YES, God Willing.
Well this is a sad reality
Are Black People incapable of having their own thriving Community?
- Thread starter egatsby
- Start date
Well this is a sad reality
ok, by your response...you figure that US BLACKS that are doing will need to DESIGNATE part of the city and make it ours. I don't mean Ben Hill,or Cascade...but an actual intown enclave that would be desirable and property value will flourish. I NOMINATE SUMMERHILL, PEOPLES TOWN, AND MECHANICSVILLE AS PERSPECTIVE PLACES. LET ALL OF THE WELL TO DO NEGROS TAKE OVER THESE AREAS... WE WILL HAVE TO CLEAN OUT THE RIFF RAFF BUT IT WILL BE WORTH IT.
LET'S ALL COME TOGETHER AND TARGET THIS AREA NOW BEFORE THE WHITES HAVE A STRANGLEHOLD ON IT. THEY ARE AT 40% RIGHT NOW....LET'S DO IT!
It's a plan that embedded in their privileged ways. They own shit, we own little. Collectively whites have been able to use their advantages to make things work for them. And using word of mouth and knowing where the job markets are going. In shear numbers whites are at a greater advantage in be able to make moves. Plus they can cover a greater area. Black are centralized to spots where whites have fuckin entire states on lock down.
ok, by your response...you figure that US BLACKS that are doing will need to DESIGNATE part of the city and make it ours. I don't mean Ben Hill,or Cascade...but an actual intown enclave that would be desirable and property value will flourish. I NOMINATE SUMMERHILL, PEOPLES TOWN, AND MECHANICSVILLE AS PERSPECTIVE PLACES. LET ALL OF THE WELL TO DO NEGROS TAKE OVER THESE AREAS... WE WILL HAVE TO CLEAN OUT THE RIFF RAFF BUT IT WILL BE WORTH IT.
LET'S ALL COME TOGETHER AND TARGET THIS AREA NOW BEFORE THE WHITES HAVE A STRANGLEHOLD ON IT. THEY ARE AT 40% RIGHT NOW....LET'S DO IT!
Yes!!! This is exactly what I'm saying!! I'm not saying the bluff or Bankhead , this is what I'm saying!!
IF YOU LOOK AT ALL THE AREAS THAT WHITE PEOPLE HAVE GENTRIFIED IN ALTLANTA ON A MAP...YOU WILL NOTICE THAT THEY BASICALLY CREATED THEIR OWN UNDERGROUND RAILROAD OF COMMUNITIES THAT ARE INTERWOVEN TO THE POINT THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO STEP FOOT IN A BLACK AREA EVER!!!
I think I misunderstood what you were saying or asking at first because in certain cities there are thriving black upscale areas but I had to rethink that. There are middle to upper middle class black neighborhoods but they don't have the same amenities as mixed or white areas.
I'm specifically referring to Chicago because we do have those areas but when you define the word "community" that is far different than the word "neighborhood". When I thought about it and as the comments came in then the difference became glaringly obvious.
There are only a few cities in the US that have a large enough black concentrated population across enough income ranges to even hold an upscale black neighborhood. Chicago, Atlanta and DC can do that easily.
But the economic, financial and business makeup of a black sustained community rather than a local neighborhood is a whole different complex subject.
We are a powerful economic consumer force but our collective buying habits are not the same as the mainstream buying public. Fortune 500 companies especially retail are not looking to invest or set up shop in predominantly black areas.
We are still a minority here. And our culture is also reflected in our buying and spending habits on a whole. It doesn't define or describe all of us but a significant number of us.
It's a complex economic situation but it is what it is.
I'm specifically referring to Chicago because we do have those areas but when you define the word "community" that is far different than the word "neighborhood". When I thought about it and as the comments came in then the difference became glaringly obvious.
There are only a few cities in the US that have a large enough black concentrated population across enough income ranges to even hold an upscale black neighborhood. Chicago, Atlanta and DC can do that easily.
But the economic, financial and business makeup of a black sustained community rather than a local neighborhood is a whole different complex subject.
We are a powerful economic consumer force but our collective buying habits are not the same as the mainstream buying public. Fortune 500 companies especially retail are not looking to invest or set up shop in predominantly black areas.
We are still a minority here. And our culture is also reflected in our buying and spending habits on a whole. It doesn't define or describe all of us but a significant number of us.
It's a complex economic situation but it is what it is.
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Basically.
Black folks have and had many thriving communities in the past.
But then the mental conditioning kicked in.
Now Black folks wanna "rejoice" with non Blacks more than anything else.
Also...keep in mind your community cant really "thrive" when u have Arabs, Asian, Jews etc owning most of the business within your community.
