Star Trek and Racism... "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield"
- Thread starter PsiBorg
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I knew right away it was gonna be this one... Star Trek/Roddenberry tackled a lot of mainstream issues of that time
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speaking of race and star trek..do you think that the concept of race would still be around by the 24 century?? In other words are Geordi, Uhura, Sisko identified as Black?? Is Kirk, Picard and Janeway White??
I think we'll need a common "alien" enemy for us to get past the racism here. White superiority is too ingrained in the folks at the top of the food chain.
I don't believe they like anyone to be honest with you. They don't like themselves. I hear Black people say all of the time, "I love my people." When was the last time you heard any white person say that?
Yes, Sisko identified as black. He referred to black people as "our people". Video is timestamped.
There's nothing wrong with seeing race. The problem is when you treat people differently based off of that. There's no poverty, white supremacy, etc. on earth in the 24th century.
That clip takes a step BACK from Roddenberry's idea of how the star trek future was supposed to go.
And actually theres everything wrong with seeing race. Race is not science based (at least not legit science). The whole concept was DESIGNED (yes I'm using that word) consciously to be a reason to treat people different. In order to get away from the idea of racial supremacy you have to get away from the concept of race.
And honestly sisko lamenting about 1962 is a big NQR... thats like you talking about how people in the Ming Dynasty were treated in the 1400s. Their talking as if that shit happened 50 years ago and it happened 400 years ago.
I know Avery Brooks wanted to make a point but it flies in the face of everything Roddenberry wanted for the Star Trek universe.
Sisko feeling that way made PERFECT sense. That episode takes place after "Far beyond the stars". Sisko didn't simply read about racism the way we'd read about the Ming Dynasty, he actually LIVED it. He personally experienced getting beat up by the police just because he was black.
Race plays a role in medicine. Certain races are more or less susceptible to various ailments. Even though they've cured cancer in the 24th century, they still have diseases to worry about.
Roddenberry did brush up against the topic a few times.
"they're all mixed types, western, mid european, latin, oriental"
"we've each learned to be delighted with what we are"
Basically, they left it up to the viewer to decide who was "right". But they did it in a way to demonstrate to us all that the end result of such intense hatred is mutually assured destruction. Regardless of whom you sided with....
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I think we'll need a common "alien" enemy for us to get past the racism here. White superiority is too ingrained in the folks at the top of the food chain.
Although, this was in Ukraine, I think the "alien" enemy would play out the same way in the United States. In essence, this actual event reinforces your statement about White supremacist being too ingrained.
You have all of that war crap going on; and yet, they still have the time to be racist shit-heads. White supremacy is a MoFo.
A common alien enemy wouldn't help us. Remember 911? It only helped for a short while. They would be back at our throats soon enough.
What would end up happening if escape was an option, the same thing that happened when black people tried to get on the train out of Ukraine.
Right now I am having a blast watching white people destroy America from the top down and the bottom up.
They're racist and Prejudice beliefs and ideologies are taking them down. The political system they built of of the people, by the people, for the people is proven to be bullshit. The politicians they elect, mostly on the Republican side, are bought and paid for by outside interests to protect the outside interests, not the people who get them elected and keep them in office
Trump supporters are no different than the followers of Hitler. Their loyalty is to the person rather than the country.
America is the chicken with his head cut off running around the yard. It's dead, it just doesn't know it yet. I just wonder when the whole shit collapses if the electricity grid will continue to work. If so, let this bitch fall. I need to get me another couple guns and some more ammo just in case
I can agree with you. But I would say this: What if the alien was very powerful. Powerful enough to really bring the U.S. down. Do you think that the fear of common destruction could possibly over power or over come the ingrained racism?
Good question!
I would say "No" the racism is too ingrained. Racism allows whites to have a privileged standing in society on a global level and many fight hard not to relinquish that.
I'm not sure if you saw the "Matrix" but the group was lead by a black man, Morpheus (Laurence Fishburne) and appearance wise they all seemed to get along for their survival.
That is, all except for "Cypher" who wanted to be plugged back in to the Matrix so that he could go back to living a "privileged lifestyle."
I would see no difference with majority of whites who would probably view equality with blacks as being a form of oppression.
Note: Your basic premise would make for a very interesting screenplay or teleplay.
Furthermore, I would like to see the screenplay written by a black man or black woman. For fun see what Chat gpt and Bard come up with.
screenrant.com
I would say "No" the racism is too ingrained. Racism allows whites to have a privileged standing in society on a global level and many fight hard not to relinquish that.
I'm not sure if you saw the "Matrix" but the group was lead by a black man, Morpheus (Laurence Fishburne) and appearance wise they all seemed to get along for their survival.
That is, all except for "Cypher" who wanted to be plugged back in to the Matrix so that he could go back to living a "privileged lifestyle."
I would see no difference with majority of whites who would probably view equality with blacks as being a form of oppression.
Note: Your basic premise would make for a very interesting screenplay or teleplay.
