Imus Gone; Focus turns to Rap

QueEx

Rising Star
Super Moderator
<font size="4">The Focus Turns to Rappers

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Don Imus and many more claimed that rappers routinely "defame and demean black women" and call them "worse names than I ever did."

Now that Imus has been silenced (for the moment), some critics are moving down the radio dial to take on hip-hop, boosting the growing movement against harmful themes in rap.


Kansas City Star columnist Jason Whitlock: "We all know where the real battleground is. We know that the gangsta rappers and their followers in the athletic world have far bigger platforms to negatively define us than some old white man with a bad radio show."

Rev. DeForest B. Soaries Jr., who as pastor of the Rutgers coach: "We have to begin working on a response to the larger problem," Soaries announced Friday that he is organizing a nationwide initiative to address the culture that "has produced language that has denigrated women."

CBS President and Chief Executive Officer Leslie Moonves: After firing Don Imus, alluded to the larger problem - - "The effect language like this has on our young people, particularly young women of color trying to make their way in this society ..."

Michelle Malkin, columnist: "What kind of relief do we get from this deadening, coarsening, dehumanizing barrage?"

Rev. Al Sharpton: "We will not stop until we make it clear that no one should denigrate women," he said after Imus' firing. "We must deal with the fact that ho and the b-word are words that are wrong from anybody's lips.

"It would be wrong if we stopped here and acted like Imus was the only problem. There are others that need to get this same message."

Stanley Crouch - cultural critic, author and columnist: a longtime foe of rap music, suspected the Imus ordeal would galvanize young black women across the country. He said a key moment was when the Rutgers players appeared at a news conference this week _ poised, dignified and defying stereotypes seen in rap videos and "dumb" comedies.

"When the public got to see these women, what they were, it was kind of shocking," Crouch said. "It made accepting the denigration not quite as comfortable as it had been for far too long."​

<font size="4">
Imus may be the impetus, but there is no question there is a move afoot to look seriously at an industry some say has been detrimental to OUR culture.

Will this develop into a serious movement ?
Can it lead to serious change ?
Or, will it just fizzle ?

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source of quotes: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/13/AR2007041301469.html
 
<font size="4">It Fizzled Before

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In 1993, the rapper-turned actor Queen Latifah challenged rap's misogyny in her hit song "U.N.I.T.Y." That same year, C. Delores Tucker, who was chairwoman of the National Political Congress of Black Women Inc., led an organized movement _ which included Congressional hearings _ condemning sexist and violent rap.

That same year, the Rev. Calvin Butts of the Abyssinian Baptist Church in Harlem drove a steamroller over a pile of tapes and CDs.

In 2004, students at Spelman College, a black women's college in Atlanta, became upset over rapper Nelly's video for his song "Tip Drill," in which he cavorts with strippers and swipes a credit card between one woman's buttocks. The rapper wanted to hold a campus bone marrow drive for his ailing sister, but students demanded he first participate in a discussion about the video's troubling images. Nelly declined.

In 2005, Essence magazine launched its "Take Back the Music" campaign. Writers such as Joan Morgan and Kierna Mayo and filmmaker Byron Hurt also have tackled the issue recently.

T. Denean Sharpley-Whiting, author of "Pimps Up, Ho's Down: Hip Hop's Hold on Young Black Women" and a professor at Vanderbilt University, said many black women resist rap music and hip-hop culture, but their efforts are largely ignored by mainstream media. As an example, the professor pointed to "Rap Sessions," the 10-city tour in which she's participating. She said the tour and its central question _ does hip-hop hate women? _ have gotten very little mainstream media coverage.

"It's only when we interface with a powerful white media personality like Imus that the issue is raised and the question turns to 'Why aren't you as vociferous in your critique of hip-hop?' We have been! You've been listening to the music but you haven't been listening to the protests from us."

Crouch said that change in rap music and entertainment likely won't come fast, because corporations are still profiting from the business _ but it's coming.

"I've been on (rappers) for 20 years," Crouch said. "I was in the civil rights movement. I know it takes a long time when you're standing up against extraordinary money and great power. But we're beginning to see a shift."

`
 
QueEx said:
<font size="4">The Focus Turns to Rappers

<font size>


Don Imus and many more claimed that rappers routinely "defame and demean black women" and call them "worse names than I ever did."

Now that Imus has been silenced (for the moment), some critics are moving down the radio dial to take on hip-hop, boosting the growing movement against harmful themes in rap.


Kansas City Star columnist Jason Whitlock: "We all know where the real battleground is. We know that the gangsta rappers and their followers in the athletic world have far bigger platforms to negatively define us than some old white man with a bad radio show."

Rev. DeForest B. Soaries Jr., who as pastor of the Rutgers coach: "We have to begin working on a response to the larger problem," Soaries announced Friday that he is organizing a nationwide initiative to address the culture that "has produced language that has denigrated women."

CBS President and Chief Executive Officer Leslie Moonves: After firing Don Imus, alluded to the larger problem - - "The effect language like this has on our young people, particularly young women of color trying to make their way in this society ..."

Michelle Malkin, columnist: "What kind of relief do we get from this deadening, coarsening, dehumanizing barrage?"

Rev. Al Sharpton: "We will not stop until we make it clear that no one should denigrate women," he said after Imus' firing. "We must deal with the fact that ho and the b-word are words that are wrong from anybody's lips.

"It would be wrong if we stopped here and acted like Imus was the only problem. There are others that need to get this same message."

Stanley Crouch - cultural critic, author and columnist: a longtime foe of rap music, suspected the Imus ordeal would galvanize young black women across the country. He said a key moment was when the Rutgers players appeared at a news conference this week _ poised, dignified and defying stereotypes seen in rap videos and "dumb" comedies.

"When the public got to see these women, what they were, it was kind of shocking," Crouch said. "It made accepting the denigration not quite as comfortable as it had been for far too long."​

<font size="4">
Imus may be the impetus, but there is no question there is a move afoot to look seriously at an industry some say has been detrimental to OUR culture.

Will this develop into a serious movement ?
Can it lead to serious change ?
Or, will it just fizzle ?

