OBAMA, the Meek & Weak routine is played. SERIOUS DISCUSSION/SOLUTIONS ONLY

[nyyyyce]

Before anybody starts with the dumb@$$ "coon"/"quit panicking"/ "ship jumper"" nonsense the views that I am about to expand upon have been echoed by me long before Tuesdays debacle. (http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=230966, http://www.bgol.us/board/showthread.php?t=227661). With that being stated, I have to say that I am really disappointed and frustrated by Obama and his handlers at what accumulated to a crushing “perception” defeat in the elections this week.

Hillary attacked this dude for a full month. She:


* praised John McCain and relegates Obama to kids table @ Thanksgiving
* questions his Christianity
* berates him in the press
* whined incessantly
* got networks to do monologues and skits around her whining
* mocks his message and S*** on his speeches
* tells the press that he is getting unfair treatment - by the press
* had HORRIBLE debate moments (zerox comment, having to answer questions first nonsense)
* DEMANDED more debates (and got two)
* Leaked the Native African dress photo


and the list goes on but you get my point.

The ENTIRE TIME Barak was left to stamp out fires that that -itch caused and he never lit one. Scratch that, when he did light one, a factual one about NAFTA, Hillary yelled at him like a kid and told him to meet her in Ohio. As reported by many on the board today Obama gained delegates in Cali and the TX caucus so he virtually has the same delegate lead…great. Dude is, however, getting his @$$ whipped the media due to Hillary’s suggestions and framing of the issues. This S*** is utterly inconceivable. And this:

Obama Says He Will Sharpen Criticism
Democrat Says He Plans To Raise Doubts About Clinton's Claims To Foreign Policy And Other Washington Experience

CHICAGO, March 5. 2008


(AP) Democratic Sen. Barack Obama on Wednesday blamed his primary defeats in Ohio and Texas on rival Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton's criticism and news coverage that he argued benefited her at his expense.

Obama's campaign immediately delivered on his pledge to criticize Clinton. Aides distributed a memo and held a conference call to question why she won't release her tax returns. The Clinton campaign responded with a statement e-mailed to reporters while they were on the Obama call that said the Clintons' returns since they left the White House will be made public around April 15.

"There's no doubt that Senator Clinton went very negative over the last week," Obama said. He said the Clinton campaign's multiple attacks "had some impact" on the election results "particularly in the context where many of you in the press corps had been persuaded that you had been too hard on her and too soft on me."


...is whiny and unacceptable to me at this point in the game.

I understand "Staying above the fray" but dude is doing NOTHING but trying to run out the clock and point to delagets. It's a new day and dude is still not adapting to the playing filed. YES, in debates, he has gotten better at answering the questions and dodging her verbal attacks, but it has always been about more than that.

There are several areas in which Barak can easily begin to shape public perception WITHOUT being nasty, negative or looking like a puss-E. Al he has to do is use the FN facts to his advantage and its a freaking wrap.


1. Obam IS THE UNDERDOG. Always Was ALWAYS will be. Why he keeps letting the media, and more importantly, Hillary keep getting away with ignoring that fact is F-N ridiculous.

2. March 22, 2007 - Clinton, Obama, Edwards Run Better In Ohio, Quinnipiac University Poll Finds; Obama Narrows Gap With Clinton Among Democrats

In the Democratic primary, Clinton leads Obama 32 - 22 percent, compared to 38 - 13 percent in a January 30 Quinnipiac University poll. In this latest survey, former Vice President Al Gore gets 14 percent, followed by Edwards with 11 percent.


TREND: (If registered Democrat) If the 2008 Democratic primary for President were being held today, and the candidates were Joe Biden, Wesley Clark, Hillary Clinton, Chris Dodd, John Edwards, Al Gore, Mike Gravel, Dennis Kucinich, Barack Obama and Bill Richardson, for whom would you vote? na = not asked

REGISTERED DEMOCRATS..
Mar 22 Mar 7 Jan 30
2007 2007 2007

Biden 1 2 2
Clark - 1 1
Clinton 32 32 38
Dodd - - -
Edwards 11 13 11
Gore 14 11 6
Gravel - na na
Kucinich 3 2 2
Obama 22 19 13
Richardson 1 1 1
SMONE ELSE(VOL) 2 2 1
WLDN'T VOTE(VOL) 1 1 1
DK/NA 15 16 17


http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1322.xml?ReleaseID=1029

3. CBS Poll: Majority Of Dems Back Clinton
Former First Lady Is Clear Front-Runner, But Significant Obstacles Remain

(CBS) Sen. Hillary Clinton has widened her lead in the race for the Democratic Party's presidential nomination, according to the latest CBS News poll of Democratic primary voters. But more than one third of voters overall say they would definitely not vote for the former first lady.

In a hypothetical three-way contest, 51 percent of Democratic primary voters choose Clinton as the nominee. That's the highest percentage since CBS News started asking the question in the spring and an increase of seven points from September. Twenty-three percent back Sen. Barack Obama, while 13 percent support former Sen. John Edwards.





