The Dems have the POTUS, the house, and the senate and they still can't get anything done.
[Health Care] Has Obama Sold Out Already?
- Thread starter Ruff Ryder
- Start date
The Dems have the POTUS, the house, and the senate and they still can't get anything done.
When the discussion of health care begins not only without single payer but without a real public option....what do you think?
The white house is bought and paid for Ahk. These people are not stupid enough to create a system of power that would allow a few mindless muh fuckas to pull a lever and walk away with they shit.
If we want POWER it's going to take a little more effort and thought then that.
That was an excellent video by the way Ruff Ryder...
The white house is bought and paid for Ahk. These people are not stupid enough to create a system of power that would allow a few mindless muh fuckas to pull a lever and walk away with they shit.
If we want POWER it's going to take a little more effort and thought then that.That was an excellent video by the way Ruff Ryder...
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Dean says kill the Senate health bill:
By Sahil Kapur:
WASHINGTON -- Following the jettisoning of both the public option and the Medicare buy-in provision, one of the nation's leading progressive voices on health care reportedly said Tuesday that the Senate bill is no longer worth supporting.
"This is essentially the collapse of health care reform in the United States Senate," former Gov. Howard Dean told political reporter Bob Kinzel of Vermont Public Radio. Kinzel relayed the news to The Plum Line's Greg Sargent, and the full VPR interview will air at 5:50 pm today.
"Honestly the best thing to do right now is kill the Senate bill, go back to the House, start the reconciliation process, where you only need 51 votes and it would be a much simpler bill," he said.
Dean has been an outspoken champion of the public insurance option, describing it as the central component of the legislation. A health care bill without it, he has said, is not worth supporting.
Dean lifted the spirits of dismayed progressives after the public option was compromised in favor of the Medicare buy-in provision. He said last Wednesday that it was a "positive step forward," and that expanding existing government-run insurance programs can achieve the same goals of lowering premiums and extending coverage.
But now that the Medicare compromise has also been scrapped, Dean no longer thinks the bill will meet these goals. According to him, it's time for Democrats to pull the plug and start over using the parliamentary procedure known as reconciliation, through which a bill can be passed with a 51-vote majority.
While some progressives agree with Dean, others say the bill still improves the current system.
"The public option and its compromised iterations were a battle that came to seem like a war," Washington Post's Ezra Klein wrote on Wednesday. "But they weren't the war. The bill itself was."
"On its own terms, the bill is the most important social policy achievement since the Great Society. It will save a lot of lives and prevent a lot of suffering," he added.
"Political change isn't easy," wrote Josh Marshall of Talking Points Memo. "It includes tons of reverses and inevitably involves not getting a lot of what you wanted, at least not at first... People don't agree on things. That's life. But that's different from cashing out of the process if you don't get just what you want."
"I understand that most of the liberal skepticism over the Senate bill is well intentioned," Nate Silver of FiveThirtyEight wrote on Wednesday. "But it has become way, way off the mark."
Dean's declaration comes on the same day that President Obama gave a speech signaling that positive health reform will pass. Obama warned that inaction will create many more problems. "If we don't get this done, your premiums are guaranteed to go up," he said.
http://rawstory.com/2009/12/howard-dean-kill-senate-health-bill-start-reconciliation/
By Sahil Kapur:
WASHINGTON -- Following the jettisoning of both the public option and the Medicare buy-in provision, one of the nation's leading progressive voices on health care reportedly said Tuesday that the Senate bill is no longer worth supporting.
"This is essentially the collapse of health care reform in the United States Senate," former Gov. Howard Dean told political reporter Bob Kinzel of Vermont Public Radio. Kinzel relayed the news to The Plum Line's Greg Sargent, and the full VPR interview will air at 5:50 pm today.
"Honestly the best thing to do right now is kill the Senate bill, go back to the House, start the reconciliation process, where you only need 51 votes and it would be a much simpler bill," he said.
Dean has been an outspoken champion of the public insurance option, describing it as the central component of the legislation. A health care bill without it, he has said, is not worth supporting.
Dean lifted the spirits of dismayed progressives after the public option was compromised in favor of the Medicare buy-in provision. He said last Wednesday that it was a "positive step forward," and that expanding existing government-run insurance programs can achieve the same goals of lowering premiums and extending coverage.
But now that the Medicare compromise has also been scrapped, Dean no longer thinks the bill will meet these goals. According to him, it's time for Democrats to pull the plug and start over using the parliamentary procedure known as reconciliation, through which a bill can be passed with a 51-vote majority.
While some progressives agree with Dean, others say the bill still improves the current system.
"The public option and its compromised iterations were a battle that came to seem like a war," Washington Post's Ezra Klein wrote on Wednesday. "But they weren't the war. The bill itself was."