</font size>

source of quotes: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/13/AR2007041301469.html

The Hollywood chapter of the NAACP killed off the black exploitation genre back in the 70's....

And now... its taking probably the government and the "white" media to do something about the misgyonistic lyrics of black "rap' music.

Mr Imus is the only white person I have ever heard to use the phrase that got him fired... all the others were black. Rap music and its demeaning lyrics has spilled over into the mainstream....

But... lest we forget... Terri Mcmillan is also culpable with her "hollywood" stereotypes of black men...

Why do we need white people to tell us how to behave....

At the end of the day... its always about money.... but...the white media should not be in the business of telling blacks how to behave or how to be nice to other black people. We as blacks should already be doing it amongst ourselves...
 
<font size ="4">It Ain't Our Fault</font size>

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Russell Simmons - rap pioneer, mogul: denies any connection between Imus and hip-hop. Rap lyrics are reflections of the violent, drug-plagued, hopeless environments that many rappers come from.

Instead of criticizing rappers, defenders say, critics should improve their reality.

"Comparing Don Imus' language with hip-hop artists' poetic expression is misguided and inaccurate and feeds into a mindset that can be a catalyst for unwarranted, rampant censorship," Simmons said in a statement Friday.


Snoop Dogg - superstar rapper: Denies there is any connection to Imus. "(Rappers) are not talking about no collegiate basketball girls who have made it to the next level in education and sports," he told MTV.com.

"We're talking about hos that's in the 'hood that ain't doing ---- that's trying to get a n---- for his money."

 
QueEx said:
<font size ="4">It Ain't Our Fault</font size>

<font size="3">
.
"Comparing Don Imus' language with hip-hop artists' poetic expression is misguided and inaccurate and feeds into a mindset that can be a catalyst for unwarranted, rampant censorship," Simmons said in a statement Friday.


Snoop Dogg - superstar rapper: Denies there is any connection to Imus. "(Rappers) are not talking about no collegiate basketball girls who have made it to the next level in education and sports," he told MTV.com.

"We're talking about hos that's in the 'hood that ain't doing ---- that's trying to get a n---- for his money."

[/indent]

Aw come on... "Stupid is as stupid does."

These dudes are only trying to protect there money makin machines...

How many "wiggers'" and other white boys tryin to be "cool" use the same type of "sorry" excuses for garbage talk.

All black people ain't stupid... People like Bob Johnson and his BET "crap" knew it was about the money... Bob Johnson even said himself... BET stands for Black entertainment... and not Black education...

If you have to sell black souls to make a buck... then so what!!!! After all, the africans sold black folks "soul" for whiskey and guns...

Why is this any different????
 
bromack1 said:
The Hollywood chapter of the NAACP killed off the black exploitation genre back in the 70's....

And now... its taking probably the government and the "white" media to do something about the misgyonistic lyrics of black "rap' music.
Unfortunately, the lessons of the 70's seem to have worn off, some time ago. At this juncture, I don't care if it is the white media, so long as someone raises the level of concern. I find it difficult to even listen to the radio with my kids around with all the bitches, ho's and N's this and N's that. Common decency seems to have simply lost it place.

But... lest we forget... Terri Mcmillan is also culpable with her "hollywood" stereotypes of black men...
I'm an equal opportunity critic - whether its Black men degrading Black women or vice-versa.

Why do we need white people to tell us how to behave....
We don't ... but thus far, we haven't lit the spark that burned the demeaning house down. If it works this way, let it burn.

At the end of the day... its always about money.... but...the white media should not be in the business of telling blacks how to behave or how to be nice to other black people. We as blacks should already be doing it amongst ourselves...
Interstingly, for the moment, the focus is also on the white corporate culture that bears as much responsibility for earning profits at any costs as does the entertainers who appear eager to make money at any costs -- in both cases, the rest of US are bearing that costs.

QueEx
 
QueEx said:
Interstingly, for the moment, the focus is also on the white corporate culture that bears as much responsibility for earning profits at any costs as does the entertainers who appear eager to make money at any costs -- in both cases, the rest of US are bearing that costs.

QueEx

One of my criticisms about the black community is our lack of understanding of how the marketplace works... sure we can blame white corporate america but underlying all that is consumerism...

If you don't "buy" the stuff.... then it won't sell and corporate america will look elsewhere for the money it needs.
 
I guess Reverednd Calvin Butts was right when he steam-rolled over rap tapes and CDs. This shit needs to be stop, I love my people(black and Latino) I would never talk shit about them. Leave it at that, yes, rap has been pretty negative about black women for about the past 15 years(positive rap broke that in 88 or so)
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYX-R8WeuvQ

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/lYX-R8WeuvQ"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/lYX-R8WeuvQ" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>
 

At the request of a member-poster, this thread
is temporarily on loan to the main "BGOL" forum



QueEx
 
I posted this in another thread but...

This is becoming an attack on free speech. Now the media is trying to use rap as a scapegoat. Why don't they talk about the Soprano's or any R-Rated movie for that matter. Why is it any different for Snoop Dogg to call some fictional character in a song a bitch or a hoe, but Bill O'Reilly can call a real human being (Snoop) a thug or a gangster? What is the difference between calling a black woman a hoe and a black man a thug? Both have equally negative connotations. Both are wrong. Difference is, Snoop is not talking about a real person, he's making up a story. Bill O'Reilly is attacking a real person. That's slander. So fuck the media and how they are trying to spin this.

The media want to pick at Al Sharpton saying he's blowing it out of proportion, but I remember back in the day, Larry King called one of the contestants for Miss America ugly on his show (white girl from Pennsylvania), there was a small uproar while they talked about his ass on every station for a week and he ended up having to apologize and all that shit. So this ain't nothin new. But because the victims are black this time, the media want to label us as "playing the race card" when they would be blowing up the situation regardless.

During the Larry King controversy, I don't remember anybody arguing, "but so-and-so calls people ugly too".
 
Way too much money in rap for them to kill it...... nice try though. I'd love to believe it can happen but hey... I like to live in reality too.


http://www.ivyresearch.com <----- this link might just save your college SEX LIFE.
 
personally rap songs dat degrade the black woman should be banned since Imus got fired for making one comment on a comedy talkshow meant for white people.
 