Look at the Mexicans for example....they may take advantage of White privilege....but for the most part they control their communities; on a small scale. It doesnt have to be something major all the time. starting off with 1-2 blocks is good enough. Take 300+ small communities and add them together..you got something special.
FOr those that may be a little dumbfounded...If you wanna see examples of Black folks running things...than just study your history..instead of assuming Blacks folks never had their shit together.
It usually starts off that way, and then over time the area becomes run down and the affluent blacks move to either white or mixed areas. I think of areas in ATL like Stone Mountain, Cascade Heights, etc. You have some neighborhoods with million dollar homes and then right around the corner you have dopeboys on every corner. The schools go to shit and those that actually care leave. The majority of blacks that are well off in those areas don't even send their kids to the schools there. The crime starts going up, same cycle over and over again. Look at PG County. One of the most affluent areas for blacks in the country with one of the worst crime rates.
Here at least, people aren't thinking about what color their neighbors are other than white people because they feel like as soon as we start moving in it's time for them to move out. In our case we want to live in a nice area with nice schools, nice home, etc. It's just that in most situations that area happens to be majority white. Some of the areas here with the highest crime and worst school systems actually used to be nice. Stone Mountain, Decatur, Lithonia, Jonesboro, Morrow...all used to be thriving nice communities. The crime got worse and whites started leaving Stone Mountain/Lithonia heading up into North Dekalb. Left Jonesboro/Morrow and started moving south into Henry County/Peachtree City. Moved from Decatur to North Decatur.
If it's gonna be possible you're going to have to figure out a way to do it without allowing the lower middle class blacks in. When that happens it's not long before it turns south. As far as the suggestion someone made about picking Mechanicsville, I wouldn't count on that. Don't expect that area to be majority black too much longer.
Here at least, people aren't thinking about what color their neighbors are other than white people because they feel like as soon as we start moving in it's time for them to move out. In our case we want to live in a nice area with nice schools, nice home, etc. It's just that in most situations that area happens to be majority white. Some of the areas here with the highest crime and worst school systems actually used to be nice. Stone Mountain, Decatur, Lithonia, Jonesboro, Morrow...all used to be thriving nice communities. The crime got worse and whites started leaving Stone Mountain/Lithonia heading up into North Dekalb. Left Jonesboro/Morrow and started moving south into Henry County/Peachtree City. Moved from Decatur to North Decatur.
If it's gonna be possible you're going to have to figure out a way to do it without allowing the lower middle class blacks in. When that happens it's not long before it turns south. As far as the suggestion someone made about picking Mechanicsville, I wouldn't count on that. Don't expect that area to be majority black too much longer.
We also can't forget about crime, education level, intact family structure (preferably two parents), employment or lack of employment and black customer or consumer support.
All of this affects and dictates whether a community can successfully thrive or not or at least be self sustaining. And as has been mentioned how will growth be affected in that community and the rise or decline of property values? Will there be mostly renters or homeowners in that community?
None of this is theoretically impossible but can it happen, could it happen and will it happen? And if so when, where and how? And how long would it or could it last?
That's a tall order and IMO a multi-generational task.
All of this affects and dictates whether a community can successfully thrive or not or at least be self sustaining. And as has been mentioned how will growth be affected in that community and the rise or decline of property values? Will there be mostly renters or homeowners in that community?
None of this is theoretically impossible but can it happen, could it happen and will it happen? And if so when, where and how? And how long would it or could it last?
That's a tall order and IMO a multi-generational task.
Yea my family moved from Bankhead to Morrow in 92 so I saw this decline first hand. Why can't we get Mechanicsville before it turns all white?
Yes you are right a lot of questions need to be answered by people a lot smarter than me. This is why I posed the question. I think BGOL is severely under utilized. This place could be a real think tank where ideas come to prosper and grass roots movements begin. We need to start ignoring the trolls and dissenters and really start coming up with ideas solutions and networks.
It is happening. A community works best when the people who live in it have a vested interest. So of course single family homes and onwer occupied homes work best.
You pretty much nailed it DEAD ON. I have seen it happen over and over again in neighborhood after neighborhood. It follows the exact same pattern that you laid out.
The upper income people buy or build nice homes in a nice area and sooner or later somehow someway Ray Ray and nem slowly ease their way in and the downhill slide begins. The homes may look nice but don't get it twisted. The same ole same ole will still do what it do.
gotta love fakeass uppity ass niggas...
god forbid someone u see as "lower" than u aspire to getting on ur level.
Let's keep this civil gentlemen please don't derail this thread
I'm out in the county. I've seen a couple of white folks living amongst us but I think they are U of MD students. I'd like to see these negroes in Prince Georges turn this place around.
Yeah but he does bring up a valid point that I forgot about completely that is another part of the problem: Classism.