"On its own terms, the bill is the most important social policy achievement since the Great Society. It will save a lot of lives and prevent a lot of suffering," he added.
"Political change isn't easy," wrote Josh Marshall of Talking Points Memo. "It includes tons of reverses and inevitably involves not getting a lot of what you wanted, at least not at first... People don't agree on things. That's life. But that's different from cashing out of the process if you don't get just what you want."
"I understand that most of the liberal skepticism over the Senate bill is well intentioned," Nate Silver of FiveThirtyEight wrote on Wednesday. "But it has become way, way off the mark."
Dean's declaration comes on the same day that President Obama gave a speech signaling that positive health reform will pass. Obama warned that inaction will create many more problems. "If we don't get this done, your premiums are guaranteed to go up," he said.
http://rawstory.com/2009/12/howard-dean-kill-senate-health-bill-start-reconciliation/
The Republican and Democratic parties are right now mirror images of each other. Well, almost. Of course, they're not. But, maybe they are.
The Republican Party is right now torn between its center or moderate wing and its right or conservative wing, i.e., recently, the moderate Republican nominee for a vacant New York U.S. House seat unexpectedly withdrew from the race bowing to a revolt led by conservative activists that badly split the national GOP leadership.
On the other side of the aisle, po-azz democrats can't seem to bring their diverse elements under one tent, either. Blue Dogs can't afford to concede too much left (because of the make-up of their districts) and the left (who can't count worth shit) sees only "Democrats" but seem oblivious to district dynamics. The result, Democrats shoot themselves.
Republicans can't afford to allow the Democrats to pull off health care, unless its some form of healthcare first advocated by Republicans; and the Democrats can't concede to less than their ideal plan, lest they risk (i their minds) losing in the 2010 midterm elections.
Who is willing to save a world that is destined to die ???
Who is willing to try ???
QueEx
The Republican Party is right now torn between its center or moderate wing and its right or conservative wing, i.e., recently, the moderate Republican nominee for a vacant New York U.S. House seat unexpectedly withdrew from the race bowing to a revolt led by conservative activists that badly split the national GOP leadership.
On the other side of the aisle, po-azz democrats can't seem to bring their diverse elements under one tent, either. Blue Dogs can't afford to concede too much left (because of the make-up of their districts) and the left (who can't count worth shit) sees only "Democrats" but seem oblivious to district dynamics. The result, Democrats shoot themselves.
Republicans can't afford to allow the Democrats to pull off health care, unless its some form of healthcare first advocated by Republicans; and the Democrats can't concede to less than their ideal plan, lest they risk (i their minds) losing in the 2010 midterm elections.
Who is willing to save a world that is destined to die ???
Who is willing to try ???
QueEx
The majority, in fact the vast majority of the U.S. Senate are corporate whores. They should wear jumpsuits emblazoned with their paymasters’ logos like NASCAR race drivers. As I posted on
11-20-2009 → Obama's Health Care Endgame- Corporatist Win
<blockquote>
“Barack Obama’s white house <i>(following Rahm Emanuel’s kiss corporate ass strategy) </i> caved in to the “health care mafia” from day one, hoping to extract some concessions down the road. It was the wrong strategy which dramatically decreased any leverage they might have had in the end game”</blockquote>
The Health Care Mafia’s U.S. Senate whores have delivered $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. 35-40 million new LEGALLY MANDATED customers. The Corporatists Win the People Lose.
“WE WIN” the Health Care Mafia Insider writes…. "Administered by private insurance companies…. No government funding. No government insurance competitor. WE WIN”
<blockquote>
“…Congressional Democrats, eager to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, have back pedaled on health care until any bill with a chance of passing will be another resounding victory for health care lobbyists. And to think, the health care industry had actually worried that a health care bill, coming from a democratic majority in Congress, might impact their outrageous profits. Obama has clearly demonstrated, in a years time, his inability to lead. The health care industry can hardly believe its good fortune, as the closer the democratic House and Senate come to passing some kind of health care legislation, the more profit the private health care industry stands to gain..”.</blockquote>
READ the entire article the quote above is from → http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/25465
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Honestly, i think the Obama admin should kill the whole Bill and start from scratch.
This really isnt Obama Health Care Plan to begin with. But if this Bill gets passed, which it looks like it will, and when it fails, which it more than likely will in the future...Obama wil get blamed for it all.
He shouldve took on battles that he couldnt win.
...and that includes running for President of a country that lacks integrity.
This really isnt Obama Health Care Plan to begin with. But if this Bill gets passed, which it looks like it will, and when it fails, which it more than likely will in the future...Obama wil get blamed for it all.
He shouldve took on battles that he couldnt win.