This just in : Hip-Hop didnt start misogyny.

Thats some masculine/feminine hierarchal BS that this society has perpetuated since man walked upright.

Notice how instead of talking about Imus and his history of being a jackass, the media chooses to focus on Snoop, Al Sharpton, and Jesse Jackson.

And for the record, neither of those 3 speak for me.

Going after a Hip-Hop (while it needs to be done), in this context is a distraction.

Speaking in generalizations, white people continue to want to shy away from this country's legacy of slavery/racism, while black people want to constantly mind white people of that aforementioned legacy.

When you have those two sides polarized, you wont get much of anything done.

Just as men dont understand that women can be offended by being referred to as "bitches" and "hoes", when women call each other that all the time, some white people just dont understand why they cant use the word "******". As if it doesnt have a historical context. Some dont understand, some just ignore it.

This is why its important to focus on the black experience in American History, because its just not Black History.
 
This is the most juvenile I've ever seen white media get, and the argument is SO weak. How can you compare imus to rappers? Rappers may say bitch, hoe, skeezer and various other things that can be deemed insulting, the big fucking difference here is Imus put a face to the word, the face of young talented women, something rappers have never done.

and crying about the word is ridiculous, if you're a hoe then you're a hoe, it's just that simple. Had Imus said he went to a strip club and it was filled with nappy headed hoes then you'd be able to link him comments with rappers, but then had he gon to a strip club and said that we probably wouldnt be seeing this kinda of media frenzy
 
Figure out that you, should be slamming the likes of rappers who exploit your black skin for their own gain, since all are born from women, can u see the damage that is being done, by our own...?????????


THE NEW HUSTLE

More rappers are moving from lyrics and videos to booming new business ventures. But too many have figured out the quickest route to riches is pimping “hos” and “bitches.” A look at the buying and selling of hip-hop

It’s Friday night. I’m riding down the Long Island Expressway to New York City in my girl’s new ’05 Trailblazer, channel-surfing her factory-installed XM satellite radio. I’m suddenly caught by the seductive sound of smooth-as-molasses shout-outs over orchestral strings and melodic percussion. My fingers stop. My mesmerist speaks, “I’m gonna stop talking and let the beat get to walking.” The voice extols the virtues of dig-in-the-crates classic R&B artists like Leroy Hutson and Erma Franklin, Aretha’s sister, as he plays their tunes. And then the revelation: “This is Snoop Dogg, and welcome to Da Chuuch.” There I was, caught up in Snoop’s ever-expanding web of alter egos, contradicting personalities and business ventures. This time it was his monthly radio show (with encores each week), on which he spins an eclectic mix of classic soul and contemporary hip-hop and R&B. And the way corporate America has embraced him, next time it could be who-knows-what. From Hollywood to Madison Avenue, Snoop, aka Calvin Broadus, has reincarnated himself from a self-described gangster and purveyor of the pimp-and-ho lifestyle to rapper to movie star to million-dollar Main Street pitchman, appearing in ads for T-Mobile, AOL and Nokia, among others. Then there are the movies, the MTV comedy show, a shoe line with Pony, and future plans for a Snoop DeGrill (yes, barbeque), restaurants and an animated series. Snoop, Inc., is a booming business, and he’s not alone. A growing band of rappers, including Lil Jon and Nelly, hang their careers on lyrics that often demean women and videos that border on pornography—with half-naked sisters who gyrate, pop it and generally drop it like it’s hot. The rappers then parlay that success into business ventures, marketing opportunities and lucrative endorsements. Meanwhile, record-label executives—mostly middle-aged White men desperate for a surefire way to pimp the artists in a struggling market—sell us hard, jiggling backsides and all, to boost the frighteningly popular testosterone-charged playa rep that loyal fans—mostly young White men—seem to want. Execs like Jimmy Iovine, chairman of Interscope Records; Steve Gottlieb, president and founder of TVT Records; and Lyor Cohen, chairman and CEO of Warner U.S. Recorded Music Group, bank million-dollar salaries and multimillion-dollar bonuses, while artists take home their exponentially smaller cuts, and most video vixens go home with, at best, $1,000. Together they are fashioning a legacy that does immeasurable damage to the global perception of Black women because these images are broadcast worldwide. Welcome to the new hustle. At its crux are Black women, legs open, hips shaking.

The driving force behind the new hustle is the confluence of the business of hip-hop and corporate America’s quest for the hottest and hardest-to-reach consumer demographics—men and teens. More than half of all rap is purchased by males, and more than half of rap’s buyers are teens and college-age, according to Isaac Josephson, who heads up music research for NPD Group. That compares with only 25 percent of rock and only 17 percent of country music being purchased by that same young, hot market. In fact, Essence research shows, young, affluent White men buy more rap music than their female counterparts and their Black male and female counterparts combined. So in the world of how-do-we-get-to-that-advertising promised land—18-to-24-year-old men and teens—Snoop is the messianic messenger du jour, leading advertisers, retailers and moviemakers to salvation: urban trendsetters and the suburban White teens who follow them. Snoop’s got that group on lockdown, and he, and the advertisers, know it. In this climate, it’s not hard to see why a company would go with somebody like Snoop. The only other proven way for advertisers to reach men is the Super Bowl or Monday Night Football. Teens, who have the most disposable income in this country, have overwhelmingly made rap their music of choice. So who cares if too many rap lyrics are about bitches and hos? On the contrary, many brand names seem to be saying, “The next time you whip out dog chains for women, can you emblazon the chains with my company logo?”