Class warfare in the black community comes with the territory when it comes to changing income levels and tax brackets. The "bourgie" negro has always been there and that perception and dynamic can't be ignored because it's not going anywhere.
When trying to improve your economic situation for yourself and your family this particular phenomenon will inevitably come into play. It's unavoidable and many upper income blacks through the years have not helped the situation with pretentiousness and elitism.
It's a tough thin line to straddle and will continue to be a problem that has to be dealt with and addressed.
Black people have to disassociate themselves from NIGGAS completely
If there's one thing other groups (non-blacks) don't have any control of black peoples is us working with each other. That's all I gotta say.
Egatsby.
Its Urban planning Bro.
Communities don't just pop up from nowhere.
Similarly communities don't go to shit out of nowhere.
I have lived in several states and cities and have been involved at the municipal level.
Guess how many black people I see:
1. Attending the meeting
2. Being a part of the planning process
I have been all over Atlanta, from Canton all teh way to Rome, south to Macon, Douglasville to Covington
The problem si the same.
No blacks involved in city planning.
city planning is where zoning laws are passed.
Zoning for residential areas, commercial areas, what walgreens should look like, whther they would allow a 24hr liquor store etc...
It where we lose the battle.
We leave it up to white folks to determine the future of our communities.
This includes black folks at all economic levels.
We fail to get involved.
Another thing is that affluent neighborhoods are built by developers in conjunction with the city i.e. they get concessions and are allowed to use the cheapest land i.e. the hood.
To get the hood cleaned up, they start over-policing and using hostile tactics, raise rents etc...
Then the developer move in and start building before the land prices go up too much.
Yuppies think they are getting in at the ground floor of a gentrified neighborhood and buy.
The developer finishes the community, the yuppies are already seeing appreciation of property.
Blacks now start to pay notice and start to buy but at this time the price has peaked
Whites sell and take their profit and move on
Blacks start feeling good about living amongst white people
As white flight takes place, property values start going down.
The city uses the tax now being paid by black property owners to subsidize the next developer.
Cops stop patrolling and let's the property go to shit since they are on patrol in the next gentrified neighborhood.
Rinse and repeat.
That is my keen observation accumulated over many years being on the inside of these planning commissions.
Its Urban planning Bro.
Communities don't just pop up from nowhere.
Similarly communities don't go to shit out of nowhere.
I have lived in several states and cities and have been involved at the municipal level.
Guess how many black people I see:
1. Attending the meeting
2. Being a part of the planning process
I have been all over Atlanta, from Canton all teh way to Rome, south to Macon, Douglasville to Covington
The problem si the same.
No blacks involved in city planning.
city planning is where zoning laws are passed.
Zoning for residential areas, commercial areas, what walgreens should look like, whther they would allow a 24hr liquor store etc...
It where we lose the battle.
We leave it up to white folks to determine the future of our communities.
This includes black folks at all economic levels.
We fail to get involved.
Another thing is that affluent neighborhoods are built by developers in conjunction with the city i.e. they get concessions and are allowed to use the cheapest land i.e. the hood.
To get the hood cleaned up, they start over-policing and using hostile tactics, raise rents etc...
Then the developer move in and start building before the land prices go up too much.
Yuppies think they are getting in at the ground floor of a gentrified neighborhood and buy.
The developer finishes the community, the yuppies are already seeing appreciation of property.
Blacks now start to pay notice and start to buy but at this time the price has peaked
Whites sell and take their profit and move on
Blacks start feeling good about living amongst white people
As white flight takes place, property values start going down.
The city uses the tax now being paid by black property owners to subsidize the next developer.
Cops stop patrolling and let's the property go to shit since they are on patrol in the next gentrified neighborhood.
Rinse and repeat.
That is my keen observation accumulated over many years being on the inside of these planning commissions.
*Place marker*
Good topic and to be honest I don't have the answer. I can tell you why my black ass is leaving to live with the white people though.. Simply because I want the best for my family and no black neighborhood near the city seems to offer such a thing.
I would like to say that all educated people strive for the same thing but for whatever reason the implementation of a good desirable black neighborhood in metro Atlanta isn't here. Maybe it's in another city but I just don't see it here.
Can we create a neighborhood? Sure, but it takes a lot of work and you'll need commitment from the majority of a neighborhood. I would also like to point out that there aren't many black soccer moms. Soccer moms stay active in the school and the community so maybe that's something to consider. My wife was a soccer mom but she sucked at it expect for being active in our kids school.
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I would like to say that all educated people strive for the same thing but for whatever reason the implementation of a good desirable black neighborhood in metro Atlanta isn't here. Maybe it's in another city but I just don't see it here.
Can we create a neighborhood? Sure, but it takes a lot of work and you'll need commitment from the majority of a neighborhood. I would also like to point out that there aren't many black soccer moms. Soccer moms stay active in the school and the community so maybe that's something to consider. My wife was a soccer mom but she sucked at it expect for being active in our kids school.
