of the same its a wrap IMO.
(1) Yeah, but while he is pounding and pounding McCain, it would be wise to continuously measure the temperament of the American people. Too much pounding can generate sympathy for the person being pounded.
(2) The American public is not white people. Geez. I can't believe you would employ such a definition.
QueEx
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part II
The exit polling in Michigan stated that 51% of REPUBLICANS were dissatisfied with the republican party. There is a pool of disgust and frustration for Obama to wade in. There is strong anti-war and anti-Bush sentiment shared in both party's. To ignore that and milk it for as much as humanly possible would be a big mistake.
2. I could show stats about the racial make up of America and how we are not the majority. I could pooint out that while Hillary can rally her minority base (women) with the veiled claim that things will be different whe she (wink - a woman) is in office and Obama is not at liberty to say the same thing about being an African American. But why. I'll sum it up by simply stating - DAMN...I was being sarcastic.
(1) Yeah, but while he is pounding and pounding McCain, it would be wise to continuously measure the temperament of the American people. Too much pounding can generate sympathy for the person being pounded.
(2) The American public is not white people. Geez. I can't believe you would employ such a definition.
QueEx
The exit polling in Michigan stated that 51% of REPUBLICANS were dissatisfied with the republican party. There is a pool of disgust and frustration for Obama to wade in. There is strong anti-war and anti-Bush sentiment shared in both party's. To ignore that and milk it for as much as humanly possible would be a big mistake.
2. I could show stats about the racial make up of America and how we are not the majority. I could pooint out that while Hillary can rally her minority base (women) with the veiled claim that things will be different whe she (wink - a woman) is in office and Obama is not at liberty to say the same thing about being an African American. But why. I'll sum it up by simply stating - DAMN...I was being sarcastic.
Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part III
<font size="5"><center>
How can Barack Obama win keys to the
White House? Karl Rove offers a few tips</font size></center>
Karl Rove suggested that race, far from hurting Barack
Obama probably works in his favour
The Times (London)
Tom Baldwin in Washington
April 26, 2007
Karl Rove, who masterminded the last two Republican victories in presidential elections, is gazing with undisguised relish at the giant target being painted on Barack Obama's back before the next one.
In an interview with The Times yesterday, he described the likely Democratic nominee as a “frail” candidate, who represents the values of an out-of-touch liberal social elite and demonstrates “tone deafness” to the concerns of ordinary Americans.
“You have probably seen this kind of guy at London parties, trailing ash from a fashionable cigarette into the carpet and making snide remarks about someone ‘being an abominable bore’,” Mr Rove said.
He suggested that voters have not heard the last of Mr Obama’s recent comments at a San Francisco fund-raiser, where he suggested small town Pennsylvanians were clinging to guns and religion because they were “bitter”.
The candidate sounded, Mr Rove said, as if he was following in the footsteps of his anthropologist mother “reporting on the exotic species of voter he had encountered in some dark corner on the opposite side of the globe”.
All this is a far cry from just a few short weeks ago when Mr Obama’s soaring oratory — his promise to heal racial divisions or transcend the partisan politics of an older generation — had Republican strategists regarding him with shock and awe.
It is now the Democrats’ turn to worry. Mr Obama’s decisive defeat in this week’s Pennsylvania primary has been followed by whispers of alarm that they may end up with a candidate who is listing badly — even holed below the water line — just as he is about to cross the finishing line in his race with Mrs Clinton. His failure to win white working-class voters in states like Ohio and Pennsylvania — both certain to be important battlegrounds in November’s general election — has raised doubts about his fitness for the fight against John McCain. He sometimes appears drained by his fight with Mrs Clinton, a woman 14 years older than him, taking time off the campaign trail this week and setting himself a light schedule for the coming days.
Whereas he once energised rallies with the chant, “Fired up! Ready to go!” he now complains about feeling tired and the length of primary season, or says he wants to go home to see his young family.
If Mr Obama loses again in Indiana on May 6, then panic will spread through the party. His campaign spent much of yesterday explaining to the Democratic super-delegates — who could yet wrest the nomination away from him, why he remains the best candidate to beat the Republicans. Mr Obama himself was busy shoring up his battered Everyman credentials by holding a press conference at an Indianapolis petrol station.
But Mr Rove said that “unless something extraordinary happens”, Mr Obama’s lead among elected delegates still means that he will be the Democratic nominee.
And, although it may be unwelcome right now, Mr Rove even had some advice for him. First, he cease making attacks on Mrs Clinton and Mr McCain, which are “corrosive of his fundamental message about representing a new kind of politics”.
Mr Rove also pointed out that Mr Obama cannot stand on a platform promising post-partisan politics when he has virtually nothing to show on this front from sitting in the Senate for three years.
“He should spend less time on the campaign trail between now and September and more time in the Senate” trying to get such an achievement under his belt, Mr Rove said. “The best way to prove a message is to live it.”
Mr Obama has also been embarrassed in recent weeks by his black liberationist pastor Jeremiah Wright, who returned to the airwaves yesterday to denounce the media for portraying him as “some sort of fanatic”.
Unhelpfully, he explained that one of the differences between him and Mr Obama is that he “goes out as a politician and says what he has to say as a politician”.
It is a treacherous, racially-charged subject, and Mr McCain has been careful this week to disassociate himself from Republicans who have launched a TV advert attacking Mr Obama’s links with the pastor.
But Mr Rove suggested that race, far from hurting Mr Obama probably works in his favour by attracting white voters who regard the prospect of a black president as a “hopeful thing”.