Conclusion: This chick was supposed to win. It's not a FN comeback?!?!? This is NOT a crushing defeat to Obama. I heard pundits say that he outspent her 4 to 1. He made up ground on her – not lost it. HOWEVER, I have yet to hear a unified, consistent echo of this fact by Obama and his surrogates before the election and since. Its like they drank the Kool-Aid too.

If any of you watched the election night coverage on MSNBC Tim Russert said something that totally slipped past most cats. Obama predicted (internally) and knew he was going to loose Ohio and Texas – THEY F-N KNEW IT! However, he let the media hype the new polls and he never did anything to temper hopes by interjecting that OH and TX were Hillary’s to loose. That is on OBAMA alone not the media.

[FLASH]http://www.youtube.com/v/xAPkoqW-yWo[/FLASH]



That S*** burned me up (and even now while I am writing I’m still pissed). I stopped watching the news until today because Obama single-handedly landed a knockout blow to himself by not getting out ahead of false expectations and framing the loss in the proper context.


What is your view/take on the issue: I want to get a discussion going about what Obama can do to change the wayward narrative that he has let grow. I want to get the pulse of the board and maybe we can, in our own way, voice this to someone in his camp, use the ideas to aid each other in conversations with those we can sway etc.


QUESTION FOR DEBATE #1: How does Obama refocus the momentum after the “perception” of loss?

IMO Obama needs to start downplaying the “presumptive nominee” mess and act like everything he is accomplishing is a great feat inspired, and only made possible, by the masses who truly want change.

He needs to remind the public that Hilary Clinton said that this race would be over by Feb. 5. It’s March and the race is still on thanks to those who are sincerely looking for change. He has to reassure his base that nothing was lost this week. The delegate count is his and that is what is important. He has to exhaustively explain the popular vote/how he is forging ahead by robbing the great Clinton dynasty of overwhelming victories in Texas. He has to remind his base about Virginia, Wisconsin and Iowa. The great odds he/we have overcome trying to challenge the Clinton machine. That she had not planned on doing anything after that date because this nomination process was supposed to be “over” (her words).**

He needs to “act” like the media is forgetting how far back he was a year ago and that the momentum that he has accumulate, though not fully achieved yet, is quickly chipping away a the establishment candidate. He has to assert that the America that has been inundated, infatuated and fixated on the Clinton brand for 35 years, is quickly beginning to learn and like his ideals. He has to make it clear that Tuesday was not a funeral but the birth of "America's Candidate" and don’t even think about giving up. If he can successfully convey this he will right the ship immediately.

** “So from my perspective, you get up every day and you get out there and you make your case and you reach as many people as possible. That's what I intend to do, so I'm in it for the long run. It's not a very long run. It'll be over by February 5th.”

- Hillary Clinton

http://baltimorechronicle.com/2008/010308Burns.shtml


I welcome your thoughts:

 

[peterlongshort]

The problem with going aggressive is two-fold:

1. The premise of his campaign is that he is doing away with the old-way of politics and bringing in a new era of coalition based solutions. The minute he gets down in the mud his standing as a true "change" candidate dissappears and he turns into just another politician.

2. Don't get it twisted. Obama is still a black man. With that being said, the minute he shows the slightest form of aggression it will be amplified. Muthafuckas might start clutching their purses when he walks by.

That's just my 2 pennies.

 

[nyyyyce]

The problem with going aggressive is two-fold:

1. The premise of his campaign is that he is doing away with the old-way of politics and bringing in a new era of coalition based solutions. The minute he gets down in the mud his standing as a true "change" candidate dissappears and he turns into just another politician.

2. Don't get it twisted. Obama is still a black man. With that being said, the minute he shows the slightest form of aggression it will be amplified. Muthafuckas might start clutching their purses when he walks by.

That's just my 2 pennies.

I will be posting some other questions for the board to discuss, but he does not have to go negative. He can use every article I posted to make the case for reevaluating the "perceived" L he took on Tuesday. It is all in how you frame the debate. He has to do nothing negative.

Obama is not erratic like Hillary. He knows he can'
t get away with that. However, he can show disdain and disgust in sharply responding to her bogus assertions.

 

[nyyyyce]

Do you want this thing in the white house

The real question is do we want you to post ever again...

 

[sirwoodz]

Do you want this thing in the white house

- WTF? u know some white boy made that shit...wow

 

[KLEPTO]

Do you want this thing in the white house

Do you want this thing in the white house

 

[Laughing Man]

This is a chess game, and Billary been playing checkers

He needs to react more, but still not stoop to her level

THats how this game is played

 

[nyyyyce]

This is fresh off the wire. This is exactly what Obama should have done this week. Dude gotta hurry up and adapt. He is showing me that he is behind the curve.



-------------------------------------------------------------------

Clinton lowers expectations in Wyo.