...and that includes running for President of a country that lacks integrity.
LOL...
You niggas are fucking clueless.
You will never get it and will always be begging for a fucking handout.
You niggas are fucking clueless.
You will never get it and will always be begging for a fucking handout.
Its still not a fail if insurance companies are REQUIRED to insure everyone. And everybody wants something for free. That shit gonna cost some money.
When the working class believes that the institutions of this country and the people who operate them somehow have a right to goods and services that the average American does not have or that the average American is looking for a handout when he demands equality is the ultimate slave mentality and it keeps the status quo in power.
In Russia after the collapse, they had an all private system for healthcare, and it failed. The insurance companies just passed the cost on instead of holding rates down.
If you don't have 60 votes, than you will have to compromise. They should have put some stuff to get some Republicans on board, tort reform and intra-state competiton.
If you don't have 60 votes, than you will have to compromise. They should have put some stuff to get some Republicans on board, tort reform and intra-state competiton.
Why are they using polls to determine the popularity of healthcare reform? It like polling slave owners in the South about emancipation. Most people don't have to pay out of pocket and the insurance companies don't fuck with them if there employer is big enough account.
Republicans (Reagan) made a smart move when they passed a federal law, requiring emergency rooms to take patients. If we had people dying in hospitals, there would be single payer
Why doesn't the bill get rid of the monopoly exemption?
How does buying in to Medicare or Public Option raise the deficit, you are paying for it...
Republicans (Reagan) made a smart move when they passed a federal law, requiring emergency rooms to take patients. If we had people dying in hospitals, there would be single payer
Why doesn't the bill get rid of the monopoly exemption?
How does buying in to Medicare or Public Option raise the deficit, you are paying for it...
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It's just weird that Obama would stake his Presidency on such a weird issue.
He certainly didn't run on healthcare, and it seemed like he was going to leave it to Hillary.
War and the economy were the two big themes.
Why it became so imperative for him to take up this cause, so early in his administration, is just baffling.
All it is going to do is coalesce the opposition against him for the next 4 years around this legislation.
It just makes me think Obama has no intention of getting a 2nd term.
His attitude is, "I'm President. That's all I needed to do. No matter what happens, you can't take that away from me. I'm set for life."
It's like he's just glad to be President, forget about trying to do a good job or carrying out any policy objectives of his own.
He certainly didn't run on healthcare, and it seemed like he was going to leave it to Hillary.
War and the economy were the two big themes.
Why it became so imperative for him to take up this cause, so early in his administration, is just baffling.
All it is going to do is coalesce the opposition against him for the next 4 years around this legislation.
It just makes me think Obama has no intention of getting a 2nd term.
His attitude is, "I'm President. That's all I needed to do. No matter what happens, you can't take that away from me. I'm set for life."
It's like he's just glad to be President, forget about trying to do a good job or carrying out any policy objectives of his own.
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No. I think those are ALL your thoughts. Any right thinking person should know by now that there is no decision that Barack Obama could make, no poisition that Barack Obama could hold, and no thought that Barack Obama could think -- that would be satisfactory, to you.
Why do you even go through with this pretention ? ? ?
QueEx
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There are many ways Obama would appear impressive.
I know my position is anti-Obama, but it is also anti-Bush.
Yet, I recognized the force with which Bush executed his policy goals. He had a sense of purpose and direction that just seems missing with Obama.
With 9/11, Bush had a mandate and got the Patriot Act passed and got the whole country behind him.
With the global economic collapse, Obama has his own supporters turning on him, and is fighting just to get this health care bill passed.
When Bush passed the Patriot Act, many felt they would be safer.
I doubt once this healthcare bill passes, people will feel they will be healthier.
I just don't get why healthcare is such a priority when you have the whole country fixated on the war, the banks and the economy?
It seems to me he has no clear idea what his Presidency should be about (war, economy, energy, healthcare).
But, you know I've always felt he was too inexperienced to be President, anyway. Healthcare just may be a manifestation of that.
Carter - energy & environment
Reagan - military & foreign policy
Bush Sr. - war & banks
Clinton - economy
Bush - war & security
Obama - war? economy? banks? healthcare? energy? environment?
security?
In a nutshell, it's all about Control. Over the past 20 yrs, our politicians have destroyed the productive capacity of this nation through laws & regulations. Now they are continuing the assault on the Bill of Rights in small increments (health care, 4th amendment, 2nd etc). This movement has its origins in a power much greater than Obama. But I'm sure you already know this
Cruise, you just made my every point. YOU don't like his agenda so YOU simply conclude that its not worthy. Each of the issues in bold were inherited by this President.
- Obama didn't start either Iraq or Afghanistan, but he does have to manage them down in a responsible manner.