“Some companies don’t care what an artist has said to become so popular. It’s just can he say it holding the company’s phone, wearing its clothes, or driving its car?” says Jackie Rhinehart, former senior vice-president of marketing for Universal/Motown Records. “It’s all about the money.” In effect, these companies are giving the corporate go-ahead to the denigration of Black women. And multiplatinum rap artists such as Snoop have the ultimate bargaining chip—millions of young fans. The top-ten–selling rap artists make up 29 percent of rap sales, while in rock music the top ten sellers account for only 11 percent of rock sales, according to NPD Group. “Rap is unlike rock in that a few high-profile artists dominate the industry,” says Josephson. For an advertiser, it’s a cost-saving no-brainer—pay one chart-topping rap artist to reach millions of young people or pay five or six rock artists to reach the same number of people. Says Rhinehart: “If an artist can reach 20 million people and command their attention, a company is not going to tell him to change the message or style that got him there in the first place.” Granted, beautiful women have been used for years to sell everything from sports cars to aftershave, and now that society’s mores have hit new lows, sex is also used to hawk toothpaste and breakfast cereal. We know sex has sold music for generations. But hip-hop has fallen out of balance. Somewhere along the way, it took Black women from eye candy to cheap tricks. Want a hit record? Sure, you need a catchy beat. But what you really want to do is throw a few “bitches” and “hos” in your lyrics, brag about their performing sex acts, and make a few obligatory references to ways to keep a woman in check. It certainly worked for Snoop. His latest album, R&G (Rhythm & Gangsta): The Masterpiece, features the solipsistic, chart-topping hit “Drop It Like It’s Hot” along with tracks like “Can U Control Yo Hoe”: Can you control yo hoe?.../Listen you’ve got to put that bitch in her place, even if it’s slapping her in her face.../This is what you made me do/I really didn’t want to put hands on you. And it wasn’t so long ago that Snoop paraded at the MTV Music Awards with scantily clad women on dog leashes.

It’s hard to hate on the get-rich part of this game. That rappers are becoming more astute businessmen, branching out into multiple industries, is a good thing. “Rap music was making a lot of money for the corporate world, and artists realized that they’d rather pimp themselves than be pimped,” explains Bryan Leach, vice-president of A&R (artists and repertoire) at TVT Records, Lil Jon’s label. Okay. But why step on sisters in their rise to the top? Perhaps it’s because they think we have no juice. “The Black woman has never been afforded the respect she deserves in the marketplace,” says Carol Motley, Ph.D., a marketing professor at Howard University’s School of Business. I asked T-Mobile, a multibillion-dollar telecommunications company, quite simply, “Why Snoop?” This answer came from Jim Goodwin, vice-president of Integrated Marketing for T-Mobile USA: “We wanted an eclectic set of personalities that, when connected through the Sidekick II, made strange bedfellows and would evolve into fun dynamics to be enjoyed by the youth audience and all demographics.” Hmmm. Where’s the “fun” in people who promote pimping and gang violence and putting women on leashes? Well, at least he got the strange bedfellows part right: Perhaps he’s seen Snoop’s porn series, produced by Larry Flynt’s Hustler Video, in which Snoop peacocks in outrageous outfits presiding over sexual festivities. The message is clear. We already knew it was, “What you say about and do to Black women is inconsequential as long as you make money for the record company.” But now it’s also, “Our company rates a ‘cool factor’ for being associated with you.” “Everyone has bones in his closet,” says Killick Datta, who, as owner of Pony, inked the sneaker deal with Snoop through his company, Global Brand Marketing. “But Snoop transcends hip-hop.” And obviously corporate values too. (By the way, the first shipment of Snoop’s Doggy Biscuitz shoe line sold out in most stores nationwide in three days.) This is not to say that every corporation looking for buzz has lost its way. “There are a slew of companies that don’t like the volatility of dealing with rap artists and have no interest in ever going down that road,” says Ken Smikle, publisher of Target Market News. Nevertheless, rap music has exploded into a $1.2 billion industry, even as rap veterans lament the state of the music. Social outcries, political messages and cultural commentary, once rap’s hallmarks, have been virtually silenced, but the business of selling it is in full throttle. In addition to porn, rap’s tentacles are reaching into music-video DVDs, video games and cell-phone ring tones, sparking new industries, breathing life into old ones, and adding dollars to rap’s bottom line (see box). “We’re creating a market that’s not about selling records but about artists developing themselves as a brand,” says TVT Records’ Bryan Leach. In the United States, sales of rap music account for about 10 percent of the $10 billion industry for CD music sales. But not much of that makes its way into the artists’ pocket. In fact, for every CD sold, the artist only gets $1 on average, and that’s if he or she had a good attorney. Others can get as little as a few cents per CD, after the artist has paid back money the label shelled out for the signing advance, marketing costs, recording studio fees and the video shoot. That’s why rappers are trying to hustle their “brands” as well. For instance, Lil Jon, who waxed on in “Bounce Dat” (Pop that p---- ho/grab that p---- ho/butterfly ho and let that p---- breathe), has a record label, Crunk!!! Energy Drink, a line of eyewear he developed with sunglasses maker Oakley and a cartoon in development. And according to published reports, 50 Cent’s (“Just a Lil Bit”: I ain’t playin’, I’ma tryin’ f--- tonight/Clothes off, face down, ass up, c’mon) endorsement deals, films, record label, and clothing and sneaker lines raked in more than $50 million in revenue for him last year. That includes a deal with Glacéau to produce Formula 50, a grape-flavored drink, as well as his G-Unit footwear line with Reebok, which alone made him a whopping $20 million last year—more than he might ever make selling records.