By SARA KUGLER, Associated Press Writer 14 minutes ago

CHEYENNE, Wyo. - A day before Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton and Sen. Barack Obama were to compete for a small scattering of delegates in Wyoming, Clinton cast herself as the underdog and said the odds are not in her favor. Clinton's campaign has sought to set low expectations for the Saturday caucuses in Wyoming as well as next week's primary in Mississippi, states where her campaign believes Obama has a better shot at winning.
ADVERTISEMENT

"I said, 'Well you know what, I'm going to go to Wyoming anyway — I know it's an uphill climb, I'm aware of that," Clinton told an audience of more than 1,500 at a community college in Cheyenne. "But, you see, I am a fighter, and I believe it's worth fighting for your votes."

She set a similar tone while campaigning in Mississippi Thursday night and Friday morning. She said a win for her in that state would be a heavy lift because of Obama's appeal there. Twelve delegates will be awarded in Wyoming's caucuses, followed by 33 on Tuesday in Mississippi.

The relatively small number of delegates in these states, not seen as important weeks ago, have gained value now that the race is down to a numbers game, following Clinton's triple-win this week in Texas, Ohio and Rhode Island, where she narrowed the gap with Obama.

Earlier Friday at a town hall meeting in Mississippi, where some in the audience were undecided or leaning toward Obama, Clinton raised the possibility that she might run with the Illinois senator on the Democratic presidential ticket.

Clinton said: "I've had people say, 'Well, I wish I could vote for both of you.' Well, that might be possible some day. But first I need your vote on Tuesday."

It was the second time this week that she has hinted at a joint ticket with the Illinois senator; he has not ruled it out but says it is premature to be having those discussions.

Obama is expected to do well in Mississippi largely because of his increasing appeal among black voters. Mississippi's population is 37 percent black.

"I know that I may have an uphill battle here in the state, I appreciate that," Clinton said.

Perhaps mindful that her audiences in Mississippi and Wyoming might view Obama favorably, Clinton has leaned more toward criticizing the Bush administration and has mostly refrained from direct attacks on her opponent, other than a few veiled references to him with phrases like "reality versus rhetoric" and "solutions over sound bites."

She told audiences in both states on Friday that the Labor Department's report on Friday showing a loss of 63,000 jobs nationwide in February is an alarming sign of economic troubles.

"The economic policies of the Bush administration are failures. People are out of work, and the work they have doesn't pay what it used to pay," Clinton said in Hattiesburg, Miss.

The Labor Department's report also indicated that the nation's unemployment rate fell to 4.8 percent as hundreds of thousands of people gave up looking for jobs. The jobless rate was 4.9 percent in January.

Job losses were widespread: in construction, manufacturing, retailing, financial services and a variety of professional and business services. Those losses swamped gains elsewhere, including education and health care, leisure and hospitality and the government.

Clinton, who supported the bipartisan federal economic stimulus plan, has said the plan's immediate tax rebates are not enough to avoid a downturn. Among other things, she proposes extending unemployment insurance and investing in so-called "green collar jobs."

 

[nyyyyce]

This is a chess game, and Billary been playing checkers

He needs to react more, but still not stoop to her level

THats how this game is played

What are you talking about? 5 days ago people were saying that it was end for her if she did not win TX and OH. She wins the perception war and is now doing her damn-dest to put FL and MI in play AFTER they were stripped of delagates. Yo, she is going to ride this out to Denver and she is alining herself with McCain of all people to pluck Obama off. She is NOT playing checkers slim...

 

[hard40]

Obama does not need to go negative he only needs to remind people of all the skeletons in this checks closet.
He just needs to run down a few bullet points say:

- The only president ever impeached on grounds of personal malfeasance
- Most number of convictions and guilty pleas by friends and associates*
- Most number of cabinet officials to come under criminal investigation
- Most number of witnesses to flee country or refuse to testify
- Most number of witnesses to die suddenly
- First president sued for sexual harassment.
- First president accused of rape.
- First first lady to come under criminal investigation
- Largest criminal plea agreement in an illegal campaign contribution case
- First president to establish a legal defense fund.
- First president to be held in contempt of court
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions from abroad
- First president disbarred from the US Supreme Court and a state court

People forget and sometimes they need to be reminded of how the "Monster" was made.

He does not need to go into depth just drop a hint and the press will do the work.

 

[nyyyyce]

Obama does not need to go negative he only needs to remind people of all the skeletons in this checks closet.
He just needs to run down a few bullet points say:

- The only president ever impeached on grounds of personal malfeasance
- Most number of convictions and guilty pleas by friends and associates*
- Most number of cabinet officials to come under criminal investigation
- Most number of witnesses to flee country or refuse to testify
- Most number of witnesses to die suddenly
- First president sued for sexual harassment.
- First president accused of rape.
- First first lady to come under criminal investigation
- Largest criminal plea agreement in an illegal campaign contribution case
- First president to establish a legal defense fund.
- First president to be held in contempt of court
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions from abroad
- First president disbarred from the US Supreme Court and a state court

People forget and sometimes they need to be reminded of how the "Monster" was made.

He does not need to go into depth just drop a hint and the press will do the work.

