WTF? Check your locks.
- Thread starter Gulley
- Start date
Man.... locksmith talked me into paying $100 to rekey my house over the summer and I was almost too cheap to do it. He explained this to me and I thought he was fulla shit, trying to "bump" the price up. I bought the "high end" locks and am just now happy I did.
If you've ever installed a lock, you should already be aware of how easy it is to 'break' that same lock.
A son of a cop gave me this qoute;
"A lock only keeps out an honest man!"
As long as you have windows [and doors], your home is NOT safe. All the same, buy good locks and add guards that protect against shims and screwdrivers as picks. Anything that slows down a criminal ain't a bad investment.
How much fear do you want to live in?
A son of a cop gave me this qoute;
"A lock only keeps out an honest man!"
As long as you have windows [and doors], your home is NOT safe. All the same, buy good locks and add guards that protect against shims and screwdrivers as picks. Anything that slows down a criminal ain't a bad investment.
How much fear do you want to live in?
k... imma start jackin niggaz now.
i have medeco's that i take with me every place i lived. they're great cause you need to have a key card to hand to the locksmith to make you a copy
I think the bigger picture as stated above, there is no such thing as really safe when it comes to criminals
get renters insurance.
I think the bigger picture as stated above, there is no such thing as really safe when it comes to criminals
get renters insurance.
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Banned
I'm glad I have guns and since the governor changed the gun law in my state a few years ago. You can pursue a criminal in your home if he is leaving. 
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What I really like about it, is now if you get up in the middle of the night and see someone breaking in your car, you can get a gun and shoot them.
Ya'll listen up. I'm about to give away a bunch of stuff for free...
This isn't new. It has been around for years. However, recent locksport enthusiasts, such as Toool have popularized it on the internet. Also, Marc Tobias has written about the subject, as well as other security vulnerabilities.
Generally, "bumping" requires more knowledge and skill that what many may believe on first blush. One should keep in mind that ANY lock can be picked by someone who knows how.
If you don't do your research and go arond representing that "key bumping" is a common risk, then you'll be wrong.
This type of threat relates primarily to seruptitious entry... needing to sneak in and out without anyone knowing you have been there. This is a very specific type of threat and is much different than even a professional thief.
A thief will most likely just break in, as would most criminals, because thier crimes are about to be known.
If you have certain other type of things going on, such as industrial security, and some issues that CP pros deal with.. then seruptitious entry may be a concern. However.. this is pretty rare and countermeasures suggested not by the vulnerability, but rather by the threat.
It requires a key that will fit into the keyway.
Using restricted keyways such as Mul-T-Lock, Medeco, Assa-Abloy, will help prevent someone from tripping over to the local hardware store to get an appropriate keyblank.
With that being done, authorized key control becomes the big issue as rights amplification is very possible.
Most people need to upgrade their locks NOT because 1 out of 2 burglars are walking around with bumpkeys, but rather because 9 out of 10 contractors, left to spec out thier own security hardware, choose the cheapest locksets and door hardware that they possibly can.
But do you need several $$$$ worth of restricted keyway Medeco locks?
Probably not.
Why spend $$$$$ on the lock when any joe blow can kick the door in, bust out the glass, or grab a pry-bar, or use any other method to BYPASS THE LOCK COMPLETEY???
Keep it in mind, gents, whatis your threat? Are you looking at seruptitious entry/non-destrucive entry threats? -or- is the threat you are dealing with mosre likely to bypass the lock completely by kicing it in, breaking the glass, or using a prybar, etc. etc.
If you are looking at improving doors and locks, pay just as much attention to the frame, jamb, etc. It is pointelss to spend megabucks on a lock that is only held in by two inchs of soft pine.
Also keep in mind that different types of lock do different things... a deadbolt is good for someone kicking the door in, but for pry attacks, your dong better going with a dropbolt.