- No one could question that he wasn't handed a "non-economy";
- no one could question that we are in serious need for alternative energy;
- no one can deny that the ice is declining, though the reason may be the subject of debate; and
- Finally, if you pay for health insurance (I do, for my family and every person employed by my firm), even a pre-schooler knows the cost of same is rapidly making it unaffordable -- all while state and local governments are paying through the nose to treat those who don't have insurance or can't otherwise afford it, through expensive emergency room care. As I know that you know, the payments made by state and local government come from none other than, OUR pockets.
In reality, it would be great if Mr. Obama could just pick one issue to concentrate and shine on. It would be even greater if we are being faced with ONLY one issue. Of the issues you listed, I don't see how we can leave one, off the list. Do you ? ? ?
Now, what I find really amazing about you is your ability to hate Mr. Obama while joining, or at least tacitly co-signing, the arguments of those whose sole purpose it seems is to ensure Mr. Obama's ride is a failure. If I read your pro-black ideology correctly, you would otherwise be up in arms against those same interest, except for now, their racial rhetoric happens to suit your anti-Obama purpose.
Really Sad.
QueEx
Close. I don't know what his agenda is.
From the last 2-term Democratic President, "It's the economy, stupid."
Why is healthcare such a priority with double-digit unemployment, foreclosures everywhere, inflation increasing, and credit disappearing?
What good is health insurance if you don't have the job to pay for it?
Everything is important, but it is the skilled political mind that can prioritize and determine what is most important. He then marshals his political capital to achieve the best possible result.
Obama, because he has never been tested politically, is not savvy enough to have developed these critical skills.
Do you really think this jack-of-all-trades approach is going to work?
My opinion is Obama is a threat to the freedom and interests of slave descendants. So, the tea bagger, birther, Fox News/Rush Limbaugh-crowd and other right-wing movements are useful, for these purposes.
Another reason Obama bugs me is what he represents. He is a morale-booster and this country needs a strategist in office, not to feel good. Unfortunately, none of the 2008 Presidential candidates was a strategist (a morale guy - Obama, 2 bureaucrats - Clinton/McCain, and a party girl - Palin, what a choice).
Ever since Nixon, this country has avoided strategist-type Presidents. They love fun guys ("W", Obama, Reagan, Clinton).
I dislike Obama mostly because he is a false hope. He lied to those who truly believed he would be a change from Bush.
Obama is not skilled enough to get away with that level of deception. He will pay for it in the next election. But, really, I don't think he cares. He got what he wanted. Anything more is gravy.
The government gets to tax the insurance profits at 35% and can use that money to subsidize coverage. With the public option, the government doesn't get any tax revenue since it is non-profit.
I guess having the public option or medicare buy in doesn't matter, the administrative costs of the insurance companies will decrease significantly since they can't cherry pick customers. Plus 30 million people can use primary care instead of emergency rooms.
Hospitals reimbursement rates should drop also since their uncompensated care costs will drop significantly.
I guess having the public option or medicare buy in doesn't matter, the administrative costs of the insurance companies will decrease significantly since they can't cherry pick customers. Plus 30 million people can use primary care instead of emergency rooms.
Hospitals reimbursement rates should drop also since their uncompensated care costs will drop significantly.
As I read more into this, it's dawning on me that the point of this healthcare rush is to ration care.
The time is rapidly approaching where there is going to be a crisis of care in this country.
The baby boomers are going to be using care right at the time when national income will be dropping like a rock.
To mitigate this, the government is panicked to do something now. Unfortunately, it won't be enough.
Black markets are going to develop and many will die because the health care they expected just isn't available given their ability to pay under govcare.
It's going to be a bad time to be sick.
The time is rapidly approaching where there is going to be a crisis of care in this country.
The baby boomers are going to be using care right at the time when national income will be dropping like a rock.
To mitigate this, the government is panicked to do something now. Unfortunately, it won't be enough.
Black markets are going to develop and many will die because the health care they expected just isn't available given their ability to pay under govcare.
It's going to be a bad time to be sick.
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You don't make shit working for the federal government compared to the top salaries of the private sector. Nobody is making millions of dollars in the federal government or the state unless they are the football coach.
Right-wing propaganda to make it seem the government is getting bigger and wealthier.
Right-wing propaganda to make it seem the government is getting bigger and wealthier.
of course they dont.
Even Obama doesnt make much being the President. A lot, but not all of the folks in the government make most of their money off side deals....i.e. deals that you do and sometimes dont know about. Unlike us...a lot of them arent really pressured to disclose their incomes....which is one of the reason why a lot of them get away without paying their taxes.
The Mayor of my city is infamous for doing side deals with corporations...thats why he's been the Mayor for so long....