This to me would represent a negative turn and make Obama look like he was going down to her level. These things don't embolden him as a legitimate candidate or a worthy political adversary. I contend that all he needs to do is use facts that are relative to his campaign, her voting record and her lack of actual experience and he can smash her.

 

[peterlongshort]

Obama does not need to go negative he only needs to remind people of all the skeletons in this checks closet.
He just needs to run down a few bullet points say:

- The only president ever impeached on grounds of personal malfeasance
- Most number of convictions and guilty pleas by friends and associates*
- Most number of cabinet officials to come under criminal investigation
- Most number of witnesses to flee country or refuse to testify
- Most number of witnesses to die suddenly
- First president sued for sexual harassment.
- First president accused of rape.
- First first lady to come under criminal investigation
- Largest criminal plea agreement in an illegal campaign contribution case
- First president to establish a legal defense fund.
- First president to be held in contempt of court
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions from abroad
- First president disbarred from the US Supreme Court and a state court

People forget and sometimes they need to be reminded of how the "Monster" was made.

He does not need to go into depth just drop a hint and the press will do the work.

Looks negative to me.

 

[Makkonnen]

Had to rate this one star. The tide is turning on this bullshit msm bashing of Obama. Everyone knows that Hillary is numerically behind the 8ball. Now her criticism of Mississippi will crush any shot at that race. Wyoming is a toss up. Im guess it goes big for Obama. I've spent time in Wyoming and people there are fiercely independent and don't like racists or assholes in general. If it weren't so dead I would have moved there. I think they will be repulsed by Shillary like we are.

Obama is playing it just right. I was questioning it today but not anymore.


Check this
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-experiencemar07,0,51719.story
More stories like that to come

 

[geechiedan]

QUESTION FOR DEBATE #1: How does Obama refocus the momentum after the “perception” of loss?

you mentioned earlier..."dude is doing NOTHING but trying to run out the clock and point to delegates"...well thats pretty much the reality since he can't get that knock out punch at this point.

If it was going to happen it would have happened last month...its a testament to hilary's popularity and support that that shouldn't be underestimated.

I think he needs to make more pointed observations at her campaign and how its run and associate that with how she would run the country...

this is the shit that obama needs to bring to light..

for an EXPERIENCED political figure with some 30+ years of campaigning including at a presidential level..hillary has made mistake after mistake

* financially - she had to loan HER OWN campaign 5 million dollars

* she's struggled to find "her voice" only doing so after losing 11 straight contests

* she's failed to plan well past the feb 5 super tuesday primaries assuming she would handily in the lead by that time.

* blew off the "lesser" states by concentrating only on the big states.

All of this experience yet she call obama inexperience and says he would have to do "on the job training" if elected in office.

This bitch has made misstep after misstep and if nothing else she HAS run presidential election campaigns before..if this is how she is on the run up to the whitehouse..what will it be like if she actually got IN the whitehouse?

 

[nittie]

Hillary deserves some credit for not folding her tent and giving up. To be honest in today's world a mobilized NATO and U.N are need to confront terrorism and rogue nations Bill and Hillary's skills would be a big asset. Obama got sucker punched last week that is not a big thing in a Dem primary but on the world stage against Al Qaeda it could be fatal.

He needs to man-up, win Penn and put HRC away once and for all.

 

[geechiedan]

Hillary deserves some credit for not folding her tent and giving up. To be honest in today's world a mobilized NATO and U.N are need to confront terrorism and rogue nations Bill and Hillary's skills would be a big asset. Obama got sucker punched last week that is not a big thing in a Dem primary but on the world stage against Al Qaeda it could be fatal.

He needs to man-up, win Penn and put HRC away once and for all.

1. the world has changed since bill and hillary where "co-presidents".. China wasn't that big of a player then..the country wasn't in an active and unpopular war. Hell even fidel's no longer in the game..lol.. its not 1994 anymore..the game's changed.

2. obama can't win PA..hillary's support there is to strong BUT he can keep it close..

don't fall for hillary's bullshit of "buyers remorse and if he's so good why can't he close the deal" SHE was the slated frontrunner in this race from the beginning. SHE was suppose to be done by super tuesday (according to her own words)..

The question (and he should put this out there) isn't why can't he put her away but why is she (the experienced veteran) one step behind a rookie?

 

[nyyyyce]

Had to rate this one star. The tide is turning on this bullshit msm bashing of Obama. Everyone knows that Hillary is numerically behind the 8ball. Now her criticism of Mississippi will crush any shot at that race. Wyoming is a toss up. Im guess it goes big for Obama. I've spent time in Wyoming and people there are fiercely independent and don't like racists or assholes in general. If it weren't so dead I would have moved there. I think they will be repulsed by Shillary like we are.

Obama is playing it just right. I was questioning it today but not anymore.


Check this
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-experiencemar07,0,51719.story
More stories like that to come

Here's the thing. For months now there has been sporadic talk about Obama's campaign style. Dude is always even. Cool. I got no issue with that. The issue is perception and the defense of his positions.