If selling the brand works for a rapper, then the most powerful ways to establish that brand are with radio play and videos. Record labels spend hundreds of thousands to get radio spins or plays in various stations’ rotation. As for music videos, well, they run the gamut from creative storytelling to salacious booty-shaking. “Nothing sells through better than the music video,” says Tom Calderone, general manager of VH1. “It builds personality and credibility and, we hope, boosts sales for the artists.” Sales also come from related products like cell-phone ring tones, which brought in more than $400 million in 2004. Snoop’s “Drop It Like It’s Hot” was the number one seller for months, with 100,000 to 200,000 downloads a week. Even if the song doesn’t ride to the top of the ring-tone list, an artist and label can still make a killing with product placement. Remember the lingering shot of the iPod in The Game’s Hate It or Love It video? Or the Xbox featured in Ludacris’s Number One Spot video? Advertisers want trendsetting artists to sip their champagne, wear their shoes, don their clothes, or whip their ride, and they are willing to fork over thousands of dollars to be associated with their lifestyle. Another increasingly popular venue for “the brand” is pornography. It’s no secret that some rap videos teeter on the cusp of porn, but several rappers, like Snoop, 50 Cent and Lil Jon, made the full-frontal leap, using women of all hues to add millions in profits and some erotic adventurism to their image. Snoop’s DoggyStyle video sold hundreds of thousands of copies, and in an industry where 4,000 copies is considered a big hit, it was named the top-selling tape of 2001 by porn trade publication Adult Video News. Snoop’s follow-up production, Snoop Dogg’s Hustlaz: Diary of a Pimp, was the top-selling title of 2003. Don’t be surprised if you see more rappers going this route. In porn they often construct a deal in which they are partners and producers, not just hired hands. So if the video sells well, they get a double payday: First as the talent, they can pull in about $1 for every copy sold, and then as a producer or investor, they can reap up to 50 percent of the profits. I couldn’t help thinking about all this as my ride into New York City that night became a journey into my mind, a trip back to the days when rap loved—even celebrated—Black women. And even though it was all street and maybe a little raw, we loved it back. But these days it’s all about the hustle. My sisterfriend and I didn’t listen to Snoop that night. Like so many Black women, we tuned out. I can’t help but wonder if one day rap’s bottom line will be all that it has left.

Kimberly L. Allers is a staff writer at Fortune magazine
 
Firstly RAP has many facets. So Rap itself is not the problem. The problem is the form of rap that should be a sub-culture is now mainstream.

When "It's hard out here for a pimp." Won and fuckin' Oscar that shoulda told us a TON about what white folks think of us and who we are. And of course we don't give a fuck what white people think nor should we. But right now they are the ones controlling what images of us get promoted. In turn displaying these images to our youth. Thus, foisting upon them what they should think of themselves. And WE are to blame for playing into their hands for the sake of profit while they walk off with the bigger bank. [Bamboozled]

The world is not only starting to think we are a bunch of pimps and ho's but apparently are comfortable with assigning us that label. Even greeting us with "Nigga" in salutation. Imus and his sidekick were wrong no doubt but one message that definitely should be gleaned from that incident is that there is now a comfort level with the idea of us being viewed as niggas, pimps, bitches and ho's. Especially since the Rutgers Women were in no form or fashion representative of the title ho.

Instead of reining in the language itself the focus should be on the subject matter in these songs that produce the language. Hip Hop has a kick ass resume on subject matter as a whole. But it seems a very limited array of subjects are getting promoted. (And we know what those are) I believe at its best Hip Hop has more heart than any genre in existence.

I don't believe certain terms need to be banned or eliminated from the music. The problem is that these days creativity goes unrewarded. While the base and crass gets lauded. For me it is not so much about eliminating certain artistry but rather promoting artists that produce higher-minded music. The bar has been set so low, few are motivated to make the attempt being there is no payoff in doing so. I'mma stop there since Colin Powell is telling my conscience to wrap this post up.
 
Props to the OP. Great comments in here, good thread.

I especially like the article from Kimberly Allers at Fortune Mag, she hit the nail on the head with her insight. It seems as if "the bottom line" is the only thing that matters even though its at the expense of "we are" portrayed as a people.

Kratos, you right brah...when "Its hard out here for a pimp" won an Oscar that shit said a lot about how "we are" viewed as a people. And I know people gonna say "who gives a fuck what white people think about us", but why shouldnt we care about what people think about us. For years "We" were thought of as stupid, lazy, non-thinkers, slaves, monkeys, etc and as a result this way of thinking perpetuates into how we are treated as black people(disrespected, unfairly treated).

Hiphop is not the source of all of our "whoes". Hiphop music has a wide array of subject, themes and messages, unfortunantly only one subject topic is being highlighted in the mainstream.
 
Music by black artists has taken a beaten by white people from the very start, starting back in the 1950's

Whites were afraid the black men back then that performed R&B and Rock-n-Roll would negatively influence their kids and try to rape their daughters

Looks like nothing has changed since :smh:
 
<font size="5"><center>Music Execs Discuss Rap Lyrics</font size>
<font size="4">meeting called by hip-hop mogul Russell Simmons' Hip-Hop
Summit Action Network ... lasted several hours, did not
result in any specific initiative</font size></center>


Apr 18, 10:40 PM (ET)
Associated Press
By MARCUS FRANKLIN

NEW YORK (AP) - In the wake of Don Imus' firing for his on-air slur about the Rutgers women's basketball team, a high-powered group of music-industry executives met privately Wednesday to discuss sexist and misogynistic rap lyrics.

During the furor that led to Imus' fall last week from his talk-radio perch, many of his critics carped as well about offensive language in rap music.

The meeting, called by hip-hop mogul Russell Simmons' Hip-Hop Summit Action Network, was held at the New York home of Lyor Cohen, chairman and chief executive of U.S. music at Warner Music Group. The summit, which lasted several hours, did not result in any specific initiative.

Organizers billed the gathering as a forum to "discuss issues challenging the industry in the wake of controversy surrounding hip-hop and the First Amendment." Afterward, they planned to hold a news conference at a Manhattan hotel to discuss "initiatives agreed upon at the meeting." But by early afternoon, the news conference was postponed, because the meeting was still going on.

After the meeting ended, it was unclear whether there would be another one. Simmons' publicist released a short statement that described the topic as a "complex issue that involves gender, race, culture and artistic expression. Everyone assembled today takes this issue very seriously."

Although no recommendations emerged, the gathering was significant for its who's-who list of powerful music executives.

According to a roster released by Simmons on Wednesday, attendees included: Kevin Liles, executive vice president, Warner Music; L.A. Reid, chairman of Island Def Jam Music Group; Sylvia Rhone, president of Motown Records and executive vice president of Universal Music Group; Mitch Bainwol, chairman and CEO of the Recording Industry Association of America; and Damon Dash, Jay-Z's former Roc-A-Fella Records partner. Top-selling rapper T.I. also attended, organizers said.

Simmons declined to comment through a spokeswoman. But he appeared this week with others at a two-day town hall meeting on "The Oprah Winfrey Show" to discuss the issue. While Simmons, Liles and the rapper Common agreed "there is a problem," Simmons cautioned against trying to limit rappers' free-speech rights.