A bigger problem for Mr Obama, he said, is winning industrial states like Ohio, Michigan and Pennsylvania with a voter base that resembles “George McGovern's coalition of college students and white wine sippers”.
Mr Rove cited polls showing that as many as 26 per cent of Mrs Clinton’s supporters will vote Republican if Mr Obama is the nominee, saying even though such numbers were likely to come down before November, “there are going to be significant numbers of defections in this contest”.
His scorn for Mr Obama was almost palpable as he described how the candidate had developed a habit of “parsing” when faced by criticism or complaining about rough treatment as he did after last week’s TV debate against Mrs Clinton.
This makes him look like a whiner, Mr Rove said. “She has been getting tough with him — but it's not as tough as it will get from all sorts of places in a general election.”
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article3819117.ece
<font size="5"><center>
How can Barack Obama win keys to the
White House? Karl Rove offers a few tips</font size></center>
Karl Rove suggested that race, far from hurting Barack
Obama probably works in his favour
The Times (London)
Tom Baldwin in Washington
April 26, 2007
Karl Rove, who masterminded the last two Republican victories in presidential elections, is gazing with undisguised relish at the giant target being painted on Barack Obama's back before the next one.
In an interview with The Times yesterday, he described the likely Democratic nominee as a “frail” candidate, who represents the values of an out-of-touch liberal social elite and demonstrates “tone deafness” to the concerns of ordinary Americans.
“You have probably seen this kind of guy at London parties, trailing ash from a fashionable cigarette into the carpet and making snide remarks about someone ‘being an abominable bore’,” Mr Rove said.
He suggested that voters have not heard the last of Mr Obama’s recent comments at a San Francisco fund-raiser, where he suggested small town Pennsylvanians were clinging to guns and religion because they were “bitter”.
The candidate sounded, Mr Rove said, as if he was following in the footsteps of his anthropologist mother “reporting on the exotic species of voter he had encountered in some dark corner on the opposite side of the globe”.
All this is a far cry from just a few short weeks ago when Mr Obama’s soaring oratory — his promise to heal racial divisions or transcend the partisan politics of an older generation — had Republican strategists regarding him with shock and awe.
It is now the Democrats’ turn to worry. Mr Obama’s decisive defeat in this week’s Pennsylvania primary has been followed by whispers of alarm that they may end up with a candidate who is listing badly — even holed below the water line — just as he is about to cross the finishing line in his race with Mrs Clinton. His failure to win white working-class voters in states like Ohio and Pennsylvania — both certain to be important battlegrounds in November’s general election — has raised doubts about his fitness for the fight against John McCain. He sometimes appears drained by his fight with Mrs Clinton, a woman 14 years older than him, taking time off the campaign trail this week and setting himself a light schedule for the coming days.
Whereas he once energised rallies with the chant, “Fired up! Ready to go!” he now complains about feeling tired and the length of primary season, or says he wants to go home to see his young family.
If Mr Obama loses again in Indiana on May 6, then panic will spread through the party. His campaign spent much of yesterday explaining to the Democratic super-delegates — who could yet wrest the nomination away from him, why he remains the best candidate to beat the Republicans. Mr Obama himself was busy shoring up his battered Everyman credentials by holding a press conference at an Indianapolis petrol station.
But Mr Rove said that “unless something extraordinary happens”, Mr Obama’s lead among elected delegates still means that he will be the Democratic nominee.
And, although it may be unwelcome right now, Mr Rove even had some advice for him. First, he cease making attacks on Mrs Clinton and Mr McCain, which are “corrosive of his fundamental message about representing a new kind of politics”.
Mr Rove also pointed out that Mr Obama cannot stand on a platform promising post-partisan politics when he has virtually nothing to show on this front from sitting in the Senate for three years.
“He should spend less time on the campaign trail between now and September and more time in the Senate” trying to get such an achievement under his belt, Mr Rove said. “The best way to prove a message is to live it.”
Mr Obama has also been embarrassed in recent weeks by his black liberationist pastor Jeremiah Wright, who returned to the airwaves yesterday to denounce the media for portraying him as “some sort of fanatic”.
Unhelpfully, he explained that one of the differences between him and Mr Obama is that he “goes out as a politician and says what he has to say as a politician”.
It is a treacherous, racially-charged subject, and Mr McCain has been careful this week to disassociate himself from Republicans who have launched a TV advert attacking Mr Obama’s links with the pastor.
But Mr Rove suggested that race, far from hurting Mr Obama probably works in his favour by attracting white voters who regard the prospect of a black president as a “hopeful thing”.
A bigger problem for Mr Obama, he said, is winning industrial states like Ohio, Michigan and Pennsylvania with a voter base that resembles “George McGovern's coalition of college students and white wine sippers”.
Mr Rove cited polls showing that as many as 26 per cent of Mrs Clinton’s supporters will vote Republican if Mr Obama is the nominee, saying even though such numbers were likely to come down before November, “there are going to be significant numbers of defections in this contest”.
His scorn for Mr Obama was almost palpable as he described how the candidate had developed a habit of “parsing” when faced by criticism or complaining about rough treatment as he did after last week’s TV debate against Mrs Clinton.
This makes him look like a whiner, Mr Rove said. “She has been getting tough with him — but it's not as tough as it will get from all sorts of places in a general election.”
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article3819117.ece
Re: Karl Rove Advice to Obama Part III
Karl Rove's advice to Obama I
(Memo to Obama: win Iowa or lose the race)
Posted December 9, 2007
http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=216846&highlight=rove+obama
`
Karl Rove's advice to Obama I
(Memo to Obama: win Iowa or lose the race)
Posted December 9, 2007
http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=216846&highlight=rove+obama
`