Obama is letting the media and Hillary define what front he has to fight on. She is being very tactical. It does not matter if the media is just picking up this story to me. These facts about her actual experience in foreign policy have been known since she left office. The article even states:

"She was never asked to do the heavy lifting" when meeting with foreign leaders, said Susan Rice, who was an assistant secretary of state in the Clinton administration and is now advising Obama. "She wasn't asked to move the mountain or deliver a harsh message or a veiled threat. It was all gentle prodding or constructive reinforcement. And it would not have been appropriate for her to do the heavy lifting."

If this chick, Susan, is IN Obama's camp and KNEW this since day one why is this just coming out in an article printed today?!?!? This info would have been very useful in a commercial in Ohio and Texas 2 weeks ago. It would have been a great talking point for Meet the Press. He could have deflected a lot of Hillary's barbs and given the right some red meat too.

No sooner did I get my post off about lowering the expectations in TX and OH for Obama then Hillary comes out today and does the same thing I suggest in Wyoming for her campaign. That -ish is tactical and strategic. I want Obama to win, but dude is too often responding to Hillary or waiting on the media to do fact finding for him.


Makk, you at least have to admit that Obama could have well used the information in this article months ago instead of waiting to AFTER a crucial primary to start this experience discussion right? Hillary has been hammering him on this from day one. Now the masses know that someone who actually was in Bill's administration can shoot down all Hillary's claims. Why is Obama holding theses Ace's dawg?!?!? It is mystifying...and more important it's too consistent a trend.

 

[nittie]

Obama and his cronies looked at the electorate map and devised a way to lead in delegates without winning the nomination outright. It's like some shit outta Oceans Eleven where real gangsters map out a plan to rob a big target. Hillary got played by a smooth hustler and should lose the race but that doesn't change the fact he is leading because he won caucuses in states that will never vote Dem.

To put all reservations to rest he should win Penn. Fuck the bullshit prove you can lead the greatest nation in history.

 

[nyyyyce]

QUESTION FOR DEBATE #1: How does Obama refocus the momentum after the “perception” of loss?

you mentioned earlier..."dude is doing NOTHING but trying to run out the clock and point to delegates"...well thats pretty much the reality since he can't get that knock out punch at this point.

If it was going to happen it would have happened last month...its a testament to hilary's popularity and support that that shouldn't be underestimated.

I think he needs to make more pointed observations at her campaign and how its run and associate that with how she would run the country...

this is the shit that obama needs to bring to light..

for an EXPERIENCED political figure with some 30+ years of campaigning including at a presidential level..hillary has made mistake after mistake

* financially - she had to loan HER OWN campaign 5 million dollars

* she's struggled to find "her voice" only doing so after losing 11 straight contests

* she's failed to plan well past the feb 5 super tuesday primaries assuming she would handily in the lead by that time.

* blew off the "lesser" states by concentrating only on the big states.

All of this experience yet she call obama inexperience and says he would have to do "on the job training" if elected in office.

This bitch has made misstep after misstep and if nothing else she HAS run presidential election campaigns before..if this is how she is on the run up to the whitehouse..what will it be like if she actually got IN the whitehouse?

Now this is what I am talking about^^^^. I am felling all those points. This is another angle he can take that is factual without getting dirty. Until the past week his campaign has been distraction free. He has his grassroots support that he can tout, the money making apparatus and the internet/cutting edge networking he has developed. Dude needs to tout that 1,000,000 contributors every F-N day.

He needs to say that he can not only bring the nation together, but hope is inspiring a generation of new voters and rekindling the fire underneath even the most disenchanted Americans.

He needs to turn outspending her on ads into a plus. Tell how it took all that and more just to pull close to the Clinton machine and he needs more. Use the will of the people as the sledgehammer to bludgeon the machine. He can do this man....

 

[hard40]

Here's the thing. For months now there has been sporadic talk about Obama's campaign style. Dude is always even. Cool. I got no issue with that. The issue is perception and the defense of his positions.

Obama is letting the media and Hillary define what front he has to fight on. She is being very tactical. It does not matter if the media is just picking up this story to me. These facts about her actual experience in foreign policy have been known since she left office. The article even states:

"She was never asked to do the heavy lifting" when meeting with foreign leaders, said Susan Rice, who was an assistant secretary of state in the Clinton administration and is now advising Obama. "She wasn't asked to move the mountain or deliver a harsh message or a veiled threat. It was all gentle prodding or constructive reinforcement. And it would not have been appropriate for her to do the heavy lifting."

If this chick, Susan, is IN Obama's camp and KNEW this since day one why is this just coming out in an article printed today?!?!? This info would have been very useful in a commercial in Ohio and Texas 2 weeks ago. It would have been a great talking point for Meet the Press. He could have deflected a lot of Hillary's barbs and given the right some red meat too.

No sooner did I get my post off about lowering the expectations in TX and OH for Obama then Hillary comes out today and does the same thing I suggest in Wyoming for her campaign. That -ish is tactical and strategic. I want Obama to win, but dude is too often responding to Hillary or waiting on the media to do fact finding for him.