He said that "poets" always come under fire for their unsanitized descriptions of the world.

"We're talking about a lot of these artists who come from the most extreme cases of poverty and ignorance ... And when they write a song, and they write it from their heart, and they're not educated, and they don't believe there's opportunity, they have a right, they have a right to say what's on their mind," he said.

"Whether it's our sexism, our racism, our homophobia or our violence, the hip-hop community sometimes can be a good mirror of our dirt and sometimes the dirt that we try to cover up," Simmons said. "Pointing at the conditions that create these words from the rappers ... should be our No. 1 concern."

Common said criticism of rappers and their music should come with love. "When I talk to the cats, regardless of rap, when I talk to cats on the street, they don't wanna be in that situation," the rapper said. "We don't wanna be in this painful situation. We want it to heal. And we are apologizing for ... the disrespect that does come from the mouths of men to women whatever color."

Meanwhile, the Rev. Al Sharpton, who said he planned to challenge the recording industry on denigrating lyrics, announced he had suspended plans to honor Def Jam's L.A. Reid during this week's convention of his National Action Network in New York. Sharpton was among Imus' most vocal critics and demanded his firing.

Several rappers under Reid's label frequently use racial and sexual epithets.

Imus was fired last week by CBS, which owned his radio show, and MSNBC, which produced the TV simulcast, for having referred to the Rutgers players as "nappy-headed hos."

http://apnews1.iwon.com//article/20070419/D8OJDDT00.html
 
<font size="5">
Imus Aftermath:
Black Leaders Vow Protest of Rap Industry</font size>


Black Press USA
by Hazel Trice Edney
NNPA Washington Correspondent

WASHINGTON (NNPA) – Fallout from the “nappy-headed hoes” slur that cost Don Imus his CBS radio and MSNBC television careers last week has moved national Black leaders to take action against racist and sexist language in all of America, including the Hip Hop industry, dominated by Black men accused of spewing insulting lyrics about Black women.

“We’re going after the record industry. We’re going at a record company that has consistently put out the misogynistic records and the records using the N-word,” says activist Al Sharpton, president of the National Action Network, who led pickets against MSNBC and CBS last week, forcing advertisers to drop the Imus shows within days after his remarks.

Sharpton and a string of activists applaud the firing of Imus, but say it’s now time to demand an end to the self-inflicted wounds in the Black community. Sharpton said he would announce a specific action to pressure a specific record company during NAN’s Ninth Annual Convention set for Wednesday through Saturday this week in New York.

“I’m talking about boycotting, I’m talking about picketing, I’m talking about demanding that they do what they’ve done [when others are insulted],” Sharpton says. “Any company can say, ‘It’s against our policy to put out records that say misogynistic and racist terms. That does not stifle free speech. That’s company policy.”

A unified national outrage hardly seen since Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott was forced to step down after praising segregationist Strom Thurmond in 2002 became volcanic last week. The Imus comments. calling the Rutgers University championship basketball team “nappy-headed hoes”, drew ire from major Black organizations from coast to coast, most of whom called for continued action.

“The explosive national furor over the 'Imus Incident' reflects that a deep and raw nerve in the American psyche has been touched and exposed,” says the Rev. Dr. William J. Shaw, president of the 7.5 million-member National Baptist Convention USA in a statement. “They were an expression of a damnable racism and sexism that still are a virus in the national soul.”

Shaw continues, “This firing is ultimately meaningless, however, unless it can become the catalyst for redemptive confrontation of the cancerous ill exposed. Mr. Imus has been embarrassed, but more than embarrassment is needed. CBS, MSNBC, Mr. Imus and all others convicted of the wrongfulness of the spirit he expressed should commit to continuing challenge of that spirit until it can be expunged and the nation made to become healthy and one.”

Organizations that support Black women, including Essence Magazine, the Links, and Congressional Black Caucus Chair Carolyn Cheeks Kilpatrick (D-Mich.,) issued public statements calling for action beyond condemnation of the comments.

“Mr. Imus’ crass and offensive remarks speak to a broader issue about diversity in the media and tolerance in America. They prove that we still have much work to do to break the chains of bigotry, racism, and sexism that still shackle our country,” says Kilpatrick. “CBS Radio and MSNBC must also increase their representation of African-Americans and other people of color at all levels within their organizations and practice zero tolerance towards racist, sexist, anti-religious, and other discriminatory commentaries. Additionally, I urge the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to mandate diversity training and to impose fines against both networks.”

Even now that Imus, long known for his disparaging racial or gender-oriented remarks against groups of people, has met with and apologized to the Rutgers team, the furor over his comments alone has proven not enough.

“Since NBC Universal and CBS Corporation have belatedly held Imus accountable for his words, why not get busy holding them and their conglomerate industry colleagues accountable for the vulgar, racist content they allow to be spewed over their airwaves on a daily basis to our children?” asks Lisa Fager, a spokeswoman for “Industry Ears”, a group describing itself as a “new generation nonpartisan think tank aimed at addressing and finding solutions to disparities in media that negatively impact individuals and communities.”

Fager, also known for her anti-tobacco work on the campuses of historically Black Colleges and Universities, says in a statement issued to the NNPA News Service, “Viacom, CBS radio, Clear Channel, Emmis Communications, Citadel Communications and Radio One own the majority of stations playing foul commercialized Hip Hop music.

Songs [containing these lyrics] receive daily spins on radio stations that cater to the 12-17-year-old demographic any time of the day.”

The NAACP this week announced a new “STOP” campaign.

“The STOP Campaign is an initiative of the NAACP Youth & College Division that
seeks to ‘stop’ the demeaning images of African-Americans in the media, particularly with respect to the portrayal of African-American women,” says a statement issued by Interim President and CEO Dennis C. Hayes, Chief Operating Officer Nelson B. Rivers III; National Youth & College Division Director Stefanie A. Brown and members of the organization’s board of directors.

“Those that are given access to the public through mainstream media must be put on notice that they have everything to lose by spewing racist ideas and rants. When required, the Association directly confronts racism, the use of defamatory language and racist actions.”