To prevent/catch seruptitious entry, your looking at other types of locks, access control, etc. in addition to CCTV, guards, etc. - not just getting a supposedly "bumpproof" lock.
I certainly agree with bringing such security vulnerabilites to light. OTOH, Somtimes the threats can be overblown and/or simply misunderstood.
My personal opinion: "key bumping" is a physical security issue that should be discussed. However, it is not a common threat. For those at risk from "uncommon threats", it would only be one particular technique among MANY that would be included in lockpicking, serputitious entry, non-destructive entry.
Bottom line is any physical security system can be bypassed.
related links
http://aloa.org/pdf/bumpkeys.pdf
http://www.security.org/middle_RESPONSE_ALOA.htm
http://www.toool.nl/bumping.pdf
http://www.crypto.com/papers/mk.pdf
http://www.crypto.com/hobbs.html
This isn't new. It has been around for years. However, recent locksport enthusiasts, such as Toool have popularized it on the internet. Also, Marc Tobias has written about the subject, as well as other security vulnerabilities.
Generally, "bumping" requires more knowledge and skill that what many may believe on first blush. One should keep in mind that ANY lock can be picked by someone who knows how.
If you don't do your research and go arond representing that "key bumping" is a common risk, then you'll be wrong.
This type of threat relates primarily to seruptitious entry... needing to sneak in and out without anyone knowing you have been there. This is a very specific type of threat and is much different than even a professional thief.
A thief will most likely just break in, as would most criminals, because thier crimes are about to be known.
If you have certain other type of things going on, such as industrial security, and some issues that CP pros deal with.. then seruptitious entry may be a concern. However.. this is pretty rare and countermeasures suggested not by the vulnerability, but rather by the threat.
It requires a key that will fit into the keyway.
Using restricted keyways such as Mul-T-Lock, Medeco, Assa-Abloy, will help prevent someone from tripping over to the local hardware store to get an appropriate keyblank.
With that being done, authorized key control becomes the big issue as rights amplification is very possible.
Most people need to upgrade their locks NOT because 1 out of 2 burglars are walking around with bumpkeys, but rather because 9 out of 10 contractors, left to spec out thier own security hardware, choose the cheapest locksets and door hardware that they possibly can.
But do you need several $$$$ worth of restricted keyway Medeco locks?
Probably not.
Why spend $$$$$ on the lock when any joe blow can kick the door in, bust out the glass, or grab a pry-bar, or use any other method to BYPASS THE LOCK COMPLETEY???
Keep it in mind, gents, whatis your threat? Are you looking at seruptitious entry/non-destrucive entry threats? -or- is the threat you are dealing with mosre likely to bypass the lock completely by kicing it in, breaking the glass, or using a prybar, etc. etc.
If you are looking at improving doors and locks, pay just as much attention to the frame, jamb, etc. It is pointelss to spend megabucks on a lock that is only held in by two inchs of soft pine.
Also keep in mind that different types of lock do different things... a deadbolt is good for someone kicking the door in, but for pry attacks, your dong better going with a dropbolt.
To prevent/catch seruptitious entry, your looking at other types of locks, access control, etc. in addition to CCTV, guards, etc. - not just getting a supposedly "bumpproof" lock.
I certainly agree with bringing such security vulnerabilites to light. OTOH, Somtimes the threats can be overblown and/or simply misunderstood.
My personal opinion: "key bumping" is a physical security issue that should be discussed. However, it is not a common threat. For those at risk from "uncommon threats", it would only be one particular technique among MANY that would be included in lockpicking, serputitious entry, non-destructive entry.
Bottom line is any physical security system can be bypassed.
related links
http://aloa.org/pdf/bumpkeys.pdf
http://www.security.org/middle_RESPONSE_ALOA.htm
http://www.toool.nl/bumping.pdf
http://www.crypto.com/papers/mk.pdf
http://www.crypto.com/hobbs.html
Raptor ES said:
Is that you Jack Bauer?
Damn.
tech9 said:
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