Makk, you at least have to admit that Obama could have well used the information in this article months ago instead of waiting to AFTER a crucial primary to start this experience discussion right? Hillary has been hammering him on this from day one. Now the masses know that someone who actually was in Bill's administration can shoot down all Hillary's claims. Why is Obama holding theses Ace's dawg?!?!? It is mystifying...and more important it's too consistent a trend.

I agree:
Hillary's attacks are sharp and well timed if she does it again and closes the delegate gap within 50 or 100 that's bad news for Obama She can then lay claim to carrying all the critical Big States and having reduced or stolen all Obama's momentum.
Obama seems to drop jabs or hints nothing to sharp and hopes the press picks up on the rest. It’s a safe but slow process and dangerous if the press does not react fast enough.
Example with the NAFTA issue look how quick that story hit and damaged Obama! The majority of the public still have no idea that Clinton was responsible for those comments. Also most people still have no idea the Canadian Govt issued a full apology and the press is dragging its feet on holding Hillary to the same standard

 

[osirus1980]

Obama and his cronies looked at the electorate map and devised a way to lead in delegates without winning the nomination outright. It's like some shit outta Oceans Eleven where real gangsters map out a plan to rob a big target. Hillary got played by a smooth hustler and should lose the race but that doesn't change the fact he is leading because he won caucuses in states that will never vote Dem.

To put all reservations to rest he should win Penn. Fuck the bullshit prove you can lead the greatest nation in history.

COSIGN: Seems tom he is still in control. This little surge in the media will most likely backfire on Hillary in the coming months. Obama's team had a plan entering into the election and it's working like a charm. I mean, remember when he first entered the race. Even I thought he didn't have a chance. Then slowly and surely he has managed to keep an hold a lead that she can't overcome. She is, all of a sudden, looking at Florida and Michigan (states she didn't care too much about earlier in the year) for a chance at a win.

 

[nyyyyce]

Obama and his cronies looked at the electorate map and devised a way to lead in delegates without winning the nomination outright. It's like some shit outta Oceans Eleven where real gangsters map out a plan to rob a big target. Hillary got played by a smooth hustler and should lose the race but that doesn't change the fact he is leading because he won caucuses in states that will never vote Dem.

To put all reservations to rest he should win Penn. Fuck the bullshit prove you can lead the greatest nation in history.

How about Hillary prove that she has won the nomination by Feb 5th - oops she can't.

How about having Hillary explain why she can't put this dude away.

How about Hillary use her 35 years of experience and contacts so that she does not have to lend money to her own campaign to jump start it.

How about Hillary run as a presidential candidate and not the wife of a President. How about Bill stay home and let her win on her own - Oh that is not happening either.

How about Hillary abide by the rules she agreed to and NOT pull the B**** move to get FL and MI counted.

How about Hillary get the number of delegates that she is supposed to sin like Obama has to.

Let her do those things and you let Obama get the required delegates like the RULES say he has to....

 

[nyyyyce]

I agree:
Hillary's attacks are sharp and well timed if she does it again and closes the delegate gap within 50 or 100 that's bad news for Obama She can then lay claim to carrying all the critical Big States and having reduced or stolen all Obama's momentum.
Obama seems to drop jabs or hints nothing to sharp and hopes the press picks up on the rest. It’s a safe but slow process and dangerous if the press does not react fast enough.
Example with the NAFTA issue look how quick that story hit and damaged Obama! The majority of the public still have no idea that Clinton was responsible for those comments. Also most people still have no idea the Canadian Govt issued a full apology and the press is dragging its feet on holding Hillary to the same standard

Co shizzle^^

That -itch is QUICK with the pouncing. And should the masses NOT know what they are thinking internally she will tell you on national television. "The press is treating me unfairly" and the media HAS TO investigate because she challenges them to do so in their face, on SNL and in debates. That chick is nothing if not shrewd. Obama gotz to get some of that but use it for good though...

 

[gene cisco]

This is obama ices the bitch(we already know I dont like neither.)

He plays the same he has been playing, just spitting game on the mic, using his charisma and her lack of charisma.

They are same policy wise, do not kid yourselves, the difference between them running the show is little.

He needs to keep working that obama game that has rational folks losing heir minds. No angry black man routine at all, he can't do it. Smile and take it, seriously this country hates angry black men, especially coming at their white women.

His campaign must remain the same, dont roll in the mud with billary.

That muthafucka got john goldie game the way he preaches. The gift of gab is his.

Use his weapon. It aint experience, it aint different policy.......

Like they said in the mack[b/]......his game is strong

 

[TCapone]

One strategy he should use is don't put hillary on his level, & don't come down to hers!

Just jab at mccain like hillarys irrelevant & use mccain to hit hillary too! Second thing he needs to do is get rid of all those half ass jack leg surrogates they aint worth a damn!

They dont know how to debate, spin, or persuade worth shit! His surrogates should be 5 star debaters & should be mostly white males, & white females dressed down to look poor like hillary supporters!

Then have them question , jab, counter & uppercut her to death all while barack smiling, & saying nice things about her to the press. Also praise the ladies more ex. .. his wife, mother, grandmother & daughters to the press!