Though the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) ban indecent or sexually explicit content from early morning to evening hours, media moguls “hide behind ‘freedom of speech’” when confronted about their violations, Fager says.

But, many contend the FCC regulations are enforced disparately.
“Interestingly, in 2005, MTV and radio stations around the country “self-regulated” and removed ‘white man’ from the Kanye West’s hit single “All Fall Down”, Fager points out. “The lyrics demonstrated the far reach of capitalism by exclaiming, “Drug dealers buy Jordans, crack heads buy crack… And a White man get paid off of all of that.’ When asked why they dubbed “White man” from the lyrics the revealing
response from MTV was ‘We didn’t want to offend anyone.’”

Sharpton agrees that there is inequality in the enforcement of FCC decency regulations.

“When Ice Tea did a record against cops they took it off the market. When Sistah Soldier did a record they said was offensive to Whites they took it off the market. So, they didn’t use free speech with them. Now, all of a sudden they can’t stop calling our women ‘whores’ and ‘bitches’? They stopped them from shooting Whites and shooting cops…You’ve got to have one standard.”

The key will be in taking action, says Fager. “Begin talking to the FCC regularly. Every time you hear an indecent lyric, submit a complaint. And, of course, the one thing that worked best in the Imus incident was advertiser contact. Identify advertisers and let them know how you feel about their support of the misogynistic, racist rants going unchecked on the airwaves.”



http://www.blackpressusa.com/News/Article.asp?SID=3&Title=Hot+Stories&NewsID=12936
 
08.11.fourbros4.jpg
 
I wonder why everybody in the United States is thinking in "white community" and "black community". There shouldn't be any thinking like that. For fu*ks sake we're all human.
And besides it's all about the money (power). It's "poor" and "rich" community. Lots of people are wondering how to feed their kids tomorrow, while there's even way too many people who don't even wonder about that anymore. Their kids gotta raise themselves. Do you think being called "nappy headed" or "hoes" is a big problem to them.
If you get raised in absolute poverty with just your 17-year old drug addicted mum around, chances are you're gonna pick up some bad language and not finish your school.
And even if you do finish school you can still be as ignorant as Don Imus or many rappers show the rest of the world. But that's not the problem at all.

The real problems are poverty and education. The real problem is segregation of wealth. Rich people getting richer and better educated, while too many kids don't even have parents to look after them anymore.

America should work on those two issues but all I see is presidents like Bush making it worse. All I see is the big leaders don't giving a shit about poverty and all they care about is their oil in the Middle-East.

PS and by the way this entire website is based on the exploitation of (sometimes nappy) headed hoes. So basically to make a change, we should all stop visiting and remove all our porn from our harddrives.
 
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There are so many replies on this thread I agree with I couldn’t quote one. As one bgol member said this is some juvenile shit the media is doing. They go from Imus straight to hip hop music. Nowadays hip hop is the blame for everything. I’m a fan of hip hop and I grew up in the hip hop era but some things really need to change in this genre. The question is how can this be done when 70% of the listeners are white. It pisses me off that there are conscious, positive rappers that don’t get any air time. Our black youth are so brain washed nowadays they don’t even want to hear conscious rap. People want to attack rappers but before you can do that you have attack the leaders of these big production companies and what color are they? :rolleyes:
 
If "hoes" exist then it is perfectly fine to talk about them.

Why dont the video "hoes" dont take flack?

They are the truly guilty ones....

THEY gralmourize "hoe-dom"
 
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QueEx said:
Rev. DeForest B. Soaries Jr., who as pastor of the Rutgers coach: "We have to begin working on a response to the larger problem," Soaries announced Friday that he is organizing a nationwide initiative to address the culture that "has produced language that has denigrated women."
:smh: :smh: :smh: :smh: :smh: :smh: WRONGWRONGWRONG


dreams_deferred said:
This just in : Hip-Hop didnt start misogyny.


Speaking in generalizations, white people continue to want to shy away from this country's legacy of slavery/racism, while black people want to constantly mind white people of that aforementioned legacy.

This is why its important to focus on the black experience in American History, because its just not Black History.

C/S
Ill reiterate that

HIPHOP DID NOY ORIGINATE MYSOGYNY
BLACK MEN DID NOT CREATE MYSOGYNY


MYSOGYNY IS AN AMERICAN TRADITION
 
Unfortunately the media will never blame white america, because they are white america. It's about money, power, and no one cares about the respect part anymore. I really wish at some point that we can resolve our issues amongst ourselves without having to let the Don Imus's of the world force the issue.

It's not just rap, we have so many different issues on so many different levels to deal with that it's terrifying.
 
Since when did "bitches and Hoes" become nothing but hip-hop terminology. Muthafuckas been saying that shit since the 1800's :smh:
 
Noketown said:
People want to attack rappers but before you can do that you have attack the leaders of these big production companies and what color are they? :rolleyes:

Uhm black? At least some are.

The best thing to do right now is to point at other races :rolleyes: They started it. No they started it! It´s the whites, the blacks, the latinos, it´s rappers, it´s the music industry, it´s white media, it´s black community, it´s Don Imus, bladibladibla.

Can´t you see this is so typically American. Never solve the problem at the root, always kill the messenger. Ahhh the world would be such a better place if people didn´t get called `nappy headed hoes´ anymore. No we would all hug and make love and have food and be happy. :D
 
ll_lexington said:
Uhm black? At least some are.
The best thing to do right now is to point at other races :rolleyes: They started it. No they started it! It´s the whites, the blacks, the latinos, it´s rappers, it´s the music industry, it´s white media, it´s black community, it´s Don Imus, bladibladibla.

Can´t you see this is so typically American. Never solve the problem at the root, always kill the messenger. Ahhh the world would be such a better place if people didn´t get called `nappy headed hoes´ anymore. No we would all hug and make love and have food and be happy. :D
http://www.hiphoponline.net/rap/printthread.php?t=2203
This is one example where Sony and Def Jam are cutting a deal. I know the president of Def Jam is Jay Z but I guarantee you that some where along the line some sponsors who where probably white worked with Def Jam.

http://www.ourmedia.org/node/247697
A Jewish guy had something to do with the start of Def Jam. Although Rick Rueben is Jewish he sure isn’t black. Russell Simmons was the entrepreneur of the duo.