Furthermore, I would like to see the screenplay written by a black man or black woman. For fun see what Chat gpt and Bard come up with.
The Matrix: Why Cypher Betrays Morpheus For The Agents
Why did Cypher turn Morpheus over to the Agents?
screenrant.com
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Deep Space Nine went so hard in "Far Beyond the Stars" calling race and racism exactly what it was.
Never watched ANY star trek like that but much respect to Avery brooks
I don't know if race is relevant in the 24th century Star Trek. But I know in 23rd century Star Trek, James Tiberius Kirk is fucking every race, creed and color.
Good question!
I would say "No" the racism is too ingrained. Racism allows whites to have a priveledge standing in society on a global level and many fight hard not to relinquish that.
I'm not sure if you saw the "Matrix" but the group was lead by a black man, Morpheus (Laurence Fishburne) and appearance wise they all seemed to get along for their survival.
That is, all except for "Cypher" who wanted to be plugged back in to the Matrix so that he could go back to living a "priveledged lifestyle."
I would see no difference with majority of whites who would probably view equality with blacks as being a form of oppression.
Note: Your basic premise would make for a very interesting screenplay or teleplay.
Furthermore, I would like to see the screenplay written by a black man or black woman. For fun see what Chat gpt and Bard come up with.
The Matrix: Why Cypher Betrays Morpheus For The Agents
Why did Cypher turn Morpheus over to the Agents?
Time and Time again...AI has seen us (blacks) as an inferior race and has had to be reprogrammed multiple times to default to white supremacy...like you said it will be interesting to see what they come up with though
Also as far as the matrix goes, i think Cypher would have been the betrayer regardless and I didn't really look at it from the "construct" of race...Cypher knows the matrix isn't real, but he chooses it anyway..i really think that his backstory could be it's own movie..."Why DIDNT cypher pick the blue pill and what was the purpose of him asking Neo? To sow doubt into his mind?
No. It's like a cease fire between the Bloods and Crips. As soon as a "perceived" injustice or threat, or bit of violence occurred they'd be back to hating us.
Their hatred of us stems from their jealousy of us. We learned when we weren't taught to. We succeeded on certain levels even with the immense obstacles they've placed in our way. They know in their heart had they been faced with similar obstacles they would not have succeeded, yet we have
Actually, I'm in agreement with you about Cypher not looking at it as a racial thing. I used him as an example of someone who may have been living a certain lifestyle and then having it taken away from him.
I think it's similar too:
"They're taking our jobs," They're moving into our neighborhoods," "They're taking over our schools, women,etc."
White people will be homeless, escaping war, in shelters, in abject poverty and still be downright white supremacists.
I remmeber the episode but that was a vision sisko was having its not his experience. He could have easily had a vision of himself as a jew in a concentration camp in the 40s or a educated cambodian living during the time of the khmer rouge and the killing fields in the 70s.
Hell they used the same type of plot a couple of times in Voyager.The issue seems to be centered on the frustration of the struggle rather than it needing to be specifically about race. I think Avery Brooks wanted to make a think piece on it but the episode makes no claim that those issues persists in that time in that society.
I think uhura said she was black one time but I think that and the example you show are just limitations of the writing.
Nyota Uhura was born in Kenya on the continent of Africa on Earth, where she grew up in a village near Lake Simbi Nyaima. (TOS: "The Savage Curtain"; SNW: "Children of the Comet") She had an aptitude for mathematics and languages. By 2259, Uhura was fluent in 37 languages, including Andorian, Vulcan, and Swahili as well as 21 other languages spoken in Kenya.
According to her canon biography Uhura isn't black even as she said the word.
I remmeber the episode but that was a vision sisko was having its not his experience. He could have easily had a vision of himself as a jew in a concentration camp in the 40s or a educated cambodian living during the time of the khmer rouge and the killing fields in the 70s.
Hell they used the same type of plot a couple of times in Voyager.The issue seems to be centered on the frustration of the struggle rather than it needing to be specifically about race. I think Avery Brooks wanted to make a think piece on it but the episode makes no claim that those issues persists in that time in that society.
I think uhura said she was black one time but I think that and the example you show are just limitations of the writing.
Nyota Uhura was born in Kenya on the continent of Africa on Earth, where she grew up in a village near Lake Simbi Nyaima. (TOS: "The Savage Curtain"; SNW: "Children of the Comet") She had an aptitude for mathematics and languages. By 2259, Uhura was fluent in 37 languages, including Andorian, Vulcan, and Swahili as well as 21 other languages spoken in Kenya.
According to her canon biography Uhura isn't black even as she said the word.
I agree it wouldn't make sense for black folks in the 24th century to be militant about a holodeck program about the 60s, which explains why Kasidy and Jake never had a problem with it.
Once he truly accepted the role of emissary, he learned to trust the Prophets, even with his son's life, so it made sense for visions like that to cause him to look at things differently.
The writers for TOS probably never imagined that almost 60 years later people would be analyzing dialog, which explains why so much had to be retconned. Lol!
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