Checkmate!

 

[nyyyyce]

One strategy he should use is don't put hillary on his level, & don't come down to hers!

Just jab at mccain like hillarys irrelevant & use mccain to hit hillary too! Second thing he needs to do is get rid of all those half ass jack leg surrogates they aint worth a damn!

They dont know how to debate, spin, or persuade worth shit! His surrogates should be 5 star debaters & should be mostly white males, & white females dressed down to look poor like hillary supporters!

Then have them question , jab, counter & uppercut her to death all while barack smiling, & saying nice things about her to the press. Also praise the ladies more ex. .. his wife, mother, grandmother & daughters to the press!


Checkmate!

valid points.

 

[Makkonnen]

Here's the thing. For months now there has been sporadic talk about Obama's campaign style. Dude is always even. Cool. I got no issue with that. The issue is perception and the defense of his positions.

Obama is letting the media and Hillary define what front he has to fight on. She is being very tactical. It does not matter if the media is just picking up this story to me. These facts about her actual experience in foreign policy have been known since she left office. The article even states:

"She was never asked to do the heavy lifting" when meeting with foreign leaders, said Susan Rice, who was an assistant secretary of state in the Clinton administration and is now advising Obama. "She wasn't asked to move the mountain or deliver a harsh message or a veiled threat. It was all gentle prodding or constructive reinforcement. And it would not have been appropriate for her to do the heavy lifting."

If this chick, Susan, is IN Obama's camp and KNEW this since day one why is this just coming out in an article printed today?!?!? This info would have been very useful in a commercial in Ohio and Texas 2 weeks ago. It would have been a great talking point for Meet the Press. He could have deflected a lot of Hillary's barbs and given the right some red meat too.

No sooner did I get my post off about lowering the expectations in TX and OH for Obama then Hillary comes out today and does the same thing I suggest in Wyoming for her campaign. That -ish is tactical and strategic. I want Obama to win, but dude is too often responding to Hillary or waiting on the media to do fact finding for him.


Makk, you at least have to admit that Obama could have well used the information in this article months ago instead of waiting to AFTER a crucial primary to start this experience discussion right? Hillary has been hammering him on this from day one. Now the masses know that someone who actually was in Bill's administration can shoot down all Hillary's claims. Why is Obama holding theses Ace's dawg?!?!? It is mystifying...and more important it's too consistent a trend.

The problem is that he has been countering all this shit for months. The problem is Hillary's press conference calls are quoted verbatim and his aren't mentioned ANYWHERE.
The problem isn't Obama it is the media. It won't matter what he does. They see a cash cow in Hillary and they aren't letting that bitch get away from them. Most journalists can't even stop being giddy over the fuckin ratings boost they've received in interviews. Politics has been gettin shit ratings before this.
This isn't a terrible thread. I'd change my vote if I could. Yall are just off base. Do you know how many websites you have to scour to get one sentence from one Obama advisor from his multiple daily phone teleconferences?????????????? A fuckin lot and you still might not find shit.

 

[BS2011]

What Obama needs to do is tell the truth! Let the country, particularly democrats see how Billary is splitting the party and ensuring that no matter who wins the nomination they will lose the general election. The only people benefiting from the negativity that Hillary is spewing is John McCain and the Republicans.
I was disappointed too and stopped watching the news because I'm so disgusted by the coverage and the story that the media is trying to sell.
I didn't even go to Obama's website for a couple of days. I got over that and just dropped another $60 a couple of minutes ago. Obama needs to get infront of the bitch ass media. He doesn't need to go negative but he needs to stop acting like a pussy and fight back.

 

[smooveface]

Obama is a politician first. He ain't gonna go and get too big for his britches. He knows what kind of clout the Clintons hold in the Democratic party and he aint gonna commit political suicide by punching too far below the belt. She can do it because it aint gonna cost her a thing. Nobody in the DNC is going to stick up for him. If he goes too hard, he'll end up another lifetime senator bouncing from insignificant committee to committee. He knows that and thats why there's no way he's gonna bring out the guns. If he plays the "gentleman" approach and "leaves it up to the voters and the leaders of the DNC" he doesn't have to put his neck out like that. He'll never get to gutter on her or else he better have some connects at a few law firms, cause he sure wont be sitting on capitol hill for very long if he loses.

 

[nyyyyce]

The problem is that he has been countering all this shit for months. The problem is Hillary's press conference calls are quoted verbatim and his aren't mentioned ANYWHERE.
The problem isn't Obama it is the media. It won't matter what he does. They see a cash cow in Hillary and they aren't letting that bitch get away from them. Most journalists can't even stop being giddy over the fuckin ratings boost they've received in interviews. Politics has been gettin shit ratings before this.
This isn't a terrible thread. I'd change my vote if I could. Yall are just off base. Do you know how many websites you have to scour to get one sentence from one Obama advisor from his multiple daily phone teleconferences?????????????? A fuckin lot and you still might not find shit.