What I am saying is that yes there are blacks who are the presidents and who own large production companies but at the very top there is a white man pulling the strings. This is the present state of Amerikkka. Even though Def Jam and other record labels of that nature are ran by blacks there is a white person somewhere in the picture making some decisions. Plus most of the music that they make is bought by white youth.

On another note I do agree with what you are saying on pointing the finger. We should continue to point the finger at other races its only fair. It seems like people want to point the finger at us so we should do it right back. Its funny how there are blacks that will blame other blacks for their fucked up situation but you never see other races do such a thing.
 
<font size="4">NOW RUSSELL SIMMONS IS DOWN WITH HIP HOP CLEAN UP:</font size><font size="4">
'Bitch,' 'ho' and '******' are words to be avoided</font size>

Eurweb
April 24, 2007

*The Hip-Hop Summit Action Network (HSAN) has now come out with its recommendations to the recording and broadcast industries in light of the recent discussion of derogatory words in rap lyrics.

Interestingly, the statement, released on Monday, shows a change of direction for the Russell Simmons and Dr. Ben Chavis headed organization.

http://eurweb.com/story/eur33046.cfm
 
<font size="4">Russell Simmons Advocates Censorship</font size>
Apr 24, 2007

Hip-hop mogul Russell Simmons is ready to curtail recording artists' rights to say what they want.

Simmons and Dr. Benjamin Chavis jointly issued a statement on behalf of the Hip-Hop Summit Action Networ in support of corporate censorship of potentially offensive words in hip-hop, and presumably, all recorded music. The statement, which specifically recommends labels and broadcasters bleep out terms such as "ho," "bitch" and "******" in all music ....


http://www.aversion.com/news/news_article.cfm?news_id=8486
 
<font size="5"><center>
Sharpton Continues Crusade
Against Offensive Hip-Hop</font size>

<font size="4">Next steps in his battle against rap music and will take
his fight into various corporations' boardrooms, by buying
stock in companies that promote the music</font size></center>


BLACK PRESS USA
Special to the NNPA from
the St. Louis American

ST. LOUIS (NNPA)- The Rev. Al Sharpton announced the next steps in his battle against rap music and will take his fight into various corporations' boardrooms, by buying stock in companies that promote the music.

Sharpton and his National Action Network are planning to purchase stock in various companies, including Time Warner and Universal Music Group, and will then use his right to attend shareholder meetings, where he will voice his opinion on lyrics deemed raunchy and
sexist.

''Some of these stockholders have no idea that they own stock in a parent company that owns companies calling them b**ches and ho's,'' Sharpton told The New York Post.

The tactic is the same strategy that C. Delores Tucker used in 1995.
Tucker was an outspoken criticism of ''gangsta rap.''
She bought stock in Time Warner and attended shareholder meetings, where she read the lyrics to various albums marketed and sold by Interscope, which was eventually dropped from Time Warner's distribution system, because of releases by Death Row Records.

Sharpton will also lead a group of women who will boycott the offices of Sony, Time Warner and Universal Music Group.
The announcement was made during the National Action Network's four-day conference, which took place from Apr. 18-21.

Various politicians supported the conference, including Senators John Edwards, Hillary Clinton, Howard Dean (DNC), NBC Nightly News Anchor Brian Williams, Governor Eliot Spitzer, filmmaker Spike Lee, Governor Bill Richardson, Fox News's Bill O'Reilly and Presidential hopeful Barack Obama, who addressed the current fervor around Hip-Hop music.

''We are all complicit...let's not just single out the rappers,'' Obama said, noting that he had heard offensive words in many places other than rap songs.
Universal Music Group withdrew it's $15,000 contribution to Sharpton's National Action Network, after Sharpton decided it was inappropriate to honor Universal Music Group executive and Island Def Jam CEO, Antonio ''L.A.'' Reid.

Sharpton, who had planned on honoring Reid with the James Brown Freedom Award prior to the Don Imus controversy, changed his mind and felt it was inappropriate to bestow the award upon Reid.

Congressman Charles Rangel, who recently introduced a bill in Congress to reinstate the military draft, is also among Sharpton's supporters.

''I heard that someone in the music industry threatened to take back $15,000 they'd paid for a table at this convention,'' told The New York Post. ''I said to Al, 'You'll have $15,000 from me tomorrow.''



http://198.65.131.81/board/showthread.php?p=2234652#post2234652
 
header_title.gif


<font size="5"><center>Protesters March For Decency In Music</font size></center>


May 03, 2007

Hundreds of people marched in Midtown Thursday evening, calling for decency in music.

The march was led by the Reverend Al Sharpton and the children of the late James Brown.

On the Godfather of Soul’s birthday, protesters called on the music industry to put a code of conduct in place for lyrics, to eliminate sexist, racist, and homophobic language.

“The message is that we want to call on three words: ******, ho, and bitch to be removed from records,” said Sharpton. “Just like you can’t make records against gays, you can’t make records against Italians or Jews, why do we allow those records?”

“As a female, I feel like I’m being disrespected,” said another protester. “Every other song I’m being called the H-word or the B-word, and as a black woman, I’m being called the N-word. So today is very important; it’s crucial for us in the community.”

The march kicked off in front of Sony Music's Midtown office, continued to Warner Music, and Universal, and then protesters ended with a rally at Columbus Circle in front of Time Warner, the parent company of NY1.

"I’m not totally against the B-word, the N-word, because I understand where they’re coming from,” said a third protester. “But we as a people got to get to the next level somehow and someway.”

“Well we want to stop all of this negative press that the rap industry has been sending out, and try to re-erect ourselves” said another rally attendee.

In a statement, Time Warner says it has no ownership part in Warner Music. As for Universal Music Group, it put out a statement saying that artists have a right to express themselves, even if it doesn’t appeal to all listeners. The company also says it puts warning labels on its music and complies with broadcast standards, as well.

The rally comes on the heels of the major uproar against shock jock Don Imus' remarks against the Rutgers women’s basketball team. After days of protest and ad buyer pulling off his show, Imus was fired by CBS.

http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=8&aid=69361
 
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