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Exactly... Self is hitting the mail on the head. In addition to my previous post we as a people are at least a generation behind on grasping what's really important in life.
Another obvious problem in Atlanta is the fact that we have no true amenities south of I-20... That shit is crazy! Think about it, if you were to visit Atlanta what business do you have south of that line? Other than the airport nothing. And we all know what's south of I-20.
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Same shit happened here. It doesn't even have to be an upscale community. It can be a community that is simply middle-class. People scraping by. But they all take care of their shit and have certain standards(No BBQing on the front porch on Wednesday at midnight and other common sense shit).
We are just afraid to have our blackness challenged. So when "ray ray and them" move in, we don't say nor do we do shit. We just let them run folks out who are then replaced by more like Ray Ray. Scared to call the police because we don't want to be perceived as sell outs or other dumb shit.
Schools go to shit. Kids start getting robbed. Stores start getting robbed. And it may not be "Ray Ray" who is doing it. It's all the folks that the family is bringing up from the hood to constantly visit(everyone who has seen this shit happen knows how much fucking traffic there is). And they will have some knucklehead who doesn't live there going to school tearing shit up, but other people won't report it.
Up here in Ohio, we don't want to have to live near white folks to have peaceful neighborhoods, but there aren't any thriving black communities up here. Every single time one starts, "ray ray and them" show up and tear shit up. WE ALLOW THEM TO DO IT.
We put up with too much horseshit and have this false notion that we must include every single black person who wants to live in our neighborhood. There isn't any quality control. You won't find any good neighborhood without fucking quality control. Quality control isn't trying to be white. It's wanting to have some fucking peace. White middle class people ain't letting rednecks from the trailer park tear up their shit, but black middle class folks will sit there quiet as fuck while hood cats tear up their shit.
Basically, a middle-class white person can tell a trailer park trash person to kick rocks and never have his/her whiteness challenged. But if a middle-class black person has a problem with "Ray Ray and them," he/she is a coon, sell-out, self-hater, or trying to be white. Thinking like that helps to ruin every single black neighborhood up here.
^^^^^ good points. I call the police constantly in my neighborhood on any and everything suspicious or out of place. My next door neighbor does as well and I feel like we keep our subdivision safe alone. When I'm gone I'm not sure what's going to happen.
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Basically, a middle-class white person can tell a trailer park trash person to kick rocks and never have his/her whiteness challenged. But if a middle-class black person has a problem with "Ray Ray and them," he/she is a coon, sell-out, self-hater, or trying to be white. Thinking like that helps to ruin every single black neighborhood up here.
Its a coast to coast problem not just limited to certain cities. It is a complex economic problem but it is directly tied to being a cultural problem. The two are inextricably linked.
And the crime problem I spoke on in one of those Chicago gangbanging threads awhile back. The community residents have to be actively involved in their neighborhoods and communities.
I lived on a block filled with older homeowners in the Chi and the minute any knuckleheads showed up and started loitering around or trying to set up dope spots or begin any semblance of dope or gang activity the police were called within hours.
There was an unwritten zero tolerance policy on ridiculousness and it worked. The block stayed free of that influence at least while I was there.
Now of course if you would leave in any of all four directions away from our block you would run right back into your normal typical hood foolishness.
That's why that whole black soccer mom thing that someone mentioned is so necessary. The community residents being deeply involved in all aspects of preserving the quality of that community is a direct result of their unified commitment to keeping to those standards.
Bickering and infighting and questioning the authenticity of our blackness just helps to tear us right back down. And the cycle just repeats itself all over again.
History says yes we are capable of having a thriving community...but they were burned down
The shitty communities are left alone
I read something recently about a spot in Philly that was growing successfully...then the city shut down the road the businesses were on to begin endless construction...the businesses ended up dying due to the lack of access and foot traffic ... I wanna say this happened in the 2000s
White people would want you to believe you are incapable of success so you don't get any wild ideas and actually try to be
The shitty communities are left alone
I read something recently about a spot in Philly that was growing successfully...then the city shut down the road the businesses were on to begin endless construction...the businesses ended up dying due to the lack of access and foot traffic ... I wanna say this happened in the 2000s
White people would want you to believe you are incapable of success so you don't get any wild ideas and actually try to be
^^^this, I was talking to someone yesterday and they said that this could start with just 5-10 families taking ownership of a block. But I see from all the responses that this is a complex issue that doesn't have an easy solution.
Ok we have discussed the issue and what we think. Anyone have any solutions? The attending zoning meetings was good.
Ok we have discussed the issue and what we think. Anyone have any solutions? The attending zoning meetings was good.