Here is the deal. Last week a representative from The Slate asked Clinton's top advisers, out of the blue, to list some of instances where Hilary has had direct foreign policy experience. They were stunned and had no answer. I saw this on Countdown as a lead story and heard it mildly mentioned on few other shows.

How many times did I hear Obama, or any of his surrogates echo this MASSIVE "gotcha" moment during the week: Once. And that was because Olberman mentioned that Obamas advisers talked about it in a conference call. That S*** WAS HUGE and Obama, nor his people ran that in the ground last week at all. I'm not talking about it being posted on a website or on a blog. Directly from his mouth and trumpeted: "0". Is that the media's fault that HE did not blow it up? C'mon...

* Hillary points to the SNL skit and how Obama gets pampered then she slings dirt at him in the debate: the media follows the story

* Hillary exposes Kirk Watson (TX) who got whored by Chris Matthews - at a debate, that she demanded to have - and the media starts to question how informed are Obama's supporters.

* Hillary says that FL and MI voters are disenfranchised by having their delegates taken - a move she agreed to - and now Dean is trying to see how to finance a do over.


There is NO WAY you or anyone else can say that the media did any of this. SHE reminded the media what happened on SNL. SHE bought it to the debate and they had to follow it. Obama IS NOT doing the same thing. Nor is he using slip up, pitfalls and missteps by Hillary to her disadvantage. It is OBAMA's job to present the facts to the media. It is his job to have competent surrogates echoing the same line or narrative at every engagement/interview. Hillary is not leaving anything up to chance and is dictating the hell out of how Barak is being covered. That is fact.

 

[nyyyyce]

What Obama needs to do is tell the truth! Let the country, particularly democrats see how Billary is splitting the party and ensuring that no matter who wins the nomination they will lose the general election. The only people benefiting from the negativity that Hillary is spewing is John McCain and the Republicans.
I was disappointed too and stopped watching the news because I'm so disgusted by the coverage and the story that the media is trying to sell.
I didn't even go to Obama's website for a couple of days. I got over that and just dropped another $60 a couple of minutes ago. Obama needs to get infront of the bitch ass media. He doesn't need to go negative but he needs to stop acting like a pussy and fight back.

That is all I am saying doc^^^^. Plain and simple.

 

[LSN]

Good response. You don't fight fire with fire. A man doesn't have to act like a bitch to deal with one. Folks are panicking because he lost 2 states he was going to lose anyway (Ohio, Rhode Island). Obama has more to lose if he slings mud with Hillary.

This is obama ices the bitch(we already know I dont like neither.)

He plays the same he has been playing, just spitting game on the mic, using his charisma and her lack of charisma.

They are same policy wise, do not kid yourselves, the difference between them running the show is little.

He needs to keep working that obama game that has rational folks losing heir minds. No angry black man routine at all, he can't do it. Smile and take it, seriously this country hates angry black men, especially coming at their white women.

His campaign must remain the same, dont roll in the mud with billary.

That muthafucka got john goldie game the way he preaches. The gift of gab is his.

Use his weapon. It aint experience, it aint different policy.......

Like they said in the mack[b/]......his game is strong

 

[Turbulent]

Good response. You don't fight fire with fire. A man doesn't have to act like a bitch to deal with one. Folks are panicking because he lost 2 states he was going to lose anyway (Ohio, Rhode Island). Obama has more to lose if he slings mud with Hillary.

they're not panicking because he lost two states. they're panicking because she has all control over the spins like Harlem Globe Troters and basketballs. She's dictating what constitutes a win/loss for Obama and controlling the perception of who's leading. Come the final vote casted by superdelegates it will be all about the math but until then it's all about the perception. The Superdelegates don't care about who has the most delegate count. they care about the fact that the population cares. it's a slight but crucial nuance because if she manages to shape the public perception into believing that Obama is weak and lost his momentum and if that perception becomes more important then the number of pledged delegates, the Supers will go her way. EVen if that doesn't happen, the perception might be so strong in her favor that eventhough he has the lead, the supers might force him to get Hillary as VP in order to get their vote.

EDIT: I agree that he has to stay cool though. he just needs some people to throw dirt for him from a distance. Meanwhile he looks like the dude who wants to change politics instead of participating.

 

[cigley]

I dont think he should go negative, but he does need to deflate the old bag.

1. When she was whining adout the media, he should have portrayed her as a paranoid person. "Oh so now there's a vast media conspiracy?"

I don't blame him though, I just think it's not in his nature to throw barbs out like that. He tried with that walmart issue he brought up during on of those debates. Notice how he doesnt bring it up again.

Believe it or not, people respond to the entertainment in politics. When she had that 3 am video, he should have had a 3 pm video, with a shot of the unread NIE report on her desk or in the trash. Then a voice over that says we need someone that will make the right choices in broad daylight.

 

[Turbulent]

Believe it or not, people respond to the entertainment in polotics. When she had that 3 am video, he should have had a 3 pm video, with a shot of the unread NIE report on her desk or in the trash. Then a voiceover that says we need someone that will make the right choices in broad daylight.